Wednesday May 20th

[carlybarly]

Sorry I couldn't wait for a new thread to be opened, and usually at this time no one is posting on the previous one.

First, please let us get something, ANYTHING from LE today on Haleigh! Better yet, let Haleigh come home today!!!

[carlybarly]

Ok now, a few questions here to start with. Answers are probably buried somewhere in previous threads but it is to much to dig through.

What time did Haleigh come home from school that day?

How long was she home before Ron went to work?

And has it definitely been confirmed that Misty is the one that picked up Haleigh from the bus stop?

When does the time line start? Before or after Ron goes to work? Is LE satisfied, from what we hear, that she was alive when Ron went to work?

[?noanswer]

Ok now, a few questions here to start with. Answers are probably buried somewhere in previous threads but it is to much to dig through.

What time did Haleigh come home from school that day?

How long was she home before Ron went to work?

And has it definitely been confirmed that Misty is the one that picked up Haleigh from the bus stop?

When does the time line start? Before or after Ron goes to work? Is LE satisfied, from what we hear, that she was alive when Ron went to work?

As far as I know none of the above has been confirmed by LE. JMO

[carlybarly]

Thanks noanswer, I don't recall answers to these questions either, but then again I could have missed them.

[panache]

Ok now, a few questions here to start with. Answers are probably buried somewhere in previous threads but it is to much to dig through.

What time did Haleigh come home from school that day?

How long was she home before Ron went to work?

And has it definitely been confirmed that Misty is the one that picked up Haleigh from the bus stop?

When does the time line start? Before or after Ron goes to work? Is LE satisfied, from what we hear, that she was alive when Ron went to work?

Great questiona Carly and ones that I have myself.

Thanks for starting the thread for today. Its been 3 months, 1 week, and 3 days since Haleigh disappeared.

Now, one question you asked that seems to have some ambiguity, is, if Misty did pick Haleigh up at the bus stop, and some feel that she did, there are witness's who say she drove in the opposite direction of Hermit's Cove, and did not return to the MH. If that's true, where did she go? I think the time line needs to begin with when Haleigh got off that bus.

moo

[?noanswer]

I just checked the Caylee thread. Yesterday there were 29 pages, 1,151 posts, and 20,946 views.

Before Haleigh's thread was closed there were 10/11 pages of posts. The 2nd one that was started had 3 pages, 96 posts and 1,250 views.

Why does one precious child generate so much more attention than another? I guess the whole fiasco of the Anthony clan, plus the fact that it was not long before LE released information on the case could be part of it. In Haleigh's case, most everything is left to speculation and after the custody issue came up, it seems there are two sides and never the twain shall meet. I can't understand how posters can become entrenched in a view without much of anything except rumors to base that view upon. JMO

[panache]

It appears the body found at the landfill is of a male. Could it be Chad?

http://www.wesh.com/news/19506069/detail.html

[panache]

I just checked the Caylee thread. Yesterday there were 29 pages, 1,151 posts, and 20,946 views.

Before Haleigh's thread was closed there were 10/11 pages of posts. The 2nd one that was started had 3 pages, 96 posts and 1,250 views.

Why does one precious child generate so much more attention than another? I guess the whole fiasco of the Anthony clan, plus the fact that it was not long before LE released information on the case could be part of it. In Haleigh's case, most everything is left to speculation and after the custody issue came up, it seems there are two sides and never the twain shall meet. I can't understand how posters can become entrenched in a view without much of anything except rumors to base that view upon. JMO

What I find interesting comparing the two cases is some who are vociferous about the Anthony case seem to feel indifferance towards Misty's behavior in this case. It seems even LE is befuddled about Misty, so its not just me.

moo

[?noanswer]

It appears the body found at the landfill is of a male. Could it be Chad?

http://www.wesh.com/news/19506069/detail.html

I guess it could be him just as well as anyone else at this point. Seems these days people disappear and noone even cares enough to report them. I guess maybe those are people that have lost all contact with anyone who cares. It does seem suspicious tho being that the body ended up in a landfill. Don't think anyone would go there and lay down and die. IIRC there was some information/rumor? that CR had left a message that he was in a dumpster.
Said people were looking for recycables. Said probably brought in Tues./Wed. Proably not CR If brought in that recently. JMO

[Scampi]

I tend to agree with you Pan. Those of us following the casey anthony case realized right away there was something very wrong when she began lying to LE.

In the cummings case, we see the exact same thing wrong, misty lying about the timeline and ronald backing her up to the extent of marrying her.

Very disturbing. imo.

[?noanswer]

What I find interesting comparing the two cases is some who are vociferous about the Anthony case seem to feel indifferance towards Misty's behavior in this case. It seems even LE is befuddled about Misty, so its not just me.

moo

I don't know what LE considers inconsistent in Misty's timeline, but at this point there is not enough other information from LE for me to come to a definite conclusion. JMO

[?noanswer]

I tend to agree with you Pan. Those of us following the casey anthony case realized right away there was something very wrong when she began lying to LE.

In the cummings case, we see the exact same thing wrong, misty lying about the timeline and ronald backing her up to the extent of marrying her.

Very disturbing. imo.

What if Misty does not remember enough to come up with a timeline. I don't know what part LE considers inconsistent, but IF she was in a deep sleep, she may not remember anymore than she has told them. JMO

[panache]

I don't know what LE considers inconsistent in Misty's timeline, but at this point there is not enough other information from LE for me to come to a definite conclusion. JMO

You might disagree but I can list a few that LE may have trouble with.

1. If she drove away from the MH as some say, where did she go?

2. What exactly was Haleigh wearing when she put her to bed? Misty does say she covered her with a sheet. Surely she noticed what Haleigh was wearing.

3. Why has her story run the gamut from who was sleeping in what bed, to her latest, that Haleigh slept alone.

4. Did she leave the MH at any time during that evening?

I can think of a few more, but that's for starters.

moo

[CC I See]

I tend to agree with you Pan. Those of us following the casey anthony case realized right away there was something very wrong when she began lying to LE.

In the cummings case, we see the exact same thing wrong, misty lying about the timeline and ronald backing her up to the extent of marrying her. Very disturbing. imo.

It also doesn't help that the family is so connected to everyone else in that small town. People are afraid to come forward to say what they know because if justice is never served, they still have to live and work there. This includes LE as well. I think that they have been backed into a corner and do not know how to get out of it.

[HouseOfClark]

What if Misty does not remember enough to come up with a timeline. I don't know what part LE considers inconsistent, but IF she was in a deep sleep, she may not remember anymore than she has told them. JMO

But she's never said, in any media interview, that she doesn't remember.

She has the evening down pat.

I don't believe it's that she doesn't remember, I believe it's more that she doesn't want to admit certain things. Most likely, in my opinion, is that it was she who left the back door propped open.

[?noanswer]

You might disagree but I can list a few that LE may have trouble with.

1. If she drove away from the MH as some say, where did she go?

2. What exactly was Haleigh wearing when she put her to bed? Misty does say she covered her with a sheet. Surely she noticed what Haleigh was wearing.

3. Why has her story run the gamut from who was sleeping in what bed, to her latest, that Haleigh slept alone.

4. Did she leave the MH at any time during that evening?

I can think of a few more, but that's for starters.

moo

The one thing that could make a difference in what happened would be if she left the home. But if she was gone and something happened then, she still might know what or when it happened. I do wish she could/would tell LE enough for them to take the next step in solving this mystery. If LE's problem is something other than the timeline, then the other things you mentioned above could come into play. JMO

[?noanswer]

But she's never said, in any media interview, that she doesn't remember.

She has the evening down pat.

I don't believe it's that she doesn't remember, I believe it's more that she doesn't want to admit certain things. Most likely, in my opinion, is that it was she who left the back door propped open.

Her leaving the back door is something I also consider possible. Why she would not at least say that it was possible that she did that I don't know. If the other people reported to be there were there, then they could have unlocked the door, especially if there were some children there. JMO

[?noanswer]

Okay I have been away for a few days but when was all of this said? everything I have seen with the exceptions of unfounded rumors, have said that Ron picked Haleigh up, she kissed him goodbye, told him she would see him later, then he went to work. When did all this change? TIA

IIRC, it changed when Cobra started his "investigation". He interviewed some people who supposedly gave him this information. As far as I know, LE has not released any information pertaining to this. JMO

[?noanswer]

With the exception of the shirt though, how do we know exactly what she told investigators about the other things?

That's it, we don't know. Even Misty said she saw the shirt and pointed it out to LE. AFIK LE has not released any info as to how the shirt was found. So who knows how the shirt discovery came about. The only info I remember about LE and the shirt is that the description of what Haleigh was wearing was changed. JMO

[titanfan217]

It appears the body found at the landfill is of a male. Could it be Chad?

http://www.wesh.com/news/19506069/detail.html

You're up bright & early this morning.

I'm only saying I'm up. Grandson still hasn't figured out that he doesn't have to catch his early bus and could sleep in.

How far was the body found from Putnam Cny? How far from where Chad was last seen?

[?noanswer]

I agree. If she was not there, she needs to tell them like YESTERDAY! If she wasn't drinking or drugging that day, (only the weekend) would she even know the difference of being exhausted, passed out?

One would think that she would want to clear up whatever it is LE is confused about. I can't understand her not doing that. JMO

[?noanswer]

I wonder who these people were that just happened to see her pick up Haleigh? I also wonder, even if Misty is the one who picked her up, why would Ron lie about being the one. At that point, Haleigh was still alive and well so what difference would it have made of who picked her up?
If this is the time that something happened to Haleigh, I don't see Ron, or either grandmother lying for Misty at this point.

It is very confusing. If we only knew what LE knew instead of what other people are reporting, then maybe it would be more clear. TJH said they should be releasing more information today that "they" have discovered. One would think he was the director of the FBI, when he talks about "their" investigation. Sun. when Cobra was on blogger radio, he gave the name of the person who said that Misty picked up Haleigh. He was also talking about a wife of someone who is helping out with children in need. There was a video of an interview with a woman that cares for children and was providing food for Cobra. They did not release her name, but there was a name identifying the video. For some reason something Cobra said made me think the woman was the wife of the man that said Misty picked Haleigh up at the bus stop. Can't remember exactly what it was, tho. JMO

[panache]

It also doesn't help that the family is so connected to everyone else in that small town. People are afraid to come forward to say what they know because if justice is never served, they still have to live and work there. This includes LE as well. I think that they have been backed into a corner and do not know how to get out of it.

You bring up a good point CC, one I have thought of myself. I'm optimistic that the lead detective has been replaced now will help move this case forward.

moo

[titanfan217]

Her leaving the back door is something I also consider possible. Why she would not at least say that it was possible that she did that I don't know. If the other people reported to be there were there, then they could have unlocked the door, especially if there were some children there. JMO

Good point.

I've been following the case near St Louis where the mommy & 2 sons were strangled. Someone on NG made the comment that the open window was a clue that it was staged.

[CANDYKISSES]

Scampi, the other reason for the large number of posts on the Caylee board may be that there is so much more information to discuss. We have so little here, and over there something new pops up daily. IMO

Adding to that the idea of this board generating many rumors with no proof IN MY OPINION and at least the Caylee board has earnest research with back-up to support offered on most of the allegations. :sad: for Haleigh tho.

:wub:Praying for Haleigh Cummings.

[Scampi]

It also doesn't help that the family is so connected to everyone else in that small town. People are afraid to come forward to say what they know because if justice is never served, they still have to live and work there. This includes LE as well. I think that they have been backed into a corner and do not know how to get out of it.


Good point CC! I would love to learn that the appointment of the new Detective assigned was the result of an internal investigation in to police misconduct. Fresh eyes on a case is always a very good thing, imo.

[grammie/va]

Good point.

I've been following the case near St Louis where the mommy & 2 sons were strangled. Someone on NG made the comment that the open window was a clue that it was staged.

OT but just a quick ? has there been a thread started about this case, I have been following it also

[grammie/va]

OT but just a quick ? has there been a thread started about this case, I have been following it also

OOPS I just found it in current crimes, I was looking in wrong place

[titanfan217]

Good point.

I've been following the case near St Louis where the mommy & 2 sons were strangled. Someone on NG made the comment that the open window was a clue that it was staged.


Breaking news so I'll quote myself.

The dad has been arrested and charged.

[FallenAngel♥]

IMO TJH's a blow hard....He said he would have some news to break today and THIS is all we get?


http://www.thesky973.com/pages/4014463.php

[carlybarly]

I have been following that case, too. We need a thread for it. The husband has been arrested and charged with three counts of murder.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/05/19/illinois.slaying.arrests/index.html?eref=ib_topstories

I've been following that too. I think in that one, he tried too hard for his alibi and that was a BIG clue from the start. At least that is the impression I got from the very beginning.

[panache]

You're up bright & early this morning.

I'm only saying I'm up. Grandson still hasn't figured out that he doesn't have to catch his early bus and could sleep in.

How far was the body found from Putnam Cny? How far from where Chad was last seen?

Hi titan

Sorry it took so long to respond. How's that grandson of your doing?

Oclawaha is where Chad disappeared from, which is in Marion county. Looks like on the map it could be near Leesburg.

Where the remains were found , (Volusia) is on the central east coast near Daytona.

moo

[FallenAngel♥]

I have been following that case, too. We need a thread for it. The husband has been arrested and charged with three counts of murder.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/05/19/illinois.slaying.arrests/index.html?eref=ib_topstories

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?t=353038

[sleuth]

But she's never said, in any media interview, that she doesn't remember.

She has the evening down pat.

I don't believe it's that she doesn't remember, I believe it's more that she doesn't want to admit certain things. Most likely, in my opinion, is that it was she who left the back door propped open.

In one of Misty's first interviews, she was asked why some of her story changed, her reply was " I don't know" She offered no reason or denied the change.
What Haleigh was wearing had to be changed on the Amber alert right after it was put out. As far as Caylee goes ( God Bless her precious llittle heart) I personally am not interested in how many candy bars Casey bought or what her attorney says. When justice is being served I will be glued to the tube but until then my prayers and attention are with this little girl " that might have a glimmer of hope being found alive" It is my hope that LE knows more than we are being told. MPHO I love this board it helps me keep up with what is happening.

[panache]

I have been following that case, too. We need a thread for it. The husband has been arrested and charged with three counts of murder.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/05/19/illinois.slaying.arrests/index.html?eref=ib_topstories

They keep coming and coming, don't they? Just this week, it makes two families wiped out. Its getting to be an epidemic.

