Caylee 8/26. 8/27

[desmom]

New day, new thread.....

Headline from yesterday:

Prosecutors release more than 2,000 pages to Casey Anthony defense
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-casey-anthony-court-documents-082509,0,2721416.story

Will we get a doc dump this week?

Will Judge Strickland release his rulings today?

[Julie Dupree]

Good Morning Everyone,

Another interesting article from the Orlando Sentinel...seems the price tag for Casey's trial has increased considerably...:(

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2009/08/casey-anthony-she-suggests-her-checkforgery-trial-start-in-november-2010.html

[Julie Dupree]

Found out who Sean Henady was...:)

http://blinkoncrime.com/2009/08/25/cayleecasey-anthony-case-exclusive-new-prosecution-witness-sean-henady/

[desmom]

Found out who Sean Henady was...:)

http://blinkoncrime.com/2009/08/25/cayleecasey-anthony-case-exclusive-new-prosecution-witness-sean-henady/

Great find Julie. Thanks for posting the link.

For those that were not here or missed it yesterday. Sean Henady was added to the state's witness list.

http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20547663/detail.html

P.S. Did you add it to the links thread? TIA

[Julie Dupree]

Great find Julie. Thanks for posting the link.

For those that were not here or missed it yesterday. Sean Henady was added to the state's witness list.

http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20547663/detail.html

Thanks desmom...gotta run. We are going thru Joint Commission Accreditation which means I have not time to feed my addiction to spending time here.
Have a great day everyone.
J

[sydney]

mornin julie and mom and everyone else!

i predict (placing first fingers of both hands on both sides of my head, squeezing my eyes shut really tightly and holding my breath) that we WILL have rulings handed down today!

what do you spose will happen after that? will the a's do a happy dance with an "i told you so" speech to the media, including statements like "this evidence will vindicate kc?"

my mental abilities do not extend that far. anyone else want to take a stab at foretelling the future?

[desmom]

mornin julie and mom and everyone else!

i predict (placing first fingers of both hands on both sides of my head, squeezing my eyes shut really tightly and holding my breath) that we WILL have rulings handed down today!

what do you spose will happen after that? will the a's do a happy dance with an "i told you so" speech to the media, including statements like "this evidence will vindicate kc?"

my mental abilities do not extend that far. anyone else want to take a stab at foretelling the future?

I can't, I won't, I refuse to even try to get in the A's head and predict what they will do next.

:eek:

[sydney]

I can't, I won't, I refuse to even try to get in the A's head and predict what they will do next.

:eek:

sorry - didn't mean to terrify you so early in the day!

will you be one of the brave posters that slogs through this latest dump? i'm easily bored. if it's technical stuff, i prolly won't read it (i prolly won't understand most of it anyway, LOL).

i'm still going back over the old stuff and reading statements, le reports, that kind of thing. some of the old stuff is very interesting, in light of later/more recent developments.

the trial will be a hum-dinger, i'm sure.

[KittyMom]

please,please,please let us hear something from Stan today... :crying:

[margaritaville]

I can't, I won't, I refuse to even try to get in the A's head and predict what they will do next.

:eek:

Lord knows you wouldn't want to get stuck in there :scared:

[Jeepers]

Good morning!
Dusting off my Crystal Ball - I see Judge Strickland rule that Amy's trial will be put off until after the murder trial. Reason I am thinking this is the defense does not want KC to have a felony on her record before the murder trial and if judge rules Amy's case forward the defense will throw more roadblocks for delays etc costing the state more money.
I really hope I am wrong but that is what my crystal ball and tea leaves say.

Anyone else have a newer crystal ball or fresh tea leaves they would like to share?

[margaritaville]

Good morning!
Dusting off my Crystal Ball - I see Judge Strickland rule that Amy's trial will be put off until after the murder trial. Reason I am thinking this is the defense does not want KC to have a felony on her record before the murder trial and if judge rules Amy's case forward the defense will throw more roadblocks for delays etc costing the state more money.
I really hope I am wrong but that is what my crystal ball and tea leaves say.

Anyone else have a newer crystal ball or fresh tea leaves they would like to share?


ITA with the part that Judge S. will postpone the check fraud case.
But I do believe that he side with L. padilla and gang and agree they were not working for Jose B.

MOO

[sydney]

Good morning!
Dusting off my Crystal Ball - I see Judge Strickland rule that Amy's trial will be put off until after the murder trial. Reason I am thinking this is the defense does not want KC to have a felony on her record before the murder trial and if judge rules Amy's case forward the defense will throw more roadblocks for delays etc costing the state more money.
I really hope I am wrong but that is what my crystal ball and tea leaves say.

Anyone else have a newer crystal ball or fresh tea leaves they would like to share?

hi, jeepers - i don't have a crystal ball, i just use my fingers, squint my eyes and hold my breath.

i agree that strickland will hold off on amy's trial. i think he wants to do everything possible to see that kc gets a fair and impartial murder trial. i think that, when she is found guilty, there will already be enough aggravating factors to impose the dp - they won't need a felony conviction.

perhaps one of the the reasons the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is if kc is convicted and given a lighter sentence in the criminal trial (i.e., manslaughter), the felony conviction could not only be used in aggravation in the penalty phase, but could conceivably extend the time she has to spend in jail, if the civil sentence is made to run consecutively with the criminal sentence.

kat?

[Rapunzel]

I am sure the A's and or Baez will have some presser or diversion ready to go to counteract any news coming out...Wonder what TV talk show they will be on???

[Jeepers]

ITA with the part that Judge S. will postpone the check fraud case.
But I do believe that he side with L. padilla and gang and agree they were not working for Jose B.

MOO

That is what I am thinking too. Lenny & Company will be allowed in court. I really want to hear what Tracey has to offer up on Ms. Casey.
I have been suprised that Tracey has not been heard since her visit with Anthony's (maybe she has been on a extended vacation to detox after her stay in the house of mayhem).

[KittyMom]

o/t tomorrow is the anniversary of Trenton Duckett's disappearance. Please remember him and his family.

http://helpfindtrenton.com/

[Rapunzel]

hi, jeepers - i don't have a crystal ball, i just use my fingers, squint my eyes and hold my breath.

i agree that strickland will hold off on amy's trial. i think he wants to do everything possible to see that kc gets a fair and impartial murder trial. i think that, when she is found guilty, there will already be enough aggravating factors to impose the dp - they won't need a felony conviction.

perhaps one of the the reasons the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is if kc is convicted and given a lighter sentence in the criminal trial (i.e., manslaughter), the felony conviction could not only be used in aggravation in the penalty phase, but could conceivably extend the time she has to spend in jail, if the civil sentence is made to run consecutively with the criminal sentence.

kat?

Well if she gets the DP...it ain't gonna matter what happens in the civil trial...she may just get timed served anyway...but will be on death row...so...like I said ain't gonna matter.

[sydney]

Well if she gets the DP...it ain't gonna matter what happens in the civil trial...she may just get timed served anyway...but will be on death row...so...like I said ain't gonna matter.

that's true, rap. but perhaps the state is hedging their bets, so to speak? who really knows what will happen in the criminal trial? i know what i HOPE will happen, but hoping and getting are two different things.

[Jeepers]

o/t tomorrow is the anniversary of Trenton Duckett's disappearance. Please remember him and his family.

http://helpfindtrenton.com/

Little Trenton, such a darling little boy. I think of him often.
Prayers for Trenton and his family:rose::rose:

[desmom]

sorry - didn't mean to terrify you so early in the day!

will you be one of the brave posters that slogs through this latest dump? i'm easily bored. if it's technical stuff, i prolly won't read it (i prolly won't understand most of it anyway, LOL).

i'm still going back over the old stuff and reading statements, le reports, that kind of thing. some of the old stuff is very interesting, in light of later/more recent developments.

the trial will be a hum-dinger, i'm sure.

I am going to try to wade through them. If it is real technical, I have to google the big words. :tonguewag: Hopefully, my walking science translator will be in the house - aka oldest child, College Son - and will be able to translate for me.

Anyone know if the items on the list of documents released yesterday http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20547523/detail.html titled "Quality Systems Documents (FBI)", "Standard Operating Procedures (FBI)" and "Proficiency Tests (FBI)" are documentation for the FBI's procedures and protocols? If yes, the dump may be pretty boring.

jmo

[Jeepers]

sorry - didn't mean to terrify you so early in the day!

will you be one of the brave posters that slogs through this latest dump? i'm easily bored. if it's technical stuff, i prolly won't read it (i prolly won't understand most of it anyway, LOL).

i'm still going back over the old stuff and reading statements, le reports, that kind of thing. some of the old stuff is very interesting, in light of later/more recent developments.

the trial will be a hum-dinger, i'm sure.

Maybe when we get the new docs I will try your method of fingers and squinting eyes to get through it enough to understand that Casey is nailed to floor and no matter how many lies and half-truths momma and diddy tell it will be to no avail.

[sydney]

dunno if this is right, but when i typed in "quality systems documentation" this is the link that came up:

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/codis/forensic.htm

don't know if it helps or not. i am so NOT a link or research queen.

[Rapunzel]

I am going to try to wade through them. If it is real technical, I have to google the big words. :tonguewag: Hopefully, my walking science translator will be in the house - aka oldest child, College Son - and will be able to translate for me.

Anyone know if the items on the list of documents released yesterday http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20547523/detail.html titled "Quality Systems Documents (FBI)", "Standard Operating Procedures (FBI)" and "Proficiency Tests (FBI)" are documentation for the FBI's procedures and protocols? If yes, the dump may be pretty boring.

jmo

Yes, I think you are so right...

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/codis/forensic.htm
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backissu/oct2003/2003_10_guide02.htm
http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache%3A21TjgunVmYwJ%3Awww.promega.com%2Fgenetic idproc%2Fussymp10proc%2Fcontent%2F04Eisenberg.pdf+ Proficiency+Tests+%28FBI%29&hl=en&gl=us&pli=1


Some of these may be what is in play...

[sydney]

Yes, I think you are so right...

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/codis/forensic.htm
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backissu/oct2003/2003_10_guide02.htm
http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache%3A21TjgunVmYwJ%3Awww.promega.com%2Fgenetic idproc%2Fussymp10proc%2Fcontent%2F04Eisenberg.pdf+ Proficiency+Tests+%28FBI%29&hl=en&gl=us&pli=1


Some of these may be what is in play...

rap, you are GOOD!

[Jeepers]

Please please please pray that Lenny and Crew are allowed to be included in relevant trial witnesses! And that Jim Hoover becomes one of the KEYS to the prosecution as well - he after all was with DCasey when they were ok poking around with sticks and hist cell phone with psychic (unless Baez has suddenly become "Miss Cleo" - or maybe Kreskin with his mind bending tricks) - cause our clueless and avenging defender of the that twit Casey. I am most curious about this "Barn Door Open - Horse Gone" motion being answered - BECAUSE I think DCasey is one humongous TIME BOMB.

HE refused depo with M/M because it is a sworn statement under legal terms that allow and if he had appeared there hw would have no choice to tell the truth OR commit perjury. I think they need DCasey for the criminal trial, and do not want it to be shown that he was sanctioned by the judge - or help the Anthony's in a "Security" detail from the beginning. That is why Hoover's testimony is so important. HE has no reason to lie, he was not paid and in teh end they treated him like dirt, never thanked him, cut him loose from what he was doing (even though it was FREE)! Explains ALOT! Can't stay - but see you all later today! :sleep:

I agree and hope to see and hear Hoover, Dominic and many others testify against the evil one.
The way Hoover was treated by the Anthony's is par for the course of how they treat everyone that does not follow them down the Rabbit Hole.

[desmom]

Please please please pray that Lenny and Crew are allowed to be included in relevant trial witnesses! And that Jim Hoover becomes one of the KEYS to the prosecution as well - he after all was with DCasey when they were ok poking around with sticks and hist cell phone with psychic (unless Baez has suddenly become "Miss Cleo" - or maybe Kreskin with his mind bending tricks) - cause our clueless and avenging defender of the that twit Casey. I am most curious about this "Barn Door Open - Horse Gone" motion being answered - BECAUSE I think DCasey is one humongous TIME BOMB.

HE refused depo with M/M because it is a sworn statement under legal terms that allow and if he had appeared there hw would have no choice to tell the truth OR commit perjury. I think they need DCasey for the criminal trial, and do not want it to be shown that he was sanctioned by the judge - or help the Anthony's in a "Security" detail from the beginning. That is why Hoover's testimony is so important. HE has no reason to lie, he was not paid and in teh end they treated him like dirt, never thanked him, cut him loose from what he was doing (even though it was FREE)! Explains ALOT! Can't stay - but see you all later today! :sleep:

I am just not sure about Hoover. Something about the man just makes me uneasy. jmo

[Rapunzel]

I am just not sure about Hoover. Something about the man just makes me uneasy. jmo

Everyone involved with the A's makes me uneasy!!!!!

How many more lives can this family destroy????

[desmom]

dunno if this is right, but when i typed in "quality systems documentation" this is the link that came up:

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/codis/forensic.htm

don't know if it helps or not. i am so NOT a link or research queen.

Yes, I think you are so right...

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/codis/forensic.htm
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backissu/oct2003/2003_10_guide02.htm
http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache%3A21TjgunVmYwJ%3Awww.promega.com%2Fgenetic idproc%2Fussymp10proc%2Fcontent%2F04Eisenberg.pdf+ Proficiency+Tests+%28FBI%29&hl=en&gl=us&pli=1


Some of these may be what is in play...


Thanks for the links. The dump may be pretty dry reading.

[jose]

Good morning!
Dusting off my Crystal Ball - I see Judge Strickland rule that Amy's trial will be put off until after the murder trial. Reason I am thinking this is the defense does not want KC to have a felony on her record before the murder trial and if judge rules Amy's case forward the defense will throw more roadblocks for delays etc costing the state more money.
I really hope I am wrong but that is what my crystal ball and tea leaves say.

Anyone else have a newer crystal ball or fresh tea leaves they would like to share?


I believe that Strickland sees thru the Sceam Teams schangians and knows the out come of the trial, hence, he will go above and beyond to preserve the record for appeal

[Jeepers]

I believe that Strickland sees thru the Sceam Teams schangians and knows the out come of the trial, hence, he will go above and beyond to preserve the record for appeal

Yep, everyone sees this dreem teem for what their reputations portray them as: BS, smoke and mirrors.
Judge Strickland, I think is doing all he can to accommodate them in order to prevent a re-do.

[bchand]

I believe that Strickland sees thru the Sceam Teams schangians and knows the out come of the trial, hence, he will go above and beyond to preserve the record for appeal

I hope so. He's known for over a year now that the truth and Miss Anthony are strangers.

I would think he's now aware that trait runs through this family also.

[BJames]

Good morning to all :smile:

I agree that Judge Strickland is going to hold off on the cheque/theft charges, probably because he doesn't want any room for the defense to try and use it as an appeal issue.
I am also wondering if indeed those charges are held over...can those issues be brought up during the murder trial considering they haven't been 'proven' yet? I am wondering if Judge Strickland may rule that anything to due with the economic charges can not be brought out in the murder trial as that trial would still be pending?
Just a thought....But I don't think Judge Strickland is going to see the relationship with Lenny and Co. as being confidential, I am looking forward to hearing what all of that crew have to say on the stand.


Just my opinion of course...

[margaritaville]

I agree and hope to see and hear Hoover, Dominic and many others testify against the evil one.
The way Hoover was treated by the Anthony's is par for the course of how they treat everyone that does not follow them down the Rabbit Hole.


Wouldn't it be just classic if the people that end up testifying and getting the DP for Casey are ones hired by her parents??
Oh the irony in that........

[Rapunzel]

Wouldn't it be just classic if the people that end up testifying and getting the DP for Casey are ones hired by her parents??
Oh the irony in that........


Oh yeah....dream come true:thumbsup:

[Jeepers]

Wouldn't it be just classic if the people that end up testifying and getting the DP for Casey are ones hired by her parents??
Oh the irony in that........

It seems like that is what is happening. The list is endless of the people
that tried to help the Anthony's in their time of need. Now they are all listed on state witness list. The ones that are not on the list will be tore apart by the state.

[KittyMom]

Wouldn't it be just classic if the people that end up testifying and getting the DP for Casey are ones hired by her parents??
Oh the irony in that........

What a miniseries that would make! I'd watch it. :laugh:

"The Caylee Anthony Story: From the Eyes of Those Who Truly Care"

Have LE tell what it was like to investigate this case and deal with the A's.

[Jeepers]

What a miniseries that would make! I'd watch it. :laugh:

"The Caylee Anthony Story: From the Eyes of Those Who Truly Care"

Have LE tell what it was like to investigate this case and deal with the A's.

KittyMom, That would be a best seller. I would love to see a book out by someone from LE that worked this case. I have always wondered what the two policemen thought and said behind the scenes when they took Casey to Universal to show them where she worked. The initial response to Cindy's 911 call when they arrived at the A's home.

[martha]

Good morning everyone.May God bless you all with a wonderful day and that would be if we could get some good news. I really don;t see how casey can get out of this but I do know it could happen. You can;t tell how the jury will see everything. Now for me the 31 days is enough to know she did something to CAYLEE no mother does anything like that. Then you take in the way she lied to le that day and took they to a place she did not work no office and it would end with me there but I do know others don;t see it that way. Then the car and the dogs hitting in the a;s back yard. Is that not enough? maybe for some people no but for me it is but I want be on the jury so I just pray we get some simple minded folks with command sense and can see past the smoke and mirrow that the def.,will put up in court.jmho

[martha]

KittyMom, That would be a best seller. I would love to see a book out by someone from LE that worked this case. I have always wondered what the two policemen thought and said behind the scenes when they took Casey to Universal to show them where she worked. The initial response to Cindy's 911 call when they arrived at the A's home.You and Kitty or so right and that is the only book I would ever read. I wish they would do one.jmho:wub:

[Jeepers]

You and Kitty or so right and that is the only book I would ever read. I wish they would do one.jmho:wub:

I would like for Lenny & Company to write a book. Tracey would be an interesting read.

[BJames]

Oh good grief...I am not going to quote myself but I need more coffee.
'to due'...should be 'to do'...duhhh me :wink:

[Jeepers]

Good morning everyone.May God bless you all with a wonderful day and that would be if we could get some good news. I really don;t see how casey can get out of this but I do know it could happen. You can;t tell how the jury will see everything. Now for me the 31 days is enough to know she did something to CAYLEE no mother does anything like that. Then you take in the way she lied to le that day and took they to a place she did not work no office and it would end with me there but I do know others don;t see it that way. Then the car and the dogs hitting in the a;s back yard. Is that not enough? maybe for some people no but for me it is but I want be on the jury so I just pray we get some simple minded folks with command sense and can see past the smoke and mirrow that the def.,will put up in court.jmho

I agree Martha, the 31 days was enough to close the door and throw away the key for me. The rest of the antics were just more fuel on the fire. jmo

[KittyMom]

KittyMom, That would be a best seller. I would love to see a book out by someone from LE that worked this case. I have always wondered what the two policemen thought and said behind the scenes when they took Casey to Universal to show them where she worked. The initial response to Cindy's 911 call when they arrived at the A's home.

