Walkaway Scenario (Redux)

[J. J. in Phila]

I'm starting this thread to look at the possibility that RFG walked away and as a continuation of the original walkaway scenario thread. It looks at the possibility , note the word "possibility" that RFG walked away, what indicators there are that he did, what indicators there are that he didn't. I still give the murder/walkaway chances at 42.5%/42.5%, though that might change based on new evidence.

First up are the witnesses. If all the Lewisburg witnesses (there are at least 7) are totally correct, there is a 100% change that RFG was in Lewisburg on 4/16/05. If the Fenton/Grine sighting is correct RFG returned to Bellefonte on the afternoon of 4/15. If the Wilkes-Barre witnesses are correct, RFG was there on 4/18/05.

In terms of timing we don't seem to have a two witnesses that place RFG in a different location at the same time. Nobody that I know of has ever said, "I saw RFG in Lewisburg at 3:00 PM, so he couldn't have been in Bellefonte." That hypothetical witness would either wrong, in part at least, or Fenton would be wrong.

Most witnesses are NOT 100% accurate. However, the chances on them being right can increase.

1. If more than one person sees the same thing increase the chances on it being accurate.

You can figure that each witness has a 10 percent chance of being perfectly accurate and a 25 percent chance of being generally accurate. I'll give a 5% and 10%, respectively, chance for each additional witness.

2. If someone knows the person being seen decreases the chances of mistaken identity, so increases the chances of accuracy.

3. The amount of contact, especially conversation, increases the chances of accuracy. The person has to concentrate a bit more to talk to someone that to just pass them on a street.

There are other factors, a mental illness, impairment, a motive to give false testimony, that would lessen the chances of accuracy. These things obviously do not apply to these witnesses.

All of these witness have some aspect of 1, 2 and 3.

All the Lewisburg witnesses saw RFG after Noon on 4/15, though this is spread out over two days. That RFG was in Lewisburg at some after Noon 4/15 is high. Even mistaken identity has been explained to some extent by racial misidentification, which isn't present. These witnesses come under 1 collectively.

Both Fenton and Grine agree that they saw RFG in another car; both know him personally. Grine isn't sure ot the day but limits it to 4/14 or 4/15; Fenton is on video where she says she was on 4/15. Fenton alone comes in on number #2 and as to RFG driving another car Grine/Fenton get both #2 and #1. We know have a higher degree of credibility that RFG was driving another car.

Wilkes-Barre has a witness that spoke with RFG and another independent witness that he was there, so we have both #1 and #3.

Lewisburg witnesses:

Chances that RFG was in Lewisburg after Noon on 4/15, just based on witness accounts. 85% Chances that RFG was there on 4/16, just based on witness accounts. 20% (possibly 25%).

Fenton/Grine:

I'll start off with a base of 40% that any Fenton would be accurate. In the personally known section I'll add 20% for each additional "personally known" witness. (I really should add more to Grine for being an ex-police officer; they are trained to be observant.)

Grine cannot confirm the date, so the likelihood of the Fenton sighting on 4/15/05 is 40%. The likelihood of RFG driving a different car on 4/14 or 4/15 is 60%.

Wilkes-Barre Witnesses:

The witness who engaged in conversation was more focused, so I'll give this a 30% of being generally accurate. The second witness apparently wasn't in the conversation, so I'll treat her as being a category one second witness and give her a 10% chance.

Overall, a 40% chance. Relatively high, but not more than likely than not.

Two things come out from the witnesses:

1. It is likely that RFG was in Lewisburg after Noon on 4/15 (85% chance from witness reports, alone).

2. It is 60% likely that RFG was driving a different car on 4/14 or 4/15. (Interestingly there is at least one witness report of RFG getting into a car in Lewisburg, but that isn't factored in to this).

Okay, from the witnesses, RFG was likely in Lewisburg after noon on 4/15 and likely driving another car on 4/14 or 4/15. A 40% chance, just from the witnesses, that RFG was at the Courthouse at 3:00 PM on 4/15 and in Wilkes-Barre on 4/18.

[ladyheartfixer]

still have to agree with you on this matter JJ...the possibility remains...either walk away or for some reason placed into a protective program because maybe he did know the "secret" and he had to be sequestered for his own protection. In that case, the fact that neither LG or PF were placed in protection makes me think that he hadn't disclosed anything to them and therefore they would be safe.

see..I DO post off and on. Just not very often.

