Dec. 15 -

[Silsbee]

I did a little research because I thought it was MM too. On Feb 8, 2007 a SW was served for Jason's yahoo email acct. Yahoo provided info from that acct thru Feb 21, 2007.

According to the Nov 6 warrant MM & JY talked from 12/18/07 - 1/25/08. This is a year after the murder. They also state there was "at least one face to face meeting between the two during the summer of 2007 that occurred in Myrtle Beach, SC."

Another SW was issued for JY yahoo acct on July 5, 2007. In this SW it states "WCSO Investigator McCormack told me on June 29, 2007 of information obtained under court order of JY being in recent contact with key case witnesses who were among those he had history of also being in email contact. The contact included renewed communications with at least one witness he had last known to contact on the date the murder victim was found. It is unknown how JY obtained this witness' new phone number."

There were no SW from March to June 2007 (that we know of) so what court order gave them the info about recent contact? Since the email contact for MM and JY hadn't occurred yet I think they are referring to their "face to face" contact in the summer of 2007.

The first SW on JY email acct does not cover the time period to capture the emails from 12/07-1/08. The second SW on JY email acct requests info from 2/22/07 thru the date of the SW (July 5, 2007). So when and where did they get the info about email communications from 12/18/07 thru 1/25/08?

Links to SW

Sils

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by JHP

The GA friend, the therapist. I'm sure there are more. Maybe people she worked, with and also the people Jason worked with that thought he was inappropriate.

And we mustn't forget MM.

But, we are talking about people that Jason would have tried to get in contact with.

I doubt he would have called Michelle's therapist to see what she knew.

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Hey Sils.
Possibly from the person he was communicating with, then?
It is confusing.
The whole case is.

Kat

[kingbuff]

Originally Posted by R_P_D

The 3 SW's for the yahoo.com account allowed much more detail, such as web cache browsing history, as Yahoo.com deposits cookies and tracks history on their servers. On the other hand, the cops can (and apparently did) obtain a court order (subpoena) to intercept e-mail from a specific IP address.

Or MM was wired or bugged via court order for the face-to-face.

[kingbuff]

Originally Posted by R_P_D

Would have been a good idea, but doubt that happened.
The cops would not have stated the two had a 2007 face to face meeting in the SW if she was working on the side of justice.

She did cooperate with pollice. Wonder how that went for her.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by kingbuff

She did cooperate with pollice. Wonder how that went for her.

Well, we know MM was one of the people that was asked to identify Jason in the video from the hotel.

Could not have been easy for her to do that, or live with all the regrets she must have about hurting Michelle.

I keep thinking that IF any of the 20 things below were really true, he would be in jail.

You can even mix and match them and they still can not get an arrest.!!

Jason's footprints on pillow
Jason's dna in blood spatter on wall
Jason's dna not excluded from jewelry box
Jason's car seen by news carrier
Jason seen leaving the hotel
Jason not answering his phone on the am after the murder
Jason mentioned in the therapists notes as being threatening/abusive
Jason trying to kill Michelle in the car
Jason attempting to drown Michelle by moving boat away from her
Jason sending MF to house to find Michelle
Jason drugging C
Jason researching ways to kill Michelle on computer
Jason telling people he was unhappy
Jason not wanting to be married
Jason not wanting another child with Michelle
Jason the insurance policy
Jason being in financial difficulty
Jason refusing to talk
Jason not walking the crime scene
Jason not contesting the wrongful death suit




Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by kingbuff

Or MM was wired or bugged via court order for the face-to-face.

Lots of missed opportunities along the way, King buff.
Lots of things they did not do until it was too late.

Even the missing shirt, if it is missing, could be explained by the fact, it was in a dirty laundry or paper/plastic bag in the back seat or trunk and was thrown out thinking it was trash on the way from Brevard to Raleigh.

I coud make another list of all the mistakes or things L E could have done differently .

[kingbuff]

I think we'll just have to wait until we see the video of Jason leaving the hotel and returning around 7 am or so. Then the shirt and shoes will have significance.