[panache]

In one of Misty's first interviews, she was asked why some of her story changed, her reply was " I don't know" She offered no reason or denied the change.
What Haleigh was wearing had to be changed on the Amber alert right after it was put out. As far as Caylee goes ( God Bless her precious llittle heart) I personally am not interested in how many candy bars Casey bought or what her attorney says. When justice is being served I will be glued to the tube but until then my prayers and attention are with this little girl " that might have a glimmer of hope being found alive" It is my hope that LE knows more than we are being told. MPHO I love this board it helps me keep up with what is happening.

Great post sleuth! I so agree, Haleigh needs all the media attention right now. There is always hope.

[?noanswer]

IMO TJH's a blow hard....He said he would have some news to break today and THIS is all we get?


http://www.thesky973.com/pages/4014463.php

I thought someone said he was on JVM last night and was agreeing with Ron not wanting the A's around. Anyone see that and what did he say? He also says in that article that the A's were there to support CS. I thought that vigil/meeing was arranged by KFN and they were they as reps of KFN. JMO

[panache]

I thought someone said he was on JVM last night and was agreeing with Ron not wanting the A's around. Anyone see that and what did he say? He also says in that article that the A's were there to support CS. I thought that vigil/meeing was arranged by KFN and they were they as reps of KFN. JMO

Here's Jane transcript, you can read for yourself what TJ said. I agree with you that the A's were reps of KFN. If Ron truly wanted to attend a vigil, he had other options. There was one held in Leesburg that was held without the Anthony's.

It was great to read that Art is joining Jane's show.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0905/19/ijvm.01.html

moo

[Peaches]

anything is possible. KWIM?Good morning!Yes...........anything is possible.This is because we do not have many FACTS.........only RUMORS!

[?noanswer]

I read that it was arranged by Michelle Bart and she extended an invitation to Crystal and Marie. As I understand it, they did not know the Anthony's were going to be there.


Doesn't MB work for KFN? JMO

[panache]

OT...

Yet another case with alleged suspects arrested.

So many more to solve.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/2009/05/20/tori-stafford.html

[Peaches]

YVW. Um.....where are the other 47 of you?


Lizziegirl, thank you for the laugh!

BTW.........good to see everyone here today!

Hopefully, it will be the day Haleigh comes home.....:wub:

[bookie]

Here's Jane transcript, you can read for yourself what TJ said. I agree with you that the A's were reps of KFN. If Ron truly wanted to attend a vigil, he had other options. There was one held in Leesburg that was held without the Anthony's.

It was great to read that Art is joining Jane's show.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0905/19/ijvm.01.html

moo


I must be missing something. I don't see anything about TJ Hart or Art in that transcript. She has 3 paragraphs where she talks about it but no commentary from anyone.

[carlybarly]

I must be missing something. I don't see anything about TJ Hart or Art in that transcript. She has 3 paragraphs where she talks about it but no commentary from anyone.

I don't see anything either bookie.

[?noanswer]

Here's Jane transcript, you can read for yourself what TJ said. I agree with you that the A's were reps of KFN. If Ron truly wanted to attend a vigil, he had other options. There was one held in Leesburg that was held without the Anthony's.

It was great to read that Art is joining Jane's show.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0905/19/ijvm.01.html

moo

I didn't see anything about TJH. Maybe it was on HLN. The thread for most of yesterday is gone, so I can't check them. Thank you anyway. JMO

[FallenAngel♥]

Doesn't MB work for KFN? JMO

YES.......and i think everyone knows how i feel about KFN :cursing:

[FallenAngel♥]

I must be missing something. I don't see anything about TJ Hart or Art in that transcript. She has 3 paragraphs where she talks about it but no commentary from anyone.

TJH wasn't on last night. He was on during the day yesterday and YES he agreed the A's should not have been there.

[panache]

TJH called in during Prime News yesterday. Do they have transcripts?

No they don't FA. I guess that's where I heard about what TJ said and read elsewhere. JVM's transcript last night was not about Haleigh. I did read a transcript of JVM with Art which must have been from last week.

Sorry for the confusion. I'm doing too many things at once.

[FallenAngel♥]

No they don't FA. I guess that's where I heard about what TJ said and read elsewhere. JVM's transcript last night was not about Haleigh. I did read a transcript of JVM with Art which must have been from last week.

Sorry for the confusion. I'm doing too many things at once.

No worries Pan,..i'm the Queen of mess ups

[panache]

No worries Pan,..i'm the Queen of mess ups

Thanks, appreciate you understanding.

[Owlface]

But she's never said, in any media interview, that she doesn't remember.

She has the evening down pat.

I don't believe it's that she doesn't remember, I believe it's more that she doesn't want to admit certain things. Most likely, in my opinion, is that it was she who left the back door propped open.

EXACTLY. Misty can't get her story straight not because she doesn't remember or she's too stupid to understand the questions put to her. She doesn't want to tell the truth about the events of that evening because there are certain things/activities she doesn't want to admit. Therefore her story doesn't track. Even an 8 year old could recite factually the events of a previous evening.

[Owlface]

I wonder who these people were that just happened to see her pick up Haleigh? I also wonder, even if Misty is the one who picked her up, why would Ron lie about being the one. At that point, Haleigh was still alive and well so what difference would it have made of who picked her up?
If this is the time that something happened to Haleigh, I don't see Ron, or either grandmother lying for Misty at this point.

I don't see Ron lying for her at all. I do see her lying for Ron, though, hence the reward marriage.

[FallenAngel♥]

Well i have a stupid question for everyone that feels like Misty and Ron were involved.........

Do you not believe what Jr said about the black man wearing all black with squeeky shoes that took his sissy? or do you think Ron and Misty told Jr to say that?

[Mimi428]

What if Misty does not remember enough to come up with a timeline. I don't know what part LE considers inconsistent, but IF she was in a deep sleep, she may not remember anymore than she has told them. JMO

I might be misunderstanding your post, but I don't think for one second that LE has asked her to explain what she was doing while she was sleeping. I don't think they expect her to provide any explanation for what anyone ELSE was doing while she was sleeping.

I think the problem is that she started with one set of so-called 'facts' of what happened that evening & night - & then she was provided with information that directly contradicted what she said. Or it was pointed out to her that what she related as being factual had, in truth, too many logical fallacies to believe (main one being that she went to sleep on the same mattress that Haleigh was on).

I don't think it is a matter of she can't remember. I think it is a matter of she can't keep her stories straight & had no logical explanation for why the details changed.

JMO

[panache]

Well i have a stupid question for everyone that feels like Misty and Ron were involved.........

Do you not believe what Jr said about the black man wearing all black with squeeky shoes that took his sissy? or do you think Ron and Misty told Jr to say that?

I don't believe Ron and Misty told Junior to say that at all. I do believe Junior said something, it could have been a play on words he overheard, but he wasn't coached by anyone.

Now since we are asking questions, what makes you so sure that Ron is totally innocent of having anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance? I think you feel differently about Misty, so I won't include her in my question. Honestly, I would really be interested in seeing the other side of this, something, I'm just not seeing.

moo

[bookie]

I don't see Ron lying for her at all. I do see her lying for Ron, though, hence the reward marriage.



Lying for Ron how? We know from LE that Ron's alibi of being at work was confirmed. We also know from LE that they are satisfied with his account of the hours in question.

And for those of you who doubt GGM Sykes was at the home that night ask yourself why LE's timeline is based on her being at the home. Evidently they have information that puts GGM Sykes where she says she was.

We also know from LE that Misti is the one who can't account for her time. They have focused on her from early on.

And since you (general) seem to believe Art Harris you can also add in that Ron was at his job his entire shift according to coworkers. He never left, even eating dinner in the cafeteria according to them. Also according to Art the "seen on video at 2:30" isn't true. He was very vocal that that was gossip awhile back.

LE also stated in an interview on HLN that a neighbor saw Haleigh playing after Ron left for work which tells me she wasn't hurt. IMO for Ron to have done something to her that would have caused her death she would not have been playing outside.

[panache]

Lying for Ron how? We know from LE that Ron's alibi of being at work was confirmed. We also know from LE that they are satisfied with his account of the hours in question.

And for those of you who doubt GGM Sykes was at the home that night ask yourself why LE's timeline is based on her being at the home. Evidently they have information that puts GGM Sykes where she says she was.

We also know from LE that Misti is the one who can't account for her time. They have focused on her from early on.

And since you (general) seem to believe Art Harris you can also add in that Ron was at his job his entire shift according to coworkers. He never left, even eating dinner in the cafeteria according to them. Also according to Art the "seen on video at 2:30" isn't true. He was very vocal that that was gossip awhile back.

LE also stated in an interview on HLN that a neighbor saw Haleigh playing after Ron left for work which tells me she wasn't hurt. IMO for Ron to have done something to her that would have caused her death she would not have been playing outside.

Two things you stated I question bookie.

#1 Its been said the convenience store has a video of Ron at that store at 2:30am. Now I realize LE has not confirmed this, but consider the possiblity it does exist.

#2 The neighbor who claims they saw Haleigh playing after Ron left for work has never been identified. Again, without proof there is such a neighbor, don't we have to consider that the dreaded word around these parts is rumor.

moo

[bookie]

Why hasn't le cleared him then?

jmo




They haven't "cleared" anyone but he is the only one they have gone on record about. They haven't said they know Crystal was at her home that night.

[bookie]

Two things you stated I question bookie.

#1 Its been said the convenience store has a video of Ron at that store at 2:30am. Now I realize LE has not confirmed this, but consider the possiblity it does exist.

#2 The neighbor who claims they saw Haleigh playing after Ron left for work has never been identified. Again, without proof there is such a neighbor, don't we have to consider that the dreaded word around these parts is rumor.

moo



The only one claiming the video is Cobra and he isn't credible imo.

The a/c repairman hasn't been identified but we know he was there. And no, it's not a rumor. Schauland is the one who said a neighbor saw Haleigh. Anything coming from the police isn't rumor.

[panache]

They haven't "cleared" anyone but he is the only one they have gone on record about. They haven't said they know Crystal was at her home that night.

I'm going to ask you the same question I asked FA if you don't mind. I really would like to understand your position. What makes you so sure that Ron is totally uninvolved in Haleigh's disappearance? What do you see that I fail to see? I'm not asking for argument sake, but I do like to view both sides.

[panache]

The only one claiming the video is Cobra and he isn't credible imo.

The a/c repairman hasn't been identified but we know he was there. And no, it's not a rumor. Schauland is the one who said a neighbor saw Haleigh. Anything coming from the police isn't rumor.

Any idea where I can view Schauland's statement about the neighbor?

[Owlface]

Lying for Ron how? We know from LE that Ron's alibi of being at work was confirmed. We also know from LE that they are satisfied with his account of the hours in question.

And for those of you who doubt GGM Sykes was at the home that night ask yourself why LE's timeline is based on her being at the home. Evidently they have information that puts GGM Sykes where she says she was.

We also know from LE that Misti is the one who can't account for her time. They have focused on her from early on.

And since you (general) seem to believe Art Harris you can also add in that Ron was at his job his entire shift according to coworkers. He never left, even eating dinner in the cafeteria according to them. Also according to Art the "seen on video at 2:30" isn't true. He was very vocal that that was gossip awhile back.

LE also stated in an interview on HLN that a neighbor saw Haleigh playing after Ron left for work which tells me she wasn't hurt. IMO for Ron to have done something to her that would have caused her death she would not have been playing outside.

Bolding mine - if this is all that matters, why haven't they cleared Ron?

If Misty had anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance in a manner that didn't include Ron there is no way Ron would have acted in the manner he did toward her. IMHO

[dustyk]

I'm going to ask you the same question I asked FA if you don't mind. I really would like to understand your position. What makes you so sure that Ron is totally uninvolved in Haleigh's disappearance? What do you see that I fail to see? I'm not asking for argument sake, but I do like to view both sides.
I think he was at work...He looks too smug when he states he was at work. I do think he knows where Haleigh is and this was all for donations. I looked at the video when Greta was interviewing RC and Misty and Misty does not seem to want to be in that interview at all. The way she says "I am" when he tells her to look at the camera, she seems irritated. The today Show interview was just as bad when she looked at him for answers. JMO

[Owlface]

Two things you stated I question bookie.

#1 Its been said the convenience store has a video of Ron at that store at 2:30am. Now I realize LE has not confirmed this, but consider the possiblity it does exist.

#2 The neighbor who claims they saw Haleigh playing after Ron left for work has never been identified. Again, without proof there is such a neighbor, don't we have to consider that the dreaded word around these parts is rumor.

moo

For whatever reason I have never put much stock in this neighbor who saw Ron after he "went to work". It's never been established just exactly when Ron went to work, so I'd like to hear more details on how neighbor knew Ron was "at work" when they saw Haleigh playing in the yard.

[bookie]

I'm going to ask you the same question I asked FA if you don't mind. I really would like to understand your position. What makes you so sure that Ron is totally uninvolved in Haleigh's disappearance? What do you see that I fail to see? I'm not asking for argument sake, but I do like to view both sides.


He was at work when Haleigh disappeared, police have verified that. He was a single father working to support 2 small children without child support for the last year. When Haleigh first disappeared Crystal tripped over herself telling everyone how much he loved his children and would never hurt Haleigh. It wasn't until her mother started slinging mud that he became abusive according to Crystal.

I don't see an abusive father. I see a jerk who had problems in his life but he stood up and took care of his kids. He may not have been the ideal father but he did his best and that is a he!! of a lot more than we can say for a lot of men.

I don't buy the claims that all of these family members on Crystal's side watched him abuse his kids and sat back and did nothing. I've seen women make false claims of abuse. I've known women who did it. I don't close my eyes to the possibility that Crystal made those half hearted claims in the custody suit so that she didn't lose custody. When it didn't work she sat back and quit fighting for custody. And like the women tipsters in this case she made some calls to DCF imo hoping to get Ron in trouble out of spite.

[Owlface]

I'm going to ask you the same question I asked FA if you don't mind. I really would like to understand your position. What makes you so sure that Ron is totally uninvolved in Haleigh's disappearance? What do you see that I fail to see? I'm not asking for argument sake, but I do like to view both sides.

I really, sincerely, would like to hear the answer to this also. It seems so obvious to me he's involved but I'm open to something concrete on the other side.

[bookie]

Any idea where I can view Schauland's statement about the neighbor?


He said it on Mike Galanos show on HLN. There are no transcripts but it was discussed here back when he said it.

