Phil Spector [6/24 please seen last post by Admin)

[Mort_Snerd]

Since Phil Spector was convicted in his second trial and has not yet been evaluated and sent to a California State prison, I have a few questions for the people who have legal experience.

1. Can Phil Spector have more than one appeal in process through the appeals court?

2. Does the fact that there is a Civil case against him mean that his 5th Admendment rights can be used while the civil case is open to give him the right not to answer questions during the case because he has appeal(s) in process?

Mortie

[Nic99]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Mortie,

One appeal only, through the appeals court. That being said, I see no grounds for a sucessful appeal. Judge Strickland would have had to make a serious error for him to be sucessful. His next step would be the Supreme Court which takes years and frankly, I don't think he will live that long.

No, he cannot invoke his Fifth Amendment Right to Self Incrimination in the Civil Trial unless the question has to do with possibility of him incriminating himself in a different criminal action than the one he has been convicted of. There is no down side if he refuses to answer. He will be held in contempt of court which makes no difference since he serving 19 to life. What is another 30 days for contempt of court mean to him now.

Why would Judge Strickland have had to made an error, what case was he on?? I thought it was Judge Fidler and he certainly made a number of errors which can and will be brought to appeal soon.

[dref99]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Mortie,

One appeal only, through the appeals court. That being said, I see no grounds for a sucessful appeal. Judge Strickland would have had to make a serious error for him to be sucessful. His next step would be the Supreme Court which takes years and frankly, I don't think he will live that long.

No, he cannot invoke his Fifth Amendment Right to Self Incrimination in the Civil Trial unless the question has to do with possibility of him incriminating himself in a different criminal action than the one he has been convicted of. There is no down side if he refuses to answer. He will be held in contempt of court which makes no difference since he serving 19 to life. What is another 30 days for contempt of court mean to him now.

Phil will certainly be advised by his lawyers not to answer questions in the civil trial viz

Mr. Spector intends to invoke his privileges not to testify against himself until all issues regarding the criminal action has been resolved. He cannot engage in discovery in this present action without being compelled to waive his privileges against self-incrimination under the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments of the United States Constitution.

from a submission (rejected) to delay discovery for the civil trial.

DW submitted
Due to the gravity of the charges pending gainst Mr. Spector, he will not be permitted to testify at deposition or respond to any form of written discovery which related to the February 3, 2003 incident. This is due to the potential impact it could have on Mr. Spector's pending crimnal case.

Full details http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/...e-motions.html

And I believe it will be very hard to find any errors made by JF for an appeal. The only comment I heard/read about related to allowing the testimony of the prior events against women.

jmo

[Nic99]

Originally Posted by dref99

Phil will certainly be advised by his lawyers not to answer questions in the civil trial viz

Mr. Spector intends to invoke his privileges not to testify against himself until all issues regarding the criminal action has been resolved. He cannot engage in discovery in this present action without being compelled to waive his privileges against self-incrimination under the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments of the United States Constitution.

from a submission (rejected) to delay discovery for the civil trial.

DW submitted
Due to the gravity of the charges pending gainst Mr. Spector, he will not be permitted to testify at deposition or respond to any form of written discovery which related to the February 3, 2003 incident. This is due to the potential impact it could have on Mr. Spector's pending crimnal case.

Full details http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/...e-motions.html

And I believe it will be very hard to find any errors made by JF for an appeal. The only comment I heard/read about related to allowing the testimony of the prior events against women.

jmo

Exactly and that last point is certainly enough to be getting on with imo; amongst other items, including hearsay, prejudicial accounts in opening testimony, etc, etc, etc......

[Nic99]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

My apologies. I did mean Judge Fidler. That being said, I think that he made every effort not to make Judicial error.

Accepted, but I do think he left areas to be appealed in this case. The PBAs being allowed; the very prejudicial opening testimony of AJ; the hearsay of VT, these are all areas which can be contested for appeal and should never have been allowed in this trial imo.

