Thursday January 22nd - Part 1

[Balesha]

Here we go!

[AnnInOhio]

I'll ask again...does anybody know where the faded pink & white VIP child's baseball hat was recovered from?

[Balesha]

No idea Ann.

[Calla]

I am confused..

So could the knife have been used to kill that baby and because it never hit bone (which was what was left ) they cannot say that it was used? Or could they tell it was used even if it had been under water for that long?

And the clothes...were they the ones Caylee had on in the Fathers Day video or do we know??

[Ionmhainn]

Thanks for starting the new thread.

While I didn't think there was very much new info in the doc dump today (there rarely is, imo), I did come away with a new thought...that maybe Caylee's body was in the laundry bag (only) in the trunk for the first couple of days. Maybe the garbage bag came later? I was always bothered as to why the smell in the trunk was so strong if she had been in a sealed plastic bag.

[norwood]

Thanks for starting the new thread.

While I didn't think there was very much new info in the doc dump today (there rarely is, imo), I did come away with a new thought...that maybe Caylee's body was in the laundry bag (only) in the trunk for the first couple of days. Maybe the garbage bag came later? I was always bothered as to why the smell in the trunk was so strong if she had been in a sealed plastic bag.
That is something to ponder. To add another question to that you would think that if she had been in the trunk of the car in the cloth bag there would have been some fibers in the trunk of the car from the bag.

What just kills me is that there was a heart sticker on the duct tape.

[Calla]

Thanks for starting the new thread.

While I didn't think there was very much new info in the doc dump today (there rarely is, imo), I did come away with a new thought...that maybe Caylee's body was in the laundry bag (only) in the trunk for the first couple of days. Maybe the garbage bag came later? I was always bothered as to why the smell in the trunk was so strong if she had been in a sealed plastic bag.


very good thought!

did you come away with any answeres to my questions above?

[Calla]

I may have read wrong ,but in the docs somewhere i thought i read the vlack bag covered the laundry bag...but the news report said opposite wish i knew ,don;t remember where in docs i read it ..too much to go back through!


and if ircc one of the 911 calls from Kronk said a "white bag"...but then she was discovered in black bags with the white one inside?

very interesting

[AnnInOhio]

A playground park . unrelated.

Thank you!!

[happygert]

Was there an inventory list that LE recovered during the search warrant?

[Ionmhainn]

very good thought!

did you come away with any answeres to my questions above?


Had to read back....I guess I don't, as of this moment, think the knife was the COD...maybe used to cut duct tape? No real description of it. IIRC, the shirt Caylee wore to visit GGP was blue.

One horrible thought did come to me, not anything to do with the docs. I suddenly remembered the home video where Cindy smashed some cake into Casey's face, and Casey then did the same to Caylee. I didn't think much of it at the time, but then the story of the fight came to mind, where Cindy is said to have "choked" Casey....and wondered.....
Just a thought, not sure if it's really an "opinion" yet.

[Balesha]

GN everyone....I'm completely wiped. Have fun posting!

On sign-off, I still say it was premed murder. Parents not involved, just duped. Casey tried to make it look like a kidnapping, similar to the One Tree Hill episode. That's where the heart fits in.

:wub:

[jusdafacts]

Was there an inventory list that LE recovered during the search warrant?

Not yet...............

[Ionmhainn]

I may have read wrong ,but in the docs somewhere i thought i read the vlack bag covered the laundry bag...but the news report said opposite wish i knew ,don;t remember where in docs i read it ..too much to go back through!

No, don't go through the docs again! I meant that Caylee's body may have only been in the laundry bag to start with, but then placed in a garbage bag. (by Casey)

[Cury-us Coyote]

I'll ask again...does anybody know where the faded pink & white VIP child's baseball hat was recovered from?

According to page 3221, VIP Very Important Princess child hat found on August 12th in wooded area north of Curry Ford Community Park, west of Econ Trail. Canine searched with negative results.
jmo

[Ionmhainn]

right so that would leave the black plastic bag on top and inside was the white laundry ...then she placed the laundry bag inside the black bag , so to me what would be visible on discovery was black bag , not white ?

I think we are on two different trains of thought! I wasn't thinking of the discovery site at all.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Was there an inventory list that LE recovered during the search warrant?

Two page Inventory Report claimed as attached on page 3171 (18 of 18) but can not be found.

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html

[happygert]

Not yet...............

Thanks really behind tonight..

[happygert]

Two page Inventory Report claimed as attached on page 3171 (18 of 18) but can not be found.

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html

thanks Cury....dang wonder what happened to it? Probably kept it out ..

[Cury-us Coyote]

The bottom page at this link (http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html) is the page regarding 'Search Warrant Inventory And Receipt.'

For 'Description Of Items Seized' it states:

** Refer to attached property forms (2 pages)

Where those two pages are is a mystery to me.

How many pages did Conway claim were illegible? TIA

[jusdafacts]

thanks Cury....dang wonder what happened to it? Probably kept it out ..

That's why I replied "not yet" :smile: However, I'm optimistic it will be released shortly .....:w00t:

[Katprint]

and if ircc one of the 911 calls from Kronk said a "white bag"...but then she was discovered in black bags with the white one inside?

very interesting
From page 15 (aka 3168) of the Orange County Sheriff's Office "Affidavit for Search Warrant" dated December 20, 2008 http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html :

"The remains appeared to have originally been within a black plastic garbage bag and within a cloth laundry hamper bag."

I understood this description to indicate that Caylee was placed within a black plastic garbage bag which was in turn placed inside a cloth laundry hamper bag. If the hamper bag was light in color (for example, the Winnie the Pooh laundry hamper which matched the rest of the bedroom decor was a pale color http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg http://www4.jcpenney.com/jcp/X6.aspx?ItemID=14e7add&ItemTyp=G&GrpTyp=PRD&ShowMenu=T&ShopBy=0&SearchString=winnie+the+pooh&RefPage=SearchDepartment.aspx&s4PageSize=15&CmCatId=searchresults&Search1Prod=True ), then that would explain the varying description of the bags.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[aubrey04]

What's the deal with the toy horsies that were found in the woods? Someone on the last thread said that they were matched with horsies from the Anthony home. Does anyone know where that is stated in the documents? TIA,

[happygert]

How many pages did Conway claim were illegible? TIA

sorry if i keep asking same questions been a long 2 days..

[happygert]

From page 15 (aka 3168) of the Orange County Sheriff's Office "Affidavit for Search Warrant" dated December 20, 2008 http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html :

"The remains appeared to have originally been within a black plastic garbage bag and within a cloth laundry hamper bag."

I understood this description to indicate that Caylee was placed within a black plastic garbage bag which was in turn placed inside a cloth laundry hamper bag. If the hamper bag was light in color (for example, the Winnie the Pooh laundry hamper which matched the rest of the bedroom decor was a pale color http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg http://www4.jcpenney.com/jcp/X6.aspx?ItemID=14e7add&ItemTyp=G&GrpTyp=PRD&ShowMenu=T&ShopBy=0&SearchString=winnie+the+pooh&RefPage=SearchDepartment.aspx&s4PageSize=15&CmCatId=searchresults&Search1Prod=True ), then that would explain the varying description of the bags.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

OMG! I have one of those hampers for my Grandson .Son has one to ..Mines a little different then that one.his isn't solid green.

[jusdafacts]

From page 15 (aka 3168) of the Orange County Sheriff's Office "Affidavit for Search Warrant" dated December 20, 2008 http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html :

"The remains appeared to have originally been within a black plastic garbage bag and within a cloth laundry hamper bag."

I understood this description to indicate that Caylee was placed within a black plastic garbage bag which was in turn placed inside a cloth laundry hamper bag. If the hamper bag was light in color (for example, the Winnie the Pooh laundry hamper which matched the rest of the bedroom decor was a pale color http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg http://www4.jcpenney.com/jcp/X6.aspx?ItemID=14e7add&ItemTyp=G&GrpTyp=PRD&ShowMenu=T&ShopBy=0&SearchString=winnie+the+pooh&RefPage=SearchDepartment.aspx&s4PageSize=15&CmCatId=searchresults&Search1Prod=True ), then that would explain the varying description of the bags.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Either way, beautiful Caylee Marie was treated like garbage or dirty laundry :crying::mad: I just cannot understand the evil that can exist for such a thing to happen .....

[Cury-us Coyote]

I don't know. Did Conway comment on these documents & I missed it?

Either way... I could read all the documents just fine. I didn't see any pages that could be called illegible. :shrug:

Greta chatted up BC about the inventory list left in the A's home regarding duct tape and other items seized. IIRC his response was something about not that he noticed but there were 2(?) pages that were illegible.
jmo

[5boxersmom]

Greta chatted up BC about the inventory list left in the A's home regarding duct tape and other items seized. IIRC his response was something about not that he noticed but there were 2(?) pages that were illegible.
jmo

Was this tonight?

[Oregongal]

:shrug:I don't know. Did Conway comment on these documents & I missed it?

Either way... I could read all the documents just fine. I didn't see any pages that could be called illegible. :shrug:

Evening Landie and all.
I'm with you Landie. I didn't find any of what I saw illegible.
Iirc, Conway was speaking of the search warrant when presented. How alot of it was illegible to him.
:shrug:
I'm thinking now, here we have a defense lawyer who is as 'I and me' based as his client is.
With these new docs, I see how Cindy especially has lied and lied....do we also have a lawyer who represents her (them, the Ant's) who also lies?
This case seems to get more bizarre each day.

[happygert]

That's why I replied "not yet" :smile: However, I'm optimistic it will be released shortly .....:w00t:

I can only hope....

[Cury-us Coyote]

Was this tonight?

No. IIRC, it was when GVS was in Orlando, she & BC went to the discovery site, reported about an unhappy CinA after an LE visit, and included a JB interview.
jmo

[jusdafacts]

Greta chatted up BC about the inventory list left in the A's home regarding duct tape and other items seized. IIRC his response was something about not that he noticed but there were 2(?) pages that were illegible.
jmo

Yes, on Jan 16th.... here's the video - around the 1:45 mark

Greta Video (http://spoiledmom-mommyconfessions.blogspot.com/2009/01/brad-conway-and-greta-visit-caylee.html)

CONWAY: Three warrants, and there were also — the Anthonys cooperated, so they gave items that were requested from the beginning.

VAN SUSTEREN: So after they found the remains, there were how many official searches after the warrants?

CONWAY: Two.

VAN SUSTEREN: Two. And in those two searches, did they pull any rolls of duct tape out of the house or garbage bags, as far as you know?

CONWAY: No, not as far as I know.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is that you couldn’t read the inventory sheet or you don’t recall or…

CONWAY: The part that I could read did not have duct tape, but there’s about a page that’s illegible.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you know if there were clothes in that bag with the remains?

CONWAY: No, I don’t. I don’t know.

[lonetraveler]

Had to read back....I guess I don't, as of this moment, think the knife was the COD...maybe used to cut duct tape? No real description of it. IIRC, the shirt Caylee wore to visit GGP was blue.

One horrible thought did come to me, not anything to do with the docs. I suddenly remembered the home video where Cindy smashed some cake into Casey's face, and Casey then did the same to Caylee. I didn't think much of it at the time, but then the story of the fight came to mind, where Cindy is said to have "choked" Casey....and wondered.....
Just a thought, not sure if it's really an "opinion" yet.

---
Your thought certainly gave me a pause. It does seem logical that in the scheme of things, what Cindy did to Casey that Casey did to Caylee in return. Thus, Cindy choking Casey led to Casey choking Caylee....

[Calla]

thanks to all who answered re: kronk & laundry bags etc...

My mind is blown!

Just don't even know what to say about all of this but it has become more and more obvious that Casey has laid the guilt trip on her parents for a long time.
If they ever had any sense, she most certainly took care of that issue over the last few years.
It really stands out to me in the latest jail video that she says..'i can't do anything in here..you have dad and lee and the HOUSE ..I could have been out of here and the opportunity was missed"

I am like OMG, she is guilting them for not getting her out and it really crossed my mind...would she have run given the chance? I think about that PR trip and wonder if she had only had the financial means....hmm

[5boxersmom]

No. IIRC, it was when GVS was in Orlando, she & BC went to the discovery site, reported about an unhappy CinA after an LE visit, and included a JB interview.
jmo

Oh ok. I quit watching Greta after the first few minutes. I thought I might have missed BC.

Thanks

[aubrey04]

:seeya:

I must come to the conclusion that Casey's DNA buccal swab was compared to Caylee's DNA profile to establish definite parenthood.

There is only one thing in the documents that suggests Lee's DNA was compared to Caylee's for the purpose of 'parentage.'

And that thing states only this → Note: Please compare DNA profile of Lee Anthony against DNA profile of Caylee Anthony (http://www.wftv.com/news/18530418/detail.html). Bottom of page forty four.

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

[Cury-us Coyote]

OTR archive 1/19
VAN SUSTEREN: So after they found the remains, there were how many official searches after the warrants?

CONWAY: Two.

VAN SUSTEREN: Two. And in those two searches, did they pull any rolls of duct tape out of the house or garbage bags, as far as you know?

CONWAY: No, not as far as I know.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is that you couldn't read the inventory sheet or you don't recall or...

CONWAY: The part that I could read did not have duct tape, but there's about a page that's illegible.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,480477,00.html

[Calla]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

Is that what they were doing? Or was it to compare a sibling of Casey in order to relate that to Caylee. ?? Since they only had Casey and no father to go by they could compare a sibling of Casey for confirmation of the match with Caylee.

I don't know. I watch too much t.v.:laugh:

[Lapis]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

Sometimes LE does things to cut off a line of defense. They heard the rumors and want to prevent them from presenting this motive for someone else (perhaps LA?) may have killed Caylee. JMO

[happygert]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

Nothing about the A's strike me as bizarre anymore..this whole family is screwed up.....JMHO

[Katprint]

Is that what they were doing? Or was it to compare a sibling of Casey in order to relate that to Caylee. ?? Since they only had Casey and no father to go by they could compare a sibling of Casey for confirmation of the match with Caylee.

I don't know. I watch too much t.v.:laugh:
They should still have Caylee's DNA profile from the paternity testing performed for Jesse Grund, which necessarily would have involved taking a DNA sample from Caylee. Since they already have Caylee's DNA profile, they wouldn't need relatives' DNA to establish Caylee's identity.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

[Cury-us Coyote]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

IMO, LA's DNA profile comparison was requested on 10/10/08 per page 3317-18. The DNA parentage test was submitted on 7/26/08 per page 3240.
jmo

[robmo]

That is something to ponder. To add another question to that you would think that if she had been in the trunk of the car in the cloth bag there would have been some fibers in the trunk of the car from the bag.

What just kills me is that there was a heart sticker on the duct tape.

Just catching up-quickly read thru docs several hours ago...

I may be mistaken but I believe there were animal hairs on blanket in bag-CA did say the dogs slept on KLee bed.