[bookie]

Bolding mine - if this is all that matters, why haven't they cleared Ron?

If Misty had anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance in a manner that didn't include Ron there is no way Ron would have acted in the manner he did toward her. IMHO


Why haven't they cleared Crystal? Chad? Teresa Neves? I don't know why they haven't cleared anyone officially but imo they have unofficially cleared Ron when they verified his alibi and said they were satisfied with his account of the hours in question.

[Owlface]

He was at work when Haleigh disappeared, police have verified that. He was a single father working to support 2 small children without child support for the last year. When Haleigh first disappeared Crystal tripped over herself telling everyone how much he loved his children and would never hurt Haleigh. It wasn't until her mother started slinging mud that he became abusive according to Crystal.

I don't see an abusive father. I see a jerk who had problems in his life but he stood up and took care of his kids. He may not have been the ideal father but he did his best and that is a he!! of a lot more than we can say for a lot of men.

I don't buy the claims that all of these family members on Crystal's side watched him abuse his kids and sat back and did nothing. I've seen women make false claims of abuse. I've known women who did it. I don't close my eyes to the possibility that Crystal made those half hearted claims in the custody suit so that she didn't lose custody. When it didn't work she sat back and quit fighting for custody. And like the women tipsters in this case she made some calls to DCF imo hoping to get Ron in trouble out of spite.

Bolded to address - I would like to see a link for this. As far as I know LE has never said at what time they believe Haleigh disappeared.

[Owlface]

Why haven't they cleared Crystal? Chad? Teresa Neves? I don't know why they haven't cleared anyone officially but imo they have unofficially cleared Ron when they verified his alibi and said they were satisfied with his account of the hours in question.

As far as I know they haven't cleared me either. To me it makes about as much sense to have to clear me as it is to have to clear Crystal, Chad etc.

[dustyk]

He was at work when Haleigh disappeared, police have verified that. He was a single father working to support 2 small children without child support for the last year. When Haleigh first disappeared Crystal tripped over herself telling everyone how much he loved his children and would never hurt Haleigh. It wasn't until her mother started slinging mud that he became abusive according to Crystal.

I don't see an abusive father. I see a jerk who had problems in his life but he stood up and took care of his kids. He may not have been the ideal father but he did his best and that is a he!! of a lot more than we can say for a lot of men.

I don't buy the claims that all of these family members on Crystal's side watched him abuse his kids and sat back and did nothing. I've seen women make false claims of abuse. I've known women who did it. I don't close my eyes to the possibility that Crystal made those half hearted claims in the custody suit so that she didn't lose custody. When it didn't work she sat back and quit fighting for custody. And like the women tipsters in this case she made some calls to DCF imo hoping to get Ron in trouble out of spite.

I'll have to respectfully agree to disagree here. Did he take care of his kids or did he have teenagers doing that. Better yet teenagers he was sleeping with and doing drugs with. Why would she want to get Ron in trouble she had had it with him.I've seen more women that have been abused than those that make false claims. After what he told LE about his stupid B girlfriend it is obvious he does verbally abuse women, and physical usually follows. IMO

[bookie]

As far as I know they haven't cleared me either. To me it makes about as much sense to have to clear me as it is to have to clear Crystal, Chad etc.


You aren't LE. It's their job to clear EVERYONE, including people you think may not be involved.

[panache]

He said it on Mike Galanos show on HLN. There are no transcripts but it was discussed here back when he said it.

I'm not doubting you bookie, but its odd that Schuland would commit to such a statement, LE has been so closed mouth.

Well I'm not too keen on Schauland right now. For him to say on that interview that * life goes on*, turned me off. Life will not *go on* for the loved ones of Haleigh until she is found. Their life is at a standstill


moo

[E-U-R]

It appears the body found at the landfill is of a male. Could it be Chad?

http://www.wesh.com/news/19506069/detail.html

well at first I thought OMG he wa in the dumpster but then it said that they think the body was brought in more recently like last week so I don't know... seems like Fl has a lot of dead bodies popping up lately

[bookie]

I'll have to respectfully agree to disagree here. Did he take care of his kids or did he have teenagers doing that. Better yet teenagers he was sleeping with and doing drugs with. Why would she want to get Ron in trouble she had had it with him.I've seen more women that have been abused than those that make false claims. After what he told LE about his stupid B girlfriend it is obvious he does verbally abuse women, and physical usually follows. IMO


Using your logic any parent who has a child in daycare isn't raising them, the daycare centers are.

Ask the women who phoned in tips to LE (in this case) to get their exes in trouble why they did it? They were done with their exes.

[bookie]

I'm not doubting you bookie, but its odd that Schuland would commit to such a statement, LE has been so closed mouth.

Well I'm not too keen on Schauland right now. For him to say on that interview that * life goes on*, turned me off. Life will not *go on* for the loved ones of Haleigh until she is found. Their life is at a standstill


moo



I disagree with you. Their lives aren't at a standstill. They are missing a part of themselves but their lives do go on. They still have Jr to raise.

[panache]

well at first I thought OMG he wa in the dumpster but then it said that they think the body was brought in more recently like last week so I don't know... seems like Fl has a lot of dead bodies popping up lately

LOL...Fla seems to have a lot of everything these days. Their traffic must be a mess with all the car wrecks just in the Cummings/Sheffield families alone. :biggrin:

[Scampi]

I'm not doubting you bookie, but its odd that Schuland would commit to such a statement, LE has been so closed mouth.

Well I'm not too keen on Schuland right now. For him to say on that interview that * life goes on*, turned me off. Life will not *go on* for the loved ones of Haleigh until she is found. Their life is at a standstill


moo

I agree with you Pan, this is an awful statement for someone in law enforcement to make, imo. Ranks right up there with the boneheaded comment that many of the tips were from disgruntled exwives. I am rapidly losing faith in some of these policemen down in Satsuma.

[bookie]

Bolding Mine
Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe daycare workers are given a thorough background check and/or need to pass a drug test.

jmo




That wasn't the point. The point was that millions of parents in this country rely on someone (daycare, babysitter, nanny, family member) to watch their children while they work. Using the logic posted none of those parents are taking care of their kids, someone else is.

[dustyk]

Using your logic any parent who has a child in daycare isn't raising them, the daycare centers are.

Ask the women who phoned in tips to LE (in this case) to get their exes in trouble why they did it? They were done with their exes.
Don't know about day care...never used them, and that information about getting ex's in trouble could very well have been exaggerated, I do hope they were investigated though.JMO

[panache]

Using your logic any parent who has a child in daycare isn't raising them, the daycare centers are.

Ask the women who phoned in tips to LE (in this case) to get their exes in trouble why they did it? They were done with their exes.

What's the exe's got to do with daycare?

Never mind, its just not worth a reply.

But I will say this. If Ron was gainfully employed these past years, then it wasn't Ron who had the day to day care of these youngsters. I think Teresa and Granny Sykes had the responsibilty of caring for them a good sense of the time. Not criticising Ron for working he had to earn a living, but he was very lucky to have family willing to help. Not to mention, he also had time for a social life it seems, meeting Amber and then Misty. So, in other words the quantity of time Ron had these children was far less than Teresa and Sykes.

moo

[panache]

Don't know about day care...never used them, and that information about getting ex's in trouble could very well have been exaggerated, I do hope they were investigated though.JMO

dusty, your in my head. The first time LE made that statement about ex's, I shook myself in astonishment. There may have been one or two, but certainly not the numbers alluded to. That was ridiculous.

moo

[bookie]

What's the exe's got to do with daycare?

Never mind, its just not worth a reply.

But I will say this. If Ron was gainfully employed these past years, then it wasn't Ron who had the day to day care of these youngsters. I think Teresa and Granny Sykes had the responsibilty of caring for them a good sense of the time. Not criticising Ron for working he had to earn a living, but he was very lucky to have family willing to help. Not to mention, he also had time for a social life it seems, meeting Amber and then Misty. So, in other words the quantity of time Ron had these children was far less than Teresa and Sykes.

moo



The exes had nothing to do with daycare which is why they were in 2 seperate sentences.

The pictures of Ron with his children show he was a hands on dad. He went fishing/swimming with them, brushed teeth with them, was right there on the flor with haleigh when she was getting a breathing treatment. He walked haleigh to the bus on her first day of school.

[dustyk]

The exes had nothing to do with daycare which is why they were in 2 seperate sentences.

The pictures of Ron with his children show he was a hands on dad. He went fishing/swimming with them, brushed teeth with them, was right there on the flor with haleigh when she was getting a breathing treatment. He walked haleigh to the bus on her first day of school.
Really....There were pictures of Lacy and Scott Peterson looking happy but we know what happened there. Pictures are only a second in time, and abusers are not always constant abusers.JMO

[bookie]

dusty, your in my head. The first time LE made that statement about ex's, I shook myself in astonishment. There may have been one or two, but certainly not the numbers alluded to. That was ridiculous.

moo



How in the world can you say that? You weren't manning the phones were you? And why in the world would police lie about that? What would it gain them.

[bookie]

Really....There were pictures of Lacy and Scott Peterson looking happy but we know what happened there. Pictures are only a second in time, and abusers are not always constant abusers.JMO



And people who claim abuse aren't always abused at all.

[panache]

The exes had nothing to do with daycare which is why they were in 2 seperate sentences.

The pictures of Ron with his children show he was a hands on dad. He went fishing/swimming with them, brushed teeth with them, was right there on the flor with haleigh when she was getting a breathing treatment. He walked haleigh to the bus on her first day of school.

LOL... I just knew those photos were going to be brought up. I could bring many family photos here from cases covered on IS, and any of them would look like the Brady Family, untill ...........it was a dark and windy night.

Photographs are not proof . Google John List. Great family photos.

moo

[bookie]

Casey Anthony had pictures with Caylee that portrayed her to be a stellar mom as well. Pictures do not always depict the truth in a childs life, imo.


Caylee Anthony never looked happy in most of the pictures I saw. Her eyes didn't sparkle like Haleigh's did. Caylee always looked sad and old for her age to me.

[dustyk]

And people who claim abuse aren't always abused at all.

but ignoring abuse claims can be fatal. JMO

[bookie]

LOL... I just knew those photos were going to be brought up. I could bring many family photos here from cases covered on IS, and any of them would look like the Brady Family, untill ...........it was a dark and windy night.

Photographs are not proof . Google John List. Great family photos.

moo



I didn't say they were proof of anything more than Ron being a hands on dad.

Remind me not to answer the next time you ask for an opinion. All you do is use it to ridicule and play games.

[dustyk]

I didn't say they were proof of anything more than Ron being a hands on dad.

Remind me not to answer the next time you ask for an opinion. All you do is use it to ridicule and play games.
The hands on is what worries me....JMO

[E-U-R]

Well i have a stupid question for everyone that feels like Misty and Ron were involved.........

Do you not believe what Jr said about the black man wearing all black with squeeky shoes that took his sissy? or do you think Ron and Misty told Jr to say that?

I am pretty sure that he did say it and if it turns out that he was coached into saying it then the fact that he supposedly told crystal this info makes me think that ron and misty did put that idea in his head to try and mislead LE and when it turned up unbelievable they put the blame of the story on crystal making it up... i think that because they were so quick to not believe it and blame crystal for making it up...JMO

[dustyk]

I am pretty sure that if he did say it and after he was interviewed by a child specialist then there would have been some sort of statement that LE was looking for a BM as a POI.... the fact that he supposedly told crystal this info makes me think that ron and misty did put that idea in his head to try and mislead LE and when it turned up unbelievable they put the blame of the story on crystal making it up... i think that because they were so quick to not believe it and blame crystal for making it up...JMO
Or......just maybe.....Rc had a black male friend come in to take Haleigh and they split the donations. He had a perfect alibi.JMO

[panache]

I didn't say they were proof of anything more than Ron being a hands on dad.

Remind me not to answer the next time you ask for an opinion. All you do is use it to ridicule and play games.

I wasn't playing games bookie. i was truly looking for something you see that I don't. I thought you had other reasons besides those photos.

Sorry if I upset you, but I resent you telling me I was game playing. I hope someone else who shares your opinion will respond to my question without using the photos as proof.

moo

[Mimi428]

Really....There were pictures of Lacy and Scott Peterson looking happy but we know what happened there. Pictures are only a second in time, and abusers are not always constant abusers.JMO

And many of them prefer to keep up an outer appearance to the rest of the world that they are a happy family unit. Not to mention the vast majority of them would not allow pictures to be taken of them abusing their spouse or children.

If all it took to ascertain the truth was to look at a smiling picture of the perp with the victim, there are a whole lot of folks who would not be in jail right now, convicted of murdering the people they swore they loved.

JMO

[FallenAngel♥]

I don't believe Ron and Misty told Junior to say that at all. I do believe Junior said something, it could have been a play on words he overheard, but he wasn't coached by anyone.

Now since we are asking questions, what makes you so sure that Ron is totally innocent of having anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance? I think you feel differently about Misty, so I won't include her in my question. Honestly, I would really be interested in seeing the other side of this, something, I'm just not seeing.

moo

pan,...I've changed how i feel about Ron in the past few weeks. I do not think that he's TOTALLY innocent. I think Misty did something, what i'm not sure but now i think Ron knows something. What he knows i don't know.......

Then again maybe Ron did something. Honestly i'm so confused :(

[dustyk]

So many thoughts go through my head on this case. Did Misty go to her brothers house after she picked up Haleigh from the bus stop...Did something happen over there and she told Misty that she would tell her dad about it and that person came in and took her before Ronald got home and misty was truly asleep or not there, or is this really staged for donations. It had to have been someone that new about the door and was bold enough to turn on the light. I hope that Ronald didn't hurt this child. JMO

[E-U-R]

Or......just maybe.....Rc had a black male friend come in to take Haleigh and they split the donations. He had a perfect alibi.JMO

anything is possible i just found it so strange that they were so quick to dismiss JR's story right off the bat... even if my ex was a total liar and she told me that our child said he saw who did it i would have said oh great what did he say lets go get the guy... i would not have immediately dismissed it... if for no other reason just at the thought of hope... and this would just further their position that it was not them in fact it was some black guy so why wouldn't they want that story to ring true... just seems illogical to dismiss it off the bat like ron did

[Mimi428]

And people who claim abuse aren't always abused at all.

True.

What, in your estimation, is the ratio? That is, if we take 100 claims of abuse, how many would you (roughly) estimate to be false claims?

I'm not talking about gossip or accusations thrown around in times of disagreement or divorce - I am talking about calls where LE gets involved, shows up at the house, somebody gets arrested & goes to jail & then later on has to go to court over it.

