Michelle Young May 21st

[jerzeegirl]

Ok i was posting and then it was closed, i guess we can discuss here :)

[jerzeegirl]

so cardinal, i was agreeing with your post on the MY forum, i believe that IF jason young did this to michelle he wasnt this evil person just waiting to kill all his life. I truly believe that people can snap. He may not have been evil before, but definitely evil now if he did this to her. The only excuse would be self defense and i dont think that would apply here. We on this forum, never knew him and even people that thought they knew him maybe didnt truly know him. I believe that when certain people are backed into a corner (not literally) they can snap. Of course this is JMO.

[annalyzer]

Thanks jerzeegirl. Cardinal I wanted to address your last post. I'm sure as caring parents they didn't normally argue loudly because of the child. But we're talking about an argument that would lead to an attempted strangulation and brutal bludgeoning. Not normal.

[awareness]

To Kat:
Its my OPINION that Michelle likely spoke to the therapist/counselor about her marriage. That's my OPINION and Im entitled to it. Didn't you read the "JMO/IMO" I placed at the bottom of each post? I don't sit and blather that each of my posts are FACT unlike several of the JII's.

Fiver:
Again, its my OPINION. Im not law enforcement, and not required to provide proof on a message board unless Im citing something as fact, which I wasn't.

Have a great night!
JMO/IMO

[jerzeegirl]

the argument could have started downstairs. Thats a pretty big house. But maybe michelle then went upstairs and he followed. I do agree that no matter who killed her, CY must have heard something. Maybe not have seen anything maybe the br door was closed.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by agathachristie
Just bringing this from the other thread:

MandyMutt:
SNIPPED........


It is possible to kill someone in a non-violent manner that doesn't produce prolonged pain and suffering that Michelle endured.



Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

05-21-2008 05:48 PM

And you know this how?
Have you spoken with those poor souls that have passed over?
I'm intrigued.
Please enlighten all of us. [/*]

i agree aggie, ive heard experts explain that dying of suffocation, strangulation and drowning are very horrific. I remember an expert on the stand explaining it minute by minute.....i cringed.

[fiver]

Originally posted by DesertDreams


Not necessarily did she hear anything. Some children sleep through everything. It is pretty clear that the weapon was a maglight (sp?) but lots of people have those. [/*]How is it pretty clear the weapon was a maglight?

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by agathachristie
Just bringing this from the other thread:

[/*]

Why?


Everyone please remember the same rules apply on this holiday thread as they do the regular. Please do your part to keep the MY forum open. Ignore the baiters, don't quote posts that are against TOS and follow the rules of TOS.

Have a good Memorial Day holiday everyone! :seeya:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Why ? Because I was questioning her post ?
I've never been a baiter, nor never will be, Miss Annalyzer.
How is that post against the terms of service?
Are you saying that Mutton's original post was against the terms of service?
I'd say your above post is against the terms of service.
I asked a valid question.
Who are YOU to decide it is invalid?
What is going on here?

MOO Aggie [/*]

No. I was just adding a reminder to everyone after my reply to your post.

But I did wonder why you felt that post was so important to bring over here and question it. Forget it now.

[fiver]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Why?


Everyone please remember the same rules apply on this holiday thread as they do the regular. Please do your part to keep the MY forum open. Ignore the baiters, don't quote posts that are against TOS and follow the rules of TOS.

Have a good Memorial Day holiday everyone! :seeya: [/*]:patriot:

:seeya:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by DesertDreams


I have been following this case since almost day one. If you see the types of wounds MY suffered it is fairly clear. She had wounds consistent with that type of weapon. The score marks and the weight of the weapon are very consistent with the injuries a maglight would inflict. LE knows this. It is fairly old news. I am not here to get into an altercation with anyone.

Justice for MY and may she and her baby son rest in peace. :rose: [/*]

When I think of a maglite I think of the little black one I keep in a drawer beside my bed. It's very small though. What are you referring to?

[fiver]

Originally posted by DesertDreams


I have been following this case since almost day one. If you see the types of wounds MY suffered it is fairly clear. She had wounds consistent with that type of weapon. The score marks and the weight of the weapon are very consistent with the injuries a maglight would inflict. LE knows this. It is fairly old news. I am not here to get into an altercation with anyone.

Justice for MY and may she and her baby son rest in peace. :rose: [/*]I have been following the case too but I don't recall anything about LE determining the weapon was a flashlight. I'm not sure what you mean by "score marks".

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by fiver
I have been following the case too but I don't recall anything about LE determining the weapon was a flashlight. I'm not sure what you mean by "score marks". [/*]

The marks left on Michelle by a weapon. I believe they were crescent shaped.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by DesertDreams


annalyzer:

There are HUGE ones also. ~ snipped ~ Anyway, just picture your little one times 10. They are big and heavy. [/*]

Okay.

[akaThreetoe]

Originally posted by DesertDreams


annalyzer:

There are HUGE ones also. Maybe you can look it up on the internet. I don't have a link, but it wouldn't be hard to find. Anyway, just picture your little one times 10. They are big and heavy. [/*]

It's Maglite.com. I honestly thought of the big flashlight when I was reading the autopsy, I promise I did. Maybe somewhere in my mind I put that with the "ridges" thing, must have. But they are heavy and sturdy enough, IMO.:shrug:

Wasn't the so called "counselor" looked up and put in one of these threads that she mainly deal and advocate for Transvestites? I seen it somewhere... :shrug:

Nothing came of the blonde hair in MY's hand? If it was JY's wouldn't that be the evidence they need?

IMO ~ I don't think he did it, again that's JMO.

