Discussion - March 19th.

[n/t]

Good Morning Everyone,

The fact remains that Nicholas is not listed on the King County website as a missing person because there is no evidence of foul play at this time. We would assume that by now they would've received the results from fingerprint analysis and/or and other forensic evidence that may have suggested foul play. Also, we could also assume that financial and / or any other records were checked. Sightings? Probably checked and verified.

http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/news/...ssing_persons/


So here we are left with the why?

Why would a handsome young man with 2 children and another on the way leave his family voluntarily supposedly without telling his wife? Or did he?

Why do we have this deafening silence from his family?

Why have there not been anymore searches in over a month?

Why does the wife continue to believe he was murdered and did not run off on them?

These are just a few.


Nicholas, if you did walk away, please please call someone to let them know you are safe. Seek legal advice if need be. Please think of your children. Remember they're only children. They don't understand and they don't deserve this.

Praying today is the day you will feel it in your heart to call someone.

[Shelby1]

Good morning everyone!

N/T, you summed it up beautifully.

I guess now, we sit and wait.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Morning everyone

Reading posts from last night it looks like it has been confirmed there is no PI. So that throws out any possible security or ethical breach or any other problems posed with Publicis that would make him walk off from his job. IMO

[AJandTam]

Originally posted by n/t [*]Good Morning Everyone,

The fact remains that Nicholas is not listed on the King County website as a missing person because there is no evidence of foul play at this time. We would assume that by now they would've received the results from fingerprint analysis and/or and other forensic evidence that may have suggested foul play. Also, we could also assume that financial and / or any other records were checked. Sightings? Probably checked and verified.

http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/news/...ssing_persons/


So here we are left with the why?

Why would a handsome young man with 2 children and another on the way leave his family voluntarily supposedly without telling his wife? Or did he?

Why do we have this deafening silence from his family?

Why have there not been anymore searches in over a month?

Why does the wife continue to believe he was murdered and did not run off on them?

These are just a few.


Nicholas, if you did walk away, please please call someone to let them know you are safe. Seek legal advice if need be. Please think of your children. Remember they're only children. They don't understand and they don't deserve this.

Praying today is the day you will feel it in your heart to call someone. [/*]

Good Morning n/t

Why O Why is right. Why leave on the 13th, a wednesday, after working half the week for a job/career you are going to just ditch. Why bother to battle the traffic on a wed morning, to and from work. Then ditch the car in Federal Way??? Why not just call from home. Claim you have an ER or a flat tire or whatever, and just head straight down to Federal Way, ditch the car and take off???

[Shelby1]

Originally posted by AJandTam [*]

Good Morning n/t

Why O Why is right. Why leave on the 13th, a wednesday, after working half the week for a job/career you are going to just ditch. Why bother to battle the traffic on a wed morning, to and from work. Then ditch the car in Federal Way??? Why not just call from home. Claim you have an ER or a flat tire or whatever, and just head straight down to Federal Way, ditch the car and take off??? [/*]

Good points.

Just when I convince myself that he left on his own, I think about all the other things that don't add up.

[AJandTam]

Originally posted by Shelby1 [*]

Good points.

Just when I convince myself that he left on his own, I think about all the other things that don't add up. [/*]

Morning Shelby. Being right is not always what it's cracked up to be. This is one of those times. I'd love to be wrong, I just have a hard time believing Nick left on his own. Doesn't make sense to me w/what little bit we know. More things could come to light later that make it all fit, but for now. I'm not buying it.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Shelby1 [*]

Good points.

Just when I convince myself that he left on his own, I think about all the other things that don't add up. [/*]

same here Shelby - like a pendulum swing

[Shelby1]

Originally posted by AJandTam [*]

Morning Shelby. Being right is not always what it's cracked up to be. This is one of those times. I'd love to be wrong, I just have a hard time believing Nick left on his own. Doesn't make sense to me w/what little bit we know. More things could come to light later that make it all fit, but for now. I'm not buying it. [/*]

Good morning!

I hope he's safe and sound, too.

The thing that makes me lean towards him leaving on his own is the complete silence of his family and friends, now. But, all the other pieces don't fit in with that scenario, so *sigh*.

[desmom]

I think it is easier for many of us to believe he walked because we don't want to believe he was injured due to foul play.

I really believe there is a lot more to the story. I would be interested in his activities 7-10 days before 2/13. I know they resigned from the church two days before he disappeared. What else?

Did he have any business appointments? Dr. appointments? Meet anyone new? Go out for dinner or to meet friends? Who did he talk to during that time? Did he have his car serviced? Did his spending habits change? Did he make any changes to insurance policies recently? Did he give away any prized possessions?

Has LE ran a credit report? Are there any new credit cards? New loans or application for loans?

jmo

Originally posted by filesmanwife [*]



I have lurking quit a while and I go back and forth between the the two ideas that he left and that something happened. When the posters started to work the SAHM angle and saying it was "not woking'. Let me clue you in on my and (many of my frieds situation) my dh met in college, I had all intents and purposes of being a career women and mom "having it all as they say. first child and 2 jobs transfers later - still working and happy..... Paying big bucks for day care - (at this point and time me and dh still earning same pay) 2nd child and another job transfer (we agreed that 1. I really couldn't further my career by continually quitting jobs everytime hubby transferred and most of my salary now would go to day care.. ff to 4 kids and more transfers, my hubby has more than doubled our salary when we started. In my taking care of homefront he has been able to focus on work... It has not been easy for either and was at first very hard financially (we lost 1/2 income). I also have a job at home which brings in $500 a month with little overhead (webconsultant).

I guess the point being is focusing on her being a sahm, takes away from look for nf.

It also concerns me that neither one of their families seems to be rallying around her. I know in that situation. My house would be full of people to help me and watch my kids while I pounded on every door I could..

I would also want to be pounding the pavement and getting his family involved because if that sob left me, he would be paying support. Pride is nothing compared to the welfare of my kids.....

jmho [/*]

Originally posted by BobbisAngel [*]Thanks Harlett....it is good to know that LE haven't just written Nick off. Just because LE hasn't found any sign of foul play doesn't really mean a thing. There are tons of missing people that LE didn't find any trace of foul play yet they have never shown up anywhere. Maybe some walked but I doubt that they all did. He is still missing...without a trace.

I'm just not into putting the blame on Christine in any way. Until LE has proof that she has done something wrong I will support her. I'm sure that she has been checked out in every way by LE. Isn't it the spouse that they look at first.

I have a hard time believing that Nick walked out on his family. It doesn't make sense that he would just leave his car parked somewhere. Why would he get rid of his car? Even if he knew that LE was looking for him and he got stopped he would only have to show them his license and say that he left on his own.

If he did walk out then in my book he isn't much of a man. He is a coward. A coward runs instead of doing it the right way. A man lets his wife know what is happening. He takes his belongings with him and doesn't leave them at home for her to deal with. A coward leaves his children without a backward glance. I agree with Christine. I don't think Nick is a coward. [/*]

BobbisAngel & filesmanwife

unfortunately your's were the last two posts but I thought they were excellent so I have quoted them here.

[AJandTam]

Originally posted by Shelby1 [*]

Good morning!

I hope he's safe and sound, too.

The thing that makes me lean towards him leaving on his own is the complete silence of his family and friends, now. But, all the other pieces don't fit in with that scenario, so *sigh*. [/*]

In some cases, I think it can be sticky for families if babies are involved.

Shelby, I know in a few other cases, we've gotten word that the person ran off on there own. If Postie is on, she can remind us of the man in Alabama a few mos back who staged his own disappearance and left his wife of 38 years. It happens. In other cases, we never know what happened, only that the person is alive and well.

[Shelby1]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/entert...,2626358.story

Here is an article about another missing man.

[dianaelaine]

Harlett: Are you able to tell us, why the family is so quiet? Why there doesn't seem to be any activity with any of his friends, coworkers or family?

Thanks

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Shelby1 [*]http://www.chicagotribune.com/entert...,2626358.story

Here is an article about another missing man. [/*]

I was just on the TES website and I'm not sure what I can link over here. But if you go to missing, then found, there is a 26 year old man who disappeared much like NF did. A few weeks later he notified his family - it was described as a "meltdown". The guy just walked off.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by desmom [*]I think it is easier for many of us to believe he walked because we don't want to believe he was injured due to foul play.

I really believe there is a lot more to the story. I would be interested in his activities 7-10 days before 2/13. I know they resigned from the church two days before he disappeared. What else?

Did he have any business appointments? Dr. appointments? Meet anyone new? Go out for dinner or to meet friends? Who did he talk to during that time? Did he have his car serviced? Did his spending habits change? Did he make any changes to insurance policies recently? Did he give away any prized possessions?

Has LE ran a credit report? Are there any new credit cards? New loans or application for loans?

jmo [/*]

I think things like this need to be checked as well. It seems like these types of inquiries could help LE in determining whether it points more to foul play or walking away.

Has anyone truly verified that Harlett speaks with CF? She will not give the exact details of how she knows for sure that Publicis did not hire a PI nor would she admit to actually speaking to CF- is that correct? So other than Harlett's words, I don't think that has truly been verified yet. It can probably be done with a few phone calls though. I'm not into vague details- but facts and justification of those facts. Otherwise it's just another member on a message board talking with the group and pondering the possibilities.

Originally posted by tulipmom [*]Has anyone truly verified that Harlett speaks with CF? She will not give the exact details of how she knows for sure that Publicis did not hire a PI nor would she admit to actually speaking to CF- is that correct? So other than Harlett's words, I don't think that has truly been verified yet. It can probably be done with a few phone calls though. I'm not into vague details- but facts and justification of those facts. Otherwise it's just another member on a message board talking with the group and pondering the possibilities. [/*]

You all are amazing - you question EVERYTHING - (did the reporter get it right, is Harlett who she claims to be, etc) EXCEPT your OWN OPINIONS - "Christine is High maintenance and responsible for this somehow"

I am so tired of reading you all slandering someone you don't know. I have a feeling you would be doing no better in her shoes!

You are missing the point. I could say that I had spoken with CF or I could make another point about knowing that LE said this or that there was never a PI hired but without links or something credible to back it up, who would believe it? So just because someone posts it, why believe it? There are many oddities in this case. They all need to be picked apart and each part of the whole puzzle matters.

[saydeezmom]

Last night I was thinking. Why would she take most all pics down except the one of her smiling directly at the photographer and the one of Zea turning 4?

Guilt! Just in case he walked. She know that if he checks it 1) he will see her face and know he did wrong 2) poor Zea was probably a daddy's girl and 3) no pics of Noah; leaving him to wonder and want to call/come home.

jmo

Originally posted by truecrimejunkie [*]

You all are amazing - you question EVERYTHING - (did the reporter get it right, is Harlett who she claims to be, etc) EXCEPT your OWN OPINIONS - "Christine is High maintenance and responsible for this somehow"

I am so tired of reading you all slandering someone you don't know. I have a feeling you would be doing no better in her shoes! [/*]

I have a request. Is it possible for you to say something like: "I believe Christine is not that way and here is why: ________" and I will listen. The power of persuasion is to not argue and get nasty, but to share your side and opinion in a manner so that others may be more open to listening to what you have to say and maybe even change their minds. I honestly have to say I cannot begin to listen to those who come in here and do hit and runs every other day just yelling at everyone. You know what I mean? I say this with all due respect and to keep the board open and free to exchange ALL of our thoughts.

BTW, I think it's libel you were looking to use. Slander is spoken. As this place by definition is an opinion and ideas board and none of us know Christine or have the ability to know the truth (but lie about it), I think we're okay. CW will tell us though.

Also, and i'm not saying this is true in Harlett's case, as I think she has enough to back her up -- but it wouldn't be the first time on one of these crime boards for someone to come on and pretend or portray themselves as somebody they are not. I will admit that I wish there was a rule on this message board that if someone claims they are a licensed PI, that they use their real name and have their license details in their sig. I am on another board that has a requirement like this for professionals (it's not a crime board, however).

That's all. Have a good day and hopefully we can keep on chatting and giving opinions

Originally posted by tulipmom [*]You are missing the point. I could say that I had spoken with CF or I could make another point about knowing that LE said this or that there was never a PI hired but without links or something credible to back it up, who would believe it? So just because someone posts it, why believe it? There are many oddities in this case. They all need to be picked apart and each part of the whole puzzle matters. [/*]

I made my OWN point

Originally posted by field of snow [*]

I have a request. Is it possible for you to say something like: "I believe Christine is not that way and here is why: ________" and I will listen. The power of persuasion is to not argue and get nasty, but to share your side and opinion in a manner so that others may be more open to listening to what you have to say and maybe even change their minds. I honestly have to say I cannot begin to listen to those who come in here and do hit and runs every other day just yelling at everyone. You know what I mean? I say this with all due respect and to keep the board open and free to exchange ALL of our thoughts.

BTW, I think it's libel you were looking to use. Slander is spoken. As this place by definition is an opinion and ideas board and none of us know Christine or have the ability to know the truth (but lie about it), I think we're okay. CW will tell us though.

