Unexplained Phenomena -part2

[Cloudbuster]

I hope I didn't do anything wrong by starting this thread. I have a question? If you heard these words paranormally -
" around the courts horses pay". "I know Patty thinks oh those horses, the horses are her soul".

Does anyone know of any gambling investagations that might have been going on or busts? Im thinking about a laptop to place the bets by way of different servers and a wire room? (Thats so LE can not track you.) Also anyone know of people getting ripped off in that time frame of 2005? I will also research this.

[J. J. in Phila]

"Courts horses" might be misheard "courthouse's."

[Cloudbuster]

"Courts horses" might be misheard "courthouse's."

JJ thanks for the tip!! I never thought of that. Thanks!!!

[Cloudbuster]

Logic where is the rock that you spoke about before? Was it Rebersburg?

[J. J. in Phila]

JJ thanks for the tip!! I never thought of that. Thanks!!!


A garbled message. I am hoping to get my DVD player hooked up. :)

[Cloudbuster]

LW thanks for the link!!! I don't know if that's the same rock Im thinking of. It was when your car shook and I think it had hearts on the rock or I love you written on it.

[Cloudbuster]

LW thanks for refreshing that about the rock area!! For some reason I just needed to know about it. Im trying to figure something out and it involves a rock. Someone would never tell someone to go somewhere unless it's a place that that person been to before. So the area is interesting. Now I need to figure out everywhere I been lol Long story.

[Serendipitous1]

Based on my own personal observations in the Bald Eagle State Forest that weekend, the DCNR was on full alert due to the dry conditions. And I suspect the DCNR, PFBC and PGC were likely informed of the BOLO for RG.

[Serendipitous1]

Likely if there were any registrants who could be asked if they noticed anything, it would have been on the 15th, opening day for camping, IIRC, with fishermen getting there early to set up and check out the streams. IIRC, Little Fishing Creek runs slong side of the horse's head, and the land below the horse's head is State Forest lands.

Mill Creek runs along side of route 477, where Pepper Run Rd., leads over to Cherry Run Rd. to Mt Riansares Rd. There should have been some fish 'scouts' out in that area that day, and some could have camped up in the Mt Riansares camping area. If there are records, might be worth a look to check and see if anyone noticed anything or anyone suspicious Friday, day or night.
JMOWhen I ran the mountain roads, I came upon the PGC's dumping site for killed animals. I have often wondered if RG's bleached bones were among them.

[sherrijean981]

I have been on Google Earth yesterday and today searching the area around the Mt Riansares area for clues written anywhere there. While doing so, I continued doing the camera trip on the site, and moving eastward, backwards on the camera site, which is westbound view. East is the only direction I traveled on Route 80 except one time, when I returned early. I never traveled back that way because it would already be getting dark and I didn't want to be stuck on an interstate if I had any car trouble.

Traveling eastward on the map, I remember how every trip I would travel past the 'I heart you' rock and feel drained but then I would proceed on around the mountain until I came to the truck stop not too far down the road and pull in for a few minutes to revitalize my energy.

After coming through the rock area where my energy felt drained, and my thoughts scrambled, I would stop at the rest area to sit for a few moments out back to just relax and enjoy the beautiful nature in that area, so I would feel revitalized before I entered the heavily wooded area between there and Milton area.

I felt like I was on top of a mountain and I always talked to God there, praying for my own strength to be revitalized and for help in the RG case. It felt like an answered prayer place, high above all the towns below, and right in the middle of so much natural beauty.

But I also remember always a moment of 'something else' there, and each time I would eyeball a shrub that was close by wondering if any clue had been tossed there at the rest stop. I kept sensing it was a 'key'. I never saw anything there though that was a physical key.

After awhile I had to laugh everytime it would come through me to look there for a key and not find anything. I never stopped, even though I seriously thought looking for a physical key there would not fit into the SOS lot location where the car was found parked, and it would take a key to get the car there.