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by logicworks [*]Using your 'rules of thumb', we can then safely conclude that RG never traveled through Bellefonte, past dozens of neighbor's houses, was not seen by any of the population who inhabit the town he lived in as he traveled through, nor by anyone enroute to or in Pleasant Gap, or in Centre Hall, or traveling down route 192. The thousands of inhabitants in Centre County who could have recognized their local DA saw NO one matching that description driving a red and white Mini prior to noon on 4/15/05.

Actually you can't. Here is a good example. RFG was in the park at 5:30 PM. At 6:17 PM he entered the Courthouse. No one saw him go between those two points, even though he obviously did. Likewise, no one saw the Mini until around 6:00 PM on 4/15. By your theory, it just appeared there, magically.

We have zero witnesses who reported such a sighting, so based on your 'numbers' that you call reliable, it was impossible for RG to have traveled in/through any of Centre County on 4/15 am.
JMO [/*]

We are looking at the accuracy of sighting, not how many people were not paying attention.

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by logicworks [*]


So based on your conclusions, residents of Centre County, including close neighbors, do not pay any attention to someone they might know, while Union Countians pay very close attention to someone they don't know. Do you have a name for that particular 'rule of thumb'?
JMO [/*]

Interestingly, under your theory, RFG was teleported from Talleyrand Park to the Courthouse and the Mini was teleported from Bellefonte to Lewisburg. We know the time roughly RFG was in the park and when he arrived at the Courthouse. No one saw him; no one saw the Mini or him walking to the Courthouse.

I am saying that people are not generally observant, and that, unless it was something obvious, like a red car parked in a lot all by itself, most people won't remember it. Consider this, were there only 10-15 people in the area of the Street of Shops on 4/15-16? There could have been several hundred there during that time. How many reported seeing RFG? A small percentage.

How many people are paying attention to watching the cars on 192? My guess would be less than 100. How many of those could see the driver of a car? Maybe 20?

Originally posted by ladyheartfixer [*]still have to agree with you on this matter JJ...the possibility remains...either walk away or for some reason placed into a protective program because maybe he did know the "secret" and he had to be sequestered for his own protection. In that case, the fact that neither LG or PF were placed in protection makes me think that he hadn't disclosed anything to them and therefore they would be safe.

see..I DO post off and on. Just not very often. [/*]

J.J. appears to be using some kind of "new" math. I could not follow it. Could you?

Good to see you posting. Any recent words of wisdom from the VA think tank?

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by logicworks [*]


How do you know PF didn't drive RG to the Courthouse on Thursday, after the park, in her car and return to pick him up?
JMO [/*]

Oh, why didn't anybody see [that? Under your theory, the should.

[sarcasm]
Oh, I know, PEF called up Commander Riker and had the Starship Enterprise beam him into the parking lot. [/sarcasm]

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Serendipitous1 [*]J.J. appears to be using some kind of "new" math. I could not follow it. Could you?

Good to see you posting. Any recent words of wisdom from the VA think tank? [/*]

A while back GS asked about witness credibility. I'm trying to quantify it.

This just deals with the witnesses.

[Cinderella]

Is it anything like 2 takes away 1 then 2 is left?

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Cinderella [*]Is it anything like 2 takes away 1 then 2 is left? [/*]

Only in the math of Court TV Conspiracy Theory.

Actually, my estimates are probably pretty low. I'm assuming, in general, a witness is completely wrong 75% of the time. I doubt it is that high (or we'd have a much high percentage of the population in prison).

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]
A while back GS asked about witness credibility. I'm trying to quantify it. This just deals with the witnesses. [/*]

Well, wouldn't you have to interview the witnesses to make the quantification (if one is even possible) anything more than a WAG? I mean, if that is your guesstimate...fine. But I think you expended a lot of effort putting up something which no one can follow. Then again, I am not that smart.

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Serendipitous1 [*]Well, wouldn't you have to interview the witnesses to make the quantification (if one is even possible) anything more than a WAG? I mean, if that is your guesstimate...fine. But I think you expended a lot of effort putting up something which no one can follow. Then again, I am not that smart. [/*]

Some of it, but I'm trying to divide up the general from the specific and I'm making that this factor would not apply:

There are other factors, a mental illness, impairment, a motive to give false testimony, that would lessen the chances of accuracy. These things obviously do not apply to these witnesses.