Also, and i'm not saying this is true in Harlett's case, as I think she has enough to back her up -- but it wouldn't be the first time on one of these crime boards for someone to come on and pretend or portray themselves as somebody they are not. I will admit that I wish there was a rule on this message board that if someone claims they are a licensed PI, that they use their real name and have their license details in their sig. I am on another board that has a requirement like this for professionals (it's not a crime board, however).

That's all. Have a good day and hopefully we can keep on chatting and giving opinions [/*]

Yes - when you all get on and have your "trash Christine" club - everything goes fine until someone with a different opinion speaks up.

IMO, we should all remember to be sure to distinguish in all of our posts if something we are stating with regards to the curcumstaces on this case, or in our interpretation of other posts/posters, whether our words are facts or opinions. I believe, we have been reminded of that on a couple of occasions. IMO, these *rules* should apply, regardless of what theory of the events of NF's disappearace we ourselves subscribe to believing. Since this seems to have turned into a "For or Against CF" issue, which it really isn't at all (IMO), the same general guidelines should apply, regardless of which *side* we are on.

IMO, *Facts* should be stated as such, with the substantiation and/or corraborating evidence or source. And *opinions* should also be clearly identified as such. Everyone should keep in mind that all posters here are entitled to their opinions, even if we do not necessarily share them. If someone states an opinion, they should not be condemed or chastised for doing so. By the same token, if something is presented as a fact, it should be presenting with supporting information so that it can be confirmed by the audience.

From an on-line dictionary:

FACT
http://education.yahoo.com/reference...GlE.C1gpqsgMMF
fact ?? (fkt) KEY ?

NOUN:

Knowledge or information based on real occurrences: an account based on fact; a blur of fact and fancy.

Something demonstrated to exist or known to have existed: Genetic engineering is now a fact. That Chaucer was a real person is an undisputed fact.
A real occurrence; an event: had to prove the facts of the case.
Something believed to be true or real: a document laced with mistaken facts.
A thing that has been done, especially a crime: an accessory before the fact.
Law The aspect of a case at law comprising events determined by evidence: The jury made a finding of fact

OPINION
http://education.yahoo.com/reference...cwLi9D1T.sgMMF
o?pin?ion ?? (-pnyn) KEY ?

NOUN:

A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof: "The world is not run by thought, nor by imagination, but by opinion" (Elizabeth Drew).
A judgment based on special knowledge and given by an expert: a medical opinion.
A judgment or estimation of the merit of a person or thing: has a low opinion of braggarts.
The prevailing view: public opinion.
Law A formal statement by a court or other adjudicative body of the legal reasons and principles for the conclusions of the court.

All of the above is MOO

Originally posted by truecrimejunkie [*]


Yes - when you all get on and have your "trash Christine" club - everything goes fine until someone with a different opinion speaks up. [/*]

But the problem is, your opinions are not about Christine, but about those who you consider are in the "Trash Christine Club". My point was to suggest sharing your opinion about the case and even CF and why she isn't the way some have an opinion of her. Instead of calling other board members names and having hissing fits...These are the attitudes that get everything riled up around here and supposive "sides" being taken.

I hope you can calm down and share.

[huskiki]

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]Yay, I finally was able to register! I've been reading all of the posts for the last few days and I think it's pretty cool that there are so many minds working together to solve this!

I wanted to throw this out there, because I do live in the Seattle area and it was on the news...

Mars Hill just opened a new location- they bought out an old night club after it was shut down due to violence. I guess members of the church have been working on the remodel for months and have found drug parafanailia (spelling?) and such.

Does anyone think he could have been helping with the remodel and someone upset that the club shut-down could have "targeted" him? It might be something, IMO.

Here's the link to the news story:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/...ml?source=mypi [/*]

Welcome aboard All4Nic

Anything is possible at this point.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]Also, does anyone know if there is a link or special place to go to get copies of his missing persons flyer? I could post some down in the Tacoma-Olympia area. [/*]

Welcome

I'm sure someone will come along that can tell you where to get some posters, and what a nice thing to do!

[dianaelaine]

mc528 said:

-------------------------------------------------

if something is presented as a fact, it should be presenting with supporting information so that it can be confirmed by the audience.

----------------------------------------------

ABSOLUTELY!!!

mc528 said:

-------------------------------------------------

If someone states an opinion, they should not be condemed or chastised for doing so.

