Nov 7th thru 10th

[MerriMent]

Then it would certainly be in Jason's best interests to identify that person, wouldn't it? For his sake, his mother's sake and MOST of all, for Cassidy's sake.

What's stopping him? Besides his belief that he can wait in his "insulated" world in Brevard for it all to go away?

Jason could point the finger at someone but there still needs to be evidence that someone is guilty of murder AND that Jason had nothing to do with it. That's what's stopping him from speaking, imo. How does he prove he had nothing to to with it?

[MerriMent]

What a pitiful interpretation. No, I am not saying that. I am saying that, perhaps, Michelle Young had reached the point in her marriage and/or her pregnancy where she no longer had any desire to be intimate with Jason.

And his frustration at that could be why he sought sex from others. It's not motive for murder.

[Cardinal]

Jason could point the finger at someone but there still needs to be evidence that someone is guilty of murder AND that Jason had nothing to do with it. That's what's stopping him from speaking, imo. How does he prove he had nothing to to with it?

According to what you posted earlier, the hotel video should do that for him.

[gbmy]

I have to believe that there is more video of JY at the hotel. Even if they didn't, I think a photo of him going down the hall towards the exit and not using his card key again shows opportunity.

I think that the 2 different size shoes is answered by the blisters on his feet. I think we all thought that he had a comfortable pair of shoes around the house in a smaller size and that is what he wore. Now to think that he deliberately wore a pair of smaller shoes to mislead LE is diabolical. If he went this far who knows if he didn't leave some foreign DNA also. He could have picked (no pun intended) a kleenix out of a wastebasket somewhere and "dropped" it at the scene.
A good lawyer, which he has, would easily shoot down a blisters on the feet theory. Too many things can cause blisters. His prints either match or they don't. And right now, they don't. Too much reasonable doubt to prove opportunity hence no arrest.

I hope he didn't do this, but after this last warrant, I think it's more likely he did then he didn't. I wish they nail the door shut on this case once and for all. The family deserves some semblance of closure.

[MerriMent]

Or she could have been seeing a therapist in preparation for a divorce. I find that more likely.

I don't. Most I know who have divorced have visited a lawyer, not a therapist who specializes in sex-related issues.

[Cardinal]

And his frustration at that could be why he sought sex from others. It's not motive for murder.

I don't recall saying that it was.

Are you saying that if someone's spouse has issues, it's okay to seek satisfaction elsewhere?

[MerriMent]

According to what you posted earlier, the hotel video should do that for him.

The hotel video doesn't prove he didn't participate in the planning of the murder.

[Cardinal]

I don't. Most I know who have divorced have visited a lawyer, not a therapist who specializes in sex-related issues.

Regardless of the therapist's alleged specialty, I find it admirable that Michelle was willing to seek therapy to deal with whatever issues she had. Don't you?

[MerriMent]

I don't recall saying that it was.

Are you saying that if someone's spouse has issues, it's okay to seek satisfaction elsewhere?

Nope I'm saying some who don't get it at home think they are justified going elsewhere.

[Cardinal]

The hotel video doesn't prove he didn't participate in the planning of the murder.

No, it doesn't. Do you think he did?

[Cardinal]

Nope I'm saying some who don't get it at home think they are justified going elsewhere.

I suppose they do. Speaks to character, imo.

[Cardinal]

~snipped for emphasis~

I wish they nail the door shut on this case once and for all. The family deserves some semblance of closure.

Amen. I can't imagine what it has been like for Michelle's family, particularly if they've known, and they probably have, the information contained in the latest SW.

[MerriMent]

A good lawyer, which he has, would easily shoot down a blisters on the feet theory. Too many things can cause blisters. His prints either match or they don't. And right now, they don't. Too much reasonable doubt to prove opportunity hence no arrest.

I hope he didn't do this, but after this last warrant, I think it's more likely he did then he didn't. I wish they nail the door shut on this case once and for all. The family deserves some semblance of closure.

After this last warrant, I think it's more likely he didn't do it. The warrant portrays him as such a jerk, it's grounds for change in venue. The DA made no move to seal it. The purpose seems to be both to embarrass him because he hasn't cooperated and to flush out another person.

[Wyn]

ITA. If the primary problem in their marriage was her dislike of sex, and Michelle decided to seek therapy about it in order to save her marriage, that might have set-off one of Jason's other women. I am curious why Michelle disliked sex so much. What could have possibly been the root of that problem?

I see that you have moved on to blaming the victim? No where is there any proof that "Michelle disliked sex so much". That's a line that cheaters use when they are trolling for sex outside their marriage. Sort of like the old line "My wife doesn't understand me". In this case, I think Michelle understood him quite well. If you have any proof to your statement above, a link would be nice. If not, I guess we'll just have to consider it wishful thinking on your part.

[Cardinal]

After this last warrant, I think it's more likely he didn't do it. The warrant portrays him as such a jerk, it's grounds for change in venue. The DA made no move to seal it. The purpose seems to be both to embarrass him because he hasn't cooperated and to flush out another person.

The warrant doesn't "portray him" as anything. The warrant simply incorporates his own words.

As for sealing it, you may not be aware that sealing a warrant is a much more difficult process in NC these days. Perhaps the judge declined to seal it.

[MerriMent]

No, it doesn't. Do you think he did?

No. I think he and Michelle decided to work on their marriage and that's why she visited the sex therapist. I think the killer is the scorned other woman.

[Wyn]

I don't. Most I know who have divorced have visited a lawyer, not a therapist who specializes in sex-related issues.

Michelle may have come across Jason's online searches for gay sex and gay bars in NYC. He would never has sought help for a therapist so perhaps that's why she was seeing a therapist? Looks like he gave her a good reason for not wanting to have sex with him. IF it was true. Of course, as many lies as Jason has told, what's one more about his sex life with Michelle? Maybe the therapist notes are all about Jason wanting to have sex with men?

[MerriMent]

The warrant doesn't "portray him" as anything. The warrant simply incorporates his own words.

As for sealing it, you may not be aware that sealing a warrant is a much more difficult process in NC these days. Perhaps the judge declined to seal it.

I'm aware there would be a public record of a request to seal it as well as the Judge's refusal.

[Wyn]

The warrant doesn't "portray him" as anything. The warrant simply incorporates his own words.

As for sealing it, you may not be aware that sealing a warrant is a much more difficult process in NC these days. Perhaps the judge declined to seal it.

If there was a "scorned" woman don't you think at some point LE would have come across cell phone records or emails to this woman from Jason, or to Jason from her?

[Cardinal]

No. I think he and Michelle decided to work on their marriage and that's why she visited the sex therapist. I think the killer is the scorned other woman.

May-be. I'm sure his work computer will shed some light on that possibility, it it's indeed a possibility. Not to mention the therapist's notes.

Btw, referring to the therapist is a "sex therapist" - do you have some substantiation that was her specialty?

[Wyn]

The warrant doesn't "portray him" as anything. The warrant simply incorporates his own words.

As for sealing it, you may not be aware that sealing a warrant is a much more difficult process in NC these days. Perhaps the judge declined to seal it.

You are correct, Cardinal, the judge has declined to seal any more warrants. That is why it was made public.

[Cardinal]

I'm aware there would be a public record of a request to seal it as well as the Judge's refusal.

Is there a record?

[MerriMent]

Michelle may have come across Jason's online searches for gay sex and gay bars in NYC. He would never has sought help for a therapist so perhaps that's why she was seeing a therapist? Looks like he gave her a good reason for not wanting to have sex with him. IF it was true. Of course, as many lies as Jason has told, what's one more about his sex life with Michelle? Maybe the therapist notes are all about Jason wanting to have sex with men?

Online searches for gay sex? Where is that in the warrant? Why would Jason Young be looking for gay bars in NYC? How could a therapist help Michelle if Jason is gay? Her choice was to either accept it or divorce. :shrug:

[MerriMent]

Is there a record?

There is public record of all search warrants. Only one is sealed. :read:

[Cardinal]

There is public record of all search warrants. Only one is sealed. :read:

My questions was, is there a public record of the request to seal this latest warrant?

[MerriMent]

You are correct, Cardinal, the judge has declined to seal any more warrants. That is why it was made public.

The search warrant was made public because it was returned. No request was made by the DA to seal it.

[MerriMent]

My questions was, is there a public record of the request to seal this latest warrant?

No because no request was made by the DA.

[Kat4Eagles]

[QUOTE=Cardinal;12400326]For the record, I'm willing to consider that a scorned woman or a hired killer murdered Michelle. But there's too much known at this point to rule out his involvement completely.

JMO[/QUOTE


Hi Card ,

I am still not getting this.

Not that I am flip flopping again, but something is still not right.

You can not have all this evidence against someone and not arrest them.

You have more then circumstantial edvidence now, there is physical evidence.

There are emails that show Jason's state of mind and thought process.

I hate how he treated Kim.

The comment about her hanging with his friends, is smug and demeaning, like she wouldn't fit in with his cool Raleigh friends.

I hate what MM did to her friend, I don't know how she can sleep.

I hate what she did to her husband cause she was "lonely".

And , the words once again, Card, that you used, "caring, open, sharing, giving", :barf bag included:

You were married, stupid.

You can't even be considered naive as Amber Frey was.
Amber did not know Scott was married, and she certainly was not
Laci's friend.

You were!!!!!!!

I had a chance to listen to the video news conference held by the Sheriff's office, and one thing he said concerned me.

Such as he would like to make an arrest tomorrow, but he has to play the cards he was dealt.

So, who else is holding cards and why do they beat LE's cards?

And, then from LF's lawyers, that it would take a minimum of a year to get the civil suit heard, that it may be more like 18 months.!!

So, what happens to C?

I think there are some dangerous games being played with C and have been from the beginning.

Openly admitting to the public that she may be a witness, and then leaving her out there.

There is much more to this.

I don't understand why head injuries were looked up.

One hit placed right would kill someone.

I don't think C was drugged, I think those were just meds kept in her room, maybe Michelle slept in there from time to time.

I don't know how anyone can be so stupid with their computers, Scott with his tide searches, Justin Barber with gun wounds, and now Jason with head injuries.

And, I guess the biggest thing is staying in contact with MM, and she with him....

~Two~STUPID and~SELFISH~people that probably deserved each other, too bad that they were married to other people, and that one of the people had to die.

:no:

K, my weekend post, back to the game!!

:seeya:

Kat

[JHP]

If there was a "scorned" woman don't you think at some point LE would have come across cell phone records or emails to this woman from Jason, or to Jason from her?


Maybe it was a "scorned" man:shrug: I hope LE has checked those out.

[Cardinal]

~snipped for emphasis~

If he wanted to be seem at midnight he is dumber than I thought.
Why would he want that ?



There have been posters here who have, for months/years, disputed Jason's involvement because of the tight timeline. Maybe being seen at midnight was intended to create exactly that doubt.

[Cardinal]

~snipped for space~

Hi Card ,

I am still not getting this.

Not that I am flip flopping again, but something is still not right.

You can not have all this evidence against someone and not arrest them.

You have more then circumstantial edvidence now, there is physical evidence.


