Michelle Fisher Young 3-3-09 [Archive] - Page 3

5swab5

03-09-2009, 12:39 PM

Good Morning Swabby!

Something that I would really really like to understand is why, if Meredith had ANYTHING to do with Michelle's murder as some here claim, and Jason is as innocent as some here claim, WHY is Jason sitting back and doing NOTHING? Why did he not fight for anything? Why did he just let his daughter go without a fight?

IF he were innocent, he certainly would have been curious about the investigation, not allowed himself to be declared a slayer and never in a million years given up PRIMARY custody of Cassidy. Operative word being IF. Jason is stuck.

Linda and Meredith should have asked for the moon and stars too, Jason would have given it to them in order to continue his charade.

As for why some people here don't see it, I guess they just don't want to. :shrug: MOO

Tia

03-09-2009, 12:40 PM

The dropper may not have "come with" the Pancof-PD, it may have been left over from Jason's inventory when he worked for the Company. No telling what the origination of that dropper was. MOO

Thats what we were trying to figure out last night. I told AE that I could find no images of it being sold with a dropper, just a cup. But the SW said "Pancof Dropper" IIRC.

Tia

03-09-2009, 12:47 PM

IF he were innocent, he certainly would have been curious about the investigation, not allowed himself to be declared a slayer and never in a million years given up PRIMARY custody of Cassidy. Operative word being IF. Jason is stuck.

Linda and Meredith should have asked for the moon and stars too, Jason would have given it to them in order to continue his charade.

As for why some people here don't see it, I guess they just don't want to. :shrug: MOO

I really don't care that they refuse to see it. I think their agendas are clear. What started out as a place to seek justice for a murder victim and her family has been turned into a forum to bash the victim's family.

Meredith is accused day in and day out of murder on this thread.

Jason basically handed the Fisher's his child on a silver platter along with his reputation since he chose not to fight the WDS. Its obvious that he is guilty by his actions and come on, if Meredith had ANYTHING to do with Michelle's murder, would Jason just toss his child over to her??

NO!!! Never in a million years. But, if he fought for the "center of his world" (or whatever he referred to Cassidy as), he would have had to open his mouth and tell the truth and would most likely be behind bars.

JMO

5swab5

03-09-2009, 12:48 PM

Did the SW say it was a Pancof dropper?

Yep, middle of page 19 of the Feb 9th SW.

(might be a different page # for you. My computer shows 21 pages, but quits at 20 pages) MOO

Tia

03-09-2009, 12:50 PM

If LF thought for a minute he had the moon and stars I think she would have asked for them.

Why did Jason give up Cassidy without a fight?

Tia

03-09-2009, 12:52 PM

I'm pretty sure I have always called her McIntyre. I could go back and look at my posts but since is has no relevance on the case I won't.

The SW's list her as Pat Young, so I dunno.

I don't know that it matters, I think Swabby was just wondering.

Stellagant

03-09-2009, 12:54 PM

Did you hear the answers to 50 questions? What I mostly hear was I don't know or talking about things that didn't even relate to the question. The dispatch may have asked 50 questions but MF sure didn't answer 50 unless you call I don't know an answer. Oh and don't forget the freaking out dog that was about 4 minutes into the call.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/audio/1119462/

Yes, it's filled with the red flags noted by the FBI. Repetitive answers, extraneous information abounds as does lack of focus on the victim, immediate acceptance that she's dead, evasive answers to questions. It's a stunning textbook example.

Tia

03-09-2009, 12:58 PM

Yep, middle of page 19 of the Feb 9th SW.

(might be a different page # for you. My computer shows 21 pages, but quits at 20 pages) MOO

Thanks, thats what I thought.

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 01:14 PM

Yes, it's filled with the red flags noted by the FBI. Repetitive answers, extraneous information abounds as does lack of focus on the victim, immediate acceptance that she's dead, evasive answers to questions. It's a stunning textbook example.

Look at the list of red flags that occurs here:
1)Outside lights on in the daytime
2)Michelle's car in the garage
3)Unlocked door
4)Freaking dog
5) Bloody footprints all over the house. (her words)
6)CY alone
7)CY walking
8)CY in bed
9)Strange 911 phonecall
10) Dead body
and the mysterious placement of the keys.

I am not saying that she had anything whatsover to do with the murder, I just find the above things strange and can't see how anyone would not know that something was horribly wrong.............and to be able to reach that conclusion without asking a 2 1/2 year old child if their Mommy fell.

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 01:20 PM

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 01:34 PM

Kat the sad thing is there is no new news. sometime this month LF will get her settlement and then what? MY is still dead and we are no closer to who killed her than we were 2 years ago. According to some not as close. Back then I think LE was convinced they were going to wrap this case up in a month and look where they are. LE went into this case wearing blinders and being let by an accomplished fabricator of stories. Look where that has got them.

I wonder, if at any point, a physic has been brought into the case.

Not saying, I would believe, but I know in the SP case, Laci's mom found some comfort in one, and I know in other police investigations thay have been used.

And, this case seems like it could use all the help it could get.

Kat

awareness

03-09-2009, 01:37 PM

If LF thought for a minute he had the moon and stars I think she would have asked for them.

Do you feel this way about other mothers who have had their pregnant daughter murdered, or is it just Linda Fisher? Just curious.

JMO

awareness

03-09-2009, 01:38 PM

It appears that L E is stuck too.......and, when I see something that proves he was able to get back to Raleigh and still make his meeting in Clintwood, I could become unstuck.......or a motive or anything else that can not be explained.

Kat

Explain then why Jason gave up Cassidy without a fight?
JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 02:08 PM

Explain then why Jason gave up Cassidy without a fight?
JMO

They can't, IMO.

It seems easier to bash the victim's family by accusing them of murder, than answering that simple question.

JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 02:42 PM

You guys keep asking that question. First he didn't give her up he's sharing her. Second only JY would be able to answer that question. What makes you think anyone here knows the answer to that question?

He isn't "sharing" her, he has allowed Meredith PRIMARY physical custody. He will have visitation.

I'm not bashing him. I want to know why those of you who think Meredith murdered Michelle think Jason gave up Primary Physical Custody to the Meredith?

Seems odd, huh? Like he has something to hide.

JMO

catdoc

03-09-2009, 02:44 PM

I'm more interested in why it took MF 5 minutes to tell that her ice cold stiff sister was dead? When dispatch asked why do you think shes dead she said I honestly don't know. How old was MF?

http://www.wral.com/news/local/audio/1119462/

/asking again. Can someone explain how to listen to this audio? I get a red cross. Nothing happens when I click on it.

awareness

03-09-2009, 02:45 PM

Just the ones that go after changing everything their daughter had in her will to suit their own needs.

Link?
JMO

awareness

03-09-2009, 02:46 PM

He isn't "sharing" her, he has allowed Meredith PRIMARY physical custody. He will have visitation.

I'm not bashing him. I want to know why those of you who think Meredith murdered Michelle think Jason gave up Primary Physical Custody to the Meredith?

Seems odd, huh? Like he has something to hide.

JMO

ITA. Confused, we're not "bashing" him, its a legitimate question.
JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 02:51 PM

Just the ones that go after changing everything their daughter had in her will to suit their own needs.

I honestly don't think Michelle would want Cassidy raised by her "slayer", JMO and all......

Stellagant

03-09-2009, 02:55 PM

Explain then why Jason gave up Cassidy without a fight?
JMO

He didn't give her up. He decided to share her. Any parent has a right to make that same decision and can change their mind based on circumstances. Better question is why didn't the Fishers force him to fight? Jason changes his mind about sharing custody, the Fishers are going to be without any custody at all.

Tia

03-09-2009, 03:18 PM

Cardinal is the one that has the will. She posted what was in it. You'll have to ask her who MY left as executor and who she left her life ins and all her other belongings to. She also told us who MY appointed as guardian of her child. It wasn't her sister.

Cardinal has Michelle Young's will?

catdoc

03-09-2009, 03:22 PM

I was having the same problem at one point and I don't remember how I fixed it. Try coping and pasting the url and see if that works. Are you using IE?

Yes I use IE. Do u mean use it like an address?
I already get the news website. Then just a box with a red cross in it. This has happened to me before and I've never known low to open the box.

BiggerRedDog

03-09-2009, 03:25 PM

/asking again. Can someone explain how to listen to this audio? I get a red cross. Nothing happens when I click on it.Sorry catdoc. The .mp3 works for me with QuickTime. Maybe you need to change whatever program you use for sound. If it makes any difference, you might also try a different source, such as:
http://www.newsobserver.com/content/multimedia/flash_audio/20061106_young.mp3
There's a transcript here:
http://frictionpowered.blogspot.com/2007/02/merediths-911-call.html

Tia

03-09-2009, 03:33 PM

Yes she posted on here that she went to the court house and got a copy. She didn't post the whole will but gave valuable details. I suggest you ask her.

I will, thanks.

It doesn't seemed to have swayed her opinion any though.........

JMO

catdoc

03-09-2009, 03:39 PM

Sorry catdoc. The .mp3 works for me with QuickTime. Maybe you need to change whatever program you use for sound. If it makes any difference, you might also try a different source, such as:
http://www.newsobserver.com/content/multimedia/flash_audio/20061106_young.mp3
There's a transcript here:
http://frictionpowered.blogspot.com/2007/02/merediths-911-call.html

Thanks. These work fine.

Doorbell

03-09-2009, 03:46 PM

Doorbell

03-09-2009, 03:47 PM

A question there is no way any of us can answer. What's the point in asking an unanswerable question? Email JY and ask him he knows.

You find answers to other questions, like, "How did Meredith feel, making the 911 call," with no problem whatsoever.

IMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 03:49 PM

Of course, her Will was written before her primary Executor became her executioner.

IMO

Another point that seems to be overlooked by the JIIs!!!

I can only hope, that if I were murdered, and my spouse was named my slayer, that my mother, father and sisters would do all they could to get my children and my money away from the named slayer.

alterEgo©

03-09-2009, 03:53 PM

Tia

03-09-2009, 03:56 PM

And I hope they wouldn't wait 2 years before doing so!

They might have to if all the evidence wasn't immediately returned to give them enough to file a WDS and then go for custody.

thats the only thing that I believe held up the Fisher's.

awareness

03-09-2009, 06:55 PM

LE didn't name JY slayer LF did that.

The court decided it was a fact.
JMO

kingbuff

03-09-2009, 07:04 PM

Hi, Kat!

This was posted over on the Haleigh thread by Bratlings. Hope she doesn't mind that I brought it over here. Good links and real food for thought about FBI analysis of 911 calls:

Originally Posted by Bratlings
"WHO WAS THE CALL ABOUT?

Topic of the Call

When contacting 911, innocent individuals remained focused on the victim. For example, one caller urgently stated, “This guy’s hurt real bad. Tell them to hurry!”

Why would individuals call the emergency line and concentrate on themselves, reporting a problem without asking the dispatcher for assistance for the person who needs it? The following dialogue occurred when a father called 911 concerning his son:

Dispatcher: 911. What is your emergency?

Guilty caller: I have an unconscious child who is breathing very shallowly.

In this case, the father took personal possession of a problem (“I have”) and referred to his problem (his dying son) as “an unconscious child.” When the paramedics arrived at the residence, the child already had died. The father had assaulted his son, causing cerebral hemorrhaging. Twelve percent of the 911 callers in the study took personal possession of the problem. All were guilty of the homicide. "

http://www.fbi.gov/publications/leb/...leb.htm#page22

Misty's first words on the 911 call....

"Misty Croslin: “Hi…umm…I just woke up…and our backdoor was wide open and I think…and I can’t find our daughter”"

http://cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/200...pt_part_1.html

"Forty-four percent of the 911 homicide callers included extraneous information in their call. Of those, 96 percent were guilty of the offense, and only 4 percent were innocent. Extraneous information was the strongest indicator of guilt in the study."

I couldn't get that fbi link to open. Do you have another link? Maybe those smarter than I will analyze Meredith's call using the fbi article as a guide.

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 07:10 PM

And I hope they wouldn't wait 2 years before doing so!

Me too, that didn't seem to be in the best interests for anyone but themselves....

Poor CY, living with a Dad who some think killed her Mom,amd no one cared enough to ask the courts for help.

Poor CY, living with a Dad who some think tried to posion her and no one cared enough to ask the courts for help.
:rolleyes:

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 07:36 PM

You find answers to other questions, like, "How did Meredith feel, making the 911 call," with no problem whatsoever.

IMO

Gosh, and no one can ever answer when we ask:
"If they have so much evidence against Jason Young, why no arrest"?

Or, why did the Fishers wait so long to make sure CY was safe?

Guess there will be always be questions like that!!

:)
Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 07:41 PM

I couldn't get that fbi link to open. Do you have another link? Maybe those smarter than I will analyze Meredith's call using the fbi article as a guide.

Try this, KB.

Courtesy of Lindsey:

http://cicentre.com/intelligencespeakers/articles/sa_june08leb.pdf

Kat

5swab5

03-09-2009, 07:49 PM

You guys keep asking that question. First he didn't give her up he's sharing her. Second only JY would be able to answer that question. What makes you think anyone here knows the answer to that question?

Some "sharing". Meredith will have PRIMARY physical custody of Cassidy starting in August.

You can try to downplay, belittle and spin it all you want, but there is nothing equitable about an 80-20 split. Jason is going to be a "weekend" dad. MOO

Stellagant

03-09-2009, 07:50 PM

I couldn't get that fbi link to open. Do you have another link? Maybe those smarter than I will analyze Meredith's call using the fbi article as a guide.

Check out the 911 COPS (Considering Offender Probability in Statements) Scale on page 27.

http://www.fbi.gov/publications/leb/2008/june08leb.pdf

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 07:57 PM

Check out the 911 COPS (Considering Offender Probability in Statements) Scale on page 27.

http://www.fbi.gov/publications/leb/2008/june08leb.pdf

Sorry, if I missed your link,Stella.