We might get one or two with serious credibility problems, but not all. Certainly not Fenton and Grine or the Wilkes-Barrie witnesses who were independent.

And, I'm using very low estimates of general accuracy. If two witnesses, that never met RFG before say, **I walked past RFG on the same street,** I give it a 35% chance of really being a sighting of RFG, or a 65% chance of NOT being RFG.

If I were a prosecutor, I'd love to have two witnesses put the defendant in the same place at the same time, if that was crucial to my case.

[Cinderella]

I'm with you S1, there are degrees of intelligence. Mine doesn't include the top notch. I like a little more on the lower shelf.

[Cinderella]

Here are some Lyrics for J. J. tonight.

Blowin' In The Wind - Bob Dylan


How many roads must a man walk down
Before you call him a man?
Yes, 'n' how many seas must a white dove sail
Before she sleeps in the sand?
Yes, 'n' how many times must the cannon balls fly
Before they're forever banned?
The answer, my friend, is blowin' in the wind,
The answer is blowin' in the wind.

How many times must a man look up
Before he can see the sky?
Yes, 'n' how many ears must one man have
Before he can hear people cry?
Yes, 'n' how many deaths will it take till he knows
That too many people have died?
The answer, my friend, is blowin' in the wind,
The answer is blowin' in the wind.

How many years can a mountain exist
Before it's washed to the sea?
Yes, 'n' how many years can some people exist
Before they're allowed to be free?
Yes, 'n' how many times can a man turn his head,
Pretending he just doesn't see?
The answer, my friend, is blowin' in the wind,
The answer is blowin' in the wind.

[day2day]

Great song, Cinderella!!

I just can't get over the fact that Mr. Gricar walked out of the Centre County Courthouse on 4/14/2005 and VANISHED into thin air! .. IMO we could be looking at an alien abduction..

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by day2day [*]Great song, Cinderella!!

I just can't get over the fact that Mr. Gricar walked out of the Centre County Courthouse on 4/14/2005 and VANISHED into thin air! .. IMO we could be looking at an alien abduction.. [/*]

Neither vanishing into thin air nor ET.

There are some thinks that LE should have looked at, but they haven't. I don't know why they haven't.

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]
Neither vanishing into thin air nor ET. There are some thinks that LE should have looked at, but they haven't. I don't know why they haven't. [/*]

You have talked with LE then? Did they tell you more of what they DID look at too? ...Or were you just being sarcastic again?

I remember billywahoo posted that the public was being made aware of approximately 5% of what LE is doing...and that was 6 weeks into the investigation (before the lead detective went into psychic mode). Obviously LE gets to pick and choose what information they give out to the press, and the press gets to pick and choose what of that gets published (and, unfortunately, how it is presented). Neither group is obliged to be candid or to correct inaccuracies.

LE coddles the psychic out of desperation, but refuses answers to the public's pertinent questions. And to fill out their "day", LE tries to identify a handful of message board posters, on a forum relatively few people read and which has yet to be recognized by the media. Why? Because those posters dare to break the information stranglehold and fill the void. Brilliant police work. Well done! MOO

[Cloudbuster]

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]

Neither vanishing into thin air nor ET.

There are some thinks that LE should have looked at, but they haven't. I don't know why they haven't. [/*]

Speaking of alien abductions and ET"s hmmm do we have anything like that from Lewisburg PA.
http://www.nuforc.org/CB020824.html JJ these LE didn't seem to look into this case much either lol.

Although this is not what happened to RG it's still apparent JJ why they didn't look into what your talking about.
It's a matter of what they already know or indirectly know about the king. All the kings horses and all the kings men couldn't fix it or make it right again. Lack of Power comes to mind or lack of courage?

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Serendipitous1 [*]You have talked with LE then? Did they tell you more of what they DID look at too? ...Or were you just being sarcastic again?

Not to LE, but both TG and PB. I keep getting the same answer. I'm looking at how RFG could have gotten out of Lewisburg or could have been driving another car. Some possibilities have been looked at, and reported. These include public transportation and car rentals. What they have not looked at, publicly, is if RFG borrowed a car, bought one, had a friend pick him up.