As far as other fibers,I believe alot were found but not sure from where.

IIRC,MOO

[RiverWalk]

Greta chatted up BC about the inventory list left in the A's home regarding duct tape and other items seized. IIRC his response was something about not that he noticed but there were 2(?) pages that were illegible.
jmo

Transcript:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,480477,00.html

ETA: Oops. I see you found it.

[5boxersmom]

What was that in the Search Warrants about taking Balls from the residences? Did it say a soccer ball?

Why would they want them?

[Calla]

The warrant says
The remains appear to have originally been within a black plastic garbage bag and within a white laundry hamper bag.
That to me means the white laundry bag contained the remains, clothes etc. And at the time of recovery the white laundry hamper bag was not totally contained within the black bag.

Which makes it sound as if she carried her out of the house within a laundry bag so as to look like she was taking clothes somewhere when all along it was her baby. :angry:

[martha]

Had to read back....I guess I don't, as of this moment, think the knife was the COD...maybe used to cut duct tape? No real description of it. IIRC, the shirt Caylee wore to visit GGP was blue.

One horrible thought did come to me, not anything to do with the docs. I suddenly remembered the home video where Cindy smashed some cake into Casey's face, and Casey then did the same to Caylee. I didn't think much of it at the time, but then the story of the fight came to mind, where Cindy is said to have "choked" Casey....and wondered.....
Just a thought, not sure if it's really an "opinion" yet.
I to wonder if the knife was the cod and it just did not hit a bone. I am thinking from something I heard someone say this child did not deserve to suffer like she did can;t remember who it was but wonder if he was ref.to the knife.jmho

[aubrey04]

Sometimes LE does things to cut off a line of defense. They heard the rumors and want to prevent them from presenting this motive for someone else (perhaps LA?) may have killed Caylee. JMO

Yeah, true. Thanks to everyone who responded to my post. Your insight was appreciated. I have wondered if the stuff Casey told Jesse and Tony might somehow make it into her defense. I just don't see how the Zanny angle will work, which makes me think the defense might try an alternate defense.

I know they don't have to provide any answers - just reasonable doubt, but in a case like this.. there needs to be some answers. And Zanny the fictional Nanny isn't going to cut it. imo.

[Calla]

What was that in the Search Warrants about taking Balls from the residences? Did it say a soccer ball?

Why would they want them?

They figure since Casey wanted to play games, she would need some toys

:laugh:

Sorry about that.
I wondered too but didn't ask

[Calla]

I to wonder if the knife was the cod and it just did not hit a bone. I am thinking from something I heard someone say this child did not deserve to suffer like she did can;t remember who it was but wonder if he was ref.to the knife.jmho

I know:sad: I want to throw up. There is no reason a knife would be there unless it was suspected that it was used

[OneUp]

I to wonder if the knife was the cod and it just did not hit a bone. I am thinking from something I heard someone say this child did not deserve to suffer like she did can;t remember who it was but wonder if he was ref.to the knife.jmho
IIRC, it was at a PC right after finding Caylee, that Sheriff Beary said that...something like " no child should ever suffer like she did..." (paraphrased).
At the time, I felt there was *something* at the scene that made them suspect a specific COD. Now, my guess is that due to the duct tape and its location, that LE felt she probably suffocated.
Regardles, I am certain we al agree that NO CHILD should be treated as Caylee was before or after her death.
JMO.

[Neffy]

Greta chatted up BC about the inventory list left in the A's home regarding duct tape and other items seized. IIRC his response was something about not that he noticed but there were 2(?) pages that were illegible.
jmo

That always bugged me. Does that sound like Conway? I'm sure as the A's attorney he'd demand that they be legible.

He foo foo'd it off so non-chalantly. Ah I dunno illegible.

[aubrey04]

IIRC, it was at a PC right after finding Caylee, that Sheriff Beary said that...something like " no child should ever suffer like she did..." (paraphrased).
At the time, I felt there was *something* at the scene that made them suspect a specific COD. Now, my guess is that due to the duct tape and its location, that LE felt she probably suffocated.
Regardles, I am certain we al agree that NO CHILD should be treated as Caylee was before or after her death.
JMO.

:( yes and he was quite emotional when he stated that.. Poor little Caylee..

[MrsHudson]

They should still have Caylee's DNA profile from the paternity testing performed for Jesse Grund, which necessarily would have involved taking a DNA sample from Caylee. Since they already have Caylee's DNA profile, they wouldn't need relatives' DNA to establish Caylee's identity.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

From what I understand Caylee's DNA profile alone would show that she was the product of incest.

[aubrey04]

Can someone please give me a link to the doc that say what was found with Caylee? TIA

Page 6 -

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530229.pdf

[5boxersmom]

From what I understand Caylee's DNA profile alone would show that she was the product of incest.

Then why would they have that on there? Do you think they do not have a complete profile of Caylee? I have never saw where Jesse or the lab where the test was performed gave anything to LE.

jmo

[mosey?]

I to wonder if the knife was the cod and it just did not hit a bone. I am thinking from something I heard someone say this child did not deserve to suffer like she did can;t remember who it was but wonder if he was ref.to the knife.jmhoCould be, but I dont think so. No Blood evidence has been found in the car, backyard, house, clothing, etc. That we've heard, yet, anyways. I think the knife has personal significance to Casey, like the letters found with the body. I wonder what letters they are? Anagrams, anyone?

[RiverWalk]

From what I understand Caylee's DNA profile alone would show that she was the product of incest.

That's incorrect, imo.

[mosey?]

Which makes it sound as if she carried her out of the house within a laundry bag so as to look like she was taking clothes somewhere when all along it was her baby. :angry:Did you notice that most all of the suspicious stains on Caseys clothing were on the left side? I wonder why that is?

[Jester]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

Oh yes, bizarre. Casey has been so secretive about the identity of the father, and Cay (which Cindy calls Casey) and Lee makes Caylee. Gotta wonder about the origin of the name if nothing else.

[Jester]

IMO, LA's DNA profile comparison was requested on 10/10/08 per page 3317-18. The DNA parentage test was submitted on 7/26/08 per page 3240.
jmo

I haven't had time to read through it all, but are the results of the test available? Does Lee have anything to do with Caylee?

[OneUp]

Did you notice that most all of the suspicious stains on Caseys clothing were on the left side? I wonder why that is?IDK if it relates, but I tend to always carry my little one on the left side. That leaves my dominant hand ( right) free to open doors, carry other items, make a drink, etc.
It could poss. be simply the side she carried things on...the stains could be suspected as related to post mortem occurances of Caylee's remains and Casey moving her from one spot to another.
JMO.

[MrsHudson]

Then why would they have that on there? Do you think they do not have a complete profile of Caylee? I have never saw where Jesse or the lab where the test was performed gave anything to LE.

jmo

I don't know. I just read something by a person who seemed very knowledgeable that only Caylee's DNA would be needed to show she was t he product of incest because the DNA would have like overlapping characteristics. It made sense to me but I can't find any confirmation of it.

Anyway here is an interesting in article about the prevalence of incest and Casey and Lee from Momlogic website :

http://www.momlogic.com/2009/01/casey_anthony_caylee_anthony_i.php

[aubrey04]

Who asked for info on the pink VIP baseball hat? I just found it while reading over the documents again..

page 25

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530363.pdf

[sunbunny]

IDK if it relates, but I tend to always carry my little one on the left side. That leaves my dominant hand ( right) free to open doors, carry other items, make a drink, etc.
It could poss. be simply the side she carried things on...the stains could be suspected as related to post mortem occurances of Caylee's remains and Casey moving her from one spot to another.
JMO.

i was just about to post almost the same thing. i don't have kids and haven't carried many around, but when i do lug bulky stuff like groceries or laundry, i always carry it on my left hip, to keep my right hand free. i haven't heard anything about the stains just being on the left side of Casey's clothing and am just catching up... i'll try to look for the link unless someone has it handy and can post it. :blink:

[MrsHudson]

That's incorrect, imo.

You might be right about that.

[aubrey04]

i was just about to post almost the same thing. i don't have kids and haven't carried many around, but when i do lug bulky stuff like groceries or laundry, i always carry it on my left hip, to keep my right hand free. i haven't heard anything about the stains just being on the left side of Casey's clothing and am just catching up... i'll try to look for the link unless someone has it handy and can post it. :blink:

page 21

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530363.pdf

[sunbunny]

page 21

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530363.pdf

thank you!!! :seeya:

[OneUp]

Long day for those following this case, huh?
:seeya:
I'm turning in and letting the new things I've read digest!

[Jester]

I don't know. I just read something by a person who seemed very knowledgeable that only Caylee's DNA would be needed to show she was t he product of incest because the DNA would have like overlapping characteristics. It made sense to me but I can't find any confirmation of it.

Anyway here is an interesting in article about the prevalence of incest and Casey and Lee from Momlogic website :

http://www.momlogic.com/2009/01/casey_anthony_caylee_anthony_i.php

Haven't read the article yet, but I think it answers the question

"DNA typing results revealed that the oldest brother in the family was the biological father of both children. Calculated data showed that even in a case of brother-sister incest, paternity could be proven with a high degree of certainty by analysis of 17 DNA loci and Amelogenin."

http://www.cmj.hr/2003/44/3/12808731.pdf

[5boxersmom]

I don't know. I just read something by a person who seemed very knowledgeable that only Caylee's DNA would be needed to show she was t he product of incest because the DNA would have like overlapping characteristics. It made sense to me but I can't find any confirmation of it.

Anyway here is an interesting in article about the prevalence of incest and Casey and Lee from Momlogic website :

http://www.momlogic.com/2009/01/casey_anthony_caylee_anthony_i.php

That's was interesting. Thanks.

[aubrey04]

While reviewing the documents - I noticed that chloroform residue was specifically indentified in the same area where the stain in the trunk was... near the spare tire area.

Page 15

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530394/detail.html

[aubrey04]

Belesha is gone to bed so can anyone else tell me... what was there about a heart on One Tree Hill?

There were searches on Casey's computer for the 100th episode of One Tree Hill. In that episode, a nanny kidnaps a little kid. That documentation was in the last doc dump - so you'd have to go through that stuff to find it.. I can't give you a link or specific page #. ETA - not sure about a "heart" - I didn't see anything about that..

[aubrey04]

Thank you so much I get so lost when they release new information.

Yes, it gets overwhelming.. I agree. Too much at one time and I start to really get frazzled.

thank you!!! :seeya:

NP! Happy to help. :)

[need2no]

In Jesse Grund’s interview with LE they asked him about having DNA tests after Caylee was born to determine if he was the father, and if this information was still available to him, he indicated it was. LE then asked if he would voluntarily provide the info to them and he agreed to do so.

[5boxersmom]

In Jesse Grund’s interview with LE they asked him about having DNA tests after Caylee was born to determine if he was the father, and if this information was still available to him, he indicated it was. LE then asked if he would voluntarily provide the info to them and he agreed to do so.

See I totally missed that. Thank you.

[aubrey04]

I just read the FBI reports. I don't see where any documents have been released about soil match-ups. I see LE turned over samples to the FBI though.

That's what I would like to know. Do the soil samples from the back of Casey's trunk match soil in the back of the Anthony home? Also, does the vegetation and "leaf" debris that was found under Casey's car match the vegetation and leaf debris in the woods?

I hate to be greedy when we just got all these new documents, but I want more. :) Maybe they will be released some time soon.. I hope.

[need2no]

See I totally missed that. Thank you.

YW! :seeya:

Lots to keep up with in this case....just imagine if we have to wait for a year or so before the trial. :w00t:

[sammielizabe]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

So basically are they telling us, without telling us......?

[5boxersmom]

Please read the documents , not the wesh article , the documents reveal as noted just what the detective saw and it was noted as such.

From the docs it merely states that there was a black bag by skull as was the laundry bag ...it states that the body was evidently at some point in both bags , does not say which one first and if it was something they could figure out ,it was not determined , not in any of the docs presented today anyway.

But earlier you said to me that you took it to mean that the laundry bag was on the outside. Do you remember that? :confused:

[5boxersmom]

YW! :seeya:

Lots to keep up with in this case....just imagine if we have to wait for a year or so before the trial. :w00t:

Yeah no kidding. Seems like everyday something new comes out.

[Babes]

I have some questions and sorry if this was discussed as i really missed the board for couple months :wub:

Any word on the source of the Laundry Bag? Where can they buy this laundry bag? Does the Anthony's have one like this on their house?
Do you have a more detail informations about the Laundry Bag? Any fingerprints on this laundry bag?

[Kathlb]

Just popping in during the middle of the night since I woke up and couldn't go back to sleep. ;-)

Help in doing research if you need more links..also posted in links thread.

Crime Scene Photos
http://www.rsxtaci.com/Caylee/

Documents & Discovery
http://cayleeanthony.wordpress.com/documents-discovery/

[Babes]

From page 15 (aka 3168) of the Orange County Sheriff's Office "Affidavit for Search Warrant" dated December 20, 2008 http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html :

"The remains appeared to have originally been within a black plastic garbage bag and within a cloth laundry hamper bag."

I understood this description to indicate that Caylee was placed within a black plastic garbage bag which was in turn placed inside a cloth laundry hamper bag. If the hamper bag was light in color (for example, the Winnie the Pooh laundry hamper which matched the rest of the bedroom decor was a pale color http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg http://www4.jcpenney.com/jcp/X6.aspx?ItemID=14e7add&ItemTyp=G&GrpTyp=PRD&ShowMenu=T&ShopBy=0&SearchString=winnie+the+pooh&RefPage=SearchDepartment.aspx&s4PageSize=15&CmCatId=searchresults&Search1Prod=True ), then that would explain the varying description of the bags.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Thanks for the pictures...

On this picture -
http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg
Did you guys notice the baby bottle with milk on the high chair beside the stuff toy? Is that real milk or a fancy baby bottle for some stuff toy only? If this is real milk - what is it doing in there when the picture was taken? - Is it Caylee's? Or it was just place intentionally for some design :scared:

[Jester]

How old is Casey, and how old is Lee? How many years between?

She was pregnant in high school. If it was some out of state guy, where did she meet him and how she end up pregnant?

Where's Jeff Hopkins? Could he be the father? He's certainly the first person she fingered when giving an explanation to the police.

[Jester]

Thanks for the pictures...

On this picture -
http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg
Did you guys notice the baby bottle with milk on the high chair beside the stuff toy? Is that real milk or a fancy baby bottle for some stuff toy only? If this is real milk - what is it doing in there when the picture was taken? - Is it Caylee's? Or it was just place intentionally for some design :scared:

That looks just like real baby bottles. If it's been sitting there all along, it's got to be worse than rancid. If it's a prop (like everything else in the room), then someone is spending too much money on Caylee's toys.

[Jester]

From page 15 (aka 3168) of the Orange County Sheriff's Office "Affidavit for Search Warrant" dated December 20, 2008 http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html :

"The remains appeared to have originally been within a black plastic garbage bag and within a cloth laundry hamper bag."

