Assessing Blame for Bad Health

[ortiga]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/community/groups/index.html?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat%3aa70e3396-6663-4a8d-ba19-e44939d3c44fForum%3a7cceb09e-a8ae-44b4-b7af-92605cbce240Discussion%3ad48fddd6-3490-4775-9b38-088633efb73c?hpid=talkbox1

discussion pro/cons assessing blame for bad health

[theal3]

Interesting read and discussion at that sight. Got me to thinking. About my lifetime, as compared to my grandparents and parents, and I'm in my mid 60s and in pretty good health so far. But ones never knows. Luckily, by educational and career choices in life, have had health insurance, full with dental, vision, since married in the mid 60s, til retirement in the late 90s and was great comfort when pregnant & raising kids with their normal childhood "things."

My parents never had health ins. raising us in the 40s, 50s and any medical bills were a big source of conflict in the family, even for routine dental or vision, or problems, but what did kids know, except you could sense the stress of "bills." and it seems parents worked out payments with the Dr., on time payments. Then, too, food supplies were very different than even when I raised a family. No "grocery stores," just smaller mom and pop markets in the cities, even new suburbs, but the larger MARKETS came, and farms were nearby by for buying produce in summer, and canning and later freezing. LOL. we didn't have a frig. til the early 50s, still had ice boxes in those days. But then freezing came in. There were canned good in stores, very little frozen til around the mid to late 50s. Everyone in my time, knew someone who knew a farmer on the outskirts of town, then the farms disappeared due to building of suburbia.

By the 60s to mid 70s,came lots of fast food, lots packaged & new canned products with preservatives, convenience foods for the new "working moms" etc, additives, corn syrups etc.

Now we have epidemic levels of diabetes, obesity, cancer all kinds of health problems, people popping pills, which I never recall seeing my parents and grandparents deal with. Then you were healthy and strong when young, put on some weight in middle years, then as you grew older, ate less and got thin with old age. I think folks ate healthier then due to more home cooking or cooking from scratch. Which seems lots harder in more recent times. And with technology in the workplace and at home: work isn't so calorie burning or strenuous. TV, computers, elec. gadgets etc has made us less active including the kids growing up in 70s, 80s, 90s.

Don't think there is blame to any one source. But as we've become a more mobile society, and families live farther apart now days due to jobs or divorce or whatever.....and people's lifestyle changes, and cuts in schools for PE, and those old fashioned home ec courses on health and cooking and diet were axed, and called "frills." It's affected everyone.

They say, we're living longer than in the past when at the turn of the 20th century old was dying in 50s or early 60s and now folks live into 70s easily....but they have "health problems" and medications now, that didn't exist then. Yet we have higher infant mortality rate, and folks live even longer in other industrial countries.

Some of bad health is genetic; some is lifestyle (bad for those who do the alcohol and drugs etc); but there are many factors involved. There was a time when a healthy mind, body and nothing in excess was emphasized.

One can't say anymore that the poor are the fat, lazy, folks anymore. It crosses all classes and income and work and cultural levels. I recall back in the early to mid 60s when JFK instituted Physical Fitness guidelines in schools, and kids could earn ranking and badges and PE was looked forward to as part of the reg. school day, and after school intramural, and reg. team sports. And kids learned early on, despite what parents did at home, what taking care of one's health was and why it's important. I think boomers got that message for the most part and are living longer, and everyone is scared of that now that they are entering "old age." The obesity in children and young adults now, IMHO has been due to our food delivery system especially in large urban areas.

So, now it seems some want to punish those in poor health, as if they caused it themselves. That's why I'm for a universal type of health care and prevention built in, and prenatal care and info for young parents etc. An investment in the future citizens. We can do better, as other countries have.

[ortiga]

snipped

So, now it seems some want to punish those in poor health, as if they caused it themselves. That's why I'm for a universal type of health care and prevention built in, and prenatal care and info for young parents etc. An investment in the future citizens. We can do better, as other countries have.

Great post, Theal. I think our lives have progressed along parallel paths. But my parents had good health insurance because of employment by a huge nationwide company, my Dad had that insurance for 25 years after he retired and it covered my Mom too, until he died and then she had to rely on medicare. And we kids were insured until age 21, IIRC. Great insurance that we took for granted but large corporations are not insuring people for life these days, much less giving them a job for all their working years. I know that some state governments used to provide life long health insurance, and one could retire after only 20 years. IE start at 18, retire at 38, and start a whole new career, eventually ending with 2 retirements and no worries about health insurance, ever. But those programs are being phased out and new employees get far fewer benefits and insurance than employees did just a few years ago. And it all costs more now.

