April 7 [Archive] - Page 2 - In Session Message Boards

Maelstrom5

04-07-2009, 12:04 PM

Very interesting article

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/april062009/child_porn_connect_4-6-09.php

More at the links. IMO, these articles are MUST READS ! I had no idea this was happening or not happening during missing child cases.

This will one to watch ! All other cities should do this and be given the $$$$ to get the job done and PROTECT OUR KIDS !

I snipped your post for space. The FBI has been doing this for some time. Some people at the FBI do nothing but look at child porn in an effort to find victims who have been reported as missing and identify predators so they can be brought to justice. Many times they find a child who has not gone missing but they see something in the pictures or videos they can trace back to a location.

Innocence lost national initiative
www.fbi.gov/innolost/innolost.htm

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:05 PM

God forgive me but I could choke someone with my bare hands who hurts a child.

There will be a long line :cursing:

BANJO GRANNY

04-07-2009, 12:06 PM

My thoughts and prayers go out to this family. To lose a child in anyway is so sad, but to have their there lives took from them by murder is very very sad.

For Sandra May You R.I.P. Sweetheart
I Know In My Heart You Are Wearing Your Angel Wings

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:06 PM

KRON showed a video of the suitcase still in the water. A pretty close pic. I didn't see any red ribbon/strap

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 12:06 PM

Something on, in, or around that piece of luggage lead LE to the church, imo.

May there be swift justice for the "human being" that discarded that beautiful child like garbage.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:07 PM

Late Monday, FBI agents and Tracy police returned to the mobile-home park and served a search warrant on a new location.

Tracy police Sgt. Tony Sheneman called the park a crime scene but would not elaborate.

"We will bring them to justice," Tracy Police Chief Janet Thiessen vowed at the news conference revealing the grim find.

http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090407/A_NEWS/904070326

Stella Rose

04-07-2009, 12:08 PM

I know what you mean, I can't fathom it either.

I do know that these "people" have no place in a decent society. There is something wrong with them and they should be segregated (at the very least) from the rest of the population.

IMO pedophilia is sexual orientation and CANNOT be changed.

It's cases like this that make me want to hunt down all the RSOs in my area and simply shoot them. I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but something has to be done to protect children from these monsters.

Laws just aren't cutting it. Sorry dear Sandra, no one should have to go through what you did. I hope that Danielle and Jessie were waiting for you on the other side.

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 12:09 PM

Does anyone have info on Sandra's siblings? Ages? Boys/girls?

Sandra lived with her mother, her maternal grandparents, two older sisters and a younger brother.

http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_12083949?source=most_emailed

5boxersmom

04-07-2009, 12:09 PM

KRON reports that additional search warrants to be served at church and Pastors home

Wow. Wonder what has led them there at this time and not earlier? Something found with the body?

This is just so heartbreaking.

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 12:11 PM

That's 1 pm Eastern, right?

Yeah......

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:11 PM

Wow. Wonder what has led them there at this time and not earlier? Something found with the body?

This is just so heartbreaking.

Maybe we will know after the PC

n/t

04-07-2009, 12:12 PM

KRON reports that additional search warrants to be served at church and Pastors home

I feel sick. If it's the pastor, I don't know what to say. Someone who is supposed to love and teach children the word of God. Children at that age trust their pastor.

I know my kids adored the priest at my church when they were that age. He was a younger cool guy who used to play soccer and other games with them.

I am so upset.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:13 PM

Search Warrants Target Church Near Mobile Home Park Where Sandra Cantu Lived

TRACY (KRON) -- Investigators searching for the killer of eight-year old Sandra Cantu are serving search warrants Tuesday morning at a church just an eighth of a mile away from the mobile home park where the girl lived.

Police strung crime scene tape around the Clover Road Baptist Church as investigators prepared to scour the property. They're not saying right now how the church may be connected with the investigation.

The search warrants are being served just hours after police confirmed a body found in a suitcase at an irrigation pond about two miles from the church and mobile home park contained the child's remains.

Tracy police say they will release more information at a press conference Tuesday at 3:30 p.m.

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:13 PM

Just trying to catch up, had problems sleeping in the night after such a gut wrenching day yesterday. Can't get the the video of Sandra skipping out of my mind.

Did I read that something in the suitcase is connected to a church? Where is this church? The pastor lives in the Park with an adult male son?

I am confident there will be an arrest of the savage that inflicted this horror very soon, there must be much evidence gleaned from the discovery site. I believe this team is doing a superb job.

Godspeed Sandra.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 12:14 PM

So does the pastor or his family live in the same mobile home park?

happy2bme

04-07-2009, 12:14 PM

I knew it finally I found grandpas interview...and knew she was coloring with a friend...I have searched for this for days as some of you know...

http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090331/A_NEWS02/903310332/-1/A_NEWS

Jose Chavez, the girl's grandfather, said he picked Sandra up from school about 2:45 p.m. Friday and brought her home. Her mother, grandmother and three siblings were at the house, he said.

When she got home, Sandra left to play with a little girl named Kassandra in a home across the trailer park.

The girls played on a wooden swing tied to a tree in front of the house. They sat on the stoop and scribbled with crayons. They went inside and watched some of the movie "Flubber."

Then Kassandra told her mother, Maria Diaz, that Sandra had to go home to do homework, the 36-year-old mother told The Record.

When Sandra arrived home - around 4 p.m., according to a surveillance camera attached to her house - she talked about going to church and a movie with her two older sisters, her grandfather said.

When the girls realized they didn't have enough money to go to a movie, Sandra left again to play, Chavez said.

.

the preachers home was searched it is on right now...

Coloring, skipping away, watching a child's movie .....playing with friends.

Our children in todays society can not even enjoy just being a child. Makes me sick.

When is this going to stop? Seems like IMO it is only getting worse instead of better. Our innocent are paying for it in the worst kind of way.

n/t

04-07-2009, 12:14 PM

I knew it finally I found grandpas interview...and knew she was coloring with a friend...I have searched for this for days as some of you know...

http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090331/A_NEWS02/903310332/-1/A_NEWS

Jose Chavez, the girl's grandfather, said he picked Sandra up from school about 2:45 p.m. Friday and brought her home. Her mother, grandmother and three siblings were at the house, he said.

When she got home, Sandra left to play with a little girl named Kassandra in a home across the trailer park.

The girls played on a wooden swing tied to a tree in front of the house. They sat on the stoop and scribbled with crayons. They went inside and watched some of the movie "Flubber."

Then Kassandra told her mother, Maria Diaz, that Sandra had to go home to do homework, the 36-year-old mother told The Record.

When Sandra arrived home - around 4 p.m., according to a surveillance camera attached to her house - she talked about going to church and a movie with her two older sisters, her grandfather said.

When the girls realized they didn't have enough money to go to a movie, Sandra left again to play, Chavez said.

.

the preachers home was searched it is on right now...

Glad you found it, mom. I know it was driving you nuts.

I'm still confused because we don't see Sandra going in her home after the first friend's house. She walked straight ahead.

Maybe we'll get the answers to those questions soon. :sad:

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 12:16 PM

I feel sick. If it's the pastor, I don't know what to say. Someone who is supposed to love and teach children the word of God. Children at that age trust their pastor.

I know my kids adored the priest at my church when they were that age. He was a younger cool guy who used to play soccer and other games with them.

I am so upset.

If it turns out to be someone associated with the church that Sandra attends, that totally explains why they were probably able to earn her trust and not create a scene.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:17 PM

I was so heartsick last night. I had trouble going to sleep. Just trying to catch up with the latest news of this church being taped off. My who could be so cruel. I'm just praying for this Mother to be somehow comforted.

I tried to go to bed 4 times and kept getting up so got no sleep...the church thing is odd to me also since it was reported by grandpa early on about church...and all of a sudden they have it taped up big time..

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 12:17 PM

So does the pastor or his family live in the same mobile home park?

I think so..

happy2bme

04-07-2009, 12:17 PM

My husband was just saying this morning that the net has undoubtedly incited these hideous SO's and made it easier for them to communicate with one another and swap child porn. God have mercy on their souls is all I can say. Who would even let their mind even go to such a dark and evil place.

That's why they should like the SO's up for good the first time they harm a child. IMO

playnice

04-07-2009, 12:17 PM

If that paster ends up being the perp it will will rock that community, not that they arent already shaken and devastated by this.

n/t

04-07-2009, 12:17 PM

Coloring, skipping away, watching a child's movie .....playing with friends.

Our children in todays society can not even enjoy just being a child. Makes me sick.

When is this going to stop? Seems like IMO it is only getting worse instead of better. Our innocent are paying for it in the worst kind of way.

Ever watch To Catch a Predator on MSNBC. 60 year old men preying on girls as young as 12 years old online and wanting to meet them. SICK SICK SICK

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:17 PM

So does the pastor or his family live in the same mobile home park?

The pastor does.

KRON just said that tire tracks and footprints were found where Sandra was found

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 12:18 PM

If it turns out to be someone associated with the church that Sandra attends, that totally explains why they were probably able to earn her trust and not create a scene.

That is true..She could have been told to go and help with some upcoming Easter things:sad:

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:18 PM

If it turns out to be someone associated with the church that Sandra attends, that totally explains why they were probably able to earn her trust and not create a scene.

noticed another name on the home address also and was not the name of any kids on the church website...not sure who it is..

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 12:18 PM

If that paster ends up being the perp it will will rock that community, not that they arent already shaken and devastated by this.

It sure will........

happy2bme

04-07-2009, 12:19 PM

Thanks for keeping this thread updated. I will see you guys this afternoon.

Prayers for this family.

5swab5

04-07-2009, 12:21 PM

The pastor does.