[Kat4Eagles]

I was thinking about possible alternatives as why L E thought C was taken from the home, (if she was)

Could a staged kidnapping also had been in the works for C?

Maybe taken from the home and then brought back when the killer(s) changed their minds?

Doesn't add up though, C would have told someone..

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

~snipped for emphasis~

Doesn't add up though, C would have told someone..

Kat

I wonder about that part, Kat. Cassidy was an extraordinarily articulate 2+ year old, based on that 911 call. I have to wonder what she said that afternoon, and what LE heard.

[Cardinal]

Originally Posted by Silsbee

I did a little research because I thought it was MM too. On Feb 8, 2007 a SW was served for Jason's yahoo email acct. Yahoo provided info from that acct thru Feb 21, 2007.


Links to SW

Sils

Now this is my kind of analysis, Sils! I'm still surprised that Jason would be discussing the case with "key witnesses", after all we've heard about his total silence.

[MerriMent]

Originally Posted by Cardinal

Now this is my kind of analysis, Sils! I'm still surprised that Jason would be discussing the case with "key witnesses", after all we've heard about his total silence.

Where do you get that Jason was discussing the murder?

[MerriMent]

Most likely LE subpoened phone records of the witnesses and found Jason's phone number in the call detail of those records.

[Hey Paula]

When JY is finally brought to justice, will MM be the Amber Frey equivalent witness in his trial? I've always thought she might very well be.

[annalyzer]

Originally Posted by Hey Paula

When JY is finally brought to justice, will MM be the Amber Frey equivalent witness in his trial? I've always thought she might very well be.

She won't generate the sympathy like Amber since she was sleeping with a best friends husband.

[Hey Paula]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

She won't generate the sympathy like Amber since she was sleeping with a best friends husband.

While that's true, Anna, if MM cooperated with LE and assisted them in solving this case, she might very well be perceived as being remorseful for her disloyalty/betrayal, and her cooperation with LE perceived as atonement.

In view of the kind of exchanges between MM and JY, none of which indicate MM was jilted or scorned by JY, her testimony shouldn't be viewed as retribution.

IMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

She won't generate the sympathy like Amber since she was sleeping with a best friends husband.

You got that right, Anna.

MM is just as much to blame as Jason for wanting to be together and only thinking of themselves.

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Hey Paula

When JY is finally brought to justice, will MM be the Amber Frey equivalent witness in his trial? I've always thought she might very well be.

When exactly is Jason going to be brought to justice?

Kat

[annalyzer]

Still no arrest?

[kingbuff]

Originally Posted by MerriMent

Where do you get that Jason was discussing the murder?

Oh, I see. Thanks for making me go back and reread the SW.

[kingbuff]

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

When exactly is Jason going to be brought to justice?

Kat

Maybe the question should be when will justice be brought to Jason and his families. I think I can answer that. When the killer(s) are arrested and charged and convicted.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

Still no arrest?

Looks like 2009 will arrive first.

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

Looks like 2009 will arrive first.

Kat

Sadly, Kat, that's probably true. I imagine the GJ has been adjourned for the holidays.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Cardinal

Sadly, Kat, that's probably true. I imagine the GJ has been adjourned for the holidays.

I know, but no one will forget Michelle.

I heard something interesting when experts on television were discussing the Caylee case earlier tonite.

That there are only 5 reasons that someone kills someone.

1) Love

2) Hate

3) Revenge

4) Money

5) Jealousy


Kat

Ps. Card, I wish you and everyone else here a happy and safe holiday.

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

I know, but no one will forget Michelle.

I heard something interesting when experts on television were discussing the Caylee case earlier tonite.

That there are only 5 reasons that someone kills someone.

1) Love

2) Hate

3) Revenge

4) Money

5) Jealousy


Kat

Ps. Card, I wish you and everyone else here a happy and safe holiday.

What a lead in! Go Kat!

[Leanne Weich]

For those who think this is a cold case. Look at what happened in Adam Walsh's case - 27 years and, unfortunately, because the perp died, there will never be justice for Adam on earth,

Police said Toole was long the prime suspect in the case and that they had conclusively linked him to the killing. They declined to be specific about their evidence and noted they had no DNA proof of the crime, but said an extensive review of the case file pointed only to Toole, as John Wash long contended.