When I was young there was always, it seemed, one person in the school class who was really overweight. And of course we kids were merciless towards them, unfortunately. Now we can see kids boarding the school bus and many of them are way overweight. I remember when we switched to pot pies and TV dinners, they were such timesavers that no one considered the amount of fat and suger they had. They were considered a luxury and that we were lucky to be able to afford them. Then the whole nation became couch potatoes due to TV, and now with computers it's even worse now with all age groups.

Countries like France have a national dedication to staying in shape, eating wholesome unprocessed foods, and I think we have to learn from that. There has to be some incentive beyond knowing that one's lifestyle is as healthy as possible (speaking generally here, not about myself.)

IMO

[airportwoman]

A lot of the increase in life expectancy is the reduction of child and infant mortality.

[Susan43]

I thought you all might enjoy this youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jng4TnKqy6A&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Edailykos%2Ecom%2Fstory%2F2 009%2F8%2F26%2F772918%2F%2D%2AAwesome%2A%2DCartoon %2DExplains%2DPublic%2DPlan&feature=player_embedded#t=275

Here in America these days I think we are overrun by people who think they have theirs and the heck with anyone else. So easy to blame illness on the victim isn't it? Because if we do that we are able to completely ignore any personal responsibility towards our neighbors.

I posted a story about a 36 yr. old woman who is insured and still ended up in debt of $100,000. She had breast cancer. I wonder what she did to do that to herself. And of course now she has a pre-existing condition.

[Brentwood]

I thought you all might enjoy this youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jng4TnKqy6A&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Edailykos%2Ecom%2Fstory%2F2 009%2F8%2F26%2F772918%2F%2D%2AAwesome%2A%2DCartoon %2DExplains%2DPublic%2DPlan&feature=player_embedded#t=275

Here in America these days I think we are overrun by people who think they have theirs and the heck with anyone else. So easy to blame illness on the victim isn't it? Because if we do that we are able to completely ignore any personal responsibility towards our neighbors.

I posted a story about a 36 yr. old woman who is insured and still ended up in debt of $100,000. She had breast cancer. I wonder what she did to do that to herself. And of course now she has a pre-existing condition.

Your link didn't work for me. Just in case it doesn't work for someone else, I searched for it, and this link to it (below), worked for me. It is an excellent explanation of how it is. Thank you Susan.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jng4TnKqy6A

[theal3]

You're making me angry. One of my SIL's had a double mastectomy almost 5 years ago, she was doing well until it came back this summer as a liver tumor. Do you think that's okay because she is what you like to call a 'right wing' republican? I suppose she brought this upon herself because of your ill-named party of "no"? You have no shame in your suppositions and name calling.
IMO

I think you missed the point: cancer of any kind, and breast cancer occurs to everyone, but it's the Republicans who are against healthcare reform when ins. would be available to both dems and repubs and no preexisting conditions. I want it for all regardless of party, but the party of No keeps spreading lies to vote it down and many followers believe the lies. It will help all citizens. No one brings it on themselves, but the way some "leaders" the people in power are talking, they are showing no compassion.

[theal3]

Maybe I did miss the point, probably I was distracted by all of the compassion shown by liberals only to each other.
IMO

I think the poster was blaming the RW politicians especially those in the Senate, and blue dog Dems for distorting what the legislation is all about: who now days doesn't know a friend or relative from either party that has suffered problems with the current problems with insurance and cost of premiums. The House already has it ducks in a row and Republicans are on board; the Senate is close: it's the hold outs from mostly rural or sparsely populated area holding up things My mother was a life long Republican and died of cancer and had breast cancer. She often voted against her own best interests as she really didn't understand issues, she just voted straight Republican all her life, like rote. Only ONCE could I get her to vote Dem, for her grandchildren's sake: and she voted for Clinton. But she died 2 years later. There's plenty of compassion on the Dem side. It's not so cut and dried or black and white, but shades of grey: my brother is a republican and far right at that, but we can still get along without being nasty or making up lies during discussions.