LE coddles the psychic out of desperation, but refuses answers to the public's pertinent questions. And to fill out their "day", LE tries to identify a handful of message board posters, on a forum relatively few people read and which has yet to be recognized by the media. Why? Because those posters dare to break the information stranglehold and fill the void. Brilliant police work. Well done! MOO [/*]

If LE checked, and found nothing, why not just announce it, or at least see the press gets that information. They did with other methods of leaving Lewisburg.

[sherrijean981]

Originally posted by Cloudbuster [*]

Speaking of alien abductions and ET"s hmmm do we have anything like that from Lewisburg PA.
http://www.nuforc.org/CB020824.html JJ these LE didn't seem to look into this case much either lol.

Although this is not what happened to RG it's still apparent JJ why they didn't look into what your talking about.
It's a matter of what they already know or indirectly know about the king. All the kings horses and all the kings men couldn't fix it or make it right again. Lack of Power comes to mind or lack of courage? [/*]

A little more on the incident you are referring to CB. This article mentions his being found in only underwear with a look of horror on his face. Wonder if the same thing was in the area in 2005? Odd isn't it?

http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:...cd=3&gl=us</a>

Quote:
"There's a really strange story going around regaxding a possible UFO-related death in Northumberland County. Pennsylvania, near Harrisburg. It seems that on August 2nd a hunter named Todd Sees took his four-wheeler up a mountain to look for pre-season deer. When he failed to return home, his wife & children became concerned, and a search party was organized including local police and even the FBI. Eventually his body was found wearing only underwear - with a look of horror on his face! Three nearby farmers said they had seen "a large real bright object" at the time of Todd's early morning disappearance. They said that a bright light eventually shined down from it and something was pulled into the light!
The UFO then went straight up and disappeared. Now there's a scary story, a bit too late for Halloween!... "
Quote

And another article:

http://www.ufocasebook.com/92802.html

Sightings and News

NORTHUMBERLAND (TODD SEES UPDATE!!) More details are coming out about the craft seen on Montour Ridge on August 6, 2002, at 5:30 AM in the morning by a farmer and three fishermen on the Susquehanna River. It was at the very top of the mountain on the western end, just hovering above the power lines. The farmer said, "He could see some sparks flying from the tower and dropping to the ground. The whole incident lasted about 10 minutes, then it got very bright and took off very low heading west, then it stopped and went straight up, it was gone in seconds. The horses on the farm were very upset and nervous for about 12 hours."

It was round and very still over the lines. Suddenly it moved what looked like a few hundred feet to the East, it stopped and a beam of blue and white light shined to the ground. He saw what appeared to be a man suspended in the light, he was being pulled up head first, he was moving his arms slowly in the light? What looked like a man was pulled up into the bottom of the craft. A few seconds later the craft started shuddering, then went west very fast, stopped briefly, and then flew straight up and out of sight. Two days later a young man was found dead not far away. The man had driven his vehicle up the mountain looking for deer signs at around 5:00 AM. His 4 wheeler was two miles from where his body was found in thick brush. The Blood hounds never got a scent past the 4 wheeler.

The Daily Item Newspaper report by Marcia Moore reports: Northumberland Investigators are still awaiting toxicology results to determine what killed a 39-year-old Northumberland County man found in the woods near his home last month. Point Township police began investigating the death of Todd Sees after his body was discovered Aug. 5 in a wooded area at the western base of Montour Ridge about 150 yards from his house. An autopsy failed to conclude a cause of death and toxicology tests were ordered. "Right now we're on hold until we get the test results," Point Township Police Chief Gary Steffen said Tuesday.

The blood tests are expected to take another four or five weeks, he said. "It's just a waiting game," Steffen said. "Something certainly caused his death. The answer has to be in the blood." Sees was reported missing on the afternoon of Aug. 4, hours after he left his home on an ATV to go scouting for deer on Montour Ridge. A family member found the ATV about two miles from his home, but there was no sign of Sees. About 200 volunteers, along with tracking dogs and searchers in helicopters, looked for the missing man for several hours.