I won't touch a thing put out by the A's but if LE wrote a book I'd buy it. Can you imagine Muri's take?

[Pruddennce]

That is what I am thinking too. Lenny & Company will be allowed in court. I really want to hear what Tracey has to offer up on Ms. Casey.
I have been suprised that Tracey has not been heard since her visit with Anthony's (maybe she has been on a extended vacation to detox after her stay in the house of mayhem).

the judge briefly commented, made a statement to JB about what that document stated...it was pretty clear that the bonds group were not hired by JB or bound by his firm. MO, the judge 'almost' denied his motion, but chose to be prudent.

what is really strange is how JB is attempting to qualify that document with unwritten legal claims. doesnt he understand his own verbiage?

IMO, Tracy had a few exchanges with Casey and everyone in that house heard those exchanges.... (George claiming he is somewhat deaf when it comes to 'other people's conversations').....right........

the state: what is the sq footage of your home? <---lol inferring one cant sneeze without someone hearing you in this small, one story home.

IMO they will be allowed to testify.

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence...*

[alisa31235]

I won't touch a thing put out by the A's but if LE wrote a book I'd buy it. Can you imagine Muri's take?

Good morning all... I think I just might have to take a peek at a book by the A`s I am just nosey like that :tonguewag: But I would love love love to know what these dectives think and even judge stan jmo

[KittyMom]

Good morning all... I think I just might have to take a peek at a book by the A`s I am just nosey like that :tonguewag: But I would love love love to know what these dectives think and even judge stan jmo

lol...I would love to be a fly on the wall of the judge's chambers when he and his clerks are discussing Jose. :laugh:

[cassidy]

lol...I would love to be a fly on the wall of the judge's chambers when he and his clerks are discussing Jose. :laugh:

I know someone who is an attorney down there and Jose does elicit more than his share of chuckles.
JMO

[Jeepers]

I won't touch a thing put out by the A's but if LE wrote a book I'd buy it. Can you imagine Muri's take?

That would be worthy of spot of its own on my bookshelf
If Muri wrote a book.

[Deannalynn]

New day, new thread.....

Headline from yesterday:

Prosecutors release more than 2,000 pages to Casey Anthony defense
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-casey-anthony-court-documents-082509,0,2721416.story

Will we get a doc dump this week?

Will Judge Strickland release his rulings today?

Simon says........Um...Yes on the doc dump and yes on the ruling.:tonguewag:

[cassidy]

That would be worthy of spot of its own on my bookshelf
If Muri wrote a book.

I think that's Yuri???

[Jeepers]

the judge briefly commented, made a statement to JB about what that document stated...it was pretty clear that the bonds group were not hired by JB or bound by his firm. MO, the judge 'almost' denied his motion, but chose to be prudent.

what is really strange is how JB is attempting to qualify that document with unwritten legal claims. doesnt he understand his own verbiage?

IMO, Tracy had a few exchanges with Casey and everyone in that house heard those exchanges.... (George claiming he is somewhat deaf when it comes to 'other people's conversations').....right........

the state: what is the sq footage of your home? <---lol inferring one cant sneeze without someone hearing you in this small, one story home.

IMO they will be allowed to testify.

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence...*

I loved seeing Jose last week trying to explain his inability to write a legal contract trying cite Fla. law without it being writtern down just implied. He is so funny. I commend Judge Strickland for not laughing Jose out of the court room. I don't know how he keeps a straight face.

[Jeepers]

I think that's Yuri???

Your right. Sorry for the oops! Yuri
But if there was a Muri working the case I would like to hear from him too. Don't won't to leave any of the good guys out. Just sayin.

[Jeepers]

lol...I would love to be a fly on the wall of the judge's chambers when he and his clerks are discussing Jose. :laugh:

I bet they double over with laughter behind closed doors.
Remember the dancing Judge Ito's ?

[Deannalynn]

Good morning!
Dusting off my Crystal Ball - I see Judge Strickland rule that Amy's trial will be put off until after the murder trial. Reason I am thinking this is the defense does not want KC to have a felony on her record before the murder trial and if judge rules Amy's case forward the defense will throw more roadblocks for delays etc costing the state more money.
I really hope I am wrong but that is what my crystal ball and tea leaves say.

Anyone else have a newer crystal ball or fresh tea leaves they would like to share?

Well, I had Chinese food last night.
My fortune cookie said...Confucius say, Judge Stan give hope to prosecutors and rule fraud case before murder trial.
Confucius also say, don't go near inside Cindy head or you get lost. Big head empty.:biggrinjester:

[martha]

I guess I should not say I would not read a book but don;t think I would. I would hate to buy one to give the an;s any more money to sit on their behinds and not work. Sure don;t want to help pay for casey def. Maybe if one comes out one persson could buy it and share all the lies with the rest of us.ha, I want to help CAYLEE get justice and that is all. If casey did not do this then I am going to have to pray for a lot of forgivness. I just can;t see how anyone elce could have done this.If someone elce did it then why or the an;s out looking for that person? I get scared i am wrong in judgeing her but really I am not judgeing her just think everything points to her doing it. She could get out of it because I have seen people get out of things that they really did. I would never understand why but they would. So I guess I will have to wait and see how this goes at trial time. jmho

[Jeepers]

Well, I had Chinese food last night.
My fortune cookie said...Confucius say, Judge Stan give hope to prosecutors and rule fraud case before murder trial.
Confucius also say, don't go near inside Cindy head or you get lost. Big head empty.:biggrinjester:

You have a very smart cookie!

[Barbara fl.]

I won't touch a thing put out by the A's but if LE wrote a book I'd buy it. Can you imagine Muri's take?



Good morning everyone,

We should combine all our posts and turn it into a book...probably would make a best seller...

[ttcRider]

Good morning everyone,

We should combine all our posts and turn it into a book...probably would make a best seller...

I think that would be a great idea! There use to be almost as much drama on this board as with the case! :laugh:

[Deannalynn]

I think that would be a great idea! There use to be almost as much drama on this board as with the case! :laugh:

I already have the name of the book...You can fool some of the people some of the time but, not the FLB's. (Too long?):biggrin:

Or..Jail cells for sale or rent, porkrinds, for 50 cents."
I'll keep my day job...

[101Spots]

I already have the name of the book...You can fool some of the people some of the time but, not the FLB's. (Too long?):biggrin:

Or..Jail cells for sale or rent, porkrinds, for 50 cents."
I'll keep my day job...

Lying for Fun and Profit by Cindy Anthony

Trading Your Soul to the Devil by Casey Anthony (nonfiction)

Clueless by Lee Anthony

The Eunuch's Code of Confrontation by George Anthony

Daisy Chains and Other Selected Stories by Leonard Padilla

Behind Closed Doors: A Manual for Defense Lawyers by Jose Baez (fiction/comedy)

Boo Hoo Hoo by Andrea Lyon

Pursuing Truth and Justice by FLABs

You Gotta Be Kidding Me! by Yuri Melich

I Remember Caylee by Shirley and Rick Plesea

Close Encounters by TonE Lazzaro

[Lavinia]

Lying for Fun and Profit by Cindy Anthony

Trading Your Soul to the Devil by Casey Anthony (nonfiction)

Clueless by Lee Anthony

The Eunuch's Code of Confrontation by George Anthony

Daisy Chains and Other Selected Stories by Leonard Padilla

Behind Closed Doors: A Manual for Defense Lawyers by Jose Baez (fiction/comedy)

Boo Hoo Hoo by Andrea Lyon

Pursuing Truth and Justice by FLABs

You Gotta Be Kidding Me! by Yuri Melich

I Remember Caylee by Shirley and Rick Plesea

Close Encounters by TonE Lazzaro

Looks like about half of yours have to be bought at the XXX truck stop south of town. :ohmy:

[sydney]

i'd like to recommend some book for the a's - "truthtelling for dummies" and "how to recognize the truth without it having to slap you in the face" and "how to gracefully admit your daughter is a murderer" and a thesaurus. i think they would REALLY get some use out of that.

[101Spots]

Looks like about half of yours have to be bought at the XXX truck stop south of town. :ohmy:

:lol:



:sneaky:

[trich]

I think that would be a great idea! There use to be almost as much drama on this board as with the case! :laugh:

I was thiinking the same thing.
We, I believe, could all be responsible for
a best seller combining all our knowledge and ideas.
I actually think we know more then the jury will ever know.
Sometimes I think we even know more then the Judge.
Like not knowing the Anthonys were appearing on tv all the time
when they said they were home grieving.
Oh I would love to be able to tell the world what all we know and believe.
you know someone wrote a book about Scott and Laci before he was even arrested I think.....or at least before he went to trial.
There was also a made for tv movie.
I really wish some one would to do something like that before the Anthonys publisize all their BS.

[Jeepers]

Lying for Fun and Profit by Cindy Anthony

Trading Your Soul to the Devil by Casey Anthony (nonfiction)

Clueless by Lee Anthony

The Eunuch's Code of Confrontation by George Anthony

Daisy Chains and Other Selected Stories by Leonard Padilla

Behind Closed Doors: A Manual for Defense Lawyers by Jose Baez (fiction/comedy)

Boo Hoo Hoo by Andrea Lyon

Pursuing Truth and Justice by FLABs

You Gotta Be Kidding Me! by Yuri Melich

I Remember Caylee by Shirley and Rick Plesea

Close Encounters by TonE Lazzaro

101Spots, I pick Daisy Chains and other selected stories by Leonard Padilla for$200.00

[Lavinia]

101Spots, I pick Daisy Chains and other selected stories by Leonard Padilla for$200.00

I hear they have a fine diner at that truck stop Spots is leading you to. :ohmy:

[101Spots]

101Spots, I pick Daisy Chains and other selected stories by Leonard Padilla for$200.00

Answer is: The warden's executive secretary.

Remember the fun "tests" Sprocket et al used to make up for the SP trial? We need her back here!

[Pruddennce]

mornin julie and mom and everyone else!

i predict (placing first fingers of both hands on both sides of my head, squeezing my eyes shut really tightly and holding my breath) that we WILL have rulings handed down today!

what do you spose will happen after that? will the a's do a happy dance with an "i told you so" speech to the media, including statements like "this evidence will vindicate kc?"

my mental abilities do not extend that far. anyone else want to take a stab at foretelling the future?

its possible, but it would behoove JB and company not to use the word vindicate. first off: how did Caylee's disposition become one of 'missing' in the first place: her official statements to LE contradict the evidence; the same statement reiterated to family services; the second 'story' , the park, was not told to LE. however, the 'storyline' was the same: an ABDUCTION, but changed up with her as a witness.

I dont see how they can merely say that someone else caused her death. they will not be able to present credible evidence that someone else, HER FRIENDS, for instance, had the 'opportunity' to take Caylee from her and murder her, and CA not telling LE who it was. she was never seen again by anyone after June 15 or if one believes GA, the 16th. the fact is, Caylee was not seen or heard from again after Cindy had her on June 15th.

also, every single witness that is called to be asked about 'what Casey told them' as to where Caylee was will be saying the same thing: with the nanny: only change up will be locations and various reasons why she no longer has her child with her: beach, parks, etc. and that will include her own parents.

there is no way around that...those witnesses cannot be dismissed as there are too many of them saying the same thing..and alot of the witnesses are not connected to each other. (several degrees of separation).

as an aside, her activities during that period, caught on film, pennys, target, and without referencing the fraud allegations, will clearly prove she was conducting her life without any thought whatsoever as to Caylee's whereabouts. the jury will conclude she didnt report her missing and continued on with her 'normal' activities because she killed and disposed of Caylee..no reason to report her missing and/or no evidence that she looked for her and ultimately gave up.

its an impossible task for the defense to present reasonable doubt with so many witnesses stating she told them Caylee was fine.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

[101Spots]

Do do do do, do do dooooooooo.
Do do do do dooooo dododododo......

[Rapunzel]

That would be worthy of spot of its own on my bookshelf
If Muri wrote a book.


You mean Yuri Melich???

[Pruddennce]

Lying for Fun and Profit by Cindy Anthony

Trading Your Soul to the Devil by Casey Anthony (nonfiction)

Clueless by Lee Anthony

The Eunuch's Code of Confrontation by George Anthony

Daisy Chains and Other Selected Stories by Leonard Padilla

Behind Closed Doors: A Manual for Defense Lawyers by Jose Baez (fiction/comedy)

Boo Hoo Hoo by Andrea Lyon

Pursuing Truth and Justice by FLABs

You Gotta Be Kidding Me! by Yuri Melich

I Remember Caylee by Shirley and Rick Plesea

Close Encounters by TonE Lazzaro

GA's IMO would be: THAT LITTLE GIRL and would consist of three sentences stating 'what he misses' about Caylee: walking to the mailbox, looking at the stars AND *I was the one who usually gave 'the little girl' breakfast in the morning...because her mother liked to sleep late*

the end.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

[summer]

Good morning everyone,

We should combine all our posts and turn it into a book...probably would make a best seller...

Barbara, that is a genius idea! Blogging has reached critical mass around the world now and this would actually be something new!

This board has everything, unbelievable humor, the facts, the pathos, the humanity, all chronicled from the first day this case became news.

I'm still a relative newbie here but lurked for a long time and I'm telling you there's nothing like this place...if it could be presented in a clever way we'd all be richer than the A's.

And then onto BROADWAY! In Sessions: The Musical!

How much fun would that be? TONS!

[jose]

Lying for Fun and Profit by Cindy Anthony

Trading Your Soul to the Devil by Casey Anthony (nonfiction)

Clueless by Lee Anthony

The Eunuch's Code of Confrontation by George Anthony

Daisy Chains and Other Selected Stories by Leonard Padilla

Behind Closed Doors: A Manual for Defense Lawyers by Jose Baez (fiction/comedy)

Boo Hoo Hoo by Andrea Lyon

Pursuing Truth and Justice by FLABs

You Gotta Be Kidding Me! by Yuri Melich

I Remember Caylee by Shirley and Rick Plesea

Close Encounters by TonE Lazzaro


How about..

Winning Confrontation Techiques hammer by Cindy

[Rapunzel]

You mean Yuri Melich???


Quoting myself now...

Sorry for the correction...I was a little late to the party...:biggrin:

[sydney]

[QUOTE=Pruddennce;13403544]its possible, but it would behoove JB and company not to use the word vindicate.[QUOTE]

(snipped)

totally agree with your post. knowing the grasp of the english language and abundance of freudian slips the a's have, they would prolly say "implicate" instead of "vindicate" anyway.

[Jeepers]

Quoting myself now...

Sorry for the correction...I was a little late to the party...:biggrin:

That is ok, I laughed at myself as soon as I hit the send button but, if there is a Muri on the force working this case I will welcome his input too. Anyone but the A's I have heard enough from them already and if I am understanding correctly they have already been well paid for their services.

[need2no]

I really wish some one would to do something like that before the Anthonys publisize all their BS.


~respectfully snipped~

Reminds me.........

Remember a couple of months ago when Nancy Grace was going to have a special about Cindy. IIRC that was about the same time MJ died so the special was never aired, & many of us assumed it would air when the MJ coverage died down. Well not only has she not aired this advertised special while filling her show with repeats of the same boring stuff, & promoting her book, but she isn't covering any news on the Anthony case, including the recent hearing. Yet she spent days on the case about the woman who hired a hit man to kill her new hubby. She treated that case like this was the only woman to ever hire a hit man for Pete's sake. Over and over she ran the same footage & discussed this ad nauseam IMO. Anyway I'm beginning to wonder if CNN received some type of legal warning not to air the special about Cindy, and as a result CNN has even instructed NG not to cover the case anymore until the trial. :shrug:

There's got to be something going on after months of NG getting great ratings from covering Caylee's case to suddenly stop all coverage. Maybe the MJ coverage is enough to maintain her show ratings. :confused:

[adair]

its possible, but it would behoove JB and company not to use the word vindicate. first off: how did Caylee's disposition become one of 'missing' in the first place: her official statements to LE contradict the evidence; the same statement reiterated to family services; the second 'story' , the park, was not told to LE. however, the 'storyline' was the same: an ABDUCTION, but changed up with her as a witness.

I dont see how they can merely say that someone else caused her death. they will not be able to present credible evidence that someone else, HER FRIENDS, for instance, had the 'opportunity' to take Caylee from her and murder her, and CA not telling LE who it was. she was never seen again by anyone after June 15 or if one believes GA, the 16th. the fact is, Caylee was not seen or heard from again after Cindy had her on June 15th.

also, every single witness that is called to be asked about 'what Casey told them' as to where Caylee was will be saying the same thing: with the nanny: only change up will be locations and various reasons why she no longer has her child with her: beach, parks, etc. and that will include her own parents.

there is no way around that...those witnesses cannot be dismissed as there are too many of them saying the same thing..and alot of the witnesses are not connected to each other. (several degrees of separation).

as an aside, her activities during that period, caught on film, pennys, target, and without referencing the fraud allegations, will clearly prove she was conducting her life without any thought whatsoever as to Caylee's whereabouts. the jury will conclude she didnt report her missing and continued on with her 'normal' activities because she killed and disposed of Caylee..no reason to report her missing and/or no evidence that she looked for her and ultimately gave up.

its an impossible task for the defense to present reasonable doubt with so many witnesses stating she told them Caylee was fine.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

As always, great post Pru......

I hope the SA show the lies that CinA told to LE...in regard to her "thinking" that kc and Caylee were bonding.....Cin sending Lee looking for her, so why would she send Lee out if she was in Orlando...dare i say bonding....Nail Cin on questions as to why she did not try and locate the nanny herself??? I dont know if there is any proof, that casey would lure cin out of the house so that she could go in and get clothes....etc. What about questions for GA....when kc came back without caylee.....wasn't that the day of the "accident" that the nanny was in. Right there gives the SA pretty good info that the "nanny" story should have been easily disproved by the Anthony's..just a call to the hospital, local police reports of any car accidents...... moo

I hope and pray that every lie the Anthony family has told to all who tried so hard to help find precious Caylee, i hope those lies come back and take a big, huge bite out of their arses. And i would like to see more investigation done into the misleads and possible fraud charges, for $ collected when they knew she was dead. The day they found the car, they knew she was dead.......IMO. JMO

[summer]

Or maybe: "In Session: This Time it's Personal" - the characters (posters) could have their individual stories told (a la "A Chorus Line") interspersed with the case they're so addicted to... ooh, I love it.

[summer]

As always, great post Pru......

I hope the SA show the lies that CinA told to LE...in regard to her "thinking" that kc and Caylee were bonding.....Cin sending Lee looking for her, so why would she send Lee out if she was in Orlando...dare i say bonding....Nail Cin on questions as to why she did not try and locate the nanny herself??? I dont know if there is any proof, that casey would lure cin out of the house so that she could go in and get clothes....etc. What about questions for GA....when kc came back without caylee.....wasn't that the day of the "accident" that the nanny was in. Right there gives the SA pretty good info that the "nanny" story should have been easily disproved by the Anthony's..just a call to the hospital, local police reports of any car accidents...... moo

I hope and pray that every lie the Anthony family has told to all who tried so hard to help find precious Caylee, i hope those lies come back and take a big, huge bite out of their arses. And i would like to see more investigation done into the misleads and possible fraud charges, for $ collected when they knew she was dead. The day they found the car, they knew she was dead.......IMO. JMO

Come to think of it, Cindy and Casey are so interwoven I don't see how this case can even be presented without Cindy's lies front and center. How can they be separated at this point?

