Michelle Fisher Young - Wednesday Dec 10 thru dec. 14

[Lindsey]

Let's see if we can start a new thread now.

[Lindsey]

Bringing over the link to a new story posted today on ABC News.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=6427041&page=1

This part is especially interesting to me.

Wake County Assistant District Attorney Howard Cummings said that explaining why Jason Young has not been charged would require revealing evidence that he's not allowed to comment on.

Cummings said Stephens' ruling would not further his office's investigation into Jason Young because it was based largely on police statements, which the District Attorney's Office has already reviewed. He also declined to comment on when or whether charges in Michelle Young's murder would be forthcoming.

That is interesting Lindsey.

It's maddening that they can't comment. I sure would like to know for certain what is preventing them from bringing charges.

And I hope the display of Spivey's obvious bias doesn't prevent the DA from bringing charges or getting a conviction.

[Lindsey]

It's all going to come out sometimes and IMO it's past time. Somebody is getting away with murder and that's just not right.

Justice for Michelle means arresting and convicting the person who killed her, whoever that may be.

BBL

[MerriMent]

Originally Posted by alter ego

That is interesting Lindsey.

It's maddening that they can't comment. I sure would like to know for certain what is preventing them from bringing charges.

And I hope the display of Spivey's obvious bias doesn't prevent the DA from bringing charges or getting a conviction.

I think there is evidence that can't be tied to Jason or Meredith and there is also evidence Jason never left the hotel.

Originally Posted by MerriMent

I think there is evidence that can't be tied to Jason or Meredith and there is also evidence Jason never left the hotel.

Don't tell Spivey, his mind is made up.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Let's see if we can start a new thread now.

Thank you, Lin and CW.


Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

It's all going to come out sometimes and IMO it's past time. Somebody is getting away with murder and that's just not right.

Justice for Michelle means arresting and convicting the person who killed her, whoever that may be.

BBL

Killer or killers must have nerves of steel..

Kat

[MerriMent]

Originally Posted by alter ego

Don't tell Spivey, his mind is made up.

his mind is closed. No wonder this case hasn't been solved.

[annalyzer]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Bringing over the link to a new story posted today on ABC News.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=6427041&page=1

This part is especially interesting to me.

Wake County Assistant District Attorney Howard Cummings said that explaining why Jason Young has not been charged would require revealing evidence that he's not allowed to comment on.

Cummings said Stephens' ruling would not further his office's investigation into Jason Young because it was based largely on police statements, which the District Attorney's Office has already reviewed. He also declined to comment on when or whether charges in Michelle Young's murder would be forthcoming.

This case gets stranger by the day, er, I mean year.

[Barbara2]

Originally Posted by alter ego

BARD is pretty universal in meaning.

I think what gets in the way is the confusion of suspicion with inference. From everything that has been released, I can see why there has been no indictment.

There certainly is reason to have suspicions that Jason killed Michelle. But suspicion won't sustain a charge let alone a conviction.

Thank you. This is an honest response without the nonsense that come with many. I appreciate your honesty and candor.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

This case gets stranger by the day, er, I mean year.

This is another link to a story posted at WRAL today, concerning trials.

This killer was in custody 24 hours after the slaying, but it took 4 1/2
years to get to trial, now this is also outside the big cities there, but, wow.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/wral_...story/4115489/


In Wake County, it is an average of 13 months or 403 days of cases pending.

Rarely does a defendant come in and ask for a speedy trial, says Colin Willoughby.
Kat

I also saw where the ADA is not going after the DP for Brad Cooper because they didn't have proof of any mitigating circumstances. I know I had a lively conversation w/someone here about that and altho 1st degree murder can be punished by death, it still requires proof of aggravating circumstances.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1321657.html

So....the question remains IF Jason murdered Michelle and IF he is ever charged, will the DP be sought and what aggravating circumstance(s) will be cited?

[Kat4Eagles]

It goes on to say, that the longer that defense lawyers are to delay a murder trial,
it is more likely it is to weaken the state's case, Willoughby says.