About 30 hours after he went missing, Sees' relatives stumbled upon his body in a densely wooded area of the ridge about 150 yards from his house. Northumberland County Coroner James Kelley said the autopsy revealed Sees had been dead between 24 hours to 36 hours, but found no signs of trauma or of coronary disease. MUFON is investigating. Thanks to Peter Davenport NUFORC

----------------------------------------

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Cloudbuster [*]


Although this is not what happened to RG it's still apparent JJ why they didn't look into what your talking about.
It's a matter of what they already know or indirectly know about the king. All the kings horses and all the kings men couldn't fix it or make it right again. Lack of Power comes to mind or lack of courage? [/*]

If, and that is a big IF, RFG walked away and he's not hiding in an attic in Lewisburg, then he had to leave Lewisburg somehow. How?

1. Public transportation, bus, taxi. LE did check these, without too much fanfare, but it was reported.

2. Rental car. With a bit more fanfare, LE did check that out.

3. Stolen car. None were stolen at the time. LE would naturally check that out.

4. Purchased car, either under a legal variation of his name, or using a false name. LE did not check.

5. "Borrowed" car. RFG borrowed a car from a friend, perhaps purchasing it for that friend, but having it registered in the friend's name. LE did not check.

6. Picked up by a friend. LE did not check whereabouts of friend, other than PEF.

In terms of 4-5, every time I've asked this question of people close to the case, the answer has been that LE has not checked. On 6, it has been noted that LE did not even interview some of the friends.

Either LE hasn't checked or are going to surprising lengths to hide the fact that they did.

[day2day]

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]

If, and that is a big IF, RFG walked away and he's not hiding in an attic in Lewisburg, then he had to leave Lewisburg somehow. How?

1. Public transportation, bus, taxi. LE did check these, without too much fanfare, but it was reported.

2. Rental car. With a bit more fanfare, LE did check that out.

3. Stolen car. None were stolen at the time. LE would naturally check that out.

4. Purchased car, either under a legal variation of his name, or using a false name. LE did not check.

5. "Borrowed" car. RFG borrowed a car from a friend, perhaps purchasing it for that friend, but having it registered in the friend's name. LE did not check.

6. Picked up by a friend. LE did not check whereabouts of friend, other than PEF.

In terms of 4-5, every time I've asked this question of people close to the case, the answer has been that LE has not checked. On 6, it has been noted that LE did not even interview some of the friends.

Either LE hasn't checked or are going to surprising lengths to hide the fact that they did. [/*]

IF he used public transportation ..SOMEONE saw him . IF he rented a car SOMEONE saw him. IF a friend PICKED HIM UP-they saw HIM.

Obviously..either someone is lying...or he VANISHED...

I can't get over the fact he walked out of that courthouse and vanished into thin air..it is not POSSIBLE!
jmo of course...

[day2day]

Originally posted by Cloudbuster [*]

Speaking of alien abductions and ET"s hmmm do we have anything like that from Lewisburg PA.
http://www.nuforc.org/CB020824.html JJ these LE didn't seem to look into this case much either lol.

Although this is not what happened to RG it's still apparent JJ why they didn't look into what your talking about.
It's a matter of what they already know or indirectly know about the king. All the kings horses and all the kings men couldn't fix it or make it right again. Lack of Power comes to mind or lack of courage? [/*]

IMO-lack of courage...*great post btw*

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by day2day [*]

IF he used public transportation ..SOMEONE saw him . IF he rented a car SOMEONE saw him. IF a friend PICKED HIM UP-they saw HIM.

There would very likely be be witnesses to RFG to using public transportation and a credit card record if RFG rented a car.

Obviously..either someone is lying...or he VANISHED...

If there was a helper the problem is that LE may never have asked helper. It may not be a lie so much as not volunteering information.

[Cinderella]

Maybe Bigfoot drug him away. I'd believe that before I would believe a UFO got him. The only time that I have seen flashing bright lights was years and years ago when I had a little too much to drink.

[Cinderella]

I didn't get to read to far before rotflmao. This must be the reason that LE isn't saying too much about the case.

April 1970 Nr Bridgewater, MA Police officer In patrol car in dark, felt rear end of car picked up and saw 'bear' running away.

Well you never know, but it could be the answer.

Oh no that happened in 1970 in MA. All that I can come up with is that they must have seen "SNARKY". :santa:

[J. J. in Phila]

I know, PEF's accomplice was from Remulak. That explains how the car got to Lewisburg.

:santa:

Now, for the serious part.