So it seemed like it wasn't a physical key that I was to be looking for, and yet I couldn't get rid of the thought that kept coming through every time I sat out back and talked to God and the thought would come through-----------look here for a key. My recent searching on Google Earth map reminded me of how many times I looked there for a key over the years.

Just something else I wanted to share about the area and what I sensed not only at the rock area but also the next point on that trip that I sensed a 'key'.
JMO


Have been reading your posts but this time you mention Milton near to the pull off. How many miles from Lewisburg to the area where you feel drained? Is that the same area as the mountain view on Rt 477? I am referring to the miles Carla Baron mentions, 1.7 or 17 miles. Have you been up to the mountain view?

You mention the bush and the feeling of looking for a "key". Could his car keys have been thrown in that area or buried under the bush? Maybe you need to take a metal detector up and check it out.

[sherrijean981]

I believe RG may very have been followed on April 9th, six days before disappearance and was being observed.

Possibly someone was waiting for him to get out of the car in that secluded location, which could possibly be the reason nothing happened back there, if someone was waiting for him to leave the car, which maybe he never got out to stretch.

I see a location where I believe one of the roads was being watched and at a location where if he had to make a sharp turn, he would have had to slow down to a crawl, with no means of going anywhere if stopped.

For anyone who hasn't found what I believe is the red and white Mini, here are directions.

Using the google map for anyone who doesn't have Google Earth, drag the map over until you are at route 477 at Livonia. Remain on map instead of satellite view until you arrive at the Cherry Run Rd. site and only then click on satellite.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&t=p&msa=0&msid=116214831746448224113.00045730cc4689085c647&ll=40.815628,-77.799339&spn=0.022735,0.036478&z=14&source=embed

Follow route 477 from Livonia up to Loganton area.
Turn left on Pepper Mill Rd until it meets Cherry Run Road.
Moving to the left on Cherry Run Rd. find the location where Mt. Riansares Rd. goes up that mountain and has a very sharp turn in it. In a straight line down from that, it is the circular white spot on Cherry Run Rd. where what appears to be the Mini is parked. Click satellite and get as close as you can to see it. On Google Earth, you can get much closer view.

Then go from that location, and straight up from it to the very sharp turn on Mt Riansares Rd. and look behind the trees. IMO, someone is there in wait, of either someone coming up that road, or waiting on someone who may have walked down over to the point below where the Mini is parkedd.

Down at the intersection of route 477, where if he came out that way, there appears to be vehicles parked there, one on each side of route 80 but on route 477, that may be observing his direction. Both appear to be light colored vans.

I am convinced something was up that day, and for whatever reason, they were not able to pull off their plan. All things considered including the secluded location, it would appear the plan may have been made to keep the car clean, no evidence left behind.
JMO


I see what you are talking about and it does look like a littel red and white car. The thing on the top road also has red in it but is it a car/truck or a building? I closed my site out before I saw the other 2 cars/vans.

I also saw what is the other Rag Valley Rd. The one from on top the mountain off Blue Ball Rd ended before it got to Madisonburg. If you remember when I was searching that area and looking for info on Rag Valley Rd at one point I found reference to 2 but later it only showed one. Here is the 2nd one, or a continuation of the first one.

[sherrijean981]

I have been on Google Earth yesterday and today searching the area around the Mt Riansares area for clues written anywhere there. While doing so, I continued doing the camera trip on the site, and moving eastward, backwards on the camera site, which is westbound view. East is the only direction I traveled on Route 80 except one time, when I returned early. I never traveled back that way because it would already be getting dark and I didn't want to be stuck on an interstate if I had any car trouble.

Traveling eastward on the map, I remember how every trip I would travel past the 'I heart you' rock and feel drained but then I would proceed on around the mountain until I came to the truck stop not too far down the road and pull in for a few minutes to revitalize my energy.

After coming through the rock area where my energy felt drained, and my thoughts scrambled, I would stop at the rest area to sit for a few moments out back to just relax and enjoy the beautiful nature in that area, so I would feel revitalized before I entered the heavily wooded area between there and Milton area.

I felt like I was on top of a mountain and I always talked to God there, praying for my own strength to be revitalized and for help in the RG case. It felt like an answered prayer place, high above all the towns below, and right in the middle of so much natural beauty.

But I also remember always a moment of 'something else' there, and each time I would eyeball a shrub that was close by wondering if any clue had been tossed there at the rest stop. I kept sensing it was a 'key'. I never saw anything there though that was a physical key.

After awhile I had to laugh everytime it would come through me to look there for a key and not find anything. I never stopped, even though I seriously thought looking for a physical key there would not fit into the SOS lot location where the car was found parked, and it would take a key to get the car there.

So it seemed like it wasn't a physical key that I was to be looking for, and yet I couldn't get rid of the thought that kept coming through every time I sat out back and talked to God and the thought would come through-----------look here for a key. My recent searching on Google Earth map reminded me of how many times I looked there for a key over the years.

Just something else I wanted to share about the area and what I sensed not only at the rock area but also the next point on that trip that I sensed a 'key'.
JMO


This is the link where you mention Milton:
"After coming through the rock area where my energy felt drained, and my thoughts scrambled, I would stop at the rest area to sit for a few moments out back to just relax and enjoy the beautiful nature in that area, so I would feel revitalized before I entered the heavily wooded area between there and Milton area. "

[sherrijean981]

They had been referring to either 1.7 or 17 miles that RG was taken after being in the SOS.

Wondered if the area where you are feeling the draw on your energy was 17 miles from SOS? But I think it would be a lot further than that.

I did check the maps out before. In fact a couple of us were talking about a park on one of the side roads off Rt 192. That went to Loganton and I-80. Not sure if it was this road or not. I also saw the areas today that you were talking aobut date marked 4/9/2005.

[sherrijean981]

Searching the map of Cherry Run Rd lot area and zooming in on the site around the car, I think there may be much more there than meets the eye.

This cannot be done on regular Google map, ONLY on Google Earth, where the road can be turned so the car is on the right, and the road is running straight up and down on the screen, with the road leading in from route 477 is at the bottom and the other part leading further into the woods at the top.

On the regular Google map it appears to just be a parking lot and nothing more. On Google Earth with the map turned, you can see the area where tracks lead up behind the lot. I see a great deal more activity going on up there that is somewhat unexplainable. Anyone up to the challenge, I would appreciate any feedback on what anyone else sees there.

Does anyone know if this is private land or part of State Forest area?
I would assume the latter, but not certain.

I am interested in the location on April 9th, for a number of reasons.
If RG had intentions of disappearing, why isn't he busy instead of likely sitting somewhere on a mountain listening to a ballgame?

If his car was seen moving into various positions up until 6:30pm on Friday evening, he may have already planned on listening to the game and was trying to see where he could get reception, including in the SOS lot, thus explaining the car moving into various positions there.

If it turned out that the reception was not good enough to suit him, he may have returned to his secluded place to listen to Friday night's game which began at 7:06 PM. It would have been over by 9:30-ish, and he would have been home by 10-10:30PM. Did the time the game was over and time to return home factor into PF's reporting him missing at 11:30PM? Was that why the Cleveland stadium was checked the next day?

If he was followed on Friday, the likely place to return the car to would be that lot, if he had been observed there doing different things that day and knowing others may have seen him. There would be witnesses placing him there already, rather than somewhere else, which who's going to be a witness back on that secluded road? A perp would know others had seen him at the SOS and it could then be assumed whatever happened, happened there instead.

I am still curious as to what else may be back in that secluded area that his being back there could have caused someone anxiety, if RG happened to be there a week before when something was 'coming down' and he witnessed a vehicles or vehicles and was possibly followed after that.
JMO


LW, I just signed up for Google Earth Map. I like the way it feels like you are flying but I don't seem to be able to see things any better with it. In fact, I tried going to Bellefonte, to see if I could see his car at home or at the courthouse but it doesn't even take me close enough to make out the streets.

Are you referring to the trees surrounding the circle the car is sitting in? I went up to the sharp curve to see if I could see any better and it looks like a larger vehicle, red. Maybe a truck?

Odd that this area is so much more viewable than in town. I am going to check out some other area's to see what time dates come up on it. I can not even see the Blue Ball Rd. I will be checking the area you are referring to.

[sherrijean981]

[quote=sherrijean981;12804628]LW, I just signed up for Google Earth Map. I like the way it feels like you are flying but I don't seem to be able to see things any better with it. In fact, I tried going to Bellefonte, to see if I could see his car at home or at the courthouse but it doesn't even take me close enough to make out the streets.
QUOTE]


Centre County has 'blurred' their area out so you can't see anything there. They don't allow you to get in close to see anything. The other counties don't blur theirs. The area I am referring to now, Mt Riansares is not blurred. If you go down to route 192, the horse area is all blurred also. Go figure----------

You have to turn the lot site where the car is parked around so you have the area behind the car on the right of your screen. Then go back up to the control at the top of the map and maneuver the top one to get different views of that area behind the car.

It takes awhile to learn how to drive a satellite view---------LOL. If you push the top arrow, you will then have to go down to the second control and keep pulling the site into view, otherwise it disappears. If you keep doing that you can look at the site from all sides------------some interesting views that are not available on other maps.

JMO

I have been looking at different areas too. In my area all the streets are noticeable and you can see things in the yards. I just saw how big the car salvage yard is behind the road from us. It is huge and I have lived here 16 years and never knew that.

Lewisburg was also checked out on 4/09/2005. One site I was on was checked last in 2003. It would be awesome to have the present time Google Map. Just think of the crimes we could bust! or the people we could find. I will go back and try the site again.

Wonder who and why the Bellefonte area is fuzzy?

[UndertheRadar]

Wonder who and why the Bellefonte area is fuzzy?

Here's what I've heard: Google has faced some potential legal challenges because Google Earth photos have shown identifiable people who didn't want to be shown. Not necessarily anyone doing anything illegal that I've heard of, but potentially embarrassing or difficult to explain. Imagine some guy having to explain to his wife why his car was parked in front of his ex-girlfriend's house, or whatever . . .

[sherrijean981]

Reading about the call on another thread, I decided to look back again at what I interpret as the call area, and the figure holding the phone.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&t=p&msa=0&msid=116214831746448224113.00045730cc4689085c647&ll=40.815628,-77.799339&spn=0.022735,0.036478&z=14&source=embed

The figure holding the phone is not moving toward Rebersburg, or Lewisburg. The figure is moving toward Bellefonte while holding the phone. If this figure is symbolic of PF answering his call that day, she would be facing toward where he was at when he called, route 192. If it is symbolic of him making the call on his way out of town, away from Bellefonte, he would be moving east toward Lewisburg.

If he had taken 1/2 day off and planned on returning by noon, the call time is right on for arriving home in time to work a half day. Instead we are told he was ON route 192, and the car was found in Lewisburg, looking like that the point of disappearance.

Exactly WHAT direction was he going? Because I trust what I see written there, IMO, it points to the person NOT going east toward Lewisburg, but instead traveling west, northwest, back toward Bellefonte.

Is it possible the witness Cind mentioned as having seen him on Friday morning early, as he was supposedly turning onto route 192 in Centre Hall is correct, and whatever occurred, happened on his return trip later that morning?

Either way, mid-day or later in the day, from what I see written in the energy there, at the time of the call, the caller was NOT heading toward Lewisburg, but was moving toward Bellefonte, not away from it.
JMO


I have questioned that direction a couple times. No one knows for which direction he was headed but when he called PF, he is just saying he won't be back in time but not that he wasn't on his way. Just not on time. By all reports he never said he was heading towards Lewisburg just that he was on Rt 192.

Maybe CF was correct on her siting after all?

[Serendipitous1]

FWIW: Bald Eagle State Forest is wonderfully vast. Highways transect it of course, repleat with private hermitages and public tourist areas. And mountain roads honeycomb it, dotted with hunting cabins and the occasional public camping/picnic area...plus the many trails.

The public can camp in some of the parks, and in isloated spots along the mountain roads. But the real draw, my fellow Thoreau enthusiast, is the 99% of the forest which lies beyond all of those things. You cannot get lost in Bald Eagle State Forest...but you can find yourself "lost" there. Camping is available year-round...but believe me, no one camps in the mountains, in the deep woods, year round.

And so it was that I found myself...camping...in Bald Eagle State Forest, in the deep woods, April 15-17, 2005...but amongst annoyances even there. I distinctly remember 4-wheelers passing by and DCNR officials following after them, though far behind (apparently the mountain roads are off limits to 4-wheelers).

And then there was the unfortunate dry condition. You have to have a campfire at night...it is fundamental to the whole camping experience. But it was so dry then. And when I left the forest on Sunday morning, I was held up by firefighters dousing a smoldering swath of burnt woods...our woods.

As far as I know, Ray Gricar was not a hunter, or a camper...or an admirer of Thoreau for that matter. And I have yet to see a Mini Cooper venture into Penn's Woods. I can say I did not see him there that weekend...but then again, Bald Eagle State Forest is wonderfully vast.

[Cloudbuster]

Up by my camp I don't think it would be noticeable if someone decided to camp at Sproul forest. Crap there is so many dirt roads and woods and hunting grounds and I never see a trooper. When you call a trooper up there it could take them till the next day to get there. Our callls have been about breakins. We was told many camps around us was also victims more than once. It seems they like stealing camping supplies. We often notice a teenage boy who rides up and down the road on his ATV and plays close attention to us being there. LW if you follow what we call the pipeline it takes you on a dirt road called the Queens Run road. Supposedly the queen wanted to buy it and it was named after her. There is no cell phone signal there. There are plenty of bikers who hang out at a bar near us called the mountaintop. It is right on the border of the sign that says Welcome to Lycombing County. Some of the locals told us the area gets alot of Philly drug runners thru it and that they are now moving into the area. There are places to rent at the bar they are like small one room cabins. On April 15th we didn't stay at the cabin because we thought it would be to cold but it really wasn't. I remember that it hadn't rained, I can't remember if there was a restiction on burning that weekend.

[ladyheartfixer]

The "Pennsylvania Wilds" to steal a term from former state rep DS is unbelievable...The dense forests, rocky terrain and mountains make it a place where one could "hide a body where no one will find it". Bald Eagle State Forest...Moshanon State Forest...Quehanna...have you ever been out to Quehanna? OMG it is the most desolate spot in PA....unbelievable in it's history as well as it's forests so thick you can get lost. And can I tell ya about the elk??? ok...back on topic...PA has a vast amount of forested and uninhabited, undeveloped area...so perfect to get lost in (not that I see RG sporting a couple years beard, wearing a flannel shirt and hunting for his food...but one can got lost...not just in the nature of it but in the fact that someone or something could be disposed of and possibly never found.....

as for the campfire...I agree...and add the moon and stars above and my guitar...and I am one happy camper...as long as the groundhogs aren't foraging in the garbage...lol

[Cloudbuster]

The only thing I could find about Queens Run was that it was misnamed, and that the correct name is Quinns Run. Are you certain it has something to do with a queen?

http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~pacentre/chistjm1.htm

That's the story my So's mom always told us. When she isn't so busy I will ask her to be more detailed about the queen. Im curious about it now too.