I understood this description to indicate that Caylee was placed within a black plastic garbage bag which was in turn placed inside a cloth laundry hamper bag. If the hamper bag was light in color (for example, the Winnie the Pooh laundry hamper which matched the rest of the bedroom decor was a pale color
http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg
http://www4.jcpenney.com/jcp/X6.aspx?ItemID=14e7add&ItemTyp=G&GrpTyp=PRD&ShowMenu=T&ShopBy=0&SearchString=winnie+the+pooh&RefPage=SearchDepartment.aspx&s4PageSize=15&CmCatId=searchresults&Search1Prod=True ), then that would explain the varying description of the bags.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions

Is that the same day bed that Caylee had as well? Back to look for the tail end of Greta's interview ... it's not. http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=bIu7Ens4WIo

[KKKKKKatie]

Morning all :seeya:

I had a lot of trouble sleeping last night. To many sad things rolling around in my head :sad:

[KKKKKKatie]

but did the tot-momster really put a heart shaped sticker over Caylee's mouth - or is this a rumor. PLEASE tell me it's a rumor :(

It appears that she put it on the duct tape that was over her mouth. LE could see the sticky outline of it and found the sticker near the scene :mad:

[Danette44]

It appears that she put it on the duct tape that was over her mouth. LE could see the sticky outline of it and found the sticker near the scene :mad:

Good Morning everyone

Did anyone else notice on Greta last night that it was stated nothing was found on the duct tape other than the heart inprint? So, does that mean no finger prints on it - and also, does the SA office have to put everything out there they have on Casey or can they keep spme evidence to themselfs?

Caylee:rose:

[n/t]

It appears that she put it on the duct tape that was over her mouth. LE could see the sticky outline of it and found the sticker near the scene :mad:
Good Morning Katie and all,

Incredible police work.

I'm still trying to figure out why she would put Caylee in a laundry bag first and where did she get the laundry bag? I really question now whether or not Caylee was murdered at home in her bed.

Those documents were very disturbing to read. What a monster.

[n/t]

Good Morning everyone

Did anyone else notice on Greta last night that it was stated nothing was found on the duct tape other than the heart inprint? So, does that mean no finger prints on it - and also, does the SA office have to put everything out there they have on Casey or can they keep spme evidence to themselfs?

Caylee:rose:


I don't get Fox so I didn't watch Greta. LE will hold alot of evidence until trial. I believe they can't release anything that directly points to Casey Anthony as being the murderer until trial.

The released information is overwhelming but in reality we can't really say Casey did it. The prosecution will connect the dots for us at trial. No doubt about it.

[KKKKKKatie]

UNTILPROVEN

From page 15 of the Orange County Sheriff's Office "Affidavit for Search Warrant" dated December 20, 2008 http://www.wftv.com/news/18530424/detail.html

"While processing the duct tape at the FBI lab in Quantico, the latent print unit noticed residue in the perfect shape of a heart. The heart was not hand drawn and residue appeared to be consistent with the adhesive side of a heart shaped sticker. It appears that the sticker was put on the duct tape intentionally. In the search area, investigators located a small heart shaped sticker similar in size to the residue found on the duct tape. The sheet from which this sticker came from was not recovered on scene."

[KKKKKKatie]

Good Morning everyone

Did anyone else notice on Greta last night that it was stated nothing was found on the duct tape other than the heart inprint? So, does that mean no finger prints on it - and also, does the SA office have to put everything out there they have on Casey or can they keep spme evidence to themselfs?

Caylee:rose:

We may not have seen all of the forensic reports yet but it is my understanding that we see everything that is turned over to the defense

[KKKKKKatie]

Good Morning Katie and all,

Incredible police work.

I'm still trying to figure out why she would put Caylee in a laundry bag first and where did she get the laundry bag? I really question now whether or not Caylee was murdered at home in her bed.

Those documents were very disturbing to read. What a monster.

not sure we will ever know the real truth n/t...Casey sure isn't gonna talk

[ellegna]

Candles for Caylee
http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/...l=eng&gi=cayle (http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=cayle)

:rose::rose::rose:

Caylee's Guest Book
http://www.legacy.com/SPTimes/GB/Gue...onId=121581033 (http://www.legacy.com/SPTimes/GB/GuestbookView.aspx?PersonId=121581033)

[Danette44]

I don't get Fox so I didn't watch Greta. LE will hold alot of evidence until trial. I believe they can't release anything that directly points to Casey Anthony as being the murderer until trial.

The released information is overwhelming but in reality we can't really say Casey did it. The prosecution will connect the dots for us at trial. No doubt about it.

I hope they take all the video's and put a good story together......I read so much from last night and I have to agree with NG on the subject of JB being Hispanic - none of us would of thought a thing about it. So, now it seems it's about him and making a name for the Hispanic's. Is he REALLY here for Casey?? Wow, it's 19 here in my part of Florida, wish they would move the trial here we never hear about it...I listen all morning and nothing about the new doc's on our news. BRB need to turn my car on and defrost the windows..brrrrr in florida this morning!

[KKKKKKatie]

Oh G-D-it, that just gives me the chills. She had to be out of her mind!

It just gets stranger and stranger doesn't it? :mad:

[n/t]

I hope they take all the video's and put a good story together......I read so much from last night and I have to agree with NG on the subject of JB being Hispanic - none of us would of thought a thing about it. So, now it seems it's about him and making a name for the Hispanic's. Is he REALLY here for Casey?? Wow, it's 19 here in my part of Florida, wish they would move the trial here we never hear about it...I listen all morning and nothing about the new doc's on our news. BRB need to turn my car on and defrost the windows..brrrrr in florida this morning!

I thought he was pathetic at that mini press conference. Even the defense attornies on HLN couldn't understand why he would make this about him. It's not about Baez. Sheesh at one point, I thought he was going to cry. He couldn't have picked a worse time, imo. The day the docs are released and he sounded like he was overwhelmed.

I agree. What does being Hispanic have to do with it? :unsure:

[KKKKKKatie]

I thought he was pathetic at that mini press conference. Even the defense attornies on HLN couldn't understand why he would make this about him. It's not about Baez. Sheesh at one point, I thought he was going to cry. He couldn't have picked a worse time, imo. The day the docs are released and he sounded like he was overwhelmed.

I agree. What does being Hispanic have to do with it? :unsure:

I missed it last night. I'm thinking that is a good thing :rolleyes:

lol

[Danette44]

I missed it last night. I'm thinking that is a good thing :rolleyes:

lol

I agree Casey is toast with an Attorney like that - has anyone noticed how the expert Dream Team has stay off the airways once Judge Strickland made that comment about turning his TV on and seeing JB's experts on it LOL Off to work - have a good day everyone.....

[witchywoman]

Thanks for the pictures...

On this picture -
http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg
Did you guys notice the baby bottle with milk on the high chair beside the stuff toy? Is that real milk or a fancy baby bottle for some stuff toy only? If this is real milk - what is it doing in there when the picture was taken? - Is it Caylee's? Or it was just place intentionally for some design :scared:

jmo, eh? but i think its toy bottle.

when i was wee thing, i had toy bottle for my dressy bessy doll and baby tender love doll, as i fed bottle to said doll, the milk in bottle would dissapear when titlted, and then re appear again afer i fed my baby doll...

anyone else remeber those bottles? i think its that kind of bottle, toy bottle, but jmo

[Kathlb]

On JVM last night they were referring to the fingerprint on the duct tape. I missed that I guess before their discussion. I wonder if they have matched it yet? I'm sure they must have.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Well, Rozzie Franco, briefly, what do you know about this fingerprint?

FRANCO: Well, ultimately, that was the question we had for investigators. And that`s something that didn`t come out quite yet, whether Casey`s DNA was actually on the duct tape, on the sticker. And...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: There`s a host of evidence. And it would be astounding if it was not DNA on all of it. The baby blanket, the clothes.

All right. Stay right there. We`re just getting started.

[AJandTam]

Or if they are actually biological bro and sis. We know the parents had a turbulent history, so there could be a chance that Lee or Caysey are actually step-siblings.

just a thought....

Good Morning. You went to sleep here :loveeyes:. That would be half siblings not step.. Right.. Same mom not same dad... Good to see ya

[AMS]

jmo, eh? but i think its toy bottle.

when i was wee thing, i had toy bottle for my dressy bessy doll and baby tender love doll, as i fed bottle to said doll, the milk in bottle would dissapear when titlted, and then re appear again afer i fed my baby doll...

anyone else remeber those bottles? i think its that kind of bottle, toy bottle, but jmo

I had one of those toy bottles too. I think the bottle is a toy unless they use a bottle to feed the yorkies (j/k).

IMO.

[Januarybaby]

and if ircc one of the 911 calls from Kronk said a "white bag"...but then she was discovered in black bags with the white one inside?

very interesting

The MR getting the color of the bags wrong isnt what caught my attention but what did is why would he say " Im not saying its Caylee or anything"

That bothers me why he would say that? Maybe IM just taking it the wrong way.

[Januarybaby]

I dont believe Casey used a knife. There is no evidence of blood anywhere to be Caylees.

The knife was found in the car. Didnt Cindy find it and wash it? I wonder if there was glue residue on it from duct tape.


Mothers usually do not kill their kids by stabbing them. They tend to drown or suffocate them.

[msgatorslayer]

G'morning, everyone!

I was watching an interesting show lastnight called "The Science of Interrogation'. I wish we had a video of Casey's chit chat with LE at Universal to see her body language. And compare it to her Mom's itchy, scratchy, touchy, chat with LE.

Anyway, on this show, one of the cases was of a young Mom suspected of killing her 2 yo Step Daughter. The interrogation techniques worked and she did confess to it being an accident, she didn't mean to do it, bla, bla, bla.

The detective said he'll never forget what he seen when walking into the bathroom of the home. Where an attack took place on the girl and her head was slammed into the toilet. In the trash can, was duct tape and gobs of hair.

While the perp never fully confessed to everything she did to the lil girl, the detectives MOO is that she duct taped the girls mouth so that nobody would hear her screaming. She had ciggy burns on her body. An ashtray with ciggys was on the bath tub. Bumps, brusies, scratches, and the blow to the head that killed her. She was tortured.

Just had to share cause of the duct tape!!!

[Regina.Lampert]

I don't get Fox so I didn't watch Greta. LE will hold alot of evidence until trial. I believe they can't release anything that directly points to Casey Anthony as being the murderer until trial.

The released information is overwhelming but in reality we can't really say Casey did it. The prosecution will connect the dots for us at trial. No doubt about it.

Good morning everyone. That's right n/t, the incriminating evidence has not and will not be released before trial, sorry sleuthies.

BTW, the residue imprint from the heart sticker, was not noticed by LE on the scene. It was discovered by the crimescene analyst using a microscope while searching for LATENT FINGERPRINTS.

For anyone on Greta's show to declare "nothing" was found on the duct tape is ludicrous, imo. I would bet prints, fibers and hair were found.

[Januarybaby]

Do we have a link to all the new documents yet?

[ellegna]

If the laundry bag was taken from the home, Cindy would know it. Heck I would know it, as I only have 2. For this reason I don't think the tot-monster would take that chance. You can easily buy one at sav-on. target etc. I'm super curious as to where she got it.


I'm leaning towards Caylee dying at home. Casey may have used the laundry bag because it was right there. Casey didn't have time to search for a garbage bag. Casey may have had an afterthought the color of the laundry bag would stand out then placed it in a darker garbage bag.

No doubt Cindy would have noticed it was gone but no one knew Caylee was missing at that time. I wouldn't be surprised if Cindy questioned Casey and got an excuse of some sort. Casey may have said she took it to Zenaida's or she tore it and will replace later.
Who knows? :shrug:

[BJames]

I am trying to think why any 'kidnapper' would use a laundry bag to put a child in...my guess is that it came from the Anthony home and Cindy would know that it was missing...even though she would no doubt deny it even in her own mind. I am remembering that their laundy is in the garage, it would make sense that Casey would filch one while disposing of the baby's body....probably when she had the car backed in.
Another thing that came to my mind yesterday...regarding 'matching' the pull-ups/diapers with the flowers on them?
I have had some experience with reporting 'faulty' diaper products to company's (mainly Kimberley-Clark, they make Depends etc.), and those diapers can be traced. Right from the cut on the tabs to the UPC code on a bag, they can figure out when they were made, where they were shipped, what store...and now with digital electronics they can tell when those codes were scanned and sold...and of course as we know retailers have store video now.
Thus far it sure appears that LE has done their jobs...I don't think they would drop the ball on any of this. Even though it seems like Casey believes her own lies, she doesn't think far enough ahead to realize how technology works these days.
As for Cindy not wanting to go home from work on the 15th and being told by her superior(s) that she should call the police? She is and was in denial...like if she didn't believe it then it couldn't be true..and it still looks like that. Somewhat the same as as long as Casey believes something to be true...then it must be.
I just wish that all of them (including Baez) could focus on the 'true' victim in this situation...not one of them even seems to notice that a baby girl is dead.
At least she isn't suffering anymore...

Just my opinion of course...

[msgatorslayer]

Do we have a link to all the new documents yet?

Yes, in the LINKS thread.:smile:

[Regina.Lampert]

If the laundry bag was taken from the home, Cindy would know it. Heck I would know it, as I only have 2. For this reason I don't think the tot-monster would take that chance. You can easily buy one at sav-on. target etc. I'm super curious as to where she got it.

Hiya Until! I was saying that yesterday, cynthia has known what was missing from that room "from day one."

We were also speculating that either casey or cynthia purchased replacement blanket and/or laundry bag from JC Penney, hence cynthia refusing to turn over those receipts/records to LE.

[Januarybaby]

Yes, in the LINKS thread.:smile:

Thank you, I just couldnt find it so I asked.

[witchywoman]

Well, id like to stay and chat, but work is calling me...

Ill lurk again later this afty noon, thanks for the chat , and the links, and thanks for keeping me in the loop as to whats happening..

peace out ya'll

[ellegna]

and if ircc one of the 911 calls from Kronk said a "white bag"...but then she was discovered in black bags with the white one inside?

very interesting


I thought about it and maybe the MR didn't get the color wrong. If Caylee was in a laundry bag what color was it? Could the garbage bag have ripped away exposing the lighter laundry bag?

[msgatorslayer]

Hiya Until! I was saying that yesterday, cynthia has known what was missing from that room "from day one."

We were also speculating that either casey or cynthia purchased replacement blanket and/or laundry bag from JC Penney, hence cynthia refusing to turn over those receipts/records to LE.

Without the smell, a laundry bag is a pretty inconspicuous item to be trotting around with in the trunk of a car.

And ITA, Cindy was holding back those CC statements because of a damning purchase made on them.

[AJandTam]

You're right - up with insomnia -- still no excuse. Either they're half siblings, or Lee is the baby daddy......or, it could be JP as Caylee has some of the same characteristics.

In any case, I'm glad ME is doing the test.

Good to see you too!

Yowza.. Interesting that this is in the doc's but left as a cliff hanger..Wish I knew more about the legalities of that??

[Januarybaby]

Cindy Anthony is unbelieveable.

Lets just say something happened and Casey is set free. What if she got out and had another baby? THis thought terrifies me.

I dont think CA and GA are in denial and dont want to face reality. What I think they cant believe is they had a murderer in their family and just dont want to admit it to people.

When GA smelled the car he knew. CA knows what Casey is like.

[Barbara fl.]

I thought about it and maybe the MR didn't get the color wrong. If Caylee was in a laundry bag what color was it? Could the garbage bag have ripped away exposing the lighter laundry bag?


That is exactly what I am thinking....Also in the 911 call, Kronk didn't say a white bag, he said he saw something white....But now I believe that the garbage bag had probably ripped and he saw the laundry bag.....JMO

[margaritaville]

GN everyone....I'm completely wiped. Have fun posting!

On sign-off, I still say it was premed murder. Parents not involved, just duped. Casey tried to make it look like a kidnapping, similar to the One Tree Hill episode. That's where the heart fits in.

:wub:


I have never seen that show or episode.
What does the heart have to do with the show??

TIA

[AJandTam]

The MR getting the color of the bags wrong isnt what caught my attention but what did is why would he say " Im not saying its Caylee or anything"

That bothers me why he would say that? Maybe IM just taking it the wrong way.

They said that he had a bit of an obsession w/finding Caylee, he knew that he was in her neighborhood so I wouldn't put alot of weight in that one statement. If the FBI/LE didn't clear the guy. I admit. I might have a different opinion of him, as his story really doesn't sound true.

[callmetree]

Candles for Caylee
http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/...l=eng&gi=cayle (http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=cayle)

:rose::rose::rose:

Caylee's Guest Book
http://www.legacy.com/SPTimes/GB/Gue...onId=121581033 (http://www.legacy.com/SPTimes/GB/GuestbookView.aspx?PersonId=121581033)


thanks ellegna and good morning all. can this case get any worse? it kills me thinking about what all caylee had to endure in her short life.

[Januarybaby]

Wonder if Baez is being accused of something he was doing with Casey every day she was at his office every day for hours.

He says it has nothing to do with her but I dont think he would want to admit to anything like that. What got me thinking is when he said he was being accused of something he didnt do.

And if I remember, didnt he get in trouble at the jail for hugging her when as a lawyer he should know you do not do that?

[Jeepers]

Ok, I have read the documents and I have read about the telephone pings.
How did Casey get Caylee out of the house if she was killed at home?

Telephone records show Casey talked to TonE basically all night early morning. Pings show she never left the immediate area. If she was spotted at the hotel in the early a.m. on the 16th the pings would still register on the same tower that her home pinged.

I don't believe George saw them before he went to work.

If Casey left with Caylee on the night of the 15th she was still close to the home cell tower. How did she get the pooh blanket, laundry bag, out of the house without Cindy noticing she had those items.

If she killed Caylee later in the afternoon of the 16th after George went to work. Casey had time to cool off from the argument her and Cindy had the night before. So if killing Caylee that afternoon then I would say premeditated murder.

[Barbara fl.]

Cindy Anthony is unbelieveable.

Lets just say something happened and Casey is set free. What if she got out and had another baby? THis thought terrifies me.

I dont think CA and GA are in denial and dont want to face reality. What I think they cant believe is they had a murderer in their family and just dont want to admit it to people.

When GA smelled the car he knew. CA knows what Casey is like.



Good morning all,

I just heard this morning...(maybe it was said before) but I never heard it...that Cindy went to work the next day and didn't call the police, that she wanted to give Casey a chance to explain....This was after smelling the odor of death in the car.....I always thought that Cindy had called LE the very first night.....

Now I am prone to believe that Cindy deliberately washed the items in the trunk of the car....I believe that the cover up started almost right away.....Maybe she was hoping against hope but she even told a coworker about it, and told that coworker that she will die if anything happened to Casey.....

Maybe this was known to everyone, but I just heard it.....

[Barbara fl.]

Ok, I have read the documents and I have read about the telephone pings.
How did Casey get Caylee out of the house if she was killed at home?

Telephone records show Casey talked to TonE basically all night early morning. Pings show she never left the immediate area. If she was spotted at the hotel in the early a.m. on the 16th the pings would still register on the same tower that her home pinged.

I don't believe George saw them before he went to work.

If Casey left with Caylee on the night of the 15th she was still close to the home cell tower. How did she get the pooh blanket, laundry bag, out of the house without Cindy noticing she had those items.

If she killed Caylee later in the afternoon of the 16th after George went to work. Casey had time to cool off from the argument her and Cindy had the night before. So if killing Caylee that afternoon then I would say premeditated murder.


I believe that is just how it happened....and I too believe it was premeditated....

[AJandTam]

I have never seen that show or episode.
What does the heart have to do with the show??

TIA

I didn't see the original post about any show. I will say, from the minute I heard chloroform. I thought of the tv shows/movies... The chloroform and the duct tape just sound like a hollywood version of a kidnapping to me.. Someone watched to much tv. I've always said that.

Another thing in this case is that I saw bits and pieces of cases from the pasts thrown in here.. Was talking to a friend about this and she and I thought about Jon Benet and the heart on her hand.. Wondered if this was again, a bit and pieces of something taken from other cases, or movies/tv shows..

[Pruddennce]

I thought about it and maybe the MR didn't get the color wrong. If Caylee was in a laundry bag what color was it? Could the garbage bag have ripped away exposing the lighter laundry bag?

in his 911 calls, he says the bag is GREY. "and a little further up from that he saw something white" in another call 'saw something round and white'.

the problem I have with his calls is that he claims he doesnt know the name of the school "he doesnt pay attention to the 'rest of that', just the meter #'. then in another call he gives the name of the school.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/3710705/Roy-Kronk-911-Calls-January-2009

who is he referencing when he says 'we'?

best regards,
Pru

[Januarybaby]

I cant believe Ricardo thinks something that says Win her over....with chloroform is funny.

To me its degrading to women. I am so glad I dont live near any of these people, I find them creepy.

[Regina.Lampert]

They said that he had a bit of an obsession w/finding Caylee, he knew that he was in her neighborhood so I wouldn't put alot of weight in that one statement. If the FBI/LE didn't clear the guy. I admit. I might have a different opinion of him, as his story really doesn't sound true.

An "obsession" with this case? Why I've never heard of such a thing................ :chicken:


lol :tonguewag:

[AJandTam]

An "obsession" with this case? Why I've never heard of such a thing................ :chicken:


lol :tonguewag:
Good Morning Reggie.
Me either. I wonder if he was obsessed w/other cases in the past?? Trenton Ducket, Jennifer Kesse ect??

[Pruddennce]

Good morning all,

I just heard this morning...(maybe it was said before) but I never heard it...that Cindy went to work the next day and didn't call the police, that she wanted to give Casey a chance to explain....This was after smelling the odor of death in the car.....I always thought that Cindy had called LE the very first night.....

Now I am prone to believe that Cindy deliberately washed the items in the trunk of the car....I believe that the cover up started almost right away.....Maybe she was hoping against hope but she even told a coworker about it, and told that coworker that she will die if anything happened to Casey.....

Maybe this was known to everyone, but I just heard it.....

Cindy went back to work after she met George at the impound.

they took the car home, took the battery out, George went to work and she went back to work. after work, she claims she went thru the car and found Amy's #.

George, in his statement to LE said she went back to work. also her statement indicates the time she says she got home from work that day.

best regards,
Pru

[AJandTam]

I believe that is just how it happened....and I too believe it was premeditated....

Definately premeditated IMHO. In the back of my mind, I have started to wonder if the motive wasn't money.. :cursing:

[msgatorslayer]

Good Morning Reggie.
Me either. I wonder if he was obsessed w/other cases in the past?? Trenton Ducket, Jennifer Kesse ect??

Wonder if he posts here, lmao.:tongueside:

[AJandTam]

Wonder if he posts here, lmao.:tongueside:

LOL, I thought about that but IF he did. He should have been pulling a Mert for us.. Telling us all he was finding... We would have helped him get some attention to what he saw, huh?

[Barbara fl.]

Cindy went back to work after she met George at the impound.

they took the car home, took the battery out, George went to work and she went back to work. after work, she claims she went thru the car and found Amy's #.

George, in his statement to LE said she went back to work. also her statement indicates the time she says she got home from work that day.

best regards,
Pru


I guess I missed alot...thought I was up on almost everything.....

My question now is, how could Cindy have even thought to go to work after smelling the odor of death in Casey's car and not have seen or spoken to her granddaughter in over a month?.....I would have been a basket case....JMO For some reason I always thought that it all took place in that one evening....

[desmom]

Definately premeditated IMHO. In the back of my mind, I have started to wonder if the motive wasn't money.. :cursing:

Good Morning Tam! I did not sleep well. The heart sticker kept creeping into my dreams.

Your post reminded me of something I read here earlier. Someone posted something about premeditated murder and the premeditation could have happened just minutes before the actual death. IOW, no big plan of who, what, when and where. Does anyone remember the post or maybe can explain it again? TIA

[msgatorslayer]

Cindy went back to work after she met George at the impound.

they took the car home, took the battery out, George went to work and she went back to work. after work, she claims she went thru the car and found Amy's #.

George, in his statement to LE said she went back to work. also her statement indicates the time she says she got home from work that day.

best regards,
Pru

Right! Morning, Pru. Yesterdays doc dump included interviews with her co-workers. After she got back from the tow yard and told them what was going on, including telling one that the car smelled like a dead body, they told her to go home and call LE. SHE DID NOT WANT TO DO THIS. Claiming she'd speak to Casey about it later. A higher up had to basically force her to leave work that day. She had work to do and that was more important than finding her lying, scamming Daughter and her missing Grand Child.

[Regina.Lampert]

Good Morning Reggie.
Me either. I wonder if he was obsessed w/other cases in the past?? Trenton Ducket, Jennifer Kesse ect??

Actually, I read (please don't ask me where, cuz I don't remember) that it was Kronk's girlfriend who kept urging him to go back and check out his suspicions.

[Regina.Lampert]

Cindy went back to work after she met George at the impound.

they took the car home, took the battery out, George went to work and she went back to work. after work, she claims she went thru the car and found Amy's #.

George, in his statement to LE said she went back to work. also her statement indicates the time she says she got home from work that day.

best regards,
Pru

GM Pru, how does the text to casey from cynthia, regarding the big problem with the car, fit in to this timeline, if you know.

[msgatorslayer]

LOL, I thought about that but IF he did. He should have been pulling a Mert for us.. Telling us all he was finding... We would have helped him get some attention to what he saw, huh?

For sure, Tam! :laugh:

[Pruddennce]

I guess I missed alot...thought I was up on almost everything.....

My question now is, how could Cindy have even thought to go to work after smelling the odor of death in Casey's car and not have seen or spoken to her granddaughter in over a month?.....I would have been a basket case....JMO For some reason I always thought that it all took place in that one evening....

incredulous isnt it?

Cindy had to be TOLD to go home and call the police.

best regards,
Pru

[Jeepers]

Cindy went back to work after she met George at the impound.

they took the car home, took the battery out, George went to work and she went back to work. after work, she claims she went thru the car and found Amy's #.

George, in his statement to LE said she went back to work. also her statement indicates the time she says she got home from work that day.

best regards,
Pru

There would be no way in the world I would have been able to even crawl back to work after smelling that car! The cover up started way too soon in my opinion. Not a normal reaction to a new discovery.
I believe that Cindy & George knew something before the car was found. Going back to work would not be normal when you find your car smelling like a dead body.
They might not have known all the details and maybe they were just piecing things together trying to figure out where Caylee was but, when the car was found they knew what they had been suspecting in my opinion. Went back to work acting like nothing significant had happened. Casually mentioning to co-workers your car smells like a dead body
Just don't add up. Maybe the immunity they are requesting dates back to mid June.
Cindy does not appear to be passive in her actions only when she directly deals with Casey. I believe Cindy and Casey had few conversations per telephone or myspace to let Cindy know something bad had happened.

The writing from Cindy July 3 about Caylee missing and Casey's writing around July 6th or 7th. Everyone Lies everyone Dies. Strikes me of little of what they conversed about. jmo.

[Pruddennce]

GM Pru, how does the text to casey from cynthia, regarding the big problem with the car, fit in to this timeline, if you know.

Im not sure RL....will have to go check that out. but the bottom line is, she didnt take action right away.

well, she didnt take action for 30 days.

nothing but attempts to 'talk to caylee' and even went to look for her at Universal on July 3rd....and in IMO she found out Casey didnt have a job.

and of course, the conflicting statements by Casey to her: in Jacksonville but working at Universal that week? it didnt make sense.

but Cindy accepted it.

IMO

best regards,
Pru

[Pruddennce]

Right! Morning, Pru. Yesterdays doc dump included interviews with her co-workers. After she got back from the tow yard and told them what was going on, including telling one that the car smelled like a dead body, they told her to go home and call LE. SHE DID NOT WANT TO DO THIS. Claiming she'd speak to Casey about it later. A higher up had to basically force her to leave work that day. She had work to do and that was more important than finding her lying, scamming Daughter and her missing Grand Child.

mg...its pretty unbelievable, isnt it?

best regards,
Pru

[msgatorslayer]

There would be no way in the world I would have been able to even crawl back to work after smelling that car! The cover up started way too soon in my opinion. Not a normal reaction to a new discovery.
I believe that Cindy & George knew something before the car was found. Going back to work would not be normal when you find your car smelling like a dead body.
They might not have known all the details and maybe they were just piecing things together trying to figure out where Caylee was but, when the car was found they knew what they had been suspecting in my opinion. Went back to work acting like nothing significant had happened. Casually mentioning to co-workers your car smells like a dead body
Just don't add up. Maybe the immunity they are requesting dates back to mid June.
Cindy does not appear to be passive in her actions only when she directly deals with Casey. I believe Cindy and Casey had few conversations per telephone or myspace to let Cindy know something bad had happened.

The writing from Cindy July 3 about Caylee missing and Casey's writing around July 6th or 7th. Everyone Lies everyone Dies. Strikes me of little of what they conversed about. jmo.

Why wasn't the first reaction one of concern that something was wrong with both Casey and Caylee?

[AJandTam]

I guess I missed alot...thought I was up on almost everything.....

My question now is, how could Cindy have even thought to go to work after smelling the odor of death in Casey's car and not have seen or spoken to her granddaughter in over a month?.....I would have been a basket case....JMO For some reason I always thought that it all took place in that one evening....

Barb. I am going to get into so much trouble over this. So much trouble.. You know what. This is the same women who could run around w/that babies picture all over her vehicle, tshirt, purse ect and carry on about a kidnapping knowing full well that child was NOT kidnapped. I am convinced in my own mind they knew. THEY have been putting out thier own version of events this whole time. Short of the doc's.. their opinion has dominated the airwaves.. What are they really capable of... We have to ask ourselves that.. We really do. They are fake and do alot of acting... How much of what we have seen is acting. I wonder..

Some think they are in denial. I think it's more like "illussional".. They worked awfully hard to convince everyone of THIER versions of everything... Went over and beyond the call of duty... I am not convinced enlight of this new evidence that they were not a part of this.. They haven't been arrested but IF they were to be. I would not be shocked.

[KKKKKKatie]

OMG! Someone just sent me this :laugh::laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qvu5pTSr6Pk

[Barbara fl.]

Right! Morning, Pru. Yesterdays doc dump included interviews with her co-workers. After she got back from the tow yard and told them what was going on, including telling one that the car smelled like a dead body, they told her to go home and call LE. SHE DID NOT WANT TO DO THIS. Claiming she'd speak to Casey about it later. A higher up had to basically force her to leave work that day. She had work to do and that was more important than finding her lying, scamming Daughter and her missing Grand Child.


This is all so very sick....There is NO way I could have went to work...The more I hear abouty Cindy, the more I see a woman trying to think real quick on what to do next....I would not have hesitated for a second, LE would have been called immediately...It's even odd that the tow company didn't call LE, a body could have been in that trunk while it was sitting in that tow yard.....

This whole case and scenerio is bazaar......

But, unlike, Lenny Padilla.....I do not see any conspiracy involved.....All I see is a mother who murdered her child and probably premeditated the murder and from then on tried to stall as long as she could in reporting it so that she could compose herself or get her lies coordinated first...from then on I see a family that tried to cover up and all the other people involved just juming on the band wagon of a high profile case.....

I see nothing wrong with how the MR reported the find....and I still look to him as a hero in this case.....JMOO (I certainly welcome yours)

[msgatorslayer]

mg...its pretty unbelievable, isnt it?

best regards,
Pru

It is. Even her co-workers knew something was wrong with what she was saying. Things weren't adding up. And the car smells like a dead body but she'd rather be at work. PFFT!:cursing:

[ellegna]

Cindy went back to work after she met George at the impound.

they took the car home, took the battery out, George went to work and she went back to work. after work, she claims she went thru the car and found Amy's #.

George, in his statement to LE said she went back to work. also her statement indicates the time she says she got home from work that day.

best regards,
Pru

GM Pru

Totally amazing isn't it

Casey wasn't staying at home. No one saw or spoke to Caylee in over a month. You find out your daughter's car was towed and sitting in an impound for weeks. You pick up the car and it smells like there's been a dead body in it. You park it in the garage, remove the battery and you go back to work?????????
What is wrong with this picture :angry:

[AJandTam]

Good Morning Tam! I did not sleep well. The heart sticker kept creeping into my dreams.

Your post reminded me of something I read here earlier. Someone posted something about premeditated murder and the premeditation could have happened just minutes before the actual death. IOW, no big plan of who, what, when and where. Does anyone remember the post or maybe can explain it again? TIA

Oh no, not you too.

This case has always had a organized/disorganized factor..

[cassidy]

GM Pru

You pick up the car and it smells like there's been a dead body in it. You park it in the garage, remove the battery and you go back to work?????????
What is wrong with this picture :angry:

Everything.

[msgatorslayer]

This is all so very sick....There is NO way I could have went to work...The more I hear abouty Cindy, the more I see a woman trying to think real quick on what to do next....I would not have hesitated for a second, LE would have been called immediately...It's even odd that the tow company didn't call LE, a body could have been in that trunk while it was sitting in that tow yard.....

This whole case and scenerio is bazaar......

But, unlike, Lenny Padilla.....I do not see any conspiracy involved.....All I see is a mother who murdered her child and probably premeditated the murder and from then on tried to stall as long as she could in reporting it so that she could compose herself or get her lies coordinated first...from then on I see a family that tried to cover up and all the other people involved just juming on the band wagon of a high profile case.....

I see nothing wrong with how the MR reported the find....and I still look to him as a hero in this case.....JMOO (I certainly welcome yours)

I see it the same way, Barb. KISS, no conspiracy.

IMO, Cindy has been hiding from the world, all Casey's life, that something was not right with her. With Caylee missing, her house of cards was crumbling before her eyes and she couldn't allow it. She is still trying to protect her families image. Just a much bigger audience now.

[AJandTam]

This is all so very sick....There is NO way I could have went to work...The more I hear abouty Cindy, the more I see a woman trying to think real quick on what to do next....I would not have hesitated for a second, LE would have been called immediately...It's even odd that the tow company didn't call LE, a body could have been in that trunk while it was sitting in that tow yard.....

This whole case and scenerio is bazaar......

But, unlike, Lenny Padilla.....I do not see any conspiracy involved.....All I see is a mother who murdered her child and probably premeditated the murder and from then on tried to stall as long as she could in reporting it so that she could compose herself or get her lies coordinated first...from then on I see a family that tried to cover up and all the other people involved just juming on the band wagon of a high profile case.....

I see nothing wrong with how the MR reported the find....and I still look to him as a hero in this case.....JMOO (I certainly welcome yours)

Money and Mentality.. that's the only reason I might disagree w/ya.. but I still :wub: ya.

[playnice]

GM Pru

Totally amazing isn't it

Casey wasn't staying at home. No one saw or spoke to Caylee in over a month. You find out your daughter's car was towed and sitting in an impound for weeks. You pick up the car and it smells like there's been a dead body in it. You park it in the garage, remove the battery and you go back to work?????????
What is wrong with this picture :angry:

They knew. Didnt report it so they could find Casey and hear her version. If cindy hadnt told her co workers what was going on I doubt she would have called 911. Im not so sure when the 911 call was made they hadnt already decided to say the nanny kidnapped her.

Of course cindy would still have been hysterical even if she figured out Casey killed Caylee. I think the cover up started the minute Cindy found Casey. Why didnt Cindy ask to see Caylee at TonE's? Becuase she already knew .

[kitty1182]

It is. Even her co-workers knew something was wrong with what she was saying. Things weren't adding up. And the car smells like a dead body but she'd rather be at work. PFFT!:cursing:

They would not have had to tell me to go home, I would never have went to work that day..
Unreal!

[Jeepers]

Why wasn't the first reaction one of concern that something was wrong with both Casey and Caylee?

I think Cindy was still able to communicate with Casey throughout the time just Cindy was not able to talk with Caylee. I think between texting and Casey's calls to phony set up a time and place for her and Cindy to meet up, then Casey would run to the house and steal food and get more clothes.
Cindy it appears to have been in touch with Casey.jmo

That is what George told LE when he was talking about opening the trunk in the tow yard. He told the guy that worked there that his granddaughter was missing. I think he thought when he opened that trunk he would see Caylee. jmo

[jammies]

This is all so very sick....There is NO way I could have went to work...The more I hear abouty Cindy, the more I see a woman trying to think real quick on what to do next....I would not have hesitated for a second, LE would have been called immediately...It's even odd that the tow company didn't call LE, a body could have been in that trunk while it was sitting in that tow yard.....

This whole case and scenerio is bazaar......

But, unlike, Lenny Padilla.....I do not see any conspiracy involved.....All I see is a mother who murdered her child and probably premeditated the murder and from then on tried to stall as long as she could in reporting it so that she could compose herself or get her lies coordinated first...from then on I see a family that tried to cover up and all the other people involved just juming on the band wagon of a high profile case.....

I see nothing wrong with how the MR reported the find....and I still look to him as a hero in this case.....JMOO (I certainly welcome yours)


Great post. Exactly how I think.....at THIS moment. I even can understand washing the pants. I have an obsession about laundry and used to go through my kids cars to get their dirty clothes. For me, it's theraputic and I'm not OCD like Cindy.

[AJandTam]

I see it the same way, Barb. KISS, no conspiracy.

IMO, Cindy has been hiding from the world, all Casey's life, that something was not right with her. With Caylee missing, her house of cards was crumbling before her eyes and she couldn't allow it. She is still trying to protect her families image. Just a much bigger audience now.

Ms G.. let me ask ya something.. this bothers me bunches. We know that Casey drug that baby out and about w/her plenty.. Yet her parents were home at night. Why did she do that.. ? Why ruin her own self centered fun when leaving the child at home w/the grandparents asleep made so much more sense. Yet, she was fine to leave Caylee over at the Grunds?? Just seems that the grandp's would have said.. Look girl... go on and go party whatever you want to do, but leave that baby here.. No need to take her w/ya.. you'll have more fun alone..

[kitty1182]

They knew. Didnt report it so they could find Casey and hear her version. If cindy hadnt told her co workers what was going on I doubt she would have called 911. Im not so sure when the 911 call was made they hadnt already decided to say the nanny kidnapped her.

Of course cindy would still have been hysterical even if she figured out Casey killed Caylee. I think the cover up started the minute Cindy found Casey. Why didnt Cindy ask to see Caylee at TonE's? Becuase she already knew .

There is so much more to come out.imo

[trich]

Anyone think it is EXTREMELY strange that LE sent out for a paternity/DNA test to establish whether Lee was Caylee's father? I just find that bizarre.

Well considering the LE had been told by Jessie and I think TonE that Casey told them she had been sexually abused at home by her brother I guess they thought maybe they had better check it out.
Who knows Baez may be going to use that as a "excuse" for Casey killing Caylee and the LE needed to see if Caylee was proof of such.:shrug:

[Mandymax]

Oh yes, bizarre. Casey has been so secretive about the identity of the father, and Cay (which Cindy calls Casey) and Lee makes Caylee. Gotta wonder about the origin of the name if nothing else.

My take on that has always been that Cindy - so insistent that Casey keep the baby - saw this as an opportunity to be a mother again and do it RIGHT this time, as clearly Casey turned out with some faults, and who really knows about Lee? I figured "Caylee" came from Cindy combining the names of her own two children as a way of symbolically doing it over again.

As always, my own opinion.

[kitty1182]

I think Cindy was still able to communicate with Casey throughout the time just Cindy was not able to talk with Caylee. I think between texting and Casey's calls to phony set up a time and place for her and Cindy to meet up, then Casey would run to the house and steal food and get more clothes.
Cindy it appears to have been in touch with Casey.jmo

That is what George told LE when he was talking about opening the trunk in the tow yard. He told the guy that worked there that his granddaughter was missing. I think he thought when he opened that trunk he would see Caylee. jmo

His gd is missing and he and Cindy go to work..Wow, I would take off from work if my dog was missing.

[jammies]

I think Cindy was still able to communicate with Casey throughout the time just Cindy was not able to talk with Caylee. I think between texting and Casey's calls to phony set up a time and place for her and Cindy to meet up, then Casey would run to the house and steal food and get more clothes.
Cindy it appears to have been in touch with Casey.jmo

That is what George told LE when he was talking about opening the trunk in the tow yard. He told the guy that worked there that his granddaughter was missing. I think he thought when he opened that trunk he would see Caylee. jmo


I find it odd that GA never asks her about Caylee on the 24th when Casey "gave" him the gas cans. He was more worried about his missing gas cans than his grand daughter??? THat one just doesn't add up for me.

[AJandTam]

There is so much more to come out.imo

That I can agree w/.. Stay tuned.....

Morning Kitty.

[klock777]

Thanks for the pictures...

On this picture -
http://i39.tinypic.com/2mcyrr9.jpg
Did you guys notice the baby bottle with milk on the high chair beside the stuff toy? Is that real milk or a fancy baby bottle for some stuff toy only? If this is real milk - what is it doing in there when the picture was taken? - Is it Caylee's? Or it was just place intentionally for some design :scared:

It looks like a toy.

On Greta last night she said there were new text messages released also, that were from after Caylee was reported missing. People saying "I had lunch with you and you never said a word..." I did not see and text messages released yesterday - maybe more to come today?

As far as the knife being found - there was no blood found anywhere so this can't be the COD - in my opinion.

Also, all the things listed in that trunk, laundry detergent and fabric sheets - this must be what all the talk was about things like that mixed could cause chloraform.

One thing I did notice on NG was she was saying GA was NOT home when the computer searches were done, but I read in the docs that his employer had verified he WAS home on one of the days.

Another thing that I would like to see is the copies of the papers found in the car that were from US and Adventure Island - or whatever it was called - approx 6-8 papers - what were those?

As far as the blanket, my kids had blankies they took everywhere with them - this may be able to be explained away as she had taken it with her to the nanny's.

[Motomom]

Ms G.. let me ask ya something.. this bothers me bunches. We know that Casey drug that baby out and about w/her plenty.. Yet her parents were home at night. Why did she do that.. ? Why ruin her own self centered fun when leaving the child at home w/the grandparents asleep made so much more sense. Yet, she was fine to leave Caylee over at the Grunds?? Just seems that the grandp's would have said.. Look girl... go on and go party whatever you want to do, but leave that baby here.. No need to take her w/ya.. you'll have more fun alone..

I don't think that they ever thought she would kill her. I imagine that would have been the last thing on her mind. So making it inconvenient to party was their way IMO of hoping she would stop. Just because she lived at home, doesn't mean that CA and GA should be there watching caylee all the time. Even if it's at night. Maybe they were tired of her partying and didn't want to be a part of it, thinking maybe Casey had enough sense not to involve her daughter? Or maybe they had no idea and Casey left the house in the mornings and didn't come home to give CA a chance to tell her to leave the baby there?

[kitty1182]

That I can agree w/.. Stay tuned.....

Morning Kitty.


Good morning..:smile:
I think the real "shocker" isn't even known yet..

[playnice]

There is so much more to come out.imo

Yes there is. And it will.

[msgatorslayer]

Ms G.. let me ask ya something.. this bothers me bunches. We know that Casey drug that baby out and about w/her plenty.. Yet her parents were home at night. Why did she do that.. ? Why ruin her own self centered fun when leaving the child at home w/the grandparents asleep made so much more sense. Yet, she was fine to leave Caylee over at the Grunds?? Just seems that the grandp's would have said.. Look girl... go on and go party whatever you want to do, but leave that baby here.. No need to take her w/ya.. you'll have more fun alone..

Interestingly enough, her co-workers spoke of Cindy always babysitting. IIRC, there was one day, weekly, where Casey would bring Caylee to Cindy's work.

I think when Casey brought Caylee to parties with her, it was for her own selfish, stupid reasons. That, or, there were nights when George and Cindy had plans of their own and could not sit for her.

[Motomom]

I find it odd that GA never asks her about Caylee on the 24th when Casey "gave" him the gas cans. He was more worried about his missing gas cans than his grand daughter??? THat one just doesn't add up for me.


IIRC in one of his interviews he does mention that he asked for Caylee and what was going on. He missed her sweet face and little voice. Casey brushed him off, didn't have time right then and there then the gas can bruhaha happened.

[PuffDragon]

jmo, eh? but i think its toy bottle.

when i was wee thing, i had toy bottle for my dressy bessy doll and baby tender love doll, as i fed bottle to said doll, the milk in bottle would dissapear when titlted, and then re appear again afer i fed my baby doll...

anyone else remeber those bottles? i think its that kind of bottle, toy bottle, but jmo

It might be a real unused bottle that Caylee used for her dolls, too. She wouldn't still be drinking from a baby bottle at her age, would she? But there might still be bottles around.

I remember those bottles where the liquids 'magically' drained and reappeared, they have been around for a long time. I also remember how angry my mother was when I took one apart to see what made it work. That may have been the last one I ever had.

I watched that old Greta interview again. There are so many toys and stuffed animals in that room that I don't know how there was room for Caylee. It seems to be forever changing, too. I know that people sometimes leave the rooms of their loved ones untouched as a shrine, but Cindy seems to rearrange and add to it. How can being in there remind her of Caylee - I assume that's the idea - if she has it changed all around now? I wonder what's that's all about?

[desmom]

GM Pru

Totally amazing isn't it

Casey wasn't staying at home. No one saw or spoke to Caylee in over a month. You find out your daughter's car was towed and sitting in an impound for weeks. You pick up the car and it smells like there's been a dead body in it. You park it in the garage, remove the battery and you go back to work?????????
What is wrong with this picture :angry:

Bingo! I have a 21 year old with no children. If I had been in a similar situation, there is no way on this green earth I could go back to work and concentrate on my job. The Mom thinks the worse hormones would kick in...OMG! Where is he...What caused that smell....What is he involved in...What caused that smell.... jmo

[Barbara fl.]

Money and Mentality.. that's the only reason I might disagree w/ya.. but I still :wub: ya.



I just can not wait for this trial to start...I believe there will be a whole lot coming out.....I saw Baez on TV last evening and not once did he state that his client was innocent....he was doing that all along but suddenly stopped....I also wouldn't be surprised if LKB backs out of this.......

If this trial is anywhere near where I can get to it....I will try my darndest to get there......

[CelticDawn]

I find it odd that GA never asks her about Caylee on the 24th when Casey "gave" him the gas cans. He was more worried about his missing gas cans than his grand daughter??? THat one just doesn't add up for me.

Maybe....based on what happened during and after the fight on JUNE 15.....he didnt EXPECT to ever see Caylee again.....????

[Regina.Lampert]

They knew. Didnt report it so they could find Casey and hear her version. If cindy hadnt told her co workers what was going on I doubt she would have called 911. Im not so sure when the 911 call was made they hadnt already decided to say the nanny kidnapped her.

Of course cindy would still have been hysterical even if she figured out Casey killed Caylee. I think the cover up started the minute Cindy found Casey. Why didnt Cindy ask to see Caylee at TonE's? Becuase she already knew .

I agree with you, God only knows if cynthia hadn't blabbed to her coworkers, who urged her to call 911 if she really would have once she picked up casey?

I'm not letting george off the hook either, as a professional he knew what that smell was and for him to return to work is disgusting.

All they cared about was themselves really, how they felt, how things looked for them? Where the heck was the concern for the one truly vulnerable and defenseless person in this nightmare, Caylee?

How this awful family failed that little girl, absolutely appalling. imo

[jammies]

Interestingly enough, her co-workers spoke of Cindy always babysitting. IIRC, there was one day, weekly, where Casey would bring Caylee to Cindy's work.

I think when Casey brought Caylee to parties with her, it was for her own selfish, stupid reasons. That, or, there were nights when George and Cindy had plans of their own and could not sit for her.


I think during spring/early summer Cindy was trying to get Casey to be more responsible for Caylee. That plus, doesn't Ricardo say she started partying then? Maybe up until that time, Cindy and GA DID watch the baby at night and/or she wasn't going out as much BEFORE this time period.

Did that make sense? Only one cup of joe.....need more.

[msgatorslayer]

I just can not wait for this trial to start...I believe there will be a whole lot coming out.....I saw Baez on TV last evening and not once did he state that his client was innocent....he was doing that all along but suddenly stopped....I also wouldn't be surprised if LKB backs out of this.......

If this trial is anywhere near where I can get to it....I will try my darndest to get there......

Hey, there is ice on my car this morning. :chicken:

I'd go too. If it was close. I was looking forward to going to the Couey trial till it got moved all the way down to Miami.

[margaritaville]

Ok, I have read the documents and I have read about the telephone pings.
How did Casey get Caylee out of the house if she was killed at home?

Telephone records show Casey talked to TonE basically all night early morning. Pings show she never left the immediate area. If she was spotted at the hotel in the early a.m. on the 16th the pings would still register on the same tower that her home pinged.

I don't believe George saw them before he went to work.

If Casey left with Caylee on the night of the 15th she was still close to the home cell tower. How did she get the pooh blanket, laundry bag, out of the house without Cindy noticing she had those items.

If she killed Caylee later in the afternoon of the 16th after George went to work. Casey had time to cool off from the argument her and Cindy had the night before. So if killing Caylee that afternoon then I would say premeditated murder.


OR

Casey had the big fight took caylee into her room. at some point that night killed her put her in the hamper waited from mom and dad to go to work and put her in the trunk................

moo

[jammies]

IIRC in one of his interviews he does mention that he asked for Caylee and what was going on. He missed her sweet face and little voice. Casey brushed him off, didn't have time right then and there then the gas can bruhaha happened.

Wow, then I take it back! Must have missed that.
Sorry for any misinfo, folks.

[PuffDragon]

I dont believe Casey used a knife. There is no evidence of blood anywhere to be Caylees.

The knife was found in the car. Didnt Cindy find it and wash it? I wonder if there was glue residue on it from duct tape.


Mothers usually do not kill their kids by stabbing them. They tend to drown or suffocate them.

How could anybody could cut duct tape with a table knife? I have a hard enough time cutting it with a sharp blade of any kind.

I don't know the statistics but I think I remember hearing that with murdering mothers drowning, suffocation, and poisoning are the common patterns, messy deaths aren't.

[Motomom]

I just can not wait for this trial to start...I believe there will be a whole lot coming out.....I saw Baez on TV last evening and not once did he state that his client was innocent....he was doing that all along but suddenly stopped....I also wouldn't be surprised if LKB backs out of this.......

If this trial is anywhere near where I can get to it....I will try my darndest to get there......

I would imagine it is hard for ANY human representing someone like Casey, especially when we find out a little heart shaped sticker was stuck to duct tape that covers a 2 yr olds mouth, and possibly her nose too. When I read that stuff yesterday, my chest physically hurt. Felt like someone had punched me because IMO you see that sort of thing with serial killers, not moms who kill. It's so very very disturbing and knowing she had her pooh blanket in that trashbag..yet not her favorite doll...not that anything would make you feel better about the death of anyone, let alone the murder of a child..but somehow knowing she didn't care enough to put something she cherished in there with her.. crazy to think that way huh? It is.. but that's where my mind goes.

[msgatorslayer]

I think during spring/early summer Cindy was trying to get Casey to be more responsible for Caylee. That plus, doesn't Ricardo say she started partying then? Maybe up until that time, Cindy and GA DID watch the baby at night and/or she wasn't going out as much BEFORE this time period.

Did that make sense? Only one cup of joe.....need more.

It made more sense than saying your Daughter has a nanny but she's always dropping your Grand Daughter off to YOU at work.:tonguewag:

[Pat]

Good Morning Katie and all,

Incredible police work.

I'm still trying to figure out why she would put Caylee in a laundry bag first and where did she get the laundry bag? I really question now whether or not Caylee was murdered at home in her bed.

Those documents were very disturbing to read. What a monster.

'Morning n/t. Someone upthread theorized the laundry bag was used to make it appear Casey was taking laundry out to the car in case anyone noticed, and later lb was put inside black garbage bag.

Sounds logical to me.

[Beach~Tenant]

G'mornin all

Can someone guide me to the link where Cindy's co workers are interviewed? I am so far behind on all the posts!
tia....

Jess

[AMS]

Someone pointed out on another site that it looks like she has a Pooh blanket in this picture.

http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=407658895&albumID=436150&imageID=1708381#

[Regina.Lampert]

Ms G.. let me ask ya something.. this bothers me bunches. We know that Casey drug that baby out and about w/her plenty.. Yet her parents were home at night. Why did she do that.. ? Why ruin her own self centered fun when leaving the child at home w/the grandparents asleep made so much more sense. Yet, she was fine to leave Caylee over at the Grunds?? Just seems that the grandp's would have said.. Look girl... go on and go party whatever you want to do, but leave that baby here.. No need to take her w/ya.. you'll have more fun alone..

I know where you're going Tam Could it be that casey anthony did not want Caylee subjected to the "actions" of george and cynthia, the same way she was?

[Motomom]

How could anybody could cut duct tape with a table knife? I have a hard enough time cutting it with a sharp blade of any kind.

I don't know the statistics but I think I remember hearing that with murdering mothers drowning, suffocation, and poisoning are the common patterns, messy deaths aren't.

Casey's friend mentions in the docs that Casey had commented about giving the baby some medicine to sleep. Had there not been ducttape around her head, I'd have thought it was simply overdose,whether on purpose or not.. But then we have ducttape and stickers..

[jammies]

It made more sense than saying your Daughter has a nanny but she's always dropping your Grand Daughter off to YOU at work.:tonguewag:


lol well thanks for that......I think :laugh:

[margaritaville]

There would be no way in the world I would have been able to even crawl back to work after smelling that car! The cover up started way too soon in my opinion. Not a normal reaction to a new discovery.
I believe that Cindy & George knew something before the car was found. Going back to work would not be normal when you find your car smelling like a dead body.
They might not have known all the details and maybe they were just piecing things together trying to figure out where Caylee was but, when the car was found they knew what they had been suspecting in my opinion. Went back to work acting like nothing significant had happened. Casually mentioning to co-workers your car smells like a dead body
Just don't add up. Maybe the immunity they are requesting dates back to mid June.
Cindy does not appear to be passive in her actions only when she directly deals with Casey. I believe Cindy and Casey had few conversations per telephone or myspace to let Cindy know something bad had happened.

The writing from Cindy July 3 about Caylee missing and Casey's writing around July 6th or 7th. Everyone Lies everyone Dies. Strikes me of little of what they conversed about. jmo.

the only problem i have with cindy "knowing" Caylee was dead prior brings up the question of why did she call the police on the 15th?
If she knew Casey killed Caylee, why get the police involved just to try and cover it up??

moo

[AJandTam]

I don't think that they ever thought she would kill her. I imagine that would have been the last thing on her mind. So making it inconvenient to party was their way IMO of hoping she would stop. Just because she lived at home, doesn't mean that CA and GA should be there watching caylee all the time. Even if it's at night. Maybe they were tired of her partying and didn't want to be a part of it, thinking maybe Casey had enough sense not to involve her daughter? Or maybe they had no idea and Casey left the house in the mornings and didn't come home to give CA a chance to tell her to leave the baby there?

That just doesn't work for me. We worry to much. We have enough worries w/thinking about the stuff our own kids are doing. Worried they'll drink and drive.., Get drunk and sexually assaulted by another drunk... Oh the worries we have.. Our minds go insane thinking about youthful mistakes we ourselves made.. Putting a small child in the middle of hormones and possibilities just doesn't sound right to me for a middle aged couple.. JMO When your childs out w/what my granny used to call the "Dry Cow", which means .. When you got a youngin Caseys age laying out at all hours of the night. You are not stupid.. You know what's going on..

[Daffodil]

Ok, I have read the documents and I have read about the telephone pings.
How did Casey get Caylee out of the house if she was killed at home?

Telephone records show Casey talked to TonE basically all night early morning. Pings show she never left the immediate area. If she was spotted at the hotel in the early a.m. on the 16th the pings would still register on the same tower that her home pinged.

I don't believe George saw them before he went to work.

If Casey left with Caylee on the night of the 15th she was still close to the home cell tower. How did she get the pooh blanket, laundry bag, out of the house without Cindy noticing she had those items.

If she killed Caylee later in the afternoon of the 16th after George went to work. Casey had time to cool off from the argument her and Cindy had the night before. So if killing Caylee that afternoon then I would say premeditated murder.

My bolding. Maybe Cindy did notice. Maybe she was right there and saw Casey remove Caylee. Maybe she knew Caylee was dead. Maybe not. Maybe she removed Caylee on the 15th while George was still at work.

[playnice]

Another reason I believe now they knew the truth the night they found Casey is because 4 people used the wrong date.
A week earlier . I can see 1 getting it wrong but all 4? And I believe they chose that date in hopes it didnt come out about the fight. They were just one big happy family.
Yep I really believe now they had a story planned WHEN Cindy called 911 .Especially now that the co workers statements have come out.

[Barbara fl.]

Great post. Exactly how I think.....at THIS moment. I even can understand washing the pants. I have an obsession about laundry and used to go through my kids cars to get their dirty clothes. For me, it's theraputic and I'm not OCD like Cindy.


I too go thru the cars and everywhere looking for dirty cloths...but I really don't think I would have touched anything in that car with smelling that odor...I don't think that I would have been thinking about dirty laundry at a time like that.....And to go to work? No way would I have gone anywhere till I knew that everyone in my family was OK....I have stayed home for alot less then that...and anyone who knows me would tell you that before I retired, I was a workaholic...But when something is troubling me (as this would have) I would not have been able to even drive to my job more less work......

But, I understand that everyone is different and everyone reacts in a different way...

I remember that Lee had told LE that the smell even came into the house from the garage.....I would have been freaking out....

[Jeepers]

His gd is missing and he and Cindy go to work..Wow, I would take off from work if my dog was missing.

Me too, I love my fur faced babies.
That is why I said they started covering up too soon. They had already put the pieces together that something bad had happened to Caylee.
Casey I believe gave Cindy enough verbal hints throught texting, myspace and phone calls to let her know something was wrong.
Cindy and George just automatically react to getting the car back, going back to work still knowing but not really knowing. Cindy finds Casey and reality that Casey really did do something to Caylee Cindy then panics and starts threatening her with LE.
They were shocked but not completely taken off guard. They knew something was wrong. When Cindy gets Casey home and Lee starts talking with Casey that is Cindy's reality moment she calls 911 this time for Caylee not the car, not the money.
I believe Cindy and George had already mentally prepared before the car was found. They just seemed so automatic in their behaviors. jmo

[margaritaville]

They knew. Didnt report it so they could find Casey and hear her version. If cindy hadnt told her co workers what was going on I doubt she would have called 911. Im not so sure when the 911 call was made they hadnt already decided to say the nanny kidnapped her.

Of course cindy would still have been hysterical even if she figured out Casey killed Caylee. I think the cover up started the minute Cindy found Casey. Why didnt Cindy ask to see Caylee at TonE's? Becuase she already knew .

If she was covering it up from the moment she found Casey, why did she call the police?

[playnice]

If she was covering it up from the moment she found Casey, why did she call the police?

You dont think eventually one of the co workers wouldnt have called the cops when they never saw Caylee again?

[jammies]

My bolding. Maybe Cindy did notice. Maybe she was right there and saw Casey remove Caylee. Maybe she knew Caylee was dead. Maybe not. Maybe she removed Caylee on the 15th while George was still at work.


Any of those items found w/Cayee's remains could have been in Casey's car. She probably just threw everything in the laundry bag and disposed of her. Laundry bag could very well have originally been in her car also. I don't believe Cindy had anything to do with disposing of Caylee.

[OneUp]

I would imagine it is hard for ANY human representing someone like Casey, especially when we find out a little heart shaped sticker was stuck to duct tape that covers a 2 yr olds mouth, and possibly her nose too. When I read that stuff yesterday, my chest physically hurt. Felt like someone had punched me because IMO you see that sort of thing with serial killers, not moms who kill. It's so very very disturbing and knowing she had her pooh blanket in that trashbag..yet not her favorite doll...not that anything would make you feel better about the death of anyone, let alone the murder of a child..but somehow knowing she didn't care enough to put something she cherished in there with her.. crazy to think that way huh? It is.. but that's where my mind goes.
I understand what you're saying completely Moto...I felt the same way.
Tho. some of the items at the dump site ( I'll not dignify it by calling it anything else...that's EXACTLY what it was to Casey IMO) seem to be left there "for" caylee by Casey...I don't think so for one second. Even Ricardo and Tony Lazarro's buddies knew that Caylee had a babydoll she took everywhere. The ONE thing everyone seemed to know she loved best was kept from her in her death. That, to me, seems to be one final cruelty.
There's no love in dumping your baby in a garbage sack, in the woods, with duct tape over her little mouth...heart sticker or no sticker, this was an act devoid of love for Caylee.
God bless that precious child! I suspect that her life had no more real love in it than the hollow gesture of a heart sticker as well!
JMO.

[msgatorslayer]

I would imagine it is hard for ANY human representing someone like Casey, especially when we find out a little heart shaped sticker was stuck to duct tape that covers a 2 yr olds mouth, and possibly her nose too. When I read that stuff yesterday, my chest physically hurt. Felt like someone had punched me because IMO you see that sort of thing with serial killers, not moms who kill. It's so very very disturbing and knowing she had her pooh blanket in that trashbag..yet not her favorite doll...not that anything would make you feel better about the death of anyone, let alone the murder of a child..but somehow knowing she didn't care enough to put something she cherished in there with her.. crazy to think that way huh? It is.. but that's where my mind goes.

Darlie and Darin Routier buried their boys with a pocket knife. One of the boys had been wanting one so....Didn't matter that they were both brutally knifed to death by their mom.

"A belief in a supernatural source of evil is not necessary; men alone are quite capable of every wickedness." - Joseph Conrad.

It doesn't surprise me that Casey wrapped her in a blankie. That is very common in filicide cases. It's the motherly instinct. To wrap the body in a cocoon. Kinda representing the womb. This was done for a sick, Casey need. Not for Caylee. Caylee didn't matter. That is why she didn't give her the doll. IMO

[aubrey04]

I guess I missed alot...thought I was up on almost everything.....

My question now is, how could Cindy have even thought to go to work after smelling the odor of death in Casey's car and not have seen or spoken to her granddaughter in over a month?.....I would have been a basket case....JMO For some reason I always thought that it all took place in that one evening....

Yes and it seems her co-workers were extremely alarmed. So much so - they flat out told her to go home and find out what was going on, but she insisted she had a lot of work to do.. then her boss told her to go home and find out what was going on.. and she left. finally.

That's just odd. jmo.

[Regina.Lampert]

the only problem i have with cindy "knowing" Caylee was dead prior brings up the question of why did she call the police on the 15th?
If she knew Casey killed Caylee, why get the police involved just to try and cover it up??

moo

Because she blabbed to her coworkers who sent her home to call 911, imo.

[cassidy]

Casey's friend mentions in the docs that Casey had commented about giving the baby some medicine to sleep. Had there not been ducttape around her head, I'd have thought it was simply overdose,whether on purpose or not.. But then we have ducttape and stickers..

Not directing this at you but using the word "you" in a general context. I don't understand why some find overdosing a child into sleep as more acceptable than killing a child? How can you "accidently" overdose and kill a child when you are giving them medications they aren't supposed to have? Maybe Casey gave Caylee xanax 99 times before the 100th time it killed her, That doesn't excuse the 99 times before nor does it make the 100th time an "accident". IF she od'd her daughter with any substance, it equates to murder in my book. Am I missing something here?

JMO

[AJandTam]

I know where you're going Tam Could it be that casey anthony did not want Caylee subjected to the "actions" of george and cynthia, the same way she was?

Yes, this is very correct. There is something bad wrong w/the big picture here. G and C's stories don't match thier actions and they don't match Casey's either. Miss Self Centered who is in total control of her parents actually drags a small child out to the parties w/her... G and C have planted ideas in everyones head, and everyones going w/those ideas.. It doesn't add up.. somethings wrong here.

[Barbara fl.]

Hey, there is ice on my car this morning. :chicken:

I'd go too. If it was close. I was looking forward to going to the Couey trial till it got moved all the way down to Miami.


There was ice on my car this morning also...20 degrees here in Ocala...I made my granddaughter put her longies on under her clothes...she wasn't to happy to do that......

I heard at one point that it would possibly be held in Jacksonville....that's a little too far for me to go....Imagine if they hold it in Ocala?....We have a large court house here (well large for this area)...but thats wishful thinking....

I just can not see them traveling too far each day...This trial is going to last a long time....

[Regina.Lampert]

His gd is missing and he and Cindy go to work..Wow, I would take off from work if my dog was missing.

Amen Sista! A few years ago, Hub and I were up until the wee hours, racing and running thru the neighborhood searching for our neighbor's doggie.

Something very, very wrong with the anthony's entire story here, imo. :mad:

[msgatorslayer]

lol well thanks for that......I think :laugh:

YW. Yes, what you said made sense. There was alot of tension in that house over Casey. Let's face it. George and Cindy already raised their kids. They should not have been tied down by a Grand Daughter. Especially, if they believed, like they've said, that Casey was working for Universal as an Event planner and had her own Nanny.

I think George got tired of it before Cindy. And it caused alot of friction. I think Cindy feels alot of guilt now and that she blames herself.

[NYGalPal]

Because she blabbed to her coworkers who sent her home to call 911, imo.

They had to talk her into calling 911. Mind blowing.

Don't kill me for asking, but where did she think her granddaughter was for a month????

[margaritaville]

You dont think eventually one of the co workers wouldnt have called the cops when they never saw Caylee again?

Not if Cindy told them Caylee was living with her other grandparents...
Or Father ...

why the police at that point..
Heck her co-workers?? Tell them Caylee is at home.. How would they know the difference?? Tell them Casey moved with Caylee to another state.... The way the Anthony's lie she could have come up with something...

I mean while she was missing cindy had her in Florida, Texas, California, north Carolina, New York........Puerto Rico! cindy could have covered this up.....

I don't think she really knew until after she called the police and after she heard all the lies that Casey told about Caylee's where abouts....

Moo

[OneUp]

This is what angers me, mommy and daddy knew the OC was not working, imo. They should have taken that car away and stopped paying for the cell phone. If they had done those two simple things, Caylee may be alive today.

And yes I know hindsight is 20/20.....that's why I'm so good at it.

:sneaky:I would have thought of cutting off her "toys" that enabled her social life first too Reggie! That really seems weird to me! To have not ever seemed to have considered telling her to pay her own cell bill and car expenses, and then cutting them off if she failed to do so ( with her LaDiDa job as an event s planner :rolleyes:...)...that seems obvious to me if one wishes their child to grow up and begin acting responsible. Everything these parents did seems totally bassackwards to my way of thinking tho...every single thing.
It's easy enough to accept SOME of their behavior as simply being "different" than you and I, but in it's totality, it makes them appear to have some very skewed family dynamics going on...who was REALLY in charge in that house?...and WHY did the adults paying the bills NOT hold the power?
JMO.

[kitty1182]

CAn someone post the one that has the co-workers statements, please?
I read it yesterday, forgot now where I found it..
Thanks!:wub:

[Barbara fl.]

Not directing this at you but using the word "you" in a general context. I don't understand why some find overdosing a child into sleep as more acceptable than killing a child? How can you "accidently" overdose and kill a child when you are giving them medications they aren't supposed to have? Maybe Casey gave Caylee xanax 99 times before the 100th time it killed her, That doesn't excuse the 99 times before nor does it make the 100th time an "accident". IF she od'd her daughter with any substance, it equates to murder in my book. Am I missing something here?

JMO


I agree 100%...what ever happened to the days that you tire a child out with activities...I hate to give the children medication when they need it more less when they don't need it.....

I would think that exposing a child to strong medications at an early age that they would become addicted to it......

And YES, even if that was the case, I would still say she murdered her child...JMO

[msgatorslayer]

There was ice on my car this morning also...20 degrees here in Ocala...I made my granddaughter put her longies on under her clothes...she wasn't to happy to do that......

I heard at one point that it would possibly be held in Jacksonville....that's a little too far for me to go....Imagine if they hold it in Ocala?....We have a large court house here (well large for this area)...but thats wishful thinking....

I just can not see them traveling too far each day...This trial is going to last a long time....

J'Ville was predicted for the Couey trial as well. Initially. I remember that because I thought it would be easy for me to attend if I wanted to take a few days vacation. My BFF's Mom lives there.

I'm not gonna even try to predict cause it can change, so fast.

[NYGalPal]

The current National Enquirer online is claiming that Casey told her boyfriend TonE L. that Caylee was the result of rape, FWIW.

Not sure this is true given it comes from the NE. Didn't Casey sleep around a lot?

More news coming up on the Today Show.

[margaritaville]

Not directing this at you but using the word "you" in a general context. I don't understand why some find overdosing a child into sleep as more acceptable than killing a child? How can you "accidently" overdose and kill a child when you are giving them medications they aren't supposed to have? Maybe Casey gave Caylee xanax 99 times before the 100th time it killed her, That doesn't excuse the 99 times before nor does it make the 100th time an "accident". IF she od'd her daughter with any substance, it equates to murder in my book. Am I missing something here?

JMO

No you are not, and I agree with you 100%

[CelticDawn]

I think during spring/early summer Cindy was trying to get Casey to be more responsible for Caylee. That plus, doesn't Ricardo say she started partying then? Maybe up until that time, Cindy and GA DID watch the baby at night and/or she wasn't going out as much BEFORE this time period.

Did that make sense? Only one cup of joe.....need more.


by the time I was caseys age I had my first two..married....but still went out a lot....My parents actually urged us to go out!!!....said it would save our family if we didnt stay cooped up.....I dont understand this familys' dynamics at all....I know that casey was single and with a child that she allegedly didn't want....but it seems to me that there is a balance between being a parent and being yourself...that Cindy failed to se.....This doesnt excuse ANY of Cindys behaviour of course....but this whole relationship is just so wrong ....IMO Of course....

[PuffDragon]

Barb. I am going to get into so much trouble over this. So much trouble.. You know what. This is the same women who could run around w/that babies picture all over her vehicle, tshirt, purse ect and carry on about a kidnapping knowing full well that child was NOT kidnapped. I am convinced in my own mind they knew. THEY have been putting out thier own version of events this whole time. Short of the doc's.. their opinion has dominated the airwaves.. What are they really capable of... We have to ask ourselves that.. We really do. They are fake and do alot of acting... How much of what we have seen is acting. I wonder..
<snipped to address>


Is it possible that right from the beginning dear Jose told them that it didn't matter what they thought, nothing was proven and if they wanted to save Casey they had better support her completely and come out in public with the story that they believed the Zanny cersion and knew that Caylee was still alive and would come home. After acting like that long enough they might even have begun to believe it at a certain level. :crying:

[NYGalPal]

OMG, a heart shaped sticker under the duct tape. Winnie the poo blanket and toys.

[AJandTam]

Is it possible that right from the beginning dear Jose told them that it didn't matter what they thought, nothing was proven and if they wanted to save Casey they had better support her completely and come out in public with the story that they believed the Zanny cersion and knew that Caylee was still alive and would come home. After acting like that long enough they might even have begun to believe it at a certain level. :crying:

There is absolutely NO WAY that JOSE or anyone can turn those two people into the type of people they are. Jose is not Jesus..

[Barbara fl.]

I agree with you, God only knows if cynthia hadn't blabbed to her coworkers, who urged her to call 911 if she really would have once she picked up casey?

I'm not letting george off the hook either, as a professional he knew what that smell was and for him to return to work is disgusting.

All they cared about was themselves really, how they felt, how things looked for them? Where the heck was the concern for the one truly vulnerable and defenseless person in this nightmare, Caylee?

How this awful family failed that little girl, absolutely appalling. imo


I certainly agree with you post.....

[jammies]

This is what angers me, mommy and daddy knew the OC was not working, imo. They should have taken that car away and stopped paying for the cell phone. If they had done those two simple things, Caylee may be alive today.

And yes I know hindsight is 20/20.....that's why I'm so good at it.

:sneaky:

This is EXACTLY what I told my friend whose son is doing the same crap. THey pay for his car, insurance, cell phone, etc. etc. WTH? No job. Sells drugs, steals from them. Same story and it has me SO worried as he's a male version of Casey. (except he doesn't pretend to work)
There are SOOO many parents who do this thinking they are "helping" or just don't have the nerve to deal and meet the problems head on.
I'm not that type.....I blow my top and go ballistic. Yet at the same time, I can sort of understand when you have a child that is so messed up it's overwhelming and many parents don't have anyone to turn to.


It's so common now where parents do not let their kids grow up, coddle them, cover up for them, etc etc. We have friends whose 27 yr old, perfectly capable, intelligent son lives in their basement and they still pay for everything. It's just crazy out there!!


Oh, and btw, in every case that I personally know of, the parents are similar to Cindy in that they are obsessed with what "everyone will think".

[Barbara fl.]

Is it possible that right from the beginning dear Jose told them that it didn't matter what they thought, nothing was proven and if they wanted to save Casey they had better support her completely and come out in public with the story that they believed the Zanny cersion and knew that Caylee was still alive and would come home. After acting like that long enough they might even have begun to believe it at a certain level. :crying:


It's probably what happened....However, it was too late, statements were already made publicly as well as to LE....I don't think they will be able to retract everything that was said....(at least no jury would buy it)......JMOO

[OneUp]

Not directing this at you but using the word "you" in a general context. I don't understand why some find overdosing a child into sleep as more acceptable than killing a child? How can you "accidently" overdose and kill a child when you are giving them medications they aren't supposed to have? Maybe Casey gave Caylee xanax 99 times before the 100th time it killed her, That doesn't excuse the 99 times before nor does it make the 100th time an "accident". IF she od'd her daughter with any substance, it equates to murder in my book. Am I missing something here?

JMO
NO. I don't think that even the OP really finds overdosing/incorrectly dosing a child to get her to sleep much more acceptable than intentional murder. There ARE certainly some who seem more "comfortable" with that than with a directly intentional act like smothering, esp. in the context of a parent harming a child. For the obvious reason that NO ONE wants to believe that bond of trust between parent and child is violated willingly and actively. It is a very basic taboo in our society ( and with good reason!).
Regardless of either method that ended in death...we are talking about an adult deciding that their need for freedom and privacy is more important than the very life of their child. Their own precious child that relies on them for protection and for the very fact of their existance! It's just heinous and inexcusable to me either way! I hope ANYONE who has every made the mistake of medicating their children for their own convenience takes heed and stops to think about how selfish that act really is...your few minutes of easy time could be the death of your child...even with OTC meds. It's crazy that apparently there ARE a significant number of perople who think the risk is worth the reward!
Sorry that turned into a mini lecture peeps! I just feel strongly too about the POV that dosing a child to sleep and the "accidental" death is somehow less ugly...either thing represents a vile level of self indulgence and lack of regard for the child IMO.
JMO.

[Barbara fl.]

Yes and it seems her co-workers were extremely alarmed. So much so - they flat out told her to go home and find out what was going on, but she insisted she had a lot of work to do.. then her boss told her to go home and find out what was going on.. and she left. finally.

That's just odd. jmo.


Just goes to show....If her coworkers and boss were alarmed...how can the family not be? :confused:

[kitty1182]

CAn someone post the one that has the co-workers statements, please?
I read it yesterday, forgot now where I found it..
Thanks!:wub:



bump:tonguewag:

[shelbar53]

Once again im late for the party so dont know if this was discussed but I found it interesting. {plant job? oops did I say that outloud?}

1. Dr henry Lee first evidence inspection at 1018 Nov 14th
2. 1248 Dr Lee, Mr.Baez and Mr Phlegar left the forensic for lunch
3. Dr Henry Lee second evidence inspection at 1415
4. after the inspection we {LE} found the following trace evidence {3 hairs}
5. Dr. Lee third inspection of the evidence..Dr. Lee found a hair in the trunk
6. 1610 Dr Lee left the office
7. 1740 after dr. lee left, LE conducted a re-inspection of evidence {looks like several more hairs and fibers were found that were not there before.

Im reading it as, after Lee, Baez and Phlegar examined the evidence additional hairs and fibers were found by LE that weren't there before their little visit. {IMO}

starts on page 3205 of LE numbering

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530363.pdf

[NYGalPal]

Just goes to show....If her coworkers and boss were alarmed...how can the family not be? :confused:

It blows my mind they were not.

[shelbar53]

CAn someone post the one that has the co-workers statements, please?
I read it yesterday, forgot now where I found it..
Thanks!:wub:

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530380/detail.html

get your magnifying glasses out to read it

[desmom]

CAn someone post the one that has the co-workers statements, please?
I read it yesterday, forgot now where I found it..
Thanks!:wub:

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530380/detail.html

Begins on the bottom of type page #5 or penciled page number 3066

[Jeepers]

I would imagine it is hard for ANY human representing someone like Casey, especially when we find out a little heart shaped sticker was stuck to duct tape that covers a 2 yr olds mouth, and possibly her nose too. When I read that stuff yesterday, my chest physically hurt. Felt like someone had punched me because IMO you see that sort of thing with serial killers, not moms who kill. It's so very very disturbing and knowing she had her pooh blanket in that trashbag..yet not her favorite doll...not that anything would make you feel better about the death of anyone, let alone the murder of a child..but somehow knowing she didn't care enough to put something she cherished in there with her.. crazy to think that way huh? It is.. but that's where my mind goes.

No it is not crazy. I am all about comfort items. I have things all through my house, little things that friends has given me over the years. I like looking at them when I pass by.
Caylee loved her baby doll, her baby brought her comfort and security. It would be natural for her to have baby doll with her.
My children are grown and gone, but when they were small they had their special toys and still have some of them at their houses.
I have two mini schnauzers and they have their special toys, when we travel they make sure their little toys are with them.

Casey likes to talk about no one to comfort her.... Well she did not give comfort a second thought when it came to Caylee.

"WTH" a heart sticker, that was an after thought moment. She put that duct tape on her then slapped that sticker on her little mouth that is an after thought. She thought that would send some sort of message to Cindy or maybe even to Little Caylee. Premeditated:cursing:

[Neffy]

I agree with you, God only knows if cynthia hadn't blabbed to her coworkers, who urged her to call 911 if she really would have once she picked up casey?

I'm not letting george off the hook either, as a professional he knew what that smell was and for him to return to work is disgusting.

All they cared about was themselves really, how they felt, how things looked for them? Where the heck was the concern for the one truly vulnerable and defenseless person in this nightmare, Caylee?

How this awful family failed that little girl, absolutely appalling. imo

ITA with you there.

This whole what Cindy and George knew and when.
Their story has crumbled.
Cindy had her suspicions right from the get go.
George is LE and he knew.
The fight between Casey and George is now revealed.
I wonder if that's why Casey and Cindy were in contact and George and Casey were not.

This is probably what was meant by Casey's, I didn't tell them anything statement.

They were all fighting.
Cindy was tired of watching Caylee all the time.
They were both tired of being her sole financial support also.

Cindy and George both indicated other wise as if it were something they'd never thought about just accepted.

This accounts alot for why no one wanted to give any details to anyone to help find Caylee.

They wanted ONLY her picture out there and George to drive that stupid billboard. Let's only talk about what Caylee looks like and keep it only on what Caylee looks like.

Keep everything else under wraps.

[margaritaville]

Once again im late for the party so dont know if this was discussed but I found it interesting. {plant job? oops did I say that outloud?}

1. Dr henry Lee first evidence inspection at 1018 Nov 14th
2. 1248 Dr Lee, Mr.Baez and Mr Phlegar left the forensic for lunch
3. Dr Henry Lee second evidence inspection at 1415
4. after the inspection we {LE} found the following trace evidence {3 hairs}
5. Dr. Lee third inspection of the evidence..Dr. Lee found a hair in the trunk
6. 1610 Dr Lee left the office
7. 1740 after dr. lee left, LE conducted a re-inspection of evidence {looks like several more hairs and fibers were found that were not there before.

Im reading it as, after Lee, Baez and Phlegar examined the evidence additional hairs and fibers were found by LE that weren't there before their little visit. {IMO}

starts on page 3205 of LE numbering

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530363.pdf

So in one case he "takes" the evidence in this case he is "adding" evidence??

Wouldn't surprise me at all......I am not a fan of Dr. Lee......

[Barbara fl.]

Did Lenny Padilla sign a contract with Nancy Grace? Why is he on there everynight? IMO, he serves NO purpose with his predictions....He is not LE, he is not connected to this case in any way....I'm surprised that LE haven't told [I]him[I] to be quiet....He really has nothing comcrete to say on the show......JMOO

[Motomom]

That just doesn't work for me. We worry to much. We have enough worries w/thinking about the stuff our own kids are doing. Worried they'll drink and drive.., Get drunk and sexually assaulted by another drunk... Oh the worries we have.. Our minds go insane thinking about youthful mistakes we ourselves made.. Putting a small child in the middle of hormones and possibilities just doesn't sound right to me for a middle aged couple.. JMO When your childs out w/what my granny used to call the "Dry Cow", which means .. When you got a youngin Caseys age laying out at all hours of the night. You are not stupid.. You know what's going on..

I agree with you 100%, don't get me wrong. I have just seen this happen. So I know it's possible. Casey may have did whatever she wanted with Caylee. We know she did for the simple fact that she had NO nanny, yet was leaving for work every day dropping Caylee off? I believe CA and GA loved Caylee and enjoyed her there, but in the end, she was Casey's child. The worries, I have younger kids and I can get mysself into a panic when it comes to worrying. None of it makes sense though. The dynamics of that family seem odd to alot of people.

[breezie]

Good Morning Tam! I did not sleep well. The heart sticker kept creeping into my dreams.

Your post reminded me of something I read here earlier. Someone posted something about premeditated murder and the premeditation could have happened just minutes before the actual death. IOW, no big plan of who, what, when and where. Does anyone remember the post or maybe can explain it again? TIA

Premeditation can be formed in an instant. Say you start choking someone out of rage. You know that their airway is cut off and they are struggling. If you continue, you know that death will occur. That can be considered premeditation. You know your actions will certainly cause death.

[msgatorslayer]

http://www.wftv.com/news/18530380/detail.html

Begins on the bottom of type page #5 or penciled page number 3066

Des to the rescue, lol. I was looking, Kitty. But couldn't find in. Yesterday, someone had given the direct link. LMAO, probably Des.:laugh:

[trich]

I agree 100%...what ever happened to the days that you tire a child out with activities...I hate to give the children medication when they need it more less when they don't need it.....

I would think that exposing a child to strong medications at an early age that they would become addicted to it......

And YES, even if that was the case, I would still say she murdered her child...JMO

I agree wholeheartedly!

As a parent/Mom I discouraged the use of any kind of drugs unless it was to fight infections and of course any life sustaining drugs that were necessary.

[Barbara fl.]

So in one case he "takes" the evidence in this case he is "adding" evidence??

Wouldn't surprise me at all......I am not a fan of Dr. Lee......


You took the words right out of my mouth....Could he be trying to recoup his credibility? It's not going to work....it's already been destroyed as far as I'm concerned.....

[Regina.Lampert]

They had to talk her into calling 911. Mind blowing.

Don't kill me for asking, but where did she think her granddaughter was for a month????

In the new docs there is information that cynthia told somebody that during one of her vacations, she, casey and Caylee were going away to "bond."


Happy Birthday, make sure you check out your birthday thread. :thumbsup:

[msgatorslayer]

Did Lenny Padilla sign a contract with Nancy Grace? Why is he on there everynight? IMO, he serves NO purpose with his predictions....He is not LE, he is not connected to this case in any way....I'm surprised that LE haven't told [I]him[I] to be quiet....He really has nothing comcrete to say on the show......JMOO

It seems that way, ha? He is a regular. Pretty soon, he'll be giving his take on OTHER cases.

[Motomom]

I understand what you're saying completely Moto...I felt the same way.
Tho. some of the items at the dump site ( I'll not dignify it by calling it anything else...that's EXACTLY what it was to Casey IMO) seem to be left there "for" caylee by Casey...I don't think so for one second. Even Ricardo and Tony Lazarro's buddies knew that Caylee had a babydoll she took everywhere. The ONE thing everyone seemed to know she loved best was kept from her in her death. That, to me, seems to be one final cruelty.
There's no love in dumping your baby in a garbage sack, in the woods, with duct tape over her little mouth...heart sticker or no sticker, this was an act devoid of love for Caylee.
God bless that precious child! I suspect that her life had no more real love in it than the hollow gesture of a heart sticker as well!
JMO.

Well I do think CA and GA loved her and I can't see how Casey loves anybody at this point. And I agree, not an act of kindness. Caylee was probably wrapped in the blanket, the only reason it was in there with her IMO.. because you don't forget something as important at her favorite doll when you are throwing her in a trashbag... it's so disgusting, all of it and so sad for Caylee.

[Neffy]

Once again im late for the party so dont know if this was discussed but I found it interesting. {plant job? oops did I say that outloud?}

1. Dr henry Lee first evidence inspection at 1018 Nov 14th
2. 1248 Dr Lee, Mr.Baez and Mr Phlegar left the forensic for lunch
3. Dr Henry Lee second evidence inspection at 1415
4. after the inspection we {LE} found the following trace evidence {3 hairs}
5. Dr. Lee third inspection of the evidence..Dr. Lee found a hair in the trunk
6. 1610 Dr Lee left the office
7. 1740 after dr. lee left, LE conducted a re-inspection of evidence {looks like several more hairs and fibers were found that were not there before.

Im reading it as, after Lee, Baez and Phlegar examined the evidence additional hairs and fibers were found by LE that weren't there before their little visit. {IMO}

starts on page 3205 of LE numbering

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0121/18530363.pdf


This is really questionable to say the least after his credibility has been shot.

[BJames]

Because she blabbed to her coworkers who sent her home to call 911, imo.


Good morning Regina, and I agree.

Two things stuck out for me...It sure doesn't seem that she expected to find Caylee with Casey at TonE's apartment, she didn't even ask where the child was anytime that she was there. (per TonE, his room mate nor Amy).
Second....Cindy had to come up with something because her co-workers were going to ask the next day. I find it interesting when I read Lee's version of the events in Casey's bedroom, and how it came to a 'kidnapping'. I think Cindy liked that theory...because instead of having to admit that Casey did anything to Caylee..the whole family became 'victims' at that point.
If Cindy had not called 911 to report the child as 'kidnapped'...what was she going to say when she went to work? It sure doesn't sound like the folks she talked to there were believing the Casey line even up until then...without a kidnapping story...she would have to face the fact that Casey had done something...anything.
Cindy could not have that with her 'perfect family' image...

Just my opinion of course..

[kitty1182]

Thanks for the link:thumbsup:

[margaritaville]

Did Lenny Padilla sign a contract with Nancy Grace? Why is he on there everynight? IMO, he serves NO purpose with his predictions....He is not LE, he is not connected to this case in any way....I'm surprised that LE haven't told [I]him[I] to be quiet....He really has nothing comcrete to say on the show......JMOO


I like him.....He isn't always right.but he adds character to the show....imo

[Elle]

I find it odd that GA never asks her about Caylee on the 24th when Casey "gave" him the gas cans. He was more worried about his missing gas cans than his grand daughter??? THat one just doesn't add up for me.


George said he did ask Casey about Caylee on the 24th, whether or not it's true, or if he even saw her that day is another question.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So as best you can tell, it happened between the 22nd and the 24th. someone broke in there.

GEORGE ANTHONY: Uh-huh.

That's when I saw my daughter. I was getting ready to go to work, and the garage door goes open and my daughter comes in. This is about 2:25, 2:30 in the afternoon on the 24th. As she comes in the house, and I said, Hey, how're you doing? And she says, Fine, Dad. I says, Well, what's going on? And she says, Oh, I'm just stopping home for about 10 minutes, get some clothes. I go to go back to work. Where's Caylee? She's with Zanny. And I said, OK, when are you guys coming home? She says, Oh, we'll be back home maybe late tonight or the next day.

I said, OK. Have you been talking to Mom? Oh, yes, I talk to Mom every day. I said, I know, but did you talk to Mom today? She sort of hesitated for a moment and she says, Yes. And she says, Oh, by the way, it's a shame what happened in the shed. And I said...


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,398490,00.html

[NYGalPal]

In the new docs there is information that cynthia told somebody that during one of her vacations, she, casey and Caylee were going away to "bond."


Happy Birthday, make sure you check out your birthday thread. :thumbsup:

Very bizaar. Going away to kill her daughter is what I think.