June 20-21 Weekend #2

[desmom]

:rose: http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=cayle :rose:

[Imperfect4]

Thanks, ma'am. :seeya:

Hopefully folks will start migrating this-a-way.

[ellegna]

I'm here :seeya:

Thanks for the new thread Desmom

[Mamie]

Yes, desmom, thanks for this new thread!

[Lavinia]

Thanks, Des! :seeya:

[summer]

Something I've been thinking about... If George took a leap of faith and stepped out of the cesspool he's been occupying - really and completely shedded a skin or two he'd be set for life.

If he told the truth, every last horrible and sickening detail of it -- and let the chips fall where they may. Hire a good ghostwriter and get it all down on paper. Travel worldwide and speak to battered mens' groups. Be a cottage industry. Show a fall and a redemption. People love a good redemption.

Even if he gets some time for obstruction of justice or even if he's convicted of being an accomplice after the fact, he'd have his life back eventually and could someday hold his head high and maybe just maybe help others.

I know it's a stretch. But miracles do happen.

OK, that's my optimism for the decade. :smile:

[Lavinia]

Something I've been thinking about... If George took a leap of faith and stepped out of the cesspool he's been occupying - really and completely shedded a skin or two he'd be set for life.

If he told the truth, every last horrible and sickening detail of it -- and let the chips fall where they may. Hire a good ghostwriter and get it all down on paper. Travel worldwide and speak to battered mens' groups. Be a cottage industry. Show a fall and a redemption. People love a good redemption.

Even if he gets some time for obstruction of justice or even if he's convicted of being an accomplice after the fact, he'd have his life back eventually and could someday hold his head high and maybe just maybe help others.

I know it's a stretch. But miracles do happen.

OK, that's my optimism for the decade. :smile:

Still sounds suspiciously like work, summer.

That's my reality for the decade, lol.

[summer]

Still sounds suspiciously like work, summer.

That's my reality for the decade, lol.

Oh yeah Lavinia, I forgot about that pesky work thingie.

Never mind... /emily litella

[Lavinia]

Oh yeah Lavinia, I forgot about that pesky work thingie.

Never mind... /emily litella

:laugh: "Emily Litella" (I just did a Rosanne Rosanna Danna somewhere this week. Funny lady.)

Yeah, I'm thinking the only gig old Georgie will take up is a rich widow who needs a lapdog.

[AnniePie]

Hi everyone,

I've been away since Thursday afternoon, so I've missed the autopsy release and all the details. Would someone (pretty please? :smile:) tell me what the highlights (lowlights) of the report are? I'd rather not have to read it unless I absolutely have to.

Thanks friends...

Annie

[summer]

oops. Looks like I stepped on imc_e's post. sorry!

[summer]

Hey Lavinia... is every inmate on death row in solitary confinement?

[Unleashed]

Hi everyone,

I've been away since Thursday afternoon, so I've missed the autopsy release and all the details. Would someone (pretty please? :smile:) tell me what the highlights (lowlights) of the report are? I'd rather not have to read it unless I absolutely have to.

Thanks friends...

Annie

No. You have to suffer the way the rest of us did.

Well, I'll tell if you share how GW was.

[Lavinia]

Hey Livinia... is every inmate on death row in solitary confinement?

I don't know about Fl. In Texas DR inmates are housed and recreated separately. I would imagine it's the same in Fl. (For some reason, once an inmate gets the DP, the state is super-duper scared someone is going to cheat them out of the "honors" it seems.)

[summer]

I don't know about Fl. In Texas DR inmates are housed and recreated separately. I would imagine it's the same in Fl. (For some reason, once an inmate gets the DP, the state is super-duper scared someone is going to cheat them out of the "honors" it seems.)

Thank you. :wub:

[Lavinia]

Thank you. :wub:

You're welcome sweets! :wub:

[Lavinia]

Hi everyone,

I've been away since Thursday afternoon, so I've missed the autopsy release and all the details. Would someone (pretty please? :smile:) tell me what the highlights (lowlights) of the report are? I'd rather not have to read it unless I absolutely have to.

Thanks friends...

Annie

Hey Pooh! :wub:

There probably isn't anything new in it, but it sure is sobering to read. The earth tried really hard to reclaim her.

[summer4meplz]

Oh yeah Lavinia, I forgot about that pesky work thingie.

Never mind... /emily litella

and his horrible violent temper.....I think he had that way before he met cindy......

[aproudmom]

OMG we are busy posting today..lol..thanks for the new thread..

[summer4meplz]

I don't know about Fl. In Texas DR inmates are housed and recreated separately. I would imagine it's the same in Fl. (For some reason, once an inmate gets the DP, the state is super-duper scared someone is going to cheat them out of the "honors" it seems.)

I'm in Oklahoma....we're next door neighbors....ROAD TRIP!!!:tonguewag:

[Imperfect4]

Something I've been thinking about... If George took a leap of faith and stepped out of the cesspool he's been occupying - really and completely shedded a skin or two he'd be set for life.

If he told the truth, every last horrible and sickening detail of it -- and let the chips fall where they may. Hire a good ghostwriter and get it all down on paper. Travel worldwide and speak to battered mens' groups. Be a cottage industry. Show a fall and a redemption. People love a good redemption.

Even if he gets some time for obstruction of justice or even if he's convicted of being an accomplice after the fact, he'd have his life back eventually and could someday hold his head high and maybe just maybe help others.

I know it's a stretch. But miracles do happen.

OK, that's my optimism for the decade. :smile:

If either Cindy and/or George could get completely honest and humble, imo, they could do some serious good. And I sincerely mean that. I think they are extreme examples of bad behavior being acted out in families all over this country.

Talk about lessons to be learned! They are textbook examples of how not to live your life.

But having said that, I think the very things that make them so abominable are the same things that will keep them stuck right where they are for the duration.

I see no redemption capacity in either of them.

[kanzz]

and his horrible violent temper.....I think he had that way before he met cindy......

Me too! and to think he had so many of us feeling so sorry for him early on. grr

[ttcRider]

o/t but I got some alarming news... I got a job.
...and I don't know if IS will be blocked from my computer at work.. I know, I know I'm just as upset as you guys are. :crying:

[Mamie]

If either Cindy and/or George could get completely honest and humble, imo, they could do some serious good. And I sincerely mean that. I think they are extreme examples of bad behavior being acted out in families all over this country.

Talk about lessons to be learned! They are textbook examples of how not to live your life.

But having said that, I think the very things that make them so abominable are the same things that will keep them stuck right where they are for the duration.

I see no redemption capacity in either of them.


It would be hard to tell on Cindy whether she was being completely honest and whether she wanted any redemption at all----George, not so much. JMO

[Lavinia]

I'm in Oklahoma....we're next door neighbors....ROAD TRIP!!!:tonguewag:

WoooHoooo! :w00t: (I thought the courtroom would be so packed we could never get in but the poor turnout at the memorial that Rev. Grund held the other day makes me wonder...)

[Carol25]

Do you think you could rent one of those really big foreclosed homes really cheap? Ya know, with a pool and all and lots of bedrooms?

[desmom]

From bugout's post from thread #1 http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?p=13212578#post13212578



--snipped--

The only type of omission we have from Casey is when she said to Cindy "not my fault" not my fault, twice. And cindy in that sickening sweet horrible "mother" voice, "well honey if you just hadn't lied to everyone"....It was at that moment that I suspected Cindy A, and still do to this day. The states case however is against Casey. Triple bagged like she was trash, is a phrase that will never be out of my head. Ever.

__________________

Your post got me to thinking about the phone call home and the 7/25 jail visit. In the very beginning, I do not think Cindy was in full-bore defense mode....yet.

Casey's phone call home from jail - http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/7/25/casey_anthony_calls_home_from_jail.html IIRC, this phone call was made within the first day or two of Casey's lst arrest.

Casey: You don’t know what my involvement is and stuff?

Cindy: Casey.

Casey: Mom.

Cindy: What?

Casey: No.

I always felt from the attitude in their voices and the conversation, they were both referring to something...something only the 2 of them know...some secret.

Cindy: I don’t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You’re not telling me where she’s at.

Did Cindy think Casey had Caylee in hiding?

Then from the July 25 jail video visit with George & Cindy. http://www.wftv.com/video/18205452/index.html

Cindy's defense mode is beginning to kick in...imo, but at the beginning of the visit ...

Cindy: We forgive you for anything that you have said or done.

Casey: I haven't said anything. Don't worry.

What does Cindy think Casey has said or done? Then Casey reassures Cindy by telling her not to worry. Is this another secret?

jmo

[bchand]

Do you think you could rent one of those really big foreclosed homes really cheap? Ya know, with a pool and all and lots of bedrooms?

Must have a pool. That way, those of us who don't get lucky enough to get into court each day will have something to do.

[aproudmom]

Awhh Moon..sorry he has passed.:wub:
Caylee was lucky that Jesse would have stepped up as her Father.

Clip of Rev. Grund's Service for Caylee
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJbh4hrM0kk&feature=channel_page

I brought this over I wanted to thank kOOkie I have been looking for this thank you so much for posting it..after reading so many comments on other forums and blogs alot thought the Anthony's were doing it and when I read about 30 people showed up I was very upset.but I guess it could be that alot did not know it had nothing to do with the Anthony's

[summer4meplz]

o/t but I got some alarming news... I got a job.
...and I don't know if IS will be blocked from my computer at work.. I know, I know I'm just as upset as you guys are. :crying:

congratulations! there's always the evening hours...yes?:wink:

[Carol25]

Must have a pool. That way, those of us who don't get lucky enough to get into court each day will have something to do.
Someone should have a connection to a bank to get a rental agreement for a foreclosed beauty.

[5boxersmom]

o/t but I got some alarming news... I got a job.
...and I don't know if IS will be blocked from my computer at work.. I know, I know I'm just as upset as you guys are. :crying:

Congrats on the new job. Can you get a blackberry or something like that? Then you can keep up with us all day. :biggrin:

[bchand]

Someone should have a connection to a bank to get a rental agreement for a foreclosed beauty.

We'll sic really on that one. :wink:

OR you didn't mean the Milstead's foreclosed house did you???? I'm not staying there. Too much bad karma in those walls.

[Imperfect4]

Hi everyone,

I've been away since Thursday afternoon, so I've missed the autopsy release and all the details. Would someone (pretty please? :smile:) tell me what the highlights (lowlights) of the report are? I'd rather not have to read it unless I absolutely have to.

Thanks friends...

Annie

Pooh,

Probably the worst of it was there were several pieces of duct tape on her little skull, over both her mouth and nose area. We're assuming the tape strips were wrapped all the way around her little head, but since we don't have the photos to go with the report, we're making an educated guess. The ME's office stated the tape had to be there before she began to decompose, since it held her jaw bone in place throughout the decomp process.

Other news is there were paper towels with fatty tissue, a product of the decomp process, in the trunk of Casey's car. IIRC, they were in one of the trash bags found in the trunk.

There was also more information on chloroform, but I'm personally very confused as to what it means. I need to go back and re-read.

From plant growth it was determined she was very probably in that spot for the entire time she was "missing." It seems a body as tiny as hers, out in the elements in Florida's climate, could completely decompose down to the skeleton in as little as 10 days. Plant growth through the skeleton, which can't start until the decomp process is complete, is the primary indicator of the length of time her remains were in the spot where Kronk found her.

Other evidence she completely decomposed in that spot (vs. somewhere else, and then was dumped there) is the way in which her remains were scattered by animal activity. I'll leave those details out for now.

I think those were the main points that stuck out. If I missed something, I'm sure someone else will fill in the blanks.

[5boxersmom]

From bugout's post from thread #1 http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?p=13212578#post13212578



Your post got me to thinking about the phone call home and the 7/25 jail visit. In the very beginning, I do not think Cindy was in full-bore defense mode....yet.

Casey's phone call home from jail - http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/7/25/casey_anthony_calls_home_from_jail.html IIRC, this phone call was made within the first day or two of Casey's lst arrest.

Casey: You don’t know what my involvement is and stuff?

Cindy: Casey.

Casey: Mom.