You say you have known females who make false accusations of abuse. I believe you. I have also known females who made false accusations of abuse.

But if I took 100 cases where abuse has been alleged, I would say that my experience has been that around 10 -15 were false accusations. The rest were false DENIALS - people who swore up & down & sideways, 'oh no, I didn't do it, s/he's a liar, s/he made it up, it wasn't that way at all. Welllllll, maybe I did push her, but not that hard. OK, well I may have hit her, but it was only one slap. Ohhhhh h#ll, you can't count THAT, she was raggin' my azz for 30 minutes & I just got sick of hearing it, it's not like I just hauled off & punched her for no reason'

Always an excuse. Always a rationalization. Always a denial. THAT'S the stuff I have seen & I saw it WAAAAAAAAY more times than I ever saw outrightly false accusations.

JMO

[Peaches]

EXACTLY. Misty can't get her story straight not because she doesn't remember or she's too stupid to understand the questions put to her. She doesn't want to tell the truth about the events of that evening because there are certain things/activities she doesn't want to admit. Therefore her story doesn't track. Even an 8 year old could recite factually the events of a previous evening.



Misty is uneducated but that in no way makes her "stupid."

[Owlface]

pan,...I've changed how i feel about Ron in the past few weeks. I do not think that he's TOTALLY innocent. I think Misty did something, what i'm not sure but now i think Ron knows something. What he knows i don't know.......

Then again maybe Ron did something. Honestly i'm so confused :(

Come on over to the dark side FA. You'll see that it's not at all about what Crystal did or didn't do 5 years ago but about the events the preceding days before Haleigh disappeared.

[Owlface]

pan,...I've changed how i feel about Ron in the past few weeks. I do not think that he's TOTALLY innocent. I think Misty did something, what i'm not sure but now i think Ron knows something. What he knows i don't know.......

Then again maybe Ron did something. Honestly i'm so confused :(

Sorry to quote you twice. The thing about Misty being the one who did something - I can't buy Ron being the bystander to Misty's actions -if he ever suspected she did something to Haleigh she would be long gone.

[FallenAngel♥]

Come on over to the dark side FA. You'll see that it's not at all about what Crystal did or didn't do 5 years ago but about the events the preceding days before Haleigh disappeared.

Owl, this case is about a precious little girl that's missing. It's not about a good side and bad side. I trust NO ONE in this case. Every adult has let a child down.

MOO

[Owlface]

anything is possible i just found it so strange that they were so quick to dismiss JR's story right off the bat... even if my ex was a total liar and she told me that our child said he saw who did it i would have said oh great what did he say lets go get the guy... i would not have immediately dismissed it... if for no other reason just at the thought of hope... and this would just further their position that it was not them in fact it was some black guy so why wouldn't they want that story to ring true... just seems illogical to dismiss it off the bat like ron did

They dismissed Jr.'s story because they knew what happened to Haleigh that night.

[FallenAngel♥]

Sorry to quote you twice. The thing about Misty being the one who did something - I can't buy Ron being the bystander to Misty's actions -if he ever suspected she did something to Haleigh she would be long gone.

Yep and i do agree.

[FallenAngel♥]

They dismissed Jr.'s story because they knew what happened to Haleigh that night.

Shouldn't they have just went along with the lie ( if it was a lie ) though so it took the heat off of them?

[E-U-R]

about who picked her up at the bus stop... if it were misty ron would lie and say it was him... he went to court with crystal and brought up the fact that sh ewas too lazy to drive the kids to the doctors... he would not admit now that he was too lazy to pick up haleigh from the bus stop so he had his underage GF w/o license do it for him...
question about the van was it misty's or chelsea's i know it belonged to chelsea but whenever it was talked about by chelsea she talked as tho it was misty's...
if it was misty who picked them up was it i the van or ron's purple car? If she was seen driving the other direction could it have been to chelsea's doesn't her niece or nephew take the same bus as HC could she have been bringing the other kid home?
would ron actually let her drive his purple car.. seems to me that people with cool purple cars might not let their gf drive them... i don't doubt he would let her drive hid kids around but i find it hard to believe he would let her drive his cool purple car

[panache]

pan,...I've changed how i feel about Ron in the past few weeks. I do not think that he's TOTALLY innocent. I think Misty did something, what i'm not sure but now i think Ron knows something. What he knows i don't know.......

Then again maybe Ron did something. Honestly i'm so confused :(

You know what I like about you FA. You say the first thing that's on your mind, and sometimes that's a good thing. Its no wonder you vacillate back and forth, I think we all do to some extent. I think its because we don't want to think of the horror that someone who loved and cared deeply for Haleigh could ever do this.

I'd like to think that horror didn't happen, its why I asked, what do some see in Ron that I have failed to see.

moo

[Owlface]

Shouldn't they have just went along with the lie ( if it was a lie ) though so it took the heat off of them?

I've thought about this. I think they made a knee-jerk reaction to dismiss what Jr. said because they knew what the truth was. Upon reflection I believe they may have kicked themselves when they realized going along with it may have worked to their advantage.

[FallenAngel♥]

You know what I like about you FA. You say the first thing that's on your mind, and sometimes that's a good thing. Its no wonder you vacillate back and forth, I think we all do to some extent. I think its because we don't want to think of the horror that someone who loved and cared deeply for Haleigh could ever do this.

I'd like to think that horror didn't happen, its why I asked, what do some see in Ron that I have failed to see.

moo

Pan,..i know i'm a simple minded mother of four and yes i know i wear rose colored glasses most of the time ..........but sometimes that makes life easier for me. and yes you are correct, i don't want to believe a parent would hurt their child :(

[bookie]

True.

What, in your estimation, is the ratio? That is, if we take 100 claims of abuse, how many would you (roughly) estimate to be false claims?

I'm not talking about gossip or accusations thrown around in times of disagreement or divorce - I am talking about calls where LE gets involved, shows up at the house, somebody gets arrested & goes to jail & then later on has to go to court over it.

You say you have known females who make false accusations of abuse. I believe you. I have also known females who made false accusations of abuse.

But if I took 100 cases where abuse has been alleged, I would say that my experience has been that around 10 -15 were false accusations. The rest were false DENIALS - people who swore up & down & sideways, 'oh no, I didn't do it, s/he's a liar, s/he made it up, it wasn't that way at all. Welllllll, maybe I did push her, but not that hard. OK, well I may have hit her, but it was only one slap. Ohhhhh h#ll, you can't count THAT, she was raggin' my azz for 30 minutes & I just got sick of hearing it, it's not like I just hauled off & punched her for no reason'

Always an excuse. Always a rationalization. Always a denial. THAT'S the stuff I have seen & I saw it WAAAAAAAAY more times than I ever saw outrightly false accusations.

JMO


I posted a link a couple of weeks ago that had the percentage of false claims as high as 70% to 75% in divorcing couples. Granted Ron and Crystal weren't married but it's the same principal.

[E-U-R]

Sorry to quote you twice. The thing about Misty being the one who did something - I can't buy Ron being the bystander to Misty's actions -if he ever suspected she did something to Haleigh she would be long gone.

this is just a scenario NOT A RUMOR...
what if misty gets home that morning they fight over wbg and ron punches her in the back of the head (just like crystal claimed he had done to her) they continue to brawl and misty now has a concussion which is why ron actually does pick up haleigh from the bus that day and not misty like usual... misty is wiped out from partying and now has a concussion and ron know she shouldn't be leaving the kids with her because she is not up to par but does it anyways...
whatever happens while he is at work... skip ahead
haleigh is now "missing"
he does not think misty herself does it and doesn't know what happened but he knows it his fault...
now it's hitting the fan he doesn't want his bad parenting skills/judgement to come out and now effect his custody of junior ( he did make the statement that he just wants his kids, strange since only one was missing and the future custody drama hadn't even come into play at that point)so he apologizes to misty and trumps everything up to she was just sleeping...
misty keeps repeating i don't know because she doesn't know and even more so doesn't know what ron wants her to say...
just a possibility and IMO Ron knows for a fact he is guilty of something just exactly what is the part that we don't know and might never know

[Mimi428]

I posted a link a couple of weeks ago that had the percentage of false claims as high as 70% to 75% in divorcing couples. Granted Ron and Crystal weren't married but it's the same principal.

I'm not talking about people in divorce court. I think I made that pretty plain in my post. I'm talking about life circumstances outside of divorce court (or child custody hearings).

When LE cannot clear the people who LIVED IN THE SAME HOUSE as Haleigh, that is significant to me.

Not clearing every other person on the planet is irrelevant compared to that.

I believe Marc Klaas & maybe John Walsh spoke about that problem in this case. I think they are qualified to know just how difficult LE's job is when they cannot do that. You may think it is pertinent that LE has not come out & declared "we have cleared Crystal, Marie, Chad...", but I don't believe that has even 1/10th of the importance as the fact that LE has not come out & declared "we have cleared Misty & Ron".

JMO

[HouseOfClark]

They dismissed Jr.'s story because they knew what happened to Haleigh that night.

The same way they dismissed Crystal's possible involvement when questioned by police. They stated up front that it was NOT a custody dispute.

IIRC, Marc Klass was the first suspect in Polly's disappearance because he and his wife were going through a divorce and Marc no longer lived in the home.

I tend to agree with your opinion that they dismiss these things because they know better.

[panache]

anything is possible i just found it so strange that they were so quick to dismiss JR's story right off the bat... even if my ex was a total liar and she told me that our child said he saw who did it i would have said oh great what did he say lets go get the guy... i would not have immediately dismissed it... if for no other reason just at the thought of hope... and this would just further their position that it was not them in fact it was some black guy so why wouldn't they want that story to ring true... just seems illogical to dismiss it off the bat like ron did

Good Point. I appreciate the male point of view.

[Mimi428]

I've thought about this. I think they made a knee-jerk reaction to dismiss what Jr. said because they knew what the truth was. Upon reflection I believe they may have kicked themselves when they realized going along with it may have worked to their advantage.

ITA - it would have absolutely worked to their advantage. Misty & Ron were the ones promoting from the get-go that someone must have come into the house.

But when Crystal reports that Junior supported their story - that someone WAS in the house, they sneered & denigrated it. I think they were more interested at that moment in trying to negate anything from Crystal & her family.

JMO

[E-U-R]

True.

What, in your estimation, is the ratio? That is, if we take 100 claims of abuse, how many would you (roughly) estimate to be false claims?

I'm not talking about gossip or accusations thrown around in times of disagreement or divorce - I am talking about calls where LE gets involved, shows up at the house, somebody gets arrested & goes to jail & then later on has to go to court over it.

You say you have known females who make false accusations of abuse. I believe you. I have also known females who made false accusations of abuse.

But if I took 100 cases where abuse has been alleged, I would say that my experience has been that around 10 -15 were false accusations. The rest were false DENIALS - people who swore up & down & sideways, 'oh no, I didn't do it, s/he's a liar, s/he made it up, it wasn't that way at all. Welllllll, maybe I did push her, but not that hard. OK, well I may have hit her, but it was only one slap. Ohhhhh h#ll, you can't count THAT, she was raggin' my azz for 30 minutes & I just got sick of hearing it, it's not like I just hauled off & punched her for no reason'

Always an excuse. Always a rationalization. Always a denial. THAT'S the stuff I have seen & I saw it WAAAAAAAAY more times than I ever saw outrightly false accusations.

JMO

I agree with your post except I don't understand why you would ask Bookie her estimate...
I can tell you a scenario...
by the time you are getting physically hit then most likely you have already been beaten down mentally to the point where you don't call the cops... either because you have seen cases where it did happen and the woman was not believed or because you believe you deserve it,and when that happens it's not always that you deserve it because you are the worthless loser that he says you are but sometimes it's that you believe you deserve it for putting your self in that situation in the first place... like well it's my own fault that I am with such a loser like him. The latter is actually a good reason because it helps you to raise yourself up and actually leave the loser (like IMO crystal did) So you cut your ties try to minimize the loss (her kids) and move on for self preservation. Then when you are strong enough you tell people and their response 9 out of 10 times is yeah right then why didn't you call the cops and the simple answer is because I thought I deserved it... it happens all the time and these days "false" allegations usually are true.. there is a difference between unprovable and false... and by the time you realize that you are worth it usually the evidence has healed... unless you are lucky enough to have scars

[FallenAngel♥]

The same way they dismissed Crystal's possible involvement when questioned by police. They stated up front that it was NOT a custody dispute.

IIRC, Marc Klass was the first suspect in Polly's disappearance because he and his wife were going through a divorce and Marc no longer lived in the home.

I tend to agree with your opinion that they dismiss these things because they know better.

they said MK and his ex wife were not suspects after just a few days after they took a LDT. I wonder why no one has been cleared in this case.

[bookie]

I'm not talking about people in divorce court. I think I made that pretty plain in my post. I'm talking about life circumstances outside of divorce court (or child custody hearings).

When LE cannot clear the people who LIVED IN THE SAME HOUSE as Haleigh, that is significant to me.

Not clearing every other person on the planet is irrelevant compared to that.

I believe Marc Klaas & maybe John Walsh spoke about that problem in this case. I think they are qualified to know just how difficult LE's job is when they cannot do that. You may think it is pertinent that LE has not come out & declared "we have cleared Crystal, Marie, Chad...", but I don't believe that has even 1/10th of the importance as the fact that LE has not come out & declared "we have cleared Misty & Ron".

JMO



In this case the abuse claims are from an ex. That is why statistics involving divorce are pertinent despite you thinking they aren't.

IMO Crystal is the angry ex who lost custody and made false accusations hoping to get custody back and cause problems for her ex.

[panache]

HLN just ran the story about Ron's lawyers distancing themselves from the Anthony's at the vigil.

My question is, if Ron didn't want to be associated with the Anthony's and therefore didn't attend the vigil, why didn't he attend the Duckett's vigil? Nothing in the presser about that.

moo

I asked that question earlier.

Here's TJ's version now.

Marie and Crystal didn't know the A's were attending.

Kim P was with them

This vigil was held nationally including Leesburg, an easy drive for Ron, without the presence of the A's to disturb him.

http://www.bloggernews.net/120960

[Owlface]

In this case the abuse claims are from an ex. That is why statistics involving divorce are pertinent despite you thinking they aren't.

IMO Crystal is the angry ex who lost custody and made false accusations hoping to get custody back and cause problems for her ex.