[101Spots]

How about..

Winning Confrontation Techiques hammer by Cindy

The opportunities are endless!

This cast of characters could fill an entire library.

[adair]

Come to think of it, Cindy and Casey are so interwoven I don't see how this case can even be presented without Cindy's lies front and center. How can they be separated at this point?


Can you imagine if Cin is charged with accessory to murder.....naw, christmas aint coming early...........I would settle for an obstruction charge. Yeah, i could do that......anyone think this could happen? All we have or know about is the hair brush? Other then the lies...and we have a stack of those..........jmo moo

[Dells]

New day, new thread.....

Headline from yesterday:

Prosecutors release more than 2,000 pages to Casey Anthony defense
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-casey-anthony-court-documents-082509,0,2721416.story

Will we get a doc dump this week?

Will Judge Strickland release his rulings today?

Thanks so much for starting the new thread! :seeya: I hope the answer is yes to both of your questions.

Good morning, everyone!:smile:

[djmsmom]

~respectfully snipped~

Reminds me.........

Remember a couple of months ago when Nancy Grace was going to have a special about Cindy. IIRC that was about the same time MJ died so the special was never aired, & many of us assumed it would air when the MJ coverage died down. Well not only has she not aired this advertised special while filling her show with repeats of the same boring stuff, & promoting her book, but she isn't covering any news on the Anthony case, including the recent hearing. Yet she spent days on the case about the woman who hired a hit man to kill her new hubby. She treated that case like this was the only woman to ever hire a hit man for Pete's sake. Over and over she ran the same footage & discussed this ad nauseam IMO. Anyway I'm beginning to wonder if CNN received some type of legal warning not to air the special about Cindy, and as a result CNN has even instructed NG not to cover the case anymore until the trial. :shrug:

There's got to be something going on after months of NG getting great ratings from covering Caylee's case to suddenly stop all coverage. Maybe the MJ coverage is enough to maintain her show ratings. :confused:

NG probably was threatened with a lawsuit, but I hope the reason she quit showing the ants is that they enjoyed the limelight too much and the best way to hurt them is to not get their lies out there. Hope they are mad they are being ignored.

[need2no]

NG probably was threatened with a lawsuit, but I hope the reason she quit showing the ants is that they enjoyed the limelight too much and the best way to hurt them is to not get their lies out there. Hope they are mad they are being ignored.

As long as the A's are mad for not getting more air time, that's good enough for me. :smile:

[summer]

Can you imagine if Cin is charged with accessory to murder.....naw, christmas aint coming early...........I would settle for an obstruction charge. Yeah, i could do that......anyone think this could happen? All we have or know about is the hair brush? Other then the lies...and we have a stack of those..........jmo moo

Accessory after the fact for sure, IMO. I really think she needs to be charged before the trial so she can be shown to be the major player she is and to bring a full understanding of the dynamic between the two and how they've essentially done this crime together. Dumb Casey perpetrating the cruelest act in the stupidest way and "Cindy the Cleaner" sweeping up behind. They go hand in hand.

I know supposedly the state can't risk charging Cindy before the trial but they have Lee and George and I think that'll get the state what they want. Lee already has some type of immunity and George will crumple on the stand in two seconds flat if he doesn't have to deal with Cindy's wrath after a day of testimony. I think he'll crumple like a little girl anyway when he really gets on the hot seat.

I say charge her!

[Dells]

Good Morning Everyone,

Another interesting article from the Orlando Sentinel...seems the price tag for Casey's trial has increased considerably...:(

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2009/08/casey-anthony-she-suggests-her-checkforgery-trial-start-in-november-2010.html

WOW!:ohmy:

Thanks so much for the link. Casey Anthony just disgusts me on so many levels I don't even know where to begin. She has wasted everybody's time and money since day 31, and probably even before that as well. What a waste. A HUGE waste.:sneaky:

[*Serenity*]

If the check fraud case is after the murder trial, will the state have to omit Casey on tape at target, penneys, and the bofa?
If so-- that is exactly why the defense wants that put off, as to NOT show what casey was doing while caylee was missing.

[101Spots]

If the check fraud case is after the murder trial, will the state have to omit Casey on tape at target, penneys, and the bofa?
If so-- that is exactly why the defense wants that put off, as to NOT show what casey was doing while caylee was missing.

I ~believe~ they can show it and mention the items (none for Caylee) but they can't say that she's shopping with Amy's money.

[Imperfect4]

~respectfully snipped~

Reminds me.........

Remember a couple of months ago when Nancy Grace was going to have a special about Cindy. IIRC that was about the same time MJ died so the special was never aired, & many of us assumed it would air when the MJ coverage died down. Well not only has she not aired this advertised special while filling her show with repeats of the same boring stuff, & promoting her book, but she isn't covering any news on the Anthony case, including the recent hearing. Yet she spent days on the case about the woman who hired a hit man to kill her new hubby. She treated that case like this was the only woman to ever hire a hit man for Pete's sake. Over and over she ran the same footage & discussed this ad nauseam IMO. Anyway I'm beginning to wonder if CNN received some type of legal warning not to air the special about Cindy, and as a result CNN has even instructed NG not to cover the case anymore until the trial. :shrug:

There's got to be something going on after months of NG getting great ratings from covering Caylee's case to suddenly stop all coverage. Maybe the MJ coverage is enough to maintain her show ratings. :confused:

Get outta my head! :ohmy:

I was wondering exactly the same thing yesterday when NG came on ... what ever happened to her special on Cindy?

JVM hasn't covered anything Anthony-related in quite some time, either, if I'm remembering correctly.

HLN with Mike Galanos tends to still report the headlines on the case.

[summer]

If the check fraud case is after the murder trial, will the state have to omit Casey on tape at target, penneys, and the bofa?
If so-- that is exactly why the defense wants that put off, as to NOT show what casey was doing while caylee was missing.

That's what I was wondering. I'd like the fraud case to go on now but as long as the state can show what she was doing during that time I can live with it. I dunno. I think if the judge allows it to be postponed I think the defense's next step will be to try and exclude everything about the check theft (including what she bought and when she bought it) claiming it's "prejudicial" to her fraud case down the road. Very tricksy and I bet that's the goal.

[adair]

Does anyone know if Rick or Shirley are going to testify for the Pros?

TIA

[breezie]

Yes, I think you are so right...

http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/codis/forensic.htm
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/lab/fsc/backissu/oct2003/2003_10_guide02.htm
http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache%3A21TjgunVmYwJ%3Awww.promega.com%2Fgenetic idproc%2Fussymp10proc%2Fcontent%2F04Eisenberg.pdf+ Proficiency+Tests+%28FBI%29&hl=en&gl=us&pli=1


Some of these may be what is in play...

How funny if these are them and LKB has been whining for these and Rap pulled them from the website. :lol:

[adair]

Good morning everyone,

We should combine all our posts and turn it into a book...probably would make a best seller...


I have always thought that that would be an interesting idea...really I have thought a lot about it, also thought that back in the day of court tv when it was from 8-5 or was that 4? Anyway...and another thought would be a guest "poster" on the show....and i have watched too many talking head "guests" who have a very poor understanding of whats really going on during the live trials....jmo moo.....(not to mention certain anchors).........moo

[5boxersmom]

Any news on docs? :biggrin:

[Pruddennce]

As always, great post Pru......

I hope the SA show the lies that CinA told to LE...in regard to her "thinking" that kc and Caylee were bonding.....Cin sending Lee looking for her, so why would she send Lee out if she was in Orlando...dare i say bonding....Nail Cin on questions as to why she did not try and locate the nanny herself??? I dont know if there is any proof, that casey would lure cin out of the house so that she could go in and get clothes....etc. What about questions for GA....when kc came back without caylee.....wasn't that the day of the "accident" that the nanny was in. Right there gives the SA pretty good info that the "nanny" story should have been easily disproved by the Anthony's..just a call to the hospital, local police reports of any car accidents...... moo

I hope and pray that every lie the Anthony family has told to all who tried so hard to help find precious Caylee, i hope those lies come back and take a big, huge bite out of their arses. And i would like to see more investigation done into the misleads and possible fraud charges, for $ collected when they knew she was dead. The day they found the car, they knew she was dead.......IMO. JMO

excellent observation adair: Cindy sending Lee out...which means she KNEW she was not shuttling back and forth between anywhere. she left out that information from her endless wordy interviews with LE.

she also would not provide LE with her JC penny statements, as if she could prevent them from obtaining them thru legal means. LE already had video of Casey at JC Penny, not one but two that we know of thru their interview with Tony..where he had to identify stills of himself as being there with Casey.

Cindy told another potential witness, Brittany S that Casey WAS sneaking back into the home by baiting her out of the home. she also told Brittany she was stealing. the same statements she made to other individuals: she was a thief. and to Ryan P: A WARNING several weeks prior to this event. she was a thief AND a sociopath.

the defense has a problem: thru Cindy's excited utterances and thru her own frustration she revealed to several individuals that Casey's exit from the home was not based on an isolated incident. she revealed that she was a thief and liar prior to her leaving the home with Caylee.

Casey's behaviour and actions 'before' this incident will be revealed thru many many witnesses...CA did not become 'someone else' in a blink of an eye....there exists many problems that were brewing, this was NOT an isolated event, nor new behaviour.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

[KP1935]

Does anyone know if Rick or Shirley are going to testify for the Pros?

TIA

I wouldn't know them if I fell over them, but I'd like to know if they've been at any of the hearings? I'd love to see them show up (and sit on prosecution side) when CA is on the stand - she'd be in shock!

[Ellie]

Does anyone else think that a "big" part of the defense's story will include the letter from the guy in jail about how someone else in Casey's life was responsible for Caylee's death? I assume he was referring to Tone-- I read it and then wasn't here for a few days after so I'm not sure if you all have already gone over this much.

[cassidy]

Your right. Sorry for the oops! Yuri
But if there was a Muri working the case I would like to hear from him too. Don't won't to leave any of the good guys out. Just sayin.

LOL I hear ya! But I don't think Yuri wants Muri taking credit for what he has done :) Although I think that if Casey gets convicted Yuri won't care who got it done :)

[spydernweb2006]

If the check fraud case is after the murder trial, will the state have to omit Casey on tape at target, penneys, and the bofa?
If so-- that is exactly why the defense wants that put off, as to NOT show what casey was doing while caylee was missing.

IMO the State can still use the vid's of Casey to show her real shennagins while searching for Caylee and her complete lack of remorse and/or worry over Caylee being missing. Buying beer, party food, party clothes just does not show any care in the welfare of Caylee.

I also believe Amy can testify to Casey's facts proven on the money issues, even if charges are pending. Such as; I never loaned my checks to Casey Anothy nor gave any permission for her to use these items but here are cancelled checks with her name on them. Amy cannot state in court that Casey is guilty but she shoud be able to say Casey is a liar and here is why.....

But I am NO legal expert, so these are only MY opinion and are subject to change when/if I learn different.

JMHO

Hugs,

Spyder

[Barbara fl.]

Barbara, that is a genius idea! Blogging has reached critical mass around the world now and this would actually be something new!

This board has everything, unbelievable humor, the facts, the pathos, the humanity, all chronicled from the first day this case became news.

I'm still a relative newbie here but lurked for a long time and I'm telling you there's nothing like this place...if it could be presented in a clever way we'd all be richer than the A's.

And then onto BROADWAY! In Sessions: The Musical!

How much fun would that be? TONS!


It certainly sounds like it would sell....when do we get started..?

[Pruddennce]

If the check fraud case is after the murder trial, will the state have to omit Casey on tape at target, penneys, and the bofa?
If so-- that is exactly why the defense wants that put off, as to NOT show what casey was doing while caylee was missing.

hey its Serenity! :)

if that is precluded for some reason, they still have video of her shopping for herself at JC Penny....two visits IIRC.

but IMO they will be able to show her day out at target and what she bought, without revealing how she paid for the items......

or if no video, the dated receipts.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

[Katprint]

hi, jeepers - i don't have a crystal ball, i just use my fingers, squint my eyes and hold my breath.

i agree that strickland will hold off on amy's trial. i think he wants to do everything possible to see that kc gets a fair and impartial murder trial. i think that, when she is found guilty, there will already be enough aggravating factors to impose the dp - they won't need a felony conviction.

perhaps one of the the reasons the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is if kc is convicted and given a lighter sentence in the criminal trial (i.e., manslaughter), the felony conviction could not only be used in aggravation in the penalty phase, but could conceivably extend the time she has to spend in jail, if the civil sentence is made to run consecutively with the criminal sentence.

kat?
I tend to believe that the primary reason the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is to dilute the attention of Casey's attorneys. I doubt any check theft/fraud convictions would be admissible even though they are felonies unless Casey takes the stand, because they are really irrelevant to the issue of whether Casey murdered Caylee. Yes, they would show that Casey is generally a bad person but that kind of character evidence is not admissible. If Casey did take the stand then then those convictions would be admissible to impeach Casey and show that she is a dishonest person. Even without any convictions, however, if Casey chooses to testify then she can be cross-examined about her various frauds, forgeries and thefts from friends and family.

The really important parts of Casey's shopping sprees at Target and getting her tattoo and otherwise using her ill-gotten gains to have a great time is not that it was paid for with stolen money but that 1) she bought items only for herself and nothing for Caylee, 2) she appears to be enjoying herself, and 3) she does not appear to be searching for Caylee. The store videos of her shopping for lingerie and clothes (no doubt because of her leaving most of her own stuff behind at Cindy's when she stormed out so she needed to buy new stuff - but only for herself because she had already killed Caylee) will come it even if the source of payment is excluded because the undue prejudice outweighs its probative value. Similarly, photos of her dancing provocatively at the clubs - authenticated by the photographers - will come in even if how she paid for her drinks is excluded. The photo of her brand new tattoo - supplemented by testimony of the tattoo artist who applied it - will come in even if how she paid for her new tattoo is excluded. and so forth.

Note: The check fraud/forgery/theft case is NOT a civil case; it is a criminal case. The defamation lawsuit filed by Zenaida Gonzales is a civil case.

Further Note: I do not know how Florida handles consecutive vs. concurrent sentencing, particularly a recidivist like Casey. Generally speaking, a non-violent first offense would result in a stiff fine, an order of restitution, and year or two of probation. However, Casey's situation is unique in the number of offenses she is charged with, the number of uncharged similar offenses (involving family members i.e. money stolen from Casey's grandmother, from Cindy's credit cards, from Casey's piggy bank, etc.) which constitute an aggravating circumstance, and the separate pending murder charge.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[desmom]

How funny if these are them and LKB has been whining for these and Rap pulled them from the website. :lol:

Breezie I thought the same thing when I saw Rapunzel post the links.

I am sure there is some legal reason they have to come from the actual source on letterhead and not from their website.

[AnniePie]

Lying for Fun and Profit by Cindy Anthony

Trading Your Soul to the Devil by Casey Anthony (nonfiction)

Clueless by Lee Anthony

The Eunuch's Code of Confrontation by George Anthony

Daisy Chains and Other Selected Stories by Leonard Padilla

Behind Closed Doors: A Manual for Defense Lawyers by Jose Baez (fiction/comedy)

Boo Hoo Hoo by Andrea Lyon

Pursuing Truth and Justice by FLABs

You Gotta Be Kidding Me! by Yuri Melich

I Remember Caylee by Shirley and Rick Plesea

Close Encounters by TonE Lazzaro



Let's not forget: "How I Gained A Lot of Knowledge and Fifty Pounds Being a FLaB on the Casey Anthony Case". :w00t:

[desmom]

excellent observation adair: Cindy sending Lee out...which means she KNEW she was not shuttling back and forth between anywhere. she left out that information from her endless wordy interviews with LE.

she also would not provide LE with her JC penny statements, as if she could prevent them from obtaining them thru legal means. LE already had video of Casey at JC Penny, not one but two that we know of thru their interview with Tony..where he had to identify stills of himself as being there with Casey.

Cindy told another potential witness, Brittany S that Casey WAS sneaking back into the home by baiting her out of the home. she also told Brittany she was stealing. the same statements she made to other individuals: she was a thief. and to Ryan P: A WARNING several weeks prior to this event. she was a thief AND a sociopath.

the defense has a problem: thru Cindy's excited utterances and thru her own frustration she revealed to several individuals that Casey's exit from the home was not based on an isolated incident. she revealed that she was a thief and liar prior to her leaving the home with Caylee.

Casey's behaviour and actions 'before' this incident will be revealed thru many many witnesses...CA did not become 'someone else' in a blink of an eye....there exists many problems that were brewing, this was NOT an isolated event, nor new behaviour.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

Great post Pru! :beer:

Keeping fingers crossed the maggot evidence is released soon.

[*Serenity*]

hey its Serenity! :)

if that is precluded for some reason, they still have video of her shopping for herself at JC Penny....two visits IIRC.

but IMO they will be able to show her day out at target and what she bought, without revealing how she paid for the items......

or if no video, the dated receipts.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

Is it known what she purchased at JCPenney? Did she replace that laundry duffle bag and Caylee's poo blankie? I never did catch the evidence about JC Penney-- I must have been out in the field working.

Nice to see you Pru... I always seem to miss you when I come here. lol

[Barbara fl.]

As always, great post Pru......

I hope the SA show the lies that CinA told to LE...in regard to her "thinking" that kc and Caylee were bonding.....Cin sending Lee looking for her, so why would she send Lee out if she was in Orlando...dare i say bonding....Nail Cin on questions as to why she did not try and locate the nanny herself??? I dont know if there is any proof, that casey would lure cin out of the house so that she could go in and get clothes....etc. What about questions for GA....when kc came back without caylee.....wasn't that the day of the "accident" that the nanny was in. Right there gives the SA pretty good info that the "nanny" story should have been easily disproved by the Anthony's..just a call to the hospital, local police reports of any car accidents...... moo

I hope and pray that every lie the Anthony family has told to all who tried so hard to help find precious Caylee, i hope those lies come back and take a big, huge bite out of their arses. And i would like to see more investigation done into the misleads and possible fraud charges, for $ collected when they knew she was dead. The day they found the car, they knew she was dead.......IMO. JMO

I can not even count how many times I tried to put myself in the Anthony's shoes...What would I have done, if my daughter had taken my grandchild out of the home she lived in and not know where my daughter was taking her? Knowing that my daughter had no place to bring her...not knowing where my grandchild was sleeping or who she was with....And NOT once could I ever come up handling it the way Cindy did......After ONE night I would have been out looking...I would have searched the cell phone bills for every contact that my daughter had...I would have went to every place that she was known to hang out at....and would have called everyone she knew...

The things I would NOT have done...sleep, go to work, sit home and do nothing.....for (31) days.....There is just NO WAY, that I would have been able to do that...