If this was a walk away, it would obviously require some planning and money. It is possible that the planning had been ongoing for more than five years.

Has the been a long term look at RFG's finances by a forensic accountant?

[Cloudbuster]

I know we are being funny but back in the 70's our current camp had a actual UFO hoovering over it (I wasn't around at the time and my so was little. The occupants in the cabin said they couldn't move and after it left they could still see the lights up on the ridge. The next day they went up on the ridge and there was a large burned out circle on the ground where this craft appeared to have landed. In the paper back then it was reported to be seen by many in Clinton County. Later a book came out with mention of this day.

SJ thanks thought it was Todd and I keep mixing him up with the man that was pulled from the lackawanna river. LW that's a interesting link!
D2D thanks it does seem like a lack of courage.

JJ you seem to think RG could have gotton a car through normal means and Im asking that you at least keep in mind that he didn't need to have any evidence of such a thing. There is no records on the 43 cars remember? Okay we know where 8 of them went to Ungard's family and himself so that leaves 35 missing cars? Think about this why leave evidence when you can get a car (especially if he was working undercover) from a drug bust? All records gone and 35 cars are unaccounted for?? I do believe if RG was in another car then i would look at the 35 missing ones.

JMOO

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Cloudbuster

JJ you seem to think RG could have gotton a car through normal means and Im asking that you at least keep in mind that he didn't need to have any evidence of such a thing. There is no records on the 43 cars remember? Okay we know where 8 of them went to Ungard's family and himself so that leaves 35 missing cars? Think about this why leave evidence when you can get a car (especially if he was working undercover) from a drug bust? All records gone and 35 cars are unaccounted for?? I do believe if RG was in another car then i would look at the 35 missing ones.

JMOO [/*]

Those cars were not in Lewisburg and there might be a record of them going out. Also, to drive it, you need a license plate.

[day2day]

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]I know, PEF's accomplice was from Remulak. That explains how the car got to Lewisburg.

:santa:

Now, for the serious part.

If this was a walk away, it would obviously require some planning and money. It is possible that the planning had been ongoing for more than five years.

Has the been a long term look at RFG's finances by a forensic accountant? [/*]

That is just ANOTHER part of the problem , IMO! His finances!! Just another item on the long list of mistakes by LE -imo !

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by day2day [*]

That is just ANOTHER part of the problem , IMO! His finances!! Just another item on the long list of mistakes by LE -imo ! [/*]

It's been reported that the FBI is monitoring his credit cards to see if there is current activity. It has not been reported (but it might have happened and was not reported) that LE ever looked at his accounts for the last decade (which could be expensive).

[day2day]

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]

It's been reported that the FBI is monitoring his credit cards to see if there is current activity. It has not been reported (but it might have happened and was not reported) that LE ever looked at his accounts for the last decade (which could be expensive). [/*]

How about his bank accounts? Are we sure anyone really knows how many accounts he has?
How bout life insurance? Does anyone know how many policies he held and who stands to benefit from his death?!

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by day2day [*]

How about his bank accounts? Are we sure anyone really knows how many accounts he has?

Unless RFG used a different SSN, all domestic accounts would come up in the IRS data base.

How bout life insurance? Does anyone know how many policies he held and who stands to benefit from his death?!

Right now, nothing. RFG is not dead, legally. I'd guess he has some, but, unless a body is found, nobody could claim it until April 2012. Waiting seven years doesn't seem like a good option.

[Politigal]

even tho i believe that circumstantial evidence implicates pf, i'm also open to the possibility that rg left by choice.

[i'm typing this way because i'm hunting and pecking as i broke my elbow today.]

anyway, i do think it's possible that rg is alive, and i believe that it's possible that his family are aware. i also think it's possible that pf is not aware.

i have always wondered why lara doesn't post and i've wondered why tokuen quit posting. in addition, i've wondered why tg so strongly defends pf, considering the circumstances of the disappearance. and of course, i'm suspicious of the seeming inactivity of law enforcement, mm, etc. in investigating this case. i think tokuen may have quit posting when she learned the truth.

i think it's possible that something was going on at the da's office or between pf and rg, that rg couldn't live with, so he 'escaped' that something.

i don't think they anticipated the tenacity of posters here in trying to find out what happened.

jmho

waiting for sj's teeth to fall out with this post

[Cloudbuster]

Originally posted by J. J. in Phila [*]

Unless RFG used a different SSN, all domestic accounts would come up in the IRS data base.