I'm curious if you think these false abuse claims have any relevance to Haleigh's "disappearance?" I'm not being snarky, I'm just curious.

[E-U-R]

I posted a link a couple of weeks ago that had the percentage of false claims as high as 70% to 75% in divorcing couples. Granted Ron and Crystal weren't married but it's the same principal.

I would love to see that link and who determines that statistic... how can you prove something didn't happen... more like the woman couldn't "prove" it did happen so it is determined it didn't (since you do need proof) and thus gets called false claims...

my ex boyfriend beat the hell out of me.. out of nowhere over 10 years ago (and i mean nowhere we had never even had an arguement prior to that but he was drunk that night and i appearantly pissed him off)... I was in shock to say the least and never told the police or anyone else except my best friend... so would you say that now since i would have no proof that it is a false claim or that it didn't happen

[bookie]

I'm curious if you think these false abuse claims have any relevance to Haleigh's "disappearance?" I'm not being snarky, I'm just curious.



Haleigh's disappearance isn't the only issue involved in this case. Crystal, Marie and Kim P decided to bring child abuse into it.

[Mimi428]

In this case the abuse claims are from an ex. That is why statistics involving divorce are pertinent despite you thinking they aren't.

IMO Crystal is the angry ex who lost custody and made false accusations hoping to get custody back and cause problems for her ex.

I'm not sure which point in time you are referring to.

Are you saying that Crystal made false accusations during the custody hearing?

Or that after Haleigh disappeared, THEN Crystal started making false accusations?

Or that she made false accusations the first time, then made more false accusations after Haleigh disappeared?

Help!

[bookie]

I would love to see that link and who determines that statistic... how can you prove something didn't happen... more like the woman couldn't "prove" it did happen so it is determined it didn't (since you do need proof) and thus gets called false claims...

my ex boyfriend beat the hell out of me.. out of nowhere over 10 years ago (and i mean nowhere we had never even had an arguement prior to that but he was drunk that night and i appearantly pissed him off)... I was in shock to say the least and never told the police or anyone else except my best friend... so would you say that now since i would have no proof that it is a false claim or that it didn't happen


There are ways to prove allegations are false. The children themselves can answer if there was or wasn't abuse involved. Photos, witnesses.

[E-U-R]

In this case the abuse claims are from an ex. That is why statistics involving divorce are pertinent despite you thinking they aren't.

IMO Crystal is the angry ex who lost custody and made false accusations hoping to get custody back and cause problems for her ex.

If that is your opinion you are entitled to it... but you can't say in 1 hand she lost custody and was so mad that she became spiteful and made false claims and in the other hand that she is a lazy no caring mother who never cared about the kids and didn't even want them... I am quoting this to you but this applies to many people on here who want to have their cake and eat it too on this matter

either she didn't care and didn't fight for her kids
or
she cared so much about losing them that she turned spiteful
you cannot have it both ways

I have my own totally different opinion but you guys can't have both

[Mimi428]

I was in shock to say the least and never told the police or anyone else except my best friend... so would you say that now since i would have no proof that it is a false claim or that it didn't happen


<snipped>

You got it. No police record, no witnesses....

DIDN'T HAPPEN.

I'm not telling you that this is what I believe, but I am telling you that I believe that happens way more often than people in general are comfortable acknowledging.

And the person who does the hitting is counting on that. That with no witnesses, no police involvement - just let enough time go by & you can swear it never, ever happened in the first place.

[bookie]

I'm not sure which point in time you are referring to.

Are you saying that Crystal made false accusations during the custody hearing?

Or that after Haleigh disappeared, THEN Crystal started making false accusations?

Or that she made false accusations the first time, then made more false accusations after Haleigh disappeared?

Help!


During the second hearing (well the first for her since she didn't show up for the first one) and now.

[panache]

I agree with your post except I don't understand why you would ask Bookie her estimate...
I can tell you a scenario...
by the time you are getting physically hit then most likely you have already been beaten down mentally to the point where you don't call the cops... either because you have seen cases where it did happen and the woman was not believed or because you believe you deserve it,and when that happens it's not always that you deserve it because you are the worthless loser that he says you are but sometimes it's that you believe you deserve it for putting your self in that situation in the first place... like well it's my own fault that I am with such a loser like him. The latter is actually a good reason because it helps you to raise yourself up and actually leave the loser (like IMO crystal did) So you cut your ties try to minimize the loss (her kids) and move on for self preservation. Then when you are strong enough you tell people and their response 9 out of 10 times is yeah right then why didn't you call the cops and the simple answer is because I thought I deserved it... it happens all the time and these days "false" allegations usually are true.. there is a difference between unprovable and false... and by the time you realize that you are worth it usually the evidence has healed... unless you are lucky enough to have scars

You have clearly raised some excellant points. I volunteer at a abused women's shelter. Allow me to tell you what nine out of ten have disclosed. They have been physically abused to the point where they will make finally make a complaint. By the time their court hearing comes up, the fear has returned, the thought that it was THEM that caused the abuse was their fault, the insecurity of being left alone to vend for themselves, and that's when they fail to show up in court, and the charges are dropped. The abuser returns, and the cycle begins anew. That's what I believe Crystal endured. She went back twice, and the last time, she finally had the fortitude to leave.

moo

eta..I neglected to add one more important thing. The threat of the abuser taking the children away plays a big factor in their decision to go or stay.

[bookie]

If that is your opinion you are entitled to it... but you can't say in 1 hand she lost custody and was so mad that she became spiteful and made false claims and in the other hand that she is a lazy no caring mother who never cared about the kids and didn't even want them... I am quoting this to you but this applies to many people on here who want to have their cake and eat it too on this matter

either she didn't care and didn't fight for her kids
or
she cared so much about losing them that she turned spiteful
you cannot have it both ways

I have my own totally different opinion but you guys can't have both

I have never said she didn't want the kids.I have said she was too lazy to get out of bed to take Haleigh to the dr.

[E-U-R]

There are ways to prove allegations are false. The children themselves can answer if there was or wasn't abuse involved. Photos, witnesses.

Some abusers actually do care about the kids and don't abuse in front of them... and how could a picture prove that abuse did not happen? and unless these witnesses can say yes your honor I was with the victim all day everyday then how could they attest that never happened

and you are right these are factors that judges use in their detrmination that I do not dispute... I am just disbuting how acurate their methods are

[Mimi428]

There are ways to prove allegations are false. The children themselves can answer if there was or wasn't abuse involved. Photos, witnesses.

That might be useful if the person making the accusations was saying the children or witnesses were present during the 'abuse'.

But what about the times when no one else is present? No witnesses, kids not there to see it, no photos.

I think you give short shrift to people who hit. A whole lot of them are smart enough to do it away from the eyes of others.

JMO

[E-U-R]

I have never said she didn't want the kids.I have said she was too lazy to get out of bed to take Haleigh to the dr.

as I said my reponse was not directed towards you but if you look at other posters posting history you will see how they like to be on both side of the fence with that and you just can't be

[bookie]

Some abusers actually do care about the kids and don't abuse in front of them... and how could a picture prove that abuse did not happen? and unless these witnesses can say yes your honor I was with the victim all day everyday then how could they attest that never happened

and you are right these are factors that judges use in their detrmination that I do not dispute... I am just disbuting how acurate their methods are



In THIS case Crystal and co are claiming the abuse happened to the kids.

A picture could prove a specific allegation true or false. Witnesses and their credibility can be evidence.

In THIS case Crystal's cousin Candice not telling anyone until MONTH'S later that she saw Ron backhand Haleigh who then fell loses credibility.

I have 6 nieces and 5 nephews. If any of them saw my SIL hit either of my grandchildren 1) I'd be bailing them out of jail after they beat the he!! out of SIL 2) they'd be on the phone telling every family member about it. And if my husband saw SIL hitting one of the grandchildren there would be no bail.

[bookie]

That might be useful if the person making the accusations was saying the children or witnesses were present during the 'abuse'.

But what about the times when no one else is present? No witnesses, kids not there to see it, no photos.

I think you give short shrift to people who hit. A whole lot of them are smart enough to do it away from the eyes of others.

JMO



You realize the abuse allegations in this case include the children right??? I'm talking about this case specifically.

[cat3]

I didn't say they were proof of anything more than Ron being a hands on dad.

Remind me not to answer the next time you ask for an opinion. All you do is use it to ridicule and play games.

The pictures of RC with Haleigh and Jr are very different than the ones of Caylee and Casey.With Casey the photos are posed with Casey showing her teeth,and the Cummings photos show a father interacting with his children in a natural setting.In my opinion they show a father that cares and loves his children.I'm not sure why people are always putting these two cases together,but since they have,that is my opinion on the difference between the Casey and RC photos.
Now moving beyond the photos,you did answer the question about Ron in post #91. I guess some missed that post and want to focus on the pics,so they can say that pictures prove nothing,however it is said that a picture is worth a thousand words.I believe that there is some truth in that old saying.IMO

[panache]

A new petition site was created to demand action in the Haleigh Cummings case.

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/2/demand-action-to-find-haleigh-cummings

Excellant. I hope it gets lots of signatures and is sent to Sheriff Hardy.

:thumbsup:

[E-U-R]

During the second hearing (well the first for her since she didn't show up for the first one) and now.

what about all the false claims that you (or someone else.. not being smart A** i really don't recall who) claimed that she made to dcf in the past couple years...

So by my count she made them at the
custody hearing
several in the past couple years which according to TN is why Ron was taught and investigated on how he could be allowed to spank
and now after one child is no where to be found after being left in his custody

seems pretty persistent for spite... especially from someone who already has a new fiance and baby and has moved on according to some

[HouseOfClark]

Who in their right mind would go to a unknown site and put their personal information out there?? This is how people get murdered.... MOO
ETA" This poster has a total of 10 post on IS....

The Petition Site has been around for years. You should read up on them and then make the decision for yourself before deciding that people who sign petitions aren't "in their right mind".

No personal information is ever given out and I can't recall a single murder case where the victim was "found" via an online petition. Can you?

[titanfan217]

Hi titan

Sorry it took so long to respond. How's that grandson of your doing?

Oclawaha is where Chad disappeared from, which is in Marion county. Looks like on the map it could be near Leesburg.

Where the remains were found , (Volusia) is on the central east coast near Daytona.

moo

Thanks.

Looks like I'm going to have to get as acquainted with Florida counties as I have been with the Illinois ones.

OT I've worked at the county where the strangle case is. I wonder what NG is going to call him. And I've also worked several times where DP is from.

Sir grandson is fine. I'm exhausted. I dropped him off about 30 minutes ago.

[HouseOfClark]

what about all the false claims that you (or someone else.. not being smart A** i really don't recall who) claimed that she made to dcf in the past couple years...

So by my count she made them at the
custody hearing
several in the past couple years which according to TN is why Ron was taught and investigated on how he could be allowed to spank
and now after one child is no where to be found after being left in his custody

seems pretty persistent for spite... especially from someone who already has a new fiance and baby and has moved on according to some


LE has also admitted that they have been to Ron's house about four times in the last few years, in addition to the DCF complaints.

So somebody has definitely called LE at one point or another.

[titanfan217]

I thought someone said he was on JVM last night and was agreeing with Ron not wanting the A's around. Anyone see that and what did he say? He also says in that article that the A's were there to support CS. I thought that vigil/meeing was arranged by KFN and they were they as reps of KFN. JMO


Somehow I think that whole thing has been twisted to make it media, not sure by who.

Personally, I don't care what RC thinks of GA and CA, just like I bet he really doesn't give a hoot what I think of them. If he does, he has too much time on his hands.

[Mel]

http://www.wesh.com/news/19506509/detail.html

Apparently Ron's public statement to the Anthony's was in retaliation because he was not invited to the vigil that Michelle Bart organized. MB extended the invitation to the side of the family that cares.

thanks for the link!

i've been busy the last few days, but i heard a little about this

[E-U-R]

You realize the abuse allegations in this case include the children right??? I'm talking about this case specifically.

No go re-read the custody transcript back then she claimed he abused her and she brought up neglect about ron in regards to the part where haleigh almost drowned
then when this all started she had hoped that he would not have let his abusive temper cross over to the children
not every abuser beats the kids too and obviously that was what she was hoping...
also when you call dcf on someone they chose to investigate it or not... like if i was to call dcf right now and said my ex bf who has kids now hit me 10 years ago.. they wouldn't bother to investigate... there need to be some credibility to even investigate... then they decide whether or not to open a case... which in my opinion is how ron made his spanking agreement with haleigh (sounds like service plan terminology to me) a service plan is what they open with the family when there is enough evidence to open a case... then if you comply they close the case usually with no strings attached

[titanfan217]

Well i have a stupid question for everyone that feels like Misty and Ron were involved.........

Do you not believe what Jr said about the black man wearing all black with squeeky shoes that took his sissy? or do you think Ron and Misty told Jr to say that?

Actually, I think that's entire possible. I also think that someone connected to either of them was there and that's waht JR saw. And I also know it's possible for a 4 year old to manufacture a story.

In other words, I don't know.

What I spent last night trying to figure out is who does RC want to find his daughter? He doesn't seem to want to push MC to work out the questions with LE. Not that I think these are the answers but it seems to have pushed Cobra, the Anthonys, and KFN away also. So is his daughter supposedly to magic appear because he made a video.

[E-U-R]

Murders,rape,stalking and other horrible things has happened because some people don.t understand that whoever has these website or allows other to help all have your ISP along with your address. FACT........

No it is not a fact that they would have your home address especially now with so many people who even have wired internet are being bounced off of wireless servers.... google IP address tracker
i did mine and supposedly I am 1 hour away from where I actually am

[E-U-R]

Actually, I think that's entire possible. I also think that someone connected to either of them was there and that's waht JR saw. And I also know it's possible for a 4 year old to manufacture a story.

In other words, I don't know.

What I spent last night trying to figure out is who does RC want to find his daughter? He doesn't seem to want to push MC to work out the questions with LE. Not that I think these are the answers but it seems to have pushed Cobra, the Anthonys, and KFN away also. So is his daughter supposedly to magic appear because he made a video.

haven't you heard god will deliver his baby girl home and no one can judge him but god...
i believe in god too but you better believe if my kid is missing i am not going to sit around waiting for a miracle

[HouseOfClark]

Murders,rape,stalking and other horrible things has happened because some people don.t understand that whoever has these website or allows other to help all have your ISP along with your address. FACT........

They don't "have your ISP". That's your Internet Service Provider.

You may be thinking of your IP. That's your internet protocol address.