Then I ask myself...What would Cindy have done if she would have found Casey the next day (after Caylee had been murdered)...would she have covered for her? And I have to say YES.....I honestly believe that had the Anthony's known from the beginning what has transpired, they would have hid Caylee's remains and told every lie in the book as to where Caylee was.....JMO

[Barbara fl.]

I tend to believe that the primary reason the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is to dilute the attention of Casey's attorneys. I doubt any check theft/fraud convictions would be admissible even though they are felonies unless Casey takes the stand, because they are really irrelevant to the issue of whether Casey murdered Caylee. Yes, they would show that Casey is generally a bad person but that kind of character evidence is not admissible. If Casey did take the stand then then those convictions would be admissible to impeach Casey and show that she is a dishonest person. Even without any convictions, however, if Casey chooses to testify then she can be cross-examined about her various frauds, forgeries and thefts from friends and family.

The really important parts of Casey's shopping sprees at Target and getting her tattoo and otherwise using her ill-gotten gains to have a great time is not that it was paid for with stolen money but that 1) she bought items only for herself and nothing for Caylee, 2) she appears to be enjoying herself, and 3) she does not appear to be searching for Caylee. The store videos of her shopping for lingerie and clothes (no doubt because of her leaving most of her own stuff behind at Cindy's when she stormed out so she needed to buy new stuff - but only for herself because she had already killed Caylee) will come it even if the source of payment is excluded because the undue prejudice outweighs its probative value. Similarly, photos of her dancing provocatively at the clubs - authenticated by the photographers - will come in even if how she paid for her drinks is excluded. The photo of her brand new tattoo - supplemented by testimony of the tattoo artist who applied it - will come in even if how she paid for her new tattoo is excluded. and so forth.

Note: The check fraud/forgery/theft case is NOT a civil case; it is a criminal case. The defamation lawsuit filed by Zenaida Gonzales is a civil case.

Further Note: I do not know how Florida handles consecutive vs. concurrent sentencing, particularly a recidivist like Casey. Generally speaking, a non-violent first offense would result in a stiff fine, an order of restitution, and year or two of probation. However, Casey's situation is unique in the number of offenses she is charged with, the number of uncharged similar offenses (involving family members i.e. money stolen from Casey's grandmother, from Cindy's credit cards, from Casey's piggy bank, etc.) which constitute an aggravating circumstance, and the separate pending murder charge.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions


Everything you say makes total sense to me....I may not speak the language, but I understand it:wink:....I do have one question for you...when they show the video of Casey purchasing the items in target (after Caylee is gone) will the prosecution then be allowed to mention that she was using Amy's checks without her permission? and when Amy takes the stand, will she be able to mention it? Just curious...

[Bala]

Katprint I have a question. Will Shirlee be able to testify to Casey stealing her check as what caused the fight between Cindy and Casey that night? Will the prosecution be able to bring up all the thefts as the cause of the in fighting in the A's home.

[summer]

It certainly sounds like it would sell....when do we get started..?

I haven't the foggiest but it's a great human interest story told through a 21st century vehicle. I think IS the corporation would have to get involved for starters. :smile:

[Katprint]

Then I ask myself...What would Cindy have done if she would have found Casey the next day (after Caylee had been murdered)...would she have covered for her? And I have to say YES.....I honestly believe that had the Anthony's known from the beginning what has transpired, they would have hid Caylee's remains and told every lie in the book as to where Caylee was.....JMO<respectfully snipped>

You mean the Anthonys would have excused, justified and covered up for Casey just like they previously did for her prior credit card/identity thefts and prior check forgeries? And her out-of-wedlock 8 months pregnancy at Uncle Rick's wedding? And her failure to complete high school? And who knows what else...

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[Barbara fl.]

<respectfully snipped>

You mean the Anthonys would have excused, justified and covered up for Casey just like they previously did for her prior credit card/identity thefts and prior check forgeries? And her out-of-wedlock 8 months pregnancy at Uncle Rick's wedding? And her failure to complete high school? And who knows what else...

Katprint
Always only my own opinions



YES....:laugh:

[CatMagnet]

It certainly sounds like it would sell....when do we get started..?

I don't know if everyone's serious about writing a book, but I think it's a great idea. I know I'm new, so don't have much to contribute about the case, but here's a few suggestions:


2 or 3 posters collaborate on the details of the case
Put the book together as an ebook
Offer the ebook free as a download on a web site
The site should also have a PROMINENT donation button with monies to go to (mind just went horribly blank.. is it Tim Miller?)


Doing an ebook like this will do several things, including possibly taking away any sales from any books the Anthonys might write in the future.

It would cost about ten bucks for a domain name, and maybe about 30 bucks for hosting. It's easy to build ebooks, just do a google search for "create free ebook" or something like that.

I sure hope this book idea goes beyond the talking stage. As I said, I'm still catching up on a lot of the background, so I guess I'm putting this out as a challenge. Are there a few of you that want to work together to make sure the general public gets the complete and true details of Caylee's story?

[Barbara fl.]

Does anyone else think that a "big" part of the defense's story will include the letter from the guy in jail about how someone else in Casey's life was responsible for Caylee's death? I assume he was referring to Tone-- I read it and then wasn't here for a few days after so I'm not sure if you all have already gone over this much.


I believe he is just a NUT...it was also said that he confessed a few times to crimes he did not commit...

[Barbara fl.]

I don't know if everyone's serious about writing a book, but I think it's a great idea. I know I'm new, so don't have much to contribute about the case, but here's a few suggestions:


2 or 3 posters collaborate on the details of the case
Put the book together as an ebook
Offer the ebook free as a download on a web site
The site should also have a PROMINENT donation button with monies to go to (mind just went horribly blank.. is it Tim Miller?)


Doing an ebook like this will do several things, including possibly taking away any sales from any books the Anthonys might write in the future.

It would cost about ten bucks for a domain name, and maybe about 30 bucks for hosting. It's easy to build ebooks, just do a google search for "create free ebook" or something like that.

I sure hope this book idea goes beyond the talking stage. As I said, I'm still catching up on a lot of the background, so I guess I'm putting this out as a challenge. Are there a few of you that want to work together to make sure the general public gets the complete and true details of Caylee's story?


All are welcome...and you certainly seem to know alot in helping it get started....I am certainly for it.......

[Katprint]

Katprint I have a question. Will Shirlee be able to testify to Casey stealing her check as what caused the fight between Cindy and Casey that night? Will the prosecution be able to bring up all the thefts as the cause of the in fighting in the A's home.
Maybe.

Shirlee was not present during any of the fights and therefore has no personal knowledge of the fights or what they were about. She only knows what she was told, which is "hearsay." Hearsay is inadmissible to prove the truth of the matter asserted but there are exceptions to hearsay. One exception is party statements being used against the party making the statement (for example, anything Casey ever said/wrote/emailed/texted is admissible if the prosecution wants to use it against her.) Another exception is a witness' prior inconsistent statements which can be used to impeach the witness.

Shortly before the trial begins, the prosecution and defense will each file motions in limine asking the judge to permit/exclude this testimony. If the judge decides to permit it, the way it will come in is that Cindy will testify that there were no fights (assuming Cindy testifies consistent with her TV interviews) then Shirlee will be called to impeach Cindy with Cindy's prior inconsistent statements concerning the fact that there were fights and what the fights were about. Also we may see the 9-1-1 dispatch records concerning police being sent to the Anthony residence for prior domestic disturbances. The police officers responding to those calls may testify about what they were told by the participants - including Casey - when they arrived.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[Barbara fl.]

I haven't the foggiest but it's a great human interest story told through a 21st century vehicle. I think IS the corporation would have to get involved for starters. :smile:


CatMagnet seems to have a good idea on how to get started...we would only use the posts of posters that want to join in....

Sounds good to me...

[Imperfect4]

<respectfully snipped>

You mean the Anthonys would have excused, justified and covered up for Casey just like they previously did for her prior credit card/identity thefts and prior check forgeries? And her out-of-wedlock 8 months pregnancy at Uncle Rick's wedding? And her failure to complete high school? And who knows what else...

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

I don't think there's any doubt. The Ants would've cracked open the door on their bulging skeleton closet just far enough to jam *Caylee's Terminal Event* in there with all their other filthy secrets.

I think the Ants' behavior since day 31, and especially since December 11, is absolute proof they would've done things very differently back in mid-July 2008.

"Caylee who?" would take on a whole new meaning. imo

[desmom]

Is it known what she purchased at JCPenney? Did she replace that laundry duffle bag and Caylee's poo blankie? I never did catch the evidence about JC Penney-- I must have been out in the field working.

Nice to see you Pru... I always seem to miss you when I come here. lol

page 2 - 3 http://www.orlandosentinel.com/media/acrobat/2009-04/46009131.pdf

6/27/08 - Time: 1457; Location: JC Penney; Purchaser - Anthony, Cynthia; Purchase Description: Clothes; Amount: $84.00; Evidence: Video Available; Notes: Casey used Mom's CC Casey & Tony in Video.

6/30/08 - Time: 1809; Location JC Penney; Purchaser - Anthony Cynthia; Amount: $73.40; Evidence: Video Available; Notes: Casey used Mom's cc Casey alone in video.

7/01/08 - Time: 1616; Locatin: JC Penney; Purcahser - Anthony, Cynthia; Amount $31.93; Evidence: Video; Notes: Casey used Mom's cc Casey & Amy in video.

ETA ~ description of purchases are not included LE's notes for 6/30/08 and 7/01/08.

[really3997]

I don't know if everyone's serious about writing a book, but I think it's a great idea. I know I'm new, so don't have much to contribute about the case, but here's a few suggestions:


2 or 3 posters collaborate on the details of the case
Put the book together as an ebook
Offer the ebook free as a download on a web site
The site should also have a PROMINENT donation button with monies to go to (mind just went horribly blank.. is it Tim Miller?)


Doing an ebook like this will do several things, including possibly taking away any sales from any books the Anthonys might write in the future.

It would cost about ten bucks for a domain name, and maybe about 30 bucks for hosting. It's easy to build ebooks, just do a google search for "create free ebook" or something like that.

I sure hope this book idea goes beyond the talking stage. As I said, I'm still catching up on a lot of the background, so I guess I'm putting this out as a challenge. Are there a few of you that want to work together to make sure the general public gets the complete and true details of Caylee's story?

Anything that takes money out of their pockets and tick off the King and Queen of Hopespring I am all for. :thumbsup:

[Barbara fl.]

Anything that takes money out of their pockets and tick off the King and Queen of Hopespring I am all for. :thumbsup:

We will have to PM each other....and maybe get things going....

[Bala]

Maybe.

Shirlee was not present during any of the fights and therefore has no personal knowledge of the fights or what they were about. She only knows what she was told, which is "hearsay." Hearsay is inadmissible to prove the truth of the matter asserted but there are exceptions to hearsay. One exception is party statements being used against the party making the statement (for example, anything Casey ever said/wrote/emailed/texted is admissible if the prosecution wants to use it against her.) Another exception is a witness' prior inconsistent statements which can be used to impeach the witness.

Shortly before the trial begins, the prosecution and defense will each file motions in limine asking the judge to permit/exclude this testimony. If the judge decides to permit it, the way it will come in is that Cindy will testify that there were no fights (assuming Cindy testifies consistent with her TV interviews) then Shirlee will be called to impeach Cindy with Cindy's prior inconsistent statements concerning the fact that there were fights and what the fights were about. Also we may see the 9-1-1 dispatch records concerning police being sent to the Anthony residence for prior domestic disturbances. The police officers responding to those calls may testify about what they were told by the participants - including Casey - when they arrived.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions
Thanks Katprint I was afraid that if the fraud case didn't go forward there'd be no way to bring in the fight that Cindy and Casey has the night Caylee went missing and why.

[breezie]

Breezie I thought the same thing when I saw Rapunzel post the links.

I am sure there is some legal reason they have to come from the actual source on letterhead and not from their website.


oh, I know...but she could have read them and had questions prepared already. I just found it funny.

[8BellesFan]

That is what I am thinking too. Lenny & Company will be allowed in court. I really want to hear what Tracey has to offer up on Ms. Casey.
I have been suprised that Tracey has not been heard since her visit with Anthony's (maybe she has been on a extended vacation to detox after her stay in the house of mayhem).

If I remember right, wasn't Tracey installed in the house to safeguard that Casey didn't leave while out on their bail money? Not for the benefit of Casey at all. I think it was a stipulation to the Padillas putting up the money.

And he got a slice of pizza delivered on day one of Casey's return home.

[really3997]

We will have to PM each other....and maybe get things going....

Okee dokee. I am on here more in the evening. :cool:

[Deannalynn]

I can not even count how many times I tried to put myself in the Anthony's shoes...What would I have done, if my daughter had taken my grandchild out of the home she lived in and not know where my daughter was taking her? Knowing that my daughter had no place to bring her...not knowing where my grandchild was sleeping or who she was with....And NOT once could I ever come up handling it the way Cindy did......After ONE night I would have been out looking...I would have searched the cell phone bills for every contact that my daughter had...I would have went to every place that she was known to hang out at....and would have called everyone she knew...

The things I would NOT have done...sleep, go to work, sit home and do nothing.....for (31) days.....There is just NO WAY, that I would have been able to do that...

This we will never know. I guess if I was the grandmother and I knew my daughter was a pathalogical liar (cause I caught her frequently) and a thief I wouldn't let her take my grandbaby anywhere, First of all, I would be scared she would try and steal something with my grand daughter and then I would be scared if she got caught the authorities would take my baby away from Casey and I would play havick getting her back out of the system.
Casey was the legal guardian on paper so that's exactly what they would do.

Then I ask myself...What would Cindy have done if she would have found Casey the next day (after Caylee had been murdered)...would she have covered for her? And I have to say YES.....I honestly believe that had the Anthony's known from the beginning what has transpired, they would have hid Caylee's remains and told every lie in the book as to where Caylee was.....JMO

I really don't think I would have let Casey take Caylee...However, Cindy was screaming and yelling and fighting about having to watch her so, Cindy let her walk. Cindy is just as irresponsible because she knew she was UNFIT!

[desmom]

I check the Orlando news sites more often than I check our local news sites.

Judge Stan needs to take a couple of deep breaths, have a piece of chocolate and release his decisions. :biggrinjester:

Or we need to see the latest doc dump.

[Barbara fl.]

I really don't think I would have let Casey take Caylee...However, Cindy was screaming and yelling and fighting about having to watch her so, Cindy let her walk. Cindy is just as irresponsible because she knew she was UNFIT!

Your right, if it were me Casey would not have even got out the door with Caylee....Cindy IS just as unfit as her daughter.....she let her leave with Caylee bcause Caylee was a responsibility that Cindy didn't want....

[Barbara fl.]

Okee dokee. I am on here more in the evening. :cool:

I'm mainly on in the evenings as well...will PM you later...

[Barbara fl.]

I check the Orlando news sites more often than I check our local news sites.

Judge Stan needs to take a couple of deep breaths, have a piece of chocolate and release his decisions. :biggrinjester:

Or we need to see the latest doc dump.


Desmom, you are the greatest.....we all appreciate your hard work in keeping us informed of the latest.....Thanks

[Ellie]

I believe he is just a NUT...it was also said that he confessed a few times to crimes he did not commit...


Ha...thanks for letting me know, Barbara. Sounds like he IS a nut. Kinda fitting, considering all the characters in this story....

[Barbara fl.]

Ha...thanks for letting me know, Barbara. Sounds like he IS a nut. Kinda fitting, considering all the characters in this story....

Your right...he fits right in...:blink:

[Katprint]

Everything you say makes total sense to me....I may not speak the language, but I understand it:wink:....I do have one question for you...when they show the video of Casey purchasing the items in target (after Caylee is gone) will the prosecution then be allowed to mention that she was using Amy's checks without her permission? and when Amy takes the stand, will she be able to mention it? Just curious...
I just don't see how using stolen checks makes it more likely that Casey killed Caylee. The prosecution isn't claiming that Casey killed Caylee to prevent Caylee telling Amy about Casey stealing and using Amy's checks. It is the classic "undue prejudice outweighing probative value" situation.

The fact that someone is generally a bad person is not admissible to prove guilt of a particular crime. Juries are not supposed to convict the defendants of being "bad people." Juries are supposed to decide whether they believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the specific crime which s/he is on trial for.

Maybe someone will make a great argument why the check thefts/frauds/forgeries prove Casey is responsible for murdering Caylee, and then I will change my opinion. :wink:

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[5boxersmom]

I don't think there's any doubt. The Ants would've cracked open the door on their bulging skeleton closet just far enough to jam *Caylee's Terminal Event* in there with all their other filthy secrets.

I think the Ants' behavior since day 31, and especially since December 11, is absolute proof they would've done things very differently back in mid-July 2008.

"Caylee who?" would take on a whole new meaning. imo

I remember one night a long time ago before Caylee was found. We were on late and all of us posters were discussing Cindy being on some tv show and we were saying Caylee Who? I never dreamed then it would continue to be that way even after her little body was found. :sad:

jmo

[Sun]

Maybe.

Shirlee was not present during any of the fights and therefore has no personal knowledge of the fights or what they were about. She only knows what she was told, which is "hearsay." Hearsay is inadmissible to prove the truth of the matter asserted but there are exceptions to hearsay. One exception is party statements being used against the party making the statement (for example, anything Casey ever said/wrote/emailed/texted is admissible if the prosecution wants to use it against her.) Another exception is a witness' prior inconsistent statements which can be used to impeach the witness.

Shortly before the trial begins, the prosecution and defense will each file motions in limine asking the judge to permit/exclude this testimony. If the judge decides to permit it, the way it will come in is that Cindy will testify that there were no fights (assuming Cindy testifies consistent with her TV interviews) then Shirlee will be called to impeach Cindy with Cindy's prior inconsistent statements concerning the fact that there were fights and what the fights were about. Also we may see the 9-1-1 dispatch records concerning police being sent to the Anthony residence for prior domestic disturbances. The police officers responding to those calls may testify about what they were told by the participants - including Casey - when they arrived.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Thank you so much Kat!!! You are so appreciated! I can understand your explanations and examples, and these issues become so much clearer to me.

This example comes to mind. In the Discovery Cindy told LE that "they had their people walk that area" (referring to where Caylee's remains were found). Yet in the Morgan depo, Cindy denied saying anything of the sort. (there were are least two LE people that indicated hearing those words out of Cindy's mouth, according to the discovery).

[adair]

Another question for Katprint or any one else.......

http://www.wftv.com/news/18394140/detail.html?rss=orlc&psp=news

Padilla Says P.I. Knew Where Caylee's Remains Were

Posted: 8:11 am EST January 1, 2009Updated: 8:32 am EST January 1, 2009
ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. -- Bounty hunter Leonard Padilla who first bailed Casey Anthony out of jail said he believes someone in the Anthony camp knew where Caylee's remains were before the meter reader found them.

Padilla says a private investigator named Dominic Casey who worked with the Anthony family was aware as early as mid-November that the remains were in a wooded area near Suburban Drive.

VIDEO REPORT: Padilla Says P.I. Knew Where Remains Were

However, the remains weren't officially found until mid-December.