Cindy: What?

Casey: No.

I always felt from the attitude in their voices and the conversation, they were both referring to something...something only the 2 of them know...some secret.

Cindy: I don’t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You’re not telling me where she’s at.

Did Cindy think Casey had Caylee in hiding?

Then from the July 25 jail video visit with George & Cindy. http://www.wftv.com/video/18205452/index.html

Cindy's defense mode is beginning to kick in...imo, but at the beginning of the visit ...

Cindy: We forgive you for anything that you have said or done.

Casey: I haven't said anything. Don't worry.

What does Cindy think Casey has said or done? Then Casey reassures Cindy by telling her not to worry. Is this another secret?

jmo


Yes I do think there is some secret they are afraid will come to light. I wonder what it is and if LE knows?

jmo

[summer4meplz]

From bugout's post from thread #1 http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?p=13212578#post13212578



Your post got me to thinking about the phone call home and the 7/25 jail visit. In the very beginning, I do not think Cindy was in full-bore defense mode....yet.

Casey's phone call home from jail - http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/7/25/casey_anthony_calls_home_from_jail.html IIRC, this phone call was made within the first day or two of Casey's lst arrest.

Casey: You don’t know what my involvement is and stuff?

Cindy: Casey.

Casey: Mom.

Cindy: What?

Casey: No.

I always felt from the attitude in their voices and the conversation, they were both referring to something...something only the 2 of them know...some secret.

Cindy: I don’t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You’re not telling me where she’s at.

Did Cindy think Casey had Caylee in hiding?

Then from the July 25 jail video visit with George & Cindy. http://www.wftv.com/video/18205452/index.html

Cindy's defense mode is beginning to kick in...imo, but at the beginning of the visit ...

Cindy: We forgive you for anything that you have said or done.

Casey: I haven't said anything. Don't worry.

What does Cindy think Casey has said or done? Then Casey reassures Cindy by telling her not to worry. Is this another secret?

jmo

sometimes I agree with Gaelic that it's possible the original plan was to hide Caylee somewhere......get lots of donations to search for her .....and casey getting mad and murdering Caylee was NOT in the plan....I think that's why cindy is so convincing when she realized something bad had happened to Caylee instead of what they had planned....I know it sounds crazy but there are deep dark secrets among the 4 of them.....not sure what they are.

I also could believe casey was planning on killing one or both of her parents......

didn't casey tell Tone she always had a plan B?

[summer4meplz]

Yes I do think there is some secret they are afraid will come to light. I wonder what it is and if LE knows?

jmo

I think LE knows.....:cool:

[Imperfect4]

It would be hard to tell on Cindy whether she was being completely honest and whether she wanted any redemption at all----George, not so much. JMO

I don't think it would be hard to tell, Mamie.

We'd be seeing and hearing two entirely different people from Cindy and George, but who were Cindy and George.

[summer4meplz]

We'll sic really on that one. :wink:

OR you didn't mean the Milstead's foreclosed house did you???? I'm not staying there. Too much bad karma in those walls.



have you seen it? it's huge!

[Unleashed]

Do you think you could rent one of those really big foreclosed homes really cheap? Ya know, with a pool and all and lots of bedrooms?

Unless donations to the fundation pick up, we might be able to get a great deal on the A's place.:tonguewag:

JMO

[ttcRider]

congratulations! there's always the evening hours...yes?:wink:

Thanks summer4meplz. I will need to adjust. :cool:

[Lavinia]

We'll sic really on that one. :wink:

OR you didn't mean the Milstead's foreclosed house did you???? I'm not staying there. Too much bad karma in those walls.

And cooties! barf

[Imperfect4]

Do you think you could rent one of those really big foreclosed homes really cheap? Ya know, with a pool and all and lots of bedrooms?

Foreclosed homes aren't always left in the best condition ... know what I mean? :scared:

[Carol25]

There was a very interesting article from Wendy Murphy's blog. Don't know if I can mention it here. But it was about the questions that were not asked. Things that were brought out in the report that would lead to other questions and weren't answered, One of which was benzodine (hope I spelled that right.) Why did LE want a test for that? It has been used for certain crimes. And the toxicology report was not given for that.

I know this sounds cryptic. Sorry.

[Chardonnay]

Do you think you could rent one of those really big foreclosed homes really cheap? Ya know, with a pool and all and lots of bedrooms?

I hear the Milstead's house might be available !:chicken:

[bchand]

have you seen it? it's huge!

Yes I've seen pictures of it. I still could not stay where they had lived. yuck.

[Carol25]

Foreclosed homes aren't always left in the best condition ... know what I mean? :scared:
I know, and the longer they are empty, the worse they will remain in good condition.

Maybe someone will rent before the place goes into foreclosure...

[Lavinia]

There was a very interesting article from Wendy Murphy's blog. Don't know if I can mention it here. But it was about the questions that were not asked. Things that were brought out in the report that would lead to other questions and weren't answered, One of which was benzodine (hope I spelled that right.) Why did LE want a test for that? It has been used for certain crimes. And the toxicology report was not given for that.

I know this sounds cryptic. Sorry.

Benzidine or benzodiazopine?

[Carol25]

Benzidine or benzodiazopine?
maybe it's benzodiazopine. Used in ...can't say it. But a form of porn. To sedate.

[AnniePie]

No. You have to suffer the way the rest of us did.

Well, I'll tell if you share how GW was.

GW? Where was I?! LOL

Okay, I'll go read it myself. (Brat.)

[desmom]

Yes I do think there is some secret they are afraid will come to light. I wonder what it is and if LE knows?

jmo

I think LE knows.

Did Casey tell JB? Is that why he said we will have an "Aha" moment when we hear Casey's story?

jmo

[Unleashed]

GW? Where was I?! LOL

Okay, I'll go read it myself. (Brat.)

Guess Who bunch, dopey!

[desmom]

Benzidine or benzodiazopine?

benzodiazepines - page 2 http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/

[AnniePie]

Pooh,

Probably the worst of it was there were several pieces of duct tape on her little skull, over both her mouth and nose area. We're assuming the tape strips were wrapped all the way around her little head, but since we don't have the photos to go with the report, we're making an educated guess. The ME's office stated the tape had to be there before she began to decompose, since it held her jaw bone in place throughout the decomp process.

Other news is there were paper towels with fatty tissue, a product of the decomp process, in the trunk of Casey's car. IIRC, they were in one of the trash bags found in the trunk.

There was also more information on chloroform, but I'm personally very confused as to what it means. I need to go back and re-read.

From plant growth it was determined she was very probably in that spot for the entire time she was "missing." It seems a body as tiny as hers, out in the elements in Florida's climate, could completely decompose down to the skeleton in as little as 10 days. Plant growth through the skeleton, which can't start until the decomp process is complete, is the primary indicator of the length of time her remains were in the spot where Kronk found her.

Other evidence she completely decomposed in that spot (vs. somewhere else, and then was dumped there) is the way in which her remains were scattered by animal activity. I'll leave those details out for now.

I think those were the main points that stuck out. If I missed something, I'm sure someone else will fill in the blanks.

Thanks so much for the recap, Impf. I may be able to read it at a later date, but right now it's just too much for me.

I always knew you were my friend :wub: unlike some people I won't mention by name. Right Lizzardbreath?

[AnniePie]

Unless donations to the fundation pick up, we might be able to get a great deal on the A's place.:tonguewag:

JMO

I wouldn't set foot in that house wearing 10 crosses and 100 cloves of garlic around my neck. Those people are EVIL. :scared:

[kanzz]

There was a very interesting article from Wendy Murphy's blog. Don't know if I can mention it here. But it was about the questions that were not asked. Things that were brought out in the report that would lead to other questions and weren't answered, One of which was benzodine (hope I spelled that right.) Why did LE want a test for that? It has been used for certain crimes. And the toxicology report was not given for that.

I know this sounds cryptic. Sorry.

searching for Wendy Murphy's blog. no luck so far. dern

[Lavinia]

benzodiazepines - page 2 http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/

Thanks, Des. Off to read.

[AnniePie]

Guess Who bunch, dopey!

Oh. :drool:

It was Randy Bachman and Burton Cummings and it was FANTASTIC! (I danced for two hours straight and today I'm stiff and hoarse. The spirit is willing, but the flesh is (old and) weak. Sigh.)

I sure missed the board though. I checked in a couple of times, but it was going too quickly. I'll have to try to read back to see what some of the comments were.

[kanzz]

benzodiazepines - page 2 http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/


Oh, TY. Reading now. I really like this part "In short, almost every piece of evidence that proves Casey's guilt need will not be shared with the public prior to trial."

[Unleashed]

I wouldn't set foot in that house wearing 10 crosses and 100 cloves of garlic around my neck. Those people are EVIL. :scared:

You are correct. I'm going to Lenny's.

JMO

[Lavinia]

maybe it's benzodiazopine. Used in ...can't say it. But a form of porn. To sedate.

Okay, I read it. My take on that is they checked for benzo's for the same reason they checked what dead squirrel would smell like. There was so much speculation from the name Zanny, that there was the use of Xanax (which is a benzo) toward Caylee. Also, the talk of Xanax in the text message with (Annie?). I am not buying in to Wendy Murphy alarmist speculation. (I have found her to be rather tabloid-y in her speculations in past cases.) IMO they would have been COMPLETELY remiss, had they NOT checked for benzo's.

[Lavinia]

searching for Wendy Murphy's blog. no luck so far. dern

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/

[Imperfect4]

benzodiazepines - page 2 http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/

Wow! That was a fascinating read! :thumbup:

[desmom]

Thanks, Des. Off to read.

LE found a RX for clonazepam in the master bedroom. The rx was for Cindy.

page 49 http://www.wftv.com/pdf/18740668/detail.html

ETA ~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clonazepam
Clonazepam is the second most abused benzodiazepine in the USA.

[kanzz]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/


TY :)

Remember - one of the most common benzodiazepines is Xanax (Zanny).

[AnniePie]

You are correct. I'm going to Lenny's.

JMO

:scared: Ack! Not without ME, you're not!!

[Lavinia]

LE found a RX for clonazepam in the master bedroom. The rx was for Cindy.

page 49 http://www.wftv.com/pdf/18740668/detail.html

That's right. Between the 2 circumstances of Cindy having an RX in the house and all the speculation regarding Xanax, I would think a test is high priority, IMO.

ETA: Wendy Murphy doesn't float my boat so much.

[kanzz]

LE found a RX for clonazepam in the master bedroom. The rx was for Cindy.

page 49 http://www.wftv.com/pdf/18740668/detail.html

ETA ~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clonazepam
Clonazepam is the second most abused benzodiazepine in the USA.

oh, TY, desmom! Over time, I've missed a great deal of info in this case. Imagine the files and files and files the prosecutor has. eeesh!

[kanzz]

That's right. Between the 2 circumstances of Cindy having an RX in the house and all the speculation regarding Xanax, I would think a test is high priority, IMO.

Yes, indeed. I'm kind of scratching my head about why Wendy Murphy is so excited about it.

[Lavinia]

TY :)

Remember - one of the most common benzodiazepines is Xanax (Zanny).

Yup. That's what I think the reason for testing is, not child porn so much.

[Carol25]

searching for Wendy Murphy's blog. no luck so far. dern
It's an article "The Evidence you are not Allowed to See"
http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/?cid=hp:beastoriginalsL2

[AnnieBell]

and his horrible violent temper.....I think he had that way before he met cindy......

He probably has a temper with others but I haven't witnessed any victim behavior from Cindy. I suspect her cajones are made of steel and now thanks to the money maker scheme she has going Cindy can now afford to get them polished every week.

[Lavinia]

Yes, indeed. I'm kind of scratching my head about why Wendy Murphy is so excited about it.

Ahh, she's full of beans, lol. (I think once you work sex crimes like she has, you see the boogieman around every corner.)

[Imperfect4]

Okay, I read it. My take on that is they checked for benzo's for the same reason they checked what dead squirrel would smell like. There was so much speculation from the name Zanny, that there was the use of Xanax (which is a benzo) toward Caylee. Also, the talk of Xanax in the text message with (Annie?). I am not buying in to Wendy Murphy alarmist speculation. (I have found her to be rather tabloid-y in her speculations in past cases.) IMO they would have been COMPLETELY remiss, had they NOT checked for benzo's.