Sympathy to MY and JY's family and friends. :rose:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by DesertDreams


I can't draw them for you, but a maglight flashlight has ridges along the plastic where the lightbulb is. Imagine if you were it with a maglight. There would obviously be "score marks" where the flashlight hit. If you have never seen a maglight, you would not understand. If you just go to a hardware store and look at a maglight, you will see it and understand. Crescent shaped wounds are also consistent with getting hit with the front of a maglight. I really don't want to go into this any further. If you research the case you will see this. [/*]

maglite photos

http://images.google.com/images?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-36,GGLG:en&q=maglight+flashlight+photo+&um=1

[jerzeegirl]

my husband has the big maglite flashlight. What makes it so much like a weapon is cuz it uses three D batteries which make it that much heavier. I know cuz it fell two inches from underneath the kitchen sink to my toe and i thought my toe was broken. Didnt Baden suggest that that could have been the weapon used? Or was that another case?

[fiver]

Originally posted by annalyzer


The marks left on Michelle by a weapon. I believe they were crescent shaped. [/*]Oh, the 1" crescentic abrasions on her upper deltoid region? Like from fingernails being dug into her arm?

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by fiver
Oh, the 1" crescentic abrasions on her upper deltoid region? Like from fingernails being dug into her arm? [/*]

I don't know. I was just going by memory of what's been discussed. :shrug:

[SaraSidle]

From the last thread.

Fiver you are absolutely right about the speeding ticket. I wrote before I thought. Grasping at straws I guess. Also why can't it be one person with more than one weapon in a panic or rage?
IMO

[fiver]

Originally posted by annalyzer


I don't know. I was just going by memory of what's been discussed. :shrug: [/*]That is what is described on the autopsy report so I googled "crescentic abrasion" and all that came up was fingernail marks.

:shrug:

[fiver]

Originally posted by SaraSidle
From the last thread.

Fiver you are absolutely right about the speeding ticket. I wrote before I thought. Grasping at straws I guess. Also why can't it be one person with more than one weapon in a panic or rage?
IMO [/*]We are all just grasping at straws :) It could one person using multiple weapons, too.

[SaraSidle]

Here is another thought. Maybe the side of the skull was fractured because it is weaker than the back of the skull. There are more empty spaces on the side of the head such as eye orbits,sinus cavities and ear canals. the back of the head could be the first set of blows and then the side of the head and face next.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


i agree aggie, ive heard experts explain that dying of suffocation, strangulation and drowning are very horrific. I remember an expert on the stand explaining it minute by minute.....i cringed. [/*]

My original posting was after the comparison was made to Laci's murder and whether Jason was capable of the degree of violence inflicted upon Michelle. We don't know how Laci was killed so it is impossible to compare the two cases.

I think both you and agathachristie missed the phrase, "prolonged pain and suffering" I included in my posting.
Michelle suffered a prolonged, agonizing death. I do not believe there has been a shred of evidence that indicates Jason is capable of such a heinous crime. Nobody has presented a history of anger management problems, reports of domestic violence, womanizing, conversations he had expressing desires for his wife's death or not wanting children.

Nothing other than daily communication with a female friend has surfaced about Jason Young as it did early on in the Scott Peterson or even Drew Peterson cases.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


My original posting was after the comparison was made to Laci's murder and whether Jason was capable of the degree of violence inflicted upon Michelle. We don't know how Laci was killed so it is impossible to compare the two cases.

I think both you and agathachristie missed the phrase, "prolonged pain and suffering" I included in my posting.
Michelle suffered a prolonged, agonizing death. I do not believe there has been a shred of evidence that indicates Jason is capable of such a heinous crime. Nobody has presented a history of anger management problems, reports of domestic violence, womanizing, conversations he had expressing desires for his wife's death or not wanting children.

Nothing other than daily communication with a female friend has surfaced about Jason Young as it did early on in the Scott Peterson or even Drew Peterson cases. [/*]

i dont believe i missed that phrase. I do not know him personally, not much about him has come out about his temper or such but at any rate, we all dont know if he was capable of snapping. Its happened before in other cases. We just dont know.

[katy1974]

I have been a long time lurker. This case has interested me a long time.
I am a new mom. I had my baby boy 5 weeks ago. He is my life now, along with his dad of course!

This is a new experience, to be a member of a message board. So please have patience with me. lol!

I think Jason looks guilty, but I am not so sure he is the murderer of Michelle. I can't believe he could kill his pregnant wife and leave his little girl there alone!
There are alot of unanswered questions and I hope we find answers some day and the guilty person/s is arrested.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by june1943

I wouldn't call it snapping if he was hours away in a motel room and decided to drive home and kill his wife. I have seen no posts where Jason had a temper problem. [/*]

Exactly.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by june1943

I wouldn't call it snapping if he was hours away in a motel room and decided to drive home and kill his wife. I have seen no posts where Jason had a temper problem. [/*]

i wouldnt call it snapping either in that sense. I would call it snapping if he went home to discuss or they were arguing over something and then he snapped, i dont think anyone here would believe he snapped at the hotel, and thats not what i insinuated.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


i dont believe i missed that phrase. I do not know him personally, not much about him has come out about his temper or such but at any rate, we all dont know if he was capable of snapping. Its happened before in other cases. We just dont know. [/*]

You keep saying it has happened before in other cases but the one you cited, S. Peterson, it didn't happen.

:shrug:

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


You keep saying it has happened before in other cases but the one you cited, S. Peterson, it didn't happen.

:shrug: [/*]

you dont know what happened in the SP case, there wasnt a cause of death announced because they couldnt determine, i can assume that SP snapped, just like i can assume that JY, if he committed this crime, i believe he snapped. And yes there are plenty of other cases that spouses snap. Im not required to list them all, i listed one.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


you dont know what happened in the SP case, there wasnt a cause of death announced because they couldnt determine, i can assume that SP snapped, just like i can assume that JY, if he committed this crime, i believe he snapped. And yes there are plenty of other cases that spouses snap. Im not required to list them all, i listed one. [/*]

I know S. Peterson is on death row for the premeditated murder of his wife. How you get "snapped" out of that is my question. In the S. Peterson case, there were negative stories about his character in the media and the tabloids were all over him months prior to his arrest. He was a womanizer, he was evasive at his wife's memorial, he seemed insincere in his media interviews and with efforts to look for his wife. The prosecutor never suggested Peterson just "snapped." The case was presented to the jury as a pre-meditated murder.