"He says, 'Yeah Dominic called me on the 15th and said you gotta get up here we found Caylee.' Hoover tells me that he then asked Dominic 'Is she alive?' 'No she's dead,'" said Padilla.

~~~~

Isn't this with holding critical evidence from LE?

I cannot wait for when LP is on the stand....I bet JB spends his whole time on his feet objecting.

But then does this come under hearsay? When infact Caylee was found in those woods?

TIA

[CatMagnet]

Respectfully snipped:I tend to believe that the primary reason the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is to dilute the attention of Casey's attorneys.
Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Katprint, on topic... do you think Casey's attorneys are aware of this, or do you think they're trying to stop the check trial because they don't want Casey to be a convicted felon when she goes on trial for murder?

Off Topic...
I tried sending you a PM, but your inbox is full.

[summer]

I just don't see how using stolen checks makes it more likely that Casey killed Caylee. The prosecution isn't claiming that Casey killed Caylee to prevent Caylee telling Amy about Casey stealing and using Amy's checks. It is the classic "undue prejudice outweighing probative value" situation.

The fact that someone is generally a bad person is not admissible to prove guilt of a particular crime. Juries are not supposed to convict the defendants of being "bad people." Juries are supposed to decide whether they believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the specific crime which s/he is on trial for.

Maybe someone will make a great argument why the check thefts/frauds/forgeries prove Casey is responsible for murdering Caylee, and then I will change my opinion. :wink:

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

I agree with your take on this. I just hope if the fraud case is put on hold everything about her comings and goings during the 31 days can be introduced at the murder trial to show state of mind while her baby was *missing*.

Reason I'd like to see the fraud case happen now is:

I'm going to retch when the defense paints Casey as pure as the driven snow (except for the one-time-only pesky murder thingie) and we can expect that.

It would drive the entire A family up a tree and that would delight me no end.

If you say (and I believe you 100%) the facts of where when and how she spent her time during the 31 days can be presented then I'm satisfied. Thanks.

[summer]

Another question for Katprint or any one else.......

http://www.wftv.com/news/18394140/detail.html?rss=orlc&psp=news

Padilla Says P.I. Knew Where Caylee's Remains Were

Posted: 8:11 am EST January 1, 2009Updated: 8:32 am EST January 1, 2009
ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. -- Bounty hunter Leonard Padilla who first bailed Casey Anthony out of jail said he believes someone in the Anthony camp knew where Caylee's remains were before the meter reader found them.

Padilla says a private investigator named Dominic Casey who worked with the Anthony family was aware as early as mid-November that the remains were in a wooded area near Suburban Drive.

VIDEO REPORT: Padilla Says P.I. Knew Where Remains Were

However, the remains weren't officially found until mid-December.

"He says, 'Yeah Dominic called me on the 15th and said you gotta get up here we found Caylee.' Hoover tells me that he then asked Dominic 'Is she alive?' 'No she's dead,'" said Padilla.

~~~~

Isn't this with holding critical evidence from LE?

I cannot wait for when LP is on the stand....I bet JB spends his whole time on his feet objecting.

But then does this come under hearsay? When infact Caylee was found in those woods?

TIA


Adair, as colorful as he is I pray he doesn't take the stand. Talk about your circuses! Hopefully it'll just be Tracey and she's pretty much unimpeachable (I think) because she stepped away from the media when her job expired. She's the only one who spent significant time with Casey and it seems to me she's the best resource for the state. Tony has nothing to offer and Lenny has created too many sideshows - he'd be on the stand for weeks if the defense has their way. Too many pitfalls..... IMO.

[Deannalynn]

I just don't see how using stolen checks makes it more likely that Casey killed Caylee. The prosecution isn't claiming that Casey killed Caylee to prevent Caylee telling Amy about Casey stealing and using Amy's checks. It is the classic "undue prejudice outweighing probative value" situation.

The fact that someone is generally a bad person is not admissible to prove guilt of a particular crime. Juries are not supposed to convict the defendants of being "bad people." Juries are supposed to decide whether they believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the specific crime which s/he is on trial for.

Maybe someone will make a great argument why the check thefts/frauds/forgeries prove Casey is responsible for murdering Caylee, and then I will change my opinion. :wink:

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Not from me Katprint.
If it was a situation like Phil Spector whereas he pulled guns on many woman before he slammed the gun in Lana's mouth then there would be an argument on past behavior. One has nothing to do with the other in Casey's case. Except it's a felony, only. Only proves she's a thief. That does not prove she's a killer. Er, that's just my thoughts about it.
No argument here.
Guess it doesn't make any difference except she was out shopping for beer, bra's and food like it was just a normal day after she killed her daughter.

[Katprint]

Respectfully snipped:

Katprint, on topic... do you think Casey's attorneys are aware of this, or do you think they're trying to stop the check trial because they don't want Casey to be a convicted felon when she goes on trial for murder?

Off Topic...
I tried sending you a PM, but your inbox is full.
One of Casey's attorneys' foremost objections to having the check theft/fraud/forgery case go forward is improper motives on the part of the prosecution to deprive Casey of her attorneys' full attention to the murder case. And of course they don't want Casey to be a convicted felon when she goes on trial for murder (or any other time - if they could delay the check trial until sometime in the next century then they would) because they have left open the possibility that she might testify. Extrapolating from the little handwritten note Casey inserted into her typewritten declaration prepared by her attorneys, Casey may INSIST on testifying against advice of counsel.

Off topic - I have made room in my inbox for PMs.

Katprint
Katprint

[Pruddennce]

Is it known what she purchased at JCPenney? Did she replace that laundry duffle bag and Caylee's poo blankie? I never did catch the evidence about JC Penney-- I must have been out in the field working.

Nice to see you Pru... I always seem to miss you when I come here. lol

that information was not released Serenity, the video nor the receipts. what we do have is LE questioning Tony, if he recalls, what she bought at Pennys when he was with her. He did say shoes, IIRC, but he wasnt able to provide alot of information (wasnt paying attention I guess).

but it will be interesting to know exactly what she bought on her trips there. she bought quite a few clothing items at Target...I guess she didnt like the shoes there :D and of course, having no money, she opted for Cindy's cc at Pennys to buy new shoes. her shopping choices were limited, that is, until she wiped out Amy's account at the bank. but didnt have a chance to spend it all, as that was the day she was 'found' by Cindy.

but she managed to attempt to pay her cell phone bill online with Amy's account. quite a busy day, going to the tattoo parlor as well to 'book' another appt for saturday.

whewwwwwww......the defense is going to have a difficult time explaining her busy day, July 15th, claiming she 'spoke with Caylee' but then proceeded on to the tattoo parlor. along with the 30 days prior to being 'found' tapping away on her computer, after a 'hard day's work' of shuttling friends from the airport and visiting the tattoo parlor.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence...*

[Bala]

I just don't see how using stolen checks makes it more likely that Casey killed Caylee. The prosecution isn't claiming that Casey killed Caylee to prevent Caylee telling Amy about Casey stealing and using Amy's checks. It is the classic "undue prejudice outweighing probative value" situation.

The fact that someone is generally a bad person is not admissible to prove guilt of a particular crime. Juries are not supposed to convict the defendants of being "bad people." Juries are supposed to decide whether they believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the specific crime which s/he is on trial for.

Maybe someone will make a great argument why the check thefts/frauds/forgeries prove Casey is responsible for murdering Caylee, and then I will change my opinion. :wink:

Katprint
Always only my own opinions
I agree 100% but I do feel Casey's stealing that check from her grandmother is very relevant and hope it can come in as I feel it was the straw that broke Cindy's back and brought about Caylee's death that night. Although Casey stealing money from her parents doesn't make her a murderer it also played a pivotal role leading up to Caylee's murder.

[Amy]

I hope so. He's known for over a year now that the truth and Miss Anthony are strangers.

I would think he's now aware that trait runs through this family also.

And seemingly they and their DD who sits in jail hire people w/that same trait, and associate w/them, too--@ least the ones they have been publicly associated since day 31.

[Pruddennce]

page 2 - 3 http://www.orlandosentinel.com/media/acrobat/2009-04/46009131.pdf

6/27/08 - Time: 1457; Location: JC Penney; Purchaser - Anthony, Cynthia; Purchase Description: Clothes; Amount: $84.00; Evidence: Video Available; Notes: Casey used Mom's CC Casey & Tony in Video.

6/30/08 - Time: 1809; Location JC Penney; Purchaser - Anthony Cynthia; Amount: $73.40; Evidence: Video Available; Notes: Casey used Mom's cc Casey alone in video.

7/01/08 - Time: 1616; Locatin: JC Penney; Purcahser - Anthony, Cynthia; Amount $31.93; Evidence: Video; Notes: Casey used Mom's cc Casey & Amy in video.

ETA ~ description of purchases are not included LE's notes for 6/30/08 and 7/01/08.

thanks des. wonder if those videos and receipts will ever be released.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

[court~critic1®]

Not from me Katprint.
If it was a situation like Phil Spector whereas he pulled guns on many woman before he slammed the gun in Lana's mouth then there would be an argument on past behavior. One has nothing to do with the other in Casey's case. Except it's a felony, only. Only proves she's a thief. That does not prove she's a killer. Er, that's just my thoughts about it.
No argument here.
Guess it doesn't make any difference except she was out shopping for beer, bra's and food like it was just a normal day after she killed her daughter.



bollding mine.....does this not go to caseys' frame of mind while her daughter was "missing" or "kidnapped"????

[summer]

I agree 100% but I do feel Casey's stealing that check from her grandmother is very relevant and hope it can come in as I feel it was the straw that broke Cindy's back and brought about Caylee's death that night. Although Casey stealing money from her parents doesn't make her a murderer it also played a pivotal role leading up to Caylee's murder.

ITA on that one, Bala. If the fight is used as motive it seems what led to that fight is very critical to the state's case and should be allowed.

[Katprint]

I agree 100% but I do feel Casey's stealing that check from her grandmother is very relevant and hope it can come in as I feel it was the straw that broke Cindy's back and brought about Caylee's death that night. Although Casey stealing money from her parents doesn't make her a murderer it also played a pivotal role leading up to Caylee's murder.
I have a vague recollection that Casey's stealing from her grandmother was supposedly to buy items for Caylee's birthday party. So I agree that a big confrontation between Cindy and Casey may have resulted in Casey basically "taking it out" on Caylee afterwards a la "this is really YOUR fault, it was YOUR birthday party that I bought the stuff for."

But that is a completely different issue from Amy's stolen money/checks and the pending check theft/fraud/forgery prosecution. Also, they will still need to prove up the fight and the cause of the fight with some evidence other that pure inadmissible hearsay.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[Sun]

ITA on that one, Bala. If the fight is used as motive it seems what led to that fight is very critical to the state's case and should be allowed.

In a statement made to OCSO, Melina says after Caylee was born, Casey told her she felt her mother was "overbearing." Melina says that according to Casey, Cynthia had told Casey she should be spending more of her time at home with Caylee. Casey and Cynthia would have "extreme" arguments, mostly over Caylee. (Melina was a high school friend of Casey's)

"Also on Sep 15, LE met with JC (a neighbor of the Anthony's) who lives directly across from them. JC had info about two very loud augrments he heard between Casey and CA in May or June, both on weekends. According to JC:

JC: Casey came out of the house, screaming at CA and calling her names. I heard "F-you," and "Just Shut Up Mom," and "I Don't Want to Hear it Anymore." Then Casey went for a jog.

JC: Another time, Casey came outside screaming some stuff at CA. CA never raised her voice, just put her head down and got in her car and drove away. Casey just acted like a spoiled brat basically.

On Part 4 of a document dump, page 49, "Mark Fuhrman also reported that GA and CA explained that CA and Casey had an argument on the 15th or 16th of June.

Cindy's brother stated on a blog, "The fight was about Casey stealing money from her grandparents. She stole a check for $354 from her granddad's nursing home account that even Cindy's mom couldn't cash. The bank had to reimburse Cindy's dad's account. Cindy's mom wanted the bank to press charges but Cindy somehow got Casey out of it. That is what the fight was about. They had jsut visited Cindy's dad on fathers day. Cindy's mom was very unhappy with Cindy for not doing something about Casey. Cindy and Casey got into it. Big blowup that the neighbors overheard.

[Katprint]

Not from me Katprint.
If it was a situation like Phil Spector whereas he pulled guns on many woman before he slammed the gun in Lana's mouth then there would be an argument on past behavior. One has nothing to do with the other in Casey's case. Except it's a felony, only. Only proves she's a thief. That does not prove she's a killer. Er, that's just my thoughts about it.
No argument here.
Guess it doesn't make any difference except she was out shopping for beer, bra's and food like it was just a normal day after she killed her daughter.

bollding mine.....does this not go to caseys' frame of mind while her daughter was "missing" or "kidnapped"????
The conduct of buying beer, bras and food is admissible to show Casey's state of mind i.e. that Casey was enjoying herself with her friends rather than worrying and/or searching frantically for her daughter. How the beer, bras and food were paid for is a completely separate issue which is probably not relevant.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[desmom]

I have a vague recollection that Casey's stealing from her grandmother was supposedly to buy items for Caylee's birthday party. So I agree that a big confrontation between Cindy and Casey may have resulted in Casey basically "taking it out" on Caylee afterwards a la "this is really YOUR fault, it was YOUR birthday party that I bought the stuff for."

But that is a completely different issue from Amy's stolen money/checks and the pending check theft/fraud/forgery prosecution. Also, they will still need to prove up the fight and the cause of the fight with some evidence other that pure inadmissible hearsay.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Casey stole 2 checks from her grandmother. The lst check was wrote to Publix for birthday party supplies for Caylee's 2nd birthday. The check was around $50.

The 2nd check was stolen in the spring of 2008. It was wrote out to AT&T for approximately $350. The check was wrote on the account connected to Mr. Plesea's nursing home account (or something like that).

jmo

(check amounts are from desmom's mental CRS files and may not be exact.)

[Rapunzel]

Here is something you all can sink your teeth into...yuk...oh well...


http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88156

Emails to and from Oak Ridge Labs and OCSO

One mentions coffin flies...interesting...some other good stuff too.

my link:

http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/corpse_fauna/flies/coffin.htm

[court~critic1®]

The conduct of buying beer, bras and food is admissible to show Casey's state of mind i.e. that Casey was enjoying herself with her friends rather than worrying and/or searching frantically for her daughter. How the beer, bras and food was paid for is a completely separate issue.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions


That is what I thought but wasn't sure. So, can they show the videos to show "frame of mind" ? TIA

[Bala]

Wasn't there 2 checks she stole from the grandmother. One for Caylee's B-Day and the other for her phone bill that Universal was to pay back.

[Deannalynn]

Casey stole 2 checks from her grandmother. The lst check was wrote to Publix for birthday party supplies for Caylee's 2nd birthday. The check was around $50.

The 2nd check was stolen in the spring of 2008. It was wrote out to AT&T for approximately $350. The check was wrote on the account connected to Mr. Plesea's nursing home account (or something like that).

jmo

(check amounts are from desmom's mental CRS files and may not be exact.)
Bolding mine...
Hey, I have one of them files myself. :biggrin:

[Amy]

the judge briefly commented, made a statement to JB about what that document stated...it was pretty clear that the bonds group were not hired by JB or bound by his firm. MO, the judge 'almost' denied his motion, but chose to be prudent.

what is really strange is how JB is attempting to qualify that document with unwritten legal claims. doesnt he understand his own verbiage?

IMO, Tracy had a few exchanges with Casey and everyone in that house heard those exchanges.... (George claiming he is somewhat deaf when it comes to 'other people's conversations').....right........

the state: what is the sq footage of your home? <---lol inferring one cant sneeze without someone hearing you in this small, one story home.

IMO they will be allowed to testify.

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence...*

I'm not a legals eagle in any way, but I do try to keep my eyes and ears open to learning the intricacies of legal stuff.

When Baez says "work product" from LP and from D Casey, I was wondering, just where DID that boy go to law school? It could not have been in the US of A, that's for sure. Makes one wonder if it was from a cracker jack box. If the person is not working for you @ the time of the activity, conversations or whatever, it is NOT a work product.

Jose Baez nor Casey Anthony nor no one on her legal team @ any time HIRED the services of LP. LP tho't if he bailed this OC out, she would "talk." He was working for himself--or @ the least, for the one who really put up the money, and that would not be Baez nor anyone associated with anything Anthony.

And, when D Casey was poking around in the wooded area, his contract w/Baez had terminated months before (end of Aug?) And I'm not sure if he was working even for the A's @ the time. I wonder if Baez is under the impression that, anyone who has ever worked for him in any capacity @ any time, is forever after going to be under his "work product" umbrella? (Shaking head in bewilderment.)

Or, it could just be a bit more of slinging anything and everything against the wall, hoping they will luck out and something will stick. They are pretty desperate, IMO.

[Deannalynn]

I agree 100% but I do feel Casey's stealing that check from her grandmother is very relevant and hope it can come in as I feel it was the straw that broke Cindy's back and brought about Caylee's death that night. Although Casey stealing money from her parents doesn't make her a murderer it also played a pivotal role leading up to Caylee's murder.

How could the state argue that it played a pivotal role in the murder of her daughter Caylee?:confused:
Stealing from Gramma.

[Bala]

What I don't get is what BOA was thinking cashing these checks in the first place. Since when can just anyone sign a check and the bank cash it.

[Amy]

I was thiinking the same thing.
We, I believe, could all be responsible for
a best seller combining all our knowledge and ideas.
I actually think we know more then the jury will ever know.
Sometimes I think we even know more then the Judge.
Like not knowing the Anthonys were appearing on tv all the time
when they said they were home grieving.
Oh I would love to be able to tell the world what all we know and believe.
you know someone wrote a book about Scott and Laci before he was even arrested I think.....or at least before he went to trial.
There was also a made for tv movie.
I really wish some one would to do something like that before the Anthonys publisize all their BS.

Catherine Crier's book came out either during or before the trial--either way, it was written before the trial. Didn't read it, was waiting for one that had more evidence that came out in trial, and the actual, factual outcome. Bill Kurtis had a documentary out before even the arrest, I think. To this day, there are portions that are downright incorrect--some shown to be incorrect before the trial, and some thru the trial. To this day, I don't think there have been any statements of correction @ the end of the documentary.

I think it is Diane Fanning who has already or is in the process of writing a book about this case. If I understood her statement correctly, she has read the doc dumps, the news articles, probably watched the tv interviews of C&G, and that is what she is basing her book on. No interviews with anyone Anthony, or Baez, the prosecution and such, tho.

[Bala]

How could the state argue that it played a pivotal role in the murder of her daughter Caylee?:confused:
Stealing from Gramma.
Because Casey's stealing was causing more and more tension in the A's home and was what caused Cindy finally to kick Casey out of the house that night. I believe that fight over the stolen check was what led up to Casey killing Caylee.