Right now, nothing. RFG is not dead, legally. I'd guess he has some, but, unless a body is found, nobody could claim it until April 2012. Waiting seven years doesn't seem like a good option. [/*]

Hold on a second it is my understanding that M$M said the family could declare RG dead remember? It was the family that didn't decide to do that. Does anyone still have the link?

[Cloudbuster]

Originally posted by day2day [*]

How about his bank accounts? Are we sure anyone really knows how many accounts he has?
How bout life insurance? Does anyone know how many policies he held and who stands to benefit from his death?! [/*]

D2D good questions especially about the life insurance. I have heard about insurance twice now unconventially but now Im curious on what it means?

JJ the words I stole one are mentioned unconvential alot and you don't think one of those vechicles would even fit that? Never mind roflmao don't answer it. I think I already know what your going to say. As of for a plate? Thats easy you can just about steal one of those in non obvious places. I don't think he would even have to worry about one of those cause if his own mini was not seen ect Im sure one can get away unnoticed without a plate too.:santa:

[Cloudbuster]

Originally posted by Politigal [*]even tho i believe that circumstantial evidence implicates pf, i'm also open to the possibility that rg left by choice.

[i'm typing this way because i'm hunting and pecking as i broke my elbow today.]

anyway, i do think it's possible that rg is alive, and i believe that it's possible that his family are aware. i also think it's possible that pf is not aware.

i have always wondered why lara doesn't post and i've wondered why tokuen quit posting. in addition, i've wondered why tg so strongly defends pf, considering the circumstances of the disappearance. and of course, i'm suspicious of the seeming inactivity of law enforcement, mm, etc. in investigating this case. i think tokuen may have quit posting when she learned the truth.

i think it's possible that something was going on at the da's office or between pf and rg, that rg couldn't live with, so he 'escaped' that something.

i don't think they anticipated the tenacity of posters here in trying to find out what happened.

jmho

waiting for sj's teeth to fall out with this post [/*]

Pgal sorry about your elbow!!! I thought about everything your saying in your post except now my view has changed and unless they say more I can't change it. It's personal. One thing though if RG was really out there why would TG want to even try to do a primetime show? It's alot of preasure and anxiety especially if you knew RG was out there? I have my views on why LG isn't on here and I have a feeling at one time she might have been. I do think that PF and POSSIBLY LG think he is out there. Meaning I think they know way more than us. I still don't believe he is.

[Cinderella]

I am starting to believe that there is a curse on the posters on this board. My leg still hasn't healed up with all the antibiotics that I have taken. I am still taking them since September. I would hate to break my elbow. Sorry Pgal, if it isn't one thing it is another.

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Cloudbuster [*]

Hold on a second it is my understanding that M$M said the family could declare RG dead remember? It was the family that didn't decide to do that. Does anyone still have the link? [/*]

That has been discussed here, even befire I showed up, and I was given the impression that it would be seven years. I believe that was discussed between Saunterer and TG.

[J. J. in Phila]

Originally posted by Cloudbuster [*]

Pgal sorry about your elbow!!! I thought about everything your saying in your post except now my view has changed and unless they say more I can't change it. It's personal. One thing though if RG was really out there why would TG want to even try to do a primetime show? It's alot of preasure and anxiety especially if you knew RG was out there? I have my views on why LG isn't on here and I have a feeling at one time she might have been. I do think that PF and POSSIBLY LG think he is out there. Meaning I think they know way more than us. I still don't believe he is. [/*]

CB, some people closer to RFG do think this was a walkaway and that has nothing to do with the financial situation.

Judging from the comments if seen posted over the years, I wouldn't blame anyone with the family for not posting. I know the exceptionally personal questions that would be asked, and if the family chooses to avoid it, I don't blame them.

And yes, if I were in LE, I'd be asking them, but not a message board.

[J. J. in Phila]

A poster commented on "circumstantial evidence" that would implicate PEF. I've seen none. Quite the opposite; I've seen PEF taking a number of actions that a murderer wouldn't take, including calling LE reasonably early.

I've also seen evidence that excludes PEF from key aspects in the their scenarios.