KRON just said that tire tracks and footprints were found where Sandra was found

Great! Every little bit helps.

playnice

04-07-2009, 12:22 PM

Hate to say it, but I look for these types of crimes to escalate as time goes by. Because of the Internet. Probably as soon as FBI & other LE break these sicko's codes they communicae with, they come up with newer codes and programs.

Few yrs ago there was a child porn ring broken by FBI and even some grandparents were using their grandchildren to sell photos of if that isn't unbelievable.

You may be right. Pervs that wouldnt go in a porn shop because someone may recognize can now sit at home and watch any kind of sexual act right on the computer. They feed their brain with garbage until they are obsessed with playing it out for real.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 12:22 PM

Worst case the pastor himself, second worse would be a family member of the pastor.

edit- well really it all just suks.

~jomomma~

04-07-2009, 12:24 PM

thanks for the updates everybody! :smile:

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:25 PM

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:25 PM

Glad you found it, mom. I know it was driving you nuts.

I'm still confused because we don't see Sandra going in her home after the first friend's house. She walked straight ahead.

Maybe we'll get the answers to those questions soon. :sad:

I figured you would say that since I kept saying it but could not find it to prove it..you were even nice enough to say no link needed..I do not know why all that has never been said since but I did know grandpa had said she came back and wanted to go to a movie or church and then when bugout kept saying she thought she had a back pack on to carry coloring books or something I remembered that being said also...still can not tell but they said she had no back pack so not sure..just glad I finally found it even though everyone was not bashing me for not providing a link...

DeeN

04-07-2009, 12:25 PM

Another one :crying:

Snipped:
By JULIANA BARBASSA, AP

TRACY, Calif. (April 7) - The body of a missing 8-year-old girl has been found in a suitcase dumped in an irrigation pond a few miles from her northern California home.
Sandra Cantu was found Monday after a 10-day search, authorities announced.

Link: http://news.aol.com/article/california-girl-cantu-dead/416950?icid=main|htmlws-main|dl1|link3|http%3A%2F%2Fnews.aol.com%2Farticle %2Fcalifornia-girl-cantu-dead%2F416950

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:26 PM

The church is an eighth of a mile away? But Sandra was walking in the opposite direction from the Park entrance. Where does the pastor live in relation to the direction of Sandra's walking on the video? Anyone know? Could the pastor or his son has been driving on that road and given her a ride to the church? I wonder if any video saw the pastor's car around the same time?
I can't remember if the entrance to the Park has surveillance video.

it has been reported that he lives in #57....don't know where that is in relation

ETA reporter said the church is 1/2 mile away

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 12:27 PM

Worst case the pastor himself, second worse would be a family member of the pastor.

edit- well really it all just suks.

Or, perhaps a person unrelated to the pastor who the pastor has taken in............

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:29 PM

The pastor does.

KRON just said that tire tracks and footprints were found where Sandra was found

They found a LOT of tire tracks and footprints around the site. You could see ithem on the feed. They will need to investigate all those tracks and hopefully isolate the right ones. Hopefully there are other clues, they did put down a lot of evidence markers yesterday.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 12:30 PM

Or, perhaps a person unrelated to the pastor who the pastor has taken in............

Good point.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:30 PM

The church is an eighth of a mile away? But Sandra was walking in the opposite direction from the Park entrance. Where does the pastor live in relation to the direction of Sandra's walking on the video? Anyone know? Could the pastor or his son has been driving on that road and given her a ride to the church? I wonder if any video saw the pastor's car around the same time?
I can't remember if the entrance to the Park has surveillance video.

I posted a address in the park and they did report his home was searched late last night he does live in the park. .I guess since it has been reported now it is ok to say it has been the one they searched last night after they had the press conf.

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:33 PM

I posted a address in the park and they did report his home was searched late last night he does live in the park. .I guess since it has been reported now it is ok to say it has been the one they searched last night after they had the press conf.

If they searched his home late last night, that's very telling. I wonder what led them to that, something in the suitcase?? My god, the PASTOR'S home?

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:34 PM

it has been reported that he lives in #57....don't know where that is in relation

ETA reporter said the church is 1/2 mile away

her home number is #63 IIRC that is what is on the front of the home his is the home listed him his wife and another person..I posted it all this morning showing the maps and names. #57

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:37 PM

her home number is #63 IIRC that is what is on the front of the home his is the home listed him his wife and another person..I posted it all this morning showing the maps and names. #57

yep! I want to know just who Clifford is???? I know we could be way off....but from the Pastors website it doesn't appear to be one of his kids. IMO

dgfred

04-07-2009, 12:37 PM

If they searched his home late last night, that's very telling. I wonder what led them to that, something in the suitcase?? My god, the PASTOR'S home?

What a nightmare.

Ninja108

04-07-2009, 12:38 PM

I pray she didn't suffer at all and that they catch the monster who did this to her.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:39 PM

If you zabba lane lawless, one of them is says a relative is a pastor..

PASTOR LANE LAWLESS
wife, Connie, They have three grown children Brian, Brett, and Joni, who are all involved in God's work, and nine beloved grandchildren

http://www.clover-road-baptist-church.com/Pastor1.html

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:39 PM

with the exception of kron channel 4 is there anywhere else the presser is being streamed? dam work won't let me download the USTREAM:cursing:

you could try http://www.fox40.com/pages/main
maybe they will have it at 10

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:39 PM

Is the church cordoned off, could the pastor or someone related have given Sandra a lift there? I'd like to know if there's surveillance video at the Park entrance and if a vehicle related to the pastor was seen leaving out of the Park.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:40 PM

PASTOR LANE LAWLESS
wife, Connie, They have three grown children Brian, Brett, and Joni, who are all involved in God's work, and nine beloved grandchildren

http://www.clover-road-baptist-church.com/Pastor1.html

Maybe Clifford is a granchild????

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 12:41 PM

I pray she didn't suffer at all and that they catch the monster who did this to her.

I have always believed that when a child is being killed, God takes the child Home right then..I don't think He would let children feel any pain..
This I have to believe..

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:41 PM

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 12:42 PM

I pray she didn't suffer at all and that they catch the monster who did this to her.

Unfortunately, realistically speaking, at the very least I'm sure she suffered:

fear
disorientation
a dreaded feeling of betrayal

I think that is the very best we can hope for at this point

But I will pray that she didn't suffer along with you.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:42 PM

yep! I want to know just who Clifford is???? I know we could be way off....but from the Pastors website it doesn't appear to be one of his kids. IMO

I know and I wondered just what you are saying KK
May have noting to do with the pastor..not sure who the 3rd person is..not a child we do know that not sure about a grandchild..or someone they have taken in..but to have the name listed in the white pages..hummm

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:44 PM

yes it is taped off...waiting for a search warrant (per KRON)

Thanks KKKKKKatie. They must have reason to believe she was taken there? This is horrible, a church is a sanctuary.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:44 PM

I know and I wondered just what you are saying KK
May have noting to do with the pastor..not sure who the 3rd person is..not a child we do know that not sure about a grandchild..or someone they have taken in..but to have the name listed in the white pages..hummm

I have been trying to find a link to the Public Records for Tracy....can't find it. Have you looked???

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:46 PM

Thanks KKKKKKatie. They must have reason to believe she was taken there? This is horrible, a church is a sanctuary.

there is also a shed on the property that KRON says they are waiting on a search warrant for it also :sad:

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 12:47 PM

Police Closing in on Suspect

Police say they are closing in on a suspect in the death of 8-year-old Sandra Cantu, whose body was found stuffed into a suitcase Monday, 10 days after the second-grader vanished from the mobile home park where she lived.

Authorities roped off a mobile home park where an 8-year-old northern California girl was last seen, searching for clues to her death after her body was found a few miles away inside a suitcase left in an irrigation pond.

"It's not as big a mystery as it was," before, Tracy, Calif. Police Sgt. Tony Sheneman told ABCNews.com, "and we believe we're getting significantly closer."

"We're hopeful that we will have something in the next couple of days," he said.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7275611&page=1

dgfred

04-07-2009, 12:48 PM

there is also a shed on the property that KRON says they are waiting on a search warrant for it also :sad:

At the church or the pastor's home?

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 12:52 PM

Here's a google map of the 3 key locations in this case

A: Orchard Estate Mobile Home
B: 11000 W Clover Rd, Tracy, CA 95376 (Clover Road Baptist Church)
C: irrigation ditch: Bacchetti Rd, Tracy, CA 95304

http://local.google.com/local?f=q&hl=en&q=812+West+Clover+Road+Tracy+CA

Add: Sorry, it doesn't seem to be working but for those interested, you can plug in the locations and get an idea of where the places are in relation to each other.

lune3

04-07-2009, 12:52 PM

If it weren't for the drainage of the pond, or if the suitcase had been dumped elsewhere, she may never have been found. With this new direction leading to someone other than those first people who were questioned, that suitcase really must have significant clues.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:53 PM

http://www.kron4.com/News/ArticleView/tabid/298/smid/1126/ArticleID/961/reftab/36/t/Search-Warrants-Target-Church-Near-Mobile-Home-Park-Where-Sandra-Cantu-Lived/Default.aspx

A shed omg it is so small???the church had officers there all night..Pastor is perhaps a family friends or relative:confused: should be searching it with in an hour...just media so don't know..they seem to get it wrong alot..the main focus is the little shed next to the church..

KTXL FOX 40

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:54 PM

At the church or the pastor's home?

the church

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 12:55 PM

Here's a google map of the 3 key locations in this case

A: mobile home
B: church
C: irrigation ditch

http://local.google.com/local?f=q&hl=en&q=812+West+Clover+Road+Tracy+CA

you are great thank you so much..

dgfred

04-07-2009, 12:55 PM

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 12:57 PM

news conference coming up in a few minutes

http://kron.com/News/WatchKRON4NewsLiveOnline/tabid/354/Default.aspx

Dove

04-07-2009, 12:59 PM

news conference coming up in a few minutes

http://kron.com/News/WatchKRON4NewsLiveOnline/tabid/354/Default.aspx

Thanks so sad for the family.