You really shouldn't be so paranoid. It's not Craigslist for crying out loud.

You should just say you don't want to sign a petition which calls for some movement in this case and be done with it. Don't attack the site, they are very credible and again, what murders, rapes, and stalkings have come from that specific site? I don't know of any and I doubt you do either.

[Mel]

They haven't "cleared" anyone but he is the only one they have gone on record about. They haven't said they know Crystal was at her home that night.

yes they have...very early on, Lt Greenwood said Haleigh's mother was in GA, where she lives, when Haleigh went missing...

it's post #34, in the very first thread on this forum

[E-U-R]

Let me see if I have this right. Crystal and Ron lived with parents, Father of abused Crystal, ex- marine, ex- deputy and numerous arrest of assault and you think Ron abused his daughter and granddaughter??? Does not say much about her father, the stand up, American hero, that goes out looking for granddaughter even though he is sick, running a high temperature. Are we talking about the same person??

okay so then by your rationale then what wa crystals dad doing even letting her live with him at that age...
and so what if he was LE or a marine...
have you never heard of cops who beat their wives... i bet most of Bookie's false abuse claims in divorces include cops and their spouses cause you know all them cop wives are liars and cops are saints who would never do that
and how about that marine who just strangled his wife and 2 sons...
I guess my question is what is your point?

[E-U-R]

I have been tracked and my name address and listed on a web site created by an individual and all I ever did was visit. I WAS NOT EVEN REGISTERED.... FACT

Was this website whitepages.com?
if not then what are you doing going to random blog sites like this:scared:

[JackiBlu]

LE has also admitted that they have been to Ron's house about four times in the last few years, in addition to the DCF complaints.

So somebody has definitely called LE at one point or another.

Do you have a link for this? I don't recall seeing that LE had been called out to Ron's house in the past. TIA

[Mel]

anything is possible i just found it so strange that they were so quick to dismiss JR's story right off the bat... even if my ex was a total liar and she told me that our child said he saw who did it i would have said oh great what did he say lets go get the guy... i would not have immediately dismissed it... if for no other reason just at the thought of hope... and this would just further their position that it was not them in fact it was some black guy so why wouldn't they want that story to ring true... just seems illogical to dismiss it off the bat like ron did

i agree!

it's like RC knew it wasn't what happened:confused:
strange, IMO

[panache]

Do you have a link for this? I don't recall seeing that LE had been called out to Ron's house in the past. TIA

I'll have to search for the link Jacki, I distinctly remember LE saying they were familar with that Green St. address.

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I do remember that.

moo

[Mel]

Sorry to quote you twice. The thing about Misty being the one who did something - I can't buy Ron being the bystander to Misty's actions -if he ever suspected she did something to Haleigh she would be long gone.

i don't buy it either, but i can if RC did something, & Misty sticking by/covering for him..jmo

[titanfan217]

haven't you heard god will deliver his baby girl home and no one can judge him but god...
i believe in god too but you better believe if my kid is missing i am not going to sit around waiting for a miracle

Me neither. I was taught God helps them that helps themselves.

[HouseOfClark]

that's what I had to do but then I bought a tinfoil hat so I am safe now

Oh no! You didn't go to tinfoilhats dot com did you? I hear they put listening devices in all of theirs.

:w00t:

[E-U-R]

My point is if J. Sheffield thought for one minute his daughter or grandchildren were being abused, he would have hurt Ron bad enough he would not show his face in Florida. That is my point!!!!

um not necessarily and I am not saying he did or didn't or that this is the case but what if he himself is also a wife abuser... some men just think it's an everyday part of life...
and lots of people believe in spanking it is the younger generation that call it abuse
take the alleged claim seen by crystal's cousin
ron supposedly slapped Jr in the back of the head hard enough and he fell on his face
it's not like ron punched him in the nose he just slapped him and sh*% happens... maybe JS doesn't think of it as abuse...
when I was little my mom used to whack me with a wooden spoon (we're italian and i was a little brat most of the time) I swore at her once so she got the spoon and i dodge onto my bed laughing cause i thought it was funny... my bedspread slipped right off my bed and so did I ... I smashed my head into my bureau and got 3 stitches...
these days that would be considered abuse... I still don't think it was but by legal term it was I guess

[JackiBlu]

yes they have...very early on, Lt Greenwood said Haleigh's mother was in GA, where she lives, when Haleigh went missing...

it's post #34, in the very first thread on this forum

Sorry but Haleigh's mother DOES NOT live in GA.

[HouseOfClark]

Make fun if you want to, but if the information I posted saves one person, I am fine with your having fun off of my personal experience.

You going to share the name of this dreadful site that tracked you down?

[titanfan217]

yes they have...very early on, Lt Greenwood said Haleigh's mother was in GA, where she lives, when Haleigh went missing...

it's post #34, in the very first thread on this forum

Hi Mel

?? to anyone. Does CS live in Baker Cny FL or Georgia???

[Mel]

ITA - it would have absolutely worked to their advantage. Misty & Ron were the ones promoting from the get-go that someone must have come into the house.

But when Crystal reports that Junior supported their story - that someone WAS in the house, they sneered & denigrated it. I think they were more interested at that moment in trying to negate anything from Crystal & her family.
JMO

exactly....

they wanted to 'slam' CS as much as possible, instead of even acting like this (what Jr supposedly said) could have been a possible scenario....they knew there was no black man in the home, imo, but weren't thinking how this could have actually helped them, as far as Haleigh being kidnapped from the home......had RC taken this seriously, i might have leaned more toward him & Misty being innocent...just too many squirrely things have happened, in regards to RC's reactions to Haleigh's disappearance...
imo

[carlybarly]

Bookie I'm with you on this one. I don't feel that Ron did anything to this little girl, And I don't think he was a horrible abusive father either. Everyone can run him down, talk about him having time for a social life etc but he's had the children since 2005, he has provided for them, they have appeared to be healthy and happy. They have been well taken care of, they had a home to live in and by the looks of the video walk through months ago it was a decent place to live. It appeared clean, it wasn't junky. And I remember some posters talking about boxes on the porch with christmas toys in them, how do we know first of all the toys were in those boxes? We keep every box here in storage (of reasonable size that is) as a matter of fact I complain to dh about never throwing boxes away, but he says you never know when you'll need them so be it. So having the boxes there mean nothing. And what if there were some toys in there? Maybe they were being saved because they got a lot at xmas. Who knows? But to assume he was depriving his kids of the toys just by boxes is ridiculous.

And of course the criticism on the xmas stockings hung up but no valentine's stuff, my kids never hung valentines stuff up. Yea we did the cards but not the deco. But the xmas stuff, you had to fight for weeks to get it all down. Maybe the kids liked them there, maybe they asked for them to be left up, what harm would it have done? Ron may not have been the perfect father with all the right choices, but he took care of those kids and even if he had help from family, he still was in their lives. He was lucky enough to have family there for him, not everyone is. And yes he made a mistake in letting the kids with Misty that night, but maybe he didn't think anything woudl happen. They'd been together for a few months at that time and nothing happened before then, why would he think anything would happen that night? yes she was partying the weekend before, but how do we know how messed up she was by the time she got home? Maybe she was tired yea, woudl explain why she went to bed at 10, but that doesn't necessarily mean she was hung over or still messed up. All we know is she went out over the weekend partying, we don't know exactly how messed up she got partying or even if she partied Sunday all day/night.

Now could my mind change about this, yea I could believe he was involved if LE woudl give us something. But this is the impression I get right now.

[panache]

Hi Mel

?? to anyone. Does CS live in Baker Cny FL or Georgia???

The very early media reports said GA, they lived very close to the border, I believe.

[Mel]

Hi Mel

?? to anyone. Does CS live in Baker Cny FL or Georgia???

i always thought she actually lived in GA, but that her family lives in Baker Cny:shrug:

good question

[Mel]

The very early media reports said GA, they lived very close to the border, I believe.

right...i was also under the impression it was at the border

[carlybarly]

The very early media reports said GA, they lived very close to the border, I believe.

That is what I got from the early media reports, that she lived in GA.

[E-U-R]

I'll have to search for the link Jacki, I distinctly remember LE saying they were familar with that Green St. address.

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I do remember that.

moo

I was just about to say the same thing.. but I am too lazty to look for the link.... I have PMS and I just ate a whole loaf of french bread LOL

[panache]

Mel, JR. had already been taken to the S/O and questioned earlier and IMO, if this had happened it would have come out at his questioning. MOO

The child psycholgists who interviewed Junior would never reveal to the public what Junior told them. That is confidential information, until it is requested in a court of law. We have no way of knowing what Junior told them.

moo

[E-U-R]

Make fun if you want to, but if the information I posted saves one person, I am fine with your having fun off of my personal experience.

again my oppologies I see you are really concerned about this so I thought I would let you in on something that may have been the cause of your dilema... Did you enter your info on your computer setting and perhaps hit autofill on accident... its a shortcut way to fill in personal info I never use it or put accurate info in it for that same reason I don't want to accidently click it... but people cannot find out your actual home address just by going to a website... maybe your computer was hacked... what kind of website was this PM me if you want my "professional" opinion I work in the online industry and might be able to set your mind at ease

[E-U-R]

Oh no! You didn't go to tinfoilhats dot com did you? I hear they put listening devices in all of theirs.

:w00t:

shhh they might hear you:angry:

[E-U-R]

bam bam, I left a complimentary message on a site once, immediately began receiving Nigerian scams. You are right. I will never do it again.

maybe in your email but not in your mailbox at your house

[Mel]

Excellant. I hope it gets lots of signatures and is sent to Sheriff Hardy.

:thumbsup:

i do too!

thanks for the link, Camille..i'm glad i noticed it, in with panache's post:smile:

[E-U-R]

Sorry but Haleigh's mother DOES NOT live in GA.

You are right she doesn't but I often wondered if she lived on the border because I have heard this same mistake on several news stations way back in the beginning.. maybe there is a GA town with same name

[panache]

I was just about to say the same thing.. but I am too lazty to look for the link.... I have PMS and I just ate a whole loaf of french bread LOL

Haha...I know what you mean. Its my day off today and I can't believe I have sat at this keyboard all day snacking. I would hate to tell you all the junk I ate. At least you had something wholesome.

Back to the case. I read Art will be on JVM tonight.

moo

[Mimi428]

My point is if J. Sheffield thought for one minute his daughter or grandchildren were being abused, he would have hurt Ron bad enough he would not show his face in Florida. That is my point!!!!

Question not just to you, but in general...

Does it ever make you wonder why, when the discussion & debate is when/if Ron did something or another - the counterpoints that are offered do NOT address the questions - but are re-directed to questions about why someone ELSE did/didn't do something?

Why is that?

Why does no one want to address Ron's behavior?

How does discussing what Crystal, Johnny, Marie, cousin this or that, neighbor somebody or another, bus driver, butcher, baker, candlestick maker did answer for Ron's behavior?

[panache]

Hi Mel

?? to anyone. Does CS live in Baker Cny FL or Georgia???

This is the best I coould do searching.

Baker is a county in the Northeast close to the Ga. border.

http://www.floridacountiesmap.com/northeast.shtml

[Mel]

I'll have to search for the link Jacki, I distinctly remember LE saying they were familar with that Green St. address.

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I do remember that.

moo

no, you aren't the only one that remembers this....i remember i found it really weird, considering RC had only been living there since, what? - November 2008?:ohmy:

[Mimi428]

Mel, JR. had already been taken to the S/O and questioned earlier and IMO, if this had happened it would have come out at his questioning. MOO

Do we know it didn't come out during his initial questioning?

LE was/is under no obligation to tell the rest of the family about anything that ANYONE else says, including Junior.

JMO

[bama__angel]

I was just about to say the same thing.. but I am too lazty to look for the link.... I have PMS and I just ate a whole loaf of french bread LOL



Dont you just love PMSing.....I have eaten the large size jar of Pace picante sauce (medium) with a spoon while reading the thread for today lol.....Lovin that salt lol

[Mel]

Mel, JR. had already been taken to the S/O and questioned earlier and IMO, if this had happened it would have come out at his questioning. MOO

ugh, i know i'll look stupid, but what is S/O?:huh:

[Mel]

SO= sexual offender.

RSO= registered sexual offender

ah......ok, thanks Grace

[Mel]

ok, so anyway....needless to say, LE did verify CS was at her home, during the time Haleigh disappeared...that was my only point...it was also said in another report early on, & it stated that CS was over 100 milles away, during that timeframe...(i think the article stated she was 130 miles away???)....i can't remember the exact milage, but it was a LE quote, regarding CS's whereabouts....(can't find the link)....i ruled CS out almost immediately, due to these early reports, as far as her kidnapping Haleigh - another thing being, if it had been CS, she would have taken Jr too, IMO)

[panache]

Question not just to you, but in general...

Does it ever make you wonder why, when the discussion & debate is when/if Ron did something or another - the counterpoints that are offered do NOT address the questions - but are re-directed to questions about why someone ELSE did/didn't do something?

Why is that?

Why does no one want to address Ron's behavior?

How does discussing what Crystal, Johnny, Marie, cousin this or that, neighbor somebody or another, bus driver, butcher, baker, candlestick maker did answer for Ron's behavior?

Great challenging question Mimi.

[HouseOfClark]

no, you aren't the only one that remembers this....i remember i found it really weird, considering RC had only been living there since, what? - November 2008?:ohmy:

I think most of the visits from CPS and LE have come about since Misty moved in.

That's just my opinion (as neither will give dates).

[E-U-R]

Thanks Camille. Call me optimistic but I'm confident I won't get murdered in my bed tonight for signing it. :scared:

Just a thought but if this pettition is valid (and no I don't me whether or not it is setup by murders stalker raper) wouldn't it most likely need to be signed by florida residents?
just seems to me that whatever florida LE/congressman or whoever else they plan to present it to...wouldn't it need to be signed by florida residents?
just a question and I hope it does not deter any of you from signing it as I support the idea of it

[E-U-R]

ugh, i know i'll look stupid, but what is S/O?:huh:

no that is a good question because i only know of it meaning Sex Offender but I am guessing by context that is not what it is meant here

[Mel]

You're welcome but I see that's not what bam bam meant. SO and RSO are used often on this site and it usually means sexual offender and registered sexual offender.

SO could also mean significant other.

Lol, are you thoroughly confused yet?

hahah!:biggrin:
i think i got it now...BB responded, & sheriff's office makes sense to his/her comment...whew!!