:seeya:

Kat

Hi, Kat. :) I'm glad to see you.

I agree, something isn't right. If they have all of this, there should be an arrest. You've said all along that someone should be worried about Cassidy if this is true. Okay, I'm worried.

[MerriMent]

And the frequency of calls the morning/afternoon after the murder? Excuse for those? The calling behavior is highly suspect.

So...he was working on his marriage and calling MM at 7:40 in the morning? Right.

Highly suspect of what exactly? LE didn't tell us how many of those calls actually connected. He was traveling in the mountains. What is the quality of reception? I don't know. He could have been working on his marriage and still talking to MM because there is no mention that they had sex after October 7th and she did say, "I wish things were different for all of us" on October 28. Sounds to me that their sexual affair was over.

[MerriMent]

And you know this how ?
For your information, the cops can ask the judge to seal a SW, not just the DA.

The request would be public record and the news media would report it as they have done all along.

[Wyn]

The search warrant was made public because it was returned. No request was made by the DA to seal it.

No request was made because the judge had already said he wasn't going to seal any more warrants.

[Cardinal]

Highly suspect of what exactly? LE didn't tell us how many of those calls actually connected. He was traveling in the mountains. What is the quality of reception? I don't know. He could have been working on his marriage and still talking to MM because there is no mention that they had sex after October 7th and she did say, "I wish things were different for all of us" on October 28. Sounds to me that their sexual affair was over.

I really don't care about the last time Jason and Michelle Money had sexual relations. In fact, I don't care about the first time. It happened - the dates don't matter.

And what was he talking to her about for 27 minutes on the way to Brevard that afternoon, while his MIL was trying to tell him his wife was dead? Again, I don't care about the content of the conversation. The affair was not over, imo.

[Wyn]

Online searches for gay sex? Where is that in the warrant? Why would Jason Young be looking for gay bars in NYC? How could a therapist help Michelle if Jason is gay? Her choice was to either accept it or divorce. :shrug:


I wouldn't know why he was looking for gay bars in NYC. Maybe he was going to hit them the next time he went to NY with Michelle to visit her family? Maybe the therapist was helping Michelle deal with the fact she thought she'd married a normal heterosexual man and it was upset to find out her life was a lie. Maybe she was trying to find a way to get Jason to go to therapy with her? Guess we'll have to wait for that information, won't we?

[MerriMent]

snipped for length

And, I guess the biggest thing is staying in contact with MM, and she with him....

~Two~STUPID and~SELFISH~people that probably deserved each other, too bad that they were married to other people, and that one of the people had to die.

:no:

K, my weekend post, back to the game!!

:seeya:

Kat

:read: the search warrant. MM and JY didn't stay in contact with one another sexually. That's huge to me.

[MerriMent]

No request was made because the judge had already said he wasn't going to seal any more warrants.

When did the judge say that? I missed it.

[Kat4Eagles]

Hi, Kat. :) I'm glad to see you.

I agree, something isn't right. If they have all of this, there should be an arrest. You've said all along that someone should be worried about Cassidy if this is true. Okay, I'm worried.


:seeya:

Thank you, you too!!

I know that was a long post, I had time to think on the ride home tonite.

I see we have some new posters, welcome, you have every right to be here!!

I don't know, something is not right.

When does "complicated" mean impossible?

Was the release of this last s/w to concur with the wrongful death suit
filed somehow?

I am more confused than ever.

But, if Jason becomes desperate, and desperate people do desperate things, then I don't want to be one of those people watching helplessly as a train wreck happens, when we have all expressed concerns.

Kat

[MerriMent]

Thanks for pointing that out.
If true, Jason had even more reason to rid himself from Michelle.
The 7:49 am call on Friday am was his first attempt to get cozy again....he knew he was now free.

Fact is, They didn't end up together.

[MerriMent]

They saw each other in Myrtle Beach the summer of 2007
Where you there ?

Only mention of sex was October 7. :read:

[Kat4Eagles]

:read: the search warrant. MM and JY didn't stay in contact with one another sexually. That's huge to me.


I did read it, and it is big, huge even.

But you know what else is big, huge even?

The fact that MM must have believed in Jason's innocence all that time.

Did she ever have any doubts?

If not, why?

Kat

[Cardinal]

:seeya:

Thank you, you too!!

I know that was a long post, I had time to think on the ride home tonite.

I see we have some new posters, welcome, you have every right to be here!!

I don't know, something is not right.

When does "complicated" mean impossible?

Was the release of this last s/w to concur with the wrongful death suit
filed somehow?

I am more confused than ever.

But, if Jason becomes desperate, and desperate people do desperate things, then I don't want to be one of those people watching helplessly as a train wreck happens, when we have all expressed concerns.

Kat

The only thing I can think at this point is that Willoughby is being his usual cautious self - he's known for that, I believe.

But I don't want to watch a train wreck either - not when it comes to that precious child. Maybe the media attention will put pressure on Willoughby to act.

Maybe we should all sign a petition. :biggrin:

[MerriMent]

I wouldn't know why he was looking for gay bars in NYC. Maybe he was going to hit them the next time he went to NY with Michelle to visit her family? Maybe the therapist was helping Michelle deal with the fact she thought she'd married a normal heterosexual man and it was upset to find out her life was a lie. Maybe she was trying to find a way to get Jason to go to therapy with her? Guess we'll have to wait for that information, won't we?

Therapy wouldn't change someone's sexual orientation. And if Jason is gay or bi-sexual all Michelle could do is accept it or divorce. I don't see Michelle's finding out about his sexuality as motive for Jason to kill her. The search warrant makes it pretty clear Jason was quite open about his sexual needs.

You said Jason was searching online for gay sex. Where do you get that? I don't see that in the search warrant.

[Cardinal]

I did read it, and it is big, huge even.

But you know what else is big, huge even?

The fact that MM must have believed in Jason's innocence all that time.

Did she ever have any doubts?

If not, why?

Kat

Don't you think she must've had doubts, Kat? Did she believe, or could she just not bring herself to believe otherwise? Is it possible she was so enamored of him that she quieted her doubts? Maybe because to admit them would make her role all the more terrible?

[Cardinal]

Therapy wouldn't change someone's sexual orientation. And if Jason is gay or bi-sexual all Michelle could do is accept it or divorce. I don't see Michelle's finding out about his sexuality as motive for Jason to kill her. The search warrant makes it pretty clear Jason was quite open about his sexual needs.

You said Jason was searching online for gay sex. Where do you get that? I don't see that in the search warrant.

Do you think Jason is gay or bi-sexual???

[Kat4Eagles]

The only thing I can think at this point is that Willoughby is being his usual cautious self - he's known for that, I believe.

But I don't want to watch a train wreck either - not when it comes to that precious child. Maybe the media attention will put pressure on Willoughby to act.

Maybe we should all sign a petition. :biggrin:



I trust L E and their judgment, but then again, all of this stuff is still new to me, they have had it for awhile.

The only thing I believe is what is actually in the s/w's.

I woud never insert myself into a case, thinking I was more important or smarter then the law.

Let them do their job.

Maybe C is safer than we think, I know I trust Kim completely, and she was looking out for her.

Kat

[MerriMent]

I did read it, and it is big, huge even.

But you know what else is big, huge even?

The fact that MM must have believed in Jason's innocence all that time.

Did she ever have any doubts?

If not, why?

Kat

I think it is because she knew Jason and Michelle were working on it. If they decided to work out their problems, no motive to murder Michelle.

I believe that was part of the discussion Jason had with Kim when she's upset neither he nor his lawyer are doing anything to sway public opinion. He says he'd been told from the start that public opinion would put him on trial and said if it helps filter out his true friends that's okay.

[Cardinal]

I trust L E and their judgment, but then again, all of this stuff is still new to me, they have had it for awhile.

The only thing I believe is what is actually in the s/w's.

I woud never insert myself into a case, thinking I was more important or smarter then the law.

Let them do their job.

Maybe C is safer than we think, I know I trust Kim completely, and she was looking out for her.

Kat

I hope you're right, Kat, about Cassidy being safe. One tragedy is more than enough. But Kim is hours away.

[MerriMent]

Showing Mike Peterson was bi-sexual was a big part of the DA's case and allowed by the judge as relevant, showing motive.

It was in the SW, please read again :read:

It was part of that case but it wasn't the motive for murdering Peterson's wife. Money was the motive.

[Cardinal]

I think it is because she knew Jason and Michelle were working on it. If they decided to work out their problems, no motive to murder Michelle.

I believe that was part of the discussion Jason had with Kim when she's upset neither he nor his lawyer are doing anything to sway public opinion. He says he'd been told from the start that public opinion would put him on trial and said if it helps filter out his true friends that's okay.

So you don't think the other woman had a motive? Since Jason and Michelle were working out their problems.

ETA: And actually, Jason didn't say "public opinion" - he said "public trial."

[Kat4Eagles]

Don't you think she must've had doubts, Kat? Did she believe, or could she just not bring herself to believe otherwise? Is it possible she was so enamored of him that she quieted her doubts? Maybe because to admit them would make her role all the more terrible?




But,see, that is something else I am having trouble with.

Since when did Jason Young become Brad Pitt?

No offense.

Kat

[MerriMent]

Do you think Jason is gay or bi-sexual???


No..........

[Wyn]

When did the judge say that? I missed it.

It's somewhere in all those links at www.wral.com. It was discussed previously here, or maybe that was somewhere else...... Bud can probably tell you for sure, even the name of the judge. He's really on top of this stuff. ;)

[MerriMent]

So you don't think the other woman had a motive? Since Jason and Michelle were working out their problems.

ETA: And actually, Jason didn't say "public opinion" - he said "public trial."


I wasn't quoting Jason exactly. Same meaning.

I do believe the other woman had a motive. I don't believe that other woman was Michelle Money, who lived in Florida. I believe it was someone else he was sleeping with in Raleigh.

[Kat4Eagles]

I hope you're right, Kat, about Cassidy being safe. One tragedy is more than enough. But Kim is hours away.



I have been a huge defender of C's safety from the beginning and wondered repeatedly here, why the Fishers did not step in.

I would much rather see a custody suit filed, if Jason killed Michelle, than one for monetary reasons.

Kat

[MerriMent]

So why were they allowed to introduce such inflammatory evidence ?
Kathleen found his gay porn on the computer and he then proceeded to kill her to protect his dirty little secret.

Inflammatory evidence is allowed at trial.

[Cardinal]

But,see, that is something else I am having trouble with.

Since when did Jason Young become Brad Pitt?

No offense.

Kat

KAT!!! Did you really just say that??? LOL

Go figure what attracts people to each other, huh? Especially when the overwhelming majority of the contact is verbal and emails, rather than face to face. Words are powerful, Kat - I think you know that.

[MerriMent]

I have been a huge defender of C's safety from the beginning and wondered repeatedly here, why the Fishers did not step in.

I would much rather see a custody suit filed, if Jason killed Michelle, than one for monetary reasons.

Kat

I've wondered why LE didn't step in from the beginning. They're the ones who found the adult drugs in CY's bedroom.

[MerriMent]

KAT!!! Did you really just say that??? LOL

Go figure what attracts people to each other, huh? Especially when the overwhelming majority of the contact is verbal and emails, rather than face to face. Words are powerful, Kat - I think you know that.

Creating babies requires a face-to-face meeting and I don't believe I'd want to continue with that goal if I suspected my lover killed his wife. I sure wouldn't remain in contact with him, either.

[MerriMent]

Well in that case the defense objected strongly and lost.
the judge ruled his sexual orientation went to motive.

There's nothing I've seen that suggests sexual orientation is part of motive in this case.

[Cardinal]

Creating babies requires a face-to-face meeting and I don't believe I'd want to continue with that goal if I suspected my lover killed his wife. I sure wouldn't remain in contact with him, either.

Well, that's you. And me, too. But neither of us knows how Michelle Money thinks, do we?

[jerry50]

I have been a huge defender of C's safety from the beginning and wondered repeatedly here, why the Fishers did not step in.

I would much rather see a custody suit filed, if Jason killed Michelle, than one for monetary reasons.

Kat

I think way back we found out that grandparent's do not have any rights in NC. ALso Linda may have thought at the time that Cassidy was safe because she was left alive and didn't want to traumatize her further by also taking her away from her dad.

[MerriMent]

Well, that's you. And me, too. But neither of us knows how Michelle Money thinks, do we?

We know she didn't cease contact altogether with JY, which I believe was Kat's point.

[MerriMent]

I think way back we found out that grandparent's do not have any rights in NC. ALso Linda may have thought at the time that Cassidy was safe because she was left alive and didn't want to traumatize her further by also taking her away from her dad.

The grandparent's of the Cooper children didn't hesitate to obtain temporary custody. I think if they hadn't done so, CPS would have stepped in.

[Kat4Eagles]

Very insightful summary of your thoughts. I've been a staunch supporter of JY since this thread opened. I must say that after reading this latest SW, the most detailed account of events thus far, my belief in his innocence is erroding. It is extremely hard for me to get my arms around why JY would be googling things BEFORE the murder like 'head trauma knockout', 'anatomy of a knockout', and 'right posterior parietal occipital region'. How can such searches mean anything other than what was in his mind at the time?

My opinion of what's preventing an arrest is the difference in shoe sizes (10 at the crime scene vs. the size 12 JY purchased). Not being able to definitively put him at the scene of the crime is a huge hole. And, if they can't definitively prove he walked out of the hotel exit that night, then that's another big hole.


Good post !!
I agree.

Kat

[Cardinal]

We know she didn't cease contact altogether with JY, which I believe was Kat's point.

So maybe we do know how she thinks. Maybe her libido takes precedence over her principles.

ETA: Actually, since she had an affair with her "good friend's" husband, I'd say that's a given.

[Wyn]

Judge Stephens issued an administrative order 6-1-08 requiring the cops to return all SW's w/o delay (they were sitting on many w/o seal ).
However, the cops and DA can still ask for a seal.

Wyn , i think you were thinking about not allowing the cops to 'sit on them' w/o proper return to the clerk any longer.

Okay, thanks. So they cannot sit on them, but can STILL request they be sealed.

[Kat4Eagles]

I wonder where Kat is? Like me, I know he has been steadfast in his defense of JY. I expended quite a bit of time trying to show empathy for him and it now appears it was not warranted. I feel so, so bad for Cassidy. She will have to grow up to be a very strong woman of faith to rise above all of this. That's where our prayers should be directed.


I am here, I already sucked it up for being wrong.
Although, I could be wrong again.

:confused:

I may just sit on the sidelines for awhile!!

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

I went back to the 2/14 SWs to see if these latest revelations shed any more light on them.

http://dig.abclocal.go.com/wtvd/youngwarrants.pdf

From the description of items to be seized: an egg shaped sterling silver tooth box with an attached ribbon

On the inventory of items seized: 1 brown paper coach bag with white rag and ribbon

Ribbon...ribbon. Interesting.

JMO

Card, please explain the ribbon reference to me?

over my head:

Kat

[Cardinal]

I am here, I already sucked it up for being wrong.
Although, I could be wrong again.

:confused:

I may just sit on the sidelines for awhile!!

Kat

Kat, I've always been willing to be wrong. :) We're all just trying to figure it out. Hopefully - based on facts.

This latest SW really set me back, and I don't expect it to do less for anyone else.

Facts, Kat. Nothing more; nothing less.

[Cardinal]

Card, please explain the ribbon reference to me?

:over my head:

Kat

After I had the Coach packaging explained to me, I don't think it means anything, Kat. I just noticed that the sterling tooth box had a ribbon and the bag had a ribbon in it. But apparently a Coach bag package comes with a ribbon. Just a thought that didn't go anywhere.

[Kat4Eagles]

June, the way I read the emails, Jason meant that the 2 broken hearts would belong to Michelle (Young) and Steve Money. Take another look at them.

And I wonder why she kept seeing him until Jan 08.


Not too sure about this, the 2 broken hearts may have meant that they knew they could never be together....

I am so mad at MM too.
What was she thinking?

Kat

[Cardinal]

You can't be serious.
Are you saying a scorned woman alone murdered MY ?

No, I'm not saying that. But if someone else cares to make a case for it, I'll consider it. And then I'll decide if it's credible for me.

I've floated some theories on this board that may or may not have been credible. I'll give the same courtesy to someone else.

[Cardinal]

Not too sure about this, the 2 broken hearts may have meant that they knew they could never be together....

I am so mad at MM too.
What was she thinking?

Kat

I think she was thinking with something other than her brain. :cool:

[Kat4Eagles]

After I had the Coach packaging explained to me, I don't think it means anything, Kat. I just noticed that the sterling tooth box had a ribbon and the bag had a ribbon in it. But apparently a Coach bag package comes with a ribbon. Just a thought that didn't go anywhere.



:lol:

K, but, don't feel bad, we have all done it.

Kat

[Cardinal]

:lol:

K, but, don't feel bad, we have all done it.

Kat

Thanks, Kat. :D

[Kat4Eagles]

I think she was thinking with something other than her brain. :cool:



.............or watched too many episodes of Desperate Housewives.

I hope no one tries to portray her as a victim of Jason Young's charms.

Maybe he gives good phone "text"..

:biggrin:

Kat

[Cardinal]

.............or watched too many episodes of Desperate Housewives.

I hope no one tries to portray her as a victim of Jason Young's charms.

Maybe he is good at "text"..

:biggrin:

Kat

ROTFL Okay, that's it for me.

Have a good one! :seeya:

[Lindsey]

I'm still trying to pick myself up off the floor, catch my breath, and process what I've read. Maybe I can make sense of it all at some point. I hope.

[Kat4Eagles]

1) Why with all the ways to kill someone, why would you go for the most brutal kind of killing?

Jason had access to drugs.

2) Did you notice that in the WDS that LF calls Jason a murderer or an accessory to murder?

Is this done because she has to cover all the bases in case it turns out to be a hit, and still wants him to be held responsible?

Or, was this done because there really is evidence that L E is holding that there were 2 people there?

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

I'm still trying to pick myself up off the floor, catch my breath, and process what I've read. Maybe I can make sense of it all at some point. I hope.



Hi Lin!!

Things sure seem to be clearer about what kind of a person Jason was.

What are your thoughts?


Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

[QUOTE=MerriMent;12398053]I'm talking about their conversations. QUOTE]



Thats another thing.!!

All these statements about Jason's inappropriate behavior, when things in the workplace are so different now.

Why didn't anyone file a sexual harrassment complaint?

And, the same with her friends.

If they thought Jason was so bad, why didn't someone tell Michelle?

Why, is it always, in retrospect, that when people look back, they see

all these things, but never do anything about them at the time?

:no:

Kat

[Lindsey]

1) Why with all the ways to kill someone, why would you go for the most brutal kind of killing?

Jason had access to drugs.

2) Did you notice that in the WDS that LF calls Jason a murderer or an accessory to murder?

Is this done because she has to cover all the bases in case it turns out to be a hit, and still wants him to be held responsible?

Or, was this done because there really is evidence that L E is holding that there were 2 people there?

Kat


The language used in the lawsuit might be standard, I don't know.

Or that could be what's holding up an arrest if they have evidence of two killers and don't have what they need to proceed. I think they should have continued to keep things close to the vest if they aren't ready to make an arrest. But why aren't they??

IMO

[Kat4Eagles]

The language used in the lawsuit might be standard, I don't know.

Or that could be what's holding up an arrest if they have evidence of two killers and don't have what they need to proceed. I think they should have continued to keep things close to the vest if they aren't ready to make an arrest. But why aren't they??

IMO

I don't know.

And, another thing I didn't know, is that C was found in the bed!!
I thought she was walking around the house?

???

Kat

[Lindsey]

Hi Lin!!

Things sure seem to be clearer about what kind of a person Jason was.

What are your thoughts?


Kat

My thoughts? Jason is scum and so is Michelle Money!!! Neither are the kind of people I would want my son or daughter to be involved with even if we weren't talking about a murder. But unfortunately we are.

My thoughts aren't really clear enough yet for me to be posting. I don't even know why I'm here. I'm just sick.

[Barbara2]

My thoughts? Jason is scum and so is Michelle Money!!! Neither are the kind of people I would want my son or daughter to be involved with even if we weren't talking about a murder. But unfortunately we are.

My thoughts aren't really clear enough yet for me to be posting. I don't even know why I'm here. I'm just sick.

You're not alone in that feeling. A lot of posters from both sides of the fence can agree with your post.

[Lindsey]

I don't know.

And, another thing I didn't know, is that C was found in the bed!!
I thought she was walking around the house?

???

Kat


Yeah, that was news to me too. Maybe that explains why she wasn't covered in blood if she had just woke up? She hadn't had time yet to find her mom and try to get her to 'wake up'. That always puzzled me that she wasn't covered in blood causing the first responders to think she might be injured and have her checked out at the ER. Maybe they did?

If LE found the medication in her room right off the bat, I wonder if they tested her to see if she had anything in her system that didn't belong there. At what point of the investigation did they find the meds in Cassidy's room?

Still so many questions.

[Lindsey]

You're not alone in that feeling. A lot of posters from both sides of the fence can agree with your post.

Hey Barbara

Is there still a fence? I feel like somebody snatched it out from under me.

[Barbara2]

Hey Barbara

Is there still a fence? I feel like somebody snatched it out from under me.

One side has gotten considerably less crowded but there is still a dissenting voice to be heard infrequently.

[Barbara2]

I don't believe for one minute Jason put that drug on Cassie's shelf that night. That drug was either in Cassie's room before Michelle died and she knew about it or someone put it there to make it look like Jason did. MF should know which it was. Jason may not be a genius but he isn't a fool either. If he used any drug on Cassie it certainly wouldn't have stayed in the house much less in her room.

I cannot believe that after everything that you know that you are still trying to point the finger at Meredith. There is no indication that she had anything to do with this crime. There is every indication that Jason did have something to do with it. IMO

[Barbara2]

How am I pointing a finger at MF? Please explain.