RIP Sandy

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 01:00 PM

koawally

04-07-2009, 01:04 PM

Maybe we will know after the PC

Saw a video a couple of days ago of a man in his early 20's(baseball cap on) that LE were interested in...could it be the pasters son???

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:04 PM

On intellus it shows Clifford Lawless as 77 years old.

Relatives

Pstr Lane Lawless
Connie Lane Lawless
Clane Lawless
Lane C Lawless
Joni I Lawless

lune3

04-07-2009, 01:05 PM

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:05 PM

Saw a video a couple of days ago of a man in his early 20's(baseball cap on) that LE were interested in...could it be the pasters son???

Don't know koa

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:06 PM

Has the presser started?

not yet......

Amy

04-07-2009, 01:07 PM

It's so frightening, scampi. I don't think they're safe anywhere. So sad for our children to have to live in fear. And for the parents too. :sad:

I think that, until the courts face the fact that pedophiles ARE NOT REHABITABLE (well, you know what I mean) and keep them off the streets, once they are caught, it isn't going to get any better. I am sure there will always be more pedophiles coming up the pike, but for pete's sake, let's cut that number as much as we can by locking those caught up forever.

I think castration is a good idea--slow, without benefit of antesthetic, then place them all in one place well away from society. I think Alcatraz would fit the bill. They can grow their own food there, take some of the burden off society.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:07 PM

I can't find any site in Tracy or the county to look up public records online.

Can someone else help me out???

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:08 PM

IS there just a black box showing?TIA

they are in commercial right now...so yes

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 01:11 PM

I can't find any site in Tracy or the county to look up public records online.

Can someone else help me out???

Google gave me these links

http://publicrecords.onlinesearches.com/CA_SanJoaquin.htm

http://recordsproject.com/county/california/san-joaquin.asp

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:11 PM

I wonder, could some religious icon, that connects to this church, have been left with Sandra? Could be the perpetrator did something or left something ritualistic out of guilt, particularly if he was connected to the church. It's chilling to think the Pastor may have been involved, I just can't believe it.

The pastor had been at this church for over 20 years....IIRC since like 1980 or 1981......IMO that is a long long time to completely hide a secret like this one......I mean you just dont wake up one day and become a pedophile......I cant believe that he did this and I cant believe that he might be involved at all.......

Tia

04-07-2009, 01:12 PM

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:13 PM

Google gave me these links

http://publicrecords.onlinesearches.com/CA_SanJoaquin.htm

http://recordsproject.com/county/california/san-joaquin.asp

thanks dar...I found that but it takes you to a site you have pay for the info

koawally

04-07-2009, 01:13 PM

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:14 PM

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:15 PM

I don't think it's the pastor...someone else in the home though

I'm guessing it's someone the Pastor reached out to help................

lune3

04-07-2009, 01:16 PM

The pastor had been at this church for over 20 years....IIRC since like 1980 or 1981......IMO that is a long long time to completely hide a secret like this one......I mean you just dont wake up one day and become a pedophile......I cant believe that he did this and I cant believe that he might be involved at all.......

I can't believe it either. It's possible that Sandra did end up at this church somehow but the perp was in that area, that it was an opportunistic crime. But then, he would have needed access to a suitcase which is unlikely unless he took her home.

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:17 PM

I can't believe it either. It's possible that Sandra did end up at this church somehow but the perp was in that area, that it was an opportunistic crime. But then, he would have needed access to a suitcase which is unlikely unless he took her home.

My guess is the suitcase came from the Pastors home. Someone living with the Pastor

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:17 PM

And every time we make progress on the ONE STRIKE LAW, the activists groups jump in and say that if we pass a one strike law, we will be putting 18 year old boys that have consensual sex with a 17 year old partner behind bars for life.

For heavens sake, do we, as a society, really lack the intelligence to differentiate between a couple of kids in high school having sex and a pedophile attacking a child?

Yes we as a society can differentiate between consentual sex and a pedophile......however our laws have to be re-written to acknowledge the difference IMO

Barbara fl.

04-07-2009, 01:18 PM

I think that, until the courts face the fact that pedophiles ARE NOT REHABITABLE (well, you know what I mean) and keep them off the streets, once they are caught, it isn't going to get any better. I am sure there will always be more pedophiles coming up the pike, but for pete's sake, let's cut that number as much as we can by locking those caught up forever.

I think castration is a good idea--slow, without benefit of antesthetic, then place them all in one place well away from society. I think Alcatraz would fit the bill. They can grow their own food there, take some of the burden off society.

I always said that about child molesters...they do not deserve a second chance....their second chance only means not to get caught again...so now they not only molest the child but kill them afterwards....

I truly believe that before they are released back into society they should be castrated.....give them the option...stay in jail or castration...

But then you have the ones that will fight it and say that it is unconstitutional and inhumane treatment and it's to H**L with the poor child that they get their hands on....

I say NO second chance....we are hit up for taxes for everything else...I wont mind paying more taxes to keep these creeps locked up for good...build prisons just for these child molesters on some island where they can never hurt another child......

They keep a person in jail longer for not paying child support then the ones who molest and murder children.....they need to get their priorities straight....

My heart is broken once again.....it seems everyday is another heart breaking story....

emdragon

04-07-2009, 01:19 PM

And every time we make progress on the ONE STRIKE LAW, the activists groups jump in and say that if we pass a one strike law, we will be putting 18 year old boys that have consensual sex with a 17 year old partner behind bars for life.

For heavens sake, do we, as a society, really lack the intelligence to differentiate between a couple of kids in high school having sex and a pedophile attacking a child?

Yes it seems we do since those 18 year olds convicted of statutory rape are branded for life as sex offenders and must register everywhere they go.

lune3

04-07-2009, 01:20 PM

My guess is the suitcase came from the Pastors home. Someone living with the Pastor

I tend to agree. Since a search was conducted late last night, there must have been a significant indication that the suitcase or other clue led to the pastors home.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:22 PM

Oh My.............

who the heck is that???? Is the name male or female???

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:22 PM

Yes we as a society can differentiate between consentual sex and a pedophile......however our laws have to be re-written to acknowledge the difference IMO

sounds easy enough.

Where there's a will, there's a way.

IMO, the reason the law does not get passed is because there are far more perverts out there than just the ones that get caught. One Strike Law would initially fill our prisons to max capacity until the pervs figured it out.

How many more of our children have to die?

lune3

04-07-2009, 01:23 PM

Also, that appears to be a locked storage area, belonging to the church.

Not likely a drifter would have a key.

If evidence is found in that shed, then it's probable they will make an arrest very soon based on who has a key.

Amy

04-07-2009, 01:23 PM

Has anything been said about if and when the child was given her dinner? I find it odd that it is not in the time logs.

She was last seen about 4-5 pm, so am thinking that dinner hadn't come up yet? Of course, that would depend on the family's habit, but that does seem a little early for dinner.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:24 PM

I'm guessing it's someone the Pastor reached out to help................

could be it is very common for pastors to do that..

lune3

04-07-2009, 01:26 PM

Just had a thought. What if the pastor, on learning the news yesterday, informed LE that one of his suitcases was missing. Therefore the rapid investigation of his home.
This Martinez fellow living in the pastor's home, if indeed he does?

merical

04-07-2009, 01:26 PM

I have a hard time wrapping my little brain around the pastor as a suspect. I would imagine that with three children and thirty-ish years under his belt as a pastor, that he did something like that. The thing is, who hires caretakers for the church? Would he give the job to someone he is helping get on their feet? Wouldn't that individual have a key to the shed?

Assuming the pastor wasn't involved, can you imagine the guilt of knowing you are directly responsible for putting a SO in close proximity to kids? How awful all the way around.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:26 PM

Yeah, but then her not being reported missing until 8 is really odd too... you would think they would have been alarmed that she didn't return for dinner. Unless they did and they looked for awhile prior to calling, I'm not sure.

I would think that is what happened museum...I'm sure they looked before they called LE IMO

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:28 PM

ok KK I hate to be a pain but i don't see a presser?? it's was supposed to start 25 minutes ago? just want to make sure i don't miss it...

it keeps breaking in just leave it up
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/kron-4-news

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:28 PM

emdragon

04-07-2009, 01:28 PM

sounds easy enough.

Where there's a will, there's a way.

IMO, the reason the law does not get passed is because there are far more perverts out there than just the ones that get caught. One Strike Law would initially fill our prisons to max capacity until the pervs figured it out.

How many more of our children have to die?

Well and there is the problem- if they know they will go away for life they have more reason to make sure they leave no witnesses.
We know the DP isn't a deterrent and all a one strike law would do is give a perp more reason to just kill their victim. Less chance of them getting caught and essentially the same sentence if they are.

There has to be another solution- and I say we start with implanted GPS locators, and development of better drugs that suppress the impulses.

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:28 PM

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:32 PM

Well and there is the problem- if they know they will go away for life they have more reason to make sure they leave no witnesses.
We know the DP isn't a deterrent and all a one strike law would do is give a perp more reason to just kill their victim. Less chance of them getting caught and essentially the same sentence if they are.

There has to be another solution- and I say we start with implanted GPS locators, and development of better drugs that suppress the impulses.

Sorry. Can't go there. Once they harm a child, lock them up. A girl in Washington was just killed by a pedophile wearing a tracking device.

Let them only molest, rape or kill once. And be done with them

Tia

04-07-2009, 01:32 PM

Yeah, but then her not being reported missing until 8 is really odd too... you would think they would have been alarmed that she didn't return for dinner. Unless they did and they looked for awhile prior to calling, I'm not sure.