[JackiBlu]

no, you aren't the only one that remembers this....i remember i found it really weird, considering RC had only been living there since, what? - November 2008?:ohmy:

I have been looking for links that they were called to the home before and the only thing I find is:

Police had never been called to the home in the past, but there have been investigations by a social services agency involving Cummings, Croslin and Haleigh and her 4-year-old brother Junior, according to Rose. He hasn't revealed the nature of those cases.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,494425,00.html

This is on several other news websites as well.

[HouseOfClark]

Just a thought but if this pettition is valid (and no I don't me whether or not it is setup by murders stalker raper) wouldn't it most likely need to be signed by florida residents?
just seems to me that whatever florida LE/congressman or whoever else they plan to present it to...wouldn't it need to be signed by florida residents?
just a question and I hope it does not deter any of you from signing it as I support the idea of it

As much as this case has gone nationwide, I don't think it just applies to Florida residents.

All of us want some action as opposed to "Life goes on". It's almost as if Schauland was saying "You win some, you lose some and some get rained out".

Very nonchalant of a law enforcement officer in my opinion.

[Mel]

Sorry, Sheriff's Office.. NO you don;t look stupid, I was assuming. I should have been clear and wrote PCSD. My bad.:wink:

got it! ... lol

[HouseOfClark]

I have been looking for links that they were called to the home before and the only thing I find is:

Police had never been called to the home in the past, but there have been investigations by a social services agency involving Cummings, Croslin and Haleigh and her 4-year-old brother Junior, according to Rose. He hasn't revealed the nature of those cases.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,494425,00.html

This is on several other news websites as well.

There was a later link. It should be on the links thread unless the poster who originally posted it is no longer here.

But LE did admit they they had been to the house several times for abuse accusations, but made no arrests.

[E-U-R]

got it! ... lol

and just a heads up now
IIRC means if i recall correctly... took me forever to pick up on that one.. probably should have just asked like you did but whatever

[Mimi428]

Great challenging question Mimi.

To me, you MUST start with the people who lived in that house. They have to be cleared before you can focus too much attention on someone else, somewhere else. We already know that from the very beginning that LE said that Crystal was at home. We have also heard that LE did not go & search her house. Both of those things give us a pretty good indication that LE had reasons to NOT suspect her or those in her household.

I think of triage when cases like this are brought to our attention. I can't turn away from Ron & Misty & start running willy-nilly in other directions. THEY are critical, they cannot be overlooked, they must be attended to & taken care of FIRST.

IF (& I do say if) Ron was abusive - it does not put a crown on Crystal's head for being mother of the year. Conversely, if Crystal was NOT mother of the year - that does NOT equate to Ron being innocent of abusive behavior. They are two separate subjects.

When the discussion turns to analyzing whether or not the claims of Ron being abusive are credible - all the imperfections of everyone else in & around his life do not matter. It is his behavior that is worthy of analysis, because he (not Crystal, Marie, Chad, Johnny, et al) lived in the same house as Haleigh!

JMO

[Mel]

and just a heads up now
IIRC means if i recall correctly... took me forever to pick up on that one.. probably should have just asked like you did but whatever

thank you!...i didn't know what that meant either, LOL

[E-U-R]

shot in the dark here but
i was thinking back to the sunshine information law thingy that gave us so much info and doc dumps in the caylee case... and i totally understand now that an arrest needs to be made in order to be entitled to the info but what about this....
LE said ( according to cobra and art) that they did question nay nay extensively while she was under arrest... would that entitle us to her interview since it was while she was charged with a crime and under areest for that crime...
i realize that it was a crime non related but is there some kind of loop hole maybe where we can get that info now?

[E-U-R]

This may help...

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?t=338396

OMG
SOCK PUPPET - A "sock puppet" is like a "clone". A phony account registered for the sole purpose of hurting someone
LOL

[JackiBlu]

There was a later link. It should be on the links thread unless the poster who originally posted it is no longer here.

But LE did admit they they had been to the house several times for abuse accusations, but made no arrests.

If the article is out there it is well hidden. I have googled and all that comes up is "never called out in the past".


JMO

[E-U-R]

If the article is out there it is well hidden. I have googled and all that comes up is "never called out in the past".


JMO

I do remember hearing this early on also and I want to say it was a speciffic number of times possibly 4 but that they were not major things or that no arrests were made... I'm going to try and look too because if this is true I do not want it to be blown off as rumor

[panache]

To me, you MUST start with the people who lived in that house. They have to be cleared before you can focus too much attention on someone else, somewhere else. We already know that from the very beginning that LE said that Crystal was at home. We have also heard that LE did not go & search her house. Both of those things give us a pretty good indication that LE had reasons to NOT suspect her or those in her household.

I think of triage when cases like this are brought to our attention. I can't turn away from Ron & Misty & start running willy-nilly in other directions. THEY are critical, they cannot be overlooked, they must be attended to & taken care of FIRST.

IF (& I do say if) Ron was abusive - it does not put a crown on Crystal's head for being mother of the year. Conversely, if Crystal was NOT mother of the year - that does NOT equate to Ron being innocent of abusive behavior. They are two separate subjects.

When the discussion turns to analyzing whether or not the claims of Ron being abusive are credible - all the imperfections of everyone else in & around his life do not matter. It is his behavior that is worthy of analysis, because he (not Crystal, Marie, Chad, Johnny, et al) lived in the same house as Haleigh!

JMO

Brillant deduction. You manage to compose in one post the words I struggle with to write. As many have often said there isn't one character in this case that doesn't have flaws. That's not the factor that should determine what defines Ron and what exactly is he? A Dad who is as puzzled as we are about his daughter's disappearance, or one of the shrewdest con artists. The jury is out on either for me. I still want to see what else, if anything LE is holding in their bag.

moo

[Mel]

To me, you MUST start with the people who lived in that house. They have to be cleared before you can focus too much attention on someone else, somewhere else. We already know that from the very beginning that LE said that Crystal was at home. We have also heard that LE did not go & search her house. Both of those things give us a pretty good indication that LE had reasons to NOT suspect her or those in her household.

I think of triage when cases like this are brought to our attention. I can't turn away from Ron & Misty & start running willy-nilly in other directions. THEY are critical, they cannot be overlooked, they must be attended to & taken care of FIRST.

IF (& I do say if) Ron was abusive - it does not put a crown on Crystal's head for being mother of the year. Conversely, if Crystal was NOT mother of the year - that does NOT equate to Ron being innocent of abusive behavior. They are two separate subjects.

When the discussion turns to analyzing whether or not the claims of Ron being abusive are credible - all the imperfections of everyone else in & around his life do not matter. It is his behavior that is worthy of analysis, because he (not Crystal, Marie, Chad, Johnny, et al) lived in the same house as Haleigh!

JMO

you're correct, Mimi...i agree 100%!

not sure what people are thinking .... it almost comes across as some simply can't get past the fact that the children didn't live w/their mother, therefore she's 'bad' & should be a suspect, & that RC is father of the year...i think it's clear that LE doesn't think of CS as a suspect in Haleigh's disappearance..

jmo

[Mel]

This may help...

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?t=338396

thanks, Grace

[panache]

Here's the article where it is said that Crystal lived in So. GA.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/18680086/detail.html

[E-U-R]

well I didn't find the police responding link that I was looking for but I did find this and I am patting myself on the back for it (we need a smiley that depicts that LOL)
There was questions on here as to whether or not GGM Sykes was alone or had someone with her durring her alleged visit to the home that evening before she went missing

Sykes remembers seeing Haleigh hours before she was abducted.

"She was sitting on the front porch when we drove up and junior was just sitting up there with a plate in the lap eating," she said.

http://www.wftv.com/news/18748531/detail.html

[panache]

I have been looking for links that they were called to the home before and the only thing I find is:

Police had never been called to the home in the past, but there have been investigations by a social services agency involving Cummings, Croslin and Haleigh and her 4-year-old brother Junior, according to Rose. He hasn't revealed the nature of those cases.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,494425,00.html

This is on several other news websites as well.

Here ya go friend. It does exist!!!!

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491008,00.html

[JackiBlu]

Here ya go friend. It does exist!!!!

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491008,00.html

Am I missing something? That is the same link I posted that said they had never been called out.

[E-U-R]

Am I missing something? That is the same link I posted that said they had never been called out.

yeah I was confused on that too... an I am still looking for the links where I may have seen that they had been called out...
I know I heard it in the beginning and that no arrests were made and that it was a video because I actually "heard" it... and I remember thinking huh 4 times with no arrests and no look what happened.. but like I said they were not for major crimes or anything... this is going to drive me nuts and I'm not going to talk about iyt anymore because I understand that as of now it is a "rumor".. until I find that D@mn link that is:biggrin:

[JackiBlu]

yeah I was confused on that too... an I am still looking for the links where I may have seen that they had been called out...
I know I heard it in the beginning and that no arrests were made and that it was a video because I actually "heard" it... and I remember thinking huh 4 times with no arrests and no look what happened.. but like I said they were not for major crimes or anything... this is going to drive me nuts and I'm not going to talk about iyt anymore because I understand that as of now it is a "rumor".. until I find that D@mn link that is:biggrin:

I have googled and googled every possible way that I can think of and still can't find it.

[panache]

Am I missing something? That is the same link I posted that said they had never been called out.





Haleigh told us they’ve been hit, and stuff like that, but to this point, everything was fine," Marie Sheffield said.

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.

"There have been some investigations done through the department of children and family," Rose told FOX News on Wednesday. He didn't elaborate.

Sorry, I didn't open your link. But Capt Rose saying there were prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children tells me there was some need of attention. Why would LE be aware of *prior problems* if they have not been called?

That statement stands for itself. There was a need for LE.

moo

[E-U-R]

so who was with GGm Sykes when she visited that day?

[E-U-R]

Haleigh told us they’ve been hit, and stuff like that, but to this point, everything was fine," Marie Sheffield said.

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.

"There have been some investigations done through the department of children and family," Rose told FOX News on Wednesday. He didn't elaborate.

Sorry, I didn't open your link. But Capt Rose saying there were prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children tells me there was some need of attention. Why would LE be aware of *prior problems* if they have not been called?

That statement stands for itself. There was a need for LE.

moo

ITA but I think Jacki wants the link to why they were called out and when

[JackiBlu]

Haleigh told us they’ve been hit, and stuff like that, but to this point, everything was fine," Marie Sheffield said.

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.

"There have been some investigations done through the department of children and family," Rose told FOX News on Wednesday. He didn't elaborate.

Sorry, I didn't open your link. But Capt Rose saying there were prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children tells me there was some need of attention. Why would LE be aware of *prior problems* if they have not been called?

That statement stands for itself. There was a need for LE.

moo

In my opinion the prior problems has to do with DCF. LE would be aware of this now that Haleigh was missing.

I don't know how you can come to the conclusion there was a need for LE when in the same article it says they had never been called out to the home.

JMO

[E-U-R]

Haleigh told us they’ve been hit, and stuff like that, but to this point, everything was fine," Marie Sheffield said.

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.

"There have been some investigations done through the department of children and family," Rose told FOX News on Wednesday. He didn't elaborate.

Sorry, I didn't open your link. But Capt Rose saying there were prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children tells me there was some need of attention. Why would LE be aware of *prior problems* if they have not been called?

That statement stands for itself. There was a need for LE.

moo

whenever cops are called for abuse they have to hand it over to DCF for investigation... JMO

[panache]

ITA but I think Jacki wants the link to why they were called out and when

Obviously LE is refusing to put that info out there, based on what Capt Rose discreetly admitted. It'll have to do.

moo

[Mimi428]

Haleigh told us they’ve been hit, and stuff like that, but to this point, everything was fine," Marie Sheffield said.

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.

"There have been some investigations done through the department of children and family," Rose told FOX News on Wednesday. He didn't elaborate.



<snipped>

Haleigh disappeared on Feb 9/10. Misty had been living with Ron for approximately 3 months (moved in w/him in November, if the reports are accurate).

What in the world could have been going on between Misty, Ron & the kids that DCF was out there within the 3 months that Misty was living there?

Three months! Three whole months (maybe a little less) - & already DCF had been called out there?

That is NOT a good sign, IMO.

[bama__angel]

Am I missing something? That is the same link I posted that said they had never been called out.


I see what you see......Police have never been called to Ron's home....but DCS has been called.....IMO

[Mel]

Yep, and I don't recall ever hearing who that other person was.

Also, Misty never mentioned that Sykes was there that night.

Hmmm

correct.....she only mentions (in interviews) her brother & his kid/kids, & the AC guy..nothing about Sykes & another person...

i don't believe GGS...jmo

[FoxySly]

Am I missing something? That is the same link I posted that said they had never been called out.

Nope, you read correctly:

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491008,00.html

But you didn't figure the rumor factor into it.

Sly

~

[Mel]

Here's the article where it is said that Crystal lived in So. GA.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/18680086/detail.html

here's another report also, of her living in GA..

http://www.news4jax.com/video/18682465/index.html

[Owlface]

To me, you MUST start with the people who lived in that house. They have to be cleared before you can focus too much attention on someone else, somewhere else. We already know that from the very beginning that LE said that Crystal was at home. We have also heard that LE did not go & search her house. Both of those things give us a pretty good indication that LE had reasons to NOT suspect her or those in her household.

I think of triage when cases like this are brought to our attention. I can't turn away from Ron & Misty & start running willy-nilly in other directions. THEY are critical, they cannot be overlooked, they must be attended to & taken care of FIRST.

IF (& I do say if) Ron was abusive - it does not put a crown on Crystal's head for being mother of the year. Conversely, if Crystal was NOT mother of the year - that does NOT equate to Ron being innocent of abusive behavior. They are two separate subjects.

When the discussion turns to analyzing whether or not the claims of Ron being abusive are credible - all the imperfections of everyone else in & around his life do not matter. It is his behavior that is worthy of analysis, because he (not Crystal, Marie, Chad, Johnny, et al) lived in the same house as Haleigh!

JMO

I totally agree with this - I don't get the tit for tat people have to do when somebody criticizes Ron they have to criticize Crystal.

[bama__angel]

correct.....she only mentions (in interviews) her brother & his kid/kids, & the AC guy..nothing about Sykes & another person...

i don't believe GGS...jmo


Do you believe the AC guy? He's the only person who has been cleared IMO by LE and he states he saw Haleigh playing outside the afternoon he was there. And I cant provide a link....but it's in the links section.....