I just posted this too, OMG.

Check out Pages 28-30 !!

It is all the things we discussed before ever having anything like this to compare it too!!
Relevance, voice modulation, determining the emergency,
1) What was the call about?
2) Who was the call about?
3)How was the call made?

Now, think of all the things MF says about herself that simply were not necessary.
1) Came here on a fluke
2) Normally good under pressure
3) Asking questions of CY that took away valuable time from the call

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 08:00 PM

Hi, Kat!

This was posted over on the Haleigh thread by Bratlings. Hope she doesn't mind that I brought it over here. Good links and real food for thought about FBI analysis of 911 calls:

Originally Posted by Bratlings
"WHO WAS THE CALL ABOUT?

Topic of the Call

When contacting 911, innocent individuals remained focused on the victim. For example, one caller urgently stated, “This guy’s hurt real bad. Tell them to hurry!”

Why would individuals call the emergency line and concentrate on themselves, reporting a problem without asking the dispatcher for assistance for the person who needs it? The following dialogue occurred when a father called 911 concerning his son:

Dispatcher: 911. What is your emergency?

Guilty caller: I have an unconscious child who is breathing very shallowly.

In this case, the father took personal possession of a problem (“I have”) and referred to his problem (his dying son) as “an unconscious child.” When the paramedics arrived at the residence, the child already had died. The father had assaulted his son, causing cerebral hemorrhaging. Twelve percent of the 911 callers in the study took personal possession of the problem. All were guilty of the homicide. "

http://www.fbi.gov/publications/leb/...leb.htm#page22

Misty's first words on the 911 call....

"Misty Croslin: “Hi…umm…I just woke up…and our backdoor was wide open and I think…and I can’t find our daughter”"

http://cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/200...pt_part_1.html

"Forty-four percent of the 911 homicide callers included extraneous information in their call. Of those, 96 percent were guilty of the offense, and only 4 percent were innocent. Extraneous information was the strongest indicator of guilt in the study."

Stella,
I am so sorry I missed your link, I was skimming the Board trying to catch up.
Kat

kingbuff

03-09-2009, 08:13 PM

Try this, KB.

Courtesy of Lindsey:

http://cicentre.com/intelligencespeakers/articles/sa_june08leb.pdf

Kat

Thanks, Kat. The link works fine....after I increased type size to 100%.
The article is Harpster's master's thesis. The woman is retired FBI and the man is a city cop. I just copied it....about 10 pages.

If you guys hadn't made B/S and Jester mad we could have a neutral, unbiased exam of Meredith's 911 call. Now, I think you will have to do it.

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 08:42 PM

Another point that seems to be overlooked by the JIIs!!!

I can only hope, that if I were murdered, and my spouse was named my slayer, that my mother, father and sisters would do all they could to get my children and my money away from the named slayer.

My daughter would want me to have her children. If I had to wait two years to make sure the change in custody was successful, I would do whatever I had to do. Better to give up two years and make sure you succeed than jump the gun and lose custody entirely.

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 08:45 PM

Thanks, Kat. The link works fine....after I increased type size to 100%.
The article is Harpster's master's thesis. The woman is retired FBI and the man is a city cop. I just copied it....about 10 pages.

If you guys hadn't made B/S and Jester mad we could have a neutral, unbiased exam of Meredith's 911 call. Now, I think you will have to do it.

I guess I missed them being mad, but this is definitely up and open for discussion. !!

Also, I owe thanks to Stella too, she and Lindsey must be on the same page !!

I am not believing it as I am reading it........

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-09-2009, 08:57 PM

"Fortunately, 911 calls are recorded, therefore investigators have access to the transcript and the actual call.

They can examine both the words and the tone of the voice."

Kat

achristie

03-09-2009, 09:01 PM

annalyzer

03-09-2009, 09:01 PM

Sorry, if I missed your link,Stella.

I just posted this too, OMG.

Check out Pages 28-30 !!

It is all the things we discussed before ever having anything like this to compare it too!!
Relevance, voice modulation, determining the emergency,
1) What was the call about?
2) Who was the call about?
3)How was the call made?

Now, think of all the things MF says about herself that simply were not necessary.
1) Came here on a fluke
2) Normally good under pressure
3) Asking questions of CY that took away valuable time from the call

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kat

Wow. Just wow.

5swab5

03-09-2009, 09:10 PM

Interesting, if you google "murderers" + "uncooperative"+ "investigation", the 9th hit is Jason Young, first page even. His mom must be so proud. MOO

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 09:14 PM

Interesting, if you google "murderers" + "uncooperative"+ "investigation", the 9th hit is Jason Young, first page even. His mom must be so proud. MOO

And THAT'S reality. The investigators know what the evidence says and who it leads to. Just a matter of time.

Doorbell

03-09-2009, 09:19 PM

LE didn't name JY slayer LF did that.

Civil court did that.

annalyzer

03-09-2009, 09:35 PM

Still no arrest? I wonder what the hold up is?

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:02 PM

My daughter would want me to have her children. If I had to wait two years to make sure the change in custody was successful, I would do whatever I had to do. Better to give up two years and make sure you succeed than jump the gun and lose custody entirely.

And this is a child's life, not a "game". They had to do everything very carefully to make sure, like you said, that they didn't jump the gun and lose custody entirely. It must have been a terribly long hard 2 years for them. They lost Michelle, and barely saw Cassidy. I am so happy for them!

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:05 PM

Still no arrest? I wonder what the hold up is?

Honestly, and this is JMO, but I don't care if he is arrested or not anymore. He gave up primary physical custody of his daughter so he is hiding something. I believe if he had one inkling that Meredith had anything to do with Michelle's murder, he would have opened his mouth for the WDS and the custody hearing.

He has nothing left IMO and Cassidy is away from her mother's slayer.

That makes me happy.:biggrin:

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:07 PM

And THAT'S reality. The investigators know what the evidence says and who it leads to. Just a matter of time.

And even if it doesn't happen, a man doesn't just sit back and allow himself to be named a slayer and allow his only child to be removed from his primary care.

So, to me, behind bars or not, his own actions make him appear guilty.

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 10:10 PM

Honestly, and this is JMO, but I don't care if he is arrested or not anymore. He gave up primary physical custody of his daughter so he is hiding something. I believe if he had one inkling that Meredith had anything to do with Michelle's murder, he would have opened his mouth for the WDS and the custody hearing.

He has nothing left IMO and Cassidy is away from her mother's slayer.

That makes me happy.:biggrin:

The last search warrant was just issued one month ago today. At the very least I would think they would wait for the results of that search to come back before they would go for an indictment.

I'm glad I'm not the person wondering every day, "Is today the day?" Not a great way to live.

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:17 PM

The last search warrant was just issued one month ago today. At the very least I would think they would wait for the results of that search to come back before they would go for an indictment.

I'm glad I'm not the person wondering every day, "Is today the day?" Not a great way to live.

Me too Barbara! Imagine waking up every day that way!! Terrible way to live, he already has it bad enough with being declared a slayer and giving up Primary Physical custody of his child whom he claims is his world-maybe thats why he agreed to the custody? He knows an arrest is coming?

JMO

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 10:20 PM

Me too Barbara! Imagine waking up every day that way!! Terrible way to live, he already has it bad enough with being declared a slayer and giving up Primary Physical custody of his child whom he claims is his world-maybe thats why he agreed to the custody? He knows an arrest is coming?

JMO

He'd have to have an inkling that it's a definite possibility. The latest search warrant named him the primary suspect. I know that we have known that for a long time but the latest warrant listed it right there in black and white.

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:27 PM

Wow doesn't even describe it. The problem is will Wake County let the FBI listen to the call. Combine that call with the 3 discrepancies in the warrants then add in the fact that the MF now has MY's daughter and her life ins. looks like we have a huge motive.

I wish they would examine it to put the suspicion of Meredith to rest here once and for all. But, I am sure they already have and she has checked out just fine which is why Jason was named the one and only suspect on the latest s/w.

JMO

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 10:31 PM

I wish they would examine it to put the suspicion of Meredith to rest here once and for all. But, I am sure they already have and she has checked out just fine which is why Jason was named the one and only suspect on the latest s/w.

JMO

LOL! Oh my goodness! They have had that tape since day one. Are people still going on about it?? Unbelievable! I am sure the tape has been analyzed and found to be exactly what it was: a woman in shock who was dealing with the unimaginable. Let's get back to the actual case and REAL evidence.

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:34 PM

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 10:38 PM

And I keep hearing about Meredith's inconsistant statements.......so she found her sister beaten to death, and forgot where she put her keys?

Thats it?

Oh, no, she saw bloody footprints, LE saw bloody footprints, but Cassidy's feet were clean........hmmmmmmm.........maybe JASON washed her feet after she ran in the room? He knocked her out with adult meds, maybe hoping he would kill her too? Maybe he was shocked to learn Cassidy didn't die too? Maybe he didn't want her either which made it easy for him to allow himself declared a slayer and to only have to play weekend dad?

Just giving some food for thought.

JMO

I honestly don't think so. I think he would have killed her outright if that's what he wanted. I really think that she woke up and came into the carnage while he was in the shower cleaning up. He found her when he came out of the shower and took her into her bathroom and closed the door while he dressed and finished what he had to do in the master bedroom. Then he went back and got the baby, cleaned her up and medicated her. He may have admonished her not to touch her mother again. The rest of the details are only known by him so I doubt we'll ever know what really happened.

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:39 PM

LOL! Oh my goodness! They have had that tape since day one. Are people still going on about it?? Unbelievable! I am sure the tape has been analyzed and found to be exactly what it was: a woman in shock who was dealing with the unimaginable. Let's get back to the actual case and REAL evidence.

It had to have been since Jason is named the one and only suspect and declared the slayer of Michelle Fisher Young!! Its been over two years now, IMO, that tape has been run through every possible test there is!

Add Jason refusal to open his mouth, and it seems pretty obvious!

JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:42 PM

I honestly don't think so. I think he would have killed her outright if that's what he wanted. I really think that she woke up and came into the carnage while he was in the shower cleaning up. He found her when he came out of the shower and took her into her bathroom and closed the door while he dressed and finished what he had to do in the master bedroom. Then he went back and got the baby, cleaned her up and medicated her. He may have admonished her not to touch her mother again. The rest of the details are only known by him so I doubt we'll ever know what really happened.

No, we never will know what really happened unless Jason decides one day to speak. Until then, we can only speculate. Maybe he had some heart and couldn't beat a 2 year old to death like he could his wife? Maybe he thought the medicine would do the job so the "daddydidit" phrase would never be heard on the 911 call? I don't know-and again, I guess we never will.

JMO

Stellagant

03-09-2009, 10:42 PM

"Fortunately, 911 calls are recorded, therefore investigators have access to the transcript and the actual call.

They can examine both the words and the tone of the voice."

Kat

And this from the same link:

Was the caller requesting assistance? If not, why not? Was the individual simply reporting a crime? Almost twice as many innocent callers (67 percent) in this study asked for help for the victim than did guilty callers (34 percent.)

Meredith Fisher asked for help for herself but she NEVER asked the dispatcher to help Michelle. And notice how polite she was?

The study: "Thirty-seven percent of the callers in the study made urgent and demanding please for help, and each was innocent. Conversely, 22 percent of the callers were patient and polite, and all were guilty of the homicides."

Look how long she waits to even mention Michelle:

DISPATCHER: 911 State your emergency

MEREDITH: I need an ambulance. It’s an emergency.

DISPATCHER: What address are you at Ma’am?

MEREDITH: Um Birchleaf…5108 Birchleaf Road

DISPATCHER: Okay and your phone number?

MEREDITH: Oh my God

DISPATCHER: Ma’am, what’s your phone number in case I lose you

MEREDITH: Um…(deleted)…hang on. Let me look at the phone. (deleted)

DISPATCHER: Alright, what’s the problem. Tell me exactly what happened.

MEREDITH: Um…I I…I think my sister’s dead.

DISPATCHER: Okay, tell me what happened, ma’am.

MEREDITH: I have no idea. Oh my God.

DISPATCHER: Alright stay on the phone with me please.

MEREDITH: Um.

DISPATCHER: What’s your name?

MEREDITH: Meredith Fisher

DISPATCHER: Alright, Meredith.

MEREDITH: And this is the Young address. Oh my God.

DISPATCHER: Meredith, listen to me please.

MEREDITH: Yeah.

DISPATCHER: Are you with the patient now?

MEREDITH: Yes and her daughter. And…she’s…

DISPATCHER: Okay, how old is the patient?

MEREDITH: …and there’s blood everywhere. She’s 28…29

DISPATCHER: 28?

MEREDITH: Should I try to move her?

DISPATCHER: Listen to me, ma’am.

MEREDITH: Yes sir.

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:48 PM

Also, as far as the "arm-chair" analysis of the 911 call on this board goes, those who seem to feel that Meredith didn't behave the "correct" way on the 911 call, seem to lose sight of the fact that she was in the company of a 2 year old.

She held it together pretty darn well in front of Cassidy IMO.

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 10:49 PM

No, we never will know what really happened unless Jason decides one day to speak. Until then, we can only speculate. Maybe he had some heart and couldn't beat a 2 year old to death like he could his wife? Maybe he thought the medicine would do the job so the "daddydidit" phrase would never be heard on the 911 call? I don't know-and again, I guess we never will.

JMO

It's hard for me to wrap my mind around someone who could kill his beautiful wife and son. I can't imagine him trying to kill his toddler. He may have but I can't get my brain to accept it.

Barbara2

03-09-2009, 10:51 PM

Tia

03-09-2009, 10:51 PM

kingbuff

03-09-2009, 11:08 PM

It's hard for me to wrap my mind around someone who could kill his beautiful wife and son. I can't imagine him trying to kill his toddler. He may have but I can't get my brain to accept it.

Hi, Barbara. You seem to have a very selective brain. What, the emperor has no clothes? http://www.answers.com/topic/the-emperor-s-new-clothes

Pretend you don't see the FBI magazine article. After all, no one can predict how a person should make a 911 call. Right?

cognac

03-09-2009, 11:09 PM

Tia

03-09-2009, 11:11 PM

Maybe that's why he fell plumb to his knees!!! She was still alive!! And here I thought he was faking it!:unsure:

Could be. But we will never know.

JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 11:18 PM

It also says guilty people try and blame the victim. She said Cassie did mommy fall. I also have always wondered why she said I am her only sister. Sounds like according to this article she was trying to make herself more important than the victim. When dispatch ask about MY it was always I don't know. Then she said she was usually good under stress. The dog was freaking out when she got there. I'm with her daughter. Sounds like she was making the call about herself not MY.

No it doesn't! I have two sisters, I would have said this is her sister, Tia......so the dispatcher did not confuse me with my other sister. Meredith stating she was her only sister, IMO, was just clarifying this to the 911 dispatcher. She was trying to be gentle with Cassidy IMO, and extract info from her by using language that a 2 year old can understand, but obviously critics of the 911 call cannot, IMO. I see nor hear nothing sinister in the 911 call, and obviously, LE doesn't either or Jason would not be the one and only suspect! Jason would have not given up Primary Physical Custody of Cassidy, nor would he have allowed himself to be declared a slayer if there was even the most remote possibility that anyone BUT him murdered Michelle. Look at the facts, look at Jason's behavior. Talk about making it all about ME, Jason wins the title there too.

JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 11:26 PM

Where did you hear that JY was the only suspect? LE said he is the primary suspect not the only one. I think if he was the only one they would have just said so.

I never heard anyone else named. I should have said only suspect. I didn't mean to confuse you. Its in the most recent SW that was linked here earlier.

JMO

Tia

03-09-2009, 11:27 PM

Where did you hear that JY was the only suspect? LE said he is the primary suspect not the only one. I think if he was the only one they would have just said so.

Thats all you got out of the entire post?

Tia

03-09-2009, 11:35 PM

What difference if the dispatch knew who you were or not? The emergency wouldn't be about you. I think MF had already identified herself and she had no other sisters so she could have said I'm her sister. But that wouldn't have made her as important . IMO

I don't know, I just know that having another sister, I would have identified which one I was. She was dealing with a toddler and her sister's dead body! Who knows what she was thinking at that moment. But, like I said, I just can't see what the 911 call critics see. I guess it keeps the board going? I just never ever saw anything wrong with it. And I really do NOT believe that Meredith wanted to think, at least at that time, that Michelle was murdered, especially by Jason.

JMO

annalyzer

03-10-2009, 12:15 AM

Honestly, and this is JMO, but I don't care if he is arrested or not anymore. He gave up primary physical custody of his daughter so he is hiding something. I believe if he had one inkling that Meredith had anything to do with Michelle's murder, he would have opened his mouth for the WDS and the custody hearing.

He has nothing left IMO and Cassidy is away from her mother's slayer.

That makes me happy.:biggrin:

If he killed her mother and left her alone with her mother's dead body then he didn't care about her anyway. So why would he care that he lost custody?

I, for one, would like to know why LE still aren't able to make an arrest. I want the murderer of Michelle behind bars no matter who it is.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:29 AM

It also says guilty people try and blame the victim. She said Cassie did mommy fall. I also have always wondered why she said I am her only sister. Sounds like according to this article she was trying to make herself more important than the victim. When dispatch ask about MY it was always I don't know. Then she said she was usually good under stress. The dog was freaking out when she got there. I'm with her daughter. Sounds like she was making the call about herself not MY.

Yes, there are quite a few examples of blame, of repeating the same phrases, of resisting cooperation and self-interruption in that call that allowed Meredith not to help her sister.

DISPATCHER: Alright, can you…can you get her on her back?

MEREDITH: [deep breath] okay…oh my God. Michelle? I don’t think so. She’s so heavy.

DISPATCHER: Alright, see if you can get her on her back.

MEREDITH: I just really think she’s dead.

DISPATCHER: Pardon?

MEREDITH: I really think she’s dead.

DISPATCHER: Okay. Are you certain?

MEREDITH: Hang on. Casssidy, sweetie, please go in your room. Okay, honey?

MEREDITH: I um…I um…I’m pretty sure.

DISPATCHER: You are?

MEREDITH: I…I don’t know…I don’t know. I’m…

DISPATCHER: Okay, we need to make sure.

MEREDITH: Okay.

DISPATCHER: Can you get her on her back for me?

MEREDITH: She’s kind of…twisted in a way that I can’t do that.

DISPATCHER: You can’t roll her over.

MEREDITH: Not…not easily.

DISPATCHER: You’re gonna have to try.

MEREDITH: Hang on…let me…I’m trying to see if I can get her pulse.

DISPATCHER: We gotta try to do CPR if we can get her on her back, Meredith.

MEREDITH: No, she’s ice cold.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:32 AM

What difference if the dispatch knew who you were or not? The emergency wouldn't be about you. I think MF had already identified herself and she had no other sisters so she could have said I'm her sister. But that wouldn't have made her as important . IMO

ITA. When he asked her if she was a relative, the shortest, most direct answer would have been, "yes."

Jester

03-10-2009, 12:37 AM

In that situation, I think I would not ask for help....I would demand it, loudly and immediately. Meredith was much too polite to suit me.

Meredith is too polite to make a 911 call?

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:40 AM

If he killed her mother and left her alone with her mother's dead body then he didn't care about her anyway. So why would he care that he lost custody?

I, for one, would like to know why LE still aren't able to make an arrest. I want the murderer of Michelle behind bars no matter who it is.

I would too, but I think that Jason has built his own prison of sorts and Cassidy will be safer with the Fisher's.

You are right, if he is the killer, he didn't care, so why would he fight?

JMO

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:42 AM

Meredith is too polite to make a 911 call?

In the opinion of the arm-chair dectectives, yes.

JMO

Jester

03-10-2009, 12:43 AM

Maybe some people accept death more quickly than others.

I think too that I would do everything I could to cooperate with the dispatcher. If he asked me if I saw what happened, I would not ignore him, especially if he asked me twice. I think I would also make a strong effort to turn the body if he asked me to do that. But maybe you had to have been there to understand.

Congratulations to you for having the confidence to know that you would be completely under control if you discovered a sibling brutally murdered. Many people would be a bit stunned in that situation, grasping to understand the reality, trying to appear calm for the sake of a very young child, and at the same time trying to comprehend questions without knowing the answers. I'm surprised that you would criticize the family of a murder victim, someone you claim to know, as they try desperately to get help, hoping beyond hope that what they see is not true.

Jester

03-10-2009, 12:46 AM

In the opinion of the arm-chair dectectives, yes.

JMO

In one comment, she is described as too polite. In the following comment, she is described as uncooperative.

Smells like the objective is to criticize. Too polite, too uncooperative. It doesn't work together.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:46 AM

Meredith is too polite to make a 911 call?

She did make the call and was polite. Took her time. No rush.

MEREDITH: Okay, can you close the door for two seconds and I’ll be right back in here, okay, sweetie?

CASSIDY: [inaudible]

MEREDITH: Okay.

DISPATCHER: Meredith.

MEREDITH: Okay, yes sir.

DISPATCHER: Okay. You got a cordless phone?

MEREDITH: Yes.

DISPATCHER: Alright.

MEREDITH: Stay right there, sweetie. Okay.

Jester

03-10-2009, 12:50 AM

She did make the call and was polite. Took her time. No rush.

MEREDITH: Okay, can you close the door for two seconds and I’ll be right back in here, okay, sweetie?

CASSIDY: [inaudible]

MEREDITH: Okay.

DISPATCHER: Meredith.

MEREDITH: Okay, yes sir.

DISPATCHER: Okay. You got a cordless phone?

MEREDITH: Yes.

DISPATCHER: Alright.

MEREDITH: Stay right there, sweetie. Okay.

So she's careful with her niece, careful not to traumatize her. Is that a problem now too?

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:53 AM

Congratulations to you for having the confidence to know that you would be completely under control if you discovered a sibling brutally murdered. Many people would be a bit stunned in that situation, grasping to understand the reality, trying to appear calm for the sake of a very young child, and at the same time trying to comprehend questions without knowing the answers. I'm surprised that you would criticize the family of a murder victim, someone you claim to know, as they try desperately to get help, hoping beyond hope that what they see is not true.

Bolding mine.

What a great post Jester!!!

Thats exactly what I think-Meredith did not want to believe what she was seeing and had Cassidy to take care of. My take, is that from the moment she dialed 911 she knew Cassidy would hear her and she was trying to be as gentle as possible. She got LE there, thats all that matters, she didn't run and hide under her mommy's skirt, she didn't lawyer up and refuse to speak with/hang up with LE, she and Linda FOUGHT for Cassidy and FOUGHT for Michelle by seeing that Jason was named Michelle's slayer in the WDS. They love Michelle and Cassidy and have done nothing, IMO, to the contrary except drive that point home. No wonder 911 critics, and the Linda and Meredith critics are so upset.

JMO

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:55 AM

So she's careful with her niece, careful not to traumatize her. Is that a problem now too?

IMO, she did an excellent job.

She was called by JASON to retrieve a document and found his handiwork. She did all she could to relate the info to LE and take care of Cassidy.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:56 AM

In one comment, she is described as too polite. In the following comment, she is described as uncooperative.

Smells like the objective is to criticize. Too polite, too uncooperative. It doesn't work together.

According to the study's authors, too polite and too uncooperative are both signs of Guilty Callers (pg, 27 of the link)

Guilty Callers
No request for help for victim
Extraneous Information
Insulting or blaming the victim
Conflicting facts

Help requested for the caller only
Focus on Caller's problem
Acceptance of victim's death

No voice modulation
Polite and patient
Resists cooperation
Self-interruptions

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:57 AM

So she's careful with her niece, careful not to traumatize her. Is that a problem now too?

According to the study's authors, Meredith's focus on the child rather than focusing on helping her sister is more than a bit of a problem.

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:57 AM

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:58 AM

According to the study's authors, Meredith's focus on the child rather than focusing on helping her sister is more than a bit of a problem.

Did you contact LE with this info?

Jester

03-10-2009, 12:59 AM

Bolding mine.

What a great post Jester!!!

Thats exactly what I think-Meredith did not want to believe what she was seeing and had Cassidy to take care of. My take, is that from the moment she dialed 911 she knew Cassidy would hear her and she was trying to be as gentle as possible. She got LE there, thats all that matters, she didn't run and hide under her mommy's skirt, she didn't lawyer up and refuse to speak with/hang up with LE, she and Linda FOUGHT for Cassidy and FOUGHT for Michelle by seeing that Jason was named Michelle's slayer in the WDS. They love Michelle and Cassidy and have done nothing, IMO, to the contrary except drive that point home. No wonder 911 critics, and the Linda and Meredith critics are so upset.

JMO

I completely agree with your post. As Linda and Meredith fight for Cassidy's rights, and succeed, the desperate, fabricated criticisms of them mount. The 911 call is has been recycled ad nauseum for two years, often used to distract the debate from other more interesting and relevant discussions about the circumstances of the murder.

Tia

03-10-2009, 01:01 AM

I completely agree with your post. As Linda and Meredith fight for Cassidy's rights, and succeed, the desperate, fabricated criticisms of them mount. The 911 call is has been recycled ad nauseum for two years, often used to distract the debate from other more interesting and relevant discussions about the circumstances of the murder.

My hope is that if those so critical of the 911 call have info to pass along to LE to find Michelle's killer, that they do it, rather than argue about it. This is serious business, not a game.

JMO

Jester

03-10-2009, 01:01 AM

According to the study's authors, too polite and too uncooperative are both signs of Guilty Callers (pg, 27 of the link)

Guilty Callers
No request for help for victim
Extraneous Information
Insulting or blaming the victim
Conflicting facts

Help requested for the caller only
Focus on Caller's problem
Acceptance of victim's death

No voice modulation
Polite and patient
Resists cooperation
Self-interruptions

I guess the police should just arrest her then. There's nothing to suggest she committed the murder, but someone thinks her 911 call is both polite and uncooperative. Sounds like someone put the horse before the cart, and was primed to first accuse, and then conclude.

Haul her off to jail before she makes another polite 911 call.

Tia

03-10-2009, 01:03 AM

I completely agree with your post. As Linda and Meredith fight for Cassidy's rights, and succeed, the desperate, fabricated criticisms of them mount. The 911 call is has been recycled ad nauseum for two years, often used to distract the debate from other more interesting and relevant discussions about the circumstances of the murder.

When Meredith and Linda filed the WDS and the Custody Suit, they layed themselves out there for Jason. Had he any info, that was the time to speak. Did he? NO.

He gave up without a fight in every area.

What does that tell any person who has any common sense?

JMO

Jester

03-10-2009, 01:06 AM

My hope is that if those so critical of the 911 call have info to pass along to LE to find Michelle's killer, that they do it, rather than argue about it. This is serious business, not a game.

JMO

It's absurd to suggest that someone is guilty of a brutal murder because of a polite, or, wait a minute, uncooperative, 911 phone call. Evidence is required, and polite 911 calls doesn't quite cut it. But hey, if that's all it takes, the info should be passed on to the police. When they dismiss it, they can focus on the slayer.

Tia

03-10-2009, 01:06 AM

I guess the police should just arrest her then. There's nothing to suggest she committed the murder, but someone thinks her 911 call is both polite and uncooperative. Sounds like someone put the horse before the cart, and was primed to first accuse, and then conclude.

Haul her off to jail before she makes another polite 911 call.

Yup! Forward the article to Detective Spivey or to the DA. Have them check into it if they feel LE hasn't done their job in reviewing the 911 call. Arguing here isn't making Jason any less a named slayer.

JMO

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 01:06 AM

I completely agree with your post. As Linda and Meredith fight for Cassidy's rights, and succeed, the desperate, fabricated criticisms of them mount. The 911 call is has been recycled ad nauseum for two years, often used to distract the debate from other more interesting and relevant discussions about the circumstances of the murder.

Cassidy's rights haven't needed protecting and aren't tied to the murder.

Why did Linda and Meredith wait two years to protect Cassidy herself is probably a question many of the jurors will want answered at Meredith's trial.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 01:09 AM

I guess the police should just arrest her then. There's nothing to suggest she committed the murder, but someone thinks her 911 call is both polite and uncooperative. Sounds like someone put the horse before the cart, and was primed to first accuse, and then conclude.

Haul her off to jail before she makes another polite 911 call.

One polite 911 call filled to the brim with other equally incriminating red flags is all that will be needed, imo. And, yes, I wish they would haul her off to jail before she has the need to make another similar call.

kingbuff

03-10-2009, 01:10 AM

I guess the police should just arrest her then. There's nothing to suggest she committed the murder, but someone thinks her 911 call is both polite and uncooperative. Sounds like someone put the horse before the cart, and was primed to first accuse, and then conclude.

Haul her off to jail before she makes another polite 911 call.

See, I knew you would make sense of this. I suggest a jail cell next to the cell for the authors of that article. You do want to jail them for making such absurd accusations. Right?

Tia

03-10-2009, 01:10 AM

It's absurd to suggest that someone is guilty of a brutal murder because of a polite, or, wait a minute, uncooperative, 911 phone call. Evidence is required, and polite 911 calls doesn't quite cut it. But hey, if that's all it takes, the info should be passed on to the police. When they dismiss it, they can focus on the slayer.

Well, IMO, LE is LE, and I don't believe any of the posters here are LE. IMO, LE has already reviewed the 911 call. Meredith's forgetfullness of where she placed her keys the day she found her sister beaten to death and her little niece in the home, have been examined as well, and IMO, its safe to assume that she has been cleared since Jason was named a suspect in the last warrant. But I encourage those who feel LE could use some help to send any info they have.

JMO

kingbuff

03-10-2009, 01:15 AM

One polite 911 call filled to the brim with other equally incriminating red flags is all that will be needed, imo. And, yes, I wish they would haul her off to jail before she has the need to make another similar call.

The way I read the article, the authors would need only one red flag before hauling her off to jail. With a multitude of red flags, they probably will just hang her....with a telephone cord. Or was it a cordless?

Tia

03-10-2009, 01:16 AM

kingbuff

03-10-2009, 01:19 AM

By the way, the authors of that article included an email address for those want to write and comment on the article....tell them how brilliant they are....or so stupid. Go for it.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 01:21 AM

The way I read the article, the authors would need only one red flag before hauling her off to jail. With a multitude of red flags, they probably will just hang her....with a telephone cord. Or was it a cordless?

yeah, I'd really like to know what they are waiting for.

It was a cordless and lead up to this very polite exchange:

DISPATCHER: Okay and your phone number?

MEREDITH: Oh my God

DISPATCHER: Ma’am, what’s your phone number in case I lose you

MEREDITH: Um…(deleted)…hang on. Let me look at the phone. (deleted)

DISPATCHER: Alright, what’s the problem. Tell me exactly what happened.

MEREDITH: Um…I I…I think my sister’s dead.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 01:24 AM

By the way, the authors of that article included an email address for those want to write and comment on the article....tell them how brilliant they are....or so stupid. Go for it.

FBI published it so I doubt they consider it as useless as a few posters want to claim.

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 01:44 AM

Meredith is too polite to make a 911 call?

In the midst of what she walked into, I guess expecting some kind of hysteria would be out of the question.
:rolleyes:

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 01:49 AM

It's absurd to suggest that someone is guilty of a brutal murder because of a polite, or, wait a minute, uncooperative, 911 phone call. Evidence is required, and polite 911 calls doesn't quite cut it. But hey, if that's all it takes, the info should be passed on to the police. When they dismiss it, they can focus on the slayer.

And, when you add in some of the other stuff!!
Lights outside on in the daytime, Michelle's car there, an unlocked door, a freaking out dog, a child alone, a dead body, and bloody footprints.

Nahhhhh, why should anyone think something might be wrong?

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 01:54 AM

Still no arrest? I wonder what the hold up is?

No one seems to know the answer , Anna!!
I have asked that more times than I can count.
:biggrin:
Good to see you !!

Kat

Leanne Weich

03-10-2009, 06:34 AM

So she's careful with her niece, careful not to traumatize her. Is that a problem now too?

I guess maybe she should have screamed at Cassidy and stormed out of Michelle's bedroom and locked the child in the bedroom.

5swab5

03-10-2009, 07:02 AM

If he killed her mother and left her alone with her mother's dead body then he didn't care about her anyway. So why would he care that he lost custody? (snipped)

EXACTLY! That's it in a nutshell. MOO

5swab5

03-10-2009, 07:19 AM

ITA. When he asked her if she was a relative, the shortest, most direct answer would have been, "yes."

Yet you can pontificate for over two years about a 911 call that a gal makes that just walked into a house of horrors? Sent there by her BIL, who is conveniently out of town, but just barely...not too far away, not too close...just right. To get a computer printout for an Anniversary...that had passed? For an auction...that had ended?

All the while refusing to scrutinize anything that the lying, cheating uncooperative husband did or does. Up to and including letting himself be declared Michelle and Rylan's slayer AND ceding PRIMARY physical custody of his only daughter.

Anyone that listens to that 911 call and doesn't feel for Meredith doesn't have a heart, much less a soul. Making fun of being polite on the phone? That's digging deep. How can you ignore the confusion, disbelief and horror in Meredith's voice? It is a dreadful tape to listen to. The terror is palpable and one can literally "feel" her trembling.

Well, Wake County still has the slayer as their prime suspect, so I guess you are just going to have to get used to the idea, that you are wrong. MOO

5swab5

03-10-2009, 07:28 AM

(snipped)
Why did Linda and Meredith wait two years to protect Cassidy herself is probably a question many of the jurors will want answered at Meredith's trial.

Hopefully at Jason's trial, if the question even comes up ...The jurors will listen to the explanation and not make the Prosecutor explain it to them 10,000 times.MOO

Jester

03-10-2009, 09:35 AM

Cassidy's rights haven't needed protecting and aren't tied to the murder.

Why did Linda and Meredith wait two years to protect Cassidy herself is probably a question many of the jurors will want answered at Meredith's trial.

Wasn't it her right to have the insurance policy processed? Her father certainly wasn't going to do that for her. That fact speaks for itself.

Jester

03-10-2009, 09:36 AM

One polite 911 call filled to the brim with other equally incriminating red flags is all that will be needed, imo. And, yes, I wish they would haul her off to jail before she has the need to make another similar call.

I hope that serves us well as a reminder to always be rude when asking the emergency service for assistance.

Jester

03-10-2009, 09:38 AM

See, I knew you would make sense of this. I suggest a jail cell next to the cell for the authors of that article. You do want to jail them for making such absurd accusations. Right?

Statistical analysis is junk science. The conclusions are entirely dependent on the variables. If I want to prove the moon is made of green cheese, I could probably set up some probability tables to prove it's probably true.

Jester

03-10-2009, 09:40 AM

I guess maybe she should have screamed at Cassidy and stormed out of Michelle's bedroom and locked the child in the bedroom.

I think it has been suggested that the appropriate response was for Meredith to run screaming from the house, with traumatized 2 year old child being dragged along behind.

Tia

03-10-2009, 10:01 AM

Yet you can pontificate for over two years about a 911 call that a gal makes that just walked into a house of horrors? Sent there by her BIL, who is conveniently out of town, but just barely...not too far away, not too close...just right. To get a computer printout for an Anniversary...that had passed? For an auction...that had ended?

All the while refusing to scrutinize anything that the lying, cheating uncooperative husband did or does. Up to and including letting himself be declared Michelle and Rylan's slayer AND ceding PRIMARY physical custody of his only daughter.

Anyone that listens to that 911 call and doesn't feel for Meredith doesn't have a heart, much less a soul. Making fun of being polite on the phone? That's digging deep. How can you ignore the confusion, disbelief and horror in Meredith's voice? It is a dreadful tape to listen to. The terror is palpable and one can literally "feel" her trembling.

Well, Wake County still has the slayer as their prime suspect, so I guess you are just going to have to get used to the idea, that you are wrong. MOO

Those "facts" are hard to over look. LE hasn't, thats for sure!!
I don't believe anyone else has either-no matter what is said or how much the 911 call is scrutinized.

Tia

03-10-2009, 10:05 AM

I think it has been suggested that the appropriate response was for Meredith to run screaming from the house, with traumatized 2 year old child being dragged along behind.

Interesting. Has it been suggested what the appropriate response to the WDS and Custody suit should have been for Jason? Or is the fact that he didn't bother fighting either one still ignored?

JMO

Jester

03-10-2009, 10:20 AM

Interesting. Has it been suggested what the appropriate response to the WDS and Custody suit should have been for Jason? Or is the fact that he didn't bother fighting either one still ignored?

JMO

The correct response is what everyone on this board assumed he would do: respond to the suit. He didn't and, naturally, after the fact, this has been explained as: he didn't care about the money. Prior to the ruling in the custody application, everyone on this board assumed he would respond. When he didn't, it was explained as: he didn't really lose primary custody, he's planning on pulling a rabbit out of his hat in July and reversing his consent order. It doesn't seem to matter what Jason does, as some people have a ready explanation for his irrational decisions.

Allyson

03-10-2009, 11:02 AM

Tia

03-10-2009, 11:07 AM

I still think that at some point, SOMEONE will have to step back,take a good long look and think "I sure am making a lot of excuses for this guy"...

Well, maybe that will happen once the 911 call discussion is over?

JMO

Doorbell

03-10-2009, 11:11 AM

The correct response is what everyone on this board assumed he would do: respond to the suit. He didn't and, naturally, after the fact, this has been explained as: he didn't care about the money. Prior to the ruling in the custody application, everyone on this board assumed he would respond. When he didn't, it was explained as: he didn't really lose primary custody, he's planning on pulling a rabbit out of his hat in July and reversing his consent order. It doesn't seem to matter what Jason does, as some people have a ready explanation for his irrational decisions.

...And I really don't mind that. It's people trying to convict the innocent sister that bothers me.

Defending the suspect makes for good discussion, and, if they could find anything real that points to another suspect, I would be willing to consider it. However, I agree with Swabby that Meredith's 911 call is straight-up genuine (I can hear the tremble, too, Swabby), and need something much more to suspect Meredith.

All the digging and innuendo doesn't add up to a hill of beans, compared with allowing oneself to be declared SLAYER, or agreeing to share custody of one's daughter with that same sister of the victim.

IMO

Allyson

03-10-2009, 11:12 AM

Well, maybe that will happen once the 911 call discussion is over?

JMO

Nah...people having been making excuses for the charming Jason Young his whole life, even when the truth is staring them in the face.

In my Opinion.

Doorbell

03-10-2009, 11:17 AM

I am guessing the rabbit is white. You know, when logic and proportion
have fallen sloppy dead (thanks Jefferson Airplane!)....

And the White Knight is talking backwards...and the Red Queen is "Off with her head!"

:smile:

Tia

03-10-2009, 11:28 AM

Nah...people having been making excuses for the charming Jason Young his whole life, even when the truth is staring them in the face.

In my Opinion.

Very true.

BTW, LOVE your siggy!

Tia

03-10-2009, 11:31 AM

I stated last week that the 911 call -- to me -- sounds like a person who in her heart wanted one thing to be true and in her head knew something else to be true. Meredith knew Michelle was dead, but didn't want her to be...and we, in that phone call, hear that reconciliation between her heart and her brain (with trying to handle a 2 year old at the same time). I honestly can picture her just staring at the floor while trying to talk to the dispatcher in complete shock as everything registers (and thus the reasons for some of the answers...kind of like when your spouse tries to answer you while not listening and focused on something completely different). How horribly sad. How disgusting of the person to put Meredith in that position.

Hi Onder!

Thats what disgusts me as well, why send her own flesh and blood to the house??! Why not call a neighbor? Tell them he can't reach Michelle and is worried, would they check on her?

Doorbell

03-10-2009, 12:00 PM

Hi Onder!

Thats what disgusts me as well, why send her own flesh and blood to the house??! Why not call a neighbor? Tell them he can't reach Michelle and is worried, would they check on her?

Maybe he didn't have any of the neighbors' numbers programmed into his phone.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:16 PM

Statistical analysis is junk science. The conclusions are entirely dependent on the variables. If I want to prove the moon is made of green cheese, I could probably set up some probability tables to prove it's probably true.

The study detailed on the FBI site isn't an analysis of statistics, it is an analysis of actual 911 recordings and the real voices and words said on those recordings. The authors didn't fabricate the verdicts in those cases, either.

If you think it is "junk science" by all means, why don't you email the authors and let them know?

:rolleyes:

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:19 PM

I think it has been suggested that the appropriate response was for Meredith to run screaming from the house, with traumatized 2 year old child being dragged along behind.

You keep repeating this but so far, the only poster who has suggested such a scenario is you. LOL

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:20 PM

Nah...people having been making excuses for the charming Jason Young his whole life, even when the truth is staring them in the face.

In my Opinion.

What does Jason Young have to do with Meredith's 911 call? Nowhere on it does she even mention the guy.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 12:26 PM

...And I really don't mind that. It's people trying to convict the innocent sister that bothers me.

Defending the suspect makes for good discussion, and, if they could find anything real that points to another suspect, I would be willing to consider it. However, I agree with Swabby that Meredith's 911 call is straight-up genuine (I can hear the tremble, too, Swabby), and need something much more to suspect Meredith.

All the digging and innuendo doesn't add up to a hill of beans, compared with allowing oneself to be declared SLAYER, or agreeing to share custody of one's daughter with that same sister of the victim.

IMO

Long before Jason was named slayer in the civil suit and agreed to share custody, you formed the opinion Jason is guilty. So what real evidence did you base your opinion on before Jason was named slayer?

I have no way of knowing whether the 911 call is genuine or not because I've never met Meredith Fisher. After listening to the 911 call is when I first suspected she was involved. It IS real evidence, whether you want to accept it or not.

Tia

03-10-2009, 12:33 PM

Maybe he didn't have any of the neighbors' numbers programmed into his phone.

Its a shame he didn't call LE to check on her!! Then we could study his response!!!

LE would have told him to get his butt straight home, NOW. No side trips to Mom's house.

awareness

03-10-2009, 02:11 PM

Long before Jason was named slayer in the civil suit and agreed to share custody, you formed the opinion Jason is guilty. So what real evidence did you base your opinion on before Jason was named slayer?

I have no way of knowing whether the 911 call is genuine or not because I've never met Meredith Fisher. After listening to the 911 call is when I first suspected she was involved. It IS real evidence, whether you want to accept it or not.

The only "real" evidence it provides IMO is an honestly shocked woman who just discovered her murdered pregnant sister.
JMO

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 02:23 PM

What does Jason Young have to do with Meredith's 911 call? Nowhere on it does she even mention the guy.

"It was a fluke, I don't usually come here during the day, I am normally good under pressure"

Who cares?

Ummm, your sister is dead, no one cares about what your normal habits are, could you, ummm, maybe get some help to the residence you are calling from?

Kat

Barbara2

03-10-2009, 02:27 PM

Its a shame he didn't call LE to check on her!! Then we could study his response!!!

LE would have told him to get his butt straight home, NOW. No side trips to Mom's house.

I thought this statement in the article was very interesting:

"For instance, patrol officers who have informed a citizen that a family member has been killed in a traffic accident know that people often respond with denial because of their inability to immediately process such shocking information."

You can definitely here that denial during the 911 call but the reaction of the husband when hearing the information? We were told that he immediately accepted it. Very interesting.

awareness

03-10-2009, 02:29 PM

"It was a fluke, I don't usually come here during the day, I am normally good under pressure"

Who cares?

Ummm, your sister is dead, no one cares about what your normal habits are, could you, ummm, maybe get some help to the residence you are calling from?

Kat

Ummm, she was probably in shock from discovering her pregnant sister dead. Of course, others will pick apart the 911 call yet have never stepped in a situation like that.
JMO

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 03:00 PM

"It was a fluke, I don't usually come here during the day, I am normally good under pressure"

Who cares?

Ummm, your sister is dead, no one cares about what your normal habits are, could you, ummm, maybe get some help to the residence you are calling from?

Kat

ITA, Kat.

Yes, it was all about Meredith. "I need an ambulance," "I don't know," "I am normally good under pressure," "I am her only sister." And, in a classic display of non-urgency, "I'm listening......."

Michelle wasn't even mentioned by name until the dispatcher asked Meredith if she had checked to see if she was breathing. A little detail that had evidently totally escaped Meredith. Not only was she not helping her sister, she actually asked if she should even try to help. Mind-boggling, imo.

DISPATCHER: Alright. Is she conscious?
MEREDITH: N..., I don’t think so. Should I try to help her?

DISPATCHER: Listen to me, ma’am.
MEREDITH: I’m listening.

DISPATCHER: Is she breathing?
MEREDITH: I don’t think so.

DISPATCHER: Have you checked?
MEREDITH: Michelle? [pause] She’s cold.

BSNBREVARDNC

03-10-2009, 03:10 PM

5swab5

03-10-2009, 03:17 PM

What caught my attention in the article is where it said that most family members don't immediately accept that a loved one is dead. Makes me think of the whole dropping plum to his knees, never asking the cops about what happened, etc. IMO

Yep, and moms can always tell. I think they learn the first time we try to fake surprise after opening our Christmas presents early and rewrapping them. MOO

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 03:20 PM

I thought this statement in the article was very interesting:

"For instance, patrol officers who have informed a citizen that a family member has been killed in a traffic accident know that people often respond with denial because of their inability to immediately process such shocking information."

You can definitely here that denial during the 911 call but the reaction of the husband when hearing the information? We were told that he immediately accepted it. Very interesting.

Where is there denial in the 911 call? If there was denial, Meredith would have been urgently asking the dispatcher to send help. Meredith asked if she should even try to help. That's acceptance that Michelle was already dead, not denial. It was the Dispatcher who was urgently trying to help Michelle, not Meredith.

This exchange certainly isn't a reflection of denial:

DISPATCHER: Alright. Is she conscious?
MEREDITH: N..., I don’t think so. Should I try to help her?

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 03:22 PM

What caught my attention in the article is where it said that most family members don't immediately accept that a loved one is dead. Makes me think of the whole dropping plum to his knees, never asking the cops about what happened, etc. IMO

Jason didn't find the body, Meredith did. Wasn't Meredith the one who informed Jason's family of the news of Michelle's death? Why wouldn't Jason believe her?

5swab5

03-10-2009, 03:33 PM

Where is there denial in the 911 call? If there was denial, Meredith would have been urgently asking the dispatcher to send help. Meredith asked if she should even try to help. That's acceptance that Michelle was already dead, not denial. It was the Dispatcher who was urgently trying to help Michelle, not Meredith.

This exchange certainly isn't a reflection of denial:

DISPATCHER: Alright. Is she conscious?
MEREDITH: N..., I don’t think so. Should I try to help her?

What your brain realizes, your heart is sometimes slow to accept.

Unlike Jason's response, when he IMMEDIATELY accepted that Michelle was dead, no "What?", "When?", "Where?", "How?" or even "Is Cassidy OK?".

Just plumb to his knees. THAT is not normal! MOO

Tia

03-10-2009, 03:42 PM

Tia

03-10-2009, 03:46 PM

Ummm, she was probably in shock from discovering her pregnant sister dead. Of course, others will pick apart the 911 call yet have never stepped in a situation like that.
JMO

IMO, the call will continue to be picked apart since there is really nothing else to discuss right now and its becoming harder and harder to ignore the fact that Jason is the primary suspect in Michelle's murder. Its a way to steer away from the facts, to not have to face the truth.

JMO

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 03:47 PM

What your brain realizes, your heart is sometimes slow to accept.

Unlike Jason's response, when he IMMEDIATELY accepted that Michelle was dead, no "What?", "When?", "Where?", "How?" or even "Is Cassidy OK?".

Just plumb to his knees. THAT is not normal! MOO

Perfectly normal where I come from. Falling "plumb to the knees" in grief is a colloquial expression pretty common in the south.

Why wouldn't Jason not believe the news? Would Meredith lie about something like that? Wouldn't Meredith make sure the Youngs knew Cassidy was okay?

It's also beside the point. Jason's reaction isn't on the 911 call, which IS evidence.

Tia

03-10-2009, 03:57 PM

awareness

03-10-2009, 03:57 PM

IMO, the call will continue to be picked apart since there is really nothing else to discuss right now and its becoming harder and harder to ignore the fact that Jason is the primary suspect in Michelle's murder. Its a way to steer away from the facts, to not have to face the truth.

JMO

ITA. Some seem to forget not only was a beloved mother, friend, daughter, sister killed but her unborn son. She was a very pregnant woman carrying Ryland. Only the worst people harm pregnant women.
JMO

awareness

03-10-2009, 03:59 PM

This case is sure complicated. I believe LE said that early on , also. We have a strange 911 call, livor on a woman's back that was found on her stomach , a clean child in a bloody environment and misplaced car keys. To make it even more complicated LE thinks her husband who was out of town did it. Two years and no arrest does anyone think LE is looking in the wrong place?

Clearly you and a few others here feel LE is in the wrong place, or that Meredith is culpable.

IMO LE is headed right where they need to be - arresting Jason Young for the criminal aspect of this horrible and cruel case.
JMO

5swab5

03-10-2009, 03:59 PM

Perfectly normal where I come from. Falling "plumb to the knees" in grief is a colloquial expression pretty common in the south.

Why wouldn't Jason not believe the news? Would Meredith lie about something like that? Wouldn't Meredith make sure the Youngs knew Cassidy was okay?

It's also beside the point. Jason's reaction isn't on the 911 call, which IS evidence.

The 911 call is evidence of a sister that was dismayed and shocked at finding her sister brutally bludgeoned to death, after being sent to the scene by her BIL on a useless errand.

Gerald was succinct when he described Jason's reaction to the news. His reaction is evidence that he didn't have to question anything about Michelle's death, because he already knew all the answers. MOO

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 04:25 PM

The 911 call is evidence of a sister that was dismayed and shocked at finding her sister brutally bludgeoned to death, after being sent to the scene by her BIL on a useless errand.

Gerald was succinct when he described Jason's reaction to the news. His reaction is evidence that he didn't have to question anything about Michelle's death, because he already knew all the answers. MOO

It's okay if that is your opinion of the 911 call. I seriously doubt Meredith's attorney will be able to find any voice analysis expert that shares your opinion but of course, they should try. If there is evidence that proves Jason sent Meredith to the scene, why haven't LE arrested him or at least included it in a search warrant to make Jason look bad?

Jason's reaction isn't proof of anything at all. If Jason already knew all the answers as you claim, it wouldn't take over two years to arrest him. LE would be able to show Jason had opportunity to commit the crime. So far, there's been no proof he sent Meredith there, no proof he had opportunity. Nada. Where's the evidence to support your claims?

BSNBREVARDNC

03-10-2009, 04:29 PM

What cops? Was there cops at his mom's house when she told him?

uuuuhhhhhhhh.....In the SW's it talks about the cops speaking with Jason on the phone. It also says that when he spoke with them he didn't ask them about what had happened.........Have you read the SW's? Sometimes it better to read things for yourself rather than listen to others tell you what they would like you to hear. Just IMO.

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 04:50 PM

Since when is falling to your knees the equivalent of acceptance of the news that took you to your knees?

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 04:51 PM

uuuuhhhhhhhh.....In the SW's it talks about the cops speaking with Jason on the phone. It also says that when he spoke with them he didn't ask them about what had happened.........Have you read the SW's? Sometimes it better to read things for yourself rather than listen to others tell you what they would like you to hear. Just IMO.So his family didn't know and he didn't find out from them what happened?

Tia

03-10-2009, 05:23 PM

The SW said the JY checked his voicemail after his MIL left them (and before getting to Brevard). He MIL stated he needed to call her back. But, her voicemails were 30 some and 40 some seconds long. I really think she said a whole lot more. And if Jason heard that whole lot more, he knew before he got to Brevard. Heck, he knew before leaving Birchleaf in the wee early mornings, IMO.

IMO, I would never be surprised to find out the 911 call critics have not read the search warrants thoroughly, just listened to the 911 call and scanned the s/w's for Meredith's name.

JMO

BSNBREVARDNC

03-10-2009, 05:32 PM

So his family didn't know and he didn't find out from them what happened?

Upon hearing that my spouse was dead, I don't think my reaction would be, "Oh, OK. Enough said, I got it." I think I would have hundreds of questions, How did they die? Did they suffer? Was my daughter hurt at all? Are you certain she is OK? Did someone break in? Why did this happen? Did anyone see anything? etc., etc., etc.

However, if you already know the answers to the questions, why ask?

It's time to go for a walk. Later.

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 05:58 PM

The SW said the JY checked his voicemail after his MIL left them (and before getting to Brevard). He MIL stated he needed to call her back. But, her voicemails were 30 some and 40 some seconds long. I really think she said a whole lot more. And if Jason heard that whole lot more, he knew before he got to Brevard. Heck, he knew before leaving Birchleaf in the wee early mornings, IMO.

Do you have a link to the search warrant that says that he checked his vm AFTER his MIL left her messages? Thanks.

awareness

03-10-2009, 06:03 PM

It's okay if that is your opinion of the 911 call. I seriously doubt Meredith's attorney will be able to find any voice analysis expert that shares your opinion but of course, they should try. If there is evidence that proves Jason sent Meredith to the scene, why haven't LE arrested him or at least included it in a search warrant to make Jason look bad?

Jason's reaction isn't proof of anything at all. If Jason already knew all the answers as you claim, it wouldn't take over two years to arrest him. LE would be able to show Jason had opportunity to commit the crime. So far, there's been no proof he sent Meredith there, no proof he had opportunity. Nada. Where's the evidence to support your claims?

Why else did Meredith just go to the house then? Obviously, its because Jason sent her over there to retreive the Coach purse info.

I also think LE hasnt released all of their evidence against Jason yet.

I think it was included in a SW that Meredith was sent over there by Jason. Let me go look and get a link for you for the "evidence" that you say is "Nada". :rolleyes: http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2009/02/10/4508366/20090210114743620.pdf Page 3
JMO

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 06:03 PM

Upon hearing that my spouse was dead, I don't think my reaction would be, "Oh, OK. Enough said, I got it." I think I would have hundreds of questions, How did they die? Did they suffer? Was my daughter hurt at all? Are you certain she is OK? Did someone break in? Why did this happen? Did anyone see anything? etc., etc., etc.

However, if you already know the answers to the questions, why ask?

It's time to go for a walk. Later.

When I deliver bad news, I always try to preface it with whatever good news I can find. The fact that CY was spared was the only good news there was. And I don't know how anyone who has just been informed his wife and son had been murdered would instantly be peppering the messenger with many questions about details. His step-dad didn't have the answers, did he?

Stellagant

03-10-2009, 06:04 PM

Why else did Meredith just go to the house then? Obviously, its because Jason sent her over there to retreive the Coach purse info.

I also think LE hasnt released all of their evidence against Jason yet.

I think it was included in a SW that Meredith was sent over there by Jason. Let me go look and get a link for you for the "evidence" that you say is "Nada". :rolleyes: http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2009/02/10/4508366/20090210114743620.pdf Page 3
JMO

Meredith's statement to LE was that Jason sent her to the house. LE haven't confirmed her statement is true.

awareness

03-10-2009, 06:14 PM

Meredith's statement to LE was that Jason sent her to the house. LE haven't confirmed her statement is true.

Well gee, why wont Jason go and clear up any misunderstandings then? If you know, Meredith is as cuplible as you claim she is.
JMO

kingbuff

03-10-2009, 06:23 PM

Since when is falling to your knees the equivalent of acceptance of the news that took you to your knees?

I've never bothered to respond to insults about Jason falling plumb to his knees. It is what it is. What isn't known is who said what to Jason, what he said in response, what he said while he was prostrate with grief, nor what was said to comfort him. I've collapsed plumb to my knees a couple of times....certainly doesn't deserve insults.

The other thing about asking the cops what happened....no one here knows how many phone calls he had with Meredith and Cassie after he got the news. He probably already knew the circumstances. Before he arrived in Raleigh he knew the cops were looking at him as the killer. Why would he ask anything? Rather a stupid comment by the cops, in my opinion. Yeah, yeah, I know: it was Spivey a year or so later who made the comment, lashing out at Jason for not talking to him. Still a stupid comment, in my opinion.

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 06:27 PM

Upon hearing that my spouse was dead, I don't think my reaction would be, "Oh, OK. Enough said, I got it." I think I would have hundreds of questions, How did they die? Did they suffer? Was my daughter hurt at all? Are you certain she is OK? Did someone break in? Why did this happen? Did anyone see anything? etc., etc., etc.

However, if you already know the answers to the questions, why ask?

It's time to go for a walk. Later.And you know that Jason didn't ask those types of questions? Or simply said "ok enough said, I got it"?

It's interesting how people know exactly what they would do if in the same spot Jason was in, however, when it comes to Meredith's 911 call the claim is 'you don't know what you would in that situation'.

Have a great walk. Later.

5swab5

03-10-2009, 06:28 PM

The SW said the JY checked his voicemail after his MIL left them (and before getting to Brevard). He MIL stated he needed to call her back. But, her voicemails were 30 some and 40 some seconds long. I really think she said a whole lot more. And if Jason heard that whole lot more, he knew before he got to Brevard. Heck, he knew before leaving Birchleaf in the wee early mornings, IMO.

Yep, between chatting it up with MM, he checked his voice mail. He had to, he had to make sure that his wife had been discovered and it was safe to continue to Brevard, for his little performance. MOO

5swab5

03-10-2009, 06:32 PM

Meredith's statement to LE was that Jason sent her to the house. LE haven't confirmed her statement is true.

They didn't "confirm" to some peoples' satisfaction that the relationship between MM and Jason was an intimate one for a long time either. We all know how that turned out.:biggrin: MOO

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 06:37 PM

I've never bothered to respond to insults about Jason falling plumb to his knees. It is what it is. What isn't known is who said what to Jason, what he said in response, what he said while he was prostrate with grief, nor what was said to comfort him. I've collapsed plumb to my knees a couple of times....certainly doesn't deserve insults.

The other thing about asking the cops what happened....no one here knows how many phone calls he had with Meredith and Cassie after he got the news. He probably already knew the circumstances. Before he arrived in Raleigh he knew the cops were looking at him as the killer. Why would he ask anything? Rather a stupid comment by the cops, in my opinion. Yeah, yeah, I know: it was Spivey a year or so later who made the comment, lashing out at Jason for not talking to him. Still a stupid comment, in my opinion.

well, ya know, he had to establish probable cause and since the purpose is to justify suspicion to a judge, nothing that could be viewed upon by the court as non-incriminating would be included. Why risk the denial of a SW?

5swab5

03-10-2009, 06:37 PM

That conversation took place on the way to Raleigh from Brevard. JY had already been informed of what happened. He didn't have to ask LE.

I would think that a loving father would have lots of questions for someone that was in Raleigh. Especially LE. Maybe just to hear it again, as a second opinion, for reassurance.

Never mind, we all know how loving Jason is towards Cassidy. Loves himself enough to give PRIMARY physical custody of her away, so he can keep his mouth shut. MOO.

awareness

03-10-2009, 06:53 PM

Even if he did get her message why would he think it would have any thing to do with his wife in Raleigh? Did LE try to call him? Did MF try to call him? He's supposed to think a call from his MIL in NY has a bearing on his family in Raleigh?

If I received phone calls (PLURAL) from my MIL who I didnt call or get calls from frequently, I would wonder if something wrong had happened.

But its MO Jason killed her, so he already knew long before Meredith showed up that Michelle & Rylan were BRUTALLY killed.
JMO

awareness

03-10-2009, 06:55 PM

Why are you so hung up on how JY is raising his child? Evidently you have no problems with MF so why do you keep bringing it up?

Most topics have already been discussed ad naseum. If you have a problem with them posting about a topic relating to the case, maybe bring it up with CW? This is a message board to discuss the case, after all.
JMO

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 07:11 PM

If I received phone calls (PLURAL) from my MIL who I didnt call or get calls from frequently, I would wonder if something wrong had happened.

But its MO Jason killed her, so he already knew long before Meredith showed up that Michelle & Rylan were BRUTALLY killed.
JMO
Well, that's you. This isn't about what you would do, it's about what Jason did.

Why on earth would his MIL, in another state, have info about Michelle that he would be concerned about? It's obvious there was no love lost between them.

And I know it's totally off the chain but there are husbands and wives who do not get along with their In Laws and who would not under any circumstance return their call.

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 07:12 PM

Most topics have already been discussed ad naseum. If you have a problem with them posting about a topic relating to the case, maybe bring it up with CW? This is a message board to discuss the case, after all.
JMO
I'll be sure to bring this post of yours forward the next time someone complains about the discussion of the 911 call.

Jester

03-10-2009, 07:13 PM

The study detailed on the FBI site isn't an analysis of statistics, it is an analysis of actual 911 recordings and the real voices and words said on those recordings. The authors didn't fabricate the verdicts in those cases, either.

If you think it is "junk science" by all means, why don't you email the authors and let them know?

:rolleyes:

This is going to be tough to explain, but here goes. When there is an analysis of when A happened, B resulted, so when A happens with a certain frequency, it's possible to conclude B, we call that statistical analysis. The analysis looks at a correlation between past circumstances and attempts to draw conclusions about future events. When the word "qualitative" is used to describe a document's contents, it's a statistical analysis. Some people call stats junk science, since it is possible to manipulate the results based on the selection of the qualitative events.

http://hsx.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/13/1/69

It's stats from a master's thesis in the Department of Criminal Justice
of the College of Education at the University of Cincinnati. The entire document is available here: http://www.ohiolink.edu/etd/send-pdf.cgi/HARPSTER%20TRACY%20K.pdf?acc_num=ucin1163534092

It looks like an interesting read (and dissection) for a Sunday afternoon.

Jester

03-10-2009, 07:17 PM

What caught my attention in the article is where it said that most family members don't immediately accept that a loved one is dead. Makes me think of the whole dropping plum to his knees, never asking the cops about what happened, etc. IMO

He got it right away - didn't need any time to accept that his wife was murdered.

awareness

03-10-2009, 07:30 PM

I'll be sure to bring this post of yours forward the next time someone complains about the discussion of the 911 call.

Well Im not complaining about anything.
JMO

alterEgo©

03-10-2009, 07:31 PM

Well Im not complaining about anything.
JMO
Didn't say you were.

Jester

03-10-2009, 07:33 PM

I've never bothered to respond to insults about Jason falling plumb to his knees. It is what it is. What isn't known is who said what to Jason, what he said in response, what he said while he was prostrate with grief, nor what was said to comfort him. I've collapsed plumb to my knees a couple of times....certainly doesn't deserve insults.

The other thing about asking the cops what happened....no one here knows how many phone calls he had with Meredith and Cassie after he got the news. He probably already knew the circumstances. Before he arrived in Raleigh he knew the cops were looking at him as the killer. Why would he ask anything? Rather a stupid comment by the cops, in my opinion. Yeah, yeah, I know: it was Spivey a year or so later who made the comment, lashing out at Jason for not talking to him. Still a stupid comment, in my opinion.

I'm a bit shocked by your post as the words "double standard" ring through my ears. Are you suggesting that when Meredith discovers her murdered sister, she should be completely coherent, but when Jason falls plumb to his knees without a question on his lips, it's normal?

5swab5

03-10-2009, 07:38 PM

Why are you so hung up on how JY is raising his child? Evidently you have no problems with MF so why do you keep bringing it up?

That's just the point, thanks to the deal that Jason struck, he WON'T be raising Cassidy. He will "exercise custodial time" with her, when he wants to, IF he wants to. Doesn't sound to me like he puts much value on his time with her, he gave it up so easily. MOO

Cardinal

03-10-2009, 07:50 PM

I think she had to go I think she had the little girl.

If I'm following you, you think Meredith removed Cassidy from the house earlier in the day and then returned to the house with Cassidy just prior to calling 911. Is that correct?

Because if it is, the scenario you're describing would mean Meredith is cold, calculating and has no capacity for compassion for Cassidy, to return her to that scene to talk about bandaids and washcloths.

And this is the woman Jason freely handed over his daughter to? If you're correct, then Jason Young has no love for his daughter at all, IMO.

achristie

03-10-2009, 08:01 PM

[QUOTE=kingbuff;12875814]I've never bothered to respond to insults about Jason falling plumb to his knees. It is what it is. What isn't known is who said what to Jason, what he said in response, what he said while he was prostrate with grief, nor what was said to comfort him. I've collapsed plumb to my knees a couple of times....certainly doesn't deserve insults.
.........................................

Respectfully Snipped
..........................................
Well, here is your chance to set the record straight. You've got the floor.

Aggie

achristie

03-10-2009, 08:04 PM

He got it right away - didn't need any time to accept that his wife was murdered.

Exactly. No disbelief. No anger. No indignation. Just acceptance.

MOO Aggie

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 08:17 PM

And you know that Jason didn't ask those types of questions? Or simply said "ok enough said, I got it"?

It's interesting how people know exactly what they would do if in the same spot Jason was in, however, when it comes to Meredith's 911 call the claim is 'you don't know what you would in that situation'.

Have a great walk. Later.

I am sure Jason was told right away that CY was fine and unhurt when they told him that Michelle was dead.

And, that would be the first thing he asked since they were both at the home together.

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 08:19 PM

I'll be sure to bring this post of yours forward the next time someone complains about the discussion of the 911 call.

:thumbsup:

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 08:24 PM

He got it right away - didn't need any time to accept that his wife was murdered.

How do you know what he got or didn't get from being told the news?

Unless, you were there, you know the same exact thing we do,
=nothing.

How you want to interpret Jason's reactions or non reactions are the same way we interpret the 911 call.

The 911 call was all about MF, but once again, even in death, she would still be in Michelle's shadow.

My interpretation, hope this helps.

Kat
.

kingbuff

03-10-2009, 08:39 PM

I'm a bit shocked by your post as the words "double standard" ring through my ears. Are you suggesting that when Meredith discovers her murdered sister, she should be completely coherent, but when Jason falls plumb to his knees without a question on his lips, it's normal?

Just to help the lurkers.... I didn't suggest Meredith be coherent, completely or otherwise. In my opinion, she could be whatever she chose to be. And who told you Jason had no comment before dropping plumb to his knees? Why do you and others make up stuff like this? I think the lurkers have taken your measure.

Allyson

03-10-2009, 08:41 PM

I am sure Jason was told right away that CY was fine and unhurt when they told him that Michelle was dead.

And, that would be the first thing he asked since they were both at the home together.

Kat

Link?

TIA

awareness

03-10-2009, 08:49 PM

Link?

TIA

I wouldnt hold your breath, I doubt there is a link to prove that.
:thumbsup:
JMO

awareness

03-10-2009, 08:50 PM

How do you know what he got or didn't get from being told the news?

Unless, you were there, you know the same exact thing we do,
=nothing.

How you want to interpret Jason's reactions or non reactions are the same way we interpret the 911 call.

The 911 call was all about MF, but once again, even in death, she would still be in Michelle's shadow.

My interpretation, hope this helps.

Kat
.

JMO Jason didnt need to hear "the news" from anyone, since he killed them.

Doorbell

03-10-2009, 09:04 PM

Doorbell

03-10-2009, 09:07 PM

Why are you so hung up on how JY is raising his child? Evidently you have no problems with MF so why do you keep bringing it up?

No answer for Jason's partial abdication of fatherhood, eh?

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 09:11 PM

Considering that she probably sounded a bit upset, yes.

But, if he didn't listen to the message, how would he know?

Why didn't he instead, take the call, fake shock, disbelief, or grief, and
maybe do it in a public setting?

He could have stopped at a rest stop or a convenience store gasping for air, saying he just received news his wife was dead!!

He could have dropped to the ground there, pleading for help, saying he couldn't go on!!

That he needed his family to come get him , etc.

There is all kinds of ways Jason could have played this, if he was guilty.

Instead, he stays on the phone with MM, knowing his whole world is about to be blown apart????

:rolleyes:

Kat

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 09:15 PM

No answer for Jason's partial abdication of fatherhood, eh?

If someone fails to answer a question, it may because they don't want to.
And, they definitely don't have to.

To suggest that they do, is harrassment..........