I think most people would look around first, calling friends homes, etc., chekcing all the places she could have been before calling the police.

JMO

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:33 PM

Well and there is the problem- if they know they will go away for life they have more reason to make sure they leave no witnesses.
We know the DP isn't a deterrent and all a one strike law would do is give a perp more reason to just kill their victim. Less chance of them getting caught and essentially the same sentence if they are.

There has to be another solution- and I say we start with implanted GPS locators, and development of better drugs that suppress the impulses.

Chemical castration might work if we could ensure that the meds were taken.....but that isnt going to repair their broken brains.......a pedophile's brain isnt fixable.....IMO......

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 01:33 PM

Is the PC suppose to be 1:00 their time?

That would be 4:00 EST.

thanks.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:33 PM

Profirio sounds like a male name given the "o" at the end. If this guy's address is listed the same as the Pastor's, either he must have been living with the family a while, or this is just an outdated listing.

I am going with the outdated addy tried to pull it up and gave a lot of addresses

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:35 PM

KK you just hush and set there and be good:tonguewag:

I'll try LOL

Were there any pictures on his myspace page?

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:35 PM

Chemical castration might work if we could ensure that the meds were taken.....but that isnt going to repair their broken brains.......a pedophile's brain isnt fixable.....IMO......

IMO one strike and that person loses their right to breathe air.......they're done.......

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 01:35 PM

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 01:36 PM

Chemical castration might work if we could ensure that the meds were taken.....but that isn't going to repair their broken brains.......a pedophiles brain isn't fixable.....IMO......

I don't think that would work either. They would only find other tools and ways to torture, rape and sodomize these innocent children.

imo

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:36 PM

Is the PC suppose to be 1:00 their time?

That would be 4:00 EST.

thanks.

no...it was supposed to start at 10....1/2 hour ago. But they are saying it should start any moment now

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:36 PM

getting ready I think..
http://www.fox40.com/pages/search_for_sandra

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/kron-4-news

n/t

04-07-2009, 01:36 PM

This link says police are closing in on the suspect.

Police Closing In on Suspect
"It's not as big a mystery as it was," before, said Tracy, Calif., police Sgt. Tony Sheneman to ABCNews.com, "and we believe we're getting significantly closer."
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7275611&page=1

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 01:37 PM

GB it's going to start shortly: http://www.fox40.com/pages/search_for_sandra

Thank you, I have errands to run too and I wanted to wait if it is now.

So it is running late?

imo

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:38 PM

and who would make sure they took their meds?

That's the whole freaken problem.........you cant ensure any of it ........

emdragon

04-07-2009, 01:38 PM

and who would make sure they took their meds?

Oh that one is easy- drugs formulated and implanted like norplant. It is the same thing I keep saying they should do with schizophrenics.

5boxersmom

04-07-2009, 01:38 PM

HLN is carrying it too.

lune3

04-07-2009, 01:39 PM

I really wonder after yesterday's news, whether the pastor recognized he had a similar suitcase, and checked his own. Called LE immediately and hence the sudden search last night. What a horror to find your own suitcase missing if that's the case.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:39 PM

we are not going to get to much right now..home and church are connected

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:39 PM

church to be searched when CSI is finished with last nights finds....later this afternoon

Stella Rose

04-07-2009, 01:40 PM

I hope it's resolved very soon too... the community needs to have that to be able to breath again.

I hate to be negative, but no community can breathe with all these pedo-monsters on the loose. Look at the RSOs in your area - you will be shocked and sickened on how many there are. 100+ in a 5 mile radius of my home.

I got an alarm system installed a week after I found that out.

We are all potential victims of these creeps. Old, young, doesn't matter.

boo

04-07-2009, 01:40 PM

Sounds like they're on to something with the church. I haven't seen this mentioned and it may not even matter, but Tracy is a very small, agricultural town up in Central California. It houses one of the State's biggest prisons, Deuel Vocational (DVI).

I don't know why they've made it such a trade tech sounding prison, but it is as hardcore as it gets. I have been there many times for hearings and all of those times it was for 1st degree murder charges.

I would be curious to know how far the prison is from the trailer park. I'm at work so I can't really check, but convicted felons are released from that prison every day, including registered sex offenders.

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:40 PM

That's the whole freaken problem.........you cant ensure any of it ........

IMO....you hurt a child in that way.....I think we should have " the shot while trying to escape " scenario.......Courts take too long.....

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:41 PM

no indication that a body was in the suitcase before hand. No one in custody and no one detained

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:42 PM

I did notice that the Sgt. referred to "perpetrators :confused:

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:43 PM

Oh that one is easy- drugs formulated and implanted like norplant. It is the same thing I keep saying they should do with schizophrenics.

What about immunity after a period of time to the medication and it stops working? Building up a tolerance........ or a reaction....Happens quite frequently with anti psychotic meds.....IMO

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:44 PM

Sgt. Sheneman. Could be Scheneman.....

Tracy PD following several leads to determine who's responsible. Can't comment on specific leads. Everyone aware of search warrant served at mobile home park and the church. Been receiving calls from public wanting to send cash, cards, and flowers. They are asking that all mail be sent to Tracy PD. Anyone interested in sending cash donations should contact Sund-Carrington Foundation.

any cards can be sent to the Tracy PD I know I will be sending the family a card...

Tracy police
Police Department
1000 Civic Center Drive
Tracy, CA 95376

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:44 PM

they went to commercial:cursing::cursing:

emdragon

04-07-2009, 01:45 PM

I hate to be negative, but no community can breathe with all these pedo-monsters on the loose. Look at the RSOs in your area - you will be shocked and sickened on how many there are. 100+ in a 5 mile radius of my home.

I got an alarm system installed a week after I found that out.

We are all potential victims of these creeps. Old, young, doesn't matter.

I'm luckier than most we have only 2 both level 2 offenders.

But the registered ones aren't the ones to worry about- you know who they are it is all the ones who haven't been caught that are the real problem.

We hear these horrible cases of known SO attacking and killing but the reality is that number while it seems high really isn't when you compare it to the number of assaults that take place unreported every day across the country.

CaresForKids

04-07-2009, 01:46 PM

I am so sorry little Sandra. :sad:

Stella Rose

04-07-2009, 01:48 PM

adpilove

04-07-2009, 01:49 PM

I did notice that the Sgt. referred to "perpetrators :confused:

I noticed it too and zeroed in on it RIGHT away.

Crispy

04-07-2009, 01:50 PM

oh man looking at clock what time is that EST? ( I think I'll be home by then)

Should be 6:30 EST.

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 01:51 PM

I did notice that the Sgt. referred to "perpetrators :confused:

He said that 10 SWs have been issued.

Are they thinking this has to do with some kind of child porn ring?

imo

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 01:52 PM

they went to commercial:cursing::cursing:

KK you can run errands now next press conf at 3:30..so I guess you can go now..lol..I am thinking they have to wait for the warrant for the church since it is not being searched yet:confused:

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 01:53 PM

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 01:54 PM

Sgt. said CSI had to get some sleep before they go to the Church IIRC

Stella Rose

04-07-2009, 01:54 PM

Chemical castration might work if we could ensure that the meds were taken.....but that isnt going to repair their broken brains.......a pedophile's brain isnt fixable.....IMO......

Oh, I disagree. It's quite fixable. One shot and it's permenantly fixed.

Sorry, I am just mad as he!! today. I should just sit on my hands.

Amy

04-07-2009, 01:55 PM

I am not sure about fingerprints as the bag has been in the pond but the inside should provide body fluids (oils) and skin cells. When we go on vacation we put freshly washed clothing into them but when we return the clothing has been worn, there should be a wealth of DNA on the inside.

But, wouldn't the pond water seep into the bag? If it had been submerged @ any point, it would seem that the water would fill all the empty space, and since it wasn't plain water, the chemicals and such could ruin the entire surfaces, inside and out.

n/t

04-07-2009, 01:56 PM

Thanks for the updates. Sounds like they know who did this and are just waiting to dot their i's and cross their t's.

Very encouraging that Sandra will get justice soon. :rose:

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 01:58 PM

Oh, I disagree. It's quite fixable. One shot and it's permenantly fixed.

Sorry, I am just mad as he!! today. I should just sit on my hands.

I agree with you completely......Please read my other post...I think that any pedophile should be " shot while trying to escape".....

Maelstrom5

04-07-2009, 02:00 PM

I think most people would look around first, calling friends homes, etc., chekcing all the places she could have been before calling the police.

JMO

I agree with you. Many times I read where people think the family must be involved if several hours go by before the police are called. But for most people the last thing on there mind is that their child was abducted.

You find that the family spent that time searching on their own; fearing their child may have been hurt, but sure their missing child was just around the next bend in the road or at the end of the line at next house they called. Most of the time their instincts turn out to be correct and the child is quickly recovered. But when it turns out not be the case: for those families the fact they did not call LE right away haunts them for the rest of their life.

Amy

04-07-2009, 02:00 PM

Where did you find that? I didnt hear that..

I don't remember where I heard it, but it was on one of the videos from last night, I think. Might have also read it in print w/the article along w/the video.

5boxersmom

04-07-2009, 02:00 PM

If a Sexual Predator is under age do they have to register?

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:00 PM

Oh, I disagree. It's quite fixable. One shot and it's permenantly fixed.

Sorry, I am just mad as he!! today. I should just sit on my hands.

sad isn't it I have 18 SO just within a mile of me and most are the highest level I think they stick close together for some reason..and I live in a nice neighborhood..I get the email alert so I can let anyone with young kids know..my neighbor has 4 little girls..so I try to help watch out for them..my kids are older thank god..

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 02:02 PM

But, wouldn't the pond water seep into the bag? If it had been submerged @ any point, it would seem that the water would fill all the empty space, and since it wasn't plain water, the chemicals and such could ruin the entire surfaces, inside and out.

I don't think so. The material was most likely water repellent and LE said it was sealed and floating....so there were still air pockets inside of the suitcase. It is sealed pretty tight once the zipper closes all the way around.

Also the decomp gasses ( pains me to write that) would also make the luggage rise to the top of the water.

I hope everything they found was intact because that gives them much more evidence to work with.

How warm had it been in Tracy at the time she was missing?

imo

Stella Rose

04-07-2009, 02:03 PM

I'd be ok with that, unfortunately its always after the fact.

They seem to kill the victim to prevent being identified as a pedophile and being charged with sexual crimes, its such a waste of a child.
They get caught anyhow.

Whats in their head, to think that an innocent child should suffer for their sickness.

I just don't understand.

I know, this just makes me so angry - there are no words. For the children who do survive these monsters, they have to live with what happened their whole lives. It's excrutiating.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:03 PM

If a Sexual Predator is under age do they have to register?

umm not sure but they should have to..have never seen anyone under the age of 18 but not sure good question

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 02:03 PM

If a Sexual Predator is under age do they have to register?

That usually goes under a juvie sealed record according to the laws in my state..........but............the offender is usually placed in lock-up in a juvenile facility with intensive counseling......sometimes at age 18according to the severity of the crime, the offender is transferred to an adult facility....IMO

juliekan

04-07-2009, 02:05 PM

If a Sexual Predator is under age do they have to register?

In Texas they do...I saw where there was a 14 yo in the next neighborhood over from me on the list from TDPS.

emdragon

04-07-2009, 02:07 PM

If a Sexual Predator is under age do they have to register?

Yes they do.

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 02:08 PM

umm not sure but they should have to..have never seen anyone under the age of 18 but not sure good question

I dont know either but didnt the Prosecutors say that the girl that took nude pictures of herself and put them on MySpace (I think) was going to have to register as a sex offender because it was considered child porn due to her being underage?

So I guess even juveniles have to register.

imo

Amy

04-07-2009, 02:08 PM

I don't know. I'm not really married to the thought of a car accident, I'm just feeling this isn't going to turn out to be what I thought all along - that a pedophile snatched her, had sex with her and murdered her.

This looks like panic to me. Usually when predators kill children, I'm amazed at how brash and self-assured their crimes appear to be. As if they have a right to the child's life.

Folding her up fully clothed, in a suitcase and putting her in that small pond - looks to me like someone who doesn't have a criminal mind and doesn't have intent to use and disrespect her. And was in such a complete panic that they couldn't even think of a reasonable way to hide her.

At any rate, I think we'll know by tonight what happened. It seems like they're closing in on finding out.

The pond has powerful chemicals. I would think a criminal mind would realize that. Even if the person knows the pond would eventually be drained, he could hope it would not be until after the chemicals have had a chance to obliberate not only any evidence, but to also make it quite difficult to identify the person in the bag.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:08 PM

I don't think so. The material was most likely water repellent and LE said it was sealed and floating....so there were still air pockets inside of the suitcase. It is sealed pretty tight once the zipper closes all the way around.

Also the decomp gasses ( pains me to write that) would also make the luggage rise to the top of the water.

I hope everything they found was intact because that gives them much more evidence to work with.

How warm had it been in Tracy at the time she was missing?

imo

I agree they can find alot in there hair fibers they have so much better testing these days..and I pray she scratched the holy heck out of who ever it was and the dna is under her nail...
not sure about weather but that will change the dec change I am still shocked they did not smell it..ugh sorry I hate saying that..

5boxersmom

04-07-2009, 02:10 PM

Thanks everyone. :thumbsup:

boo

04-07-2009, 02:12 PM

I just googled the Tracy State Prison and it is 6 miles from the church/trailer park.

At this point, I don't think there is any connection going that direction.

So sad.

lune3

04-07-2009, 02:12 PM

Regarding perpetrators, "person or persons", and the previous speculation of a child porn ring........does anyone remember in which home that men's hair dye and possible evidence of long hair being cut, was? Those strands of hair were to be sent for examination, but we never again heard anything about that.

royals02

04-07-2009, 02:13 PM

I don't know who or where it came from about Sandra wanting to go to church on Friday...but from the pastor's website there does not appear to be any type of services on fridays....just Wed and Sun

lune3

04-07-2009, 02:16 PM

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:17 PM

I dont know either but didnt the Prosecutors say that the girl that took nude pictures of herself and put them on MySpace (I think) was going to have to register as a sex offender because it was considered child porn due to her being underage?

So I guess even juveniles have to register.

imo

yes I heard about that she is being charged with child porn or something like that right??also they are breaking down on these kids for sexting sending pics over their cellphones..so you may be right..what you thinking GB a minor may have done something you getting a vide..I am wondering what is leading them to this shed..and if the pastor called in why would they rush the home like that last night if he had called and said he noticed the luggage..:confused:

Amy

04-07-2009, 02:17 PM

I am getting confused. There isn't a service or any type of gathering on Friday?

Where are you hearing this, mom? TIA

Is the live link showing the church still? When I looked it just had the regular news and weather on there.

imo

Grandpa didn't seem to think it odd that the girls had talked about going to church (he said church and the movies, but they didn't have enough money) on that particular night. It could have been a kid thing. DD used to go to the Salvation Army church and there were Friday night things for the kids to do. I know there were times the "things to do" included a movie, or going to the Y to swim. So, maybe no "church" service, but some type of gathering for the kids?

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 02:17 PM

Im wondering if her body was in that shed before she was put in a suitcase..

Kip

04-07-2009, 02:18 PM

Finding Sandra -- the church and water connection -- brought back memories of a murder in my town 20 years ago. A 12-year-old girl left her house to walk to the store to get ice cream and disappeared. She was murdered in a church and her body was found days later in garbage bag in a creek. The perp (a Sunday School teacher) was heavily into phone porn (no internet back then).

I just googled the case and her school friends are having a big memorial for her later this month -- it's nice to know so many people have remembered her all these years.

Rest in peace, Sandra. And prayers for you and your family.

lune3

04-07-2009, 02:20 PM

Im wondering if her body was in that shed before she was put in a suitcase..

If that's the case, LE will narrow down suspects due to that shed being locked and needing a key.

sunstar

04-07-2009, 02:20 PM

From the presser:

1. Autopsy in progress

2. They did not know that there was a body in the suitcase until they opened it up.

The second bit makes me think that maybe she wasn't in there that long if there was no decomp odor. IMO
Hi everyone and thanks so much for the updates for those of us here at work who can't watch! :smile: I was just thinking about LE not knowing a body was inside the suitcase and I interpret it as they suspected but weren't positive until the suitcase was opened up. There had to be some strong clues leading them to believe this suitcase was involved in Sandra's disappearance or a crime, for them to spend so many hours out there yesterday, with the FBI and CSI. MOO

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 02:20 PM

Im wondering if her body was in that shed before she was put in a suitcase..

Yep. my thought too

(they had to go round up the suitcase)

5boxersmom

04-07-2009, 02:20 PM

westport321

04-07-2009, 02:20 PM

a few years ago my 5 yo grandaugter was molested by a 16 yo babysitter, he was hauled off to an eval center and declared as just experimenting..... Well I dont and didnt buy that so I made sure that everyone at his school new about this and everyone I talked to in our small community ws well aware of my feelings. I was asked to cease and desist with this as I would possibly interfere with the boys future, HAH! fast forward 3 years the boy was caught raping a 13 yo girl he had grabbed at a local mcdonalds. As far as Im concerned all molesters should have a tattoo on their forhead that says molester in big black letters, easy to see easy to avoid,we all know that the bleeding hearts will try to cure them so putting them away forever will never get past the courts. If you guys hold them down Ill carve the words into their skin.( sorry this is so long but I am heartbroken at the loss of another innocent)

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 02:22 PM

If that's the case, LE will narrow down suspects due to that shed being locked and needing a key.

Correct!!!!!

titanfan217

04-07-2009, 02:26 PM

Prayers for Sandras family & friends.

I am trying to think of reasons why LE would have the church / shed as a crime scene. I would think , in a church shed there would lawn equipment. I wonder if someone who volunteers or works at the church also lived, worked or visited someone in the mobile home park.

Maybe Sandra was taken by vehicle out of the park and TO the shed...then killed there ?
These cases are so sad (and scarey).

I think they already know who it is and an arrest will come soon.

I haven't read all the messages so apologize to anyone who has covered this before, but it appears that a minister at the church lives in the mobile home park.

(OT Back later -- going to take my frustrations out on a stubborn lawn mower).

LILMANMAX

04-07-2009, 02:26 PM

My heart is breaking for her family and friends.
Another lovely little girl lost too soon.

RIP Sandra :rose:

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:32 PM

I don't know who or where it came from about Sandra wanting to go to church on Friday...but from the pastor's website there does not appear to be any type of services on fridays....just Wed and Sun

her grandpa said it..and I also noticed they did not have service on Friday..I guess that is the church she goes to..really have no idea..I tried to see if they had any special events but did not see anything on the site..

juliekan

04-07-2009, 02:34 PM

On FOX:

Dr. Baden: should still be DNA evidence on the body/suitcase that can be used.

emdragon

04-07-2009, 02:36 PM

If that's the case, LE will narrow down suspects due to that shed being locked and needing a key.

Unless the key was kept in a place accessible to anyone- that is often the case with Churches.

sunstar

04-07-2009, 02:36 PM

On FOX:

Dr. Baden: should still be DNA evidence on the body/suitcase that can be used.

That's good news and I appreciate the update!