[denjet]

hey its Serenity! :)

if that is precluded for some reason, they still have video of her shopping for herself at JC Penny....two visits IIRC.

but IMO they will be able to show her day out at target and what she bought, without revealing how she paid for the items......

or if no video, the dated receipts.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

Hi Pru! (if you're still here...)
ITA ... videos of her shopping at Target and Penny's and renting movies at Blockbuster ... pictures of her out clubbing will paint the picture ... they won't be able to use anything that's in the fraud charges in her murder trial ...

Even if the fraud trial takes place before the murder trial and she's convicted, I don't believe that can be used in the murder trial only the penalty phase.

I have a feeling the judge will put this trial off but because of financial reasons, and not the reasons Lyon spoke about ... I found her arguements to be threatening ... many motions, COV, etc., etc. to imply to the court that the fraud trial will be a long one and cost a lot of money ... I think the judge will rule to avoid this JMO

However, I think they lost the Padilla and TES one ... the judge will most likely rule for the limited access to TES and searchers that Nejame put forth because it's reasonable ... as far as Padilla and crew ... "that horse has left the barn"!! :tonguewag:

[Amy]

How about..

Winning Confrontation Techiques hammer by Cindy

We're missing Lee--probably because he seems to be missing, lol!!!!

I dunno---"Protester Poster Removal 101" ??????

[desmom]

What I don't get is what BOA was thinking cashing these checks in the first place. Since when can just anyone sign a check and the bank cash it.

Casey signed Amy's name to the checks...with the exception of one.

IMO, that one check probably cost the checker her job or she received additional training.

[Bala]

Casey signed Amy's name to the checks...with the exception of one.

IMO, that one check probably cost the checker her job or she received additional training.
But didn't Casey also sign her name to her grandmother's check. I put the wrong date on a check once and the bank sent it back how can AT&T cash a check from the grandmother's account with Casey's name.

[desmom]

But didn't Casey also sign her name to her grandmother's check. I put the wrong date on a check once and the bank sent it back how can AT&T cash a check from the grandmother's account with Casey's name.

I don't believe we have seen the AT&T check on Grandma's account.

If the date on a check is within the last 6 months, the banks in this area will accept the check. If the check is a post dated check, the bank will return it or contact the account holder. jmo

[*Serenity*]

that information was not released Serenity, the video nor the receipts. what we do have is LE questioning Tony, if he recalls, what she bought at Pennys when he was with her. He did say shoes, IIRC, but he wasnt able to provide alot of information (wasnt paying attention I guess).

but it will be interesting to know exactly what she bought on her trips there. she bought quite a few clothing items at Target...I guess she didnt like the shoes there :D and of course, having no money, she opted for Cindy's cc at Pennys to buy new shoes. her shopping choices were limited, that is, until she wiped out Amy's account at the bank. but didnt have a chance to spend it all, as that was the day she was 'found' by Cindy.

but she managed to attempt to pay her cell phone bill online with Amy's account. quite a busy day, going to the tattoo parlor as well to 'book' another appt for saturday.

whewwwwwww......the defense is going to have a difficult time explaining her busy day, July 15th, claiming she 'spoke with Caylee' but then proceeded on to the tattoo parlor. along with the 30 days prior to being 'found' tapping away on her computer, after a 'hard day's work' of shuttling friends from the airport and visiting the tattoo parlor.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence...*

That was one of her quick spur-of-the-moment lies to Cindy in hopes of getting Cindy to back off, and of course give her one more day. lol
All of her lies seem to be johnny on the spot with whatever pops in her head -- no planning or thinking ahead for that girl.. IMO

[Amy]

If the check fraud case is after the murder trial, will the state have to omit Casey on tape at target, penneys, and the bofa?
If so-- that is exactly why the defense wants that put off, as to NOT show what casey was doing while caylee was missing.

I don't think they can use anything she is not yet convicted on, but that is JMO. I think only that which has been proven (in another case) can be used. I would think they would be able to use whatever to show she was not making purchases for a 2 year old, just not be able to mention or ask about payment methods.

[sydney]

Casey signed Amy's name to the checks...with the exception of one.

IMO, that one check probably cost the checker her job or she received additional training.

real quick here - we had an employee embezzle over $30k in checks from our company - they were made to the company and she signed her name on "behalf" of the company. turns out she had a "friendly" teller who just went and cashed those checks anyway. some of them were deposited in those overnight deposit slots and the person who processed them didn't question the endorsement on the back. i have no clue what happened to those individuals.

they've tightened things up here quite a bit at some banks. in some cases, if you are trying to cash a third party check, you have to bring the individual the check is originally made out to and who has already endorsed it to state, in front of the teller, that it is okay for the other person to cash the check. even if the bank knows your relationship with that person, i.e. father and son.

don't you have to provide your driver's license for id in order to cash checks? i recall (dimly) having to have do that in the past.

[Katprint]

What I don't get is what BOA was thinking cashing these checks in the first place. Since when can just anyone sign a check and the bank cash it.
Some check cashing businesses won't cash checks above a certain amount unless they can call the maker of the check and verify that they wrote the check. This is time-consuming and is part of the reason that check cashing businesses charge higher fees. Most banks merely cash checks that appear correct on their face, and if those checks turn out to be forged/stolen checks then the banks may be liable to reimburse their customers. However, their customers also have a duty to take reasonable precautions to safeguard their checks and to promptly notify the bank when their checks are stolen. This limits the banks' potential exposure.

A situation like Amy's where her checks are stolen out of a normally safe place (the glovebox of her car) by a close friend while she is out of the country is pretty unusual. Normally people know pretty quickly when their purses/wallets have been stolen and they are able to notify their banks and credit card companies to change their account numbers.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[Amy]

How funny if these are them and LKB has been whining for these and Rap pulled them from the website. :lol:

Maybe she's on the same page as Baez--wanting the state to provide them w/all the doucments, etc for free, when the rest of the attorneys have to pay for them. Maybe, if one of the dream teem or their minions are reading the message boards, they will figure out where to look online for that which they are wanting. Ooops, guess they'd still have to pay for the ink and paper in their own printer, plus the electricity, and someone to get it all printed out for them. Guess we're back to square one--waiting for the state to provide them in print for free. :biggrin:

[Imperfect4]

I just don't see how using stolen checks makes it more likely that Casey killed Caylee. The prosecution isn't claiming that Casey killed Caylee to prevent Caylee telling Amy about Casey stealing and using Amy's checks. It is the classic "undue prejudice outweighing probative value" situation.

The fact that someone is generally a bad person is not admissible to prove guilt of a particular crime. Juries are not supposed to convict the defendants of being "bad people." Juries are supposed to decide whether they believe beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the specific crime which s/he is on trial for.

Maybe someone will make a great argument why the check thefts/frauds/forgeries prove Casey is responsible for murdering Caylee, and then I will change my opinion. :wink:

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Bolded to address. I get that point intellectually, but from an emotional sort of "gut" perspective, I disagree with it. Imo, a person's character does and should factor into the equation at some level. Otherwise, the message we seem to be sending is it's okay to be a rotten, lousy person as long as you don't take it all the way to murder. Problem is, excusing and enabling rotten, lousy people is what helps them grow into murderers.

Character does matter in life. It really does. The fact it supposedly doesn't matter when we're talking about people accused of crimes just doesn't sit right with me.

[Amy]

Does anyone else think that a "big" part of the defense's story will include the letter from the guy in jail about how someone else in Casey's life was responsible for Caylee's death? I assume he was referring to Tone-- I read it and then wasn't here for a few days after so I'm not sure if you all have already gone over this much.

I guess they could bring that up--but surely, if they did their homework like I would expect LE did--it wouldn't take much to check up on TonE (or any other bf's that might have been in NY @ one time) to rule him out. Besides, Mr Jackson mentioned he had been in prison w/this person who killed Caylee, and by his description, the incarcertation would have had to have been AFTER Caylee was killed. I didn't notice TonE missing in action, and I would think if he had gone to prison @ any time, that would have been fodder for the media-@ the least, the tabloids.

I guess if they want egg on their face (more egg, that is) they could just go right on ahead.

[Scampi]

Here is something you all can sink your teeth into...yuk...oh well...


http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88156

Emails to and from Oak Ridge Labs and OCSO

One mentions coffin flies...interesting...some other good stuff too.

my link:

http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/corpse_fauna/flies/coffin.htm

What a goldmine this is, thanks Rap!! Looks like the entomologist is going to play a pivitol role in this trial.

[jammies]

excellent observation adair: Cindy sending Lee out...which means she KNEW she was not shuttling back and forth between anywhere. she left out that information from her endless wordy interviews with LE.

she also would not provide LE with her JC penny statements, as if she could prevent them from obtaining them thru legal means. LE already had video of Casey at JC Penny, not one but two that we know of thru their interview with Tony..where he had to identify stills of himself as being there with Casey.

Cindy told another potential witness, Brittany S that Casey WAS sneaking back into the home by baiting her out of the home. she also told Brittany she was stealing. the same statements she made to other individuals: she was a thief. and to Ryan P: A WARNING several weeks prior to this event. she was a thief AND a sociopath.

the defense has a problem: thru Cindy's excited utterances and thru her own frustration she revealed to several individuals that Casey's exit from the home was not based on an isolated incident. she revealed that she was a thief and liar prior to her leaving the home with Caylee.

Casey's behaviour and actions 'before' this incident will be revealed thru many many witnesses...CA did not become 'someone else' in a blink of an eye....there exists many problems that were brewing, this was NOT an isolated event, nor new behaviour.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*


Still just KILLS me when I think of Cindy reciting to LE (or FBI) Casey's agenda for the entire month she was "bonding". Always made me think CINDY made the whole thing up. How did she have it all down to a "t" otherwise?? Didn't she figure that it would eventually come out that she KNEW Casey was in Orlando the entire month??

How her lies flow so smoothly off her forked tongue is amazing to me. Then watching Casey lie right back to her and GA and they don't bat an eye. Lies upon lies upon lies. A big circle of fantasy and pretend.

The fake outrage when questionned, the hysterics, threats etc.....these folks are pros. They didn't just become this way when Cindy called 911.... this is WHO THEY ARE.

Would absolutely LOVE to know what LE/FBI has to say about them behind closed doors. (Strickland too) Course they deal with folks like this day in, day out so maybe it's not so unusual. :scared:

[Rapunzel]

What a goldmine this is, thanks Rap!! Looks like the entomologist is going to play a pivitol role in this trial.

Quite welcome...I believe the gentleman who posted this info pays for the discovery so some of this comes out sooner the waiting for the media.

[onlykaty]

Your right, if it were me Casey would not have even got out the door with Caylee....Cindy IS just as unfit as her daughter.....she let her leave with Caylee bcause Caylee was a responsibility that Cindy didn't want....

Cindy made a lot of mistakes, George too as far as that goes, they seemed to fail as parents, there is more to parenting than just putting a roof over thier heads, feeding and clothing them. They let Casey get by with so much, lived in denial of anything she did, not even being able to face the fact she was pregnant until they had to. The fact that Casey was a liar and theif is something that should have been dealt with early on. BUT, in my mind, they had no idea she would murder her own child. I'm sure if they did they would have stopped it. I blame Casey for Caylee's death and her alone. They still enable Casey by covering up for her and supporting the person that killed their grand daughter, for that I have no sympathy for them and don't give them a pass on it. The one thing I do know is they raised a child killer and that will someday, when they are old and gray haunt them in their last days. I don't even know if Casey had a different life if things would have been different, she was so obessessed with herself, Casey, was a legend in her own mind, best friend to everyone in school, always was the person people came to when they needed to talk, she seemed to think well of herself. Look how she had all of friends fooled. Casey destroys lives and takes what she wants, then discards what is not usefull to her anymore or gets in her way. Caylee was the one thing in her life she felt like was her's to do with as she pleased without having to maniuplate. Casey wanted to live the good life and there was no room in it for Caylee. I could go on and on.

Casey alone killed Caylee, there are alot of what ifs, but sooner or later as long as she was in that childs life, I beleive the outcome would have been the same.

as always jmo

[sunbunny]

Quite welcome...I believe the gentleman who posted this info pays for the discovery so some of this comes out sooner the waiting for the media.

definitely looks to be genuine, too! i "tracked" the fed ex number that was mentioned!! :w00t:

please keep posting these "goldmines." :wub:

[jammies]

Bolded to address. I get that point intellectually, but from an emotional sort of "gut" perspective, I disagree with it. Imo, a person's character does and should factor into the equation at some level. Otherwise, the message we seem to be sending is it's okay to be a rotten, lousy person as long as you don't take it all the way to murder. Problem is, excusing and enabling rotten, lousy people is what helps them grow into murderers.

Character does matter in life. It really does. The fact it supposedly doesn't matter when we're talking about people accused of crimes just doesn't sit right with me.

I hear ya, Imp. Like when a jury doesn't get to hear the background of a total scumbag. Background counts for a lot in my book but as you wrote, intellectually I understand why it doesn't come up in court.

I hate that we at HOME know the entire history but a jury only get a tiny piece. ...and yes, I judge people for what they have done in the past if they haven't turned their life around. Character DOES count and in the real world you either have it or you don't. Haven't met many people that suddenly "found" it although we all know there are exceptions.

[onlykaty]

I hear ya, Imp. Like when a jury doesn't get to hear the background of a total scumbag. Background counts for a lot in my book but like you wrote, intellectually I understand why it doesn't come up in court.

I hate that we at HOME know the entire history but a jury only get a tiny piece. ...and yes, I judge people for what they have done in the past if they haven't turned their life around. Character DOES count and in the real world you either have it or you don't. Haven't met many people that suddenly "found" it although we all know there are exceptions.

We all have had a lot of time to go over and re go over everything we can get our hands on, which is a lot. I have thought about so many what ifs. :(

There is going to be a lot for the jury to take in, I hope they all bring pens and a BIG notebook with them. Its going to be a longgggggg trial imo.

[Katprint]

I hear ya, Imp. Like when a jury doesn't get to hear the background of a total scumbag. Background counts for a lot in my book but like you wrote, intellectually I understand why it doesn't come up in court.

I hate that we at HOME know the entire history but a jury only get a tiny piece. ...and yes, I judge people for what they have done in the past if they haven't turned their life around. Character DOES count and in the real world you either have it or you don't. Haven't met many people that suddenly "found" it although we all know there are exceptions.
While I agree that character is important - I never said it wasn't - what is also important is not merely rounding up "the usual suspects" whenever a crime is committed. There are many scumbags who nonetheless are innocent of a particular crime. There are people who commit heinous crimes who have never been convicted before (e.g. Scott Peterson.) I am NOT saying that Casey has been falsely accused, but I honestly believe in the legal principle that each criminal trial needs to stand on its own facts and not what other unrelated crimes the person has previously (or subsequently) committed.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[jammies]

What a goldmine this is, thanks Rap!! Looks like the entomologist is going to play a pivitol role in this trial.


Love the pizza memo's. "The pizza story came from the mother" lol

[Deannalynn]

Here is something you all can sink your teeth into...yuk...oh well...


http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88156

Emails to and from Oak Ridge Labs and OCSO

One mentions coffin flies...interesting...some other good stuff too.

my link:

http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/corpse_fauna/flies/coffin.htm

What they said was Fruit flies may be "corpse flies?"
They found decomp?
They spoke about Casey's shoes that she may taken them off after she walked in the water with Caylee. Also her pants. The bottom of her pants But...'ol Cindy probably washed them both.
They need to get thrown in the poky with Casey for obstruction of justice! jmho

[Lapis]

Hi Pru! (if you're still here...)
ITA ... videos of her shopping at Target and Penny's and renting movies at Blockbuster ... pictures of her out clubbing will paint the picture ... they won't be able to use anything that's in the fraud charges in her murder trial ...

Even if the fraud trial takes place before the murder trial and she's convicted, I don't believe that can be used in the murder trial only the penalty phase.

I have a feeling the judge will put this trial off but because of financial reasons, and not the reasons Lyon spoke about ... I found her arguements to be threatening ... many motions, COV, etc., etc. to imply to the court that the fraud trial will be a long one and cost a lot of money ... I think the judge will rule to avoid this JMO

However, I think they lost the Padilla and TES one ... the judge will most likely rule for the limited access to TES and searchers that Nejame put forth because it's reasonable ... as far as Padilla and crew ... "that horse has left the barn"!! :tonguewag:

For the record it is not considered a threat when someone states that they will exercise their legal rights. JMO

[jammies]

While I agree that character is important - I never said it wasn't - what is also important is not merely rounding up "the usual suspects" whenever a crime is committed. There are many scumbags who nonetheless are innocent of a particular crime. There are people who commit heinous crimes who have never been convicted before (e.g. Scott Peterson.) I am NOT saying that Casey has been falsely accused, but I honestly believe in the legal principle that each criminal trial needs to stand on its own facts and not what other unrelated crimes the person has previously (or subsequently) committed.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions


Oh, I know, Kat. You don't have to explain because I completely understand what you are saying. That's why YOU are an attorney and I'm not! I'm definately judgemental and I admit it. For instance, if you are a lousy parent, child services have been to your home, your kids are neglected and one day your child turns up missing or dead...... whether you hurt that child or not, in my mind you are GUILTY!

I would never make it on a jury either..... probably a good thing! :biggrin:

[Deannalynn]

Cindy made a lot of mistakes, George too as far as that goes, they seemed to fail as parents, there is more to parenting than just putting a roof over thier heads, feeding and clothing them. They let Casey get by with so much, lived in denial of anything she did, not even being able to face the fact she was pregnant until they had to. The fact that Casey was a liar and theif is something that should have been dealt with early on. BUT, in my mind, they had no idea she would murder her own child. I'm sure if they did they would have stopped it. I blame Casey for Caylee's death and her alone. They still enable Casey by covering up for her and supporting the person that killed their grand daughter, for that I have no sympathy for them and don't give them a pass on it. The one thing I do know is they raised a child killer and that will someday, when they are old and gray haunt them in their last days. I don't even know if Casey had a different life if things would have been different, she was so obessessed with herself, Casey, was a legend in her own mind, best friend to everyone in school, always was the person people came to when they needed to talk, she seemed to think well of herself. Look how she had all of friends fooled. Casey destroys lives and takes what she wants, then discards what is not usefull to her anymore or gets in her way. Caylee was the one thing in her life she felt like was her's to do with as she pleased without having to maniuplate. Casey wanted to live the good life and there was no room in it for Caylee. I could go on and on.

Casey alone killed Caylee, there are alot of what ifs, but sooner or later as long as she was in that childs life, I beleive the outcome would have been the same.

as always jmo

ITA...A lot of what you said sounds like Cindy, too.:sneaky:

She tried to minipulate LE..Didn't work and it pizzed her off to no end.
JMO

[jose]

I tend to believe that the primary reason the state is pressing for the check fraud trial to go forward is to dilute the attention of Casey's attorneys. I doubt any check theft/fraud convictions would be admissible even though they are felonies unless Casey takes the stand, because they are really irrelevant to the issue of whether Casey murdered Caylee. Yes, they would show that Casey is generally a bad person but that kind of character evidence is not admissible. If Casey did take the stand then then those convictions would be admissible to impeach Casey and show that she is a dishonest person. Even without any convictions, however, if Casey chooses to testify then she can be cross-examined about her various frauds, forgeries and thefts from friends and family.