Kat

Jester

03-10-2009, 09:19 PM

Just to help the lurkers.... I didn't suggest Meredith be coherent, completely or otherwise. In my opinion, she could be whatever she chose to be. And who told you Jason had no comment before dropping plumb to his knees? Why do you and others make up stuff like this? I think the lurkers have taken your measure.

I seem to recall you suggesting that Meredith was both too polite, and uncooperative (back on page 17ish). You seemed to find fault with her answers. I understood that you were critical of her difficulty in comprehending the brutal murder of her sister while speaking with the 911 emergency service.

Jason's stepfather said that he told Jason what happened, and Jason went plumb to his knees. No one is making stuff up, merely taking words at face value. Just for fun, I think we should look at the phrase "plumb to his knees" a little closer, so we can eliminate any suggestion that Jason asked several questions and then, as an afterthought, went plumb to his knees.

I chose the Merriam Webster source:
Middle English, from Anglo-French plum, plomb, from Latin plumbum lead
Date:14th century
a lead weight attached to a line and used to indicate a vertical direction
(reference: Merriam Webster Dictionary; the book)

I think that means Jason went down like a lead weight.

Tia

03-10-2009, 09:22 PM

JMO Jason didnt need to hear "the news" from anyone, since he killed them.

:thumbsup:

ITA. Which is why, IMO, he didn't answer Linda's calls and had so many calls to him mother prior to arriving in Brevard. What were they discussing?

Tia

03-10-2009, 09:28 PM

Why are you so hung up on how JY is raising his child? Evidently you have no problems with MF so why do you keep bringing it up?

Maybe some are "hung up" on how he is raising his child since he was named her mother's slayer?? Maybe since he is the primary suspect in her mother's murderd???

JMO

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 09:30 PM

I seem to recall you suggesting that Meredith was both too polite, and uncooperative (back on page 17ish). You seemed to find fault with her answers. I understood that you were critical of her difficulty in comprehending the brutal murder of her sister while speaking with the 911 emergency service.

Jason's stepfather said that he told Jason what happened, and Jason went plumb to his knees. No one is making stuff up, merely taking words at face value. Just for fun, I think we should look at the phrase "plumb to his knees" a little closer, so we can eliminate any suggestion that Jason asked several questions and then, as an afterthought, went plumb to his knees.

<snipped>
.

But, the difference is, we don't know what Jason said!!
But, we do hear what MF said...it is captured on tape.
Do you see the difference?

Now, if someone videotaped Jason's reaction and words we could go from there, but the only thing we have is what we were told.

That Jason fell plumb to his knees?, I am not sure that is any funnier than someone saying that they are usually good under pressure when finding a dead body.

Why would it not be okay to become hysterical at that time?

Kat

achristie

03-10-2009, 09:31 PM

:thumbsup:

ITA. Which is why, IMO, he didn't answer Linda's calls and had so many calls to him mother prior to arriving in Brevard. What were they discussing?

Help me out here, Tia. Just how many calls did he make? Was it 28 to Mom and 50 to MM? It's all running together.

Tia

03-10-2009, 09:31 PM

Well gee, why wont Jason go and clear up any misunderstandings then? If you know, Meredith is as cuplible as you claim she is.
JMO

I was wondering that too. Oh, wait, he is too busy allowing Meredith to have primary physical custody of his daughter.............:rolleyes:

JMO

Barbara2

03-10-2009, 09:36 PM

I was wondering that too. Oh, wait, he is too busy allowing Meredith to have primary physical custody of his daughter.............:rolleyes:

JMO

Not that it means anything since I can't link to my communication, but I gave the chart and the 911 recording to a friend in LE and had him analyze it without saying anything at all about the case. Just listening to the call and going by the criteria in the chart shown in the FBI article, he ranked Meredith 8 out of the 11 in the innocent category. FWIW.

Tia

03-10-2009, 09:36 PM

Help me out here, Tia. Just how many calls did he make? Was it 28 to Mom and 50 to MM? It's all running together.

28 to Mom for sure. I have to go back and look up how many to MM.

achristie

03-10-2009, 09:40 PM

28 to Mom for sure. I have to go back and look up how many to MM.

No need to search. Thanks.:wink:

Tia

03-10-2009, 09:44 PM

Not that it means anything since I can't link to my communication, but I gave the chart and the 911 recording to a friend in LE and had him analyze it without saying anything at all about the case. Just listening to the call and going by the criteria in the chart shown in the FBI article, he ranked Meredith 8 out of the 11 in the innocent category. FWIW.

Of course! IMO, there are very few who seem to have a problem with it.

Also, a comment was made on another forum about how Det. Spivey has specialized training in statement analysis. Its on most of the s/w's when he is listing his credentials. I am sure he used that training when he listened to the 911 call and took Meredith's statements. Since she has never been named a suspect, she is, IMO, in the clear and this daily game of trying to implicate her in a MURDER is just not right. There is tons more to suggest Jason commited this murder, right down to him being the named slayer of Michelle.

JMO

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 09:44 PM

Not that it means anything since I can't link to my communication, but I gave the chart and the 911 recording to a friend in LE and had him analyze it without saying anything at all about the case. Just listening to the call and going by the criteria in the chart shown in the FBI article, he ranked Meredith 8 out of the 11 in the innocent category. FWIW.

The words from the seasoned police officers that came across the scene that was described as one of the bloodiest, gruesome, horrific murders that they ever saw, are what I use to judge the 911 call as reference.

If what they saw compared to someone who thought someone "fell", then they must have been talking about and looking at 2 different crime scenes.

:rolleyes:

Kat

Barbara2

03-10-2009, 09:48 PM

Of course! IMO, there are very few who seem to have a problem with it.

Also, a comment was made on another forum about how Det. Spivey has specialized training in statement analysis. Its on most of the s/w's when he is listing his credentials. I am sure he used that training when he listened to the 911 call and took Meredith's statements. Since she has never been named a suspect, she is, IMO, in the clear and this daily game of trying to implicate her in a MURDER is just not right. There is tons more to suggest Jason commited this murder, right down to him being the named slayer of Michelle.

JMO

My friend just listening to the call and not having any information from the search warrants or anything else did talk about what shock does to a person who finds a body like that. It was a very interesting discussion. I didn't mention that she had been sent over there or any of the other details. I can't say it was enlightening because he pretty much confirmed what the majority of us have thought all along. It was nice to have it stated affirmatively by an expert though.

Tia

03-10-2009, 09:51 PM

My friend just listening to the call and not having any information from the search warrants or anything else did talk about what shock does to a person who finds a body like that. It was a very interesting discussion. I didn't mention that she had been sent over there or any of the other details. I can't say it was enlightening because he pretty much confirmed what the majority of us have thought all along. It was nice to have it stated affirmatively by an expert though.

Yes, its nice to have some confirmation.

What also needs to be considered is Meredith had Cassidy there. She did all she could to try to get info from Cassidy without being "harsh".

She did a great job under the circumstances, IMO.

She may have been screaming on the inside, but remained composed enough to speak calmly around Cassidy and get help.

Kat4Eagles

03-10-2009, 09:52 PM

My friend just listening to the call and not having any information from the search warrants or anything else did talk about what shock does to a person who finds a body like that. It was a very interesting discussion. I didn't mention that she had been sent over there or any of the other details. I can't say it was enlightening because he pretty much confirmed what the majority of us have thought all along. It was nice to have it stated affirmatively by an expert though.

Then you won't mind if the rest of us who do have problems with the 911 call continue to discuss it until we reach a decison of our own.?

Thanxx.....:)
Kat

Barbara2

03-10-2009, 09:56 PM

Yes, its nice to have some confirmation.

What also needs to be considered is Meredith had Cassidy there. She did all she could to try to get info from Cassidy without being "harsh".

She did a great job under the circumstances, IMO.

She may have been screaming on the inside, but remained composed enough to speak calmly around Cassidy and get help.

I was thinking again about Alan's description of Jason and being a "chameleon". I was thinking about the descriptions given of him when hearing the news and his behavior on the ride back to Raleigh. I know that somewhere it was mentioned that he was "crying so hard he needed a towel". (Really? Or did he want it to cover his face to keep from betraying any real emotions?) Those who try to become what they think others expect them to be often display exaggerated and inappropriate responses to situations. IMO

BSNBREVARDNC

03-10-2009, 10:02 PM

Then you won't mind if the rest of us who do have problems with the 911 call continue to discuss it until we reach a decison of our own.?

Thanxx.....:)
Kat

I promise that I’m not trying to sound like a jerk or anything, but I thought you had already made up your mind on the 911 call?:unsure:

achristie

03-10-2009, 10:03 PM

I was thinking again about Alan's description of Jason and being a "chameleon". I was thinking about the descriptions given of him when hearing the news and his behavior on the ride back to Raleigh. I know that somewhere it was mentioned that he was "crying so hard he needed a towel". (Really? Or did he want it to cover his face to keep from betraying any real emotions?) Those who try to become what they think others expect them to be often display exaggerated and inappropriate responses to situations. IMO

I found Alan Fisher's words VERY incriminating, especially after all those posts about how he sided with JY ! I never bought into him thinking more of JY than he thought of his own daughters. Some people did. But I didn't. Would be hilarious were this not such a sad case!!!!!!!

MOO Aggie

Barbara2

03-10-2009, 10:05 PM

I found Alan Fisher's words VERY incriminating, especially after all those posts about how he sided with JY ! I never bought into him thinking more of JY than he thought of his own daughters. Some people did. But I didn't. Would be hilarious were this not such a sad case!!!!!!!

MOO Aggie

There were a number of posts by some people that were so off base as far as Alan was concerned, you wonder why they don't question other misinformation that they may have been given. Just a thought.

achristie

03-10-2009, 10:11 PM

Tia

03-10-2009, 10:45 PM

I was thinking again about Alan's description of Jason and being a "chameleon". I was thinking about the descriptions given of him when hearing the news and his behavior on the ride back to Raleigh. I know that somewhere it was mentioned that he was "crying so hard he needed a towel". (Really? Or did he want it to cover his face to keep from betraying any real emotions?) Those who try to become what they think others expect them to be often display exaggerated and inappropriate responses to situations. IMO

Is that why he hung up on LE? He was crying too hard?

:angry:

Tia

03-10-2009, 10:49 PM

There were a number of posts by some people that were so off base as far as Alan was concerned, you wonder why they don't question other misinformation that they may have been given. Just a thought.

The affair with MM is another that was argued for MONTHS, turns out, he had an affair. It was argued what a "good daddy" Jason is and how he'd fight for Cassidy, he didn't.

I'm sure there is more, so far, jsut about all points argued in Jason's favor, have been proven untrue.

Tia

03-10-2009, 10:56 PM

Truthfully? Makes no difference to me. Justice will be served.

MOO Aggie

Hi Aggie!

I think it HAS been served in a way. Jason is now the named slayer of Michelle, lost any $ he may have received from her death, lost his daughter for the most part, so life isn't exactly looking fun for Jason these days. His unwillingness to stand up and fight for anything for fear of getting "caught" has him painted into a corner.

JMO

awareness

03-10-2009, 11:33 PM

Or naive to believe some of the rumors.

Kat

ITA! Especially the one where Meredith is supposedly a suspect. There is nothing to support that whatsoever. Jason on the other hand was having at least one affair, had strange internet searches, gave up primary physical custody of his surviving child with no fight, etc.
JMO

awareness

03-10-2009, 11:35 PM

Hi Aggie!

I think it HAS been served in a way. Jason is now the named slayer of Michelle, lost any $ he may have received from her death, lost his daughter for the most part, so life isn't exactly looking fun for Jason these days. His unwillingness to stand up and fight for anything for fear of getting "caught" has him painted into a corner.

JMO

I agree justice is coming in bits and pieces. Next Monday is hopefully the final ruling for the WD suit. Of course, nothing can replace Michelle & Ryland.
JMO

Kat4Eagles

03-11-2009, 12:20 AM

I promise that I’m not trying to sound like a jerk or anything, but I thought you had already made up your mind on the 911 call?:unsure:

Not really, and I wouldn't call you a jerk, :no:
Name calling leads to timeouts and bannings,
and/or the Board being closed.

And, the Board has become hostile enough,
to the point where many people are either
ignored, or on ignore. Many, many good
posters have left due to the arguing.

I find a lot of things strange about the call,
but it does not make someone a murderer
because they don't react the way the
way that I and many others might.

But, clearly the case against Jason is
not all that either.
:)

Kat

Tia

03-11-2009, 12:41 AM

ITA! Especially the one where Meredith is supposedly a suspect. There is nothing to support that whatsoever. Jason on the other hand was having at least one affair, had strange internet searches, gave up primary physical custody of his surviving child with no fight, etc.
JMO

ITA awareness, those things are HUGE red flags, IMO.

Why why why would he do those things if he were innocent??
Especially give up Primary Physical Custody!
:confused:

Stellagant

03-11-2009, 01:07 AM

Nov 6, 2008 SW. Page 6. After it gives the times of LF's calls to JY, it states that he got his voicemail.

http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2008/11/06/3914018/20081106190923866.pdf

Nowhere on that warrant does it Jason checked his voice messages and received LF's message.

Jules2

03-11-2009, 01:12 AM

Nowhere on that warrant does it Jason checked his voice messages and received LF's message.

Cell phone records from Nov 3rd, 2006 showed that Jason Young called his voice mail and checked his messages

Page 7

http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2008/11/06/3914018/20081106190923866.pdf

Stellagant

03-11-2009, 01:18 AM

This is going to be tough to explain, but here goes. When there is an analysis of when A happened, B resulted, so when A happens with a certain frequency, it's possible to conclude B, we call that statistical analysis. The analysis looks at a correlation between past circumstances and attempts to draw conclusions about future events. When the word "qualitative" is used to describe a document's contents, it's a statistical analysis. Some people call stats junk science, since it is possible to manipulate the results based on the selection of the qualitative events.

http://hsx.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/13/1/69

It's stats from a master's thesis in the Department of Criminal Justice
of the College of Education at the University of Cincinnati. The entire document is available here: http://www.ohiolink.edu/etd/send-pdf.cgi/HARPSTER%20TRACY%20K.pdf?acc_num=ucin1163534092

It looks like an interesting read (and dissection) for a Sunday afternoon.