I repsectfully disagree with you.....I DO NOT believe that GGS would lie to protect Misty or Ron, especially if she thought either had anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance...IMO

[Owlface]

you're correct, Mimi...i agree 100%!

not sure what people are thinking .... it almost comes across as some simply can't get past the fact that the children didn't live w/their mother, therefore she's 'bad' & should be a suspect, & that RC is father of the year...i think it's clear that LE doesn't think of CS as a suspect in Haleigh's disappearance..

jmo

I totally agree. Gazillions of single moms have custody of their kids and nobody looks at their father badly since he don't have custody. But if a father actually cares enough to request custody then he must be golden.

Also - abusive fathers request custody more often than fathers in general. It's a control thing that has been discussed before.

[Mel]

Haleigh told us they’ve been hit, and stuff like that, but to this point, everything was fine," Marie Sheffield said.

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.

"There have been some investigations done through the department of children and family," Rose told FOX News on Wednesday. He didn't elaborate.

Sorry, I didn't open your link. But Capt Rose saying there were prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children tells me there was some need of attention. Why would LE be aware of *prior problems* if they have not been called?

That statement stands for itself. There was a need for LE.

moo

i agree

i was going to try & find an additional link, but got sidetracked with the 'GA thing'...

this has been reported more than once...(about LE being called out to RC's, in the past) ...

[bama__angel]

I totally agree. Gazillions of single moms have custody of their kids and nobody looks at their father badly since he don't have custody. But if a father actually cares enough to request custody then he must be golden.

Also - abusive fathers request custody more often than fathers in general. It's a control thing that has been discussed before.


Abusive fathers want custody more often.......Where are you getting your info? Many mothers have control issues......Is this the only reason they seek custody?

[JackiBlu]

Obviously LE is refusing to put that info out there, based on what Capt Rose discreetly admitted. It'll have to do.

moo

I'm just asking for the link that some said they read where LE stated they were called out in the past.

How does Capt Rose say in one paragraph they had never been called out. Then according to you he discreetly admitted this in another paragraph in the same article. Makes no sense to me.



JMO

[Mel]

whenever cops are called for abuse they have to hand it over to DCF for investigation... JMO

exactly...

[panache]

Nope, you read correctly:

Police had never been called to the home in the past — but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491008,00.html

But you didn't figure the rumor factor into it.

Sly

~

I hope your not accusing Capt Rose of spreading rumors.

If DCYF was notified by whatever method and they did not notify LE, well, they failed according to this information.

http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/abuse/definitions.shtml



moo

[panache]

I'm just asking for the link that some said they read where LE stated they were called out in the past.

How does Capt Rose say in one paragraph they had never been called out. Then according to you he discreetly admitted this in another paragraph in the same article. Makes no sense to me.



JMO

I agree Jacki, it is a contradiction. But you can't deny DCYF was tuned into the Cumming household if you believe Capt. Rose.

moo

[panache]

Do you believe the AC guy? He's the only person who has been cleared IMO by LE and he states he saw Haleigh playing outside the afternoon he was there. And I cant provide a link....but it's in the links section.....

I repsectfully disagree with you.....I DO NOT believe that GGS would lie to protect Misty or Ron, especially if she thought either had anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance...IMO

Hold the phone! I have yet to see a statement by the AC man. Where did you find that link?

moo

[Mel]

Do you believe the AC guy? He's the only person who has been cleared IMO by LE and he states he saw Haleigh playing outside the afternoon he was there. And I cant provide a link....but it's in the links section.....

I repsectfully disagree with you.....I DO NOT believe that GGS would lie to protect Misty or Ron, especially if she thought either had anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance...IMO

there's no link...i haven't heard/read LE say anything, other than he's been cleared, & that's good enough for me....nothing about who/what he saw at the home, or even what time he was there...

[bama__angel]

Hold the phone! I have yet to see a statement by the AC man. Where did you find that link?

moo


OK...I'll hold the phone for a minute.......LE stated that the AC guy was cleared and that he had seen Haleigh playing outside that afternoon.........I read this in here from another poster who had provided the link to the article which was in the links section...IMO


If I am mistaken, I will apologize to all......It's not my intention to mislead anyone.....

[FallenAngel♥]

Hi Mel

?? to anyone. Does CS live in Baker Cny FL or Georgia???

On Tuesday, Haleigh's mother, 23-year-old Crystal Sheffield, and her grandmother, Marie Griffis, arrived on the scene from Georgia. Griffis initially told the media that there were no problems between her daughter and Cummings; today, however, she told the media that their relationship had been "rocky."

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2009/02/florida-police-say-haleigh-cummings-was-abducted.html?cid=6a00d8341bf67c53ef01156ed2e1b197 0c


but honestly i'm not sure.

[JackiBlu]

I hope your not accusing Capt Rose of spreading rumors.

If DCYF was notified by whatever method and they did not notify LE, well, they failed according to this information.

http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/abuse/definitions.shtml



moo

Geez I must be missing something again. All it says in regards to LE is that they will take the lead in all criminal investigations and prosecution. I don't see where DCF contact LE on all abuse claims.


JMO

[Mel]

I totally agree. Gazillions of single moms have custody of their kids and nobody looks at their father badly since he don't have custody. But if a father actually cares enough to request custody then he must be golden.
Also - abusive fathers request custody more often than fathers in general. It's a control thing that has been discussed before.

yep, & abusive fathers use the kids as pawns, in the fight, for the most part...of course it's a control thing!

oooh, there's a case...Brad Cunningham??..i think i've got his name right...he fought his poor wife, tooth & nail, over the kids, & put himself across as a wonderful caring, & loving father...sickening:cursing:

anything to hurt his wife; he had to control the situation....he got the boys, alright...after he beat their mama to death...of course he was finally convicted of it too..

[JackiBlu]

It's much ado about nothing, imo.

We know Ron has been arrested numerous times. His rap sheet speaks for itself.

We know that, according to your link, DCF has been called concerning Ron, Misty and Haleigh, so what is your point?

My point is some posters said they read a specific link that stated LE had been called out to the home in the past. If you had been reading the posts you would have known my point.

I'm done with this until I see the link that was mentioned.


JMO

[Mel]

anyone watching JVM???

forgot it was on, & just now turned the TV on:huh:

[panache]

Geez I must be missing something again. All it says in regards to LE is that they will take the lead in all criminal investigations and prosecution. I don't see where DCF contact LE on all abuse claims.


JMO

Wouldn't abuse warrant an investigation? And isn't that when DCYF should notify LE?

Why is it so difficult for you to realize that there was something going on in that household? What keeps you from accepting that it is a possibilty?

Capt. Rose has said so, relatives have said so. Don't you think its best to protect the children rather than the parent?

moo

[titanfan217]

Do you believe the AC guy? He's the only person who has been cleared IMO by LE and he states he saw Haleigh playing outside the afternoon he was there. And I cant provide a link....but it's in the links section.....

I repsectfully disagree with you.....I DO NOT believe that GGS would lie to protect Misty or Ron, especially if she thought either had anything to do with Haleigh's disappearance...IMO


When/where did the AC say anything? People have asked over and over whether the he actually saw Haleigh..

As far as GGM, I've heard 2 or 3 versions including she drove by, she stopped by with someone, maybe an aunt, and either the kids were eating or MC was fixing dinner. On the one where they are eating, nothing about MC was even mentioned but I agree that GGM wouldn't have left the children alone.

And the original was "someone" was sent to check on the children which "proved" that MC was there all night.

[titanfan217]

On Tuesday, Haleigh's mother, 23-year-old Crystal Sheffield, and her grandmother, Marie Griffis, arrived on the scene from Georgia. Griffis initially told the media that there were no problems between her daughter and Cummings; today, however, she told the media that their relationship had been "rocky."

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2009/02/florida-police-say-haleigh-cummings-was-abducted.html?cid=6a00d8341bf67c53ef01156ed2e1b197 0c


but honestly i'm not sure.


There is a Baker County in Georgia, (SW) but I'm pretty sure it's more than 2 hours away.

[calamitygirl]

Bookie I'm with you on this one. I don't feel that Ron did anything to this little girl, And I don't think he was a horrible abusive father either. Everyone can run him down, talk about him having time for a social life etc but he's had the children since 2005, he has provided for them, they have appeared to be healthy and happy. They have been well taken care of, they had a home to live in and by the looks of the video walk through months ago it was a decent place to live. It appeared clean, it wasn't junky. And I remember some posters talking about boxes on the porch with christmas toys in them, how do we know first of all the toys were in those boxes? We keep every box here in storage (of reasonable size that is) as a matter of fact I complain to dh about never throwing boxes away, but he says you never know when you'll need them so be it. So having the boxes there mean nothing. And what if there were some toys in there? Maybe they were being saved because they got a lot at xmas. Who knows? But to assume he was depriving his kids of the toys just by boxes is ridiculous.

And of course the criticism on the xmas stockings hung up but no valentine's stuff, my kids never hung valentines stuff up. Yea we did the cards but not the deco. But the xmas stuff, you had to fight for weeks to get it all down. Maybe the kids liked them there, maybe they asked for them to be left up, what harm would it have done? Ron may not have been the perfect father with all the right choices, but he took care of those kids and even if he had help from family, he still was in their lives. He was lucky enough to have family there for him, not everyone is. And yes he made a mistake in letting the kids with Misty that night, but maybe he didn't think anything woudl happen. They'd been together for a few months at that time and nothing happened before then, why would he think anything would happen that night? yes she was partying the weekend before, but how do we know how messed up she was by the time she got home? Maybe she was tired yea, woudl explain why she went to bed at 10, but that doesn't necessarily mean she was hung over or still messed up. All we know is she went out over the weekend partying, we don't know exactly how messed up she got partying or even if she partied Sunday all day/night.

Now could my mind change about this, yea I could believe he was involved if LE woudl give us something. But this is the impression I get right now.

Perfect post carly. And exactly fits for right now.

[titanfan217]

anyone watching JVM???

forgot it was on, & just now turned the TV on:huh:


Yes, it was getting a bit warm.

KP was about the quietest of the bunch.

[E-U-R]

<snipped>

Haleigh disappeared on Feb 9/10. Misty had been living with Ron for approximately 3 months (moved in w/him in November, if the reports are accurate).

What in the world could have been going on between Misty, Ron & the kids that DCF was out there within the 3 months that Misty was living there?

Three months! Three whole months (maybe a little less) - & already DCF had been called out there?

That is NOT a good sign, IMO.

FROM SAME ARTICLE THAT JACKI LINKED ABOVE:
— but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491008,00.html

That says problems as in plural... so imagine that fact that it was not only one time in just over 3 months

[panache]

Yes, it was getting a bit warm.

KP was about the quietest of the bunch.

Can you give a recap? I was feeding the furbabies.

[JackiBlu]

Wouldn't abuse warrant an investigation? And isn't that when DCYF should notify LE?

Why is it so difficult for you to realize that there was something going on in that household? What keeps you from accepting that it is a possibilty?

Capt. Rose has said so, relatives have said so. Don't you think its best to protect the children rather than the parent?

moo

Yes LE does get involved after the DCF investigation shows the abuse should be a criminal charge. I thought you said in your post they are required by law to call LE on every abuse case they are investigating.

I have never said there was not something going on with DCF prior to Haleigh missing but we don't have a clue what it was.

How does asking for the link posters were talking about that LE had been called to the house in the past get to me protecting a parent?

JMO

[Mel]

Yes, it was getting a bit warm.

KP was about the quietest of the bunch.

dang!...i missed it:mad:

[E-U-R]

In the article, they say they were not called.

Yeah I know that but my point was say if someone (maybe not from the immediate area like maybe Crystal) calls the police on Ron for abuse from her house the cops in rons hood would not have responded to rons house they would have called it in to DCF... like say Haleigh tells her Daddy hit me and she calls the cops they are not going to go out to Rons house they would just have dcf look into it
just a possibility as to why the cops would not have responded yet would be aware of the problems at rons house and with the people within it

[calamitygirl]

Question not just to you, but in general...

Does it ever make you wonder why, when the discussion & debate is when/if Ron did something or another - the counterpoints that are offered do NOT address the questions - but are re-directed to questions about why someone ELSE did/didn't do something?

Why is that?

Why does no one want to address Ron's behavior?

How does discussing what Crystal, Johnny, Marie, cousin this or that, neighbor somebody or another, bus driver, butcher, baker, candlestick maker did answer for Ron's behavior?

I will address Ron's behavior. He has had custody of his kids for the last 4 yrs. IMO, he did the best he knew how to do being a young father. Thats all he can do. Thats all any of us can do. Has some of his behavior been perfect. Not by a long shot. Has any of ours? Have we never done anything stupid? Did most of us do the best that we know how? I believe so.
Bottom line is Ron nor Misty have been accused of any wrongdoing in Haleigh being missing. Until and if that happens, like it or not, they are innocent until proven guilty.

[JackiBlu]

In the article, they say they were not called.

To some it doesn't matter what the article says. They read into how they want to.

JMO

[Mimi428]

FROM SAME ARTICLE THAT JACKI LINKED ABOVE:
— but there have been prior problems with Cummings, Croslin and the children, Putnam County Capt. Steve Rose said.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491008,00.html

That says problems as in plural... so imagine that fact that it was not only one time in just over 3 months

Good point, problems, as in more than one problem.

I have no idea how the schools in that specific district deal with children with a lot of unexcused absences, but I would not think that it would necessarily be something they would always ask DCF for assistance with. Others have pointed out that school was not mandatory at Haleigh's age, but I can definitely appreciate why the school would want her in attendance, since they would lose money every day she was not at school.

I just don't think we have a very good chance of finding out what the DCF issues were about, unless someone in that household is put under arrest. The confidentiality rules are strict when it comes to children, as they should be.

Heck, for all we know, DCF could have been sent to the house because of Misty's young age & her not being in school. Who knows?

JMO

[calamitygirl]

you're correct, Mimi...i agree 100%!

not sure what people are thinking .... it almost comes across as some simply can't get past the fact that the children didn't live w/their mother, therefore she's 'bad' & should be a suspect, & that RC is father of the year...i think it's clear that LE doesn't think of CS as a suspect in Haleigh's disappearance..

jmo

Sorry but I disagree. I don't think its has to do with people thinking whether or not he is or isn't father of the year. IMO, it has more to do with all the abuse allegations put forth by Crystal. And in return, with the abuse allegations comes then why didn't she fight harder for her kids. Because some believe everything or most of it anyways, how rotten Ron is, then if Crystal had fought harder, those kids would have been under Crystals care, and Haleigh might not be missing as she is now.