I tend to agree about Wendy being an alarmist ... she's run the porn thing up the flagpole as a TH on HLN or JVM or maybe NG, one of those.

But a big missing piece of the puzzle for me is what Casey did for two years, since she wasn't working. Two years is a long time to play hide-and-seek with her parents. And what about pocket money? Was she stealing and using Cindy's credit cards for two whole years and it didn't become an issue until shortly before Caylee went "missing?" It just doesn't make sense to me, especially with Cindy's focus on the almighty buck.

I'm left to believe we'll hear more at trial about what the OC did with her days (and possibly, nights).

[desmom]

It is obvious from reading Wendy Murphy's article she is familiar with the case. It is an interesting read to see it from her point of view because of her history as a prosecutor and independent counsel to the chief medical examiner in Massachusetts.

here is the article: http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/

jmo

ETA ~ I know she is big on the child porn, but I do think she points out some interesting things.

[Carol25]

TY :)

Remember - one of the most common benzodiazepines is Xanax (Zanny).

Heavens, I didn't know that! I don't know all of that stuff. I thought it must be some exotic drug!

[Carol25]

Casey didn't go to the Father's Day celebration at the Home with C and G and Caylee on the 15th. Did Caylee say something in the car about what the did during the day while they were in the car that started the big fight when they got home? We certainly know 1) She had disdain for her daughter and 2) She do anything for money

It's a disgusting leap, but not that big of one. for the OC

[Lavinia]

I tend to agree about Wendy being an alarmist ... she's run the porn thing up the flagpole as a TH on HLN or JVM or maybe NG, one of those.

But a big missing piece of the puzzle for me is what Casey did for two years, since she wasn't working. Two years is a long time to play hide-and-seek with her parents. And what about pocket money? Was she stealing and using Cindy's credit cards for two whole years and it didn't become an issue until shortly before Caylee went "missing?" It just doesn't make sense to me, especially with Cindy's focus on the almighty buck.

I'm left to believe we'll hear more at trial about what the OC did with her days (and possibly, nights).

Yup. If George had worked and been away from home, I could see her doing it (hiding from them). But if she had to dodge him during daylight hours, that's a lot of time to fill.

[kanzz]

Ahh, she's full of beans, lol. (I think once you work sex crimes like she has, you see the boogieman around every corner.)


LOL - glad I'm not the only one thinking that!

[Lavinia]

It is obvious from reading Wendy Murphy's article she is familiar with the case. It is an interesting read to see it from her point of view because of her history as a prosecutor and independent counsel to the chief medical examiner in Massachusetts.

here is the article: http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-21/the-evidence-yoursquore-not-allowed-to-see/

jmo

ETA ~ I know she is big on the child porn, but I do think she points out some interesting things.

You're right Des, she brought up some good questions about why we're not seeing more discovery. I was just talking to the benzo issue.

[Postergeist]

a question that may have been posed before in the past 11 months- but thinking about how Baez also does his pressers to the Hispanic/Spanish news media-

what is the local vibe in Orlando from the Latino community, especially since Casey and her family blamed a Latina for kidnapping Caylee?

anyone know?


(brought my post over from the daily thread to see if any locals know what the word on the street is) tia

[kanzz]

He probably has a temper with others but I haven't witnessed any victim behavior from Cindy. I suspect her cajones are made of steel and now thanks to the money maker scheme she has going Cindy can now afford to get them polished every week.

It's interesting to read your view. I've had the opposite view of Cindy for quite some time - thinking she looks like the vicitm who became a victimizer to some extent. Of course, I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong... just saying it's interesting that we have two different perspectives.
;-)

[Imperfect4]

You're right Des, she brought up some good questions about why we're not seeing more discovery. I was just talking to the benzo issue.

WM apparently read the same exceptions to the FL Sunshine Laws I read way back when (and which at least one other poster who shall remain nameless should read up on). There are a couple apparently quite above-board exceptions to the law that can easily be dropped over this case like a blanket to explain why we haven't seen more of the state's evidence against Casey.

Doesn't mean the evidence doesn't exist.

Doesn't mean the state must release it prior to trial.

[TunaMelt]

Ahh, she's full of beans, lol. (I think once you work sex crimes like she has, you see the boogieman around every corner.)

I believe I recall (?? how's that for being certain??) hearing Wendy Murphy talking about the possibility that Caylee was used in child porn in some way. This was last fall sometime, or winter. It was her speculation, based on her experience and no evidence other than the Xanax/Zanny club drug association.

I do think she suspects kiddie porn in a lot of instances, and who knows about this one -- who knows? I sure don't. Casey would do anything if she got something from it, including selling her child for sex pics IMO -- but that's Wendy Murphy's kind of thinking, too.

I like her when she goes up against Jane Weintraub. Wendy's the only one I've heard that I can think of who can out persist and out yell Jane W.

:smile:

[Imperfect4]

It's interesting to read your view. I've had the opposite view of Cindy for quite some time - thinking she looks like the vicitm who became a victimizer to some extent. Of course, I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong... just saying it's interesting that we have two different perspectives.
;-)

My view of George's temper: tempest in a teapot.

All blow, no go.

I think he only needs to be told to STHU and he's done.

His little tantrums are too "out there," imo, to be serious. Most dangerous abusers tend to be a whole lot lower key, in my experience.

I think primarily George is a drama queen, regardless of which emotion is on display.

[Lavinia]

WM apparently read the same exceptions to the FL Sunshine Laws I read way back when (and which at least one other poster who shall remain nameless should read up on). There are a couple apparently quite above-board exceptions to the law that can easily be dropped over this case like a blanket to explain why we haven't seen more of the state's evidence against Casey.

Doesn't mean the evidence doesn't exist.

Doesn't mean the state must release it prior to trial.

That is my understanding, too, Imp.

[TunaMelt]

My view of George's temper: tempest in a teapot.

All blow, no go.

I think he only needs to be told to STHU and he's done.

His little tantrums are too "out there," imo, to be serious. Most dangerous abusers tend to be a whole lot lower key, in my experience.

I think primarily George is a drama queen, regardless of which emotion is on display.

I agree.
He's just a wimp who gets overly frushtrated now and then and needs Cindy to put him back in his place. :sneaky::w00t:

[Imperfect4]

I agree.
He's just a wimp who gets overly frushtrated now and then and needs Cindy to put him back in his place. :sneaky::w00t:

Wonder if he ever balls his hands up in little fists and finds it difficult to swallow? :rolleyes:

[TunaMelt]

...and then he can't shwallow which makes him even more frushtrated.

:w00t:

[AnnieBell]

It's interesting to read your view. I've had the opposite view of Cindy for quite some time - thinking she looks like the vicitm who became a victimizer to some extent. Of course, I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong... just saying it's interesting that we have two different perspectives.
;-)

No harm taken.

[TunaMelt]

GMTA :lol: !!

[Lavinia]

I believe I recall (?? how's that for being certain??) hearing Wendy Murphy talking about the possibility that Caylee was used in child porn in some way. This was last fall sometime, or winter. It was her speculation, based on her experience and no evidence other than the Xanax/Zanny club drug association.

I do think she suspects kiddie porn in a lot of instances, and who knows about this one -- who knows? I sure don't. Casey would do anything if she got something from it, including selling her child for sex pics IMO -- but that's Wendy Murphy's kind of thinking, too.

I like her when she goes up against Jane Weintraub. Wendy's the only one I've heard that I can think of who can out persist and out yell Jane W.

:smile:

WM wouldn't be scared of the devil himself, lol. You are right on that!
I think Casey would probably be too jealous to make Caylee do porn. She would see that as more attention on Caylee, (as sick as you and I know that to be), that I don't think she could abide it, plus, I think putting her in porn would cause some industriousness on her part that may not be there.

[seeing_eye]

Something I've been thinking about... If George took a leap of faith and stepped out of the cesspool he's been occupying - really and completely shedded a skin or two he'd be set for life.

If he told the truth, every last horrible and sickening detail of it -- and let the chips fall where they may. Hire a good ghostwriter and get it all down on paper. Travel worldwide and speak to battered mens' groups. Be a cottage industry. Show a fall and a redemption. People love a good redemption.

Even if he gets some time for obstruction of justice or even if he's convicted of being an accomplice after the fact, he'd have his life back eventually and could someday hold his head high and maybe just maybe help others.

I know it's a stretch. But miracles do happen.

OK, that's my optimism for the decade. :smile:

Are you kidding? George is the mold that Casey came from. He and Casey are just alike. Not only do they look alike, but they act alike. It's my opinion, from what I've read, that George is a thief, a fraud, and a liar. He's the one who taught Casey, by example, how to lie, how to keep from having to work, and how to use other's credit cards, etc. Not only that, he is weak and spineless. I think, like most other people, I had a lot of sympathy in the beginning for George, but that changed after I began to see some of his history. MOO

[kellabeck]

We have frequently discussed the family members of perps who refuse to believe the truth and cling to the notion that their relatives are innocent, haven't we? Like Cindy and George Anthony, the parents of Scott Peterson and so on.

I've discovered some who are in such denial they beat this bunch: the son and daughter of Eugene Zapata who strangled his wife in the 70s and got away with it until recently. His first trial ended in a hung jury and before the retrial could begin, he decided to cop a plea to a reduced charge (reckless manslaughter.) His other daughter, who was interviewed for 48 HRS/Mystery approved of the deal as long as her father told how he did it and what he did with her [still missing] body and that it be videotaped. (He was sentenced under old laws and got 5 years and should serve 3. Quite a deal.)

So he confessed with all the details. But his other children still believe he's innocent!

BTW, 48 HRS has begun to post their episodes - in full -- online at crimesider.com.

[AMS]

You are correct. I'm going to Lenny's.

JMO

Wonder if Sawgrass Apartments rent by the week? :wink:


imo

[enigma™]

WM apparently read the same exceptions to the FL Sunshine Laws I read way back when (and which at least one other poster who shall remain nameless should read up on). There are a couple apparently quite above-board exceptions to the law that can easily be dropped over this case like a blanket to explain why we haven't seen more of the state's evidence against Casey.

Doesn't mean the evidence doesn't exist.

Doesn't mean the state must release it prior to trial.

Why does this post make me "grin"?

Some of the legally educated are not up to par on the FL sunshine laws. As they do not practice law in FL, it is understandable, but, it would behoove some to either get up to speed, or drop their feigned attitudes of righteousness.

[Lavinia]

Wonder if Sawgrass Apartments rent by the week? :wink:


imo

Ay Dios mio! :laugh:

[seeing_eye]

and his horrible violent temper.....I think he had that way before he met cindy......

Yeah, I forgot about George's violent temper in my earlier post where I was comparing George and Casey. That must be where Casey inherited her temper (and Cindy's rage was just the icing on the cake). I wonder how Lee's temper is?

[AnnieBell]

Are you kidding? George is the mold that Casey came from. He and Casey are just alike. Not only do they look alike, but they act alike. It's my opinion, from what I've read, that George is a thief, a fraud, and a liar. He's the one who taught Casey, by example, how to lie, how to keep from having to work, and how to use other's credit cards, etc. Not only that, he is weak and spineless. I think, like most other people, I had a lot of sympathy in the beginning for George, but that changed after I began to see some of his history. MOO

Oh, I agree with George's contribution but curious what did she learn from Cindy? Nothing!!! b/c heaven forbid Cindy would ever deny or say no to her little princess.

[seeing_eye]

o/t but I got some alarming news... I got a job.
...and I don't know if IS will be blocked from my computer at work.. I know, I know I'm just as upset as you guys are. :crying:

Oh, I sure hope you have access at work. I wouldn't want to have to be away from this board that long.

[seeing_eye]

Do you think you could rent one of those really big foreclosed homes really cheap? Ya know, with a pool and all and lots of bedrooms?

Maybe the Milstead home? :confused:

[Postergeist]

Why does this post make me "grin"?