Why did you say that "MF should know which it was"? How would Meredith know what was in Cassidy's room? She didn't live there anymore.

[Barbara2]

In the SW Jason is telling MM that MF is at the house. I assume she was in Cassie's room. Maybe she wasn't. I took you off of ignore because I thought we were all gonna play fair . I guess not if you intend to pick on every word I type.

I'm not picking on every word. I just don't understand why you want to pick on Meredith.

Jason's email to MM was referring to Meredith being there for him to talk to. It made no reference to her being there physically. That doesn't begin to translate into Meredith being in Cassie's room.

[Cardinal]

Nice while it lasted, eh?

Thanks to everyone who made the effort.

[annalyzer]

Who said Michelle disliked sex? Maybe she just didn't like it with Jason any more.
ITA and after the latest I can see why.

[Barbara2]

ITA and after the latest I can see why.

I think that those who want to defend him are forgetting how much trauma Michelle's body had been through in a short period of time. She had a 2 year old child, had been pregnant, been in an accident, had a miscarriage and in a very short period of time, was pregnant again. She was working full time, taking care of a toddler and didn't have the support of her husband. No surprise that she didn't feel amorous, IMO.

[annalyzer]

I think that those who want to defend him are forgetting how much trauma Michelle's body had been through in a short period of time. She had a 2 year old child, had been pregnant, been in an accident, had a miscarriage and in a very short period of time, was pregnant again. She was working full time, taking care of a toddler and didn't have the support of her husband. No surprise that she didn't feel amorous, IMO.


Not only that but just his attitude, as we have witnessed through the latest sw, would turn me off.

[Lindsey]

It will be interesting to me when all the phone records are revealed, where exactly was he when he called MM that Friday morning at 7:49(?) If he was still in the area of the HI, his excuse of getting lost - thus being late for his 10:00 meeting - doesn't hold water. He should have been way gone from the HI by then. Well, I don't believe the excuse already but the pings on his phone will prove he was lying.

I don't find it suspicious that the Ebay auction for that purse was ending on Thursday night. He might not have been intending to buy it from Ebay but used that site to find a picture to show, just the same as has been done here many times. Did Michelle already have a Coach purse? If not, where did the Coach stuff come from that was found in the 2/14 SW?

I'm still trying to absorb some of this stuff.

[jerry50]

Yeah, that was news to me too. Maybe that explains why she wasn't covered in blood if she had just woke up? She hadn't had time yet to find her mom and try to get her to 'wake up'. That always puzzled me that she wasn't covered in blood causing the first responders to think she might be injured and have her checked out at the ER. Maybe they did?

If LE found the medication in her room right off the bat, I wonder if they tested her to see if she had anything in her system that didn't belong there. At what point of the investigation did they find the meds in Cassidy's room?

Still so many questions.

Does any one know if Cassidy was potty trained? If she was still wearing a diaper, LE may have been able to test the urine in the diaper for the drug.

[Kat4Eagles]

I imagine we all feel sick.

But, I don't regret defending Jason or holding out until there were more facts released, facts, not rumors.

I always said I would need more to think he was involved.

Now, I have it, more or less.

But ,something is still wrong.

You can not have 50 things in the guilt column, without having something that discredits them in the innocent column.

Something pretty powerful that has made the arrest so far an impossibility.

Kat

[alter ego]

Something pretty powerful that has made the arrest so far an impossibility.

Kat

It's called 'reasonable doubt'.

[alter ego]

I think that those who want to defend him are forgetting how much trauma Michelle's body had been through in a short period of time. She had a 2 year old child, had been pregnant, been in an accident, had a miscarriage and in a very short period of time, was pregnant again. She was working full time, taking care of a toddler and didn't have the support of her husband. No surprise that she didn't feel amorous, IMO.I thought she had a medical abortion, not a miscarriage.

[Kat4Eagles]

It's called 'reasonable doubt'.


It is hard to believe that with what all they have, that there is something that they don't have, that makes them afraid to go ahead with an arrest?

Most of have here have finally reached the same conclusion, more or less.

I mean, I might still want a little more..but, most of you are satisfied.


Kat

[alter ego]

It is hard to believe that with what all they have, that there is something that they don't have, that makes them afraid to go ahead with an arrest?

Most of have here have finally reached the same conclusion, more or less.

I mean, I might still want a little more..but, most of you are satisfied.


KatAltho I am inclined to believe Jason killed Michelle, if what we know from the SWs was presented to me in court, it would be insufficient to prove murder BARD.

Franklin10 shoe print at the scene has to be explained

walking toward an exit does not mean that exit was used

The SW alludes that Jason proppped open an exit door. This indicates that if Jason comitted this crime, he intended to return to the hotel. How does his return to the hotel fit into the timeline established in the SWs and how does that jive with cell phone tower pings of his location that morning?

[alter ego]

A miscarriage is referred to as a "spontaneous abortion" in medical terminology.
Most of the time , a D and C is done , post miscarriage to remove any extra tissue or detritus , which is in the best interest of the mother.Yeah I know.

She had a medical induced abortion because the fetus stopped developing, not a miscarriage or spontaneous expulsion of the fetus.

[Kat4Eagles]

Altho I am inclined to believe Jason killed Michelle, if what we know from the SWs was presented to me in court, it would be insufficient to prove murder BARD.

Franklin10 shoe print at the scene has to be explained

walking toward an exit does not mean that exit was used

The SW alludes that Jason proppped open an exit door. This indicates that if Jason comitted this crime, he intended to return to the hotel. How does his return to the hotel fit into the timeline established in the SWs and how does that jive with cell phone tower pings of his location that morning?


We can only go by the sheriff's words too.

That he wishes he could make an arrest tomorrow, but he has to play the cards he was dealt.

Something to that effect..

So, does this mean the killer or killers is holding a better hand?

I say, someone should call their bluff and everyone puts all the cards on the table.

If ever there was a time to go all in, this is it.

This 2 year old stalemate waiting for someone to blink needs to end.

Kat

[Lindsey]

We can only go by the sheriff's words too.

That he wishes he could make an arrest tomorrow, but he has to play the cards he was dealt.

Something to that effect..

So, does this mean the killer or killers is holding a better hand?

I say, someone should call their bluff and everyone puts all the cards on the table.

If ever there was a time to go all in, this is it.

This 2 year old stalemate waiting for someone to blink needs to end.

Kat


Yeah, Harrison's choice of words made me go 'huh?' when he said they would be tickled to death if they could make an arrest tomorrow etc. etc.

Why can't they?!?!?! If the stuff in the SWs are true, and it must be, they have way more CE for an arrest than any case I've heard of.

Something is very wrong with this picture, IMO.

[Lindsey]

Yeah I know.

She had a medical induced abortion because the fetus stopped developing, not a miscarriage or spontaneous expulsion of the fetus.

That is the way I remember it too. Since she didn't have a miscarriage, it was necessary to do a medical abortion since the baby had died. That procedure is usually easier on the woman's body but harder on her emotions, according to what I've heard from women who have been through that.

[alter ego]

We can only go by the sheriff's words too.

That he wishes he could make an arrest tomorrow, but he has to play the cards he was dealt.

Something to that effect..

So, does this mean the killer or killers is holding a better hand?

I say, someone should call their bluff and everyone puts all the cards on the table.

If ever there was a time to go all in, this is it.

This 2 year old stalemate waiting for someone to blink needs to end.

KatThe DA only gets one bite at the apple so a good DA will build a solid case, particularly when a whole lot of inference is involved.

And Jason's silence has meant that WSCO has to do a whole lot of leg work since they don't have LE's favorite 'weapon' - the words of the person they are interested in, words to use against him.

[alter ego]

No. That is incorrect.A miscarriage or spontaneous abortion IS an expulsion of the fetus. A D and C is done to clean out any remnants left behind to prevent infection and excessive bleeding. A medically induced abortion is different.How is what I said incorrect when it's the same thing you said.

me: a miscarriage or spontaneous expulsion of the fetus.

you: A miscarriage or spontaneous abortion IS an expulsion of the fetus

:read:

[alter ego]

Yeah, Harrison's choice of words made me go 'huh?' when he said they would be tickled to death if they could make an arrest tomorrow etc. etc.

Why can't they?!?!?! If the stuff in the SWs are true, and it must be, they have way more CE for an arrest than any case I've heard of.

Something is very wrong with this picture, IMO.I disagree that they have way more than they need for an indictment - based on just the info in the SWs.

Any guesses on the contents of the SW that will be unsealed on 12/01?

[Lindsey]

I disagree that they have way more than they need for an indictment - based on just the info in the SWs.

Any guesses on the contents of the SW that will be unsealed on 12/01?


I can't even begin to guess but it must be big for them to keep it hidden and then sealed for so long. But again, if it's that big why can't they get an indictment? Will we all be blown away on 12/01 or will we say why were they holding that back??

I'm still trying to digest/process what we learned last week.

I'm even more curious too about the therapist's notes now. Are you?

[alter ego]

I can't even begin to guess but it must be big for them to keep it hidden and then sealed for so long. But again, if it's that big why can't they get an indictment? Will we all be blown away on 12/01 or will we say why were they holding that back??

I'm still trying to digest/process what we learned last week.

I'm even more curious too about the therapist's notes now. Are you?Well if warrants were sealed to protect someone getting a fair trial or to protect the ability of the DA to bring charges, I don't know why a judge would unseal them. So, perhaps they were sealed because it is an ongoing investigation and perhaps not even Jason knows the contents. Difficult to say.

Yes, I would really like to know what was on Michelle's mind in the months before her murder. Those notes will never see the inside of a courtroom tho.

[Lindsey]

It is different because this is what you said...........

She had a medical induced abortion because the fetus stopped developing, not a miscarriage or spontaneous expulsion of the fetus.
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

Let me explain this as best as I can.
A miscarriage or spontaneous abortion is when the fetus expulses itself from the uterus. The mother has contractions and bleeding and the fetus comes out. Normally, a Dand C is performed to clean out any tissue that is retained to prevent infection and bleeding.
A medically induced abortion is done when it is determined that a fetus has ceased to develop BUT has not expulsed itself. There is a difference.
Hope this helps.

MOO Aggie

That is what Michelle had. She had no choice. The baby was dead but her body didn't abort it as it should have.

[alter ego]

That is what Michelle had. She had no choice. The baby was dead but her body didn't abort it as it should have.
Yeah, she had a medically induced abortion because the fetus stopped developing, not a miscarriage or spontaneous expulsion of the fetus.

[Lindsey]

Well if warrants were sealed to protect someone getting a fair trial or to protect the ability of the DA to bring charges, I don't know why a judge would unseal them. So, perhaps they were sealed because it is an ongoing investigation and perhaps not even Jason knows the contents. Difficult to say.

Yes, I would really like to know what was on Michelle's mind in the months before her murder. Those notes will never see the inside of a courtroom tho.

You could be right. I'm ready for some answers but I know they've got to get it right the first time. There's not a second chance if they flub up.

Maybe it won't be much longer but for sure we won't get any news tonight so I'm out of here to get some sleep. Goodnight.

[Cardinal]

I've never entertained the thought that Kim was involved in any way, other than possibly posting on the boards early on.
I'm not sure who (maybe Cardinal?), that posted she could be the perp.
Sorry in advance , if this is the wrong info.;)

The nice while it lasted comment was directed at no one in particular – it was just an offhand comment. I have no problem with you, Aggie, and don’t understand your making it personal. As for calling me Card, I only object when it’s done disrespectfully, as it was by the poster I said that to.

Yes, I theorized that Kim could have killed Michelle. As I said earlier last evening, also in response to you, I have floated theories on this board that may or may not have been credible. After reading the email in the latest SW, I admitted here that I was wrong.

I do think, however, that Kim knows much more about the murder than most.

JMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Well if warrants were sealed to protect someone getting a fair trial or to protect the ability of the DA to bring charges, I don't know why a judge would unseal them. So, perhaps they were sealed because it is an ongoing investigation and perhaps not even Jason knows the contents. Difficult to say.

Yes, I would really like to know what was on Michelle's mind in the months before her murder. Those notes will never see the inside of a courtroom tho.


Morning AE and everyone...

So, what is the purpose of having the therapist records opened then, if they can not be used?

Other than to show Michelle's state of mind.?

Woudn't Jason know all their troubles would be exposed?

If not by the therapist, then by friends and family?

And, still go ahead and kill her?

I don't know about you, but in those emails to Kim, he sure doesn't come across as worried about anything.

He seems somewhat defiant,almost challenging to the point he knows that can not get him.

Now, why is that??

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

The nice while it lasted comment was directed at no one in particular – it was just an offhand comment. I have no problem with you, Aggie, and don’t understand your making it personal. As for calling me Card, I only object when it’s done disrespectfully, as it was by the poster I said that to.

Yes, I theorized that Kim could have killed Michelle. As I said earlier last evening, also in response to you, I have floated theories on this board that may or may not have been credible. After reading the email in the latest SW, I admitted here that I was wrong.

I do think, however, that Kim knows much more about the murder than most.

JMO


Hi Card !!

Is there anything about this case that still leaves questions?

I guess mine would be, why that choice of death?

I was thinking maybe we could make a list of all the things against

Jason that we now know,a list of facts, not rumors.

If I have time later at work, I will try.

Kat

ETA:

Was C sleeping with Michelle?

[Kat4Eagles]

I think it is because he never left the motel. I think if he had a hand in Michelles death it was in getting someone to kill her. With as many cameras as there is in that motel if Jason left for the night LE knows it. If they knew it he would be under arrest. I think he was right there all night long. I think LE has proof of that.



If true, then no wonder it is so confusing.

I do have trouble with the rock story..

No one actually saw him put it there.

Plus, you are taking a big chance of it still being there.

Taking a lot of chances, actually, in all that happened that nite.

Are we back to a hired hit?

Kat

[jerry50]

Well if warrants were sealed to protect someone getting a fair trial or to protect the ability of the DA to bring charges, I don't know why a judge would unseal them. So, perhaps they were sealed because it is an ongoing investigation and perhaps not even Jason knows the contents. Difficult to say.

Yes, I would really like to know what was on Michelle's mind in the months before her murder. Those notes will never see the inside of a courtroom tho.

Normal procedure is not to seal the warrants. The public has a right to know what LE is doing. Sealing them is unusual. JY should be thanking the DA's office for keeping any of them sealed.

I think that the notes and the therapist will be at trial. That the judge allowed her to be deposed under oath indicates that the information is critical to the murder. I think that they are related to the car accident and Michelle beginning to wonder if JY was trying to kill her.

[mulhollanddr]

I would say against a hit:

- Crime of passion according to TV expert who saw the pictures.
- Late for work, and in a hyper mood.
- Phone call record (could have been left out) shows no mysterious calls.
- Phone call record showing 28 calls to his mum before anything had been told to him.
- Didn't ask if Cassidy was safe or how Michelle died. (Seemed to know).
- Possibly leaving the hotel. No record of JY using his keycard after.
- Possible print according to SW of where the killer could have come in contact with wall.
- Blisters possibly from wearing shoe size too small, Franklins?
- Reported light/white SUV
- Missing pullover
- Possible drugging of Cassidy with drugs he got from work
- LE investigating whether deck stain print and pillow print are the same, unless the hitman did his decks.

Thats off the top of my head, while if you wanted to you could explain them away, its not a pretty picture. And that's just evidence of him vs a hitman.

[jerry50]

If true, then no wonder it is so confusing.

I do have trouble with the rock story..

No one actually saw him put it there.

Plus, you are taking a big chance of it still being there.

Taking a lot of chances, actually, in all that happened that nite.

Are we back to a hired hit?

Kat


I just think that there is no perfect murder. He thought he had the perfect alibi by being away for the night. Who at the hotel would connect the rock to a murder in Raleigh.
I don't think a hired hit would have bludgeoned her the way that the murder was committed. If you read all the FBI profiles etc, this method of murder is highly personal.
I think he thought he was too smart to be caught and that by not talking he was home free.

[MerriMent]

I would say against a hit:

- Crime of passion according to TV expert who saw the pictures.
- Late for work, and in a hyper mood.
- Phone call record (could have been left out) shows no mysterious calls.
- Phone call record showing 28 calls to his mum before anything had been told to him.
- Didn't ask if Cassidy was safe or how Michelle died. (Seemed to know).
- Possibly leaving the hotel. No record of JY using his keycard after.
- Possible print according to SW of where the killer could have come in contact with wall.
- Blisters possibly from wearing shoe size too small, Franklins?
- Reported light/white SUV
- Missing pullover
- Possible drugging of Cassidy with drugs he got from work
- LE investigating whether deck stain print and pillow print are the same, unless the hitman did his decks.

Thats off the top of my head, while if you wanted to you could explain them away, its not a pretty picture. And that's just evidence of him vs a hitman.


Blister-like spots on his feet five days could have too many other explanations. I don't know how anybody can cram their foot into an athletic shoe two sizes too small or why Jason would leave a Hush Puppy print. Why not just dispose of the pillow? I asked a friend who is a CSI about it and she said LE has to consider both prints could be planted to make it appear there was more than one killer. She also said Franklins may have been the wrong size shoe worn by somebody other than Jason. If he hired a hit man, Jason wouldn't also be at the scene of the crime as a participant.

[MerriMent]

I just think that there is no perfect murder. He thought he had the perfect alibi by being away for the night. Who at the hotel would connect the rock to a murder in Raleigh.
I don't think a hired hit would have bludgeoned her the way that the murder was committed. If you read all the FBI profiles etc, this method of murder is highly personal.
I think he thought he was too smart to be caught and that by not talking he was home free.

The act of not talking never prevents an arrest. If he was smart enough to leave a rock in the door, he was smart enough not to leave his own shoeprints on a pillowcase.

[mysterybuff]

Normal procedure is not to seal the warrants. The public has a right to know what LE is doing. Sealing them is unusual. JY should be thanking the DA's office for keeping any of them sealed.

I think that the notes and the therapist will be at trial. That the judge allowed her to be deposed under oath indicates that the information is critical to the murder. I think that they are related to the car accident and Michelle beginning to wonder if JY was trying to kill her.

This is exactly what i have believed as soon as I learned about the therapist's notes. The fact that they were described as being related to her murder makes me believe that MY may indeed have began to think that the car accident, and possibily the boating accident, were attempts by Jason to kill her. Obviously, MOO.

[Wyn]

Hi, great list Mulholland. Hey can we add the fact that he sent his SIL Meredith Fisher over to find the body and rescue Cassidy ? Er...I mean to get a printout off his computer so the surprise belated gift he wanted to give Michelle for their anniversary wouldn't be spoiled ?

Page 2. "It has been determined that the auction items from the printouts and thh computer data search were for auctions that would have ended prior to Mr. Young arriving at the Hampton Inn in Hillsville, VA. Therefore, the searched handbags from the printouts would no longer been available for purchase or bidding."

They were just worthless pieces of paper for an excuse to have Meredith discover her sister's body.

[Wyn]

The act of not talking never prevents an arrest. If he was smart enough to leave a rock in the door, he was smart enough not to leave his own shoeprints on a pillowcase.

I've seen kindergarten children put rocks, books, other stuff, in a door at the elementary school my daughter attended. Even five and six year olds are aware doors lock when closed sometimes. Jason thought he could knock Michelle unconcious and then strangle her. Didn't expect the blood or Michelle to put up the fight he did. Doubt he considered where he was stepping when he beat her to death.

[MerriMent]

I've seen kindergarten children put rocks, books, other stuff, in a door at the elementary school my daughter attended. Even five and six year olds are aware doors lock when closed sometimes. Jason thought he could knock Michelle unconcious and then strangle her. Didn't expect the blood or Michelle to put up the fight he did. Doubt he considered where he was stepping when he beat her to death.

Five and six year olds place a rock in a school door so it won't lock behind them. Jason as the mastermind killer would have done it so that his hotel room key card information wouldn't be recorded. If he was that smart, he'd be smart enough not to leave behind a pillowcase with his own shoe prints on it. I also don't believe a jury will conclude the killer wore two different style and sizes of shoes.

[dkny]

I would love to peruse JY's expense reports b4 and after the murder. JMO

[jerry50]

The act of not talking never prevents an arrest. If he was smart enough to leave a rock in the door, he was smart enough not to leave his own shoeprints on a pillowcase.

Where does my post say that not talking never prevents an arrest?

[MerriMent]

IMO, Jason had no idea the hotel recorded keycard entries, or he would have tried to clear himself that way (not sure how, but he would have). I believe he no longer had his keycard with him when the door was propped and that is why he propped it. It is my theory that he had left his keycard in the room like many do when checking out, along with showering, messing up the bed, etc...to make it appear as though he had stayed.

I'm not following you. If he left his keycard in the room, there was no way for him to get back into the room and also no reason to place a rock in the exit door.

[Wyn]

Five and six year olds place a rock in a school door so it won't lock behind them. Jason as the mastermind killer would have done it so that his hotel room key card information wouldn't be recorded. If he was that smart, he'd be smart enough not to leave behind a pillowcase with his own shoe prints on it. I also don't believe a jury will conclude the killer wore two different style and sizes of shoes.

Yet the kindergarten child and Jason both did it for the same purpose, so the door wouldn't lock. You don't have to be a genius to know that the card would have recorded re-entry. Everyone is aware of that these days. They learn this stuff on television no matter where they live.

In Jason's panic over not being able to knock Michelle out and strangle her to death I doubt he was considering where he was standing. I doubt he thought he'd have to beat her to death or that there would be so much blood. You think he was careful where he was putting his feet while he struggled with Michelle, I don't. I think he was scared he was going to fail and wasn't thinking about anything but ending Michelle's life.

I also think a jury is going to conclude that those blisters on his feet came from wearing smaller shoes during the murder. He's not going to talk and his attorney is not going to be able to provide the jury another believable reason for them. Jason will never be on the stand.

[MerriMent]

Where does my post say that not talking never prevents an arrest?

If he's guilty, how could he possibly know that by not talking, he'd be home free? You really think he'd believe that if he was the one who left behind the shoeprint and was also having an affair?

Originally Posted by jerry50
I think he thought he was too smart to be caught and that by not talking he was home free.

[alter ego]

Morning AE and everyone...

So, what is the purpose of having the therapist records opened then, if they can not be used?

Other than to show Michelle's state of mind.?

Woudn't Jason know all their troubles would be exposed?

If not by the therapist, then by friends and family?

And, still go ahead and kill her?

I don't know about you, but in those emails to Kim, he sure doesn't come across as worried about anything.

He seems somewhat defiant,almost challenging to the point he knows that can not get him.

Now, why is that??

Kat

The therapist notes were ordered released to the DA to assist in the investigation - specifically to get inside the mind of the victim in the months leading up to her death, which certainly would be pertinent to the investigation as the judge ruled.

I'm not going to even try to second guess what Jason may or may not have known, thought or guessed.

We are only seeing a snippet of conversations - we don't know the full context. What I got from it was that he wasn't as concerned about what others thought of him as Kim did. She was obviously mortified about what was being said about him and wanted him or his atty to refute the allegations prolly like what the attys for Brad Cooper did. However, there is no upside for Jason's atty to make any statement to the press since his client has not been charged with anything.

[MerriMent]

Yet the kindergarten child and Jason both did it for the same purpose, so the door wouldn't lock. You don't have to be a genius to know that the card would have recorded re-entry. Everyone is aware of that these days. They learn this stuff on television no matter where they live.

In Jason's panic over not being able to knock Michelle out and strangle her to death I doubt he was considering where he was standing. I doubt he thought he'd have to beat her to death or that there would be so much blood. You think he was careful where he was putting his feet while he struggled with Michelle, I don't. I think he was scared he was going to fail and wasn't thinking about anything but ending Michelle's life.

I also think a jury is going to conclude that those blisters on his feet came from wearing smaller shoes during the murder. He's not going to talk and his attorney is not going to be able to provide the jury another believable reason for them. Jason will never be on the stand.

LE has known about the rock, known about the blisters for over two years and Jason hasn't been arrested.

The kindergarten child isn't trying to avoid detection of a key card.

All the lights were on in the house according to the witness. The pillow could have easily been removed from the house yet it was left right there to be found. A CSI has told me it's very possible it was intentional to give the appearance of more than one perpetrator. Why is this so impossible for you to believe happened?

[MerriMent]

I explained in a different post. I believe he didn't have to get back into the room. Kind of like this:

--Jason checks in
--Jason showers, changes, messes up the bed, perhaps sets the alarm clock to something reasonable though he isn't going to use it...all to make it so the room appeared "used." (dirty towels, messed up bed, etc).
--Close to midnight, Jason gathers up all of his stuff and leaves and lets the door lock behind him (with his keycard on the dresser, like many people who check out)
--Jason goes down the stairs near the door that was propped and out to his car to put his luggage/items back in, but props the door so he can re-enter through it since he has no keycard
--Jason puts his stuff in his vehicle
--Jason then walks back through the propped door and down to the front desk to ask for a receipt citing that he has to be up and around early and won't have time to check out or something of that nature
--Jason then walks back down the hallway and out the propped door to his vehicle and doesn't return to the hotel, or at least his room.

It is just a theory, that is all. But, to me it is the one that makes the most sense knowing what we know about the keycard. Additionally, I don't think he would want to plan to come back to the hotel. Why risk being seen? What if something goes wrong and things take too long? Going back to the hotel would just slow him down more and would be quite risky.

Obviously no one knows what happened except Jason. I would hope that the police have more video footage of him...but I don't know.

All up for discussion...

I think the hotel security video doesn't record Jason Young ever leaving the hotel.

[alter ego]

snipped

I also think a jury is going to conclude that those blisters on his feet came from wearing smaller shoes during the murder. He's not going to talk and his attorney is not going to be able to provide the jury another believable reason for them. Jason will never be on the stand.
Oh a defense atty would have a field day with the podiatrist. One simple question is all that it will take to cast doubt on the Pros theory.

"Can you tell with any degree of certainty when those blister like impressions were formed on the feet in the photograph"

[MerriMent]

The therapist notes were ordered released to the DA to assist in the investigation - specifically to get inside the mind of the victim in the months leading up to her death, which certainly would be pertinent to the investigation as the judge ruled.

I'm not going to even try to second guess what Jason may or may not have known, thought or guessed.

We are only seeing a snippet of conversations - we don't know the full context. What I got from it was that he wasn't as concerned about what others thought of him as Kim did. She was obviously mortified about what was being said about him and wanted him or his atty to refute the allegations prolly like what the attys for Brad Cooper did. However, there is no upside for Jason's atty to make any statement to the press since his client has not been charged with anything.

What I found interesting is that he seemed prepared by his attorney to expect the public scrutiny. The Duke Lacrosse case was also unfolding at that time and look at how those players were villified publicly. I agree that the atty had no need to talk because he hadn't been charged. That's still true. I think there might be more in the response filing to the civil suit, though.

[MerriMent]

That very well could be, but that doesn't mean he didn't leave. Depending on the position of the cameras and their time delay (it has been stated they were rolling captures), he may have left undetected.

The DA must prove Jason did leave and also provide an explanation of why the video cameras didn't detect it. I don't believe LE can do that.

[MerriMent]

Oh a defense atty would have a field day with the podiatrist. One simple question is all that it will take to cast doubt on the Pros theory.

"Can you tell with any degree of certainty when those blister like impressions were formed on the feet in the photograph"

Now that the civil suit has been filed, can't Jason's attorney subpoena the hotel security videos LE has? That search warrant wasn't sealed.

[Wyn]

LE has known about the rock, known about the blisters for over two years and Jason hasn't been arrested.

The kindergarten child isn't trying to avoid detection of a key card.

All the lights were on in the house according to the witness. The pillow could have easily been removed from the house yet it was left right there to be found. A CSI has told me it's very possible it was intentional to give the appearance of more than one perpetrator. Why is this so impossible for you to believe happened?

What's your point? Yes they have know for two years, doesn't mean there's not going to be an arrest. Seems like it's a lot closer now doesn't it? I think it'll come before the civil suit. If not, then I guess we'll see if Jason talks or not. I'm guessing not. :biggrin:

No the kindergarten child isn't trying to avoid the detection of a key card. Again, what's your point? Jason had one, he put a rock in the door so he wouldn't have to use it. Rock gone. He either came back in the front door, or waited until someone else came out and went in. Or, he could have put his stuff back in the car before going back to the front desk in that dark shirt with the stripe. Only LE knows if there's more video. Again, we wait. Knowing to do that doesn't mean he's smart, it just means he watches tv crime shows.

"CSI has told me it's very possible it was intentional to give the appearance of more than one perpetrator." Who says I don't believe it was left there to give the appearace of more than one "perpetratror"? That's exactly why I think Jason left it there, after stepping on it in the too small shoes that caused the blisters to his feet.

[alter ego]

What I found interesting is that he seemed prepared by his attorney to expect the public scrutiny. The Duke Lacrosse case was also unfolding at that time and look at how those players were villified publicly. I agree that the atty had no need to talk because he hadn't been charged. That's still true. I think there might be more in the response filing to the civil suit, though.
I am anxious to see the response to the civil suit. Particularly because Jason had 2 years to probate the will but he was supposedly denounced as executor for failing to probate it. But it appears the 2 year toll had not run out before he was denounced which brings the appt of Linda as executrix into question. And if she is not executrix, she has no standing to file the suit.

I don't see the WD suit making it past the first motion to dismiss, which will be filed with the response to the suit.

[Wyn]

Oh a defense atty would have a field day with the podiatrist. One simple question is all that it will take to cast doubt on the Pros theory.

"Can you tell with any degree of certainty when those blister like impressions were formed on the feet in the photograph"

I think the jury will be able to figure it out if there's no other plausible explanation for the blisters no matter what the defense does to try and cast doubt. What could Jason's attorney come up with that would have caused those blisters in the span of four days after the murder? Remember where he was during those days.

[alter ego]

Now that the civil suit has been filed, can't Jason's attorney subpoena the hotel security videos LE has? That search warrant wasn't sealed.That subpoena would be quashed because it's an ongoing criminal investigation.

[alter ego]

I think the jury will be able to figure it out if there's no other plausible explanation for the blisters no matter what the defense does to try and cast doubt. What could Jason's attorney come up with that would have caused those blisters in the span of four days after the murder? Remember where he was during those days.That's just it.

The DA can't prove when those blisters were formed or that they were formed the night Michelle was murdered.

What if Jason's feet always have those blisters? What if the blisters were over a month old when photographed? What if the blisters were 2 days old when photographed?

[MerriMent]

What's your point? Yes they have know for two years, doesn't mean there's not going to be an arrest. Seems like it's a lot closer now doesn't it? I think it'll come before the civil suit. If not, then I guess we'll see if Jason talks or not. I'm guessing not. :biggrin:

No the kindergarten child isn't trying to avoid the detection of a key card. Again, what's your point? Jason had one, he put a rock in the door so he wouldn't have to use it. Rock gone. He either came back in the front door, or waited until someone else came out and went in. Or, he could have put his stuff back in the car before going back to the front desk in that dark shirt with the stripe. Only LE knows if there's more video. Again, we wait. Knowing to do that doesn't mean he's smart, it just means he watches tv crime shows.

"CSI has told me it's very possible it was intentional to give the appearance of more than one perpetrator." Who says I don't believe it was left there to give the appearace of more than one "perpetratror"? That's exactly why I think Jason left it there, after stepping on it in the too small shoes that caused the blisters to his feet.

In the civil case, all Jason has to answer to the question did you kill your wife is, "no." There is nothing that he can be asked that proves he killed his wife. I have no idea what YOUR point is about kindergartners and rocks.

[MerriMent]

I am anxious to see the response to the civil suit. Particularly because Jason had 2 years to probate the will but he was supposedly denounced as executor for failing to probate it. But it appears the 2 year toll had not run out before he was denounced which brings the appt of Linda as executrix into question. And if she is not executrix, she has no standing to file the suit.

I don't see the WD suit making it past the first motion to dismiss, which will be filed with the response to the suit.

Yes, I think that response will be an eye-opener.

[alter ego]

Yes, I think that response will be an eye-opener.
I am still baffled as to how Linda would go about proving her case. :shrug:

[MerriMent]

That subpoena would be quashed because it's an ongoing criminal investigation.

iirc, in the Cooper case, the reason the request to see the autopsy report as part of the civil custody case was denied was because it was sealed in an ongoing criminal investigation.

Parts of the hotel security video are already in the public record. Since it is video of Jason, not the crime scene, I don't know how or why a Judge could squash his request to see it in its entire form. Especially if it is exculpatory evidence that he never left the hotel. If he can prove he never left the hotel, Fisher must prove he was an accessory and that is quite a mountain for her to climb.

[MerriMent]

I think he might have left. He might have gone for a bite to eat after he showered. I have said before when he came back he might have stopped by the front desk and that is the video we see at 12 something. Then he goes down the hall toward the exit but we have just learned the stairs ,also. Someone just brought it to the forum that the stairs were at the end of that hallway. Then he is seen again the next morning leaving for his meeting. He would have to be the worlds luckiest man if he got out of and back into that motel without detection. Then we have the problem of gas for the car. i am sure that someone maybe even LE drove the exact route Jason drove. I would bet when they got gas where Jason did after his meeting that it took the same amount or close to it that Jason bought to fill the car up. That's gonna be a big thing for LE to overcome. Did he know about the killing before hand , I can't say but I'm really starting to believe that someone took advantage of the problems that Jason and Michelle were having and killed her.

June, I don't see him going for a bite to eat after midnight and after showering. At that time of night I think he would have stopped to eat before arriving at the hotel. I don't believe Jason ever left the hotel premises and hotel security video proves it.

[GBARD]

iirc, in the Cooper case, the reason the request to see the autopsy report as part of the civil custody case was denied was because it was sealed in an ongoing criminal investigation.

Parts of the hotel security video are already in the public record. Since it is video of Jason, not the crime scene, I don't know how or why a Judge could squash his request to see it in its entire form. Especially if it is exculpatory evidence that he never left the hotel. If he can prove he never left the hotel, Fisher must prove he was an accessory and that is quite a mountain for her to climb.

What happens if, due to the time delay of the cameras, there is no evidence whatsoever of JY leaving? We know for a fact that he left so that would not necessarily be of value to the defense imo?

[5swab5]

I am still baffled as to how Linda would go about proving her case. :shrug:


That's the beauty of a civil case. The jurors will not be held to the "beyond a reasonable doubt" standard.

A simple preponderance of the evidence...will most likely do.

Thank Goodness Jason will FINALLY be held accountable, if even in a small, monetary way. Must really scare the unemployed one, living at home. Might have to start flipping burgers or delivering pizzas in Brevard in order to afford the Attorneys that it is going to take to even answer the allegations.

Couldn't happen to a more deserving fellow. How the high and mighty are falling.


Justice for Michelle & Rylan!:rose:

MOO

Swabby

[alter ego]

iirc, in the Cooper case, the reason the request to see the autopsy report as part of the civil custody case was denied was because it was sealed in an ongoing criminal investigation.

Parts of the hotel security video are already in the public record. Since it is video of Jason, not the crime scene, I don't know how or why a Judge could squash his request to see it in its entire form. Especially if it is exculpatory evidence that he never left the hotel. If he can prove he never left the hotel, Fisher must prove he was an accessory and that is quite a mountain for her to climb.That's just it - he doesn't have to prove anything.

The DA listed multiple reasons for quashing the subpoenas filed by Cooper. Some of them are eye poppers.

http://www.newsobserver.com/content/media/2008/10/14/cooper%20police%20response.pdf

[alter ego]

That's the beauty of a civil case. The jurors will not be held to the "beyond a reasonable doubt" standard.

A simple preponderance of the evidence...will most likely do.

Thank Goodness Jason will FINALLY be held accountable, if even in a small, monetary way. Must really scare the unemployed one, living at home. Might have to start flipping burgers or delivering pizzas in Brevard in order to afford the Attorneys that it is going to take to even answer the allegations.

Couldn't happen to a more deserving fellow. How the high and mighty are falling.


Justice for Michelle & Rylan!:rose:

MOO

SwabbyThat's what I'm asking - what evidence will she present?

[alter ego]

What happens if, due to the time delay of the cameras, there is no evidence whatsoever of JY leaving? We know for a fact that he left so that would not necessarily be of value to the defense imo?:confused: Jason leaving the hotel has not been established as fact. If that were the case we would be discussing testimony at the criminal trial.

[MerriMent]

What happens if, due to the time delay of the cameras, there is no evidence whatsoever of JY leaving? We know for a fact that he left so that would not necessarily be of value to the defense imo?

I don't know for a fact that he left. There isn't that much time delay to the cameras to not recapture him returning and headed down that hallway in the opposite direction or returning through another entrance.

[MerriMent]

That's just it - he doesn't have to prove anything.

The DA listed multiple reasons for quashing the subpoenas filed by Cooper. Some of them are eye poppers.

http://www.newsobserver.com/content/media/2008/10/14/cooper%20police%20response.pdf

If he can prove he never left the hotel, why not get that fact before a Judge? It would make it much more difficult if LE makes an arrest of someone and they try to implicate Jason in order to receive a plea deal.

[GBARD]

:confused: Jason leaving the hotel has not been established as fact. If that were the case we would be discussing testimony at the criminal trial.

Obviously, he left. He is no longer there. I believe I read that there are 13 or 14 cameras which record on a time delay sequence. If JY did not have to physically check out, he could well have exited the hotel through the side entrance without being caught on camera, either to leave just after midnight or in the a.m. to attend his meeting, imo.

[GBARD]

If he can prove he never left the hotel, why not get that fact before a Judge? It would make it much more difficult if LE makes an arrest of someone and they try to implicate Jason in order to receive a plea deal.

Who, in your opinion, should get the fact before a judge. LE wouldn't at the point I don't think and how would JY get it before a judge prior to being charged? I'm obviously missing something here!!!

[jerry50]

:confused: Jason leaving the hotel has not been established as fact. If that were the case we would be discussing testimony at the criminal trial.

LE still has to place him the bedroom at the time of the murder. I think LE is still working on JY's DNA which showed up in the blood splatter to show that the DNA was deposited after or during the murder. This is one area where the DA wants to be sure BARD.

[GBARD]

LE still has to place him the bedroom at the time of the murder. I think LE is still working on JY's DNA which showed up in the blood splatter to show that the DNA was deposited after or during the murder. This is one area where the DA wants to be sure BARD.

Whilst I'm sure the DA would love that bit of evidence, is it possible to determine when DNA was deposited? I'd google it myself if I wasn't late for work. Grrrr.

[Wyn]

That's just it.

The DA can't prove when those blisters were formed or that they were formed the night Michelle was murdered.

What if Jason's feet always have those blisters? What if the blisters were over a month old when photographed? What if the blisters were 2 days old when photographed?

I don't think the DA is going to have to prove the blisters were formed that night. I think that they will just have to prove he didn't do anything after the murder that would have caused them. The investigators that viewed his feet will be able to testify to their condition and I'm sure the photos that they have available will show the condition in great detail.

There's a difference in month old blisters and fresh four day old blisters. If they were only 2 days old, I guess Jason's attorney is going to have to explain what Jason was doing two days after his wife was beaten to death that caused blisters. Who else is going to know what he was doing two days later? They will be called to testify even if Jason refuses.

[GBARD]

I don't think the DA is going to have to prove the blisters were formed that night. I think that they will just have to prove he didn't do anything after the murder that would have caused them. The investigators that viewed his feet will be able to testify to their condition and I'm sure the photos that they have available will show the condition in great detail.

There's a difference in month old blisters and fresh four day old blisters. If they were only 2 days old, I guess Jason's attorney is going to have to explain what Jason was doing two days after his wife was beaten to death that caused blisters. Who else is going to know what he was doing two days later? They will be called to testify even if Jason refuses.

ITA Wyn. I think the shoes/blisters are the least of the DA's problems. I wonder if they found any gas cans in the garage of the home which JY could have used to fill his vehicle before returning to his meeting?

[Barbara2]

I don't think the DA is going to have to prove the blisters were formed that night. I think that they will just have to prove he didn't do anything after the murder that would have caused them. The investigators that viewed his feet will be able to testify to their condition and I'm sure the photos that they have available will show the condition in great detail.

There's a difference in month old blisters and fresh four day old blisters. If they were only 2 days old, I guess Jason's attorney is going to have to explain what Jason was doing two days after his wife was beaten to death that caused blisters. Who else is going to know what he was doing two days later? They will be called to testify even if Jason refuses.

It is once again a case of "you can explain away each individual piece but when you put the whole mountain out there, you can't ignore it."

[Wyn]

In the civil case, all Jason has to answer to the question did you kill your wife is, "no." There is nothing that he can be asked that proves he killed his wife. I have no idea what YOUR point is about kindergartners and rocks.

Big surprise there, I didn't expect that he would say "Yes"! :D I'm quite sure there are questions that can be asked that will point in the direction of him being the only one who would have been the murderer. If not, no one would ever win these suits now would they? They didn't get OJ in the murder trial but they did in the civil suit.

You know what my point is, you just don't like it. Sorry, he's no genius. :shrug:

[Wyn]

ITA Wyn. I think the shoes/blisters are the least of the DA's problems. I wonder if they found any gas cans in the garage of the home which JY could have used to fill his vehicle before returning to his meeting?

I wonder too because most people have at least one to fill the lawn mower.

[alter ego]

It is once again a case of "you can explain away each individual piece but when you put the whole mountain out there, you can't ignore it."
If each individual piece is not proven BARD then the mountain crumbles.

[Jules2]

Obviously, he left. He is no longer there. I believe I read that there are 13 or 14 cameras which record on a time delay sequence. If JY did not have to physically check out, he could well have exited the hotel through the side entrance without being caught on camera, either to leave just after midnight or in the a.m. to attend his meeting, imo.


Welcome, GBARD!

I understood fully what you were implying. He obviously is no longer at that hotel so he had to leave at some point and if they don't have him on any video camera leaving, then there's no way to prove when he left. Could very well have been at midnight.

[Wyn]

It is once again a case of "you can explain away each individual piece but when you put the whole mountain out there, you can't ignore it."

You're right, you can't ignore so many things pointing to Jason's guilt. Surely he's not the most unluckiest man in the world? All the items in the search warrant are just more pieces to the puzzle. Just imagine what they may have we haven't seen or heard yet. There's more computer evidence out there we haven't seen from his last job at Novo, isn't there?

[Barbara2]

You're right, you can't ignore so many things pointing to Jason's guilt. Surely he's not the most unluckiest man in the world? All the items in the search warrant are just more pieces to the puzzle. Just imagine what they may have we haven't seen or heard yet. There's more computer evidence out there we haven't seen from his last job at Novo, isn't there?

Sorry. I answered the wrong post.

[Barbara2]

If each individual piece is not proven BARD then the mountain crumbles.

We heard the exact same thing in the Scott Peterson case. Each piece had some explanation. He's now sitting on death row. (End of story.) IMO

[Cardinal]

Obviously, he left. He is no longer there. I believe I read that there are 13 or 14 cameras which record on a time delay sequence. If JY did not have to physically check out, he could well have exited the hotel through the side entrance without being caught on camera, either to leave just after midnight or in the a.m. to attend his meeting, imo.

I was just about to make that same point, GBARD.

Welcome to the board. :)

[Cardinal]

I am anxious to see the response to the civil suit. Particularly because Jason had 2 years to probate the will but he was supposedly denounced as executor for failing to probate it. But it appears the 2 year toll had not run out before he was denounced which brings the appt of Linda as executrix into question. And if she is not executrix, she has no standing to file the suit.

I don't see the WD suit making it past the first motion to dismiss, which will be filed with the response to the suit.

The 2-year statute of limitations applies only to the WDS, AE. There is no statute of limitations on initiating probate - BUT Jason could have been viewed by the CSC as remiss for letting it go so long.

Linda is the Executrix. Jason can challenge it, but I doubt he'll be successful. The Clerk didn't make that decision lightly, imo, and the paperwork will be in order. Besides, what grounds would he have to challenge it?

[jerry50]

I think the hotel security video doesn't record Jason Young ever leaving the hotel.

So are you saying that Jayson is still at the hotel?

[5swab5]

That's what I'm asking - what evidence will she present?


"What Evidence"? LOL

How about each and every nuance that we have discussed ad nauseum for 2 years for starters, and I would wager that we only "know" the tip of the iceberg.

MOO

Swabby

Justice for Michelle & Rylan!:rose:

[5swab5]

ITA Wyn. I think the shoes/blisters are the least of the DA's problems. I wonder if they found any gas cans in the garage of the home which JY could have used to fill his vehicle before returning to his meeting?


He did have his dad's boat in the garage, and every boat of that type that I have ever heard of has two six gallon removable tanks...at least. Not to mention, being a home owner with a lawn mower and such, so at the minimum, accounting for 17 gallons is very easy.


But, it really would have been so much simpler just to pay cash in a little out-of-the-way station, than to fool with all that mess. No records, easy peasey.

MOO

Swabby

[Lindsey]

It was said Jason had to borrow clothes to wear when he returned to Raleigh and LE took his luggage along with his Explorer. Did he have to borrow shoes too? Maybe they weren't a perfect fit and caused blisters on his feet?


:shrug:

[Barbara2]

It was said Jason had to borrow clothes to wear when he returned to Raleigh and LE took his luggage along with his Explorer. Did he have to borrow shoes too? Maybe they weren't a perfect fit and caused blisters on his feet?


:shrug:

That would be a stretch. He came home from his business meeting wearing a dress shirt and I assume dress shoes. I don't think those were taken by LE when they took his car.

[Lindsey]

It is once again a case of "you can explain away each individual piece but when you put the whole mountain out there, you can't ignore it."

It does seem like a mountain for sure. I still haven't absorbed all of it. Wondering what the warrant to be unsealed 12-01 is going to be like.

[Lindsey]

That would be a stretch. He came home from his business meeting wearing a dress shirt and I assume dress shoes. I don't think those were taken by LE when they took his car.

If I had to wear my dress shoes for 4 -5 days straight, I'd be limping and that includes my most comfortable pairs of dress shoes.

I'm just still thinking and pondering on stuff ...

[GBARD]

I was just about to make that same point, GBARD.

Welcome to the board. :)

Thanks Card. Thinking about it, I will be very happy if there isn't any video of him leaving at all. What we have seen then will become a very persuasive piece of CE, I'd think. In an ideal world, I'd like to think Jason is not guilty but, quite honestly, after seeing the latest SW, I know it is not an ideal world. Poor Cassidy. I even feel sorry for Jason's mother. I just can't imagine what she must have thought when she saw the latest PC in the SW.

[Barbara2]

It does seem like a mountain for sure. I still haven't absorbed all of it. Wondering what the warrant to be unsealed 12-01 is going to be like.

I'm interested in that as well. We have been teased with information that is going to point in another direction but we've been hearing that tease for two years. I look forward to the release. I would like to have all the information available.

[Barbara2]

If I had to wear my dress shoes for 4 -5 days straight, I'd be limping and that includes my most comfortable pairs of dress shoes.

I'm just still thinking and pondering on stuff ...

Yeah, but you're not a guy. I don't believe their dress shoes are as uncomfortable as our dress shoes. And it's not like he couldn't go out and buy another pair of shoes in those 4-5 days.

[Lindsey]

I'm interested in that as well. We have been teased with information that is going to point in another direction but we've been hearing that tease for two years. I look forward to the release. I would like to have all the information available.


ITA It's way past time, IMO.

[MerriMent]

Thanks Card. Thinking about it, I will be very happy if there isn't any video of him leaving at all. What we have seen then will become a very persuasive piece of CE, I'd think. In an ideal world, I'd like to think Jason is not guilty but, quite honestly, after seeing the latest SW, I know it is not an ideal world. Poor Cassidy. I even feel sorry for Jason's mother. I just can't imagine what she must have thought when she saw the latest PC in the SW.

I didn't realize you'd take something so literally in order to spin it. Of course there is security video of Jason leaving the hotel. Just doesn't seem to be any security video of Jason leaving through that exit at midnight or returning in the wee hours.

[MerriMent]

It does seem like a mountain for sure. I still haven't absorbed all of it. Wondering what the warrant to be unsealed 12-01 is going to be like.

My guess is that it is for another woman's computer or cell phone to see if she continued communicating with Jason after the murder and they hooked up. I think she is one of the women listed in the most recent warrant.

There was a recent trial for a funeral home director who's girlfriend murdered his wife while he was on vacation. LE went after communication and found evidence they planned it together. LE doing same thing in Young case, imo.

[Barbara2]

My guess is that it is for another woman's computer or cell phone to see if she continued communicating with Jason after the murder and they hooked up. I think she is one of the women listed in the most recent warrant.

There was a recent trial for a funeral home director who's girlfriend murdered his wife while he was on vacation. LE went after communication and found evidence they planned it together. LE doing same thing in Young case, imo.

His call to his lover prior to 8 a.m. the day of the murder would either implicate her or clear here. A ping from Florida at that time would make it virtually impossible for her to have been in NC during the time of the murder. IMO

[Barbara2]

Won't Jason's attorney be able to subpoena the videos for his rebuttal to LF WDS? Won't he be able to show who's finger prints were on the medicine bottles? I would think all of this evidence that is in the SW will now be available to Jason's attorney. Am I wrong?

When he finds that it's Jason's fingerprints on the bottle, what do you suppose he will do with that? :shrug:

[5swab5]

Jason has 30 days to respond to the WD suit.
Until he answers, discovery is a mute point.

As long as the criminal investigation is ongoing, his attorney can forget getting evidence collected by the cops. This is not a criminal proceeding, the plaintiff does not hand over their evidence to the defense.

Once again, "the beauty of a civil suit"!:D

Jason will NOT be privy to anything, but Linda's lawyers and thereby the Wake County DA's Office will learn what all kinds of excuses Jason might put forward.

SWEET!

MOO

Swabby

Justice for Michelle & Rylan!:rose:

[MerriMent]

His call to his lover prior to 8 a.m. the day of the murder would either implicate her or clear here. A ping from Florida at that time would make it virtually impossible for her to have been in NC during the time of the murder. IMO

Do you really believe Jason's only lover was the woman in Florida?

[MerriMent]

Stop spinning
You have no idea what the video shows or does not show.
The cops only released 4 still shots.

Those four shots do give me enough to form an opinion.

[dkny]

If I had to wear my dress shoes for 4 -5 days straight, I'd be limping and that includes my most comfortable pairs of dress shoes.

I'm just still thinking and pondering on stuff ...

JY was used to wearing dress shoes, I was thinking he would say he borrowed shoes for the funeral because he did not go back to the house and all his clothes he had w/him were seized. JMO

[MerriMent]

Won't Jason's attorney be able to subpoena the videos for his rebuttal to LF WDS? Won't he be able to show who's finger prints were on the medicine bottles? I would think all of this evidence that is in the SW will now be available to Jason's attorney. Am I wrong?

I'm pretty sure it is available if a Judge grants a subpoena request. In the Cooper case, his attorney asked for investigative information but the DA successfully argued it wasn't relevant to a custody case trying to determine if Cooper was a fit parent. Since this is a wrongful death action in the Young case, I don't know why a Judge wouldn't grant the request from Jason's attorney. Don't forget one thing Jason's attorney does have are the forensic test results from the NTIO order.

[MerriMent]

Once again, "the beauty of a civil suit"!:D

Jason will NOT be privy to anything, but Linda's lawyers and thereby the Wake County DA's Office will learn what all kinds of excuses Jason might put forward.

SWEET!

MOO

Swabby

Justice for Michelle & Rylan!:rose:

Sweet maybe. Too bad it isn't true.

Linda's lawyers can't be given any evidence Jason isn't given. Our justice system isn't quite that unbalanced.

[Lindsey]

JY was used to wearing dress shoes, I was thinking he would say he borrowed shoes for the funeral because he did not go back to the house and all his clothes he had w/him were seized. JMO

IIRC, the NTIO was done the day before Michelle's funeral.

[MerriMent]

Thank you that was the question I was asking. I guess Bud didn't know the answer so he went off on the MF thing again. It sure is funny how he always brings her name to the forum and trys to make it look like someone else brings it here.

I can't figure out why some posters are so defensive about Meredith Fisher. If her best friend and husband betrayed Michelle, it's possible her sister betrayed her, too. Jason does sound fond of Meredith. Was there more to it?

[MerriMent]

Hey you have a point there. Wasn't MM her maid of honor and look what she did to her. I'm starting to think Michelle's and Jason's life was as screwed up as the Coopers.

Seems that way.

[5swab5]

Do you really believe Jason's only lover was the woman in Florida?

I certainly don't!
Just looking at the computer searches.....

I think that page #10-line #11 of the latest SW...("gay bars and gay bars in New York City"), the only "woman" in Florida, as Jason's lover might be a tad restrictive for this discussion.

JMO

Swabby

[5swab5]

(snipped) Don't forget one thing Jason's attorney does have are the forensic test results from the NTIO order.

GOOD! Then Jason's Attorney(s²) can get to work on refuting the podiatrist's opinion that Jason had blisters on his feet from wearing shoes that were too small.

Little by little, Jason's potential criminal case will bite the dust.

SWEET!

MOO

Swabby

[5swab5]

Sweet maybe. Too bad it isn't true.

Linda's lawyers can't be given any evidence Jason isn't given. Our justice system isn't quite that unbalanced.


ROTFLMAO!

There is a HUGE difference between what a Defendant will be privy to in a "civil case" vs a "criminal case". But since we are going to apparently, eventually see both against Jason Lynn Young...we should learn all. Stay tuned.

MOO

Swabby.

[5swab5]

I can't figure out why some posters are so defensive about Meredith Fisher. If her best friend and husband betrayed Michelle, it's possible her sister betrayed her, too. (snipped)

Blood is thicker than water!

Why is it so much easier for some people to vilify Meredith, than to admit that Jason was a no-good, philandering, murdering scumbag?

I will never understand.

MOO

Swabby

[BiggerRedDog]

Does anyone know who or what Birnam Wood is ?I haven't read back, but Birnam Wood was featured in Shakespeare's MacBeth. Was it mentioned here? I wonder in what context.

[mulhollanddr]

I think the Meredith Fisher talk is out of desperation more than anything. The people who have slandered her in the past have been outed as close JY associates, especially one who was keen to change public opinion IMO.

I don't take it too seriously anymore, Swab. We know its just someone who read the SW and decided it looks bad, and needs to do some PR.