In the Young case, there hasn't been remotely similar coverage of Jason's character. You want to believe Jason Young snapped and I'm asking you what you are basing your opinion on.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I know S. Peterson is on death row for the premeditated murder of his wife. How you get "snapped" out of that is my question. In the S. Peterson case, there were negative stories about his character in the media and the tabloids were all over him months prior to his arrest. He was a womanizer, he was evasive at his wife's memorial, he seemed insincere in his media interviews and with efforts to look for his wife. The prosecutor never suggested Peterson just "snapped." The case was presented to the jury as a pre-meditated murder.

In the Young case, there hasn't been remotely similar coverage of Jason's character. You want to believe Jason Young snapped and I'm asking you what you are basing your opinion on. [/*]

Im basing my opinion on that i think he did this to michelle and that no i do not believe he planned it and that i think he snapped during an argument. You can argue my opinion all you want but to say that it doesnt ever happen is wrong. I wasnt speaking about all the facts in the SP case, i am quite familiar with all the facts in that case that we and LE knows, what we dont know is the cause of death in that case. Womanizer or not, it doesnt explain HOW he killed Laci, nooone knows that for sure, we can only assume and my opinion on that is that he snapped, didnt want to become a father is the factor of my opinion, time was running out for him, she was due in a couple weeks, yes i believe he snapped because he had no prior history of violence, womanizing isnt considered physically violent in my book, emotional abusive maybe. And yes i believe JY may have snapped if he did this to her, also because he has no prior history of violence. You can disagree, its all good, its called debating, but its not a stretch that he could have snapped if he did this to her and it has happened in cases before.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I know S. Peterson is on death row for the premeditated murder of his wife. How you get "snapped" out of that is my question. [/*]

and premeditated can be minutes before.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


Im basing my opinion on that i think he did this to michelle and that no i do not believe he planned it and that i think he snapped during an argument. You can argue my opinion all you want but to say that it doesnt ever happen is wrong. I wasnt speaking about all the facts in the SP case, i am quite familiar with all the facts in that case that we and LE knows, what we dont know is the cause of death in that case. Womanizer or not, it doesnt explain HOW he killed Laci, nooone knows that for sure, we can only assume and my opinion on that is that he snapped, didnt want to become a father is the factor of my opinion, time was running out for him, she was due in a couple weeks, yes i believe he snapped because he had no prior history of violence, womanizing isnt considered physically violent in my book, emotional abusive maybe. And yes i believe JY may have snapped if he did this to her, also because he has no prior history of violence. You can disagree, its all good, its called debating, but its not a stretch that he could have snapped if he did this to her and it has happened in cases before. [/*]

All I asked you to do is cite a case where it has happened and you keep insisting S. Peterson "snapped." He didn't. Scott Peterson was convicted of premeditated murder and the premediation took place days and weeks prior, not seconds. Scott didn't just "snap" as you claim. I guess how you arrived at the conclusion Peterson "snapped" will remain a mystery.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


All I asked you to do is cite a case where it has happened and you keep insisting S. Peterson "snapped." He didn't. Scott Peterson was convicted of premeditated murder and the premediation took place days and weeks prior, not seconds. Scott didn't just "snap" as you claim. I guess how you arrived at the conclusion Peterson "snapped" will remain a mystery. [/*]


"All i asked you to do is....." Thats A joke MM. I dont know who you think you are here but dont condescend me. It is of my opinion that SP snapped because he didnt want to become a father. I have every right to have that opinion just like i have every right to have the opinion that if JY did this to his wife, HE SNAPPED and my reasoning for that is because he didnt have any prior history of violence. Now after three posts, if you dont get that and wanna keep picking apart my posts, thats fine, type away. Its my opinion and i have every right to it.

[fiver]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


Im basing my opinion on that i think he did this to michelle and that no i do not believe he planned it and that i think he snapped during an argument. You can argue my opinion all you want but to say that it doesnt ever happen is wrong. I wasnt speaking about all the facts in the SP case, i am quite familiar with all the facts in that case that we and LE knows, what we dont know is the cause of death in that case. Womanizer or not, it doesnt explain HOW he killed Laci, nooone knows that for sure, we can only assume and my opinion on that is that he snapped, didnt want to become a father is the factor of my opinion, time was running out for him, she was due in a couple weeks, yes i believe he snapped because he had no prior history of violence, womanizing isnt considered physically violent in my book, emotional abusive maybe. And yes i believe JY may have snapped if he did this to her, also because he has no prior history of violence. You can disagree, its all good, its called debating, but its not a stretch that he could have snapped if he did this to her and it has happened in cases before. [/*]
So, in your senario - Michelle and Jason had an spat while speaking on the phone and it affected him in such a way that he drove 3 hours to confront her and during that confrontation he snapped and tried to strangle her and failing that, he beat her to death. Right?

[fiver]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl



"All i asked you to do is....." Thats A joke MM. I dont know who you think you are here but dont condescend me. It is of my opinion that SP snapped because he didnt want to become a father. I have every right to have that opinion just like i have every right to have the opinion that if JY did this to his wife, HE SNAPPED and my reasoning for that is because he didnt have any prior history of violence. Now after three posts, if you dont get that and wanna keep picking apart my posts, thats fine, type away. Its my opinion and i have every right to it. [/*]Of course you do. When someone is desribed as having "snapped" and committing murder, it is usually considered a "heat of the moment" type reaction - in other words, the act of murder immediately follows the "snap". In the SP case, as MM pointed out, there was obvious planning of the murder presented by the DA, which negates "heat of the moment". If I understand you correctly, you think that something in SP's mind snapped which caused him to formulate the murder plan. Do I have that right?

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by fiver

So, in your senario - Michelle and Jason had an spat while speaking on the phone and it affected him in such a way that he drove 3 hours to confront her and during that confrontation he snapped and tried to strangle her and failing that, he beat her to death. Right? [/*]

well kinda, thats one scenario. I actually was thinking that Michelle may have found out that night about MM (if there was anything going on with them). She could have called him and said "get your @ss home, we have to talk". He came home with no intention on going back to the meeting, they argued, she threw her wedding ring and said its over, maybe she even nailed him in the face with it, who knows just a scenario, maybe she even pushed him, or not, but anyway, it got out of hand and he snapped. Just my theory.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by fiver
Of course you do. When someone is desribed as having "snapped" and committing murder, it is usually considered a "heat of the moment" type reaction - in other words, the act of murder immediately follows the "snap". In the SP case, as MM pointed out, there was obvious planning of the murder presented by the DA, which negates "heat of the moment". If I understand you correctly, you think that something in SP's mind snapped which caused him to formulate the murder plan. Do I have that right? [/*]

No, i followed the SP case on this board and on tv very closely. It is my opinion that he didnt want to be a father and things were building up in his world and his mind (having a girlfriend). I never believed he had the whole thing planned out for months as some may believe, and that he snapped that day, panicked and snapped. Maybe an argument started it, maybe not, but i do not think he planned this months in advance cuz his alibi put him right where the bodies were.

[fiver]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


well kinda, thats one scenario. I actually was thinking that Michelle may have found out that night about MM (if there was anything going on with them). She could have called him and said "get your @ss home, we have to talk". He came home with no intention on going back to the meeting, they argued, she threw her wedding ring and said its over, maybe she even nailed him in the face with it, who knows just a scenario, maybe she even pushed him, or not, but anyway, it got out of hand and he snapped. Just my theory. [/*]That's as good of a theory as anyone has presented. :)

In your theory, if Jason had no intention of going back for his meeting did he only return to the hotel to provide himself an alibi?

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by fiver
That's as good of a theory as anyone has presented. :)

In your theory, if Jason had no intention of going back for his meeting did he only return to the hotel to provide himself an alibi? [/*]

yes thats what i think IF he did this.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


you dont know what happened in the SP case, there wasnt a cause of death announced because they couldnt determine, i can assume that SP snapped, just like i can assume that JY, if he committed this crime, i believe he snapped. And yes there are plenty of other cases that spouses snap. Im not required to list them all, i listed one. [/*]


SP did not snap, he had a well thought laid out plan to get rid of Laci..
The computer charts of the bay , telling Amber, Laci was dead before she really was , and acting the grieving husband prior to actually being one.

Kat

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl



"All i asked you to do is....." Thats A joke MM. I dont know who you think you are here but dont condescend me. It is of my opinion that SP snapped because he didnt want to become a father. I have every right to have that opinion just like i have every right to have the opinion that if JY did this to his wife, HE SNAPPED and my reasoning for that is because he didnt have any prior history of violence. Now after three posts, if you dont get that and wanna keep picking apart my posts, thats fine, type away. Its my opinion and i have every right to it. [/*]

I didn't suggest you don't have a right to your opinion, I merely asked why you believed Peterson "snapped" when there was an abundance of evidence presented at his trial that he planned it.

:shrug:

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I didn't suggest you don't have a right to your opinion, I merely asked why you believed Peterson "snapped" when there was an abundance of evidence presented at his trial that he planned it.

:shrug: [/*]

and i stated why, but whatever, we are off topic, the only reason why i brought it up is because I believe SP snapped, i stated why, you dont have to agree.

I believe JY snapped, i could be wrong, maybe he didnt even do this, but my theory is he did until more facts come out, until then my theory stands that he snapped, i dont believe he planned. I believe he covered up well after the fact.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


well kinda, thats one scenario. I actually was thinking that Michelle may have found out that night about MM (if there was anything going on with them). She could have called him and said "get your @ss home, we have to talk". He came home with no intention on going back to the meeting, they argued, she threw her wedding ring and said its over, maybe she even nailed him in the face with it, who knows just a scenario, maybe she even pushed him, or not, but anyway, it got out of hand and he snapped. Just my theory. [/*]

It is a fact that MM admitted she had daily contact with JY. It is a fact that she lived hundreds of miles away. It is a fact the two couples were all friends.

But there has been nothing presented to us that indicates it was a serious relationship that threatened the marriage and thus would trigger such a strong reaction from Michelle Young, that she would demand Jason return home immediately. I do not believe a discussion over daily phone/email contact would escalate into the horrendous degree of violence that resulted.

[fiver]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


It is a fact that MM admitted she had daily contact with JY. It is a fact that she lived hundreds of miles away. It is a fact the two couples were all friends.

But there has been nothing presented to us that indicates it was a serious relationship that threatened the marriage and thus would trigger such a strong reaction from Michelle Young, that she would demand Jason return home immediately. I do not believe a discussion over daily phone/email contact would escalate into the horrendous degree of violence that resulted. [/*]
I agree.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by fiver
That's as good of a theory as anyone has presented. :)

In your theory, if Jason had no intention of going back for his meeting did he only return to the hotel to provide himself an alibi? [/*]

I find it helpful if theories are based on facts and the fact is, Jason was at the hotel that morning and he did attend his meeting. Surely, all the attendees at that meeting were interviewed by LE as to his demeanor, appearance, etc.

[SaraSidle]

Originally posted by fiver

I agree. [/*]


I also agree. SP wanted Amber,did not want to be a father and did not want a divorce. No snapping there. And I do not believe there is any real proof at this time that JY is guilty. Snapping or not. IMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


and i stated why, but whatever, we are off topic, the only reason why i brought it up is because I believe SP snapped, i stated why, you dont have to agree.

I believe JY snapped, i could be wrong, maybe he didnt even do this, but my theory is he did until more facts come out, until then my theory stands that he snapped, i dont believe he planned. I believe he covered up well after the fact. [/*]

I don't agree that people without a history of anger management problems one day just "snap" and fly into a homicidal rage and then "snap" right out of it back into normalcy, which is what one has to believe if you believe Jason did this.

[Kat4Eagles]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MandyMutton


I don't agree that people without a history of anger management problems one day just "snap" and fly into a homicidal rage and then "snap" right out of it back into normalcy, which is what one has to believe if you believe Jason did this. [/*][/QUOTE

Hi Mandy...:seeya:

This is why I will not understand the pre~med theory.

If ever a murder was in the heat of the moment, this one was.

I always thought and still do this was not an intentional murder.
All heck broke loose, but by whom, over what, and why are the outstanding questions.

Kat

[fiver]

According to investigators, Jason Young said he had left the house sometime Nov. 2 for a business trip to Virginia.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/crime_safety/michelle_young/story/571385.html

Appears that Jason did, indeed, speak to the investigators before he got an attorney.

[fiver]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MandyMutton


I don't agree that people without a history of anger management problems one day just "snap" and fly into a homicidal rage and then "snap" right out of it back into normalcy, which is what one has to believe if you believe Jason did this. [/*][/QUOTE

Hi Mandy...:seeya:

This is why I will not understand the pre~med theory.

If ever a murder was in the heat of the moment, this one was.

I always thought and still do this was not an intentional murder.
All heck broke loose, but by whom, over what, and why are the outstanding questions.

Kat [/*]

I'm not sure how anyone could call it planned, let alone carefully or well planned when the strangulation attempt was a failure :shrug:

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver
According to investigators, Jason Young said he had left the house sometime Nov. 2 for a business trip to Virginia.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/crime_safety/michelle_young/story/571385.html

Appears that Jason did, indeed, speak to the investigators before he got an attorney. [/*]

I had read that awhile back, and I know Jason spoke to them briefly..

But, you have to remember these guys were waiting for him since close to the time Michelle's body was found, at around 1:30 pm, and he did get there until around 8-9 pm.

Think they weren't on the warpath by the time he drove up??


Kat

[fiver]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I find it helpful if theories are based on facts and the fact is, Jason was at the hotel that morning and he did attend his meeting. Surely, all the attendees at that meeting were interviewed by LE as to his demeanor, appearance, etc. [/*]I would hope so, but then again, that may be why this case is still unsolved.

[fiver]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


I had read that awhile back, and I know Jason spoke to them briefly..

But, you have to remember these guys were waiting for him since close to the time Michelle's body was found, at around 1:30 pm, and he did get there until around 8-9 pm.

Think they weren't on the warpath by the time he drove up??


Kat [/*]I'm not sure I'm following you, why would they be on the warpath?

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver


I'm not sure how anyone could call it planned, let alone carefully or well planned when the strangulation attempt was a failure :shrug: [/*]


Exactly, Fiver.
The crime scene itself shows you it was not planned, all Jason had to do was smother Michelle after she was asleep, if that was the plan.

The crime scene was a mess and with the struggle Michelle put up, her killer or killers had to substain some injuries, even minor ones.

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver
I'm not sure I'm following you, why would they be on the warpath? [/*]

Can you imagine waiting to talk to someone or ask them questions, after coming from the crime scene from the Young home 6-7-8 hours ago.?

They had to be impatient , at least, to see Jason.
Bet they were not too happy.

Kat

[fiver]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles



Exactly, Fiver.
The crime scene itself shows you it was not planned, all Jason had to do was smother Michelle after she was asleep, if that was the plan.

The crime scene was a mess and with the struggle Michelle put up, her killer or killers had to substain some injuries, even minor ones.

Kat [/*]Or come up with a better plan than manual strangulation. And of course an air tight alibi is always part of a carefully planned murder so that all bases are covered.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver
Or come up with a better plan than manual strangulation. And of course an air tight alibi is always part of a carefully planned murder so that all bases are covered. [/*]


That's another thing.

We were told Jason drove until he was tired and ended up at a hotel that he just decided to stop at.

Think about it.

If this was all so pre~planned, why not make reservations somewhere or sometime in advance?

There is your better alibi.

Kat

[fiver]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


Can you imagine waiting to talk to someone or ask them questions, after coming from the crime scene from the Young home 6-7-8 hours ago.?

They had to be impatient , at least, to see Jason.
Bet they were not too happy.

Kat [/*]I would consider it very unprofessional if they got upset because Jason had drive from hours away and they had to wait to talk with him.:shrug:

[fiver]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles



That's another thing.

We were told Jason drove until he was tired and ended up at a hotel that he just decided to stop at.

Think about it.

If this was all so pre~planned, why not make reservations somewhere or sometime in advance?

There is your better alibi.

Kat [/*]:confused: I thought one of the Search Warrants had a reservation confirmation for the hotel he stayed at.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by fiver
:confused: I thought one of the Search Warrants had a reservation confirmation for the hotel he stayed at. [/*]

I think LE found a "receipt" for the hotel. I don't know exactly what a "receipt" is.

JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Your source for this information is WRONG :lol: [/*]

Do you have a link for the correct information?

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MandyMutton


I don't agree that people without a history of anger management problems one day just "snap" and fly into a homicidal rage and then "snap" right out of it back into normalcy, which is what one has to believe if you believe Jason did this. [/*][/QUOTE

Hi Mandy...:seeya:

This is why I will not understand the pre~med theory.

If ever a murder was in the heat of the moment, this one was.

I always thought and still do this was not an intentional murder.
All heck broke loose, but by whom, over what, and why are the outstanding questions.

Kat [/*]

I think entry into the house was premeditated. It's possible the murder was a spontaneous event when Michelle awakened.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


It is what they give you at checkout.
;) [/*]

It could also be the printout from online reservations, or the printout they give you at check-in.

JMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Interesting, you were absolutely convinced MF killed her sister.
You are also convinced the perpetrator would have sustained some injuries.
MF had no scratches or bruises on her face , hand or arms.

Thanks for your admission that MF did not kill her sister.;) [/*]

It is unknown whether MF had any injuries. LE didn't obtain an NTIO for her although it's doubtful she was injured if she was the one who took aim at her only sister's head with an object.

JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


No link Cardinal. I just asked the people that knew the facts

She has no link to her info...except it came from the retired teacher. [/*]

The difference in your 2 statements is that she said "we were told"; you stated it as fact.

Without a link, it is only what YOU were told, and I have no way to judge the credibility of your source. So you may or may not be correct, imo.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


It is unknown whether MF had any injuries. LE didn't obtain an NTIO for her although it's doubtful she was injured if she was the one who took aim at her only sister's head with an object.

JMO [/*]

I doubt the killer sustained injuries regardless of whom it may have been.

JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Well lets see. Kats info came from the retired teacher...that is a fact.

My info came for careful research with confidential sources that know the facts.
I really don't care if you believe me or not . [/*]

That's a good thing. :)

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by fiver


I'm not sure how anyone could call it planned, let alone carefully or well planned when the strangulation attempt was a failure :shrug: [/*]

Those calling it "planned" are desperate to have Jason arrested. It's obvious what their agenda is and it's nothing to do with justice for Michelle.

I think LE has established that Jason didn't "plan" his trip to Brevard until after he was on the road, phoned his mother, phoned his wife. The possibility was wide open that Michelle would have said, "no." The GA friend was there when he phoned. Mrs. Young spoke to LE.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Those calling it "planned" are desperate to have Jason arrested. It's obvious what their agenda is and it's nothing to do with justice for Michelle.

I think LE has established that Jason didn't "plan" his trip to Brevard until after he was on the road, phoned his mother, phoned his wife. The possibility was wide open that Michelle would have said, "no." The GA friend was there when he phoned. Mrs. Young spoke to LE. [/*]

The information in your 2nd paragraph may or may not be true as well, but I don't think it was planned either.

JMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Wonder why they did not get a NTIO for MF :confused: [/*]

Bad judgment? Inept? Inexperienced with psychopaths? Whatever the reason, mistakes were made in this case.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Cardinal


The information in your 2nd paragraph may or may not be true as well, but I don't think it was planned either.

JMO [/*]

My confidential sources assure me that both Mrs. Young and the GA friend have been interviewed and have cooperated.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


My confidential sources assure me that both Mrs. Young and the GA friend have been interviewed and have cooperated. [/*]

It seems as though we have lots of confidential sources represented on the board tonight.

:biggrin:

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


So the killer was sneaking in the bedroom to get something and she awoke. He then tried to strangle her before bashing her brains in . Yea right. [/*]

No, I believe it was two people. One sneaked in to the bedroom to steal the jewelry, the other went into CY's bedroom to make sure she didn't awake. The failed strangulation created noise so the second party joined the first party and proceeded to obliterate Michelle. My theory.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


The ONLY source Mutton and Kat have is the retired teacher. [/*]

Really? And who are your sources?

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Again, 'facts' from the retired teacher.
Do you actually believe MY said "ok, go to your Mommy's and I will entertain YOUR friends when they come tomorrow night" :lol: [/*]

Actually I know there was no need for Michelle to entertain anyone on Friday night. That guest had cancelled. The friends were expected on Saturday, not Friday, so maybe you should worry more about the credibility of your own sources?

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


The ONLY source Mutton and Kat have is the retired teacher. [/*]

The retired teacher has yet to see his friend so much as named a POI by LE so it seems his information is quite solid and credible. Yours? Not so much.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


WRONG [/*]

I'm not wrong, much to your chagrin it seems.

[fiver]

Originally posted by Cardinal


The information in your 2nd paragraph may or may not be true as well, but I don't think it was planned either.

JMO [/*]I saw your theory on the other thread and I appreciate you taking the time to type it all out. :)

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by fiver
I saw your theory on the other thread and I appreciate you taking the time to type it all out. :) [/*]

Thanks, fiver. It could be totally off the wall, but it's a theory.

:)

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Bludgeon a pregnant mom to death in overkill fashion to grab a drawer of costume jewelry + a wedding ring ....yea right. [/*]

Unfortunately, the animal who committed this crime didn't care.

jmo

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Sorry, I meant to say the clan from the hills. [/*]

And is it your crusade to villify Jason's family? I fail to see how that's any more acceptable.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


:lol: :lol:

Oh yes , you are VERY WRONG.

You have no idea who was on the way from Charlotte and who called them while they were on I-85 Friday afternoon on the way to Raleigh.

Quit making up crap Mutton, you are not even close. [/*]

I'm not making anything up. Why would they leave Charlotte on Friday afternoon when they weren't to be at the Young's until Saturday? Were they bicycling?

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Holding court again Cardinal ?

There is a difference in using a slang term to describe JY's family and all but calling the victim's sister a killer.:read: [/*]

I'm not holding anything, Bud. Just responding to posts. Isn't that what one does on a message board?

If someone chooses to believe that Michelle's sister is capable of murder, that's their right. Isn't it?

JMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Well Mutton, they were invited for Friday night , not Saturday.
They were on their way as planned Friday night and were called by a mutual friend in route.
Trying to twist the facts will not change anything. [/*]

I'm not twisting the facts. Believe whatever you want but it is a fact the guest expected for Friday night cancelled out.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Geez. Your post tried to equate Mutton's vilifying MF as the killer to me calling the Young's a 'clan'. [/*]

Vilify:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/vilify

"to lower in estimation or importance "

It could be interpreted that calling Jason's family a "clan from the hills" is lowering them in estimation or importance, couldn't it?

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I'm not holding anything, Bud. Just responding to posts. Isn't that what one does on a message board?

If someone chooses to believe that Michelle's sister is capable of murder, that's their right. Isn't it?

JMO [/*]

Yes. I believe MF was involved and have stated why. I'm not inventing facts to support my theory.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by june1943
If you are who I think you are I can't see how you would turn on Jason the way you have. He thought you were his friend as well as Michelle's. For your information some of the best people in NC come from the hills as you call them. Look at the crime rate in the hills compared to the cities. I'll take the hills any time. [/*]

I doubt either Jason or Michelle ever met Bud.

PS,
clear your PMs, pls.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser




I absolutely think the Young clan is way below importance.
They are slime IMO [/*]

Now THAT is vilification. For the record.

So it really gives you no standing to call out anyone else, does it?

JMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


For you to say that is fact is a bold face lie.
Again, YOU have no idea what you are spewing on this board.

BTW, it was not "a" guest, it was the killer's college bud and his wife [/*]

It isn't a lie. Cite a link that supports your claim a guest was expected on Friday. It's pure myth, imo.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Cite a link ? :lol:

Cite a link they were expected Saturday but cancelled, [/*]

I haven't claimed they were expected Saturday and cancelled. Activities planned for after the murder really are irrelevant.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser
Mutton continues on her sick crusade to vilify Meredith Fisher.

Not even worth a read or response.

Have fun ya' hear.

:seeya: [/*]

Then why do you keep responding?



Everyone please do your part to keep the MY board up and open. Please ignore the baiters, no insults or rumors, don't quote posts that are against the TOS and please follow the rules of TOS. :read:

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by june1943
Why would Meres college friend be staying with Jason and Michelle when she had a house 15 minutes away? [/*]

Good point.

In reality, if a guest was expected for Friday night, their friends would have mentioned it in that newspaper article that mentioned Jason's plan to swing by Brevard.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by june1943


I guess since there are no links to support either one and its not relevant to the murder any way we can move on. Do you not think that a strong person was in front of Michelle hitting and that is why all the damage to the left side of the head and mouth? Now a weaker person was in back of her . That is why after more than 13 blows no under lying bone damage was done. [/*]

Someone (I can't remember) posted earlier that the back of the skull may be stronger than the portion around the face. That makes sense to me, although I don't know if it's true.

Does anyone?

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Then why do you keep responding?



Everyone please do your part to keep the MY board up and open. Please ignore the baiters, no insults or rumors, don't quote posts that are against the TOS and please follow the rules of TOS. :read: [/*]

Thanks, annalyzer, for the reminder.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Wrong Mutton. The N&O quoted Rhett Fussell.
He was not involved in the Friday night plans so he had no idea.
As for the"swing by" statement, better check with Kim . [/*]

Rhett made the statements and unlike yourself, he actually knew the Youngs. If you want to continue to believe there were guests expected on Friday, that's okay by me.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


She had a base skull fracture......

Base skull fracture, is a linear skull fracture involving the base of the skull. Breaks in bones at the base of the skull, require more force to cause than other skull fractures. Thus they are rare, occurring as the only fracture in only 4% of severe head injury patients.

This type of skull fracture can be caused by a blow to the back of the head [/*]

Okay, but are the bones at the rear of the skull stronger than the ones around the face?

[awareness]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I'm not twisting the facts. Believe whatever you want but it is a fact the guest expected for Friday night cancelled out. [/*]

Link please - since you're saying its a FACT.

JMO/IMO

[on the go]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Rhett made the statements and unlike yourself, he actually knew the Youngs. If you want to continue to believe there were guests expected on Friday, that's okay by me. [/*]

If you knew the guests were on their way to the Youngs on Friday, what would you then make of Jason's side trip to Brevard?

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


She was struck on the mouth and mandible , not the face. [/*]

So I'm not technically correct. Fine, I don't have that expertise.

I'm trying to determine whether June's theory is correct, that different amounts of force were required to inflict the injuries.

Would the same amount of force inflict different injuries on different portions of the skull?

[awareness]

Originally posted by june1943
Why would Meres college friend be staying with Jason and Michelle when she had a house 15 minutes away? [/*]

Bud was referencing Michelle & Jason's friends - but Im sure you realized this before you made your post just to stir the pot.

Its my OPINION that they were yet another back up plan to retrieve Cassidy. Just in case Meredith didn't go over. IIRC/IMO Jason called her in the morning, even though Meredith was a waitress and I think she worked the night before IIRC? But Meredith didn't go over there until what around 1-1:30? So its IMO that the friends were a back up plan to rescue Cassidy in case Meredith didn't go over. NOTE- Im saying none of this is FACT so don't ask me for a link.

JMO/IMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser



She had a single blow to her mouth, breaking her mandible and causing avulsion of 5 teeth.

The remaining blows to the side and rear of her head were inflicted with the same force, as all the cuts were down to the skull. [/*]

Thank you. As gory as that is, I appreciate the explanation.

So, June, if that's true, I don't think the blows support a theory of 2 killers inflicting them with different degrees of force.

JMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by on the go


If you knew the guests were on their way to the Youngs on Friday, what would you then make of Jason's side trip to Brevard? [/*]

The media asked friends questions. No mention made to the media that friends were to be guests of the Youngs Friday night.

:shrug:

[on the go]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


The media asked friends questions. No mention made to the media that friends were to be guests of the Youngs Friday night.

:shrug: [/*]

Yes, I understand your position. But what if they were coming Friday. What would you then think of Jason's side trip to Brevard?

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver
I would consider it very unprofessional if they got upset because Jason had drive from hours away and they had to wait to talk with him.:shrug: [/*]\


I agree but I bet they were over~anxiously awaiting to talk to Jay.

I hope they were nice to him.
Or, at least sympathetic.

I hope they did not go into complete accusatory mode.

:shrug:

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver
:confused: I thought one of the Search Warrants had a reservation confirmation for the hotel he stayed at. [/*]


I am pretty sure it was a hotel receipt for the date he stayed,

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by fiver
I saw your theory on the other thread and I appreciate you taking the time to type it all out. :) [/*]

I agree, even if I disagreed with the theory
I know that Card is trying their best to be fair.
And, that is not easy here.

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles
\


I agree but I bet they were over~anxiously awaiting to talk to Jay.

I hope they were nice to him.
Or, at least sympathetic.

I hope they did not go into complete accusatory mode.