Some the legally educated are not up to par on the FL sunshine laws. As they do not practice law in FL, it is understandable, but, it would behoove some to either get up to speed, or drop their feigned attitudes of righteousness.

:beer: here here!

While I'm not of the legal mindset and have no desire to be, I've followed and posted about this case when it broke on cable news, before the boards here were even opened back up last year.

And while it's one thing to be "new" to the case, it's a whole other ball of wax to have to scroll thru posts and finger wagging that mention cases not pertaining to Florida law let alone ones that really aren't about THIS case but what appears to be a personal agenda or personal blog about gosh knows what except to show outrage at those who feel outraged at the antics of the Anthonys and their attorneys and associates.

imo

[AnnieBell]

Maybe the Milstead home? :confused:

We could hire a couple of priest, Paranormal gooney's, truck loads of garlic, metal crosses and bibles to cleanse the spirit. All join in to form a circle outside the house and bring in the Mighty One. But we have to make sure the Milstead don't get any of our pennies. :biggrin:

[Imperfect4]

Why does this post make me "grin"?

Some of the legally educated are not up to par on the FL sunshine laws. As they do not practice law in FL, it is understandable, but, it would behoove some to either get up to speed, or drop their feigned attitudes of righteousness.

:sneaky:

Call me a loon, but aside from reading up on exceptions myself (and I'm hardly fluent in legalese), I also tend to trust that Florida state's attorneys know what is and isn't within the law, by chapter and by verse.

[Imperfect4]

I have a question.

Has it been reported or does any one know if G&C will be doing a media tour this week?

I looked on the link thread and didn't see any response from them about the release of the autopsy. Surely they have responded by now?


TIA

I don't think there have been any announcements.

My guess is they'll cool it for a week or two ... either because they "lost" in court, or because they're hoping absence will make the public yearn to see them again.

lol

lolol

lolololololololol :lol:

[enigma™]

:beer: here here!

While I'm not of the legal mindset and have no desire to be, I've followed and posted about this case when it broke on cable news, before the boards here were even opened back up last year.

And while it's one thing to be "new" to the case, it's a whole other ball of wax to have to scroll thru posts and finger wagging that mention cases not pertaining to Florida law let alone ones that really aren't about THIS case but what appears to be a personal agenda or personal blog about gosh knows what except to show outrage at those who feel outraged at the antics of the Anthonys and their attorneys and associates.

imo

Are you waxing poetic? :laugh:

Seriously, I appreciate the legal eagles (Katprint and Lapis, especially). Their input is greatly appreciated by me, as they take the time to look up information and explain it so that the lay person can understand the terminoligy.

[Postergeist]

Yeah, I forgot about George's violent temper in my earlier post where I was comparing George and Casey. That must be where Casey inherited her temper (and Cindy's rage was just the icing on the cake). I wonder how Lee's temper is?

just earlier today folks were refreshing our memory of Lee's temper- with photo shots of him tearing down signs and the fact he pitched the water from a doggie bowl in the hot sun. I think this link is where he is accused of trying to run over some children in the neighborhood

ck. time from 4:48 on

http://www.wesh.com/video/17452770/index.html

[bchand]

:beer: here here!

While I'm not of the legal mindset and have no desire to be, I've followed and posted about this case when it broke on cable news, before the boards here were even opened back up last year.

And while it's one thing to be "new" to the case, it's a whole other ball of wax to have to scroll thru posts and finger wagging that mention cases not pertaining to Florida law let alone ones that really aren't about THIS case but what appears to be a personal agenda or personal blog about gosh knows what except to show outrage at those who feel outraged at the antics of the Anthonys and their attorneys and associates.

imo


Wow - What YOU said !

[enigma™]

:sneaky:

Call me a loon, but aside from reading up on exceptions myself (and I'm hardly fluent in legalese), I also tend to trust that Florida state's attorneys know what is and isn't within the law, by chapter and by verse.


You are a loon! You told me to call you that. :tonguewag:

Once this trial gets under way, there will not be much time to pick apart posters, which is a good thing. We will have plenty of fodder and law to consume, state law, exceptions to rules, etc. And, last but not least, what people wear to attend the trial, who Cindy pointed at, what button Geo wore, and if Lee's acne reignited.

[summer]

Are you kidding? George is the mold that Casey came from. He and Casey are just alike. Not only do they look alike, but they act alike. It's my opinion, from what I've read, that George is a thief, a fraud, and a liar. He's the one who taught Casey, by example, how to lie, how to keep from having to work, and how to use other's credit cards, etc. Not only that, he is weak and spineless. I think, like most other people, I had a lot of sympathy in the beginning for George, but that changed after I began to see some of his history. MOO

Hey now! :seeya:

I said never mind / emily litella!

But anyway, my thoughts were going to comments about George not being able to leave Cindy partly because of the finance angle and i was just saying he could make a fortune in a way that (I don't believe) Cindy can -- if he fessed up and started a battered guy tour.

I think men are particularly sensitive to him, for whatever reason. Hey I can't stand the guy myself and I never have.

Anyway, it's a bad idea because along with his temper (as others have pointed out) he just doesn't have the maturity - IMO - to be self sustaining, much less instruct or lead others.

[AnnieBell]

Dang it, my body is demanding sleep now so I have to close the computer but I be back in the morning!!!:sad:

Carry on night crew:cool:

[gaelicpeas]

sometimes I agree with Gaelic that it's possible the original plan was to hide Caylee somewhere......get lots of donations to search for her .....and casey getting mad and murdering Caylee was NOT in the plan....I think that's why cindy is so convincing when she realized something bad had happened to Caylee instead of what they had planned....I know it sounds crazy but there are deep dark secrets among the 4 of them.....not sure what they are.

I also could believe casey was planning on killing one or both of her parents......

didn't casey tell Tone she always had a plan B?:seeya: You said it well, summer... :smile:

[summer]

I don't think there have been any announcements.

My guess is they'll cool it for a week or two ... either because they "lost" in court, or because they're hoping absence will make the public yearn to see them again.

lol

lolol

lolololololololol :lol:

I realllly thought the DP would shut them up for a long while but nope, like the Energizer Bunnies they were back in a flash. Same here I think.

[kanzz]

My view of George's temper: tempest in a teapot.

All blow, no go.

I think he only needs to be told to STHU and he's done.

His little tantrums are too "out there," imo, to be serious. Most dangerous abusers tend to be a whole lot lower key, in my experience.

I think primarily George is a drama queen, regardless of which emotion is on display.

Very well could be. It's probably obvious to everyone by now that my perspective of George is based on some personal experience with a very similar "drama queen", as you so aptly call him. This one was a pussycat in front of nearly all who knew him, but actually a wolf in sheep's clothing. A sociopath and a very scary dude. George is so much like him it's eery.

[Postergeist]

Are you waxing poetic? :laugh:

Seriously, I appreciate the legal eagles (Katprint and Lapis, especially). Their input is greatly appreciated by me, as they take the time to look up information and explain it so that the lay person can understand the terminoligy.

hehe- oh why not- spring is sprung the grass is green I wonder where my lawnmower are?

I'm a gypsy, see my bracelets, I'm a daredevil, see my kneesocks, I'm a danger to myself, please tip the delivery pizza boy while I write 9 pages...

see me wrapping to my wray of music cuz my "gut feeling" is stronger than any digits on a Hand, band of the Hand, where'd the ring go Casey O?

for my next stage appearance- I'll do it all in the Scottish dialect

[gaelicpeas]

There was a very interesting article from Wendy Murphy's blog. Don't know if I can mention it here. But it was about the questions that were not asked. Things that were brought out in the report that would lead to other questions and weren't answered, One of which was benzodine (hope I spelled that right.) Why did LE want a test for that? It has been used for certain crimes. And the toxicology report was not given for that.

I know this sounds cryptic. Sorry.That would be benzodiazepine. Here is a link with basic info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzodiazepine

[summer4meplz]

Yeah, I forgot about George's violent temper in my earlier post where I was comparing George and Casey. That must be where Casey inherited her temper (and Cindy's rage was just the icing on the cake). I wonder how Lee's temper is?

ask the owner of the dog who had her dog bowl and sign thrown out by lee...:angry:

[imc_e]

oops. Looks like I stepped on imc_e's post. sorry!


Thats Ok! :thumbup:

[Imperfect4]

You are a loon! You told me to call you that. :tonguewag:

Once this trial gets under way, there will not be much time to pick apart posters, which is a good thing. We will have plenty of fodder and law to consume, state law, exceptions to rules, etc. And, last but not least, what people wear to attend the trial, who Cindy pointed at, what button Geo wore, and if Lee's acne reignited.

My BFF and I have been starting sentences with, "Call me a loon ..." for years. And as soon as one of us says it, the other interrupts with, "You're a loon!" :laugh:

Guess you had to be there ... :blushing:

[Unleashed]

:scared: Ack! Not without ME, you're not!!

Not a problem, AnniePie. He's man enough to go around. I'll share.:w00t:

JMO

[summer]

I think the middle finger is actually insane in the clinical sense. IMO.

[aproudmom]

I was watching TV and for some reason I am getting HBO and SEDG never heard of the channel anyway my son wanted to watch this movie untraceable and all of a sudden my jaw dropped that is one of the movies KC rented right??

[summer]

GMTA :lol: !!

I like that. What do the letters stand for exactly? (It's like you owe me a Coke or something, right?)

[Lavinia]

I was watching TV and for some reason I am getting HBO and SEDG never heard of the channel anyway my son wanted to watch this movie untraceable and all of a sudden my jaw dropped that is one of the movies KC rented right??

I believe it is APM. (I just checked my HBO's and don't see it. :confused:)

[Lavinia]

I like that. What do the letters stand for exactly? (It's like you owe me a Coke or something, right?)

Great Minds Think Alike. (Pinch, poke, you owe me a Coke.)

[bchand]

Hey now! :seeya:

I said never mind / emily litella!

But anyway, my thoughts were going to comments about George not being able to leave Cindy partly because of the finance angle and i was just saying he could make a fortune in a way that (I don't believe) Cindy can -- if he fessed up and started a battered guy tour.

I think men are particularly sensitive to him, for whatever reason. Hey I can't stand the guy myself and I never have.

Anyway, it's a bad idea because along with his temper (as others have pointed out) he just doesn't have the maturity - IMO - to be self sustaining, much less instruct or lead others.


My bold - I think it's because men do not like women who emasculate other men. Never mind the men who allow it to happen. (aka Jon & Kate) Lots of sympathy for him too.

[imc_e]

o/t but I got some alarming news... I got a job.
...and I don't know if IS will be blocked from my computer at work.. I know, I know I'm just as upset as you guys are. :crying:

Wow! Congrats!

(now its my turn)

And if you can't access the board, there are easy ways to bypass security with proxy servers. (after your probation period..lol)

Good stuff ttc! :smile:

[summer]

Great Minds Think Alike. (Pinch, poke, you owe me a Coke.)

Gotcha! :smile:

[Lavinia]

My bold - I think it's because men do not like women who emasculate other men. Never mind the men who allow it to happen. (aka Jon & Kate) Lots of sympathy for him too.

Yes, he's the everyman's hen-pecked victim that they can all sympathize with and root for. Like you say, never mind that he handed his jewels over to her on a velvet pillow...

[Unleashed]

Dang it, my body is demanding sleep now so I have to close the computer but I be back in the morning!!!:sad:

Carry on night crew:cool:

:seeya: AnnieBell (see, I got it right!)
Sleep with angels.

[Postergeist]

I was watching TV and for some reason I am getting HBO and SEDG never heard of the channel anyway my son wanted to watch this movie untraceable and all of a sudden my jaw dropped that is one of the movies KC rented right??

yep- just checked

she rented Untraceable and Jumper on June 16th

One movie was “Untraceable,” about a kidnapper and killer. The other was “Jumper,” which features a character who is a mother who abandons her five-year-old child.



http://kreuzer33.wordpress.com/2008/11/03/casey-anthony-rented-murder-films-on-the-day-caylee-disappeared/

[sunstar]

WM wouldn't be scared of the devil himself, lol. You are right on that!
I think Casey would probably be too jealous to make Caylee do porn. She would see that as more attention on Caylee, (as sick as you and I know that to be), that I don't think she could abide it, plus, I think putting her in porn would cause some industriousness on her part that may not be there.
I agree and I think if she'd done that, it would've shown up on the Internet and we'd know all about it. MOO

[Imperfect4]

So I'm re-reading the reports released on Friday.