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by alter ego

I also saw where the ADA is not going after the DP for Brad Cooper because they didn't have proof of any mitigating circumstances. I know I had a lively conversation w/someone here about that and altho 1st degree murder can be punished by death, it still requires proof of aggravating circumstances.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1321657.html

So....the question remains IF Jason murdered Michelle and IF he is ever charged, will the DP be sought and what aggravating circumstance(s) will be cited?

Do you think the fact that C was left behind alone be considered an aggravating factor?

Kat
I know this case is aggravating me.

[Kat4Eagles]

I was trying to think of one word to describe this case.

Endless, is what comes to mind.

What would yours be?

Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally Posted by alter ego

I also saw where the ADA is not going after the DP for Brad Cooper because they didn't have proof of any mitigating circumstances. I know I had a lively conversation w/someone here about that and altho 1st degree murder can be punished by death, it still requires proof of aggravating circumstances.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1321657.html

So....the question remains IF Jason murdered Michelle and IF he is ever charged, will the DP be sought and what aggravating circumstance(s) will be cited?

At this point I couldn't care less whether the murderer of Michelle got the death penalty or LWOP. I just want the murderer(s) arrested, tried, convicted and in prison.

[Hey Paula]

North Carolina capital punishment aggravating factors:

North Carolina-
(1)The murder was especially heinous, atrocious, cruel or depraved (or involved torture)
(2) The capital offense was committed during the commission of, attempt of, or escape from a specified felony (such as robbery, kidnapping, rape, sodomy, arson, oral copulation, train wrecking, carjacking, criminal gang activity, drug dealing, or aircraft piracy)
(3)The murder was part of a course of conduct in which the defendant engaged
(4) The defendant knowingly created a grave risk of death for one or more persons in addition to the victim of the offense
(5) The murder was committed for pecuniary gain or pursuant to an agreement that the defendant would receive something of value
(6) The murder was committed to avoid or prevent arrest, to effect an escape, or to conceal the commission of a crime
(7) The capital offense was committed to interfere with the lawful exercise of any government function or the enforcement of the laws
(8) The defendant has been convicted of, or committed, a prior murder, a felony involving violence, or other serious felony
(9) The capital offense was committed by a person who is incarcerated, has escaped, is on probation, is in jail, or is under a sentence of imprisonment
(10) The victim was a government employee, including peace officers, police officers, federal agents, firefighters, judges, jurors, defense attorneys, and prosecutors, in the course of his or her duties
(11)The murder was committed against a witness against the defendant while engaged in the performance of his official duties

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/aggr...nishment-state

North Carolina fetal homicide law:


N.C. Gen. Stat. § 14-18.2 relates to injury to pregnant woman. The law states that any person, who in the commission of a felony, causes injury to a woman, knowing the woman to be pregnant, in which injury results in the miscarriage or stillbirth by the woman is guilty of a felony that is one class higher than the felony committed.

http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/fethom.htm

AE,

Do you think Nos 1, 4 and 5 might apply?

No Paula, I do not think any of those are aggravating circumstances in this case.

And NC does not have a fetal homicide law.

[Hey Paula]

Originally Posted by alter ego

No Paula, I do not think any of those are aggravating circumstances in this case.

And NC does not have a fetal homicide law.

Thanks for your reply, AE.

I thought that although JY didn't pursue the proceeds from the LIP, that it would nevertheless be viewed as a motive, given the circumstances of his alibi not being ironclad. I also felt that due to the number of wounds Michelle sustained, and that the murder was committed while Cassidy was home, that #1 might apply.

Re NC Fetal Homicide Law:

Do you mean that the law wasn't in effect in 2006? The link I posted was updated in 2008 and reads that there are FHLs in the following states:

Currently, at least 36 states have fetal homicide laws. The states include: Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Nebraska, Nevada, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia and Wisconsin. At least 19 states have fetal homicide laws that apply to the earliest stages of pregnancy ("any state of gestation," "conception," "fertilization" or "post-fertilization"), indicated below with an asterisk (*).

[annalyzer]

There is a difference between Laci's law and the fetal homicide law?

I'll go google.

[annalyzer]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

There is a difference between Laci's law and the fetal homicide law?

I'll go google.

Under Laci and Connor law the death of the fetus would be a seperate offense.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

At this point I couldn't care less whether the murderer of Michelle got the death penalty or LWOP. I just want the murderer(s) arrested, tried, convicted and in prison.

Me too, it is taking forever.

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

This also does not sound too promising.

From the article at WRAL today:

Referring to time going by in a murder case.....

"You can't find a witness,you lose a piece of evidence,someone's
memory is unfaulty or uncertain.
Passage of time usually works in the favor of the defendant."

Then Willoughby goes on to say ,and I find this interesting.
"The personailty of the D A's also plays a role, some are more willing to accept a plea offer than others"

Hmm.

Kat

[Barbara2]

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

This also does not sound too promising.

From the article at WRAL today:

Referring to time going by in a murder case.....

"You can't find a witness,you lose a piece of evidence,someone's
memory is unfaulty or uncertain.
Passage of time usually works in the favor of the defendant."

Then Willoughby goes on to say ,and I find this interesting.
"The personailty of the D A's also plays a role, some are more willing to accept a plea offer than others"

Hmm.

Kat

I seriously doubt that the murderer has requested a plea deal at this point since he has yet to be indicted/arrested. JMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Barbara2

I seriously doubt that the murderer has requested a plea deal at this point since he has yet to be indicted/arrested. JMO

I didn't have anyone special in mind when I posted that, just a concept of what is going on within the system.

Kat

[Hey Paula]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Bringing over the link to a new story posted today on ABC News.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=6427041&page=1

This part is especially interesting to me.

Wake County Assistant District Attorney Howard Cummings said that explaining why Jason Young has not been charged would require revealing evidence that he's not allowed to comment on.

Cummings said Stephens' ruling would not further his office's investigation into Jason Young because it was based largely on police statements, which the District Attorney's Office has already reviewed. He also declined to comment on when or whether charges in Michelle Young's murder would be forthcoming.

I think the evidence DA Cummings is referring to is the same evidence Det Spivey submitted to Judge Stephens which, if made public now, might jeopardize their case.

I believe JY will be charged, but only at a time when the DA believes it will serve in a successful prosecution and result in a conviction.

IMO

[achristie]

Originally Posted by Hey Paula

I think the evidence DA Cummings is referring to is the same evidence Det Spivey submitted to Judge Stephens which, if made public now, might jeopardize their case.

I believe JY will be charged, but only at a time when the DA believes it will serve in a successful prosecution and result in a conviction.

IMO

Nice to see you, Paula. Always the voice of reason.
I agree that JY will be charged EVENTUALLY.
Some earlier discussion about the death penalty.
I'm so torn about that. Are you? Ever since reading Sister Helen Prejean her words have haunted me.

MOO Aggie

[annalyzer]

Originally Posted by Hey Paula

I think the evidence DA Cummings is referring to is the same evidence Det Spivey submitted to Judge Stephens which, if made public now, might jeopardize their case.

I believe JY will be charged, but only at a time when the DA believes it will serve in a successful prosecution and result in a conviction.

IMO

But what will more time give him to get a successful conviction? I'm thinking the more time that elapses the less successful he will be.

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by Hey Paula

I think the evidence DA Cummings is referring to is the same evidence Det Spivey submitted to Judge Stephens which, if made public now, might jeopardize their case.

I believe JY will be charged, but only at a time when the DA believes it will serve in a successful prosecution and result in a conviction.

IMO

Or he could be referring to something that doesn't point to Jason at all. That would certainly explain why he hasn't been arrested. It could even be the therapist's notes.

IMO

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

But what will more time give him to get a successful conviction? I'm thinking the more time that elapses the less successful he will be.

Hi Anna.

I'm thinking the same. The longer this goes on, the less hope I have of ever seeing justice for Michelle.

[Hey Paula]

Originally Posted by achristie

Nice to see you, Paula. Always the voice of reason.
I agree that JY will be charged EVENTUALLY.
Some earlier discussion about the death penalty.
I'm so torn about that. Are you? Ever since reading Sister Helen Prejean her words have haunted me.