Your portrayal of the 911 call as "junk science" is as laughably lame as your claim Jason "poisoned" his daughter.

The analysis in the FBI publication concerns analysis of voices, not documents. The only event is a 911 call tied to a homicide. Content analyzed was in the present, not the future. Bottom line is that such analysis is admissable as evidence. Try again. :rolleyes:

Stellagant

03-11-2009, 01:20 AM

Cell phone records from Nov 3rd, 2006 showed that Jason Young called his voice mail and checked his messages

Page 7

http://www.wral.com/asset/news/local/2008/11/06/3914018/20081106190923866.pdf

Nowhere does it claim Jason checked his voice mail AFTER Linda Fisher left her messages.

Stellagant

03-11-2009, 01:27 AM

My friend just listening to the call and not having any information from the search warrants or anything else did talk about what shock does to a person who finds a body like that. It was a very interesting discussion. I didn't mention that she had been sent over there or any of the other details. I can't say it was enlightening because he pretty much confirmed what the majority of us have thought all along. It was nice to have it stated affirmatively by an expert though.

I think it is only a matter of time before Meredith is indicted for the murder of her sister and that 911 call is going to play a huge part. Maybe your expert friend will be willing to testify at Meredith's trial? Because I'm betting the majority on the jury aren't going to hear "shock" after they listen to the prosecution's expert analysis of that call.

Doorbell

03-11-2009, 01:30 AM

I think it is only a matter of time before Meredith is indicted for the murder of her sister and that 911 call is going to play a huge part. Maybe your expert friend will be willing to testify at Meredith's trial? Because I'm betting the majority on the jury aren't going to hear "shock" after they listen to the prosecution's expert analysis of that call.

I'll take that bet.

Even if she's not the one on trial.

Stellagant

03-11-2009, 01:30 AM

Not really, and I wouldn't call you a jerk, :no:
Name calling leads to timeouts and bannings,
and/or the Board being closed.

And, the Board has become hostile enough,
to the point where many people are either
ignored, or on ignore. Many, many good
posters have left due to the arguing.

I find a lot of things strange about the call,
but it does not make someone a murderer
because they don't react the way the
way that I and many others might.

But, clearly the case against Jason is
not all that either.
:)

Kat

The case against Jason is far weaker than the case against Meredith at this point. Meredith's 911 call plus conflicting statements she made to LE are far more evidence of guilt than anything we've seen about Jason.

Tia

03-11-2009, 01:34 AM

Is it a violation of the TOS to publicly accuse someone of murder when LE hasn't even named them a suspect?

5swab5

03-11-2009, 05:46 AM

The case against Jason is far weaker than the case against Meredith at this point. Meredith's 911 call plus conflicting statements she made to LE are far more evidence of guilt than anything we've seen about Jason.

I guess those EIGHTEEN Search Warrants for all things Jason Lynn Young were just a waste of time, energy and pulpwood then? NOT! There has never been a single thing, either published in the press or released by LE that names Meredith as a suspect in these crimes. Very easy to see the direction that the investigation is heading and it is certainly not towards the cooperative, although polite Meredith. MOO

Barbara2

03-11-2009, 09:12 AM

I guess those EIGHTEEN Search Warrants for all things Jason Lynn Young were just a waste of time, energy and pulpwood then? NOT! There has never been a single thing, either published in the press or released by LE that names Meredith as a suspect in these crimes. Very easy to see the direction that the investigation is heading and it is certainly not towards the cooperative, although polite Meredith. MOO

The article linked on this thread from the FBI bulletin was a condensed version of the actual master's thesis. The full text listed the "polite" factor as "inappropriate politeness". They gave an example of a guilty caller starting out the 911 call by saying "Hi". There are some posters that in my opinion are trying to stretch to ridiculous lengths to try and make the 911 call in the Young case fit what they want to believe is a guilty person placing that call.

Barbara2

03-11-2009, 09:26 AM

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 09:38 AM

Make that 19. Apparently another one was served yesterday.

Do you have any more info. you can share?

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:13 AM

Do you have any more info. you can share?

Hi Leanne!

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1437214.html

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:15 AM

Make that 19. Apparently another one was served yesterday.

It sure doesn't look as if LE suspects Meredith!!

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1437214.html

"Some fights lasted for hours, the woman said, and Jason Young once punched holes in a wall and ripped a door off its hinges."

What a good Daddy he is!!! NOT!

"The 16-page search warrant affidavit also includes e-mail messages between the Youngs. In one, Jason Young wrote he'd been having trouble with their daughter Cassidy because of a power outage.

"I can't entertain her enough w/o tv to finish the [expletive] yard," the message reads. "I am taking beer and her to pool. I am in a mood that makes our trip to myrtle seem mild, pray the beer kicks in. I could kill u for not letting me finish the yard this morning."

Doorbell

03-11-2009, 10:17 AM

alterEgo©

03-11-2009, 10:19 AM

Hi Leanne!

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1437214.html

Thanks Tia!

Wonder when they will have the actual SW up.

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 10:22 AM

Hi Leanne!

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1437214.html

Thanks Tia. Barbara had already given it to me so thanks too Barbara. Seems like Michelle was well aware of Jason's infidelity and it doesn't appear MM was the first either. I really wouldn't be surprised if a divorce was on the cards for Michelle and that was what pre-empted her murder.

Oh boy, Jason's attitude toward caring for the center of his world during a power outage sure gives an indication of how he'd feel about someone who wasn't the center of his world huh? HMVUHO.

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:25 AM

Thanks Tia. Barbara had already given it to me so thanks too Barbara. Seems like Michelle was well aware of Jason's infidelity and it doesn't appear MM was the first either. I really wouldn't be surprised if a divorce was on the cards for Michelle and that was what pre-empted her murder.

Oh boy, Jason's attitude toward caring for the center of his world during a power outage sure gives an indication of how he'd feel about someone who wasn't the center of his world huh? HMVUHO.

Yes, she told me after I posted it here.

Great Daddy huh?

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:26 AM

Thanks Tia!

Wonder when they will have the actual SW up.

I don't know, soon I would think.

WRAL has NOTHING on it yet!

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:34 AM

Well I just said after 18 warrants LE has found no evidence JY killed his wife. Now they've served another. Wonder at what point they will start looking somewhere else? Some times square pegs just can't be put in round holes no matter how hard you try.

Did you read the article? It appears he was a liar and verbally abusive to Michelle and physically violent.

LE is looking in the right direction. I have NO doubt.

The "Meredith did it" story just doesn't hold any water IMO when you read all the s/w's and this latest article.

alterEgo©

03-11-2009, 10:38 AM

Did you read the article? It appears he was a liar and verbally abusive to Michelle and physically violent.

LE is looking in the right direction. I have NO doubt.

The "Meredith did it" story just doesn't hold any water IMO when you read all the s/w's and this latest article.It makes no sense at all that she would want to have another child with a man that was verbally abusive and violent.

No sense at all.

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 10:38 AM

Well I just said after 18 warrants LE has found no evidence JY killed his wife. Now they've served another. Wonder at what point they will start looking somewhere else? Some times square pegs just can't be put in round holes no matter how hard you try.

Because you've failed to see any evidence, doesn't mean LE doesn't have any. No matter how much you wish it were so, LE wouldn't keep applying for and being granted SWs if the Judge didn't feel there was evidence set out in the PC to give him the authority to authorize them. You also will never fit a 2 x 4 into a round hole either.

I know it's been a really long time since Michelle was murdered but if you ever watch Cold Cases on CI, you'll know 2+ years is not a hopeless scenario for a case to be solved - particularly in a spousal homicide. Then again, you don't believe it is a spousal homicide so I guess that makes a difference in how you view things.

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 10:44 AM

I read the article . Did you happen to see any names given to these stories? We were told a story back when this murder first happened about how MY had gotten so mad at JY she scratched the blood out of him. That story went no where and I bet these don't either.

That story didn't emanate from a SW though. It was put out there by one of Jason's staunchest defenders and, as such, most of us took it from whence it came and didn't put much, if any stock in it at all. I'm looking forward to reading the SW once it is online to see what LE says about these allegations. Provided they are contained in the SW, I'll believe them, even if people are not named. LE could well be being prudent in not furnishing the names of people who they are talking to especially if those people are still friendly with the SLAYER. In the Anthony case, we recently learned that Casey's ex-boyfriend was wired by LE for a meeting with Lee Anthony and any one of a number of people could be being used by LE in the same manner with JY, imo.

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:46 AM

It makes no sense at all that she would want to have another child with a man that was verbally abusive and violent.

No sense at all.

Maybe not to you or I, but apparently, from things I have read in other cases I've followed, its fairly common for abused women.

Doorbell

03-11-2009, 10:48 AM

Maybe not to you or I, but apparently, from things I have read in other cases I've followed, its fairly common for abused women.

Even in this day and age, there are such things as accidental pregnancies. Not every child is planned.

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:50 AM

The fact that no names have been given to these so called friends tells me they just want their few minutes of fame. Funny how they have come forward 2 years after the murder.

We won't know when the friends talked to LE until the SW is released, it could have been two years ago for all we know.

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 10:53 AM

Now you've spun the story to MY was an abused woman. Where did you get this information? Where there police reports of this abuse?

If you don't think that sleeping with one of your wife's best friends and taking another lover to your daughter's school while your wife is very pregnant is not abusive, then I feel sorry for you. In many ways, I think that kind of abuse could be worse than having a husband slap you around.

alterEgo©

03-11-2009, 10:54 AM

Maybe not to you or I, but apparently, from things I have read in other cases I've followed, its fairly common for abused women.Well IF Jason was verbally abusive, it doesn't mean Michelle was an abused woman. On the surface, the media report indicates she yelled back at him - something abused women don't do.

Tia

03-11-2009, 10:55 AM

Now you've spun the story to MY was an abused woman. Where did you get this information? Where there police reports of this abuse?

Did you read the email he sent Michelle?
He threatened to KILL HER.

Thats verbal abuse.

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 10:57 AM

We won't know when the friends talked to LE until the SW is released, it could have been two years ago for all we know.

Tia,

It could also be that whoever told LE of those acts was a friend of Jasons who still stood by him in the early days and has had a change of heart now. If I thought a friend had been falsely targetted for a crime, I might not volunteer information which, with that outlook I didn't think was permanent. However, if after a period of time, I came to realize my friend wasn't as innocent as I had thought, I'd sing like a canary.

5swab5

03-11-2009, 10:58 AM

It sure doesn't look as if LE suspects Meredith!!

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1437214.html

"Some fights lasted for hours, the woman said, and Jason Young once punched holes in a wall and ripped a door off its hinges."

What a good Daddy he is!!! NOT!

"The 16-page search warrant affidavit also includes e-mail messages between the Youngs. In one, Jason Young wrote he'd been having trouble with their daughter Cassidy because of a power outage.

"I can't entertain her enough w/o tv to finish the [expletive] yard," the message reads. "I am taking beer and her to pool. I am in a mood that makes our trip to myrtle seem mild, pray the beer kicks in. I could kill u for not letting me finish the yard this morning."

Oh Man,

That's what I always like to see. A loving dad that takes his child to the swimming pool with the intention of "letting the beer kick in".

Watering down adult meds is obviously not the first time that Jason played russian roulette with Cassidy's life. MOO

Doorbell

03-11-2009, 10:59 AM

Now you've spun the story to MY was an abused woman. Where did you get this information? Where there police reports of this abuse?

"I could kill u" is abuse. Ripping doors off hinges is abuse. Putting his fist through walls is abuse.

http://www.ndvh.org/get-educated/what-is-domestic-violence/

from the link:

You may be in an emotionally abusive relationship if your partner:

* Calls you names, insults you or continually criticizes you.
* Does not trust you and acts jealous or possessive.
* Tries to isolate you from family or friends.
* Monitors where you go, who you call and who you spend time with.
* Does not want you to work.
* Controls finances or refuses to share money.
* Punishes you by withholding affection.
* Expects you to ask permission.
* Threatens to hurt you, the children, your family or your pets.
* Humiliates you in any way.

You may be in a physically abusive relationship if your partner has ever:

* Damaged property when angry (thrown objects, punched walls, kicked doors, etc.).
* Pushed, slapped, bitten, kicked or choked you.
* Abandoned you in a dangerous or unfamiliar place.
* Scared you by driving recklessly.
* Used a weapon to threaten or hurt you.
* Forced you to leave your home.
* Trapped you in your home or kept you from leaving.
* Prevented you from calling police or seeking medical attention.
* Hurt your children.

Tia

03-11-2009, 11:00 AM

Well IF Jason was verbally abusive, it doesn't mean Michelle was an abused woman. On the surface, the media report indicates she yelled back at him - something abused women don't do.

"If Jason was verbally abusive, it doesn't mean Michelle was an abused woman".

Sorry, that makes no sense.

The more glimpses I get into this guys life, the more of a creep I think he is.

In his email to Michelle, he threatened to kill her.

The over-all big picture is that Jason was a horrible human being to his wife and child, IMO.

Leanne Weich

03-11-2009, 11:00 AM

Oh Man,

That's what I always like to see. A loving dad that take his child to the swimming pool with the intention of "letting the beer kick in".

Watering down adult meds is obviously not the first time that Jason played russian roulette with Cassidy's life. MOO

She's really lucky she's the center of his world or I have no doubt she would have met the same fate as her mom and brother. JMOOC.