About the paper towels with the grave wax on them ...

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/0619/19801996.pdf
page 7

The report says they were a part of the debris found in the trunk of the Pontiac. The report also says " ... the conversion of oleic acid [which is a product of decomp] could have occurred during the month the car was sitting in the summer heat."

If I read between the lines, the implication is Casey may not have known there was evidence on those paper towels because it took time for whatever was on them to convert to decomp acids. Which may be why they were still in the trunk when the car was found, but I find it odd Casey would leave them there.

Any thoughts on what she used those paper towels for? Did she wipe the "stain" on the trunk carpet with them? Did she wipe her hands with them? Did they come in contact with Caylee while she was in the trunk?

I just can't believe the OC was stupid enough to leave anything that might've touched Caylee or fluids from Caylee's body in that trunk.

[imc_e]

I don't think casey cared or gave it much thought.

Look at how she borrowed a shovel after she killed Caylee.

[bchand]

Yes, he's the everyman's hen-pecked victim that they can all sympathize with and root for. Like you say, never mind that he handed his jewels over to her on a velvet pillow...

Oh look at some of these gorgeous rentals in the Kissimmee area:

http://www.pleasantstays.com/traveler/jsp/main/PSTraveler.jsp

7 bedrooms, pool, spa, etc etc. (Sleeps 14)

We need to find out where this trial will take place!

[AnniePie]

I think the middle finger is actually insane in the clinical sense. IMO.

The entire HAND is insane. My very humble (but correct) opinion only. :rolleyes:

[bchand]

So I'm re-reading the reports released on Friday.

About the paper towels with the grave wax on them ...

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/0619/19801996.pdf
page 7

The report says they were a part of the debris found in the trunk of the Pontiac. The report also says " ... the conversion of oleic acid [which is a product of decomp] could have occurred during the month the car was sitting in the summer heat."

If I read between the lines, the implication is Casey may not have known there was evidence on those paper towels because it took time for whatever was on them to convert to decomp acids. Which may be why they were still in the trunk when the car was found, but I find it odd Casey would leave them there.

Any thoughts on what she used those paper towels for? Did she wipe the "stain" on the trunk carpet with them? Did she wipe her hands with them? Did they come in contact with Caylee while she was in the trunk?

I just can't believe the OC was stupid enough to leave anything that might've touched Caylee or fluids from Caylee's body in that trunk.

I don't know. It's hard to believe she didn't just throw all that stuff in the dumpster that she parked her car next to.

OR that Cindy/George didn't get rid of it.

[aproudmom]

I believe it is APM. (I just checked my HBO's and don't see it. :confused:)

it is on my satellite 522 Stars EDG or starz however they spell it...I have Direct TV

[Postergeist]

I'm thinking the defense will say the paper towels were planted

I wouldn't think they came into direct contact with Caylee- but agree they may have been used to mop up anything on the trunk floor or hands.

But G & C had the car in their possession for some time and may have used and left those towels too.

But she did leave her pants in the car and her shoes, and C washed those because they did smell like the car. But the defense will likely say the clothes were planted as well, that not only did the nanny have extra clothes she kept for Caylee, that she also kept a wardrobe of extra clothes for Casey. She was the all-purpose amazing woman, that nanny.

I've got to go return my e. coli cookie dough, hope to check back later to see if anyone local posts.

:seeya:

[crimeq]

I need some help here on the timeline. Casey is 7 months pregnant and clearly she is seeing Jesse, because tried to pin the paternity on him (and it was determined he met her after she was already pregnant?).

It has never made sense to me that Cindy, a nurse, didn't know that Casey was pregnant. Even if Casey didn't tell her, Cindy would pick that up.

What if ... Cindy was fully aware that Casey was pregnant and told her to keep quiet about it (not tell the family, friends, etc. but DENY it) because Cindy was in her "fixer mode" and was going to find a father for that baby--and there's Jesse, and they go for him full-throttle until Richard Grund steps in and suggests a paternity test.

Then Cindy has to come up with another story, so we have the "dead" father.

Was Cindy actually trying to clean up that latest mess of Casey's, like she always covered up for Casey's messes -- just like she is doing now?

I think she knew full well that Casey was pregnant and she went into her normal mode to "fix it" and save Casey.

Sound familiar?

[AlohaRainbow]

We could hire a couple of priest, Paranormal gooney's, truck loads of garlic, metal crosses and bibles to cleanse the spirit. All join in to form a circle outside the house and bring in the Mighty One. But we have to make sure the Milstead don't get any of our pennies. :biggrin:

don't forget the sage for smudging. :smile:

[aproudmom]

Yeah there is even a site on called killwithme.com which is on the movie but I did not go on it..actually the movie is enough but my son does not understand why I would rather watch something else

[Imperfect4]

I don't think casey cared or gave it much thought.

Look at how she borrowed a shovel after she killed Caylee.

I sort of separate what Casey assumes she can get away with simply by running her mouth, and what she assumes she can get away with that is direct evidence of something she did.

Borrowing the shovel was a running of her mouth thing (bamboo shoots :rolleyes:). And there was nothing on that shovel according to the test results.

Leaving paper towels in the trunk with possible evidence on them I put in the second category.

Not saying the OC is bright by any means, but the paper towel thing has me puzzled. Especially since it seems she went to some lengths initially to clean up the car, or at least try to mask the smell.

[imc_e]

I need some help here on the timeline. Casey is 7 months pregnant and clearly she is seeing Jesse, because tried to pin the paternity on him (and it was determined he met her after she was already pregnant?).

It has never made sense to me that Cindy, a nurse, didn't know that Casey was pregnant. Even if Casey didn't tell her, Cindy would pick that up.

What if ... Cindy was fully aware that Casey was pregnant and told her to keep quiet about it (not tell the family, friends, etc. but DENY it) because Cindy was in her "fixer mode" and was going to find a father for that baby--and there's Jesse, and they go for him full-throttle until Richard Grund steps in and suggests a paternity test.

Then Cindy has to come up with another story, so we have the "dead" father.

Was Cindy actually trying to clean up that latest mess of Casey's, like she always covered up for Casey's messes -- just like she is doing now?

I think she knew full well that Casey was pregnant and she went into her normal mode to "fix it" and save Casey.

Sound familiar?

It makes TOTAL sense, yes. :thumbup:

[Imperfect4]

I need some help here on the timeline. Casey is 7 months pregnant and clearly she is seeing Jesse, because tried to pin the paternity on him (and it was determined he met her after she was already pregnant?).

It has never made sense to me that Cindy, a nurse, didn't know that Casey was pregnant. Even if Casey didn't tell her, Cindy would pick that up.

What if ... Cindy was fully aware that Casey was pregnant and told her to keep quiet about it (not tell the family, friends, etc. but DENY it) because Cindy was in her "fixer mode" and was going to find a father for that baby--and there's Jesse, and they go for him full-throttle until Richard Grund steps in and suggests a paternity test.

Then Cindy has to come up with another story, so we have the "dead" father.

Was Cindy actually trying to clean up that latest mess of Casey's, like she always covered up for Casey's messes -- just like she is doing now?

I think she knew full well that Casey was pregnant and she went into her normal mode to "fix it" and save Casey.

Sound familiar?

Sounds entirely possible. Also sounds a lot like summer's theory from earlier today.

Another GMTA moment!!

[imc_e]

I sort of separate what Casey assumes she can get away with simply by running her mouth, and what she assumes she can get away with that is direct evidence of something she did.

Borrowing the shovel was a running of her mouth thing (bamboo shoots :rolleyes:). And there was nothing on that shovel according to the test results.

Leaving paper towels in the trunk with possible evidence on them I put in the second category.

Not saying the OC is bright by any means, but the paper towel thing has me puzzled. Especially since it seems she went to some lengths initially to clean up the car, or at least try to mask the smell.

How in the world would Cindy have overlooked paper towels, and left them there in the trunk with a dryer sheet?
I mean, she is a nurse of decomposition. :sneaky:

Could the paper towels have been from Cindy cleaning the stain, or the inside of the trunk? and she was not done cleaning when the car was taken as evidence?

[aproudmom]

I can not believe she would watch this movie it is the sickest thing she is a sick A$$ MONSTER..Kill your child and then go rent a murder, torture movie..

[Lavinia]

Oh look at some of these gorgeous rentals in the Kissimmee area:

http://www.pleasantstays.com/traveler/jsp/main/PSTraveler.jsp

7 bedrooms, pool, spa, etc etc. (Sleeps 14)

We need to find out where this trial will take place!

CEMENT PONDS! :w00t:

[sunstar]

I need some help here on the timeline. Casey is 7 months pregnant and clearly she is seeing Jesse, because tried to pin the paternity on him (and it was determined he met her after she was already pregnant?).

It has never made sense to me that Cindy, a nurse, didn't know that Casey was pregnant. Even if Casey didn't tell her, Cindy would pick that up.

What if ... Cindy was fully aware that Casey was pregnant and told her to keep quiet about it (not tell the family, friends, etc. but DENY it) because Cindy was in her "fixer mode" and was going to find a father for that baby--and there's Jesse, and they go for him full-throttle until Richard Grund steps in and suggests a paternity test.

Then Cindy has to come up with another story, so we have the "dead" father.

Was Cindy actually trying to clean up that latest mess of Casey's, like she always covered up for Casey's messes -- just like she is doing now?

I think she knew full well that Casey was pregnant and she went into her normal mode to "fix it" and save Casey.

Sound familiar?

I think it's a good theory! What I don't understand is why would she allow Casey to attend her brother's wedding if she was so into covering up the pregnancy? In times past, this is when the kid would be sent to school in Europe, or someplace away from home until after the baby. Trying to pass the pregnancy off the way she did at the wedding was almost comical. MOO

[sunstar]

I can not believe she would watch this movie it is the sickest thing she is a sick A$$ MONSTER..Kill your child and then go rent a murder, torture movie..

Maybe it was her way of immediately reliving the moment? :scared:

[crimeq]

So I'm re-reading the reports released on Friday.

About the paper towels with the grave wax on them ...

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/0619/19801996.pdf
page 7

The report says they were a part of the debris found in the trunk of the Pontiac. The report also says " ... the conversion of oleic acid [which is a product of decomp] could have occurred during the month the car was sitting in the summer heat."

If I read between the lines, the implication is Casey may not have known there was evidence on those paper towels because it took time for whatever was on them to convert to decomp acids. Which may be why they were still in the trunk when the car was found, but I find it odd Casey would leave them there.

Any thoughts on what she used those paper towels for? Did she wipe the "stain" on the trunk carpet with them? Did she wipe her hands with them? Did they come in contact with Caylee while she was in the trunk?

I just can't believe the OC was stupid enough to leave anything that might've touched Caylee or fluids from Caylee's body in that trunk.


The paper towels were in the bag of trash Casey took from Tony L's house. I think she purposely left the garbage/trash in the trunk to smell up the car, hoping it would cover the smell of decomp (or the decomp odor could be blamed on the trash, so little did the little CSI expert know ...). I don't think she had ANY idea at all that the paper towels had been compromised in any way. I don't think she forgot anything, but that she simply didn't know, didn't put it together.

[kanzz]

So I'm re-reading the reports released on Friday.

About the paper towels with the grave wax on them ...

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/0619/19801996.pdf
page 7

The report says they were a part of the debris found in the trunk of the Pontiac. The report also says " ... the conversion of oleic acid [which is a product of decomp] could have occurred during the month the car was sitting in the summer heat."

If I read between the lines, the implication is Casey may not have known there was evidence on those paper towels because it took time for whatever was on them to convert to decomp acids. Which may be why they were still in the trunk when the car was found, but I find it odd Casey would leave them there.