The really important parts of Casey's shopping sprees at Target and getting her tattoo and otherwise using her ill-gotten gains to have a great time is not that it was paid for with stolen money but that 1) she bought items only for herself and nothing for Caylee, 2) she appears to be enjoying herself, and 3) she does not appear to be searching for Caylee. The store videos of her shopping for lingerie and clothes (no doubt because of her leaving most of her own stuff behind at Cindy's when she stormed out so she needed to buy new stuff - but only for herself because she had already killed Caylee) will come it even if the source of payment is excluded because the undue prejudice outweighs its probative value. Similarly, photos of her dancing provocatively at the clubs - authenticated by the photographers - will come in even if how she paid for her drinks is excluded. The photo of her brand new tattoo - supplemented by testimony of the tattoo artist who applied it - will come in even if how she paid for her new tattoo is excluded. and so forth.

Note: The check fraud/forgery/theft case is NOT a civil case; it is a criminal case. The defamation lawsuit filed by Zenaida Gonzales is a civil case.

Further Note: I do not know how Florida handles consecutive vs. concurrent sentencing, particularly a recidivist like Casey. Generally speaking, a non-violent first offense would result in a stiff fine, an order of restitution, and year or two of probation. However, Casey's situation is unique in the number of offenses she is charged with, the number of uncharged similar offenses (involving family members i.e. money stolen from Casey's grandmother, from Cindy's credit cards, from Casey's piggy bank, etc.) which constitute an aggravating circumstance, and the separate pending murder charge.
Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Good post Kat, my take is the prosecution wants to be able to tell the jury that KC is a convicted felon during the penalty phase going to aggravating circumstances

[jammies]

"From: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 2:15 PM
To: Vincent, Michael
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

Mike, we are still very curious about the very high levels of chloroform we saw in the trunk sample. I know you said nothing was found in the house search, but did the mother r other family member or friend/other relative have any access to pharmaceutical supplies ie working in a lab or hospital, veterinary clinic etc?? Just a thought. Arpad

Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D."


:ohmy:

[Postergeist]

GA's IMO would be: THAT LITTLE GIRL and would consist of three sentences stating 'what he misses' about Caylee: walking to the mailbox, looking at the stars AND *I was the one who usually gave 'the little girl' breakfast in the morning...because her mother liked to sleep late*

the end.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

Hi all! Reading thru and enjoying everyone's posts- Pru, gotta say, his book would be a tad bit longer-

I think he'd include her calling him Jo Jo, and that he misses the smell of her sweat. :rolleyes:

(in fact, apologies to the poster/s that mentioned previous book suggestions in the past- someone mentioned there could be some sort of scratch and sniff with stickers book- pizza smell, squirrel, etc. I say throw in extras like a pop-up book- be sure to work in NG's comments to go with them- "push up bra and boots" and "bombshell")

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0901/30/ng.01.html

1/30/09

GRACE: Well, you know, I would agree with you, except, Joe Episcopo, we have all the photos of the real Casey that we`ve come to know outside the jailhouse walls, the one of her at the stripper pole in the push-up bra and the mini-skirt with the stiletto boots, OK? Now, if this were another situation, maybe I could take Sherman`s argument. But give her dignity? I mean, when she`s outside jailhouse walls, she does not dress like Mrs. Frumpett.

[5boxersmom]

"From: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 2:15 PM
To: Vincent, Michael
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

Mike, we are still very curious about the very high levels of chloroform we saw in the trunk sample. I know you said nothing was found in the house search, but did the mother r other family member or friend/other relative have any access to pharmaceutical supplies ie working in a lab or hospital, veterinary clinic etc?? Just a thought. Arpad

Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D."


:ohmy:


Who was the friend of Casey's that worked at a Vet Clinic? I remember this being mentioned.

jmo

[Rapunzel]

Who was the friend of Casey's that worked at a Vet Clinic? I remember this being mentioned.

jmo


I was a Veterinary Tech for 25 years...OK I'm old...been retired since 2000...we never had chloroform ever for anything...in the early days we did have ether.

[frances1]

While I agree that character is important - I never said it wasn't - what is also important is not merely rounding up "the usual suspects" whenever a crime is committed. There are many scumbags who nonetheless are innocent of a particular crime. There are people who commit heinous crimes who have never been convicted before (e.g. Scott Peterson.) I am NOT saying that Casey has been falsely accused, but I honestly believe in the legal principle that each criminal trial needs to stand on its own facts and not what other unrelated crimes the person has previously (or subsequently) committed.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Katprint, haven't read all the posts, but are you saying there is no advantage for the prosecution to try the checks case prior to the murder case, because it wouldn't come in anyway? Thanks for all you contribute to this forum.

[ttcRider]

Casey signed Amy's name to the checks...with the exception of one.

IMO, that one check probably cost the checker her job or she received additional training.

I remember thinking that when it first came out... I don't think re-training is an option for this poor girl! :laugh:

[Postergeist]

We will have to PM each other....and maybe get things going....

psst- isn't the problem tho that IS actually "owns" our posts? Wouldn't we have to get permission (or give them a cut?)

well, we do have our illustrious legal team of our very own posters here!

:thumbup:

It would be funny tho- for others to see our nics- and then our nics for our nics (like desmom- aka the Link Queen) etc.

hehe, think we could get a Coldwater Speaks chapter!

[jammies]

Who was the friend of Casey's that worked at a Vet Clinic? I remember this being mentioned.

jmo


Never heard that mentioned, boxer. Maybe someone else remembers.


I'm intrigued by the "coffin flies"..... as someone else said on that board: could be the smoking gun.

[ttcRider]

Who was the friend of Casey's that worked at a Vet Clinic? I remember this being mentioned.

jmo

Sorry OT but in the Benardo case up here the wife had access to vet meds and used them on her sister causing her death... :sad:

[5boxersmom]

Never heard that mentioned, boxer. Maybe someone else remembers.


I'm intrigued by the "coffin flies"..... as someone else said on that board: could be the smoking gun.

I think it was Ryan P or someone he mentioned.

jmo

[Barbara fl.]

psst- isn't the problem tho that IS actually "owns" our posts? Wouldn't we have to get permission (or give them a cut?)

well, we do have our illustrious legal team of our very own posters here!

:thumbup:

It would be funny tho- for others to see our nics- and then our nics for our nics (like desmom- aka the Link Queen) etc.

hehe, think we could get a Coldwater Speaks chapter!


I think it could be worth a try....I'll be in touch...

[jammies]

I think it was Ryan P or someone he mentioned.

jmo


I googled and all I came up with was JB requesting the cadaver dogs vet records.

[Dells]

How could the state argue that it played a pivotal role in the murder of her daughter Caylee?:confused:
Stealing from Gramma.

I guess the state could say that it shows motive. :shrug: They could say that Casey stealing from her Grandmother caused the huge fight between Cindy and Casey which ultimately led to Casey murdering Caylee in order to get back at Cindy. The stealing doesn't even have to come into play during the trial. Just seeing Casey buying things only for herself so nonchalantly as if she didn't have a care in the world will be plenty.:sneaky:

[CatMagnet]

"From: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 2:15 PM
To: Vincent, Michael
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

Mike, we are still very curious about the very high levels of chloroform we saw in the trunk sample. I know you said nothing was found in the house search, but did the mother r other family member or friend/other relative have any access to pharmaceutical supplies ie working in a lab or hospital, veterinary clinic etc?? Just a thought. Arpad

Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D."


:ohmy:

Imo, I wonder if the chloroform was caused by tons of use of some sort of cleaner, or something like hand sanitizer:

"Some hand sanitizer products use agents other than alcohol, such as triclosan or benzalkonium chloride, to kill germs.... Triclosan leads to various problems with natural biological systems and triclosan, when combined with chlorine e.g. from tap water, produces chloroform."

Triclosan is also "... found in soaps (0.10-1.00%), deodorants, toothpastes, shaving creams, mouth washes, and cleaning supplies, and is infused in an increasing number of consumer products, such as kitchen utensils, toys, bedding, socks, and trash bags."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_sanitizer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triclosan

[Postergeist]

Because Casey's stealing was causing more and more tension in the A's home and was what caused Cindy finally to kick Casey out of the house that night. I believe that fight over the stolen check was what led up to Casey killing Caylee.

I too think that was a big part of it Bala- throw in Casey wanting to go to PR and Cindy likely saying she wasn't going to give her the money or watch Caylee during that time...and boom!

While Cindy didn't seem to think her daughter's thieving from others were an issue (telling RG it was 'only one time' about Jesse) I think Cindy must've felt more protective when it came down to her mother getting rooked again.

So much discord in that house it seems.

[adair]

I too think that was a big part of it Bala- throw in Casey wanting to go to PR and Cindy likely saying she wasn't going to give her the money or watch Caylee during that time...and boom!

While Cindy didn't seem to think her daughter's thieving from others were an issue (telling RG it was 'only one time' about Jesse) I think Cindy must've felt more protective when it came down to her mother getting rooked again.

So much discord in that house it seems.


I think that Cindy offering kc to come and clean Shirley house to help pay her back, and Shirley saying...nope, dont really want her around here...was like a bunch in the gut to Cindy. JMO MOO.

But thats gotta hurt.

[Postergeist]

I think it could be worth a try....I'll be in touch...

ty hon! :smile:

There would need to be a section for all of our lingo tho, so they can get our inside jokes!

and Rapunzel- you'd be mighty helpful over on the Animal forum here with your experience!

(love the fact that we have so many with so many areas of training here!)


(oh- o/t did any one see the thread by 8Belles about one of our Caylee posters that passed away? :sad: it's over in the b'day & spiritual forum)

[Postergeist]

ITA...A lot of what you said sounds like Cindy, too.:sneaky:

She tried to minipulate LE..Didn't work and it pizzed her off to no end.
JMO

Who does this??!!!

I tell ya, I'm too meek around LE, heck- if I just see a cop car when I'm driving I somehow think I must be guilty of something- and I'm no law breaker!

(maybe because I've never been a bully?) :shrug:

[onlykaty]

We're missing Lee--probably because he seems to be missing, lol!!!!

I dunno---"Protester Poster Removal 101" ??????


I wonder why we hear or see nothing of Lee? Lee and Casey, by all that I have heard Lee say were very close, shared thier ups and downs with each other. Lee was right up front at first but now, nothing. I feel like if it wasn't for Lee having to live with his parents disdain and maybe possibly shutting him out of their lives, I think he would be able to tell a lot. Lee knows Casey is guilty, but since the whole family has spent their lives putting up a front for the rest of the family and anyone else they came in contact with, its second nature to deny deny deny. Does anyone know how involved Lee is in G and C's organization (scam) for making money?

[Postergeist]

I think that Cindy offering kc to come and clean Shirley house to help pay her back, and Shirley saying...nope, dont really want her around here...was like a bunch in the gut to Cindy. JMO MOO.

But thats gotta hurt.

oh! I had forgotten about that little olive branch being extended!

I agree with the great gran- cleaning the house doesn't get the light bill paid, nor the fee for the nursing facility. It'd be cash or no deal. tyvm

She was smart not wanting that piece of work back into her home, imo.

[farrahrani]

I remember thinking that when it first came out... I don't think re-training is an option for this poor girl! :laugh:


I think it's very common for cashier's to accept checks and credit cards with little or no identification verification.
I remember working in the mall, and this two women approached my counter to charge a large stack of clothes using a credit card. As usual, I asked for their id. They became extremely offended, and said that other counters in the store I worked didn't insist on id, just went ahead and finished the transaction. I knew that was probably true, but refused to allow the purchase at my register. When they went around the corner to catch the escalator, I picked up the phone to call security, and...they turned back around to peek around the corner and WATCH me xp. They later tried to file a complaint against me which of course didn't really matter, since I was in the right, and I digress. It's very common for checks and credit cards to be used fraudulently, especially here in FL.

Someone stole my credit card number, not the card itself, and in the course of two days managed to rack up 2400 dollars in debt at several different stores. I only caught it when my bill came. I believe it was someone through the drive in window at the takeout place that was able to do a rubbing on the front of my card and get the number really fast.

It was resolved really fast, and as I was willing to file a report with the credit card company, it did not affect my credit while the theft was being investigated. I was lucky that it was caught quickly, and that it was so obvious it was theft, so my credit score was not affected adversely.

It is frighteningly easy to just use checks and cc numbers at stores, especially discount retail where you have overworked, underpaid cashiers and staff who are just putting in time till they get out.

[Postergeist]

I wonder why we hear or see nothing of Lee? Lee and Casey, by all that I have heard Lee say were very close, shared thier ups and downs with each other. Lee was right up front at first but now, nothing. I feel like if it wasn't for Lee having to live with his parents disdain and maybe possibly shutting him out of their lives, I think he would be able to tell a lot. Lee knows Casey is guilty, but since the whole family has spent their lives putting up a front for the rest of the family and anyone else they came in contact with, its second nature to deny deny deny. Does anyone know how involved Lee is in G and C's organization (scam) for making money?

Thinking about this (before I have to go) - wondering what the time frame is of when Tony's undercover recording of Lee came out and when we all stopped seeing Lee much?

We learned he moved back in with them- but then later learned the Milsteads moved in with the A's- so did Lee stick around to be the newly made Walton family?

Recall that Lee had some harsh opinions of his dad that he conveyed to Tony.

While said in a joking manner- there's usually always a hint of real truth in jokes- I don't think he respects his father, thinks his dad is a joke type of thing. It seems like G never had much of a stable work life and maybe Lee never looked up to his dad.

If G & C listened to the entire video recording of their son- maybe there's been a bit of a falling out with them?

imo

[onlykaty]

What a goldmine this is, thanks Rap!! Looks like the entomologist is going to play a pivitol role in this trial.

If we all think its a goldmine and see the importance of it, just think about what the jury will think. I wonder if the new documents just out, will include further information from this same source? This is very interesting reading. Not sure I understand it all but I certainly get the gist of it.

[adair]

oh! I had forgotten about that little olive branch being extended!

I agree with the great gran- cleaning the house doesn't get the light bill paid, nor the fee for the nursing facility. It'd be cash or no deal. tyvm

She was smart not wanting that piece of work back into her home, imo.


Yeah, it would be more work for Shirley hiding all the silver....j/k

[ruth66]

o/t but Dominick Dunne has passed away.....RIP

[onlykaty]

Thinking about this (before I have to go) - wondering what the time frame is of when Tony's undercover recording of Lee came out and when we all stopped seeing Lee much?

We learned he moved back in with them- but then later learned the Milsteads moved in with the A's- so did Lee stick around to be the newly made Walton family?

Recall that Lee had some harsh opinions of his dad that he conveyed to Tony.

While said in a joking manner- there's usually always a hint of real truth in jokes- I don't think he respects his father, thinks his dad is a joke type of thing. It seems like G never had much of a stable work life and maybe Lee never looked up to his dad.

If G & C listened to the entire video recording of their son- maybe there's been a bit of a falling out with them?

imo

The A's have lots of work to do become the Waltons, so funny, :lol:


Regardless of what Cindy would like for us to beleive I don't think there is anything out they haven't read, this board included. They very well may be on the outs as of now.

[Rapunzel]

Yeah, it would be more work for Shirley hiding all the silver....j/k


Hells Bells...she would have to hide so much stuff...there would be nothing left for KC to clean...:wink:

[Amy]

Cindy made a lot of mistakes, George too as far as that goes, they seemed to fail as parents, there is more to parenting than just putting a roof over thier heads, feeding and clothing them. They let Casey get by with so much, lived in denial of anything she did, not even being able to face the fact she was pregnant until they had to. The fact that Casey was a liar and theif is something that should have been dealt with early on. BUT, in my mind, they had no idea she would murder her own child. I'm sure if they did they would have stopped it. I blame Casey for Caylee's death and her alone. They still enable Casey by covering up for her and supporting the person that killed their grand daughter, for that I have no sympathy for them and don't give them a pass on it. The one thing I do know is they raised a child killer and that will someday, when they are old and gray haunt them in their last days. I don't even know if Casey had a different life if things would have been different, she was so obessessed with herself, Casey, was a legend in her own mind, best friend to everyone in school, always was the person people came to when they needed to talk, she seemed to think well of herself. Look how she had all of friends fooled. Casey destroys lives and takes what she wants, then discards what is not usefull to her anymore or gets in her way. Caylee was the one thing in her life she felt like was her's to do with as she pleased without having to maniuplate. Casey wanted to live the good life and there was no room in it for Caylee. I could go on and on.

Casey alone killed Caylee, there are alot of what ifs, but sooner or later as long as she was in that childs life, I beleive the outcome would have been the same.

as always jmo

I would like to hear from all those friends who called her "mom" because Casey was the one to go for, for advice and such. According to Cindy, they were still calling Casey "mom," but I didn't see all these high school and even after high school "friends" swarming the press to let the world know what a good person "mom" is. I hope to God that, if indeed others went to her for advice, that they did exactly the opposite of what "mom" advised them to do, otherwise, there is probably a boat load of "friends" not doing so well in this world!!!

Or, it could be that she fooled no one. It could be that her "friends" saw thru her and her lying, and if they stuck around, knew enough to take her w/a grain of salt. Again, where are all her friends? Were they going door-to-door w/the A's searching for Caylee? Were they in front of reporters' mics singing Casey's praises? Were they helping the A's to defend their home and hearth against the protesters? If they are around, I sure missed any activity or statements from them. Except the one who babysat for free, thinking that Casey was a hard working single mom needing a break on day care. And the one who thinks that breastfeeding a baby means the mom cannot possibly harm that child, let alone murder her.

[Amy]

I was a Veterinary Tech for 25 years...OK I'm old...been retired since 2000...we never had chloroform ever for anything...in the early days we did have ether.

I know there has been mention in previous months of Cindy's working in a clinic and having access to things like chloroform. I just don't think chloroform is something that is kept around much. Not in the hospital where I work, in the vet clinic where you worked, and probably not in the Home Health office where Cindy worked. And probably not in a vet clinic where a friend allegedy works or worked. I could more see a peer of Casey's helping her out to obtain or make chloroform before I could see Cindy procuring it for her, if it was available @ her home health agency, which is pretty unlikely, IMO. It's not even like it is something new and novel--it's an old, old chemical, one that seems to have been replaced by much better, safer ones used for the purpose(s) chloroform formerly was used for.

[Deannalynn]

Who does this??!!!

I tell ya, I'm too meek around LE, heck- if I just see a cop car when I'm driving I somehow think I must be guilty of something- and I'm no law breaker!

(maybe because I've never been a bully?) :shrug:

Watching Cindy in action when they had her making her statements and answering questions when she was in the LE's office. She had her notebook and she was going thru it like she was interrogating them. The part that made my brows rise was how often she kept repeating WHY she told the police department she called to report a stolen car. "to get them to come faster"
Helloooooo..All she had to say was "there is a 2 year old that has been missing for 31 days and the mother who did not report it, is right here."