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:38 PM

I don't know who or where it came from about Sandra wanting to go to church on Friday...but from the pastor's website there does not appear to be any type of services on fridays....just Wed and Sun

http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090331/A_NEWS02/903310332/-1/A_NEWS

Jose Chavez, the girl's grandfather, said he picked Sandra up from school about 2:45 p.m. Friday and brought her home. Her mother, grandmother and three siblings were at the house, he said.

When she got home, Sandra left to play with a little girl named Kassandra in a home across the trailer park.

The girls played on a wooden swing tied to a tree in front of the house. They sat on the stoop and scribbled with crayons. They went inside and watched some of the movie "Flubber."

Then Kassandra told her mother, Maria Diaz, that Sandra had to go home to do homework, the 36-year-old mother told The Record.

When Sandra arrived home - around 4 p.m., according to a surveillance camera attached to her house - she talked about going to church and a movie with her two older sisters, her grandfather said.
When the girls realized they didn't have enough money to go to a movie, Sandra left again to play, Chavez said.

maybe she never went back in and only talked to her sister

Amy

04-07-2009, 02:41 PM

I figured you would say that since I kept saying it but could not find it to prove it..you were even nice enough to say no link needed..I do not know why all that has never been said since but I did know grandpa had said she came back and wanted to go to a movie or church and then when bugout kept saying she thought she had a back pack on to carry coloring books or something I remembered that being said also...still can not tell but they said she had no back pack so not sure..just glad I finally found it even though everyone was not bashing me for not providing a link...

I remembered the article about Grandpa, too. Glad you found it and posted it again. I knew he had said she and a sister had wanted to go to church and a movie, but didn't have the money. I see many posts about why church, but some churches do have afternoon/evening activities available for kids these days. It just did not seem to me that Grandpa had any questions about the kids going to church--so there had to be some kind of activity going on there--or @ least he and Sandra and the sister seemed to think there was.

CC I See

04-07-2009, 02:41 PM

sad isn't it I have 18 SO just within a mile of me and most are the highest level I think they stick close together for some reason..and I live in a nice neighborhood..I get the email alert so I can let anyone with young kids know..my neighbor has 4 little girls..so I try to help watch out for them..my kids are older thank god..

...the saddest part is why should we have to watch out for these offenders. If they weren't on the street in the first place there would be little or no need. In most cases LE knows who they are... and they should take away their freedom to re offend because they almost always do.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:41 PM

On FOX:

Dr. Baden: should still be DNA evidence on the body/suitcase that can be used.

great to hear that

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:43 PM

...the saddest part is why should we have to watch out for these offenders. If they weren't on the street in the first place there would be little or no need. In most cases LE knows who they are... and they should take away their freedom to re offend because they almost always do.

ITA most experts say they will offend again some just can not change...lock them all up for life..

Amy

04-07-2009, 02:45 PM

They found a LOT of tire tracks and footprints around the site. You could see ithem on the feed. They will need to investigate all those tracks and hopefully isolate the right ones. Hopefully there are other clues, they did put down a lot of evidence markers yesterday.

I would imagine there would be tire tracks and footprints around. Even the ones of the farm workers who found the suitcase, and I would imagine there was some sort of surveilance of the pond by workers--to see that the pond did not overfill, etc. I don't know about recent rains there and all that, but there could even still be tracks and prints from 2 weeks ago when they started filling the pond.

lune3

04-07-2009, 02:47 PM

Surely LE must have a warrant to look in that shed by now. I wish we know if there was any evidence there. Are any press in that area so we could have an indication they are searching the shed?

Amy

04-07-2009, 02:51 PM

And every time we make progress on the ONE STRIKE LAW, the activists groups jump in and say that if we pass a one strike law, we will be putting 18 year old boys that have consensual sex with a 17 year old partner behind bars for life.

For heavens sake, do we, as a society, really lack the intelligence to differentiate between a couple of kids in high school having sex and a pedophile attacking a child?

Surely, if it needs to be spelled out for otherwise supposedly intelligent people (ACLU, lawyers, judges, etc etc etc) it could be done. I truely believe there ARE people on the registry who should not be-especially in the instance you mention above. People need to use just a tad bit of common sense, IMO.

ann10

04-07-2009, 02:52 PM

Surely LE must have a warrant to look in that shed by now. I wish we know if there was any evidence there. Are any press in that area so we could have an indication they are searching the shed?

Fox just showed the church and a mobil home roped off with yellow crime scene tape. Another presser is scheduled for 6:30 eastern.

darjeeling

04-07-2009, 02:56 PM

Police to search church in Tracy girl's slaying

Tracy police plan to search a church today in connection with the slaying of 8-year-old Sandra Cantu, whose body was found in a suitcase floating in an irrigation pond....

Sandra's family does not attend the church, neighbors said.

Residents of the mobile home park said the pastor lives with his wife, daughter and granddaughter. The church's Web site said the pastor has headed the church since 1981 and has three grown children and nine grandchildren.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/04/07/BA8016UFO2.DTL

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 02:57 PM

I'm guessing it's someone the Pastor reached out to help................

yep my cousin got 5 yrs did 2 1/2 he was 18 she was 15 almost 16 he broke up with her and her parents pressed charges..he is still registered as a child molester..he is far from that just had sex with someone who go mad he plead thinking or hoping to get less time..well he got 5 he spent more time than some of these level 3 offenders..senior in high school

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 02:57 PM

Yeah, I forgot about the Wed. nights....:smile:

And I forgot to add choir practice after the Wed. night suppers lol.

Pinetree

04-07-2009, 02:57 PM

A lot of Hispanics are Catholic....I wonder if Sandra wanted to go to Catholic church on Fri. night? Or, do we know, are the family members of this church?

lune3

04-07-2009, 02:58 PM

Fox just showed the church and a mobil home roped off with yellow crime scene tape. Another presser is scheduled for 6:30 eastern.

Do you know if the home is the Pastor's place?

Pinetree

04-07-2009, 03:00 PM

And I forgot to add choir practice after the Wed. night suppers lol.

lol....we do a lot of eating, also. Fish frys during lent, Sat. night potluck after Mass, pastries after Sun. morning Mass plus various and sundry dinners. Lots of food!

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 03:01 PM

And I forgot to add choir practice after the Wed. night suppers lol.

Ni singing from me..lol

I am thankful she was found so soon before too much evedence was destroyed....My heart goes out to the mother....:sad:

emdragon

04-07-2009, 03:03 PM

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 03:03 PM

yep my cousin got 5 yrs did 2 1/2 he was 18 she was 15 almost 16 he broke up with her and her parents pressed charges..he is still registered as a child molester..he is far from that just had sex with someone who go mad he plead thinking or hoping to get less time..well he got 5 he spent more time than some of these level 3 offenders..senior in high school

Once they turn 18 , they have to be real careful of who they date. Rule in our house was always up or down one year until both you and whoever you are dating turn 18. Too much age spread at a young age can bring about bad things.

lune3

04-07-2009, 03:03 PM

Ni singing from me..lol

I am thankful she was found so soon before too much evedence was destroyed....My heart goes out to the mother....:sad:

I'm hoping though that the time of death will be determined to be very soon after she disappeared. I can't stand the thought that she was kept for a while.

Amy

04-07-2009, 03:03 PM

and who would make sure they took their meds?

That's a problem. No one can be "forced" to take medications...even if they are something that keeps them on an even keel. Even if it was made a condition of their parole or release, or whatever, I am sure groups like ACLU would find a way to carp about it. Maybe, the only way some of this would get changed would be for a child related to a top official of such organizations to befall such a tragedy. Not that I would want to wish that on any child, of course. But bet the tune would be changing.

ann10

04-07-2009, 03:03 PM

Do you know if the home is the Pastor's place?

I don't, sorry. They just said 'a' mobil home.

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 03:05 PM

I'm hoping though that the time of death will be determined to be very soon after she disappeared. I can't stand the thought that she was kept for a while.

Me either...I think back to Jessica L.....:sad:

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 03:06 PM

I'm tired of being called a bleeding heart because my faith tells me it is not ok to kill, even if we are outraged by the acts in question.

I care just as deeply for these kids as anyone of you advocating shooting on site.

The factual truth is that statistics show the average SO molests around 117 kids before they are found out.

So please tell me how killing the SO AFTER he gets caught helps those other 116 kids?

Shouldn't our goal be to PREVENT the crime in the first place and that means BEFORE a SO offends for the FIRST time.

Sorry for my outburst but I get sick of reading implications that anyone who doesn't want to line them up and shoot them doesn't care or doesn't understand- quite the contrary.

You are fine. We don't have to kill them. Let's just lock them up for life and quit providing inmates with all kinds of comforts. They are the worst of the worst, in my opinion, so let their living conditions compare to the nature of the crime.

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 03:08 PM

Ni singing from me..lol

I am thankful she was found so soon before too much evedence was destroyed....My heart goes out to the mother....:sad:

I wanted to let you know that I appreciate what you said in an earlier post about how God takes the pain away from children who are dying.....I can now think when a child is dying the only voice heard is God's and the only touch is God's hands....Thank you......

Amy

04-07-2009, 03:08 PM

From the presser:

1. Autopsy in progress

2. They did not know that there was a body in the suitcase until they opened it up.

The second bit makes me think that maybe she wasn't in there that long if there was no decomp odor. IMO

The chemicals from the pond could probably mask or cut any odors. I don't know, maybe there is a chemical smell that would over power any other?

ann10

04-07-2009, 03:08 PM

I'm tired of being called a bleeding heart because my faith tells me it is not ok to kill, even if we are outraged by the acts in question.

I care just as deeply for these kids as anyone of you advocating shooting on site.

The factual truth is that statistics show the average SO molests around 117 kids before they are found out.

So please tell me how killing the SO AFTER he gets caught helps those other 116 kids?

Shouldn't our goal be to PREVENT the crime in the first place and that means BEFORE a SO offends for the FIRST time.

Sorry for my outburst but I get sick of reading implications that anyone who doesn't want to line them up and shoot them doesn't care or doesn't understand- quite the contrary.

It does prevent the crime from happening in the first place, ultimately.

This is a cyclical crime. Those that have been offended become offenders. Of course, this is not always the case. By exterminating these violent offenders, we will eventually come close to eliminating this problem.

Extermination is the only solution that does get to the root of the problem. Our children and women are not valued enough for this to happen, unfortunately. imo.

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 03:09 PM

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 03:09 PM

Once they turn 18 , they have to be real careful of who they date. Rule in our house was always up or down one year until both you and whoever you are dating turn 18. Too much age spread at a young age can bring about bad things.

hey he did his time and has went on and yeah he was wrong but really had no idea that could happen until he called my brother in law who is a judge and he told him he should plea they wanted to smack 15yrs on him..and i am sorry it is a huge difference than some of these sick pervs molesting little kids over and over..anyway he did his time and is just fine now and has a wonderful wife and 3 kids...

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 03:12 PM

I wanted to let you know that I appreciate what you said in an earlier post about how God takes the pain away from children who are dying.....I can now think when a child is dying the only voice heard is God's and the only touch is God's hands....Thank you......

I have always believed that..I think the child is lifted up the moment it starts, the body is there, but the child has gone home...
The God that has been so good to me, would never let a child feel pain while being hurt or killed....

BorderCollieMom

04-07-2009, 03:14 PM

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 03:16 PM

hey he did his time and has went on and yeah he was wrong but really had no idea that could happen until he called my brother in law who is a judge and he told him he should plea they wanted to smack 15yrs on him..and i am sorry it is a huge difference than some of these sick pervs molesting little kids over and over..anyway he did his time and is just fine now and has a wonderful wife and 3 kids...

sorry to quote myself but he was not the only one a guy after him also ended up in jail for sleeping with her and now she is married to him and has kids after her parents had him put away for breaking up with her big difference IMO.they should be put in certain categorys..all jmo

VC2

04-07-2009, 03:17 PM

I'm tired of being called a bleeding heart because my faith tells me it is not ok to kill, even if we are outraged by the acts in question.

I care just as deeply for these kids as anyone of you advocating shooting on site.

The factual truth is that statistics show the average SO molests around 117 kids before they are found out.

So please tell me how killing the SO AFTER he gets caught helps those other 116 kids?

Shouldn't our goal be to PREVENT the crime in the first place and that means BEFORE a SO offends for the FIRST time.

Sorry for my outburst but I get sick of reading implications that anyone who doesn't want to line them up and shoot them doesn't care or doesn't understand- quite the contrary.

very good post! I am against the death penalty, always have been always will be. Apart from moral reasons, until they find a way to ensure that only guilty are executed, that there is no disparity based on race, culture, city or area of the country in meting it out, its just wrong to me. When the green river killer and btk don't get it but the young thug on the corner does for one murder...its wrong.

Doesn't mean i don't care just as much that these people are kept away from kids or my heart doesn't break at these deaths

emdragon

04-07-2009, 03:18 PM

It does prevent the crime from happening in the first place, ultimately.

This is a cyclical crime. Those that have been offended become offenders. Of course, this is not always the case. By exterminating these violent offenders, we will eventually come close to eliminating this problem.

Extermination is the only solution that does get to the root of the problem. Our children and women are not valued enough for this to happen, unfortunately. imo.

It doesn't prevent the crime from happening in the first place.
So how do you prevent the 100s of victims they assault BEFORE they are caught and you kill them?

If we follow your logic we should just kill all the victims since they will grow into offenders anyway.

We have to find a way to prevent the crime from ever happening- to stop the urges before they are acted upon.

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 03:18 PM

I'm tired of being called a bleeding heart because my faith tells me it is not ok to kill, even if we are outraged by the acts in question.

I care just as deeply for these kids as anyone of you advocating shooting on site.

The factual truth is that statistics show the average SO molests around 117 kids before they are found out.

So please tell me how killing the SO AFTER he gets caught helps those other 116 kids?

Shouldn't our goal be to PREVENT the crime in the first place and that means BEFORE a SO offends for the FIRST time.

Sorry for my outburst but I get sick of reading implications that anyone who doesn't want to line them up and shoot them doesn't care or doesn't understand- quite the contrary.

I dont think you are a bleeding heart at all......But you tell me how we prevent this from happening....What does a SO look like? When does he begin offending? Does he fall within a certain age group?
What can we look for in young children to see a potential SO in the making? Who makes that judgment? How do we begin to prevent an SO from his first molestation?

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 03:21 PM

I have always believed that..I think the child is lifted up the moment it starts, the body is there, but the child has gone home...
The God that has been so good to me, would never let a child feel pain while being hurt or killed....

I think they do feel the pain of their death. Their pain is what I feel, and I'm sure many others feel. This feeling is what drives me to change our laws, change our outlook and protect our most vulnerable citizens.

If I thought they felt no pain I wouldn't feel the urgency to change our laws

Just my opinion. others are also entitled to theirs

dgfred

04-07-2009, 03:21 PM

Seems we are getting sidetracked, we don't even know if it was a SO.

aproudmom

04-07-2009, 03:21 PM

:seeya:well all it is nappy time for me can not keep my eyes open hope I dont miss the press con. I pray when I get back they have someone arrested and able to anwser more questions...

thanks everyone for you wonderful post been a joy in the darkness and sadness that we have all felt..

RIP SWEET SANDRA:rose:

GentleBreeze

04-07-2009, 03:23 PM

I'm Baptist also...about as Southern fried as you can get.....We have WEdnesday night suppers after bible study every Wednesday night....Bible study used to be called prayer meeting.....

That is the way it is with our church. I am Baptist too.

imo

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 03:24 PM

I think they do feel the pain of their death. Their pain is what I feel, and I'm sure many others feel. This feeling is what drives me to change our laws, change our outlook and protect our most vulnerable citizens.

If I thought they felt no pain I wouldn't feel the urgency to change our laws

Just my opinion. others are also entitled to theirs

No, the laws would have to be changed..It's not right to take a child away from it's parents, something they never get over......The laws should be made tougher...I don't know how they could be changed, but something is gonna have to be done......

kitty1182

04-07-2009, 03:25 PM

I wonder if it was the mom going to the hospital last night. In article it said 3 ambulances were called into mobil park.

http://www.news10.net/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=57432&catid=2

I heard it was the mother:sad:

Amy

04-07-2009, 03:26 PM

I'm tired of being called a bleeding heart because my faith tells me it is not ok to kill, even if we are outraged by the acts in question.

I care just as deeply for these kids as anyone of you advocating shooting on site.

The factual truth is that statistics show the average SO molests around 117 kids before they are found out.

So please tell me how killing the SO AFTER he gets caught helps those other 116 kids?

Shouldn't our goal be to PREVENT the crime in the first place and that means BEFORE a SO offends for the FIRST time.

Sorry for my outburst but I get sick of reading implications that anyone who doesn't want to line them up and shoot them doesn't care or doesn't understand- quite the contrary.

That seems to be the problem--no one KNOWS who is the unidentified SO. How are we going to prevent them, if we don't recognize them?

The other problem is, AFTER the SO is released, whether s/he actually registers or not--they DO NOT change their spots. They ARE going to offend again. It's the SUBSEQUENT kids we can save. Especially for the SO who has been released--before s/he might have let the kids go, but now are more likely to MURDER so as to not be identified and returned to prison.

And, if they can't be rehabed--what makes us think it can be PREVENTED--;you can't change their spots before they act, either.

emdragon

04-07-2009, 03:29 PM

I dont think you are a bleeding heart at all......But you tell me how we prevent this from happening....What does a SO look like? When does he begin offending? Does he fall within a certain age group?
What can we look for in young children to see a potential SO in the making? Who makes that judgment? How do we begin to prevent an SO from his first molestation?

I wish I had an answer, that was my point I believe we need to spend more energy and resources on answering those questions than trying to close the barn door after the horse gets out.

It was said that killing the SO would give justice to their estimated 116 victims my response to that comment has to be "don't you think those victims would rather have not gone through the assault rather than have justice?

90% of offenders are known to the victim.

and what level of offenses deserve death? The teacher and the 17 yr student? Do we kill her? the 11yr playing Dr do we kill one of them? (yes those cases are prosecuted believe it or not usually the older child is charged even if they didn't initiate things)

Experts do believe that some offenders can be monitored and will not re-offend- not that they are cured just that some can learn control but we should kill them as well?

BorderCollieMom

04-07-2009, 03:29 PM

I've read two posts now saying there are strong chemicals in the pond. Where did this information come from? What source stated there were chemicals in the pond? Does one of the posters who made the chemical claim have a link?

Hi Cav. I wondered the same. I just googled "chemicals in irrigation ponds"...it was pretty much layed out in the list of links. I didnt even click on one to read it. I figured it just one of things that alot of folks knew, except me, lol.

Maelstrom5

04-07-2009, 03:31 PM

hey he did his time and has went on and yeah he was wrong but really had no idea that could happen until he called my brother in law who is a judge and he told him he should plea they wanted to smack 15yrs on him..and i am sorry it is a huge difference than some of these sick pervs molesting little kids over and over..anyway he did his time and is just fine now and has a wonderful wife and 3 kids...

I am glad to hear he is doing OK. Nothing like that would have happened if your state had a Romeo & Juliet law in place.

emdragon

04-07-2009, 03:33 PM

Seems we are getting sidetracked, we don't even know if it was a SO.