Any thoughts on what she used those paper towels for? Did she wipe the "stain" on the trunk carpet with them? Did she wipe her hands with them? Did they come in contact with Caylee while she was in the trunk?

I just can't believe the OC was stupid enough to leave anything that might've touched Caylee or fluids from Caylee's body in that trunk.

I think the conversion would only occur within the body, rather than the conversions of something outside of the body. I could be very, very wrong - but my opinion is that these products were the result of body cavity rupture while in the trunk.

[AnniePie]

CEMENT PONDS! :w00t:

Does Jethro now wear a black cowboy hat? :w00t:

[~jomomma~]

Then Cindy has to come up with another story, so we have the "dead" father.

Was Cindy actually trying to clean up that latest mess of Casey's, like she always covered up for Casey's messes -- just like she is doing now?

I think she knew full well that Casey was pregnant and she went into her normal mode to "fix it" and save Casey.

Sound familiar?

snipped.........


funny, cuz i was googling something earlier and came across this (which we've all read before) but it hit me again what cindy said to george (if it's true) about the odor in the car......

"I believe that there's something dead back there," Anthony said. "And I hate to say the word human . . . I mean that law-enforcement stuff that I did, we caught people out in the woods, in a house, in a, in a car. So I know what it smells like. It's a smell that you never . . . never get rid of."

Anthony continued: "When I first went there to pick up that vehicle I got within three feet of it I could smell something. You look up and you say, please don't let this be. Please don't let this be."

Anthony said he opened the door and tried to vent the car. When he walked around the Pontiac to look inside the trunk, Anthony told detectives: "I think I whispered out to myself 'Please don't let this be my Caylee.' That's what I thought. That's what I, my heart was saying."

When Anthony and the wrecker employee opened the trunk, Anthony said, he saw the garbage bag and a stain the size of a basketball.

The car smelled so bad, Anthony didn't know how he was going to drive it home. "I couldn't freaking breath [sic]," he said.

When Anthony got the car home and pulled into the garage, he said his wife Cindy said, "Jesus Christ, what died?"

"But then she said it in a way, she says, 'George, it was the pizza, right?' And I said, 'Yeah (affirmative), it was the pizza.' And that's what I left it go at that

[Imperfect4]

Imperfect - I thought the find on the paper towel was important. The lab examined the paper towel (noted as a napkin on evidence sheet) because it had flies on it and found the grave wax. It also had the smell of pot so it probably came from Tone's apt.

I hope they can find finger prints, Casey's DNA or something on it to tie it to Casey other than just being in her car.

Yep ... the pot residue is also interesting. I wonder if she either cleaned off her hands or wiped the trunk carpet with the paper towels, then took them into Tony's apartment and tossed them in the trash, only to return the trash to her trunk? (Remember there was a bag of trash from his apartment in her trunk.)

Or did she do the reverse ... take the paper towels (already exposed to the pot smoking) from Tony's apartment down to her car, wiped something with them, and then left them?

I just don't think she deliberately left them in that trunk.

[Lavinia]

it is on my satellite 522 Stars EDG or starz however they spell it...I have Direct TV

Crud! I'm using Time-Warner and don't see it. :cursing:

[crimeq]

Sounds entirely possible. Also sounds a lot like summer's theory from earlier today.

Another GMTA moment!!

Oh, missed Summer's theory from earlier -- I've been in and out all day. So GMTA, one of those "universal knowledge" moments, lol!

Anyway, I think it's a very real possibility--and another "script" established by Cindy. I think that's how she handles things with Casey--just say this, here's your script--and I'll take care of it.

[Lavinia]

Yep ... the pot residue is also interesting. I wonder if she either cleaned off her hands or wiped the trunk carpet with the paper towels, then took them into Tony's apartment and tossed them in the trash, only to return the trash to her trunk? (Remember there was a bag of trash from his apartment in her trunk.)

Or did she do the reverse ... take the paper towels (already exposed to the pot smoking) from Tony's apartment down to her car, wiped something with them, and then left them?

I just don't think she deliberately left them in that trunk.

I think she took them from Tony's maybe when she took the trash from there. I do believe she could have left the PT's. She left her stupid purse and clothes/shoes. She's gonna do a half-azz job on anything she does, IMO.

Did we ever figure out what it was from the dump site that must have surely tied back to the house THAT DAY? I don't think they saw the blanket at that time, because the excavation went so slowly to preserve evidence. I think there is *something* that was laying around or something that sent them right to the house.

[bchand]

I think it's a good theory! What I don't understand is why would she allow Casey to attend her brother's wedding if she was so into covering up the pregnancy? In times past, this is when the kid would be sent to school in Europe, or someplace away from home until after the baby. Trying to pass the pregnancy off the way she did at the wedding was almost comical. MOO

Sounds almost as brazen as walking the police down a hallway at Universal to your office, which doesn't exist.

[Lavinia]

Does Jethro now wear a black cowboy hat? :w00t:

When he's playing a double-naught spy. :laugh:

[bchand]

Crud! I'm using Time-Warner and don't see it. :cursing:

It's on Starz here.

[crimeq]

I think it's a good theory! What I don't understand is why would she allow Casey to attend her brother's wedding if she was so into covering up the pregnancy? In times past, this is when the kid would be sent to school in Europe, or someplace away from home until after the baby. Trying to pass the pregnancy off the way she did at the wedding was almost comical. MOO

Denial has always worked for Cindy. She didn't want to get into the particulars; she was trying to line up Jesse as the father, at which time she'd continue to claim that she really didn't know. So at the wedding, she simply denied. She still had her master plan to make it all better, and frankly, I don't think she cares at all what the family or anyone thinks of her. I believe she had established a script for Casey to follow (that she was following too) and had everything worked out to "fix" the situation. And she probably would have said something to Casey like, don't say anything to anyone, deny if it comes up, I'll take care of it.

I do think Cindy would have found out past the first trimester, though, because I believe an abortion would have been had if it wasn't too late.

[Dick Tracy]

Yep ... the pot residue is also interesting. I wonder if she either cleaned off her hands or wiped the trunk carpet with the paper towels, then took them into Tony's apartment and tossed them in the trash, only to return the trash to her trunk? (Remember there was a bag of trash from his apartment in her trunk.)

Or did she do the reverse ... take the paper towels (already exposed to the pot smoking) from Tony's apartment down to her car, wiped something with them, and then left them?

I just don't think she deliberately left them in that trunk.

Maybe before she killed Caylee, she got stoned. Didn't they do a drug test on her when she got to jail, or ?? I don't know the rules.

[Lavinia]

The paper towels were in the bag of trash Casey took from Tony L's house. I think she purposely left the garbage/trash in the trunk to smell up the car, hoping it would cover the smell of decomp (or the decomp odor could be blamed on the trash, so little did the little CSI expert know ...). I don't think she had ANY idea at all that the paper towels had been compromised in any way. I don't think she forgot anything, but that she simply didn't know, didn't put it together.

Oops. I just posted almost the same thing. :blushing: We all know the script now.

[imc_e]

Sounds almost as brazen as walking the police down a hallway at Universal to your office, which doesn't exist.

as brazen as cashing other peoples cheques she stole and signing her name to them. :huh:

[Lavinia]

It's on Starz here.

Got it! Thanks Bet!

[Imperfect4]

I think the conversion would only occur within the body, rather than the conversions of something outside of the body. I could be very, very wrong - but my opinion is that these products were the result of body cavity rupture while in the trunk.

But doesn't that mean the body would've been in the trunk approximately a month?

The decomp odors detected at the Body Farm put the time in trunk at about 2 and a half days.

This seems so confusing. Ack! :confused:

[Lavinia]

Maybe before she killed Caylee, she got stoned. Didn't they do a drug test on her when she got to jail, or ?? I don't know the rules.

I believe that would be an illegal search and seizure Dick. That's like testifying against yourself. I stand to be corrected though.

ETA: Of course she can consent, if the above is true.

[gaelicpeas]

How in the world would Cindy have overlooked paper towels, and left them there in the trunk with a dryer sheet?
I mean, she is a nurse of decomposition. :sneaky:

Could the paper towels have been from Cindy cleaning the stain, or the inside of the trunk? and she was not done cleaning when the car was taken as evidence?I am pretty sure the paper towels were in the bag of trash that the towyard manager tossed into the dump and LE recovered. Therefore, Cindy had no chance to "clean" them.

[crimeq]

snipped.........


funny, cuz i was googling something earlier and came across this (which we've all read before) but it hit me again what cindy said to george (if it's true) about the odor in the car......

"I believe that there's something dead back there," Anthony said. "And I hate to say the word human . . . I mean that law-enforcement stuff that I did, we caught people out in the woods, in a house, in a, in a car. So I know what it smells like. It's a smell that you never . . . never get rid of."

Anthony continued: "When I first went there to pick up that vehicle I got within three feet of it I could smell something. You look up and you say, please don't let this be. Please don't let this be."

Anthony said he opened the door and tried to vent the car. When he walked around the Pontiac to look inside the trunk, Anthony told detectives: "I think I whispered out to myself 'Please don't let this be my Caylee.' That's what I thought. That's what I, my heart was saying."

When Anthony and the wrecker employee opened the trunk, Anthony said, he saw the garbage bag and a stain the size of a basketball.

The car smelled so bad, Anthony didn't know how he was going to drive it home. "I couldn't freaking breath [sic]," he said.

When Anthony got the car home and pulled into the garage, he said his wife Cindy said, "Jesus Christ, what died?"

"But then she said it in a way, she says, 'George, it was the pizza, right?' And I said, 'Yeah (affirmative), it was the pizza.' And that's what I left it go at that

OK refresh me here, did Cindy see the bag of garbage or the pizza box while the car was still at the tow yard, or does she know nothing about this when George drives the car into the garage? If she didn't know about it, how could she say it was the pizza?

[bchand]

Got it! Thanks Bet!

I just picked up on it half way through but I've watched it at least 1/2 dozen times. Mainly because I just love Diane Lane.

[Imperfect4]

Maybe before she killed Caylee, she got stoned. Didn't they do a drug test on her when she got to jail, or ?? I don't know the rules.

Ack. Another piece of the puzzle we don't have. She was drug-tested at some point (or several points), and the results were not released.

[imc_e]

I am pretty sure the paper towels were in the bag of trash that the towyard manager tossed into the dump and LE recovered. Therefore, Cindy had no chance to "clean" them.


ty! ty!

That makes more sense than what I was thinking.

That evidence will be coming in, IMO.

[Lavinia]

But doesn't that mean the body would've been in the trunk approximately a month?

The decomp odors detected at the Body Farm put the time in trunk at about 2 and a half days.

This seems so confusing. Ack! :confused:

One of the links we saw yesterday says that adipocere forms *within* a month. Caylee's age is going to have a lot to do with the formation of adipocere IMO, due to the fat patterns and amounts of fat found in most children.

ETA: Not that I answered a dang thing, but yesterday the first person that brought this up kept saying it takes a full month to form adipocere and it's "within a month", which we know can be an altogether different animal.

[crimeq]

Oops. I just posted almost the same thing. :blushing: We all know the script now.

LOL, the pieces are falling into place. We've been around each other too long, here on the IS Caylee board:wink:

[Lavinia]

Ack. Another piece of the puzzle we don't have. She was drug-tested at some point (or several points), and the results were not released.

Now that you say this, it's nagging at me. Argh!!! CRS. DESMOM! :laugh:

[Unleashed]

Maybe before she killed Caylee, she got stoned. Didn't they do a drug test on her when she got to jail, or ?? I don't know the rules.

I'm not fluent in pot, but I don't believe it brings out the killer in most.

JMO

[Imperfect4]

I think she took them from Tony's maybe when she took the trash from there. I do believe she could have left the PT's. She left her stupid purse and clothes/shoes. She's gonna do a half-azz job on anything she does, IMO.

Did we ever figure out what it was from the dump site that must have surely tied back to the house THAT DAY? I don't think they saw the blanket at that time, because the excavation went so slowly to preserve evidence. I think there is *something* that was laying around or something that sent them right to the house.

Someone was nice enough yesterday to post the list of things taken from the house in that first search warrant.