---------------------------------------------

That's the way they do things over at the BIZ site, and is exactly why I came over here.

[dianaelaine]

Originally posted by field of snow [*]

But the problem is, your opinions are not about Christine, but about those who you consider are in the "Trash Christine Club". My point was to suggest sharing your opinion about the case and even CF and why she isn't the way some have an opinion of her. Instead of calling other board members names and having hissing fits...These are the attitudes that get everything riled up around here and supposive "sides" being taken.

I hope you can calm down and share. [/*]

Absolutely!!!

[n/t]

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]Also, does anyone know if there is a link or special place to go to get copies of his missing persons flyer? I could post some down in the Tacoma-Olympia area. [/*]

Here's the latest version.

http://www.findnicholasfrancisco.com/

[Shelby1]

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]Also, does anyone know if there is a link or special place to go to get copies of his missing persons flyer? I could post some down in the Tacoma-Olympia area. [/*]

Welcome!! I'm trying to find a link for you.

[desmom]

Originally posted by EG~Lives [*]


Harlett is the cream of the crop. If she said she did... she did.


IMO



[/*]

ITA! Harlett is one heck of an advocate for the missing.

[isitme]

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]Also, does anyone know if there is a link or special place to go to get copies of his missing persons flyer? I could post some down in the Tacoma-Olympia area. [/*]

Here is one that can be downloaded. There may be others out there. This is one that was quickest for me to find.

http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.co...-to-15000.html

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]Also, does anyone know if there is a link or special place to go to get copies of his missing persons flyer? I could post some down in the Tacoma-Olympia area. [/*]

also contact Harlett as she was looking for volunteers in your area and I think you are the only one that has said they were willing to help.

[dianaelaine]

Originally posted by decor [*]

also contact Harlett as she was looking for volunteers in your area and I think you are the only one that has said they were willing to help. [/*]

I contacted Harlett quite awhile ago, to tell her my sons would help, but never heard back from her.

[isitme]

Originally posted by All4Nic [*]

This one will work, the one from his website doesn't have the large "missing" at the top like this one. I think it will catch more eyes! Thank you. [/*]

Your welcome. And thanks for doing whatever you can to help find him.

I have debating whether to post this. It has been mentioned that his car was parked in proximity to a park. In one of the areas we lived in there was a park which was nortorius for being a "hook-up" sight for married gay men. could it be that this park was one of those parks and nick went there and either.

1. met with someone who harmed him

2. met with someone with whom he ran off with??

it is very curious the case of the other man who disappeared at the same time as nf.

I wish his family would speak on the subject. To me their silence is very curious....

[Postergeist]

Mornin' all!

I was catching up with yesterday's thread and noticed this link being bandied about again-


http://www.waspc.org/mp/missing.php?wac=08M0002895

Since it's been over a month and this site STILL hasn’t been updated with a photo or description of clothing, location of where he was last seen either and wondered why NF's family haven't tried to correct that, or others that are in the "industry" (if you will) of listing and finding missing people?

(granted, I had to notify my local FBI twice to say please update your site that the child's remains { Heaven LaShae Ross} had finally been recovered, as they still had her listed as missing)


Since most postings on family and friends of NF/CF blogs/mbs/ et al have stopped cold since last month other than "we're still praying for you" type posts and from reading some posts last night it really does seem he may have walked away.

I do recall reading somewhere that when CF was asked if her hubby had a passport, she wasn't certain.

Anyone know if they had any friends/business dealings with anyone in Canada?

If he indeed walked, IMO he must've thought his wife as a stable enough person to continue to provide a healthy environment for their safety and wellbeing.

Originally posted by dianaelaine [*]

I contacted Harlett quite awhile ago, to tell her my sons would help, but never heard back from her. [/*]

maybe she wanted to hear from your sons who be the ones volunteering. I would think it would be a little difficult to have to go thru you to communicate with them since they are there and you are on this side of the country.

[huskiki]

Originally posted by filesmanwife [*]I have debating whether to post this. It has been mentioned that his car was parked in proximity to a park. In one of the areas we lived in there was a park which was nortorius for being a "hook-up" sight for married gay men. could it be that this park was one of those parks and nick went there and either.

1. met with someone who harmed him

2. met with someone with whom he ran off with??

it is very curious the case of the other man who disappeared at the same time as nf.

I wish his family would speak on the subject. To me their silence is very curious.... [/*]

That is a very good possiblity, especially if he met someone online and decided to meet up.

I think most cities must have a park known for this!