MOO Aggie

Hi there Aggie!

It's always a pleasure to see you too, my dear!

I haven't read Sister Helen's thoughts re the DP. Are they posted on the internet or have you read one of her books?

As for myself, I feel LWOP is often the best punishment, i.e., poetic justice, especially for those who choose murder as a means to obtain personal freedom and/or to enrich themselves.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Or he could be referring to something that doesn't point to Jason at all. That would certainly explain why he hasn't been arrested. It could even be the therapist's notes.

IMO

Wouldn't that be something?

If we were to make a list of all they have that we know of, there is no way there is not enough there to indict.

And, yet they don't.

Or maybe, they can't.

Kat

[achristie]

Originally Posted by annalyzer

But what will more time give him to get a successful conviction? I'm thinking the more time that elapses the less successful he will be.

Anna, I think that may hold true for the small cadre of people that have followed this case since day one. MOST people are not like US. A jury comes in cold, listens to the facts that are presented, then makes their decision. To me, the more time it takes doesn't necessarily translate to less success. We have eaten just about every morsel, rumor and fact, for a VERY long time. We have angst and yearning and questions BECAUSE we have stuck with it since day 1. Not so for an unbiased jury. In fact, not one of us would make good jurists on this case. Something to think about.

MOO Aggie

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Hi Anna.

I'm thinking the same. The longer this goes on, the less hope I have of ever seeing justice for Michelle.

It just should not be taking be this long.

That is why when someone writes this case is a slam dunk, and an arrest is imminent, I have to wonder what case they are following.!!

The biggest thing in Jason's favor, to me, is that there is no motive .


Kat

[Barbara2]

Originally Posted by achristie

Anna, I think that may hold true for the small cadre of people that have followed this case since day one. MOST people are not like US. A jury comes in cold, listens to the facts that are presented, then makes their decision. To me, the more time it takes doesn't necessarily translate to less success. We have eaten just about every morsel, rumor and fact, for a VERY long time. We have angst and yearning and questions BECAUSE we have stuck with it since day 1. Not so for an unbiased jury. In fact, not one of us would make good jurists on this case. Something to think about.

MOO Aggie

Excellent point! (I looked for an icon but none were appropriate. Just pretend. :wineglass: )

[Barbara2]

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

It just should not be taking be this long.

<snipped>

The biggest thing in Jason's favor, to me, is that there is no motive .


Kat

I know you said that you followed the Laci Peterson case and you believed all along that he was guilty. What did you see as his motive? I don't see a lot of difference in the two cases in terms of circumstances so I'm curious.

[Hey Paula]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Or he could be referring to something that doesn't point to Jason at all. That would certainly explain why he hasn't been arrested. It could even be the therapist's notes.

IMO

I think the therapist's notes might perhaps refer to a transgender issue Michelle might have learned about, which LE might feel was motive for her murder, given the proximity of the disclosure to her death. A search of "gay bars in NYC" was found on JY's computer.

IMO

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by Kat4Eagles

It just should not be taking be this long.

That is why when someone writes this case is a slam dunk, and an arrest is imminent, I have to wonder what case they are following.!!

The biggest thing in Jason's favor, to me, is that there is no motive .


Kat

I think they can't place him at the scene or even they can't prove he actually left the hotel that night. Walking down the hall toward the exit door doesn't mean anything if it doesn't show him going outside. The stairs are in the same direction he is walking too ... not just the exit.

I also think they might have evidence from the crime scene that does not fit Jason and they can't explain that.

JMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally Posted by Barbara2

I know you said that you followed the Laci Peterson case and you believed all along that he was guilty. What did you see as his motive? I don't see a lot of difference in the two cases in terms of circumstances so I'm curious.

1) Scott lied every time he opened his mouth.
2) Scott told Amber Laci was dead, before she was.
3) Scott pretended to be in Paris with Francois and Pasquale.
4) Scott did not want to be a Father.
5) Scott pretended to be something he wasn't.

And, now he is right where he should be.

Kat