"Our agency has devoted an inordinate amount of time seeking leads to other potential perpetrators rather than emphasizing Ottis Toole as our primary suspect," said Hollywood Police Chief Chadwick Wagner. "Ottis Toole has continued to be our only real suspect."

Sorry, but I have lost the link from which this excerpt was taken. If anyone insists, I'll try to find it but there are hundreds of links all saying basically the same thing. Sad but I'm happy for John and his family.

I just hope we don't have to wait that long for justice for Michelle and Rylan - in fact, my biggest hope is that there is an indictment, arrest and conviction during my lifetime although, with the length of time it's taking and my failing health, it may not happen.

[Cardinal]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_case

"Cold case refers to a crime or accident that has not been solved and is not the subject of current criminal investigation or civil litigation...."

Unless I misunderstand the definition of a cold case, a case in which a SW was issued as recently as Nov 6 is hardly "cold". On the contrary, it appears to me that this case is most definitely the subject of a current criminal investigation. I just hope the investigation continues to progress and that we will see justice for Michelle and Rylan in the new year.


In the meantime, I wish a happy, healthy and safe holiday season to you, too, Kat, and to Leanne, Sils, Anna, AE and everyone else.

[annalyzer]

Originally Posted by Leanne Weich

snip~
I just hope we don't have to wait that long for justice for Michelle and Rylan - in fact, my biggest hope is that there is an indictment, arrest and conviction during my lifetime although, with the length of time it's taking and my failing health, it may not happen.

They didn't have the technology back then that they do now and while the investigation was bungled in both cases (in this case missed tooth, no rape kit done, etc.) I really see no excuse for this case to not be solved without a deathbed confession.

I am sorry to hear you aren't feeling well and hope that your health improves.

[Leanne Weich]

Originally Posted by Cardinal

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_case

"Cold case refers to a crime or accident that has not been solved and is not the subject of current criminal investigation or civil litigation...."

Unless I misunderstand the definition of a cold case, a case in which a SW was issued as recently as Nov 6 is hardly "cold". On the contrary, it appears to me that this case is most definitely the subject of a current criminal investigation. I just hope the investigation continues to progress and that we will see justice for Michelle and Rylan in the new year.


In the meantime, I wish a happy, healthy and safe holiday season to you, too, Kat, and to Leanne, Sils, Anna, AE and everyone else.

Card, I know it isn't a cold case. I was pointing out how long Adam's case took and used "cold case" because for the longest time Kat was adamant if no arrest happened the 2 year mark, it would be cold.

Thanks for the good wishes and I hope the very same for you. I hope that some way, some how, Linda and Meredith can get presents to Cassidy although I'm not hopeful, given that presents were returned before Linda ever initiated the WDS. I just wish the adults would step up and keep Cassidy's best interests at heart and, love them or not, she deserves a relationship with both her maternal and paternal families, imo.

[Leanne Weich]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

They didn't have the technology back then that they do now and while the investigation was bungled in both cases (in this case missed tooth, no rape kit done, etc.) I really see no excuse for this case to not be solved without a deathbed confession.

I am sorry to hear you aren't feeling well and hope that your health improves.

You're right about the mess ups in this case - hopefully that is one of the reasons the DA wants what appears to be an excessive amount of CE.

Thanks for the good wishes - nothing that open heart surgery wont fix hopefully.

Originally Posted by Cardinal

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_case

"Cold case refers to a crime or accident that has not been solved and is not the subject of current criminal investigation or civil litigation...."

Unless I misunderstand the definition of a cold case, a case in which a SW was issued as recently as Nov 6 is hardly "cold". On the contrary, it appears to me that this case is most definitely the subject of a current criminal investigation. I just hope the investigation continues to progress and that we will see justice for Michelle and Rylan in the new year.


In the meantime, I wish a happy, healthy and safe holiday season to you, too, Kat, and to Leanne, Sils, Anna, AE and everyone else.

I've always been told a case goes cold when they run out of leads. I'm not sure why someone put in wiki that civil litigation has any bearing on a case being cold or not.

Thanks for the warm wishes - right back atcha (i miss our santa smilies)

Originally Posted by Leanne Weich

Card, I know it isn't a cold case. I was pointing out how long Adam's case took and used "cold case" because for the longest time Kat was adamant if no arrest happened the 2 year mark, it would be cold.

Thanks for the good wishes and I hope the very same for you. I hope that some way, some how, Linda and Meredith can get presents to Cassidy although I'm not hopeful, given that presents were returned before Linda ever initiated the WDS. I just wish the adults would step up and keep Cassidy's best interests at heart and, love them or not, she deserves a relationship with both her maternal and paternal families, imo.

Is there a credible link to presents for Cassidy from Linda and Meredith being returned?

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Dominique

What a lead in! Go Kat!

Huh?



I guess you could count thrill killers in there.

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by alter ego

Is there a credible link to presents for Cassidy from Linda and Meredith being returned?

None that I know of.

But, I guess, now, after filing the wrongful death suit, L F knew she would hurt any chance she had of seeing C..

Kat

Originally Posted by Leanne Weich

You're right about the mess ups in this case - hopefully that is one of the reasons the DA wants what appears to be an excessive amount of CE.

How so when the CE that we know about only leads to a strong suspicion that won't survive a motion to dismiss?

"However, if the evidence is “sufficient only to raise a suspicion or conjecture as to either the commission of the offense or the identity of the defendant as the perpetrator, the motion to dismiss must be allowed.” Molloy, 309 N.C. at 179, 305 S.E.2d at 720 (internal citation omitted). “This is true even though the suspicion aroused by the evidence is strong.”

...“[e]very inference must stand upon some clear and direct evidence,...

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/script...invol=040567-1

(read the whole opinion, there are cases cited that have more CE than this one, yet they were smacked down because the evidence didn't get past suspicion and/or relied on double inference/building of inferences)

[Leanne Weich]

Originally Posted by alter ego

How so when the CE that we know about only leads to a strong suspicion that won't survive a motion to dismiss?

"However, if the evidence is “sufficient only to raise a suspicion or conjecture as to either the commission of the offense or the identity of the defendant as the perpetrator, the motion to dismiss must be allowed.” Molloy, 309 N.C. at 179, 305 S.E.2d at 720 (internal citation omitted). “This is true even though the suspicion aroused by the evidence is strong.”

...“[e]very inference must stand upon some clear and direct evidence,...

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/script...invol=040567-1
(read the whole opinion, there are cases cited that have more CE than this one, yet they were smacked down because the evidence didn't get past suspicion and/or relied on double inference/building of inferences)

AE, thanks for the case law link. I'll read it later .. it is 3.25a.m. now and I have to be at the hospital at 6.00 a.m. so I'd better get some sleep. Just something to ponder though - Spivey said there is more evidence that the public is unaware of.

[kingbuff]

Originally Posted by alter ego

Is there a credible link to presents for Cassidy from Linda and Meredith being returned?

I just looked but can't find it. Someone in the Fisher family shared that info with at least one board poster who then shared it with our world. Credible? Someone better organized than I am can link you to those posts then you decide.

[kingbuff]

Leanne---good luck with your health issues!!! And may the new year be good to you!!

[bookie]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

For Spivey to state his opinion concerning Jason's guilt, there must be considerable solid evidence. You don't hear many in LE sticking their necks out that way. Hope everything turns out good for you Leanne, and your health improves quickly. Happy Holidays everyone !!

If there was "considerable solid" evidence there would have been an arrest by now.

Adding my good wishes for Leanne.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by bookie

If there was "considerable solid" evidence there would have been an arrest by now.

Adding my good wishes for Leanne.

Hi Bookie, of course there would have been an arrest.

Same for me, Leanne..take care of yourself.

Now for the disgusting news of the day,
/OT/
Drew Peterson is engaged to be married again.

Why can't they arrest him?

Kat