Thanks you are exactly right- we are all assuming. But who knows it could have been an accident covered up. Or like that one kid who just decided to kill the little boy that came to his door.

bama__angel

04-07-2009, 03:35 PM

I wish I had an answer, that was my point I believe we need to spend more energy and resources on answering those questions than trying to close the barn door after the horse gets out.

It was said that killing the SO would give justice to their estimated 116 victims my response to that comment has to be "don't you think those victims would rather have not gone through the assault rather than have justice?

90% of offenders are known to the victim.

and what level of offenses deserve death? The teacher and the 17 yr student? Do we kill her? the 11yr playing Dr do we kill one of them? (yes those cases are prosecuted believe it or not usually the older child is charged even if they didn't initiate things)

Experts do believe that some offenders can be monitored and will not re-offend- not that they are cured just that some can learn control but we should kill them as well?

I believe that "some offenders " can be monitored and might not re-offend.......However, I am going to draw a line between a sex offender and a pedophile........A pedophile you CAN NOT repair......And a pedophile is in a different category to a sex offender, a pedophile is a sex offender, but a sex offender doesnt have to be a pedophile....BIG difference.....IMO

merical

04-07-2009, 03:36 PM

At the very beginning, the LE stated the cadaver dogs alerted near a body of water, a river or strem or creek, but nothing was there. Does anyone know where that was? Where in proximity to where the suitcase was found?

I saw the news earlier and the news guy was showing that from the church, you could actually see the memorial set up in front of the mobile home park. I'm interested in how far from the church the body of water where the dogs alerted happens to be.

As the cops did an extensive ground search, wouldn't the dogs have alerted near the church at some point? If the girl had been on the property, I'm sure that area was checked at some point, that shed had to have been checked at some point, as well. This confuses me.:confused:

dgfred

04-07-2009, 03:46 PM

Seems the 'resting' CSI would want to get this wrapped up as quickly as possible for the people of the town, not take a break. Heck, fly some fresh people in.

Stella Rose

04-07-2009, 03:47 PM

I'm tired of being called a bleeding heart because my faith tells me it is not ok to kill, even if we are outraged by the acts in question.

I care just as deeply for these kids as anyone of you advocating shooting on site.

The factual truth is that statistics show the average SO molests around 117 kids before they are found out.

So please tell me how killing the SO AFTER he gets caught helps those other 116 kids?

Shouldn't our goal be to PREVENT the crime in the first place and that means BEFORE a SO offends for the FIRST time.

Sorry for my outburst but I get sick of reading implications that anyone who doesn't want to line them up and shoot them doesn't care or doesn't understand- quite the contrary.

I am firmly in the "line them up and shoot them" corner, but I would never question someone else's beliefs.

I have never seen any good way to prevent these crimes - other than keeping your children locked up 24/7.

I would love to hear theories on how to prevent all these horrible crimes, especially the 116...

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 03:48 PM

Seems the 'resting' CSI would want to get this wrapped up as quickly as possible for the people of the town, not take a break. Heck, fly some fresh people in.

the Sgt said that they worked until 4 am....I would rather have them rested than make a mistake IMO

titanfan217

04-07-2009, 03:49 PM

Where in the article...I cannot find anything when I googled about her mom going to the hospital.? I am tired today so I could just be missing it...???/

They must have changed it. I didn't find it either.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 03:49 PM

Even with a killer roaming around?

juliekan

04-07-2009, 03:50 PM

I heard it was the mother:sad:

it was in an article posted here earlier, don't remember which one. the mom passed out and was taken to the hospital.:sad:

dgfred

04-07-2009, 03:52 PM

the Sgt said that they worked until 4 am....I would rather have them rested than make a mistake IMO

Unless they have a pretty good idea who did this... I wouldn't.

juliekan

04-07-2009, 03:52 PM

At the very beginning, the LE stated the cadaver dogs alerted near a body of water, a river or strem or creek, but nothing was there. Does anyone know where that was? Where in proximity to where the suitcase was found?

I saw the news earlier and the news guy was showing that from the church, you could actually see the memorial set up in front of the mobile home park. I'm interested in how far from the church the body of water where the dogs alerted happens to be.
As the cops did an extensive ground search, wouldn't the dogs have alerted near the church at some point? If the girl had been on the property, I'm sure that area was checked at some point, that shed had to have been checked at some point, as well. This confuses me.:confused:

On Fox earlier, they said 2 miles. Do not know if this is correct.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 03:54 PM

Unless they have a pretty good idea who did this... I wouldn't.

HLN reported that it is now being searched....not sure when it started but apparently it is underway IMO

dgfred

04-07-2009, 03:55 PM

HLN reported that it is now being searched....not sure when it started but apparently it is underway IMO

Please keep us updated.

emdragon

04-07-2009, 03:57 PM

we had something similar to this in our area a couple summers ago... a dirty old man who made some very inappropriate comments to a neighbors 12 year old daughter... when we talked to the cops about telling neighbors we were warned that since he was NOT registered as a SO, if we told people that WE could be in trouble. we did it anyways... i would rather be in trouble than allow some child be hurt by them not knowing!!!

Yeah same thing here the guy was out waiting for trial but LE could list him or send out information.

I can understand that just being accused doesn't mean you actually did anything.

But I don't see how community members passing the info on by word of mouth could be stopped.
Now the victims family going door to door would be a problem.

I've never done a lot of research on the subject but I have to wonder if the attraction to young girls (12-13 and up) isn't in the human genetic code- through history it was common for men to take young brides to procreate sooner and more. The human life span was much less and that has changed as has societies few on what is acceptable- but I do have to wonder. (and I'm not talking about those SO who like little boys or pre-pubescent girls as their hard wiring is clearly malfunctioning)

dgfred

04-07-2009, 03:57 PM

I agree that I want their evidence collected properly, tested and retested so there are no screw ups that allow the beast who is responsible to be let loose on another little girl.

These people are only human... and the jobs they are responsible for have a stress level I cannot even imagine, the things they see and have to deal with take a toll.... they deserve the same opportunity to sleep and to be able to take care of themselves otherwise how do they take care of anyone else?

If I was a CSI, I wouldn't be able to sleep anyway after finding the girl's body and other evidence was uncovered.

juliekan

04-07-2009, 04:02 PM

If I was a CSI, I wouldn't be able to sleep anyway after finding the girl's body and other evidence was uncovered.

I once worked 21 hours (in the ICU) because I was worried about one of my patients and we were very busy. But at some point you have to realize you may do more harm than good if you get too tired. Just as the CSI people might not want to screw up anything that would put the sick killer away in this case.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 04:04 PM

I once worked 21 hours (in the ICU) because I was worried about one of my patients and we were very busy. But at some point you have to realize you may do more harm than good if you get too tired. Just as the CSI people might not want to screw up anything that would put the sick killer away in this case.

I understand, but what would you want to do?

juliekan

04-07-2009, 04:07 PM

I understand, but what would you want to do?

The child is already dead. I would want to do what was best for finding the evidence to put the killer away for life. Which would be get a little sleep, have a sandwich and large coffee and get back to work. Sounds like that's what they are doing.

KKKKKKatie

04-07-2009, 04:07 PM

HLN reported again, just now, that the search of the church is going on now. No other news about it :cursing:

dgfred

04-07-2009, 04:09 PM

The child is already dead. I would want to do what was best for finding the evidence to put the killer away for life. Which would be get a little sleep, have a sandwich and large coffee and get back to work. Sounds like that's what they are doing.

Well maybe keeping this from happening to another. Sleeping would be out of the question for me personally.

juliekan

04-07-2009, 04:13 PM

Well maybe keeping this from happening to another. Sleeping would be out of the question for me personally.

...and then your boss says, "go get some sleep. Let's not screw this up!"

dgfred

04-07-2009, 04:15 PM

I agree you might not WANT to leave or sleep... but your body needs the break... once you get to that over exhausted area... mistakes are made. What if that one crucial piece of evidence is mishandled or the testing is botched and that is the ONE thing that let's this POS go???? Would you be able to live w/that mistake????

To each their own.
I, personally would not be too worn down (curiosity and emotions of finding the killer) after a long day (and night?) of work. I would be jacked to the moon and paying special attention to NOT making a mistake.
I want them to be rested, it is just the idea of a killer around there would knock out the need to rest for me.

Dogmatic

04-07-2009, 04:15 PM

The child is already dead. I would want to do what was best for finding the evidence to put the killer away for life. Which would be get a little sleep, have a sandwich and large coffee and get back to work. Sounds like that's what they are doing.

Exactly. A very costly mistake could be made by being over tired. Due to the time frame in this case, there should/could/would be alot of valuable evidence contained within the suitcase.

I want that CSI team well rested, fed and on their "A" game when they collect their samples.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 04:16 PM

...and then your boss says, "go get some sleep. Let's not screw this up!"

No thanks boss, let's get this killer like... yesterday.

emdragon

04-07-2009, 04:19 PM

To each their own.
I, personally would not be too worn down (curiosity and emotions of finding the killer) after a long day (and night?) of work. I would be jacked to the moon and paying special attention to NOT making a mistake.
I want them to be rested, it is just the idea of a killer around there would knock out the need to rest for me.

Guess you don't care about the defense attorney who would then stand up in court and discredit your work and your testimony because you had been awake and on the job for an excess amount of time.

I'm betting you expect all DNA testing to be done in 50 minutes like on TV too.

dgfred

04-07-2009, 04:20 PM

Exactly. A very costly mistake could be made by being over tired. Due to the time frame in this case, there should/could/would be alot of valuable evidence contained within the suitcase.

I want that CSI team well rested, fed and on their "A" game when they collect their samples.

There shouldn't be any too-tired CSI members when they just found the suitcase yesterday.
I understand completely what y'all mean, just in my opinion - I would not be too tired to investigate thoroughly.