But to answer your question, no, we don't know what they saw at the dump site that sent them right to the house to secure it while they got a search warrant. Would that be SOP in any case?

[Lavinia]

LOL, the pieces are falling into place. We've been around each other too long, here on the IS Caylee board:wink:

I swear they're gonna need us at the trial to bring up some of these things, lol. (Maybe they can pay for our rental house? :sneaky:)

[Elle]

From bugout's post from thread #1 http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?p=13212578#post13212578



Your post got me to thinking about the phone call home and the 7/25 jail visit. In the very beginning, I do not think Cindy was in full-bore defense mode....yet.

Casey's phone call home from jail - http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/7/25/casey_anthony_calls_home_from_jail.html IIRC, this phone call was made within the first day or two of Casey's lst arrest.

Casey: You don’t know what my involvement is and stuff?

Cindy: Casey.

Casey: Mom.

Cindy: What?

Casey: No.

I always felt from the attitude in their voices and the conversation, they were both referring to something...something only the 2 of them know...some secret.

Cindy: I don’t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You’re not telling me where she’s at.

Did Cindy think Casey had Caylee in hiding?

Then from the July 25 jail video visit with George & Cindy. http://www.wftv.com/video/18205452/index.html

Cindy's defense mode is beginning to kick in...imo, but at the beginning of the visit ...

Cindy: We forgive you for anything that you have said or done.

Casey: I haven't said anything. Don't worry.

What does Cindy think Casey has said or done? Then Casey reassures Cindy by telling her not to worry. Is this another secret?

jmo

It is my belief that Casey has witheld Caylee before, used her as leverage. I believe that is what Lee was talking about when he asks her 'is this like last time?'. I think Cindy thought Casey set up the whole thing to unite the family. At least that is what I took from this statement she made last July 21st.

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/7/20/caylee_last_spoke_with_mother_tuesday.html

“Her plan was to get us all back together, and I think her plan has changed and I think that's what happened,” said Cindy Anthony. “Her plan changed halfway through, and she doesn't know where it’s at right now. I truly believe Casey knows who has Caylee but it's code name. That's why they can't find that person just yet.”


moo

[crimeq]

I am pretty sure the paper towels were in the bag of trash that the towyard manager tossed into the dump and LE recovered. Therefore, Cindy had no chance to "clean" them.

She also wouldn't have known about the pizza, right? So how could she have made that comment to George right off the bat when he pulled the car into the garage? Sounds like George got at least part of his story together with Cindy (or she was trying) before he made that first surreptitious visit to the police department to talk to LE.

[sunstar]

Sounds almost as brazen as walking the police down a hallway at Universal to your office, which doesn't exist.

Like mother, like daughter, right??!! :wink:

[Lavinia]

I'm not fluent in pot, but I don't believe it brings out the killer in most.

JMO

:laugh: Only for a bag of Doritos.

[gaelicpeas]

OK refresh me here, did Cindy see the bag of garbage or the pizza box while the car was still at the tow yard, or does she know nothing about this when George drives the car into the garage? If she didn't know about it, how could she say it was the pizza?We have no record of whether George told Cindy there was a pizza box in the trunk, so who knows...

[Imperfect4]

I'm not fluent in pot, but I don't believe it brings out the killer in most.

JMO

lol.

I think he probably meant maybe she just wanted to get high before doing the deed. Sort of like a hit of "cannibas courage" (playing off "liquid courage" ... get it?).

[Lavinia]

Someone was nice enough yesterday to post the list of things taken from the house in that first search warrant.

But to answer your question, no, we don't know what they saw at the dump site that sent them right to the house to secure it while they got a search warrant. Would that be SOP in any case?

I don't know if finding the body gave them probable cause for a further search or what, but they took off for that house with a mission in mind, IMO. It was like finding her body tied up a loose end for them. :shrug:

[crimeq]

I swear they're gonna need us at the trial to bring up some of these things, lol. (Maybe they can pay for our rental house? :sneaky:)

I think we should go for it :biggrin: We'll have this figured out before the trial, they won't even need the trial! We can go on LKL and the Early Show and explain it all, and get trips and limos and crab puffs.

[apothecary]

I am pretty sure the paper towels were in the bag of trash that the towyard manager tossed into the dump and LE recovered. Therefore, Cindy had no chance to "clean" them.
Did that bag also have the maggots?

[~jomomma~]

OK refresh me here, did Cindy see the bag of garbage or the pizza box while the car was still at the tow yard, or does she know nothing about this when George drives the car into the garage? If she didn't know about it, how could she say it was the pizza?

you know, i don't know.

what gets me is

cindy: it's the pizza, george, right? huh? it's the pizza, isn't it george. :sneaky:

george: yeah....it's the pizza :bored:

when both of them know what it is.

[bchand]

Like mother, like daughter, right??!! :wink:

Yes sunstar, that was my exact point.

[gaelicpeas]

Did that bag also have the maggots?yes, I believe they sent off several maggot "pupae" for analysis.

[Unleashed]

:laugh: Only for a bag of Doritos.

Or pork rinds and twinkies :laugh:

jmo

[sunstar]

Denial has always worked for Cindy. She didn't want to get into the particulars; she was trying to line up Jesse as the father, at which time she'd continue to claim that she really didn't know. So at the wedding, she simply denied. She still had her master plan to make it all better, and frankly, I don't think she cares at all what the family or anyone thinks of her. I believe she had established a script for Casey to follow (that she was following too) and had everything worked out to "fix" the situation. And she probably would have said something to Casey like, don't say anything to anyone, deny if it comes up, I'll take care of it.

I do think Cindy would have found out past the first trimester, though, because I believe an abortion would have been had if it wasn't too late.

I agree, and especially with the last part. MOO

[Lavinia]

I think we should go for it :biggrin: We'll have this figured out before the trial, they won't even need the trial! We can go on LKL and the Early Show and explain it all, and get trips and limos and crab puffs.

Now you're talking, lol. :thumbsup:

[crimeq]

We have no record of whether George told Cindy there was a pizza box in the trunk, so who knows...

But it couldn't have happened the way he said it did, as soon as he pulled the car into the garage, right after saying it smelled like a dead body in the car ... Cindy couldn't have attributed it to pizza. So they must have had conversation to "fix" the cause of that odor.

[imc_e]

you know, i don't know.

what gets me is

cindy: it's the pizza, george, right? huh? it's the pizza, isn't it george. :sneaky:

george: yeah....it's the pizza :bored:

when both of them know what it is.

That was part of the script.

I don't think its what really was said.

[Lavinia]

Or pork rinds and twinkies :laugh:

jmo

If they ever get around to it, lol.

[Unleashed]

lol.

I think he probably meant maybe she just wanted to get high before doing the deed. Sort of like a hit of "cannibas courage" (playing off "liquid courage" ... get it?).

Gotcha.

My apologies, DT, our fearless NODA leader.:tonguewag:

jmo

[sunstar]

I'm not fluent in pot, but I don't believe it brings out the killer in most.

JMO

The psychiatrist guest on Nancy's show said this appears to be a "rage killing" with the many layers of duct tape. Doesn't marijuana make someone more "mellow"? :shrug: MOO

[haveaniceday]

Did that bag also have the maggots?

Geraldo is going to discuss the case shortly

[aproudmom]

Crud! I'm using Time-Warner and don't see it. :cursing:

Lav it is not the greatest movie but so shocked she could watch a movie of a serial killer..and the worse thing is duct tape was used over someones mouth...I am not sure when this movie or movies came out but I just wonder if she watched them before the night of the 16th all it says is 2008

[Mamie]

OK refresh me here, did Cindy see the bag of garbage or the pizza box while the car was still at the tow yard, or does she know nothing about this when George drives the car into the garage? If she didn't know about it, how could she say it was the pizza?

This is just supposition on my part, here, but maybe George told her that there was a bag of trash, including the pizza box in the bag (and he supposed there was pizza in it) but the tow guy grabbed it and threw it away for George. So when she says what died, and he'd told her about it, then she comes back with that the smell was from the "pizza, right?" JMO

[Imperfect4]

It is my belief that Casey has witheld Caylee before, used her as leverage. I believe that is what Lee was talking about when he asks her 'is this like last time?'. I think Cindy thought Casey set up the whole thing to unite the family. At least that is what I took from this statement she made last July 21st.

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/7/20/caylee_last_spoke_with_mother_tuesday.html

“Her plan was to get us all back together, and I think her plan has changed and I think that's what happened,” said Cindy Anthony. “Her plan changed halfway through, and she doesn't know where it’s at right now. I truly believe Casey knows who has Caylee but it's code name. That's why they can't find that person just yet.”


moo

Interesting.

My initial reaction is Cindy was trying to put a heroic spin on Casey's behavior.

These people played so many games with one another, and lied so often, they had no clue what the others were thinking, feeling, or doing.

[gaelicpeas]

But it couldn't have happened the way he said it did, as soon as he pulled the car into the garage, right after saying it smelled like a dead body in the car ... Cindy couldn't have attributed it to pizza. So they must have had conversation to "fix" the cause of that odor.We don't have any record of George and Cindy's conversations prior to arriving at their home, unfortunately.. so who knows...

[gaelicpeas]

The psychiatrist guest on Nancy's show said this appears to be a "rage killing" with the many layers of duct tape. Doesn't marijuana make someone more "mellow"? :shrug: MOO
I seriously don't think Casey killed Caylee because she was high on pot. Makes ZERO sense, IMO.

[Lavinia]

The psychiatrist guest on Nancy's show said this appears to be a "rage killing" with the many layers of duct tape. Doesn't marijuana make someone more "mellow"? :shrug: MOO

It's not something you would usually think of to motivate yourself to do *anything*, but maybe watch The Home Shopping Network with the sound turned off and music on, and eat ice-cream and tacos. And Cheetos. And chocolate. And the leftovers from Tues. Night dinner. Rinse, repeat.

[Imperfect4]

I don't know if finding the body gave them probable cause for a further search or what, but they took off for that house with a mission in mind, IMO. It was like finding her body tied up a loose end for them. :shrug:

Ooooh. Well, now I'm back to Wendy Murphy's blog about all the evidence we don't know about.

[Mamie]

I believe it is APM. (I just checked my HBO's and don't see it. :confused:)

It's on SEDG.

[gaelicpeas]

Interesting.

My initial reaction is Cindy was trying to put a heroic spin on Casey's behavior.

These people played so many games with one another, and lied so often, they had no clue what the others were thinking, feeling, or doing.I agree.. that is a very bizarre conversation that Cindy was having. Who knows what she meant....

[sunstar]

Geraldo is going to discuss the case shortly

That's what I've been staying up waiting for! :smile:

[Imperfect4]

I seriously don't think Casey killed Caylee because she was high on pot. Makes ZERO sense, IMO.

I don't think anyone's suggesting that. This started with discussion of the paper towels found in the trunk -- the ones containing grave wax. They also tested positive for THC and canni-something or other.

[Mamie]

I seriously don't think Casey killed Caylee because she was high on pot. Makes ZERO sense, IMO.

I agree------I could see her smoking it afterward, but not before. JMO

[gaelicpeas]

It's not something you would usually think of to motivate yourself to do *anything*, but maybe watch The Home Shopping Network with the sound turned off and music on, and eat ice-cream and tacos. And Cheetos. And chocolate. And the leftovers from Tues. Night dinner. Rinse, repeat.lol.. my thoughts exactly...

[Unleashed]

If they ever get around to it, lol.

Later, duuuuude.:cool:

[sunstar]

It's not something you would usually think of to motivate yourself to do *anything*, but maybe watch The Home Shopping Network with the sound turned off and music on, and eat ice-cream and tacos. And Cheetos. And chocolate. And the leftovers from Tues. Night dinner. Rinse, repeat.

:lol: I love your explanation!!

[Lavinia]

Ooooh. Well, now I'm back to Wendy Murphy's blog about all the evidence we don't know about.

Yeah, remember they seemed to take more interest in the sunglasses collection and footwear for some reason. Or at least that's what stuck out to me.