I freak out too when I see a police car behind me. I'm always nervous he will see I have done something wrong. LE does NOT bother Cindy. No one does for that matter.:sneaky:
(Maybe Judge Strickland)
We sure will see at trial, won't we.
JMO

[Amy]

Sorry OT but in the Benardo case up here the wife had access to vet meds and used them on her sister causing her death... :sad:

Was chloroform one of the chemicals used? There is another case where the wife offed the husband using euthanizing meds, but I don't recall a mention of chloroform in that one, either.

[Amy]

I wonder why we hear or see nothing of Lee? Lee and Casey, by all that I have heard Lee say were very close, shared thier ups and downs with each other. Lee was right up front at first but now, nothing. I feel like if it wasn't for Lee having to live with his parents disdain and maybe possibly shutting him out of their lives, I think he would be able to tell a lot. Lee knows Casey is guilty, but since the whole family has spent their lives putting up a front for the rest of the family and anyone else they came in contact with, its second nature to deny deny deny. Does anyone know how involved Lee is in G and C's organization (scam) for making money?

Doesn't Lee have a board position? And, in the first foundation they were setting up, Mallory and her mom were both on the board, her mom being the financial officer or whatever that position was called.

I don't know about Lee and Mallory on the current (or the last one I saw, is it still a foundation? Or, did it ever make it to foundation status?) but Mallory's mom--June? Judy?--is on that board, too. Her name was on one of the website pages, I think the one about how to buy tshirts and such, and where to send donations. IIRC, IMO.

[onlykaty]

I would like to hear from all those friends who called her "mom" because Casey was the one to go for, for advice and such. According to Cindy, they were still calling Casey "mom," but I didn't see all these high school and even after high school "friends" swarming the press to let the world know what a good person "mom" is. I hope to God that, if indeed others went to her for advice, that they did exactly the opposite of what "mom" advised them to do, otherwise, there is probably a boat load of "friends" not doing so well in this world!!!

Or, it could be that she fooled no one. It could be that her "friends" saw thru her and her lying, and if they stuck around, knew enough to take her w/a grain of salt. Again, where are all her friends? Were they going door-to-door w/the A's searching for Caylee? Were they in front of reporters' mics singing Casey's praises? Were they helping the A's to defend their home and hearth against the protesters? If they are around, I sure missed any activity or statements from them. Except the one who babysat for free, thinking that Casey was a hard working single mom needing a break on day care. And the one who thinks that breastfeeding a baby means the mom cannot possibly harm that child, let alone murder her.

I think it was all in Casey's mind, I did read where a guy she went to shcool with or maybe it was his brother that was in Casey/s class, said something to this effect also. No, Casey had no "real" lasting fiendships because sooner or later I think she burned everyone of them in some kind of way or the other, or just discarded them and made new friends. Cindy will say or do anything now to cover for Casey, she knows she can never get Caylee back and she doesn't want to lose Casey too. Plus, having to face the truth of what poor parents her and Geaorge really were. Lots of pride and not wanting anyone to think she spawned a killer. Yes, like I read in a previous post, Cindy and Casey are a lot alike, but I don't think Cindy is a killer otherwise she would have already done Casey in. jmo

[Amy]

oh! I had forgotten about that little olive branch being extended!

I agree with the great gran- cleaning the house doesn't get the light bill paid, nor the fee for the nursing facility. It'd be cash or no deal. tyvm

She was smart not wanting that piece of work back into her home, imo.

My biggest concern would be that she would be doing more than cleaning the house--possibly cleaning OUT the house of anything valuable enough to be sold @ the nearest pawn shop.

[101Spots]

o/t but Dominick Dunne has passed away.....RIP

What a gentleman, as well as a gentle man.

There's nothing but an announcement on Sprocket's blog, but I expect she'll write a nice tribute soon.

Sprocket's Blog (http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/)

RIP.

[onlykaty]

Doesn't Lee have a board position? And, in the first foundation they were setting up, Mallory and her mom were both on the board, her mom being the financial officer or whatever that position was called.

I don't know about Lee and Mallory on the current (or the last one I saw, is it still a foundation? Or, did it ever make it to foundation status?) but Mallory's mom--June? Judy?--is on that board, too. Her name was on one of the website pages, I think the one about how to buy tshirts and such, and where to send donations. IIRC, IMO.

Oh geez, what a mess. I will never be able to figure out how anyone can become involved with this bunch. Birds of a feather, I guess..:mad:

[imc_e]

o/t but Dominick Dunne has passed away.....RIP

awwww thanks for posting this..

Thanks for all you did for justice Dominick :rose:

[Amy]

Thinking about this (before I have to go) - wondering what the time frame is of when Tony's undercover recording of Lee came out and when we all stopped seeing Lee much?

We learned he moved back in with them- but then later learned the Milsteads moved in with the A's- so did Lee stick around to be the newly made Walton family?

Recall that Lee had some harsh opinions of his dad that he conveyed to Tony.

While said in a joking manner- there's usually always a hint of real truth in jokes- I don't think he respects his father, thinks his dad is a joke type of thing. It seems like G never had much of a stable work life and maybe Lee never looked up to his dad.

If G & C listened to the entire video recording of their son- maybe there's been a bit of a falling out with them?

imo

Except for a few shining moments, Lee has laid pretty low since day 31. He was in the police interviews, he led Casey in and out of the house or jail or Baez' office, he tore up a protester's poster and dumped the dog's water. Then, really nothing seen or heard from him for a time--he wasn't @ the A's when Casey was there, to help protect the parents and sister from the protesters (I think, one other time, he might have confronted someone.)

I remember questions about where he might be when Casey was returned to jail the last time. He really wasn't seen, I can't remember how the news got around that he had moved back to the A's--I think that info came from Lukas or Conway. Then, he showed up @ the memorial, and to the civil depo and the state depo. But there were weeks @ a time all thru this case when Lee was not seen, not heard. IMO

[nana6]

Hi All,Do we have any news today from the judge?

[Deannalynn]

I think it was all in Casey's mind, I did read where a guy she went to shcool with or maybe it was his brother that was in Casey/s class, said something to this effect also. No, Casey had no "real" lasting fiendships because sooner or later I think she burned everyone of them in some kind of way or the other, or just discarded them and made new friends. Cindy will say or do anything now to cover for Casey, she knows she can never get Caylee back and she doesn't want to lose Casey too. Plus, having to face the truth of what poor parents her and Geaorge really were. Lots of pride and not wanting anyone to think she spawned a killer. Yes, like I read in a previous post, Cindy and Casey are a lot alike, but I don't think Cindy is a killer otherwise she would have already done Casey in. jmo

I don't think Cindy is a killer either but...She did attack Casey and tried to choke her. Perhaps she was trying to get her attention or that's not the first time she came after Casey like that. (I doubt it)
Obviously if the story is true it didn't scare Casey but it sure did make her angry. (Rage)
jmo

[onlykaty]

What a gentleman, as well as a gentle man.

There's nothing but an announcement on Sprocket's blog, but I expect she'll write a nice tribute soon.

Sprocket's Blog (http://sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/)

RIP.

awww, so sorry to hear that, RIP..:sad:

[8BellesFan]

ty hon! :smile:

There would need to be a section for all of our lingo tho, so they can get our inside jokes!

and Rapunzel- you'd be mighty helpful over on the Animal forum here with your experience!

(love the fact that we have so many with so many areas of training here!)


(oh- o/t did any one see the thread by 8Belles about one of our Caylee posters that passed away? :sad: it's over in the b'day & spiritual forum)

thank you :wub:

[ish]

I wonder why we hear or see nothing of Lee? Lee and Casey, by all that I have heard Lee say were very close, shared thier ups and downs with each other. Lee was right up front at first but now, nothing. I feel like if it wasn't for Lee having to live with his parents disdain and maybe possibly shutting him out of their lives, I think he would be able to tell a lot. Lee knows Casey is guilty, but since the whole family has spent their lives putting up a front for the rest of the family and anyone else they came in contact with, its second nature to deny deny deny. Does anyone know how involved Lee is in G and C's organization (scam) for making money?

I thought George (of course his credibility is questionable) said that Casey and Lee were very close but when Casey lied to Lee about being pregnant, Lee was hurt and he sort of backed off the relationship. Things had been kind of cool between them since, not much communication.

[onlykaty]

I don't think Cindy is a killer either but...She did attack Casey and tried to choke her. Perhaps she was trying to get her attention or that's not the first time she came after Casey like that. (I doubt it)
Obviously if the story is true it didn't scare Casey but it sure did make her angry. (Rage)
jmo


I beleive the fight did happen the night of the 15th. Both Cindy and Casey were in a rage and finally Casey grabbed Caylee up and left with her, thats the last time Cindy ever seen Caylee.

I fault Cindy that she didn't grab that child first and let the good for nothing daughter go. Casey killed her own chid, no remorse from her only self pity that she isn't out living the good life.

[cassidy]

But didn't Casey also sign her name to her grandmother's check. I put the wrong date on a check once and the bank sent it back how can AT&T cash a check from the grandmother's account with Casey's name.


IIRC she did that online. All you need in the routing number and the account number.

[Pruddennce]

Hi Pru! (if you're still here...)
ITA ... videos of her shopping at Target and Penny's and renting movies at Blockbuster ... pictures of her out clubbing will paint the picture ... they won't be able to use anything that's in the fraud charges in her murder trial ...

Even if the fraud trial takes place before the murder trial and she's convicted, I don't believe that can be used in the murder trial only the penalty phase.

I have a feeling the judge will put this trial off but because of financial reasons, and not the reasons Lyon spoke about ... I found her arguements to be threatening ... many motions, COV, etc., etc. to imply to the court that the fraud trial will be a long one and cost a lot of money ... I think the judge will rule to avoid this JMO

However, I think they lost the Padilla and TES one ... the judge will most likely rule for the limited access to TES and searchers that Nejame put forth because it's reasonable ... as far as Padilla and crew ... "that horse has left the barn"!! :tonguewag:

hi denjet! wow....you just a hit a nerve with me and one which will definitely be hit by the jurors: BLOCKBUSTER. HOURS LATER. and 'for sure testimony from Tony' as to what the two of them did that nite and the morning.

and....of course, DAYS LATER, friday nite, she is at fusion. and leading up to the friday nite fusion event, she is sending out global text alerts to everyone's cell phone that she knows, along with posting on her ms/facebook about fusion.

this is going to be a HUGE problem for the defense...HOURS LATER. and hopefully they will zero in on her outgoing cell phone records for June 16th, ALL DAY. and then every day thereafter evidencing not one call to the nanny.

aside from that, her written statement referencing JUNE 12th to go along with the bogus JUNE 9th missing date:

With many and all attempts to contact Zenaida, and with the one short conversation, on June 12, 2008, I was never able to check on the status or well-being of my daughter.

Zenaida never made an attempt to explain why Caylee is no longer in Orlando, or is she is ever going to bring her home.

I always found that statement interesting. along with this:

After 31 days, I know that the only thing that matters is getting my daughter back.

her entire statement was strange, but that was really a strange thing to say along with stating ZFG's birthday month.

???

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*

[Lavinia]

Bolded to address. I get that point intellectually, but from an emotional sort of "gut" perspective, I disagree with it. Imo, a person's character does and should factor into the equation at some level. Otherwise, the message we seem to be sending is it's okay to be a rotten, lousy person as long as you don't take it all the way to murder. Problem is, excusing and enabling rotten, lousy people is what helps them grow into murderers.

Character does matter in life. It really does. The fact it supposedly doesn't matter when we're talking about people accused of crimes just doesn't sit right with me.

Hey Sis! :seeya: I agree with you in theory but you would need a measurement to quantify someone's bad character. IMO, laws are a good yardstick and it's not very likely someone with a really bad character is able to stay out of the justice system (excluding terminal jerks). I think it all works out as well as anything associated with humans can. (That's today's opinion. Tomorrow's may vary wildly. :laugh:)

[onlykaty]

I thought George (of course his credibility is questionable) said that Casey and Lee were very close but when Casey lied to Lee about being pregnant, Lee was hurt and he sort of backed off the relationship. Things had been kind of cool between them since, not much communication.

I think once the trial starts and probably only then, maybe we will find out whats been up with Lee. :shrug:

[5boxersmom]

hi denjet! wow....you just a hit a nerve with me and one which will definitely be hit by the jurors: BLOCKBUSTER. HOURS LATER. and 'for sure testimony from Tony' as to what the two of them did that nite and the morning.

and....of course, DAYS LATER, friday nite, she is at fusion. and leading up to the friday nite fusion event, she is sending out global text alerts to everyone's cell phone that she knows, along with posting on her ms/facebook about fusion.

this is going to be a HUGE problem for the defense...HOURS LATER. and hopefully they will zero in on her outgoing cell phone records for June 16th, ALL DAY. and then every day thereafter evidencing not one call to the nanny.

aside from that, her written statement referencing JUNE 12th to go along with the bogus JUNE 9th missing date:

With many and all attempts to contact Zenaida, and with the one short conversation, on June 12, 2008, I was never able to check on the status or well-being of my daughter.

Zenaida never made an attempt to explain why Caylee is no longer in Orlando, or is she is ever going to bring her home.

I always found that statement interesting. along with this:

After 31 days, I know that the only thing that matters is getting my daughter back.

her entire statement was strange, but that was really a strange thing to say along with stating ZFG's birthday month.

???

IMO

best regards,
Pru

*waiting on maggot evidence....*


She probably thought she could convince LE not to search Orlando for Caylee, but search Texas, NY, PR and Miami and all those other places. :rolleyes:

I truly believe she thought they would believe her and that would be that. No one in her life had ever called her on her lies.

jmo

[Lavinia]

She probably thought she could convince LE not to search Orlando for Caylee, but search Texas, NY, PR and Miami and all those other places. :rolleyes:

I truly believe she thought they would believe her and that would be that. No one in her life had ever called her on her lies.

jmo

That's what I think, too 5BM. I mean she wasn't even concerned enough to "fake it"! A 5 year old child (with a conscience) wouldn't have the short-sightedness to steal a cookie (kill their child) then go write on a blackboard in the kitchen, "I sure feel good after taking that cookie." (La Bella Vida tattoo.) Cold blooded killer+gross stupidity=Death Penalty.

Was normal emotion in that house so bad that she couldn't learn to fake how people should/would react to such a tragedy? Boggles the mind. It's like she is an emotional feral child.

[happygert]

any news today on the rulings?

[Rapunzel]

I know there has been mention in previous months of Cindy's working in a clinic and having access to things like chloroform. I just don't think chloroform is something that is kept around much. Not in the hospital where I work, in the vet clinic where you worked, and probably not in the Home Health office where Cindy worked. And probably not in a vet clinic where a friend allegedy works or worked. I could more see a peer of Casey's helping her out to obtain or make chloroform before I could see Cindy procuring it for her, if it was available @ her home health agency, which is pretty unlikely, IMO. It's not even like it is something new and novel--it's an old, old chemical, one that seems to have been replaced by much better, safer ones used for the purpose(s) chloroform formerly was used for.

It has been banned since 1976 for the open market...don't know about hospitals...but we never used it in Veterinary Medicine.

[adair]

That's what I think, too 5BM. I mean she wasn't even concerned enough to "fake it"! A 5 year old child (with a conscience) wouldn't have the short-sightedness to steal a cookie (kill their child) then go write on a blackboard in the kitchen, "I sure feel good after taking that cookie." (La Bella Vida tattoo.) Cold blooded killer+gross stupidity=Death Penalty.

Was normal emotion in that house so bad that she couldn't learn to fake how people should/would react to such a tragedy? Boggles the mind. It's like she is an emotional feral child.


It sorta reminds me of when i was in 7th grade, and had planned to sleep over at a friends house. Well the friends mother got home, didn't know i was there, and lit into her daughter for not switching the clothes out of the washer into the dryer...or something along those lines.....I was horrified, and i wanted to go home. I felt both horrified and embarrassed. As soon as the mom knew i was there, she was a totally different person. I always wondered if my friend paid some sort of "price" for not telling her mom that she had company, even though, it should not have been a surprise.....i never returned. Ever.

jmo

[Deannalynn]

any news today on the rulings?

Nope!
But, We HAVE SOME GOOD READING FROM THE LAB...CHECK IT OUT...

[Lavinia]

It sorta reminds me of when i was in 7th grade, and had planned to sleep over at a friends house. Well the friends mother got home, didn't know i was there, and lit into her daughter for not switching the clothes out of the washer into the dryer...or something along those lines.....I was horrified, and i wanted to go home. I felt both horrified and embarrassed. As soon as the mom knew i was there, she was a totally different person. I always wondered if my friend paid some sort of "price" for not telling her mom that she had company, even though, it should not have been a surprise.....i never returned. Ever.

jmo

I remember some neighbors when I was a kid that were the same way. Sugar wouldn't melt in their mouths when we were with our parents around them but when our parents weren't there, they morphed into something awful. That was my first experience with people who aren't as they seem. It was very confusing. I've run into many people like that since then and it's no less confusing. :sad:

[Lavinia]

Nope!
But, We HAVE SOME GOOD READING FROM THE LAB...CHECK IT OUT...

What? Where? :confused:

[happygert]

Nope!
But, We HAVE SOME GOOD READING FROM THE LAB...CHECK IT OUT...


Thanks I will..

[adair]

It sorta reminds me of when i was in 7th grade, and had planned to sleep over at a friends house. Well the friends mother got home, didn't know i was there, and lit into her daughter for not switching the clothes out of the washer into the dryer...or something along those lines.....I was horrified, and i wanted to go home. I felt both horrified and embarrassed. As soon as the mom knew i was there, she was a totally different person. I always wondered if my friend paid some sort of "price" for not telling her mom that she had company, even though, it should not have been a surprise.....i never returned. Ever.

jmo



I hate quoting myself.....but i am wondering if this was the type of mother that Cindy was.........if she really didnt like hispanic people, and was prejudiced as to who could come into HER home......that had to have been awful growing up in. NOT that i am making any excuses for kc..........jmo moooo

[Deannalynn]

Where might I find this good reading? TIA

Page 5..Post 175:sleep:

[Dells]

What? Where? :confused:

Check out this post:

Here is something you all can sink your teeth into...yuk...oh well...


http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88156

Emails to and from Oak Ridge Labs and OCSO

One mentions coffin flies...interesting...some other good stuff too.

my link:

http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/corpse_fauna/flies/coffin.htm

[Lavinia]

Check out this post:

Thanks Dells and Deanalynn! :thumbup:

[onlykaty]

Their talking about the documents released on hln right now.

[Deannalynn]

I remember some neighbors when I was a kid that were the same way. Sugar wouldn't melt in their mouths when we were with our parents around them but when our parents weren't there, they morphed into something awful. That was my first experience with people who aren't as they seem. It was very confusing. I've run into many people like that since then and it's no less confusing. :sad:

Well, I had a really good friend who both parents were very nice every time I came over.
I hung out with her for 2 years. Yep, Barbara . Great family. The mother was a waitress at a club.
Well, the father was great with her and the kids everytime I was there.
Then, one day after school we walked home to her house and the police were there.
Fireman, ambulance, all of it.
Her father (out of a jealousy rage) shot and killed her mother and turned the gun on himself. OMG, my friend Barbara was totally unwrapped. I didn't know how to react or what to do.
We were only 16.
The saddest thing I remember in my life.:sad: