CAYLEE ANTHONY - Wednesday 12/24 Part 1

[cloe23]

Im on vacation and can only get here once a day for a little while....bit....Let me get this right!...!!! Leonard Padilla WANTED a photo shoot with Caylee's SKULL...???!!!I always thought he was a little into the fame of being involved in the search,....even gave him the benefit of the doubt as a good man who wanted to help......but this takes the cake

Lenny Lenny Lenny:sneaky:
IIRC one of his recent broadcast with some TH. He stated that he was 30days and 6miles short of finding lil Caylee. He can't be more obvious as to what his true motive it(was) jmo

[SavannahStar]

I tend to view both Cindy and George with no admiration. I base my views on seperate things but I don't sympathize with either of them more than the other.
I don't blame them for what Casey did, too many people are raised by poor parents and with poor values taught. To excuse away Casey or blame her parents for who she is wouldn't be right or fair. She made her choices and now must deal with the repercussions. I'm lucky in that my children's transgressions were mild compared to the horror the Anthonys have now. Flipping off a police officer from the back of the school bus brough down the wrath of mom... they didn't push their luck twice. I'm certain that every day for the rest of their days Cindy and George will think back and regret not punisihing Casey and not dealing with her when her actions were small but I won't bash them for then. They'll do that themselves.
I do still hold them responsible for their deliberate words and actions during the time Caylee was still assumed missing. They should have willingly done everything asked of them, a child was at stake and to waste valuable time, resources, and manpower on purpose was wrong.

I just think their hell is forever now and as long as they own up to their actions and words I think their selfinduced hell is enough of a punishment for me. If they don't or can't then perhaps a few slaps to the wrist are in order.

Wow. Just wow. Sorry I can't feel like you do about them this Christmas Eve. Or at any time, really. But....glad you find their self-induced hell enough of a punishment to satisfy you. That's so important ya know. :thumbdown:

[WillowInFlight]

Lenny Lenny Lenny:sneaky:
IIRC one of his recent broadcast with some TH. He stated that he was 30days and 6miles short of finding lil Caylee. He can't be more obvious as to what his true motive it(was) jmo

Lenny wanted more than anything to find Caylee, but I think for the wrong reasons. I think he wanted to stick it to the Anthonys

[dixie77]

Originally Posted by Nikibee

Im on vacation and can only get here once a day for a little while....bit....Let me get this right!...!!! Leonard Padilla WANTED a photo shoot with Caylee's SKULL...???!!!I always thought he was a little into the fame of being involved in the search,....even gave him the benefit of the doubt as a good man who wanted to help......but this takes the cake

=================

OMG............where did this come from? Is there a link?

[SavannahStar]

Merry Christmas Savannah. Hope you and your family enjoy the holiday.


Backattcha, Dinner Troll! Hope yours is merry and bright, and that you have a jolly good New Year as well!

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c241/Ceetveerefugees/kisses.gif

[Mimi428]

I feel very bad for the Anthony's during this Christmas time. I hope they can find some peace or solace somewhere.

JMO.

Me too, Dunnie.

[dixie77]

Originally Posted by Deb7

I read that article the other day and I wondered if rather than taking evidence if they are measuring for some sort of memorial for Caylee. Do you think maybe George and Cindy might have commissioned someone to make a memorial in their backyard for Caylee? Anyway, just a thought and JMO.

=============

Good thought but that would mean that they would be living there permanently. I dont think G & C will remain there once this is over. JMO

[KatieKates]

Wow. Just wow. Sorry I can't feel like you do about them this Christmas Eve. Or at any time, really. But....glad you find their self-induced hell enough of a punishment to satisfy you. That's so important ya know. :thumbdown:

Don't forget those wrist slaps. LOL

Merry Christmas, SavannahStar, et al.

I will keep the Anthony family in my thoughts this holiday, and hope they find moments of peace through this horrific ordeal.

[??WHATthe??]

Wow. Just wow. Sorry I can't feel like you do about them this Christmas Eve. Or at any time, really. But....glad you find their self-induced hell enough of a punishment to satisfy you. That's so important ya know. :thumbdown:

What was and is important escaped the Anthony's mind when it was most crucial... what was and is important never mattered to them...

What was and is important is Caylee Marie...

Most don't have sympathy for them, because they are and should be held accountable for their actions... no one here held a gun to their head and made them act the way they did and do the things they did...

I don't wish anyone pain and suffering... but I do believe that they put themselves in this position... short of losing their granddaughter of course... I have never believed they played a part in that...

Merry Christmas SavannahStar...:seeya:

[WillowInFlight]

Originally Posted by Deb7

I read that article the other day and I wondered if rather than taking evidence if they are measuring for some sort of memorial for Caylee. Do you think maybe George and Cindy might have commissioned someone to make a memorial in their backyard for Caylee? Anyway, just a thought and JMO.

=============

Good thought but that would mean that they would be living there permanently. I dont think G & C will remain there once this is over. JMO

And I was just thinking, would it be legal to bury her in the back yard?

[MalloryCat]

His eyebrows don't match his hair. Not that there's anything wrong with that or anything. : ) Merry Christmas MalloryCat.

Merry Christmas!!!! Yes, George is actually older than my father, so I dont look at him like that, just cant! But he's not hideous, and I can see how it appears he is the product of a henpecking wife, but oh well, If I were Cindy I would probably have some issues with his non working behind too!

[marshmallow]

Wow. Just wow. Sorry I can't feel like you do about them this Christmas Eve. Or at any time, really. But....glad you find their self-induced hell enough of a punishment to satisfy you. That's so important ya know. :thumbdown:




:thumbdown:I should have expected your comment.

please reread what I wrote and maybe you'll see I wasn't attacking them, just stating the obvious and saying that I do not feel obstruction charges are in order at this time.

[cloe23]

Lenny wanted more than anything to find Caylee, but I think for the wrong reasons. I think he wanted to stick it to the Anthonys

ITA, I wish the TH's would stop having him on their shows. It's time for Lenny to go home and get back to work, JMO. LP has long ago shown his true colors. :angry:

[rosieposett]

Merry Christas to all and a Happy New Years too. Is it just me or is Casey in a deep auto-pilot trance with no emotions. She had to be sedated when Caylee's body was found, which I think was fake. Otherwise the girl seems to be living in her own world without any fear of jail or prison. Just doesn't jive, you know. As long as she can get her jerky and reese cups she seems fine and dancy. Nothing is bothering her.jmo

[WillowInFlight]

Merry Christmas!!!! Yes, George is actually older than my father, so I dont look at him like that, just cant! But he's not hideous, and I can see how it appears he is the product of a henpecking wife, but oh well, If I were Cindy I would probably have some issues with his non working behind too!

Oh for sure, wasn't it George and his addiction that caused the major financial problems in the first place? Then you have Casey who thought nothing of digger the whole a little deeper.

[??WHATthe??]

ITA, I wish the TH's would stop having him on their shows. It's time for Lenny to go home and get back to work, JMO. LP has long ago shown his true colors. :angry:

Now... Now Cloe! Stop that! That means we have to take him back... you can keep him!!!:lol:

One of Sactown's pride and joy... barf OMGoodness, did I just say that...???

[KatieKates]

In a way, though, I think they did play a part in that. Because if you look at all the times Cindy threw it up in Casey's face about how bad a mother she was, all the times Cindy rubbed it in that she was a better mother to Caylee than Casey was, all the times that she used Caylee as a weapon against Casey, Casey would not have been so jealous of this child and her parents' affections toward her. She was instrumental in that her twisting the knife may have driven Casey to harm Caylee in order to get even with her mother.

Again, no matter what, these people have to answer to their higher power in all of this and they are the ones that have to live with what they did or neglected to do. All of them.

I disagree. If my daughter decided to hide her pregnancy from me and then expect ME to take care of her and her baby you can bet she wouldn't get off so easy. Casey was her mother, she should have acted like it and not expected her mother to pay the way.

And I think we ALL will answer to a higher power. Not just the Anthony's.

Merry xmas.

[??WHATthe??]

In a way, though, I think they did play a part in that. Because if you look at all the times Cindy threw it up in Casey's face about how bad a mother she was, all the times Cindy rubbed it in that she was a better mother to Caylee than Casey was, all the times that she used Caylee as a weapon against Casey, Casey would not have been so jealous of this child and her parents' affections toward her. She was instrumental in that her twisting the knife may have driven Casey to harm Caylee in order to get even with her mother.

Again, no matter what, these people have to answer to their higher power in all of this and they are the ones that have to live with what they did or neglected to do. All of them.

While I truely believe that parents do influence how a child is molded... I refuse to hold them accountable for her actions... that's just not fair IMO...:wink:

Edited to add: Unless they can prove that she was a severely abused child, which I just do see at this point!

[KatieKates]

Yes, but you are thinking like a sane and rational person. Casey is not rational. She has some major personality flaw or sociopathy or schitzophrenia or something that doesn't make her think like you and I so what makes sense to her, doesn't to us. Casey was jealous of that baby and the fact that she was Caylee's mother, doesn't change that. To Casey, Caylee was the competition.

I totally agree with that, but Cindy couldn't see that coming, IMO. I'm sure it was the farthest thing from her mind that Casey would ever harm her. MOO

[Lavenia]

Originally Posted by Nikibee

Im on vacation and can only get here once a day for a little while....bit....Let me get this right!...!!! Leonard Padilla WANTED a photo shoot with Caylee's SKULL...???!!!I always thought he was a little into the fame of being involved in the search,....even gave him the benefit of the doubt as a good man who wanted to help......but this takes the cake

=================

OMG............where did this come from? Is there a link?

Happy Holidays, Dixie!

Yeah, there's a link somewhere, (I'm on link strike, though!). It was during the Tim Milller/LP "feud" about LP searching Blanchard Park. TM didn't want to search the water, saying he had sent his sonar in and saw nothing of significance, and LP was trying to get him to, saying something along the lines of "Just think of how much money we'll make with media taking a picture of you with your hand on Cayee's skull." (loosely) Not good. TM levied that charge against LP on NG one night and LP didn't deny it, he just went on to another subject.

[WillowInFlight]

Yes, but you are thinking like a sane and rational person. Casey is not rational. She has some major personality flaw or sociopathy or schitzophrenia or something that doesn't make her think like you and I so what makes sense to her, doesn't to us. Casey was jealous of that baby and the fact that she was Caylee's mother, doesn't change that. To Casey, Caylee was the competition.

I think the only personality disorders Casey has is she is emotionally and mentally immature, who was used to using vindictiveness as a way of getting what she wanted. I think she knew things about George that Cindy didn't know and held it over his head. I think she learned at a very young age how to manipulate. And I think she was a pro at it.

[cloe23]

Now... Now Cloe! Stop that! That means we have to take him back... you can keep him!!!:lol:

One of Sactown's pride and joy... barf OMGoodness, did I just say that...???

My post is unfair. I got to thinking about it, who am I to will someone to go back to work as I sit and watch TV, read and blog.
Sorry Lenny:mellow: If only he would cut the public shows, was he really offered a movie or a book deal???

[Lavenia]

Now... Now Cloe! Stop that! That means we have to take him back... you can keep him!!!

One of Sactown's pride and joy... barf OMGoodness, did I just say that...???

Well it's your turn anyway. :tonguewag: The first time I laid eyes on him I just *knew* he was going to be from good old TX, but, ding, ding, ding! YOU get the jackpot! :biggrin:

[??WHATthe??]

I am not saying they are accountable. What I am saying is that it wasn't just Casey in this family that acted as catalysts to the death of this child. It was Cindy and her controlling vindictiveness (or in Casey's words "a spiteful b****), George and his indulgence in allowing his kids to run amok, and even Lee for aligning himself with his sister against their parents while at the same time sucking up to the parents which Casey had to have noticed. It was the who famdamily that played a part in the demise of this baby. IMHO.

Oh... I agree to a point January... but I dont' think anyone of them would have forcasted murder. They were extremely dysfunctional yes... but had I known them and been in their world prior to Caylee being murdered, I don't think even I would have seen that writing on the wall... Unless as a child she was harming small animals, etc... I wouldn't have viewed her as a potential murderer... :wink:

[??WHATthe??]

Well it's your turn anyway. :tonguewag: The first time I laid eyes on him I just *knew* he was going to be from good old TX, but, ding, ding, ding! YOU get the jackpot! :biggrin:

Winner... Winner... Chicken Dinner! Yeah... I guess I do get the BOOBY prize don't I... :lol:

Thank you for your support!!!!

[steffaroob4]

MSNBC is running the Dateline story again.

[Lavenia]

Winner... Winner... Chicken Dinner! Yeah... I guess I do get the BOOBY prize don't I... :lol:

Thank you for your support!!!!

De nada, amiga! :lol:

Feliz Navidad!

[Lavenia]

MSNBC is running the Dateline story again.

Thanks Steff. Missed it the first time.

Merry Christmas! You're good to us and you're appreciated!

[??WHATthe??]

De nada, amiga! :lol:

Feliz Navidad!

Same her Lavenia!!!

I gots to run peeps... everyone have a wonderful Holiday! I'll check in on you guys later just to make sure you are still all agreeing with me!!!:blink:

Goodness... I really like that bug eyed smilie!

Take Care all! See you later... :seeya:

[Deb7]

And I was just thinking, would it be legal to bury her in the back yard?

Hmmm, I wouldn't think that would be legal, but my husband is leaning over me saying "yea you can". I honestly don't know about that one.

Makes one think though.

:confused:

BTW I meant to add... I sure do like your signature. Very nice. :)

[courtsinsession]

Protocol in Florida, no one leaves when charged with 1st degree murder.


Just wait till Cindy reads a "prepared statement" from the grieving mom at the public memorial service; Don't put anything past this family

[SavannahStar]

:thumbdown:I should have expected your comment.

please reread what I wrote and maybe you'll see I wasn't attacking them, just stating the obvious and saying that I do not feel obstruction charges are in order at this time.


I read it and re-read it. What is obvious to you isn't obvious to me. And vice versa, apparently. I did think it was attacking them, but that is your prerogative, certainly. I don't feel any charges should be made against them either. Anyway, have a wonderful Christmas and New Year.

[WillowInFlight]

Hmmm, I wouldn't think that would be legal, but my husband is leaning over me saying "yea you can". I honestly don't know about that one.

Makes one think though.

:confused:

BTW I meant to add... I sure do like your signature. Very nice. :)

Thanks Deb. I'm not sure either, on one hand I think why not, then I think, what if we all wanted to do something like that. :ohmy:

[Lavenia]

Hmmm, I wouldn't think that would be legal, but my husband is leaning over me saying "yea you can". I honestly don't know about that one.

Makes one think though.

:confused:

BTW I meant to add... I sure do like your signature. Very nice. :)

It's hugely variable but most municipalities have written codes against that. There is the fear of unreported deaths, of course, but also, a lot of health concerns. Water pollution, insect activity, fear of disease spread if certain precautions aren't observed. Frankly, the funeral home industry was behind a lot of the laws, (a "captive audience" if you will) and there is a grassroots movement toward a "greener" (environmentally) burial process, with less chemicals, less cost, more familial involvement, etc. America now has a lot of different cultures in it that don't do the whole death "industry" (and it IS a HUGE industry) and they are helping to redefine new options, IMO.

That said, I don't think the A's have even considered a home burial. (Not that I know of course, I'm just thinking culturally, socially, etc.)

[SavannahStar]

What was and is important escaped the Anthony's mind when it was most crucial... what was and is important never mattered to them...

What was and is important is Caylee Marie...

Most don't have sympathy for them, because they are and should be held accountable for their actions... no one here held a gun to their head and made them act the way they did and do the things they did...

I don't wish anyone pain and suffering... but I do believe that they put themselves in this position... short of losing their granddaughter of course... I have never believed they played a part in that...

Merry Christmas SavannahStar...:seeya:

Merry Christmas to you also. I don't agree with you on some basic issues but hey that's okay. I hope your holidays are wonderful. God bless!

[Deb7]

Thanks Deb. I'm not sure either, on one hand I think why not, then I think, what if we all wanted to do something like that. :ohmy:

I searched and I only found one article. I am pretty sure it isn't in Florida though, so not sure if Florida has similar non laws. Link here...
http://www.mountainhomenews.com/story/1397399.html

Interesting to say the least.

[WillowInFlight]

It's hugely variable but most municipalities have written codes against that. There is the fear of unreported deaths, of course, but also, a lot of health concerns. Water pollution, insect activity, fear of disease spread if certain precautions aren't observed. Frankly, the funeral home industry was behind a lot of the laws, (a "captive audience" if you will) and there is a grassroots movement toward a "greener" (environmentally) burial process, with less chemicals, less cost, more familial involvement, etc. America now has a lot of different cultures in it that don't do the whole death "industry" (and it IS a HUGE industry) and they are helping to redefine new options, IMO.

That said, I don't think the A's have even considered a home burial.
I have to admit, I have always found burying the dead in the ground a disgusting practice. It's just something I don't believe in.

[Neffy]

I agree, she underestimated her daughter. But hindsight is 20/20.

Apparently Casey didn't learn that when your angry you just choke someone enough to scare them.

[daHawg]

Hmmm, I wouldn't think that would be legal, but my husband is leaning over me saying "yea you can". I honestly don't know about that one.

Makes one think though.

:confused:

BTW I meant to add... I sure do like your signature. Very nice. :)
Actually yes you can however in the A's case their property is not large enough or far away enough from water supplies. Plus all deaths must be accompanied by a signed death certificate and recorded as well.

From the link.

H) Can I bury my family on my own property?

Florida allows for the establishment of family cemeteries of less than two acres, which do not sell burial spaces or burial rights.

Check local zoning laws and deed restrictions, etc. to determine if it is allowed in the local community.

You may also wish to contact the Florida Department of Environmental Protection for any concerns they may have.

The future sale of the property should also be considered as family cemetery may place a cloud on the title.

There would also have to be adequate ingress and egress allowed for family members to visit the burial spaces.
http://www.myfloridacfo.com/funeralcemetery/fc_consumerfaq.htm

[Lavenia]

Apparently Casey didn't learn that when your angry you just choke someone enough to scare them.

I could be more forgiving if I thought Casey killed Caylee out of anger. Unfortunately, (for Casey), I think Caylee outlived her usefulness.

[sofiesmom]

I haven't posted much here, but have been here every single day...until Saturday. My computer just quit on me. We had a long power outage last Wed and I had to go to the cable co for a new modem box and everything was fine. Then on Sat., my really great Dell wouldn't power on. Long story short, I've been missing you posters so much. I've had real physical withdrawals. I took out a loan on an IRA so that I could get this crappy computer that is way too big for my setting. I'm having to learn to use a mouse and lots of things I didn't have to know about before. But, I'm so grateful to have found my In Session posters, and am looking forward to catching up on the latest on sweet little Caylee.

[WillowInFlight]

MERRY CHRISTMAS SOFIESMOM.:wub:

[Lavenia]

I haven't posted much here, but have been here every single day...until Saturday. My computer just quit on me. We had a long power outage last Wed and I had to go to the cable co for a new modem box and everything was fine. Then on Sat., my really great Dell wouldn't power on. Long story short, I've been missing you posters so much. I've had real physical withdrawals. I took out a loan on an IRA so that I could get this crappy computer that is way too big for my setting. I'm having to learn to use a mouse and lots of things I didn't have to know about before. But, I'm so grateful to have found my In Session posters, and am looking forward to catching up on the latest on sweet little Caylee.

Oh gosh, that's terrible sofiesmom! I would be in trouble for sure if that happened.

I'm glad you made it back safe and sound to us! Have a great holiday!

[norwood]

In case anyone is interested there is a program about this investigation on MSNBC right now. I just happen to turn it that channel and saw it.

[Deb7]

Actually yes you can however in the A's case their property is not large enough or far away enough from water supplies. Plus all deaths must be accompanied by a signed death certificate and recorded as well.

From the link.

H) Can I bury my family on my own property?

Florida allows for the establishment of family cemeteries of less than two acres, which do not sell burial spaces or burial rights.

Check local zoning laws and deed restrictions, etc. to determine if it is allowed in the local community.

You may also wish to contact the Florida Department of Environmental Protection for any concerns they may have.

The future sale of the property should also be considered as family cemetery may place a cloud on the title.

There would also have to be adequate ingress and egress allowed for family members to visit the burial spaces.
http://www.myfloridacfo.com/funeralcemetery/fc_consumerfaq.htm


Thank you daHawg. I found another link that kind of creeped me out a little. Link here... http://belovedhearts.com/Grief_Center/Burying_Laws.htm

Even though I realize they (that website) do seem to be sincere.
So, the Anthony's could not bury her on their property, but if they have her cremated, then they could put a little memorial out in their back yard with an urn.
I suppose (and no I'm not trying to sound rude here) they could just be building a new fence. However, under the circumstances I sort of thought the memorial made more sense (and the burial as well). Whatever the case, I suppose we will hear about it sooner or later.

[MerriMent]

In a way, though, I think they did play a part in that. Because if you look at all the times Cindy threw it up in Casey's face about how bad a mother she was, all the times Cindy rubbed it in that she was a better mother to Caylee than Casey was, all the times that she used Caylee as a weapon against Casey, Casey would not have been so jealous of this child and her parents' affections toward her. She was instrumental in that her twisting the knife may have driven Casey to harm Caylee in order to get even with her mother.

Again, no matter what, these people have to answer to their higher power in all of this and they are the ones that have to live with what they did or neglected to do. All of them.

It truly is a shame that nobody else knew that household was a toxic environment for little Caylee. Fights, stealing, gambling, yelling, choking, unemployment, debt, threats of divorce, threats of custody, lying, possible mental illness. The protective way Caylee folded herself into her great-grandfather's arms speaks volumes. She was his "sunshine" and my sympathy and prayers are for his profound loss.

If the outcome had been violence toward an adult, rather than a child, we wouldn't be here hashing it over. The Anthonys do share blame because it was their house, they helped create and participate in the dysfunction and they failed to protect Caylee. But I also think their behavior since Caylee was first reported missing reflects their enormous guilt, remorse and emotional pain. I wish them peace and courage on this day and those ahead.

Caylee is safe now. :rose:

[dixie77]

And I was just thinking, would it be legal to bury her in the back yard?

============

Since the A's live in a subdivision, i highly doubt that would be legal.

[WillowInFlight]

It truly is a shame that nobody else knew that household was a toxic environment for little Caylee. Fights, stealing, gambling, yelling, choking, unemployment, debt, threats of divorce, threats of custody, lying, possible mental illness. The protective way Caylee folded herself into her great-grandfather's arms speaks volumes. She was his "sunshine" and my sympathy and prayers are for his profound loss.

If the outcome had been violence toward an adult, rather than a child, we wouldn't be here hashing it over. The Anthonys do share blame because it was their house, they helped create and participate in the dysfunction and they failed to protect Caylee. But I also think their behavior since Caylee was first reported missing reflects their enormous guilt, remorse and emotional pain. I wish them peace and courage on this day and those ahead.

Caylee is safe now. :rose:
Wow MerriMent, great post. I think your post is how a lot of us feel.

[Lavenia]

Thank you daHawg. I found another link that kind of creeped me out a little. Link here... http://belovedhearts.com/Grief_Center/Burying_Laws.htm

Respectfully snipped>



"If you are fit and enthusiastic, it should take about three hours work to dig a four foot deep grave." I thought this wording a little suspect, lol. Are you supposed to admit you're "enthusiastic" about digging a grave? :blink:

[sunstar]

Yes, but you are thinking like a sane and rational person. Casey is not rational. She has some major personality flaw or sociopathy or schitzophrenia or something that doesn't make her think like you and I so what makes sense to her, doesn't to us. Casey was jealous of that baby and the fact that she was Caylee's mother, doesn't change that. To Casey, Caylee was the competition.
This happens more often than a lot of people probably realize, and I've also seen it with a husband becoming jealous of a child because of the attention his wife is giving the child instead of him. I'm not sure what psychological disorder it is, but if nothing else, emotional immaturity. MOO

[WillowInFlight]

We are all very saddened by caylee's being gone from this world. But ....with ehe exception of our emotions....GOD TRUMPS SANTA ANYDAY.....and caylee is now safe....
Her live here on Earth was cut much too short, but Her life in Heaven is for an Eternity. A happy safe Life....

So I am letting my emotions rule for one day.

[shelbar53]

Shhhhhhh I have a reputation to keep up ya know..

Yes, it is so true.. So very true.. and as judgemental as I may appear..that's not really how I am.. I just have a huge interest in how things like this happen. How it all spins out of control... By studying domestic murders, you learn that the people involved get caught up in things that are so very ordinary. It's not like you can see what is coming before it happens. It's just ordinary people living ordinary lives and something spins out of control and this is what you get.. whether it be something as ordinary as a love affair, a need to be free of a child , a financial desire that you have... or a domestic abuse situation that could spin out of control at any moment if you don't leave the abuser.. it's scary to stop for one minute and take a good look at your life and wonder. Is there something in your own life that could spin out of control on you and you could be the next Big Case... Would you see the warning signs coming.. Probably not, if the people in the cases that we follow could see it coming. Surely they would have done something to prevent it, right??

Just wondering how many people "spun out of control" and got away with it? This case woke me up to the reality of, just how many children under school age are murdered? The parent could just move away and none the wiser. On that note

Merry Christmas everyone. Happy holidays to all

[TeenyNRossi]

She's not schizophrenic...she hasn't shown the typical signs...religious persecution, paranoia or voices (that we know of) in her head. I've been exposed to a true schizophrenic & it is frightening. Who knows though, she may begin to exhibit those symptoms as most schizophrenics begin to show those symptoms in their early 20's. I vote for a selfish, spoiled, ociopathic Bi**h! jmo I believe this girl has never had to "own up" to anything in her life / was enabled, a princess and never learned the correct social skills.

Unfortunately, having boys at the age of 21 & 14, I've seen so many children raised this way. I understand that we all want the best for our kids & I think it is human nature or maybe evolution, to want our kids to have better & be better than we are. I think that many parents have neglected the important teachings of responsibility and how to make it on your own.

Sorry for the rant...my selfish, spoiled 14 yr old is driving me crazy with the loud music...j/k

[desmom]

Will the photo be part of the Defense Team's evidence? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,435002,00.html

Meanwhile, Baez said through his spokesman Todd Black that the defense's own investigators are out of state getting a photo of the Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez who Anthony contends took Caylee, according to MyFOXOrlando.com.

Black says the picture was taken at a park and shows the woman they say is the baby sitter, Anthony and little Caylee. It isn't known when the photo was taken.

Black said Anthony's lawyer has for weeks been trying to find the man who has the picture and after finally locating him, sent a team to interview him.

[Amy]

I just listened to the tapes of the meter reader.....and a thought occured to me......

Mr. Kronk seemed totally believable to me in the way he comes accross.

He did not specifically seem focused on a bag....he had more of a suspicion about certain things in the general area.

Most of all...he seemed compelled to search that area......and at the same time it was like he didn't even want to be doing this or having these feelings...

My first thought was some type of psychic vision, but then I remembered that his wife died of cancer a year ago.

I know some will think I am crazy but is it possible that somehow his departed wife led him to Caylee???

What I got out of his messages (@ least, the ones I was hearing, which had to have been @ least 2) was that he was not specific in his directions. Saying "the Anthony Road," the "elementary school" which he did was not able to give a name to in @ least one call. He was interspersing other stuff while he was trying to describe the road, etc. I could see where it would be difficult to dispatch someone to a specific place with such nonspecific directions.

[sunstar]

Will the photo be part of the Defense Team's evidence? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,435002,00.html

Meanwhile, Baez said through his spokesman Todd Black that the defense's own investigators are out of state getting a photo of the Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez who Anthony contends took Caylee, according to MyFOXOrlando.com.

Black says the picture was taken at a park and shows the woman they say is the baby sitter, Anthony and little Caylee. It isn't known when the photo was taken.

Black said Anthony's lawyer has for weeks been trying to find the man who has the picture and after finally locating him, sent a team to interview him.
The article was from Oct. 9. Did Baez ever get this photo? :shrug:

[WillowInFlight]

The article was from Oct. 9. Did Baez ever get this photo? :shrug:

I don't think so, it was never brought up again, I think this was around the time Casey had to turn herself in on the murder charge, and they were trying to take the focus off of her.

[TeenyNRossi]

The article was from Oct. 9. Did Baez ever get this photo? :shrug:


I imagine if he did have this photo, it would have been splashed on every news outlet possible...makes me think there is no photo...jmo

[breezie]

Will the photo be part of the Defense Team's evidence? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,435002,00.html

Meanwhile, Baez said through his spokesman Todd Black that the defense's own investigators are out of state getting a photo of the Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez who Anthony contends took Caylee, according to MyFOXOrlando.com.

Black says the picture was taken at a park and shows the woman they say is the baby sitter, Anthony and little Caylee. It isn't known when the photo was taken.

Black said Anthony's lawyer has for weeks been trying to find the man who has the picture and after finally locating him, sent a team to interview him.

Nothing nada about this since October. I would think it would be have been out there while we were still looking for a live Caylee and the kidnapper if they had it. I think it was a smoke screen and thrown out because a doc dump or the Grand Jury was coming. That was their MO. Doc dump or incriminating information released... wah lah! A new siting. Sadly, Caylee was in a garbage bag on the side of the road all that time.

[joolz]

The article was from Oct. 9. Did Baez ever get this photo? :shrug:

The invisible nanny has the invisible photo. JMO

[Lavenia]

Will the photo be part of the Defense Team's evidence? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,435002,00.html

Meanwhile, Baez said through his spokesman Todd Black that the defense's own investigators are out of state getting a photo of the Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez who Anthony contends took Caylee, according to MyFOXOrlando.com.

Black says the picture was taken at a park and shows the woman they say is the baby sitter, Anthony and little Caylee. It isn't known when the photo was taken.

Black said Anthony's lawyer has for weeks been trying to find the man who has the picture and after finally locating him, sent a team to interview him.

That was dropped as soon as it came up desmom. Shoot, if they had anything credible, AT ALL, they wouldn't wait for a trial to nip this in the bud. They're coming up snake eyes.

[Amy]

That is a strong posibility, that she did lead him to the baby.

What I am having problems with is why when he called in those tips in August, why the LE, did nothing to follow up, why they didn't ask Mr. Kronk, to meet them at the site in question, show them where the bag was.

I tho't they WERE to meet him. Was it the first call where he really didn't give very good directions, not knowing the name of the school, saying "the Anthony road." And, he DID say he wanted to be anonymous because he was afraid if there was a body there, he would be fired (altho that doesn't make much sense, either, IMO.)

It could be they went where they tho't he was directing them, but it wasn't where he was. OR, they DID get to the right place, but he did not stick around. IIRC, they did hook up on the 3rd call.

[desmom]

The article was from Oct. 9. Did Baez ever get this photo? :shrug:

I do not recall reading any more about this photo of Zanny, Casey and Caylee. I do not believe there ever was a photo...just another spin by the defense to put doubt in the public's mind.

jmo

[rbrnmw]

Just wondering how many people "spun out of control" and got away with it? This case woke me up to the reality of, just how many children under school age are murdered? The parent could just move away and none the wiser. On that note

Merry Christmas everyone. Happy holidays to all

ITA there was a case in Ohio about 18 years ago where a little boy was scalded to death and buried in the back yard for years and the horrible thing was people did call Children Services but they would make something up about the child being here or there, and CS would just leave I dont know how it came about but finally someone got suspicious and called the Sheriff and the Mother finally cracked and confessed I will look up the case and provide a link if I can find one

[Lavenia]

The invisible nanny has the invisible photo. JMO

Quick! Call the invisible tipline and tell the invisible defense! :tonguewag:

[joolz]

Quick! Call the invisible tipline and tell the invisible defense! :tonguewag:


I was going to, but I can't find my invisible phone!:laugh:

[desmom]

I imagine if he did have this photo, it would have been splashed on every news outlet possible...makes me think there is no photo...jmo

I agree! They did not hesitate to post the picture of a little girl playing in a mall all over the news and internet. IMO, this would have been front page in every major newspaper and media websites in the country.

[sunstar]

I don't think so, it was never brought up again, I think this was around the time Casey had to turn herself in on the murder charge, and they were trying to take the focus off of her.

Yes that part was also mentioned in the article. I agree about trying to get the focus off her.

[Amy]

Good morning and Merry Christmas Eve, everyone. Okay this is just me thinking but with the dumping of the bag timeline, the prosecution saying that the body was dumped shortly after death does not jive with me. And I say this because if that is so, how then do you explain the condition of the trunk when George and the tow truck guy opened it that day. The strong smell of decomposition and the presence of maggots and I know there is conflicting reports on the maggots and bugs but I seem to recollect someone on Nancy Grace and I think it may have been Dr. Kobilinsky, saying that there were maggots in that trunk.

I think that this body had been moved at least twice if not more. I think Casey may have had help in that department because I think that the place where the remains were found, was placed there by someone helping Casey out (and I have an idea who that was) while she was sitting in prison. Just think about it. If that is the case, what a better way to cast doubt on a jury and also to say "oh, look, someone else had to do it because the bag was not there back in June or July when the place was searched". The only thing that the defense forgets if they use such a strategy is that one juror (and that's all it takes) mights say "well, yeah, to me that only means she had an accomplice. It certainly does not mean that she is not guilty".

Shortly after death could be several days, I would think. Not IMMEDIATELY after death, but SHORTLY after death.

[sunstar]

I do not recall reading any more about this photo of Zanny, Casey and Caylee. I do not believe there ever was a photo...just another spin by the defense to put doubt in the public's mind.

jmo

I don't think this Zanny ever existed so whatever photo he was looking for would be somebody else in it ~ if there was any truth to this "photo" to begin with! MOO :smile:

[rbrnmw]

ITA there was a case in Ohio about 18 years ago where a little boy was scalded to death and buried in the back yard for years and the horrible thing was people did call Children Services but they would make something up about the child being here or there, and CS would just leave I dont know how it came about but finally someone got suspicious and called the Sheriff and the Mother finally cracked and confessed I will look up the case and provide a link if I can find one

here is a link
http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:llV6NW8vU5kJ:www.sconet.state.oh.us/rod/docs/pdf/0/1996/1996-ohio-179.pdf+christopher+engle+murder&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=18&gl=us&client=firefox-a

[sunstar]

The invisible nanny has the invisible photo. JMO

Why of course! The only logical explanation. :biggrin:

[rbrnmw]

here is a link
http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:llV6NW8vU5kJ:www.sconet.state.oh.us/rod/docs/pdf/0/1996/1996-ohio-179.pdf+christopher+engle+murder&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=18&gl=us&client=firefox-a

I guess it wasnt years maybe I am thinking of something else

[WillowInFlight]

I don't think this Zanny ever existed so whatever photo he was looking for would be somebody else in it ~ if there was any truth to this "photo" to begin with! MOO :smile:

I just can't believe he even ever announced anything about that picture and never said another word. I wish when he was giving his PC, someone would have asked him

[openminded]

Great post and Cindy has been manipulated by her immediate family forever, sadly George and Caseys cons were normal for her.

Women tend to be more gracious toward George because he is not hideous looking I suppose.

jmo

The reason I waffle back and forth about George is that in his interviews with the FBI and LE he gave them bits of the truth while Cindy continued to try to mislead them all the way.

[Amy]

I was just wondering if Casey told her parents that she felt Caylee was close, so if Caylee's body was found, Casey could say "See, I told you Caylee was close, the babysitter never left the area, she killed her and dumped her near our house so her remains would be found".

For some reason I think this is her defense if they stick to the kidnapper story.

Of course. Zanny had a key to the house, you know. AND, there is that little tidbit about how Casey kept a key to the car in her pocket in case Caylee was accidentally locked in. You know, Zanny probably picked that key from her pocket and used that very car, probably using it a couple of days that Casey wasn't aware of (I'll have to think a bit about how she would not know, but that's a minor detail!!!) And, of course had Caylee's body in the trunk and then put her in the woods and returned the car. And all this time, Casey was looking for Zanny in the nightclubs, and Zanny was zipping around town in Casey's own car, with her baby's body in the trunk.barf

[aubrey04]

I tend to view both Cindy and George with no admiration. I base my views on seperate things but I don't sympathize with either of them more than the other.
I don't blame them for what Casey did, too many people are raised by poor parents and with poor values taught. To excuse away Casey or blame her parents for who she is wouldn't be right or fair. She made her choices and now must deal with the repercussions. I'm lucky in that my children's transgressions were mild compared to the horror the Anthonys have now. Flipping off a police officer from the back of the school bus brough down the wrath of mom... they didn't push their luck twice. I'm certain that every day for the rest of their days Cindy and George will think back and regret not punisihing Casey and not dealing with her when her actions were small but I won't bash them for then. They'll do that themselves.
I do still hold them responsible for their deliberate words and actions during the time Caylee was still assumed missing. They should have willingly done everything asked of them, a child was at stake and to waste valuable time, resources, and manpower on purpose was wrong.

I just think their hell is forever now and as long as they own up to their actions and words I think their selfinduced hell is enough of a punishment for me. If they don't or can't then perhaps a few slaps to the wrist are in order.

Great post and I completely agree. :thumbup:

[Amy]

I think it's suspicious that Casey Anthony would say that she felt that

Caylee "was close" when asked where she thought Caylee was. Those

words are just eerie to me like Casey knew where Caylee was all along.

IMO

Suspicious, yes. Eerie? No, because Casey KNEW where Caylee was, "close to home" where she put her.

[Barbara fl.]

It must be a very sad day for that household in any case....Little Caylee should be getting ready to open Sant'as gifts and instead she is waiting to be buried.....

I hope Casey is thinking about this right now.....I wonder if she thinks it was all worth it to have her freedom...too bad her freedom from little Caylee is behind bars......And Tone is probably with someone else by now...and Casey is all alone in a lonely cell.....:crying:

[canada]

And I was just thinking, would it be legal to bury her in the back yard?

That's illegal in most places. The only way they could do that is if the remains were cremated and then scattered. If I were them I wouldn't scatter Caylee in the yard because who knows when and if they will be moving.

[sofiesmom]

Thanks so much,Willow, Lavenia,Fallen-Angel, and all. I'm having a hard time re-learning computer.

I have a question that I'm sure was asked and answered long ago, but I missed it: In any of
Casey's flurry of calls on 6/16 (iirc), was there a voice message left? This has bothered me for well, forever. Why didn 't Cindy answer her phone? Would Caylee be alive if Casey's calls were answered? I'm definately not sympathetic to Casey, I'm just wondering.

[WillowInFlight]

It must be a very sad day for that household in any case....Little Caylee should be getting ready to open Sant'as gifts and instead she is waiting to be buried.....

I hope Casey is thinking about this right now.....I wonder if she thinks it was all worth it to have her freedom...too bad her freedom from little Caylee is behind bars......And Tone is probably with someone else by now...and Casey is all alone in a lonely cell.....:crying:

I have been asking myself those same questions. Just how worth it was this?

[playnice]

It must be a very sad day for that household in any case....Little Caylee should be getting ready to open Sant'as gifts and instead she is waiting to be buried.....

I hope Casey is thinking about this right now.....I wonder if she thinks it was all worth it to have her freedom...too bad her freedom from little Caylee is behind bars......And Tone is probably with someone else by now...and Casey is all alone in a lonely cell.....:crying:

She is probably blaming Caylee because if she didnt have her none of this would be happening now and she would be free.

[Barbara fl.]

Of course. Zanny had a key to the house, you know. AND, there is that little tidbit about how Casey kept a key to the car in her pocket in case Caylee was accidentally locked in. You know, Zanny probably picked that key from her pocket and used that very car, probably using it a couple of days that Casey wasn't aware of (I'll have to think a bit about how she would not know, but that's a minor detail!!!) And, of course had Caylee's body in the trunk and then put her in the woods and returned the car. And all this time, Casey was looking for Zanny in the nightclubs, and Zanny was zipping around town in Casey's own car, with her baby's body in the trunk.barf


To you and me...that's just how rediculous it sounds....But I bet to Linda Baden, she will try and convince the jury of just that.....

What I can not understand is that Dr. Baden, was always a well respected man....How did he get tied up with Linda? They seem to be like night and day and seem to have different principals....(at least until the PS case)...That was when I totally lost all respect for the man....

I do not get it....I would never think that a man of such statute would compromise his integrety for a few bucks......I hope that Koby doesn't follow suit......The only one I would trust right now is Dr. Purper, he seems totally honest in all his opinions....

[TeenyNRossi]

It must be a very sad day for that household in any case....Little Caylee should be getting ready to open Sant'as gifts and instead she is waiting to be buried.....

I hope Casey is thinking about this right now.....I wonder if she thinks it was all worth it to have her freedom...too bad her freedom from little Caylee is behind bars......And Tone is probably with someone else by now...and Casey is all alone in a lonely cell.....:crying:


I had this same thought as I was doing kitchen prep work... I was just trying to imagine how even the coldest person could not be thinking how the holiday should be progressing now. Maybe this time will give her pause...maybe she is thinking of how badly she messed (trying not to cuss here) up & maybe, just maybe she is feeling some remorse. If she is not now....she never will! :sad:

[Barbara fl.]

She is probably blaming Caylee because if she didnt have her none of this would be happening now and she would be free.


I wouldn't doubt it.....it's just so sad.....

[Barbara fl.]

Well, I have to finish up a few things and get ready for Santa myself...So, I wish everyone a Merry Christmas....and a safe one....



God Bless.....

[sunstar]

I just can't believe he even ever announced anything about that picture and never said another word. I wish when he was giving his PC, someone would have asked him

And of course when he's on Geraldo's show he isn't going to be asked. :mad: MOO

[sunstar]

Well, I have to finish up a few things and get ready for Santa myself...So, I wish everyone a Merry Christmas....and a safe one....



God Bless.....

Have a very Merry Christmas!

[WillowInFlight]

What do you call this again? Oh, yeah. Smoke and mirrors.

YEP. I swear this trial is going to be a mess, I can see Baez screwing up royally and Casey getting a new trial.:mad:

[sunstar]

YEP. I swear this trial is going to be a mess, I can see Baez screwing up royally and Casey getting a new trial.:mad:

I'm just wondering now that she also has LKB defending her, could she really think she'd win a new trial? I just don't see the FL supreme court overturning a conviction with the experience LKB has. Or for that matter even if Baez was on his own defending her. :shrug: MOO

[Amy]

I dont think anyone had to break the news to Nancy, I am pretty sure she knew it was Caylee when a tiny body was found, shes pretty smart. I think shes emotional because of her new found motherhood.

jmo

I agree. From the get-go, pretty much everyone figured the body in the woods was Caylee. Even the defense team.

I don't think there is necessarily a pattern to Nancy's tearfulness. She is about to sob over some things that I think--WHAT is there to be so emotional about? Or, she is ricocheting off the her chair @ things that are not all that much to be excited (or bombshelled) over.

She gets some bee in her bonnet (and sometimes a "mistruth" bee) and goes on and on and on.

Like the funeral. Now, I happen to think that the policy that prevents her from attending is quite alright w/her. EVEN IF she is innocent (which I don't think she IS) there are many people in Orlando FL who are ADAMANT that she is, and I do think she would have to fear for her safety. Her protester friends who show up might not be the friendliest of folks toward her these days. Not to say that just because they are protesters that they would do her harm, but it would only take one flying off the handle to start a riot of sorts. Now, some may not care whether or not Casey would be killed if she were out for this funeral, but I certainly would prefer her to be put to trial. I'm betting she is VERY fearful for her life, and even if LE went to all the extra secuity and all--could someone hurt her?

[randyjsing]

I agree. From the get-go, pretty much everyone figured the body in the woods was Caylee. Even the defense team.

I don't think there is necessarily a pattern to Nancy's tearfulness. She is about to sob over some things that I think--WHAT is there to be so emotional about? Or, she is ricocheting off the her chair @ things that are not all that much to be excited (or bombshelled) over.

She gets some bee in her bonnet (and sometimes a "mistruth" bee) and goes on and on and on.

Like the funeral. Now, I happen to think that the policy that prevents her from attending is quite alright w/her. EVEN IF she is innocent (which I don't think she IS) there are many people in Orlando FL who are ADAMANT that she is, and I do think she would have to fear for her safety. Her protester friends who show up might not be the friendliest of folks toward her these days. Not to say that just because they are protesters that they would do her harm, but it would only take one flying off the handle to start a riot of sorts. Now, some may not care whether or not Casey would be killed if she were out for this funeral, but I certainly would prefer her to be put to trial. I'm betting she is VERY fearful for her life, and even if LE went to all the extra secuity and all--could someone hurt her?

To tell you the truth...the last time she was out she was "strutting"...all the while knowing that Caylee was in a bag in the woods decomposing...

I agree with you that she may be fearful for her life and that she could care less about having to sit in a place where all of the attention is on Caylee...to her that would be a slap in the face...for Caylee to get all of the attention while she is sitting in the room. She'd rather be in jail ordering her special treats...moo

[Amy]

Barskin, goodmorning. Think about it. Maggots means fly activity. Where are there flies in a sealed plastic garbage bag? Also, there is too much evidence of "a damn dead body in the trunk" . The stain, the maggot or "bugs" they found, I think she moved that body and I think that's why they took the soil samples from the backyard. I think there may have been different soils on or inside that bag that didn't match up with the soil at the woods. Again, flies lay eggs which turn to maggots. Where are flies? A dumpster maybe? Where was the car parked? By a dumpster.

She could have been killed, placed in the backyard, placed in the trunk and then dumped in the woods shortly after she was killed. Not IMMEDIATELY after she was killed, but shortly after she was killed. Shortly could mean a matter of days.

[Amy]

Where have you ever seen a fly inside of a garbage bag that just came off the roll? It's impossible and that's just a fact. No live fly can possibly survive being inside of a garbage bag on a fresh roll.

I am standing by my theory, that the body was moved and that Casey may have had help. And I bet you dollars to donuts someone else besides me on the defense or the prosecution team is thinking the same exact thing.

I think there are a number of posters who believe the body was moved. From the back yard, to the car, and when the smell became intrusive and everyone was noticing, she moved it one last time--to the woods. Of course there are no flies on a fresh garbage bag on a roll, there has to be an attraction when the bag is actually in use--like a decomposing body. I don't think she actually put the body in a bag @ the time she murdered her.

[GinoA797]

Of course. Zanny had a key to the house, you know. AND, there is that little tidbit about how Casey kept a key to the car in her pocket in case Caylee was accidentally locked in. You know, Zanny probably picked that key from her pocket and used that very car, probably using it a couple of days that Casey wasn't aware of (I'll have to think a bit about how she would not know, but that's a minor detail!!!) And, of course had Caylee's body in the trunk and then put her in the woods and returned the car. And all this time, Casey was looking for Zanny in the nightclubs, and Zanny was zipping around town in Casey's own car, with her baby's body in the trunk.barf

I am gonna go thru my keys IthinkIhave a key to there house also!! Great quote.. Happy Holidays All!!

[aubrey04]

I think Caylee was buried in the backyard for a few days then moved. The maggots started attracting shortly after she was buried in the backyard. Then Casey moved the body a few days later. That lines up with the facts so far:

1. The cadaver dogs hit on Casey's trunk & the backyard.
2. A body, which had been decomposing for 2.6 days, had been in Casey's trunk ~ according to the air sample tests done by the Body Farm
3. The maggots
4. Casey borrowing Brian Burner's shovel for an hour one day, plus Burner's statement that he saw Casey's car backed into the garage of the Anthony home on the 17th, 18th, 19th and 20th. Casey was unloading her body from the trunk... burying her.. then retrieving her body to dispose of in the woods.

jmo

[aubrey04]

She could have been killed, placed in the backyard, placed in the trunk and then dumped in the woods shortly after she was killed. Not IMMEDIATELY after she was killed, but shortly after she was killed. Shortly could mean a matter of days.

How about around 2.6 days.. :blink: ?

[Amy]

When did he say that? Also, just to let everyone know I just googled where maggots come from, they are the eggs of flies BUT the fly lays the egg and the egg turns into a maggot within 8-20 hours. That would put the timeline right where the prosecutors are saying. The body was dumped in the woods "shortly after death", which would give credibility (at least to me) that Casey was driving a few days with Caylee in the trunk. I WAS WRONG. :thumbdown:

I think it was an interview with a reporter on the street (as opposed to being on a talk show) during one of the heated discussions w/Cindy proclaiming that people should be looking for a live Caylee. And George chimed in that they had followed Caylee to NINE places, but that the kidnappers had always been gone by the time they got there. I always wondered if they ever indulged this info for LE to look into. LE has never responded to that remark, but then I don't recall any reporter asking (@ least in public.) I woud suppose that, if LE were informed, it might be a point brought up in trial. If they weren't informed, THEY certainly would not bring it up, and I highly doubt the defense would. I think George was just chiming in w/info he thot would substantiate Cindy's statement.

[Amy]

I know but I just thought it was weird he said 8 times and that he had gone to all those places, but we could never figure out when he went to PR.

I don't remember that he ever said WHERE---cuz that's what my question to him was--WHERE were these places, George? Did you inform LE so they could follow up? (Of course, he couldn't hear me screaming @ him, so he didn't answer me, lol.)

[rj1212]

I think it was an interview with a reporter on the street (as opposed to being on a talk show) during one of the heated discussions w/Cindy proclaiming that people should be looking for a live Caylee. And George chimed in that they had followed Caylee to NINE places, but that the kidnappers had always been gone by the time they got there. I always wondered if they ever indulged this info for LE to look into. LE has never responded to that remark, but then I don't recall any reporter asking (@ least in public.) I woud suppose that, if LE were informed, it might be a point brought up in trial. If they weren't informed, THEY certainly would not bring it up, and I highly doubt the defense would. I think George was just chiming in w/info he thot would substantiate Cindy's statement.

This is one of the reasons why I have significant issues with George...all of that was a bunch of hooey....imo

[Amy]

I missed this whole episode. George told someone that the kidnappers were being watched by mysterious people that he knew and that Caylee was moved 8 times while they had her???:confused:

I have a question. Did George have a stroke or something that would affect his thinking? He is supposed to be an educated law enforcement agent. If he was the one in charge of investigating this crime, do any of you believe he would believe the nonsense coming out of his mouth?

I, for one, think George has known all along that Caylee was dead, not that he knew any of the particulars about how or where she was. Just from his interviews and his description of the smell of the car, and his getting sick talking about that.

However, even early on, he was saying that the kidnappers were watching them, and they had to be careful because the kidnappers threatened not only Caylee, but the family. It was several weeks later that he came up with having followed them, and always being too late @ each place.

[Noahs ARK]

The reason I waffle back and forth about George is that in his interviews with the FBI and LE he gave them bits of the truth while Cindy continued to try to mislead them all the way.

I think George "morphs" into whatever he has to be - depending on who he's talking to.

[Amy]

Not sure if this link has been posted before, but to answer you querry about LE not following up, there seems to be numerous reasons. None of which is the fact that that area seemed to have been cleared earlier in August or late July..However, if you just look at the area closely..look at the foliage and thick vegatation that was supposedly cleared. its enormous not to mention, Caylee was indeed there all along she was like a needle in a haystack..not suprising she got missed.

http://psychicgale.com/blinddrive.htm

Even this group felt compelled and certain Caylee was there!!! Yikes, it is too bad that it had to wait until the weather killed off most of that foliage in order to find that bundle well hidden. That area is swampy too, even before Hurrricane Faye hit!

As much as we all would wish to have found Caylee back then, it is obvious just why she wasnt located until December. Thankful she was found at all, as many seasoned searchers didnt even thing they would ever find her!!

LMS:sad:

I agree about the area being swampy. Regardless of what the faux TES searcher (Joy?) and others say, the METER READER, in his giving directions IN AUGUST to the dispatcher and to the sheriff's office--HE SAID, A SWAMPY AREA. He said that several times. According to what I saw and heard when the calls were aired. So, no matter WHEN Hurricane Faye came thru, IT WAS SWAMPY when the meter reader saw the area in August.

[rj1212]

I think George "morphs" into whatever he has to be - depending on who he's talking to.

I think George has become an embarrassment to LE, husbands, and men in general. For him to make such inconsistent and crazy statements only prove to me that he and Cindy aren't too different.

I'm sorry if I seem so blunt today but maybe I'm getting emotional on Christmas Eve as I see the excitement of my children as they anticipate Christmas day. Caylee's family members, George and Cindy should've come out of the fog quite some time ago as circumstantial evidence showed over and over that there was no Zanny, no job, decompostion in the car, and partying by Casey while she knew her child was missing/dead. This is so far beyond denial...

[bchand]

I think George "morphs" into whatever he has to be - depending on who he's talking to.


Yep, just like his daughter.

He forgot who he was talking to though, when he thought he had to spell out a naughty word to LE.

[legalmania]

Now he has morphed into a grieving grandfather, no matter who he's talking to.


What do you think George saw in the trunk?

[Amy]

In case anyone is interested there is a program about this investigation on MSNBC right now. I just happen to turn it that channel and saw it.

It is the same one that has aired probably 6 times in the last couple of weeks. @ least this program does seem to supply some updates as the case progresses. Most of the others seem to be produced and aired--without any updates, even if it is months or years later.

[Amy]

It truly is a shame that nobody else knew that household was a toxic environment for little Caylee. Fights, stealing, gambling, yelling, choking, unemployment, debt, threats of divorce, threats of custody, lying, possible mental illness. The protective way Caylee folded herself into her great-grandfather's arms speaks volumes. She was his "sunshine" and my sympathy and prayers are for his profound loss.

If the outcome had been violence toward an adult, rather than a child, we wouldn't be here hashing it over. The Anthonys do share blame because it was their house, they helped create and participate in the dysfunction and they failed to protect Caylee. But I also think their behavior since Caylee was first reported missing reflects their enormous guilt, remorse and emotional pain. I wish them peace and courage on this day and those ahead.

Caylee is safe now. :rose:

This post pretty much covers it all. Thank you

[legalmania]

Does anybody remember what George said about what he saw in the trunk? Didn't he say " that better not be what I think it is". He then explained that he was referring to the gas cans.

[Amy]

"If you are fit and enthusiastic, it should take about three hours work to dig a four foot deep grave." I thought this wording a little suspect, lol. Are you supposed to admit you're "enthusiastic" about digging a grave? :blink:

When we buried my dog @ my folks', it did not take 3 hours that I remember. But, maybe it wasn't four feet. And, BIL wasn't all that enthusiastic about having to do the digging. I also think one would have to take into consideration the type of soil. In some areas, the ground is quite hard, and takes more than a shovel, or perhaps some soaking of the area before digging commences. Sandy areas would not be as difficult, unless the it was fine and dry enough for the sides to keep caving in.

I don't know the hardness of the soil in the A's backyard, but it seems the problem there was more the vegetation (the bamboo plants.) If there was a grave dug in the woods--the problem is, it was SWAMPY, according to the meter reader. I would suppose the area would fill w/water and impede the digging.

[Mamie]

The reason I waffle back and forth about George is that in his interviews with the FBI and LE he gave them bits of the truth while Cindy continued to try to mislead them all the way.

That's because (in my opinion) Cindy has more practice at it than George. Cindy, although she has a heart, has not a lot of genuine feeling in it. JMO

[Amy]

Will the photo be part of the Defense Team's evidence? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,435002,00.html

Meanwhile, Baez said through his spokesman Todd Black that the defense's own investigators are out of state getting a photo of the Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez who Anthony contends took Caylee, according to MyFOXOrlando.com.

Black says the picture was taken at a park and shows the woman they say is the baby sitter, Anthony and little Caylee. It isn't known when the photo was taken.

Black said Anthony's lawyer has for weeks been trying to find the man who has the picture and after finally locating him, sent a team to interview him.

The reason I have trouble believing this is, IF there was a photo, and IF the defense team had it, WHY would Baez let his client continue to sit in jail, awaiting trial for the murder of her baby, when all it would take would be to turn (a copy, of COURSE he would keep the original :wink:) it over to even the FBI for this woman to be located? WHY would he wait until the trial (which will be God knows when) to spring the pic on the prosecution? IMO, IF his detective was really going to that man to get that pic, and he DID get it, Baez would not be able to contain himself. If the detective could not find the man or get the pic if he DID find him, IMO, Baez would have had some story-maybe right along w/George's about all the places they found that Caylee had been @)--about why they did not get it. The story just faded into the background, and that is what I think it is---a story. OR, it's impossible to actually take a picture of an imaginary person, so Zanny didn't really show up in the photo!! :biggrin:

[legalmania]

The reason I have trouble believing this is, IF there was a photo, and IF the defense team had it, WHY would Baez let his client continue to sit in jail, awaiting trial for the murder of her baby, when all it would take would be to turn (a copy, of COURSE he would keep the original :wink:) it over to even the FBI for this woman to be located? WHY would he wait until the trial (which will be God knows when) to spring the pic on the prosecution? IMO, IF his detective was really going to that man to get that pic, and he DID get it, Baez would not be able to contain himself. If the detective could not find the man or get the pic if he DID find him, IMO, Baez would have had some story-maybe right along w/George's about all the places they found that Caylee had been @)--about why they did not get it. The story just faded into the background, and that is what I think it is---a story. OR, it's impossible to actually take a picture of an imaginary person, so Zanny didn't really show up in the photo!! :biggrin:

They better bring in live testimony, we all can produce a photo but I want to hear her say yes I took care of Caylee from 9 to 5 so on and so forth.

[Amy]

I don't think this Zanny ever existed so whatever photo he was looking for would be somebody else in it ~ if there was any truth to this "photo" to begin with! MOO :smile:

That's one think I was thinking it could be. And then, some unsuspecting woman would look @ the tv screen or the newspaper and see HER picture, with the caption of Zanny the Nanny!!!! I think they probably better not do that, tho. They already have to contend w/the person with that name suing them. I don't think they could juggle 2 civil lawsuits while they are trying to deal w/the murder trial.

[bchand]

Does anybody remember what George said about what he saw in the trunk? Didn't he say " that better not be what I think it is". He then explained that he was referring to the gas cans.


I believe he said to himself (or out loud, he wasn't sure) I hope this isn't Caylee or Casey - when he was about to open the trunk at the impound lot. (The smell.)

IMO he KNEW the gas cans were in her trunk on the 24th.

[legalmania]

I believe he said to himself (or out loud, he wasn't sure) I hope this isn't Caylee or Casey - when he was about to open the trunk at the impound lot. (The smell.)

IMO he KNEW the gas cans were in her trunk on the 24th.

O.K. so it was at the impound. I thought it was around the 18th or 19th.

[rj1212]

Hope your holiday is brighter in the knowledge that George and Cindy will spend this Christmas, no longer protected by the "fog" that allowed them to hope for the chance to see the excitement of their precious little grandaughter, in anticipation of this Christmas day, and every Christmas day that they have yet to endure.


Happy holidays to you and yours.

Thank you...

Of course, what a happy day it would be if Caylee were found unharmed and alive...that's the kind of crow I'd be glad to eat...

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to you and yours as well! :biggrin:

[legalmania]

Hope everybody a safe but fun holiday. I'm off to eat ,probably be back latter.

[aubrey04]

I believe he said to himself (or out loud, he wasn't sure) I hope this isn't Caylee or Casey - when he was about to open the trunk at the impound lot. (The smell.)

IMO he KNEW the gas cans were in her trunk on the 24th.

He said something like, "Please God.. don't let it be Caylee"..

ETA - http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0811/07/ng.01.html

George Anthony: ......... I think I whispered out to myself, Please don`t let this be my Caylee. That`s what I thought. That`s what I -- my heart was there. Opened it up, and that`s when I seen that bag. I did see a stain. I think it`s right about where the spare time is at, basketball- size or something around there.

I have the same friggin` feeling that I did the day we found the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every tip that we get that`s out of state, the FBI calls up, not local agencies.

GEORGE ANTHONY: I`m not trying to get sick

[Amy]

To you and me...that's just how rediculous it sounds....But I bet to Linda Baden, she will try and convince the jury of just that.....

What I can not understand is that Dr. Baden, was always a well respected man....How did he get tied up with Linda? They seem to be like night and day and seem to have different principals....(at least until the PS case)...That was when I totally lost all respect for the man....

I do not get it....I would never think that a man of such statute would compromise his integrety for a few bucks......I hope that Koby doesn't follow suit......The only one I would trust right now is Dr. Purper, he seems totally honest in all his opinions....

The times I have heard Dr Baden on the various shows, he has answered questions truthfully, seeming to be on neither "side" but stating facts. But, I did not watch all his appearances, and there are those who felt he was not being impartial. IIRC, Baden did not testify in the SP case, because what he had to say was not what MG was wanting touted, so MG just did not call him (and I do think the other guy was Henry Lee) which, to my way of thinking is that they were ready to testify according to principal, instead of according to money in the pocket.

The last few times (over a week or so) that I have listened to Kobe--he also has been citing FACTS, and did not have a defense spin going @ all. No backtracking on things that would show the defendant in a more "innocent" light. I didn't watch NG from the beginning, so will have to take posters' word that he went from being factual to spinning for the defense @ some point. But, lately I have not heard that from him @ all.

[sunstar]

That's one think I was thinking it could be. And then, some unsuspecting woman would look @ the tv screen or the newspaper and see HER picture, with the caption of Zanny the Nanny!!!! I think they probably better not do that, tho. They already have to contend w/the person with that name suing them. I don't think they could juggle 2 civil lawsuits while they are trying to deal w/the murder trial.

Yes I could just see that ~ trying to convince the jury "here's Zanny" when it's somebody else altogether. I agree they already have their hands full with the real ZG's lawsuit! :scared: MOO

[Amy]

I wouldn't doubt it.....it's just so sad.....

And, that DOES get right back to Casey--CAYLEE didn't cause or allow the pregnancy to occur. THAT happened because of the actions of CASEY. Need to focus the responsibility right back to where it belongs (apparently a foreign concept to Casey.)

[Amy]

And of course when he's on Geraldo's show he isn't going to be asked. :mad: MOO

NONE of the shows seemed to have asked him nor the A's any HARD questions, as we say. And, even when they are asked semi-solid questions, they take off on a tangent to get out whatever message they want to get out @ that time.

[aubrey04]

I think that was what he said he was thinking at the towyard.

JMO

Yes, at the towyard. He goes on to say more. I think at that point - George knew Caylee was gone... and everything he did after that point was to satisfy Cindy.

jmo

[bchand]

O.K. so it was at the impound. I thought it was around the 18th or 19th.

June 24 was the gas can incident.

July 15 was the date they got the car from the impound lot.

[Amy]

YEP. I swear this trial is going to be a mess, I can see Baez screwing up royally and Casey getting a new trial.:mad:

I don't know how they could possibly cry ineffective counsel with LKB on "the dream team."

[breezie]

The times I have heard Dr Baden on the various shows, he has answered questions truthfully, seeming to be on neither "side" but stating facts. But, I did not watch all his appearances, and there are those who felt he was not being impartial. IIRC, Baden did not testify in the SP case, because what he had to say was not what MG was wanting touted, so MG just did not call him (and I do think the other guy was Henry Lee) which, to my way of thinking is that they were ready to testify according to principal, instead of according to money in the pocket.

The last few times (over a week or so) that I have listened to Kobe--he also has been citing FACTS, and did not have a defense spin going @ all. No backtracking on things that would show the defendant in a more "innocent" light. I didn't watch NG from the beginning, so will have to take posters' word that he went from being factual to spinning for the defense @ some point. But, lately I have not heard that from him @ all.

Treat yourself to a view of Baden in the Spector trial. He was twisting in the *follow the wife's plan of evidence* so hard that MY back hurt. Pitiful. Embarrassing for a professional to be that chewed up and spit out. His "Aha" moment of shame.

Kobi did try to spin, but Nancy caught him at it. He's now trying to get his *impartial* wings back. We'll see what his performance is like at trial. Jury still out in this camp....

[rj1212]

June 24 was the gas can incident.

July 15 was the date they got the car from the impound lot.

I'm having a hard time believing that the car didn't wreak of human decomposition on the 24th of June...UNLESS...the body wasn't placed in the trunk until AFTER the 24th of June.

Either George knew about Caylee on the 24th of June, or he truly was clueless until the 15th of July...

[Elfinrow]

I think George saw more than just gas cans that day. He saw Caylee dead in the trunk, which is why later he said "that was NOT the body of my granddaughter in that trunk"
I really do believe this.

I think possibly he helped Casey to get rid of her body at that point, staging the scene at Amscot with a car that wasnt even out of gas.
Purse on the seat. Body, tampered with. (duct tape)

I believe he knew, and he knew early on. I also think it's why they delayed when they got the tow notice.

[Amy]

What do you think George saw in the trunk?

I don't think George saw ANYTHING in the trunk, because I don't think Casey let him get close enough. I believe that because that was his first rendition of the occasion. He changed it later to his actually getting the cans himself sometime later, I would think after they realized that there was suspicion that Caylee had been placed in the trunk, they needed a new version.

[aubrey04]

Treat yourself to a view of Baden in the Spector trial. He was twisting in the *follow the wife's plan of evidence* so hard that MY back hurt. Pitiful. Embarrassing for a professional to be that chewed up and spit out. His "Aha" moment of shame.

Kobi did try to spin, but Nancy caught him at it. He's now trying to get his *impartial* wings back. We'll see what his performance is like at trial. Jury still out in this camp....

You mean when he tried to say that even though Lana Clarkson's spinal cord was severed - she could still spew blood out of her mouth? .. enough blood to get on Phil Spector's jacket? :lol:

Dr. Werner Spitz was a nightmare during Spector's trial too and he's part of Casey's defense team.

[sunstar]

I don't think George saw ANYTHING in the trunk, because I don't think Casey let him get close enough. I believe that because that was his first rendition of the occasion. He changed it later to his actually getting the cans himself sometime later, I would think after they realized that there was suspicion that Caylee had been placed in the trunk, they needed a new version.

I believe now he got close enough to scare Casey into dumping Caylee at the first place she could think of as soon as she left the house. MOO

[Amy]

They better bring in live testimony, we all can produce a photo but I want to hear her say yes I took care of Caylee from 9 to 5 so on and so forth.

Oh, not just 9 to 5 remember!!! She took her to the beach, to Disneyworld, kept her for DAYS @ a time when Casey "traveled" for her event planner position!!!

[rj1212]

I don't think George saw ANYTHING in the trunk, because I don't think Casey let him get close enough. I believe that because that was his first rendition of the occasion. He changed it later to his actually getting the cans himself sometime later, I would think after they realized that there was suspicion that Caylee had been placed in the trunk, they needed a new version.

That new rendition (LIE) was very telling to me. It shows that George did know a whole lot more.

[aubrey04]

I'm having a hard time believing that the car didn't wreak of human decomposition on the 24th of June...UNLESS...the body wasn't placed in the trunk until AFTER the 24th of June.

Either George knew about Caylee on the 24th of June, or he truly was clueless until the 15th of July...

Remember Casey started text messaging Amy on June 25th - telling her that something stunk in her car... At one point, Casey text'ed Amy and told her that her dad had run over a squirrel.. (Which never made sense - the odor was from the trunk - not the front end).. then on the 27th, Casey text msg's Amy and tells her that she got rid of the smell.

She got rid of the smell alright.. She dumped the car off at Amscot and never planned on picking it up again, IMO. I am still unclear how close George got to the car on the 24th though.

I still think that Caylee was dumped in the woods around the 20th of June though.. and then the odor from the stain in the trunk progressively got worse over time.

[PuffDragon]

<snipped for relevance>

The last few times (over a week or so) that I have listened to Kobe--he also has been citing FACTS, and did not have a defense spin going @ all. No backtracking on things that would show the defendant in a more "innocent" light. I didn't watch NG from the beginning, so will have to take posters' word that he went from being factual to spinning for the defense @ some point. But, lately I have not heard that from him @ all.

I've noticed that too, Amy. I wondered if he had gotten word that he probably wouldn't be needed when the case finally got to trial.

[rj1212]

I believe now he got close enough to scare Casey into dumping Caylee at the first place she could think of as soon as she left the house. MOO

Very good point sunstar...perhaps George smelled something that caused Casey to get very defensive. I'm sure she fled in short order. To me that shows that she had already placed the body in the trunk. Either it was still in the trunk or it had been recently moved from the trunk but there could've been evidence of a corpse in the trunk that Casey didn't want anyone to see/smell.

Casey could've cared less about the gas cans...heck...I would've just told George I had the gas cans to avoid suspicion if I were Casey...but there had to be more than that.
mo

[rj1212]

Remember Casey started text messaging Amy on June 25th - telling her that something stunk in her car... At one point, Casey text'ed Amy and told her that her dad had run over a squirrel.. (Which never made sense - the odor was from the trunk - not the front end).. then on the 27th, Casey text msg's Amy and tells her that she got rid of the smell.

She got rid of the smell alright.. She dumped the car off at Amscot and never planned on picking it up again, IMO. I am still unclear how close George got to the car on the 24th though.

I still think that Caylee was dumped in the woods around the 20th of June though.. and then the odor from the stain in the trunk progressively got worse over time.

Thanks for reminding me about the text messages Aubrey! Good point...

[ms1950]

Hello and Merry Christmas to All

I read the boards here often and I have watched and listened and read all I can on this case.

What baffles my mind is that we have a former LE officer involved. George had training in matters such as this. He, above all, should have been on alert status the minute he realized the car had been towed. When George picked up that letter from the post office, he knew something was not right. They had not seen or talked to Caylee for a month. When they picked up the car, the smell alone was all George needed to called LE. Yet, he went to work. He drove the car home, smelled the scent of death, saw his daughters purse in the car and Caylee's car seat and favorite doll. He saw the stain in the trunk. Come on, he knew something was VERY wrong! I know Cindy is a controlling woman so perhaps she called the shots. But, exactly WHAT finally alerted her to take action? Her daughter and granddaughter gone for a month, Casey never comes back for any clothes for herself or Caylee? Come on! The only thing I can think of is as we know, Casey and her parents had a huge fight. Casey left that morning and had no intention of coming back. Whatever coonversation George may have had with her I assume it was not cordial. She may have told him they will never see Caylee again. Who knows? But Cindy doesn't strike me as a woman who would take too much crap before she acts. She didn't "go after" Casey for a whole month. Possibly because she was told by Casey she could not speak with Caylee. Too much obvious b.s. was dictated to Cindy about where Casey and Caylee were each day when they spoke. Listen to the FBI interview with Cindy. She was use to checking up on all of Casey's "claims". She knew her daughter couldn't be trusted. I think Casey played emotional blackmail with them constantly and used Caylee as the pawn.

The Anthonys have a lot of explaining to do.

This is a sad thing to be thinking about on Christmas Eve, but just like all of you, Caylee is on my mind.

[rj1212]

Hello and Merry Christmas to All

I read the boards here often and I have watched and listened and read all I can on this case.

What baffles my mind is that we have a former LE officer involved. George had training in matters such as this. He, above all, should have been on alert status the minute he realized the car had been towed. When George picked up that letter from the post office, he knew something was not right. They had not seen or talked to Caylee for a month. When they picked up the car, the smell alone was all George needed to called LE. Yet, he went to work. He drove the car home, smelled the scent of death, saw his daughters purse in the car and Caylee's car seat and favorite doll. He saw the stain in the trunk. Come on, he knew something was VERY wrong! I know Cindy is a controlling woman so perhaps she called the shots. But, exactly WHAT finally alerted her to take action? Her daughter and granddaughter gone for a month, Casey never comes back for any clothes for herself or Caylee? Come on! The only thing I can think of is as we know, Casey and her parents had a huge fight. Casey left that morning and had no intention of coming back. Whatever coonversation George may have had with her I assume it was not cordial. She may have told him they will never see Caylee again. Who knows? But Cindy doesn't strike me as a woman who would take too much crap before she acts. She didn't "go after" Casey for a whole month. Possibly because she was told by Casey she could not speak with Caylee. Too much obvious b.s. was dictated to Cindy about where Casey and Caylee were each day when they spoke. Listen to the FBI interview with Cindy. She was use to checking up on all of Casey's "claims". She knew her daughter couldn't be trusted. I think Casey played emotional blackmail with them constantly and used Caylee as the pawn.

The Anthonys have a lot of explaining to do.

This is a sad thing to be thinking about on Christmas Eve, but just like all of you, Caylee is on my mind.

Thank you for your insight. Please post more often!
Merry Christmas!

[Carol25]

It's getting dark now. It's time to put three year olds on your lap and read them the Story of the Night before Christmas. Then go over to the Nativity scene and talk about Baby Jesus. And Mary and Joseph. And time for cookies and milk.

And giggle about Rudolph and his big red nose! Oh what a beautiful night with the candles glowing... the fire is burning and the carols are in the background!

What are they Anthony's thinking about tonight? Tonight I hope it's Caylee. What would Santa have brought for her?

[bchand]

I don't know how they could possibly cry ineffective counsel with LKB on "the dream team."

Just had a thought about LKB at the Spector trial. Remember her notes??? I thought she'd never get finished talking. That stack of documents rivaled Cindy's binder.

I don't know who I'm looking forward to less, her or Jose.

[Katt2]

I think George saw more than just gas cans that day. He saw Caylee dead in the trunk, which is why later he said "that was NOT the body of my granddaughter in that trunk"
I really do believe this.

I think possibly he helped Casey to get rid of her body at that point, staging the scene at Amscot with a car that wasnt even out of gas.
Purse on the seat. Body, tampered with. (duct tape)

I believe he knew, and he knew early on. I also think it's why they delayed when they got the tow notice.

That's quite an accusation. Apparently LE don't share your beliefs or George would be under arrest.

[Amy]

Very good point sunstar...perhaps George smelled something that caused Casey to get very defensive. I'm sure she fled in short order. To me that shows that she had already placed the body in the trunk. Either it was still in the trunk or it had been recently moved from the trunk but there could've been evidence of a corpse in the trunk that Casey didn't want anyone to see/smell.

Casey could've cared less about the gas cans...heck...I would've just told George I had the gas cans to avoid suspicion if I were Casey...but there had to be more than that.
mo

Casey did not care about the gas cans, but she did care about her dad getting too close to the trunk of that car. Either Caylee was in there @ the time (not likely, IMO) or there was the odor was beginning to be noticable, or, the stain was noticable. And Lee has told LE that George details those cars, he would want to know what happened there. (and she didn't have a good story cooked up yet.)

[breezie]

That's quite an accusation. Apparently LE don't share your beliefs or George would be under arrest.

There's a difference between what they believe and what they can prove. I think he will torture himself enough over it. When silence takes over and the case is done. He will be left alone with his thoughts and actions. God help him.

[rj1212]

It's getting dark now. It's time to put three year olds on your lap and read them the Story of the Night before Christmas. Then go over to the Nativity scene and talk about Baby Jesus. And Mary and Joseph. And time for cookies and milk.

And giggle about Rudolph and his big red nose! Oh what a beautiful night with the candles glowing... the fire is burning and the carols are in the background!

What are they Anthony's thinking about tonight? Tonight I hope it's Caylee. What would Santa have brought for her?

:crying: Okay...that's it. It's time to hug my kids and get on with the evening and read Luke ch. 2 with them and share the anticipation of Santa Claus with them. It's going to be a day of joy to share with them. But we must remember that Caylee is in a much better place than we could ever comprehend. Justice is coming soon for Caylee folks...

Peace to you and goodnight,
RJ

[Amy]

Hello and Merry Christmas to All

I read the boards here often and I have watched and listened and read all I can on this case.

What baffles my mind is that we have a former LE officer involved. George had training in matters such as this. He, above all, should have been on alert status the minute he realized the car had been towed. When George picked up that letter from the post office, he knew something was not right. They had not seen or talked to Caylee for a month. When they picked up the car, the smell alone was all George needed to called LE. Yet, he went to work. He drove the car home, smelled the scent of death, saw his daughters purse in the car and Caylee's car seat and favorite doll. He saw the stain in the trunk. Come on, he knew something was VERY wrong! I know Cindy is a controlling woman so perhaps she called the shots. But, exactly WHAT finally alerted her to take action? Her daughter and granddaughter gone for a month, Casey never comes back for any clothes for herself or Caylee? Come on! The only thing I can think of is as we know, Casey and her parents had a huge fight. Casey left that morning and had no intention of coming back. Whatever coonversation George may have had with her I assume it was not cordial. She may have told him they will never see Caylee again. Who knows? But Cindy doesn't strike me as a woman who would take too much crap before she acts. She didn't "go after" Casey for a whole month. Possibly because she was told by Casey she could not speak with Caylee. Too much obvious b.s. was dictated to Cindy about where Casey and Caylee were each day when they spoke. Listen to the FBI interview with Cindy. She was use to checking up on all of Casey's "claims". She knew her daughter couldn't be trusted. I think Casey played emotional blackmail with them constantly and used Caylee as the pawn.

The Anthonys have a lot of explaining to do.

This is a sad thing to be thinking about on Christmas Eve, but just like all of you, Caylee is on my mind.

But, they were in contact with Casey during that month, and I think the phone records reflect that. Or, @ least Cindy was, and Caylee was always w/the nanny or asleep when Cindy wanted to talk to her. I think Cindy tho't Caylee WAS available, but that Casey was punishing her, just not going to let her talk to Caylee.

I don't think George particularly tho't anything wrong until he approached the car and there was the smell that he could never forget--the smell of a decomposing body.

[BANJO GRANNY]

:rose::rose:
MERRY CHRISTMAS CAYLEE
YOU ARE SPENDING YOUR FIRST CHRISTMAS IN HEAVEN AND IT WILL BE YOUR BEST ONE EVER.
YOU ARE GOD'S SUNSHINE NOW AND NO ONE WILL EVER TAKE YOU AWAY FROM HIM, NO ONE WILL EVER HURT YOU AGAIN. YOU WILL FOREVER BE SMILING, SINGING, AND DANCING WITH THE ANGELS BABY GIRL.
:rose:

[Carol25]

:crying: Okay...that's it. It's time to hug my kids and get on with the evening and read Luke ch. 2 with them and share the anticipation of Santa Claus with them. It's going to be a day of joy to share with them. But we must remember that Caylee is in a much better place than we could ever comprehend. Justice is coming soon for Caylee folks...

Peace to you and goodnight,
RJ
Merry Christmas Rj, and don't be sad, Caylee is experiencing the Real Christmas!

[Cury-us Coyote]

WESH2 Video 2:56

Update: Caylee's Toys, Casey's Christmas
http://www.wesh.com/video/18355236/index.html

[sunstar]

:rose:
MERRY CHRISTMAS CAYLEE
YOU ARE SPENDING YOUR FIRST CHRISTMAS IN HEAVEN AND IT WILL BE YOUR BEST ONE EVER.
YOU ARE GOD'S SUNSHINE NOW AND NO ONE WILL EVER TAKE YOU AWAY FROM HIM, NO ONE WILL EVER HURT YOU AGAIN. YOU WILL FOREVER BE SMILING, SINGING, AND DANCING WITH THE ANGELS BABY GIRL.
:rose:

I share these beautiful thoughts also. :rose:

Merry Christmas Caylee!

[johnielee333]

Merry Christmas Caylee ! :rose:
We Love You ! :rose:

[Cury-us Coyote]

Up-To-The-Minute Update
Wednesday, Dec. 24
5 p.m.
Anonymous person donates 125 gift wrap toys from Bloomingdales at the Caylee memorial site. The Orlando Union Rescue Mission will give the toys to the 84 children in the organization's custody
http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/12/12/minutetominute_update_in_remains_discovery_12_11.h tml

[aubrey04]

Thankfully LE is able to separate fact from fiction, guided by logic, rather than a dislike for the Anthony family. I hope the Anthony's have someone who reads every false word that has been published about them, and perhaps in the future, files an action for damages.

Happy holidays, Katt.

Righttttt.. Well, the Anthony's better start their lawsuits with the media, as they were the first to report that the Anthony's might be arrested for obstruction of justice.

Back on November 26th it was reported:

http://www.wftv.com/news/18150085/detail.html

CASEY'S PARENTS MAY EVENTUALLY FACE CHARGES ~ Dec. 13th

http://www.wftv.com/news/18271333/detail.html

[Amy]

Not surprising as the criminal case should be heard first. If Casey was to be found not guilty, (not that I think that will happen), it would leave the civil case in question, as to whether it should go forward or not.

I would think the civil case would be unchanged, regardless of the outcome of the criminal trial. The damages ZFG is suing for occured because of what the A's said about Zanny. What they said affected STILL affected Zenaida, for the purposes of the civil suit.

[aubrey04]

Speaking of lawsuits... I bet Jesse Grund and Amy have about as good of a chance to win a lawsuit against Cindy Anthony for dragging their name through the mud, as the Anthony's do against the media and message board posters.

[Oregongal]

WESH2 Video 2:56

Update: Caylee's Toys, Casey's Christmas
http://www.wesh.com/video/18355236/index.html

Merry Christmas Eve to all of my wonderful poster friends.
Thank you Cury for posting this link.
My dd just colored my hair, the gray ya know, needed to be caught on.
And in the few mins I have right now until I rinse, wanted to pop in and see what was happening.
I find this wonderful. The anonymous donor remembering Caylee and blessing so many children. This is truly the spirit of Christmas. It's also again reminded me that Caylee was here for a reason. Even tho her life was cut short, the love she has brought out in people has brought me to tears.
Her short life has brought so much to so many people and I am proud to be part of the people who have cared and loved her so much.
Well, got to jump in the shower now.
Will try and check in later.
I hope all of you are enjoying this Christmas Eve.
:wub: You all.

[Carol25]

Has anyone heard of an exparte motion for a special master? Supposedly done today? What woould that be?

[Amy]

I may be wrong, but I thought Zenaida's lawsuit named only Casey, not the entire family. Personally I don't think Zenaida will be able to prove damages, and for that reason alone, she won't prevail.

You are right, Casey is being sued.

I personally never figured out how ONE out of how many Zenaidas seemed to be affected by the story of the invisible nanny, and think it a rather frivolous lawsuit. I seem to be one of the minority here on this one, tho. I still think, either way the criminal case goes, the civil case will continue as I don't see this Zenaida changing her mind about the trouble having the same name as the nanny has caused her.

[marshmallow]

WESH2 Video 2:56

Update: Caylee's Toys, Casey's Christmas
http://www.wesh.com/video/18355236/index.html


May God bless the person who did that, honoring Caylee by making another child's Christmas a bit better. That's the true Christmas spirit.


I hope each of you here have a blessed holiday full of family, friends, and love. The one gift we can always give each other is kindness and the one thing we all have to share with our families and friends is love. Merry Christmas eve.

[starling]

:rose::rose:
MERRY CHRISTMAS CAYLEE
YOU ARE SPENDING YOUR FIRST CHRISTMAS IN HEAVEN AND IT WILL BE YOUR BEST ONE EVER.
YOU ARE GOD'S SUNSHINE NOW AND NO ONE WILL EVER TAKE YOU AWAY FROM HIM, NO ONE WILL EVER HURT YOU AGAIN. YOU WILL FOREVER BE SMILING, SINGING, AND DANCING WITH THE ANGELS BABY GIRL.
:rose:



Beautiful!



December 24,2002
Laci & Conner went home to heaven

[aubrey04]

Not too sure about Amy, but I suspect that Jesse and his family have the capacity to forgive and rise above, out of love and respect for Caylee.

but you don't think the Anthony's can be forgiving to people who have judged their awful behavior and concluded that maybe they know more than they are saying.. Their actions, behavior and their own words make them seem suspicious.. You insinuated that they should sue. If anyone has a right to sue - I would say it is Jesse Grund and Amy. Cindy told police she suspects that Zanny is actually Jesse or Amy.. She insinuated to the FBI, no less, that they were child abductors!.. to the police and FBI!

Personally, I am anti-frivolous lawsuits. So I don't think any of them should sue, but if we are talking about someone being slandered when they have done nothing suspicious..nothing wrong.. besides befriend that worthless "waste", Casey Anthony.. --> That would be Amy and Jesse, not the Anthony's.

[WillowInFlight]

While I read all your wonderful plans for tonight my heart is heavy, I miss my grandbaby, but I heard he is enjoying the Elmo live we sent him. My heart breaks for Caylee, Cindy and George, they are the ones that are missing out . Christmas has always meant so much more than gifts to me, This year I am going to get exactly what I asked for, a tube of facial scrub, it was the only thing I could think of that I needed, I learned a long time ago unless society changes, I will never get what I truly want.
I hope Cindy and George are with loved ones tonight, The heartache and guilt that they carry will last a life time, I don't see how they will ever heal.

Casey will continue to live in her fantasy world believing either she did nothing wrong, or she was justified in doing what she did, my only comfort there is knowing where her soul is going.

[sunstar]

Beautiful!



December 24,2002
Laci & Conner went home to heaven

It seems hard to believe it's been six years already. :rose:

[Carol25]

Where did you hear that? Do you remember in Spector.. they had to call in a special master to decide if Spector's earlier attorney could testify against him? Maybe Baez is alleging some kind of inside impropriety.
Over at WS. Had no idea what to make of it, don't remember it in the Spector trial.

[coffee1950j]

Yes I could just see that ~ trying to convince the jury "here's Zanny" when it's somebody else altogether. I agree they already have their hands full with the real ZG's lawsuit! :scared: MOO

nope, it's going to be "here's the picture that Zanny took of us together".

[aubrey04]

You are right, Casey is being sued.

I personally never figured out how ONE out of how many Zenaidas seemed to be affected by the story of the invisible nanny, and think it a rather frivolous lawsuit. I seem to be one of the minority here on this one, tho. I still think, either way the criminal case goes, the civil case will continue as I don't see this Zenaida changing her mind about the trouble having the same name as the nanny has caused her.

Hey Amy,

I think the reason this Zenaida Gonzalez filed suit is because she is the one who visited Sawgrass Apartments on June 17th. Her attorney, John Morgan, said in an interview that he thinks Casey somehow stole her information from the sign-in card from Sawgrass.

But I agree with you... I think it is pretty frivolous. Casey was given a photo line-up to identify ZFG and she did not recognize ZG's picture.. plus the age is wrong, the number of children is wrong, the description is wrong..

However, I do feel badly for Ms. Gonzalez. I have said this before.. Can you imagine living in Orlando, Florida with that name? It must be a nightmare! She has six children too. I wonder how they have been affected by this at school?!?

[WillowInFlight]

How is this Zenaida going to prove that she was the one that Casey was talking about? I could never figure that out.

[Carol25]

Where did you hear that? Do you remember in Spector.. they had to call in a special master to decide if Spector's earlier attorney could testify against him? Maybe Baez is alleging some kind of inside impropriety.
would "ex parte" mean neither of the parties involved (not defense or prosecution has brought this matter forward?)

Or there was some impropriety done by someone not involved with the case?

Could it be the prosecution that is bring it to the judge?

[Cury-us Coyote]

Case Number: 08-CF-0015606-O
12/24/2008 A EX PARTE MOTION TO APPOINT SPECIAL MASTER
http://www.myorangeclerk.com/myclerk/

[Katt2]

There's a difference between what they believe and what they can prove. I think he will torture himself enough over it. When silence takes over and the case is done. He will be left alone with his thoughts and actions. God help him.

We were able to listen to George's interviews with LE. They gave no indication nor were any of the questions even hinted at George being involved. LE had no problem straight out asking Casey if she was involved. Wouldn't they do the same with George if they suspected it?

[WillowInFlight]

In the early days when Cindy was trying to find where Caylee was, she was hoping against all hope that Casey was telling the truth. The Grunds have forgiven. I hope Amy has too.

I doubt Amy has given Casey a second thought, after all she only stole money from Amy, she stole Caylee's life. She may regret having even met her but I doubt she will hold the theft against her.

[Amy]

How is this Zenaida going to prove that she was the one that Casey was talking about? I could never figure that out.

She ISN'T because she does not even fit the description that Casey gave to LE, in age, number of kids, etc. Casey DID NOT identify her or any other Zenaida placed in a picture line up. I just don't know how having that name is going to affect employment (I haven't heard about any of the others having problems) because ANY employer who recognizes the name also is probably intelligent enough to realize the Zanny story was something made up, and, regardless of description, ANY Zenaida seeking employment is NOT the invisible nanny!!!!

[sunstar]

Merry Christmas everybody! :seeya:

[gaelicpeas]

Merry Christmas everyone.

Quite frankly, thank God Cindy has had such a strong personality. The facts bear out that Cindy alone kept this family as functional as it was for many years, dealing with an addictive husband, an immature, pathological liar of a daughter whilst providing a loving environment for little Caylee during her few short years on this earth, while consulting legal counsel to ensure Caylee's future should something happen to Casey AND, more recently, consulting legal counsel to gain custody of Caylee. All the while working in a responsible job and paying the bills.

<snipped to address point I highlighted in red above

In the last doc dump, there is a footnote on the transcript of Cindy's interview where she relates about how she consulted an attorney about this - the footnote says that LE contacted this attorney, who says he has no such file.

JMO

[WillowInFlight]

The lawsuit is against Casey, the A's are not defendant's.

I would say yet, if they continue to go along with the nanny story I sure as heck would add them to the suit. And they can't have it both way.

[Carol25]

Ex parte is a one sided application, intended to benefit one side only, done without notice and challenge from the opposing side.
Thank you!

[WillowInFlight]

In the last doc dump, there is a footnote on the transcript of Cindy's interview where she relates about how she consulted an attorney about this - the footnote says that LE contacted this attorney, who says he has no such file.

JMO

Just like there was no file that Cindy claims regarding the father of Caylee.

[gaelicpeas]

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I was thinking more along the lines of suing the outside people, who have never met them, and who have intentionally set out to spread false information, absent any basis of truth, all over the internet.hmmm... let me get this straight. Are you saying that the Anthony's could sue message board posters for theorizing about their involvement? I have never in my life heard of such.....

JMO

[WillowInFlight]

hmmm... let me get this straight. Are you saying that the Anthony's could sue message board posters for theorizing about their involvement? I have never in my life heard of such.....

JMO

And you never will, skip and scroll, we all know who this is.

[AlohaRainbow]

I think George saw more than just gas cans that day. He saw Caylee dead in the trunk, which is why later he said "that was NOT the body of my granddaughter in that trunk"
I really do believe this.

I think possibly he helped Casey to get rid of her body at that point, staging the scene at Amscot with a car that wasnt even out of gas.
Purse on the seat. Body, tampered with. (duct tape)

I believe he knew, and he knew early on. I also think it's why they delayed when they got the tow notice.
interesting theory of events, elfin.
that would certainly be one explanation for his remark (not the body of his granddaughter in the tunk).

i vacillate back and forth between casey did everything alone (which is where i usually end up), and that someone in her family helped hide/dump the body (IF she had family help, i then go back and forth between lee and george).

[Amy]

hmmm... let me get this straight. Are you saying that the Anthony's could sue message board posters for theorizing about their involvement? I have never in my life heard of such.....

JMO

I know there have been cases, can't remember the exact circumstances, tho. That is why we are cautioned about what we say, how we say it, as TTV will hold no responsibility for what individual posters post. Any problem comes of a post or posts, the poster is on his/her own to defend it.

[WillowInFlight]

Anything said in the course of a trial, is fair game, and a witness can't be sued for defamation for anything they say in court.

They sure as heck can, if they are proven to be lying. And in Cindy's case, she better watch her pocketbook.

[gaelicpeas]

And you never will, skip and scroll, we all know who this is.

Thanks. I was just amazed to read that - lol, if so, half of us on IS would be broke from defamation suits!

[gaelicpeas]

I know there have been cases, can't remember the exact circumstances, tho. That is why we are cautioned about what we say, how we say it, as TTV will hold no responsibility for what individual posters post. Any problem comes of a post or posts, the poster is on his/her own to defend it.

(below posted by Dinner Troll - sorry, don't know how to do multiple quotes)
Not for theorizing, but for willfully and intentionally posting damaging information which they know or should know, to be without a truthful basis.

I would love to see a link to support these statements... TIA.

[Amy]

Wrong.. You cannot be sued in a civil action, for testimony given in trial.

If someone would give false testimony in a civil case could s/he be charge with perjury same as in a criminal trial? Not that I have anyone in mind that would be doing it, just wondering.

[WillowInFlight]

Wrong.. You cannot be sued in a civil action, for testimony given in trial.

I would be willing to bet that Cindy can and would be sued a lot quicker than any poster here for what she has claimed to be true. And who was talking about a civil, I was talking about a murder trial. I am hoping that Z puts this on the back burner. She may have a lot more to gain.

[Oregongal]

Those aren't gray hairs, they are just pieces of misplaced tinsel.
:w00t:

Happy holidays Oregongal.

:lol:
I love it Dinner. Well, the tinsel is gone...for a bit anyway.
I've my new jammies that dd got for me on and feel all comfy.
I still have some tagging and putting bows on the gifts I finally wrapped last night.
Caylee is so much on my mind, I've had a hard time with the Christmas spirit this year.
As my dd and I get my gson bathed and in his new jammies, put the cookies out for Santa, I will be thinking of her.
But, I must say that story of the anonymous donor of gifts for other children in the name of Caylee lifted my heart somewhat.
On to catch up a bit. You have sped ahead of me.
:)

[aubrey04]

In the last doc dump, there is a footnote on the transcript of Cindy's interview where she relates about how she consulted an attorney about this - the footnote says that LE contacted this attorney, who says he has no such file.

JMO

Right.. and originally in Cindy's interview with LE - she could not remember the name of the lawyer who supposedly drew up the papers.

Strange.

:mellow:

[Amy]

I would love to see a link to support these statements... TIA.

I don't have a link--I have read several times on like the MSN home page (and this is over a 7 year period of time) about various cases where people have been sued over what was posted on message boards. I don't even remember the outcome. I don't remember if the suits went to trial. I DO remember reading people have sued.

And, if you read in the TOS or the posting guidelines, you will see reference to being careful how you post things, and if you are sued, you are on your own (paraphrase.)

[aubrey04]

As I recall.. the special master was brought in to hear what Spector's old attorney(the lady who's name I'm forgetting), would say in testimony, to determine if her testimony would violate Spector's rights. Fidler reclused himself from making that decision, and he appointed the spec. master.

Sarah Kaplin (sp?)..

[WillowInFlight]

Not for theorizing, but for willfully and intentionally posting damaging information which they know or should know, to be without a truthful basis.

Well then I guess Cindy and George have opened the way for a lawsuit.

[Amy]

I would love to see a link to support these statements... TIA.

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?t=338376

Under c. is where you will find about being careful of what you post, and a couple of paragraphs down about TTV will not take care of expenses for attorneys, etc etc etc.


I do think these would be put in for a reason, such as, there have been lawsuits, and this is how they will be dealt with.

[gaelicpeas]

www.findlaw.com

I meant a specific link.

[gaelicpeas]

I don't have a link--I have read several times on like the MSN home page (and this is over a 7 year period of time) about various cases where people have been sued over what was posted on message boards. I don't even remember the outcome. I don't remember if the suits went to trial. I DO remember reading people have sued.

And, if you read in the TOS or the posting guidelines, you will see reference to being careful how you post things, and if you are sued, you are on your own (paraphrase.)

Thanks. My understanding of the TOS is that if you are theorizing, you need to add "just my opinion" (JMO) or IMO or something like that.

[gaelicpeas]

That's interesting, gaelic, thanks. I'll check it out after Christmas. All the best to you and yours this holiday season. :)

Thanks, Sanity, same to you...

[WillowInFlight]

I don't think you understand this issue, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Well then correct me, You are saying it's unlawful to post untruths about someone, as a fact. I agree, I haven't seen that here, but I have seen untruths spoken by the Anthonys, I guess they could get by the point claiming the heard it from Casey. But they believe Casey, so which is it, are the telling untruths, or are telling what they believe to be real?

[AlohaRainbow]

I've noticed that too, Amy. I wondered if he had gotten word that he probably wouldn't be needed when the case finally got to trial.

there are at least 2 types of experts: expert witness and consulting expert. sometimes an attorney may hire a "consulting expert" who works behind the scenes to help the atty understand technical evidence, but who might not be prepared (or willing) to testify as an expert witness at trial. from the way that kobe has spoken at times, i wonder if he was hired purely as a consultant (and not as an expert witness), e.g. i've heard him say at least once that he was hired to "help" baez understand dna evidence.
it will be interesting to see what develops

[gaelicpeas]

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?t=338376

Under c. is where you will find about being careful of what you post, and a couple of paragraphs down about TTV will not take care of expenses for attorneys, etc etc etc.


I do think these would be put in for a reason, such as, there have been lawsuits, and this is how they will be dealt with.
When I read "c", all I saw was references to nudity and pornographic materials.

I just read all of this (again), and I don't really see where there is any rule that says you can't theorize about someone's involvement in a case.

JMO

[WillowInFlight]

Hi Willow, can you just allow other posters to have their opinions, please? I don't think you'd appreciate it if people told other posters to ignore your point of view, would you?

I think you and I have been posting long enough to know what I meant.

happy Holidays.

[Amy]

I would love to see a link to support these statements... TIA.

These are a few links from googling message board lawsuits:
http://www.seroundtable.com/archives/006385.html

http://www.overlawyered.com/2007/06/autoadmit-message-board-lawsuit/

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=90851

The last one was dismissed without prejudice.

[Amy]

Thanks. My understanding of the TOS is that if you are theorizing, you need to add "just my opinion" (JMO) or IMO or something like that.

You have to be careful WHAT you post, and HOW you post it. And, definitely, the use of IMO is encouraged. But you also can't just up and say anything you want about anybody anytime. There would need to be a background to it, like your opinion on what the A's said, or how Baez acted, whether or not you tho't their attire was appropriate for a specific occasion, etc.

[sunbunny]

I think you and I have been posting long enough to know what I meant.

happy Holidays.

merry christmas, willow! :seeya:

just butting in to say i am glad Caylee is "home" for Christmas. whenever the baby killer's trial starts (and it will hopefully be televised), i am going to take a week's vacation to watch that so-and-so go DOWN!!!

[gaelicpeas]

These are a few links from googling message board lawsuits:
http://www.seroundtable.com/archives/006385.html

http://www.overlawyered.com/2007/06/autoadmit-message-board-lawsuit/

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=90851

The last one was dismissed without prejudice.

Interesting, although only the last site looked half-way reputable (IMO). It appears from that last site that suing anonymous posters for their opinions was frivolous. Which was my point, I believe.

Anyway, I will continue to theorize about various persons' involvement in this case, and I doubt seriously that I will be sued for defamation.

JMO

[Oregongal]

While I read all your wonderful plans for tonight my heart is heavy, I miss my grandbaby, but I heard he is enjoying the Elmo live we sent him. My heart breaks for Caylee, Cindy and George, they are the ones that are missing out . Christmas has always meant so much more than gifts to me, This year I am going to get exactly what I asked for, a tube of facial scrub, it was the only thing I could think of that I needed, I learned a long time ago unless society changes, I will never get what I truly want.
I hope Cindy and George are with loved ones tonight, The heartache and guilt that they carry will last a life time, I don't see how they will ever heal.

Casey will continue to live in her fantasy world believing either she did nothing wrong, or she was justified in doing what she did, my only comfort there is knowing where her soul is going.

Willow, my heart is with you. I've also always felt that Christmas is more than gifts. It is the love of family for those of us blessed enough to have that. There were a couple of years I was without that, after my parents died, my 'kid's' in their own lives, my divorce.
I cannot even imagine what George and Cindy are going thru tonight and I truly hope that the Lord will bless them with some kind of comfort.
As for Casey, I would like to be able to say I have prayed for her, but in all honesty, I haven't been able to. I don't think she has a soul, if she does, it is evil, and as you, I have faith and comfort knowing she will be held accountable for her horrendous act of murdering her own flesh and blood. Not only in this life thru the trial she faces, but in the next when she has to face her Creator and answer to Him.

[Amy]

Well then correct me, You are saying it's unlawful to post untruths about someone, as a fact. I agree, I haven't seen that here, but I have seen untruths spoken by the Anthonys, I guess they could get by the point claiming the heard it from Casey. But they believe Casey, so which is it, are the telling untruths, or are telling what they believe to be real?

I remember Cindy admitting that she had told some "mistruths" but not lies. I can't remember if she specified which statements were mistruths, tho.

[gaelicpeas]

You have to be careful WHAT you post, and HOW you post it. And, definitely, the use of IMO is encouraged. But you also can't just up and say anything you want about anybody anytime. There would need to be a background to it, like your opinion on what the A's said, or how Baez acted, whether or not you tho't their attire was appropriate for a specific occasion, etc.
Right - so if I just posted "CINDY DID IT", that could be a problem. But if I posted my reasons for why I thought so, then it would be okay. Or at least that is how I understand it.

JMO

[Amy]

there are at least 2 types of experts: expert witness and consulting expert. sometimes an attorney may hire a "consulting expert" who works behind the scenes to help the atty understand technical evidence, but who might not be prepared (or willing) to testify as an expert witness at trial. from the way that kobe has spoken at times, i wonder if he was hired purely as a consultant (and not as an expert witness), e.g. i've heard him say at least once that he was hired to "help" baez understand dna evidence.
it will be interesting to see what develops

You are right. I remember I think it was NG asking him half a dozen ways if he was going to testify in court and he has been careful to say he will be doing what Baez asks of him, and if that includes testifying, he would be doing what Baez asks of him (kind of redundant, lol.) He isn't gonna say one way or the other.

But in the 3 man defense witness list, was he specified, or just a medical expert? I can't remember now. If not, I guess we all just assumed he would be the one to testify.

[WillowInFlight]

I remember Cindy admitting that she had told some "mistruths" but not lies. I can't remember if she specified which statements were mistruths, tho.
Mistruths to me are lies, but thats not the point , the point is we, they, have a child lost. And George and Cindy are left to pick the pieces up, the only way I can see them doing that is to tell the truth, or quit telling mistruths, as the like to call it.

[ann10]

Speaking of lawsuits... I bet Jesse Grund and Amy have about as good of a chance to win a lawsuit against Cindy Anthony for dragging their name through the mud, as the Anthony's do against the media and message board posters.


This is true. Also, the bar is different for those in the public eye. In other words, the level of proof of actual damages is different for someone who's situation is being dissected in the public eye.

If it was you or me, the person suing would have to prove that the allegation is false, and that the person alleging it knew that it was false. They would also have to show that I am no longer held in the same esteem by others. A very difficult thing to prove.

The Anthonys would have to show that, plus that there is an objectively measurable financial damage.

These suits, and the likelihood of winning these suits is exceptionally rare. imo.

[Amy]

When I read "c", all I saw was references to nudity and pornographic materials.

I just read all of this (again), and I don't really see where there is any rule that says you can't theorize about someone's involvement in a case.

JMO

It doesn't say you can't theorize. It specifies tho, that each poster needs to be careful of how they post, what they post. Which is why IMO is a useful tool. Otherwise, some statements look to be as FACT when they are just a poster's opinion of a situation. a fact.

[WillowInFlight]

Thank You Oregongal, I just remember cherishing my kids and wished they would never grow, Now they have, and life is a Challenge with them, but a good challenge. Though at this age they sleep till 3:00 want nothing but money and want to be left alone, LOL. How we remember those days. I wish Casey at least gave it a chance, I just can't imagine why when she had it all, or did she?

[WillowInFlight]

Happy Holidays too you too, Willow.

You don't know how long I've been posting here, nor do I know how long you have. The bottom line is that everyone is allowed a respectful opinion here and I don't think you have a right to tell others to ignore the opinions of others.

I hope you understand that because, from what I've seen here, most do.

Duly noted.

[gaelicpeas]

It doesn't say you can't theorize. It specifies tho, that each poster needs to be careful of how they post, what they post. Which is why IMO is a useful tool. Otherwise, some statements look to be as FACT when they are just a poster's opinion of a situation. a fact.

Okay, then I think we are in agreement that we can theorize all we like as long as we say it is our own opinion and give some basis for our opinions.

JMO (lol)

[Oregongal]

It seems hard to believe it's been six years already. :rose:

It seems like just last year to me. That was the first major case I followed from start to finish.
It made a major impact on my life because seeing SP, I was finally able to recognize how sick my ex was and break away. I was finally able to learn so much I had not known about him and I thanked God that I was still alive.
As much as I grieved for Laci, Conner and Sharon and all of the family, I also thought as I have thought now about Caylee....there was a reason.
For me, I wanted to thank Laci, as well as God. At that time in the pain and confusion of my life, I saw the reason for her life and her death was for me. It was thru her the veil was lifted from my eyes and I finally saw what and who my ex was. It gave me the courage and strength to break away from him before he pulled a Scott Peterson.
I am praying that there may be other families that could possibly thru the death of Caylee will also be as affected as I was and that possibly a child will be saved from what she went thru.
Caylee, just like Laci and Conner were here for a reason.
:rose:

[ann10]

Has anyone heard of an exparte motion for a special master? Supposedly done today? What woould that be?


A special master is a person who is appointed by the judge to perform tasks. It can be an attorney or just somebody with specialized knowledge.

An example would be coordinating large and complex discovery.

It would have to be in some sort of context. Exparte means it's done without notice to the other party.

[Amy]

Right - so if I just posted "CINDY DID IT", that could be a problem. But if I posted my reasons for why I thought so, then it would be okay. Or at least that is how I understand it.

JMO

Sounds right.

[aubrey04]

Well, I am not scared of the Anthony's. I will post my opinion of them - no matter what.. Unless CW says we can no longer talk about George and Cindy.. and their actions.

The Anthony's put themselves in the public eye and under scrunity when they did several national talk show interviews. Their statements to the police and FBI are a part of public record. It is - what it is.

jmo

[ann10]

This isn't about the Anthonys. This is about a message board poster who for reasons of her/his own, is desperately trying to control what is posted about the Anthonys. It has gone beyond compassion and into the realm of the slightly scary, imo.


Well, whatever it's about, fear not, lawsuits are highly unlikely. Again, the bar is much higher for those who are in the public eye, and naturally subject to discussion. imo.

[WillowInFlight]

Willow has as much right to recommend that certain posters be ignored, as certain posters do to attempt to control the content of opinions that others post.

No I don't honey, and it's so out of character for me to do so. We all are allowed our opinion. But I do :wub: you!!! And I so understand what you are saying.

[breezie]

Merry Christmas everyone.

As far as blame, I can't lay blame on anyone else than an adult 22-year-old Casey Anthony.

I've read ms1950's and MerriMent's posts about George having been in LE and that he should have known better, and Cindy having a strong personality so she should have been able to stop Casey from so many bad decisions, etc., etc.

Quite frankly, thank God Cindy has had such a strong personality. The facts bear out that Cindy alone kept this family as functional as it was for many years, dealing with an addictive husband, an immature, pathological liar of a daughter whilst providing a loving environment for little Caylee during her few short years on this earth, while consulting legal counsel to ensure Caylee's future should something happen to Casey AND, more recently, consulting legal counsel to gain custody of Caylee. All the while working in a responsible job and paying the bills.

So many of you strong women posters talk about what you would have done yet, without having lived in Cindy's shoes, can you really, honestly say you could have created a different outcome?

May God help Cindy to get her through her first Christmas without little Caylee. No one adored that little girl more than she did.

hmmnnnn... Cindy has a dead granddaughter who was murdered by her own daughter, the child's mother. How's that working for Cindy?

PU-lease.

[gaelicpeas]

A special master is a person who is appointed by the judge to perform tasks. It can be an attorney or just somebody with specialized knowledge.

An example would be coordinating large and complex discovery.

It would have to be in some sort of context. Exparte means it's done without notice to the other party.

Thanks, Ann (sounds like you are in the legal profession). So what do you think this motion is about? TIA

[breezie]

You tell me. Are you blaming Cindy for Caylee's death now? Personally, I put the blame on Casey, but I respect that you may feel differently, despite all indications that Cindy has done nothing but try to provide a warm, loving environment for her.

no, of course not. But you are trying to make her some sort of martyr or saint. Just sayin' none of the *strong women* around here seem to have a child who is a murderer of their own grandchild. So Cindy has some ownership in the dysfunction that was her household.

[WillowInFlight]

Willow, you're a class act. :)

We are all hurting, we have grown to love this little girl, It's Christmas, her grandparents are mourning, that we can agree on. we may not agree on much else, but I think we can agree this angel met a mis-justice. fault is Casey. Work that Baez. ( yes I like to get the last word) LOL

[legalmania]

A special master is a person who is appointed by the judge to perform tasks. It can be an attorney or just somebody with specialized knowledge.

An example would be coordinating large and complex discovery.

It would have to be in some sort of context. Exparte means it's done without notice to the other party.

Don't they have something to do with prison?

[breezie]

Don't they have something to do with prison?

I don't think so. Remember the infamous sealed envelope in the OJ trial. A special master was named to retrieve it without the knowledge of the prosecution team. I don't think we ever found out what it was....many suspected the knife.

[WillowInFlight]

hmmnnnn... Cindy has a dead granddaughter who was murdered by her own daughter, the child's mother. How's that working for Cindy?

PU-lease.

I think that is working sick for Cindy right now, How would you think that is working for her?

[legalmania]

Donations to the Union Mission in Memory of Caylee.


http://www.wesh.com/video/18355236/index.html

I like to donate to the National Center for missing and exploded children because there are so many missing children that still need to be found. Caylee is a peace wherefore many children are not.

[Amy]

Don't they have something to do with prison?

Someone posted up thread that a special master was used in the Spector trial--the judge needed to decide if a former attorney's testimony could be used, and he recused himself and had a special master hear the testimony to make the decision. (If I understood it correctly.)

[legalmania]

I don't think so. Remember the infamous sealed envelope in the OJ trial. A special master was named to retrieve it without the knowledge of the prosecution team. I don't think we ever found out what it was....many suspected the knife.

One was appointed for 911 also to distribute funds wonder what the reason is for this case?

[legalmania]

The pressure on this board the last few days to say absolutely nothing except words of pity for the Anthonys has been intense. It's coming from no more than 2 or 3 posters, but it is non-stop, and is intended to guilt people into posting only what these 2 or 3 posters approve of. imo

Hey I don't mind playing bad cop but remember it's not necessairly the way I really think.

[breezie]

I think that is working sick for Cindy right now, How would you think that is working for her?

That's the point. Cindy's control and facade is NOT working, hence her daughter murdered her granddaughter. Cindy's no study in good parenting or family matters. Hers is in shambles around her. It didn't happen in a vacuum around her.

Yet, she still lies and covers and accuses the innocent. I just don't get the attraction some feel for her. I pity her. She learned too late that secrets fester.

[legalmania]

Someone posted up thread that a special master was used in the Spector trial--the judge needed to decide if a former attorney's testimony could be used, and he recused himself and had a special master hear the testimony to make the decision. (If I understood it correctly.)

You know what I bet it's because Casey can't go to the funeral.

[ann10]

Thanks, Ann (sounds like you are in the legal profession). So what do you think this motion is about? TIA


That post jumped out at me, because I can't imagine. They are typically used in large scale litigation with large numbers of plaintiffs. For example, the phen phen diet pill lawsuits, or asbestos litigation.

They would coordinate the production of documents, the timing of depositions, etc.

The court will utilize a special master for specialized fact finding. In New Jersey, there was a new type of breathalyzer being used for DWI's. There was a challenge made by certain defendants that the new breathalyzer was inaccurate. The court had to review and analyze some very technical matter, and there was a special master retained to make a determination and report to the court.


In the Anthony case, I really have no clue. The motion makes no sense. Do we even know if it was filed?

[breezie]

I don't even know how to respond to this post since you seem to have a lot of issues with not understanding the words I wrote (and your adding "martyr" and "saint" to them), your minimizing the capabilities of the wonderful women on this board, and your concluding that Cindy should own what happened to Caylee.

I'll leave it up to the many other intelligent women on this board tell you what is wrong with your premises.

Insulting me won't work, S. I understood completely what you wrote. I responded. Big deal. I don't agree with you.

You're putting words in my mouth like you accused me of doing. I never said Cindy should own Caylee's murder. She should own her own dysfunction. She still tries to make us think she's got the perfect family...everyone's just out to get them. If only Zanny..er Jesse...er Amy or ANYONE but Casey would just stand up. :rolleyes:

[legalmania]

A message board is for expression of opinions. It's for respectful debate about whatever the topic might be.

The constant guilting, badgering and holier-than-thou posting by a handful of posters is tiresome.

That's all I intend to say on the subject.





Tonite. :tongue:

It's cool we have all had our heated moments.

[legalmania]

That post jumped out at me, because I can't imagine. They are typically used in large scale litigation with large numbers of plaintiffs. For example, the phen phen diet pill lawsuits, or asbestos litigation.

They would coordinate the production of documents, the timing of depositions, etc.

The court will utilize a special master for specialized fact finding. In New Jersey, there was a new type of breathalyzer being used for DWI's. There was a challenge made by certain defendants that the new breathalyzer was inaccurate. The court had to review and analyze some very technical matter, and there was a special master retained to make a determination and report to the court.




In the Anthony case, I really have no clue. The motion makes no sense. Do we even know if it was filed?

I would not put it past the defense to file this motion on the grounds Casey was banned from the funeral.

[breezie]

It's cool we have all had our heated moments.

gotta love the ole holiday board.

[legalmania]

gotta love the ole holiday board.

I just got back on and things were hotter than my dinner.

[Amy]

That post jumped out at me, because I can't imagine. They are typically used in large scale litigation with large numbers of plaintiffs. For example, the phen phen diet pill lawsuits, or asbestos litigation.

They would coordinate the production of documents, the timing of depositions, etc.

The court will utilize a special master for specialized fact finding. In New Jersey, there was a new type of breathalyzer being used for DWI's. There was a challenge made by certain defendants that the new breathalyzer was inaccurate. The court had to review and analyze some very technical matter, and there was a special master retained to make a determination and report to the court.


In the Anthony case, I really have no clue. The motion makes no sense. Do we even know if it was filed?

There was a link to it (you had to insert the #'s of the case, etc) a few pages back. Under details, where there is a list of what has gone on by date, @ the bottom for 12/24/08 ex parte--can't remember the rest of the line. That's all it said, not who filed or anything. And, there is no link to click that would bring more detail to the item.

[legalmania]

There was a link to it (you had to insert the #'s of the case, etc) a few pages back. Under details, where there is a list of what has gone on by date, @ the bottom for 12/24/08 ex parte--can't remember the rest of the line. That's all it said, not who filed or anything. And, there is no link to click that would bring more detail to the item.

Ex-parte filed by who?

[ann10]

I would not put it past the defense to file this motion on the grounds Casey was banned from the funeral.

No, I doubt it. Baez will file a motion asking the judge to allow her to go to the funeral. The prosecution will argue that it's a security issue, and the judge will grant permission if it's proven to him that the viewing or funeral can be conducted in sufficient privacy. (My opinion)

I know the jail said she cannot go, but the judge has to make that decision. That is, if Casey wants to go and makes the request.

Mary Winkler attended her husband's funeral, although I'm not sure if she was out on bail at the time. I don't remember, but I don't think she was.

[Amy]

I would not put it past the defense to file this motion on the grounds Casey was banned from the funeral.

The jail spokesperson said their protocol would not allow her to go, but that they could appeal to the judge. From all that I have read or heard, they haven't done that. Unless, they went to Judge Strickland and HE filed for a special master to make the decision? I don't know why HE wouldn't make the decision, tho, he hasn't backed off from handing down all the other decisions.

Casey wasn't banned from the funeral. That would be an act on her parents' part and there has been no word that they have. I would think, if that were the case, that would have been one of those bombshells they like to put out on the talk shows. She isn't allowed to go to the funeral because protocol @ the jail is such that they don't take prisoners to funerals. It is their stance that the security risk would be too great, and I agree w/that wholeheartedly. And, I'm thinking that possibly Casey might think so, too, because, as to date, there has been no word that Baez has appealed to the judge on her behalf to have her go.

[legalmania]

No, I doubt it. Baez will file a motion asking the judge to allow her to go to the funeral. The prosecution will argue that it's a security issue, and the judge will grant permission if it's proven to him that the viewing or funeral can be conducted in sufficient privacy. (My opinion)

I know the jail said she cannot go, but the judge has to make that decision. That is, if Casey wants to go and makes the request.

Mary Winkler attended her husband's funeral, although I'm not sure if she was out on bail at the time. I don't remember, but I don't think she was.

Maybe then we enter the special master? I'm just trying to figure out how a special master came into this case.

[Amy]

Ex-parte filed by who?

It doesn't say.

[breezie]

Maybe then we enter the special master? I'm just trying to figure out how a special master came into this case.

I think it has to do with the Anthonys wanting immunity and some evidence. The Defense asked for a Special Master who works outside the discovery route. totally a guess though.

[legalmania]

The jail spokesperson said their protocol would not allow her to go, but that they could appeal to the judge. From all that I have read or heard, they haven't done that. Unless, they went to Judge Strickland and HE filed for a special master to make the decision? I don't know why HE wouldn't make the decision, tho, he hasn't backed off from handing down all the other decisions.

Casey wasn't banned from the funeral. That would be an act on her parents' part and there has been no word that they have. I would think, if that were the case, that would have been one of those bombshells they like to put out on the talk shows. She isn't allowed to go to the funeral because protocol @ the jail is such that they don't take prisoners to funerals. It is their stance that the security risk would be too great, and I agree w/that wholeheartedly. And, I'm thinking that possibly Casey might think so, too, because, as to date, there has been no word that Baez has appealed to the judge on her behalf to have her go.

I have a feeling the constitution will figure into it. OJ was able to go to Nicoles funeral and this was a very high profile case, of course he was not charged. Even though Casey is charged she is presumed innocent.

[legalmania]

It doesn't say.

Thank you.

[ann10]

Maybe then we enter the special master? I'm just trying to figure out how a special master came into this case.


Me too, it probably doesn't.

The exparte motion might be filed if for some reason there might be a prejudice if the other side was aware of it. For instance, the prosecution wants an order that the defense turn over a piece of physical evidence and the concern is that if they're aware of it ( the defense) that they might destroy the evidence.

I think the special master thing is just a case of 'lost in translation', but maybe not.