[gaelicpeas]

Ooooh. Well, now I'm back to Wendy Murphy's blog about all the evidence we don't know about.Well, they had the Winnie the Pooh blanket.. and they had the garbage bags with the yellow ties.. and the laundry hamper/bag... and the duct tape with the Henkel logo.. LOTS of things tied back to the house, IMO.

[CelticDawn]

OK refresh me here, did Cindy see the bag of garbage or the pizza box while the car was still at the tow yard, or does she know nothing about this when George drives the car into the garage? If she didn't know about it, how could she say it was the pizza?

Did he call her while driving home with the car? or did she call him?
How did she know to ask if it was "the pizza'?.....

IIRC she wasn't at the tow yard

Another thing that confuses me is that george SAID that he saw the bag but did the tow yard attendant actually see the contents of the trunk?
IF he did not, then there is nobody to corroborate the contents of the trunk EXCEPT GEORGE. and Cindy upon the return to the house.

[Imperfect4]

That was part of the script.

I don't think its what really was said.

I think we may be officially going insane, sitting here trying to figure out things based on what a group of lying liars said. :scared:

[Lavinia]

I don't think anyone's suggesting that. This started with discussion of the paper towels found in the trunk -- the ones containing grave wax. They also tested positive for THC and canni-something or other.

Cannabinoids. Compounds present in pot, IIRC.

[gaelicpeas]

I don't think anyone's suggesting that. This started with discussion of the paper towels found in the trunk -- the ones containing grave wax. They also tested positive for THC and canni-something or other.Personally, I will be very surprised if these paper towels mean anything. AFAIK, ALL of that trash was from TonE's apartment (thus the THC)... I personally think this is a red herring. JMO

[aproudmom]

The psychiatrist guest on Nancy's show said this appears to be a "rage killing" with the many layers of duct tape. Doesn't marijuana make someone more "mellow"? :shrug: MOO

I am not a pro or anything but no Marijuana would not cause someone to kill you either laugh and act stupid or your very mellow and enjoying your buzz..then the munchies kick in..or so I have been told

[joolz]

I don't think anyone's suggesting that. This started with discussion of the paper towels found in the trunk -- the ones containing grave wax. They also tested positive for THC and canni-something or other.

Belated greetings, sleuths - sun hasn't set here yet and I'm just trying to catch up quickly (before True Blood).

I checked out the THC and canni-whatever because it made me curious when I was reading the autopsy. From what I could tell (not great at ferreting through science-speak), both of those substances are products of hemp that would just come from the breakdown of the paper towels, not the drug products of hemp. Of course, I could be absolutely wrong, but that was my impression. :confused:

[Lavinia]

Well, they had the Winnie the Pooh blanket.. and they had the garbage bags with the yellow ties.. and the laundry hamper/bag... and the duct tape with the Henkel logo.. LOTS of things tied back to the house, IMO.

But at the time I remember them going for the house, I don't believe her body was excavated yet. That had to be a very slow, methodical procedure with the anthropologist and the people mapping, bagging evidence, photos etc. I don't know how they could have gotten much info from what was IN the bag for a while, but that's just my crazy head talking. Maybe I'm thinking they got to the house that day to do the SW much earlier than they did.

[gaelicpeas]

I think we may be officially going insane, sitting here trying to figure out things based on what a group of lying liars said. :scared:Very good point.. we cannot believe ANYthing the Anthonys have said, IMO.

[Mamie]

I think we may be officially going insane, sitting here trying to figure out things based on what a group of lying liars said. :scared:

LMAO----and so right!

[djmsmom]

On Geraldo they are saying that the duct tape could have been placed after death to keep the mouth closed, as they do in funeral homes.

[Imperfect4]

Well, they had the Winnie the Pooh blanket.. and they had the garbage bags with the yellow ties.. and the laundry hamper/bag... and the duct tape with the Henkel logo.. LOTS of things tied back to the house, IMO.

I'm not sure how much of that was known at the time they secured the A's home. I think they were over at the house literally within minutes of their arrival at the recovery site.

[CelticDawn]

Belated greetings, sleuths - sun hasn't set here yet and I'm just trying to catch up quickly (before True Blood).

I checked out the THC and canni-whatever because it made me curious when I was reading the autopsy. From what I could tell (not great at ferreting through science-speak), both of those substances are products of hemp that would just come from the breakdown of the paper towels, not the drug products of hemp. Of course, I could be absolutely wrong, but that was my impression. :confused:

You will NOT get any kind of a semi-measurable amount of THC from any paper towel unless it was drenched in resin from a marijuana plant....and a potent healthy one at that...cannibas and its derivatives are not going to be produced from the breakdown of paper products ...and paper towels are pretty much well-processed paper products...

[gaelicpeas]

But at the time I remember them going for the house, I don't believe her body was excavated yet. That had to be a very slow, methodical procedure with the anthropologist and the people mapping, bagging evidence, photos etc. I don't know how they could have gotten much info from what was IN the bag for a while, but that's just my crazy head talking. Maybe I'm thinking they got to the house that day to do the SW much earlier than they did.LE had been in the Anthony house before. My guess is that SOMEthing at the remains site triggered a memory of something.. probably the Winnie the Pooh blanket is my best guess... but who knows...

[Dick Tracy]

I'm not fluent in pot, but I don't believe it brings out the killer in most.

JMO

Doesnt' anyone remember those early government flicks, showing how dangerous pot was? That you smoked it, and you started turning into a wolfman? Or crazed psycho? Maybe all that propoganda had a little truth to it, hmm? Of course, my DAD told me about those early shorts of video!

[sunstar]

Dr. Baden is in the studio with Geraldo talking about the autopsy report and the duct tape around Caylee's head. Now LKB is also there promoting their book. Judge Larry Seidlin is there too. :biggrin: Judge is saying it will be tough to get an impartial jury, the evidence will be devastating against the defendant. He is also saying the civil case needs to be stayed until the criminal trial is over. Geraldo asking Judge Seidlin about other cases where the DP has been sought against a mother who killed her child. Judge is suggesting the defense think about entering a plea to a lesser charge. :scared: LKB is talking about the duct tape and almost saying part of the defense will be challenging the tape was over Caylee's mouth at death. She's also saying DNA should be on the tape. Geraldo talking about Kronk finding Caylee's body. Judge Seidlin is saying Kronk changes his story almost as much as the defendant. Geraldo saying Casey's promiscuous lifestyle will be considered by the jury.

[imc_e]

I think we may be officially going insane, sitting here trying to figure out things based on what a group of lying liars said. :scared:

So lets throw everything out that any of the Anthonys have said, and stick with the facts. :biggrin:

[aproudmom]

I don't think anyone's suggesting that. This started with discussion of the paper towels found in the trunk -- the ones containing grave wax. They also tested positive for THC and canni-something or other.

if it came from his home and they smoked in there would it not give the napkin a contact buzz..sorry had to say it..but really I have been around people who smoked it and it stays on their clothes and hair..

[Imperfect4]

Yeah, remember they seemed to take more interest in the sunglasses collection and footwear for some reason. Or at least that's what stuck out to me.

Oh, yes! Good thought! This is another example. Nothing we've read about from the dump site had anything to do with sunglasses or Caylee's footwear (in fact, we've wondered about whether shoes and socks were found with the remains). Yet LE was interested in those items at the A's home. :sneaky:

[Lavinia]

Cannibinoid resin is high in terpenes. Was it on the outside of Casey's car that had terpene?

[joolz]

You will NOT get any kind of a semi-measurable amount of THC from any paper towel unless it was drenched in resin from a marijuana plant....and a potent healthy one at that...cannibas and its derivatives are not going to be produced from the breakdown of paper products ...and paper towels are pretty much well-processed paper products...

Thank you! I was right when I said I wasn't fluent in science-speak!:biggrin:

[Imperfect4]

if it came from his home and they smoked in there would it not give the napkin a contact buzz..sorry had to say it..but really I have been around people who smoked it and it stays on their clothes and hair..

Yep, my guess is the paper towels were in Tony's apartment. Or, Casey was smoking dope in her car.

[Imperfect4]

So lets throw everything out that any of the Anthonys have said, and stick with the facts. :biggrin:

Okay! You start! :w00t:

[sunstar]

GR calling Casey another **** like Amanda Knox.

I wonder how comfortable LKB was sitting there between Judge Seidlin's comments and Geraldo saying that! :scared:

[Mamie]

OMG-----Judge Seidlin!!!

[Lavinia]

Doesnt' anyone remember those early government flicks, showing how dangerous pot was? That you smoked it, and you started turning into a wolfman? Or crazed psycho? Maybe all that propoganda had a little truth to it, hmm? Of course, my DAD told me about those early shorts of video!

Reefer Madness. We used to go to the midnight movies and watch Monterrey Pop, Woodstock, Reefer Madness, Chech and Chong movies etc. :biggrinjester::hat: It made me turn into a Lavinia. :scared:

[seeing_eye]

I need some help here on the timeline. Casey is 7 months pregnant and clearly she is seeing Jesse, because tried to pin the paternity on him (and it was determined he met her after she was already pregnant?).

It has never made sense to me that Cindy, a nurse, didn't know that Casey was pregnant. Even if Casey didn't tell her, Cindy would pick that up.

What if ... Cindy was fully aware that Casey was pregnant and told her to keep quiet about it (not tell the family, friends, etc. but DENY it) because Cindy was in her "fixer mode" and was going to find a father for that baby--and there's Jesse, and they go for him full-throttle until Richard Grund steps in and suggests a paternity test.

Then Cindy has to come up with another story, so we have the "dead" father.

Was Cindy actually trying to clean up that latest mess of Casey's, like she always covered up for Casey's messes -- just like she is doing now?

I think she knew full well that Casey was pregnant and she went into her normal mode to "fix it" and save Casey.

Sound familiar?

This sounds very plausible to me. Cindy's pattern throughout Casey's life seems to have been to fix all the predicaments Casey ever got herself into.

[Unleashed]

Doesnt' anyone remember those early government flicks, showing how dangerous pot was? That you smoked it, and you started turning into a wolfman? Or crazed psycho? Maybe all that propoganda had a little truth to it, hmm? Of course, my DAD told me about those early shorts of video!

Chill, fearless leader. I pollygized!
And no, I'm not even old enough to know what video is. Is that like records or 8-tracks or something? :tonguewag:

JMO

[Lavinia]

I'm not sure how much of that was known at the time they secured the A's home. I think they were over at the house literally within minutes of their arrival at the recovery site.

Good! Someone else has that memory, too! That's sure the way it felt to me.

[Lavinia]

On Geraldo they are saying that the duct tape could have been placed after death to keep the mouth closed, as they do in funeral homes.

Oh for Pete's sake. Casey wasn't planning on a viewing. That's the only reason they do that at the funeral home. (Not fussing at you, djmsmom, lol.)

[imc_e]

Okay! You start! :w00t:


Ok, here goes.

Casey duct taped and murdered Caylee in cold blood, then threw her away like garbage in trash bags.

Then she went and watched a movie and got laid.

[Imperfect4]

You will NOT get any kind of a semi-measurable amount of THC from any paper towel unless it was drenched in resin from a marijuana plant....and a potent healthy one at that...cannibas and its derivatives are not going to be produced from the breakdown of paper products ...and paper towels are pretty much well-processed paper products...

So ... you're saying that first she soaked the paper towels in a healthy, wet marijuana plant, and then they somehow came in contact with Caylee's dead body? :confused:

Or what? I'm confused.

http://www.clickorlando.com/download/2009/0619/19801996.pdf
page 7, under "1. Paper towels"

[Lavinia]

LE had been in the Anthony house before. My guess is that SOMEthing at the remains site triggered a memory of something.. probably the Winnie the Pooh blanket is my best guess... but who knows...

That was one of my first thoughts that day gaelicpeas. It was almost like they saw something and thought, "Oh, so that's what that means (at the house)!"

[kanzz]

I'm not fluent in pot, but I don't believe it brings out the killer in most.

JMO

and I'd agree with you 100%. In fact, my guess is that it would have just the opposite effect. Ya think you wanna kill somebody? smoke a little weed and mellow the heII out!