[Details]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

My apologies. I did mean Judge Fidler. That being said, I think that he made every effort not to make Judicial error.

Even the defense attorney praised him as a good judge - while they disagreed with the verdict. He made no errors - gave the defense every leeway practical, sometimes almost too much.

Appeals very rarely succeed even to the point of getting a new trial, even with bad judges, and real issues, let alone with this made up issue that women having a gun pointed at them as they turn Phil down are not similar enough to be an admissible pattern of behavior.

[Nic99]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

To adequately answer your comment, I need to search case law on PBA's being allowed in a retrial. VT's name escapes me at the moment. VT?

I was referring to Vincent Tannazo. I have researched the law regarding the PBAs and VT's hearsay and believe there is a very good case for an appeal for PS at appeal.

[dref99]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

To adequately answer your comment, I need to search case law on PBA's being allowed in a retrial. VT's name escapes me at the moment. VT?

PBAs were fought against by all the defence attorneys for both trials - unsuccessfully. I don't believe this will be a winner for an appeal - but mentioned it because it is the ONLY thing that DW suggested when he stated they would appeal (He said "lots of issues" but only mentioned one)

VT is Vincent Tannazzo - retired security guard for Joan Rivers - first witness for the prosecution.


jmo

[Pinwheel]

sorry if this question is a bit off topic or really dim-witted but i tried to follow this case but kept getting pulled away from it with other things. i heard that other women testified that they were threatened and stuff by him in the same way as the victim (without being killed of course) and some of those women say it happened many years ago. was that stuff considered hearsay because he wasn't charged with assault back then when it happened? i ask because i wonder if that could be an appealable thing.

[Nic99]

The PBAs are not similar in any way with the Lana case and many of the ladies involved actually went back and visited PS again, so they couldn't have been that afraid of him or else why go back. The prosecution were clutching at straws and these will be their down fall in appeal. Crikey one of the PBA witnesses had unfortunately passed away and her testimony could not be questionned; so there is a point in itself at the second trial. Major mistake made there imo. Could cost them heavily in the appeal

[Details]

Originally Posted by Pinwheel

sorry if this question is a bit off topic or really dim-witted but i tried to follow this case but kept getting pulled away from it with other things. i heard that other women testified that they were threatened and stuff by him in the same way as the victim (without being killed of course) and some of those women say it happened many years ago. was that stuff considered hearsay because he wasn't charged with assault back then when it happened? i ask because i wonder if that could be an appealable thing.

It's not hearsay - they testified to what happened to them - no need for any charges to be filed for it to be valid. However, at least one of them did call the police - the police just dismissed the whole thing. The PBAs were IDENTICAL to Lana - and the fact that some of them continued contact with Spector does not diminish them in any way.

[Nic99]

Originally Posted by Details

It's not hearsay - they testified to what happened to them - no need for any charges to be filed for it to be valid. However, at least one of them did call the police - the police just dismissed the whole thing. The PBAs were IDENTICAL to Lana - and the fact that some of them continued contact with Spector does not diminish them in any way.

Yup exactly, the police dismissed the whole thing, they obviously had good reason too; doesn't mean that is then valid as a previous PBA, else why dismiss it. This whole case is hugely flawed and I hope that the truth comes out in the appeal; as much as some seem to want to slaughter PS on this board and his supporters, he should be given a fair appeal and justice should prevail; he is no scapegoat and should not be allowed to be.

[Details]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

In the initial trial, Tannazzo testified that he thought the events took place sometime between 1994 and 1997. Today, he changed his testimony slightly, stating that the events could have occurred in the "early 90's" from 1991 on. In cross, Weinberg kept asking him "why" he changed his testimony, and ed home the fact that Tannazzo did not have any corroborating evidence to back up his claim that the events took place. He admitted he did not speak to Joan Rivers or Dorothy Melvin about the incidents afterwards, nor did he try to report it to the police when he discovered Spector was carrying a concealed weapon at one event or note them in a diary. Weinberg tried to paint Tannazzo as someone who purposefully interjected himself in the first trial for the publicity.

http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/...testimony.html

Cridible witness? What do you think? I doubt that he will ever be called if there is an appeal.

Credible by me. He matches every other bit of testimony about Spector. The guy had problems with women telling him No, and liked his guns. Nor is it any shock he didn't speak to the hosts about this behavior - these are powerful people, you try stepping up and speaking out, and you will get squashed, lose your job, and be blacklisted by all the other powerful people. Same reason as some of the other women threatened by Spector were still willing to be around him, same reason why the cops took Spector's side when called out. This was a very different time, and a very different culture than what most of us live in today.

[Pinwheel]

Originally Posted by Details

It's not hearsay - they testified to what happened to them - no need for any charges to be filed for it to be valid. However, at least one of them did call the police - the police just dismissed the whole thing. The PBAs were IDENTICAL to Lana - and the fact that some of them continued contact with Spector does not diminish them in any way.

thank you that clears that up. i remember reading that the same scenario was happening to so many women over like 30 years in his home and then i watched that ramones documentary and they said he did it to them too. he wouldn't let them leave! he ain't lonely now!

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Mort_Snerd

Since Phil Spector was convicted in his second trial and has not yet been evaluated and sent to a California State prison, I have a few questions for the people who have legal experience.

1. Can Phil Spector have more than one appeal in process through the appeals court?

Sure. Next step is to the intermediate court of appeals for CA. Next step is to the CA SC.

A 2254 Motion can be filed in a federal district court after state remedies are exhausted, ONLY if a FEDERAL question is presented, as we see in 2254:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/se...4----000-.html

OR an appeal directly to the US SC from the CA SC.

If you mean more than one appeal at the SAME time, no.

2. Does the fact that there is a Civil case against him mean that his 5th Admendment rights can be used while the civil case is open to give him the right not to answer questions during the case because he has appeal(s) in process?

Mortie

We have 2 distinct documents here, the US Constitution AND the CA Constitution.

You will find, the US Constitution incrimination clause does not compel a person, who faces a civil lawsuit, to make any statement that would tend to incriminate them, IF a criminal appeal is pending.

I am assuming the CA Constitution is in line, even if not, the 5th AM is controlling.

[Mort_Snerd]

How long does a California "Evaluation" period normally last in a felony murder case.

Mortie

[Ellie]

Ahem. Very good question, Mort. I'd also like to be kept abreast of PS's chances of appeal as well as how he fares in prison, and of course information on the civil trial.

[RootBeer]

My question is, when will we know Phil's prison address. I would like to send him a card.

[dref99]

I sure never thought to look on this particular board, but at last there is a reply button. The Prison web site suggests 60 to 90 days to process incoming inmates

http://www.cdcr.ca.gov/Visitors/Facilities/NKSP.html

[Nic99]

Small price to pay for Phil's inevitable freedom that will follow. Its good to know he's settled in and has made a great impression; always knew he would (head honcho an' all).

[Jay]

More specifically:


http://www.courtinfo.ca.gov/rules/in...nkid=rule8_308

[Anakerie]

Originally Posted by Nic99

Small price to pay for Phil's inevitable freedom that will follow. Its good to know he's settled in and has made a great impression; always knew he would (head honcho an' all).

"Head honcho"? ROFL!! Do you really think that Phil could dominate a prison and become "head honcho"? Oh my goodness.. If the information is coming from Rachelle, please pass a ton or so of salt..

[RootBeer]

Originally Posted by Lifeisgrand

I read on Sprocket a fan asking for the same info even though it is posted here and a few other sites. What about when he was in a jail in LA? Could have sent a card there if you really wanted to send him well wishes.

I sent Phil a card right after the verdict but mailed it to his penthouse address in hopes that Rachelle will pass it along. I just was not sure what his final destination in the prison system and did not want to send a card to the wrong place.

I will keep you all updated on any response I get from my friend Phil.

[True2Blues]

Originally Posted by Anakerie

"Head honcho"? ROFL!! Do you really think that Phil could dominate a prison and become "head honcho"? Oh my goodness.. If the information is coming from Rachelle, please pass a ton or so of salt..

No kidding. Who ever said he'd "Made a Great Impression"? Those people see two bit murderers every single day. I don't recall reading that any of them found PS to be anything special.

[RootBeer]

Originally Posted by True2Blues

No kidding. Who ever said he'd "Made a Great Impression"? Those people see two bit murderers every single day. I don't recall reading that any of them found PS to be anything special.

But that is what you don't get, Phil Spector is "special", always has been, always will be. jmo

[Details]

Spector's hair is sure 'special' - the rest of him - not so much. Just another person with violent tendencies that went too far. Prison is where we collect those 'special' people.

[Anakerie]

Originally Posted by RootBeer

But that is what you don't get, Phil Spector is "special", always has been, always will be. jmo

Once upon a time, Phil might have been considered "special" by people because of his talent.. Not all people though.. Just some of them. Now though he's pretty much a "has-been". Hasn't done anything musically in years besides collect royalties for his and other people's music.

As far as I can see, the only thing "special" about him now is the fact that he played with a gun one too many times and he finally killed someone. He'll be treated now to being hosted by the State of California along with all the other murderers, druggies, thieves and other criminals. Oh yeah, that's "special" all right...

Now, can we get back to the topic at hand, RootBeer? I'm curious about your idea of what the grounds for appeal will be? And when do you think it'll be filed?

[True2Blues]

Originally Posted by RootBeer

But that is what you don't get, Phil Spector is "special", always has been, always will be. jmo

He's in that special class known as cold blooded murderers, yes. Other than that, he isn't special in any way, to me and many, many, others.

[dref99]

Originally Posted by True2Blues

He's in that special class known as cold blooded murderers, yes. Other than that, he isn't special in any way, to me and many, many, others.

So many people (including myself) said during trial 1 that they had never heard of Phil until the death of Lana - so it seems he is more infamous than famous. Computers have long taken over many of the skills of music production - but not the art of the singer. Listening to a soloist who can sing without ANY backing is my idea of great vocalist.

jmo

[RootBeer]

Originally Posted by dref99

So many people (including myself) said during trial 1 that they had never heard of Phil until the death of Lana - so it seems he is more infamous than famous. Computers have long taken over many of the skills of music production - but not the art of the singer. Listening to a soloist who can sing without ANY backing is my idea of great vocalist.

jmo

I never heard of Lana until she died.

[RootBeer]

Originally Posted by Anakerie

Once upon a time, Phil might have been considered "special" by people because of his talent.. Not all people though.. Just some of them. Now though he's pretty much a "has-been". Hasn't done anything musically in years besides collect royalties for his and other people's music.

As far as I can see, the only thing "special" about him now is the fact that he played with a gun one too many times and he finally killed someone. He'll be treated now to being hosted by the State of California along with all the other murderers, druggies, thieves and other criminals. Oh yeah, that's "special" all right...

Now, can we get back to the topic at hand, RootBeer? I'm curious about your idea of what the grounds for appeal will be? And when do you think it'll be filed?

Grounds for Appeal: one of them being the PBA witness who could not be cross examined, and baciscally the PBAs themself.

Appeal to be filed: not sure, but would think before the end of the year.

[Nic99]

Originally Posted by dref99

So many people (including myself) said during trial 1 that they had never heard of Phil until the death of Lana - so it seems he is more infamous than famous. Computers have long taken over many of the skills of music production - but not the art of the singer. Listening to a soloist who can sing without ANY backing is my idea of great vocalist.

jmo

Exactly, computers have now taken over the skills of music production, HOWEVER, when Phil was producing he used REAL musicians to create that unique and famous 'wall of sound' quality, that was achieved by using many musicians for the 'wall' in the background, and not computers. Hence, he produced superb real music that is played and played even today.

Some people may not have known the name of Phil Spector, BUT, you name me one person that does not know of at least one of the songs he produced. He is pure musical genius. A very rare thing these days unfortunately.

Nic

[vonna]

Originally Posted by Nic99

Exactly, computers have now taken over the skills of music production, HOWEVER, when Phil was producing he used REAL musicians to create that unique and famous 'wall of sound' quality, that was achieved by using many musicians for the 'wall' in the background, and not computers. Hence, he produced superb real music that is played and played even today.

Some people may not have known the name of Phil Spector, BUT, you name me one person that does not know of at least one of the songs he produced. He is pure musical genius. A very rare thing these days unfortunately.

Nic

While we may have been familiar with the music we were totally unfamiliar with the name. Being a musical genius does not give one a free pass to commit murder.

[tartangirl]

All the wonderful pieces of music
in the world will not make up for the last deed executed on February 03, 2003. That action is the one that will stay in the minds of many for long.


~ as always, my opinion, Justice for Lana and those who love her ~ At Last ~

http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/...?l=eng&gi=lana

[Deannalynn]

Originally Posted by Mort_Snerd

How long does a California "Evaluation" period normally last in a felony murder case.

Mortie

I am with the understanding it could take up to 3 months.
JMO

[Deannalynn]

Originally Posted by RootBeer

Grounds for Appeal: one of them being the PBA witness who could not be cross examined, and baciscally the PBAs themself.

Appeal to be filed: not sure, but would think before the end of the year.

Judge Fidler was very specific it that ruling if you remember. There are no grounds for these PBA witnesses for an appeal.
This has been hashed over since day one.
Any more grounds?
JMO

[Anakerie]

Originally Posted by Deannalynn

Judge Fidler was very specific it that ruling if you remember. There are no grounds for these PBA witnesses for an appeal.
This has been hashed over since day one.
Any more grounds?
JMO

I seem to remember Judge Fidler citing precedents for his ruling on the PBA's when the arguments were going on... Or am I remembering a different case? I do know that Judge Fidler was very precise and very careful with all of his rulings. I don't think any of his rulings were done in the "heat of the moment"... I do know that he has a very good reputation in the area of appeals.. In other words, his rulings usually stand intact.

[vonna]

Originally Posted by Deannalynn

Judge Fidler was very specific it that ruling if you remember. There are no grounds for these PBA witnesses for an appeal.
This has been hashed over since day one.
Any more grounds?
JMO

It certainly has! It's as if there are those who think that if they say it often enough it will have validity.

[♫Rock*Star♫]

Originally Posted by Nic99

snipped

He is pure musical genius.

Nic

Was.

Phil Spector is now merely a convicted murderer.

A not so very rare thing these days. Unfortunately.

[Deannalynn]

Originally Posted by RootBeer

I never heard of Lana until she died.

Point taken. Lana Clarkson was an honest, beautiful person who got up every day and went to work, paid her bills and was kind to everyone who came across her path. She paid her bills, her taxes and had a family who loved her so dearly. She was full of life and a good friend and daughter to those who loved her dearly. Then a fatal night occurred when she came across a man who decided she was going to do as he said or she would die.
It continues to sadden many people because she didn't deserve to die at the hand of a man who didn't know her, didn't know her family and the wonderful things she contributed to society.
This murder is far from being over and it has nothing to do with an appeal that will be sought. There are many years upcoming for Lana to have what is do to her. A family and friends who will continue the fight until ALL justice is prevailed.
Yes, I'm thinking about the Civil suit.
She will be able to finally rest when all is said and done.

JMO