:shrug:

Kat [/*]

Of course they were over-anxious. Honestly, if I were LE, I would've been too.

And I doubt they were nice, although I do think they should have at least pretended to be sympathetic.

I don't doubt that by the time Jason and his family arrived in Raleigh, LE was tired, ragged and ready to jump on him. They'd seen a horrible crime and waited a long time.

Was that the best way to handle it? Probably not. Did they think the statistics dictated the killer? Probably so.

Were they right, or wrong? We don't know yet.

JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


I agree, even if I disagreed with the theory
I know that Card is trying their best to be fair.
And, that is not easy here.

Kat [/*]

Thanks, Kat. :)

I know you disagree, and that's fine. But we absolutely agree about one thing: whatever you think here, it's not easy.

JMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by on the go


Yes, I understand your position. But what if they were coming Friday. What would you then think of Jason's side trip to Brevard? [/*]

I would want to know what the friends thought of the Brevard trip.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Thanks, Kat. :)

I know you disagree, and that's fine. But we absolutely agree about one thing: whatever you think here, it's not easy.

JMO [/*]

yw.......

I don't think anything is going to happen over the Memorial Day weekend , do you?

This will be the 2nd Memorial Day since Michelle died, another season getting ready to start without resolution.

Kat

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser



She had a single blow to her mouth, breaking her mandible and causing avulsion of 5 teeth.

The remaining blows to the side and rear of her head were inflicted with the same force, as all the cuts were down to the skull. [/*]

It wasn't a single blow to her mouth that broke her mandible.

[on the go]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I would want to know what the friends thought of the Brevard trip. [/*]

I agree. It would be interesting to know their thoughts on Brevard.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by june1943


You are wrong. There was a blow to the back of the head near the base of the skull but it caused no underlying damage. It could not have caused the fracture to the left fossa. [/*]

Good analysis, June.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


yw.......

I don't think anything is going to happen over the Memorial Day weekend , do you?

This will be the 2nd Memorial Day since Michelle died, another season getting ready to start without resolution.

Kat [/*]

I think if anything were going to happen this week, it would have already. LE wouldn't wait for the weekend.

And yes, it's another holiday without resolution. How sad...........

JMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I think if anything were going to happen this week, it would have already. LE wouldn't wait for the weekend.

And yes, it's another holiday without resolution. How sad...........

JMO [/*]


I guess those who thought because L F was meeting with the DA , something was going to happen with the GJ this week.

Fact is, nothing ever does.

Kat

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


lol june, you have no idea what the left middle lossa is .
The base of the skull sustained the fracture. Like I said, it appeared the blows to the back of the skull were inflicted with the same force as those behind her ear (left lossa area) [/*]
what's a lossa?

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by alter ego

what's a lossa? [/*]

lol id like to know too

[katy1974]

I'm new to this so have patience.
I have been a long time lurker. Just registered today.
I guess you can say I'm a fence sitter.

I want to ask those that think JY is guilty. Why do think he is?
And how do you know that Jason's planned visit with his mother was a last minute idea?
What is the one thing that makes Jason guilty, and not the sister?
What does Jason have to gain?
It looks like he would be miserable with his life now.
why do you think Meredith would kill Michelle. Didn't they do alot together? Is there a fact that they weren't close or were fighting over something? Has Meredith spoke at Michelle's memorials?
Has Jason spoke at any of them?

Has anybody said jason didn't want another baby?
Why would he want to kill the baby?

I just can't believe that Jason would kill Michelle. And leave his little girl there by herself.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


No june, you are wrong.
The contusion at the top of her neck had nothing to do with the base skull fracture. I never said that :rolleyes:

The fatal base skull fracture was due to a crushing blow in the skull area directly behind her left ear. [/*]
Fatal base skull fracture?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by june1943
I wear my mouth on my face don't you? [/*]That's where my mouth is.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Very rare and often fatal. [/*]There is no base skull fracture described in the AR for Michelle Young. It prolly is in Dale Earnhardt's tho.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Ask june, she seems to be the expert on lossas :lol: [/*]She said lossa once then corrected herself. Can't say the same for you.

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Hello katy.
This board is now frequented mainly by a handful of "JII" posters.
If you want the truth and an unbiased opinion, go to
this board and join the dscussion.

http://frictionpowered.hqforums.com/michelle-young-murder-vf1.html
I [/*]

Hello.
I posted earlier today too, but no one commrnted or has said a word to me. I thought maybe I was invisible. Now I know I'm not.

I never knew about that other board.
I'll go over there and take a look.
Thank you very much Bud Wiser.

[katy1974]

I have a print out on her autopsy. There was a base skull fracture, means severe violently beaten, enough to break bone in this area is very very rare.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by katy1974


Hello.
I posted earlier today too, but no one commrnted or has said a word to me. I thought maybe I was invisible. Now I know I'm not.

I never knew about that other board.
I'll go over there and take a look.
Thank you very much Bud Wiser. [/*]

I saw your first post but in it you didn't ask any questions of others, only stated your opinion. I also could not understand this ~ "I think Jason looks guilty, but I am not so sure he is the murderer of Michelle. "

You think he looks guilty but not sure he is the murderer? So what do you think he looks guilty about? And by what photo did you base this opinion?

[katy1974]

Originally posted by annalyzer


I saw your first post but in it you didn't ask any questions of others, only stated your opinion. I also could not understand this ~ "I think Jason looks guilty, but I am not so sure he is the murderer of Michelle. "

You think he looks guilty but not sure he is the murderer? So what do you think he looks guilty about? And by what photo did you base this opinion? [/*]

I mean that some of the things he has done, or not done, make him appear guilty. Not talking, alleged affair, insurance policy, do make him look a little suspicious, but is he the killer?

I just don't think he could kill the mother of his child though! The pregnant mother of his little girl, pregnant with a baby boy. What man doesn't want to have a son too?

Thank you for your response annalyzer:)

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by katy1974


I mean that some of the things he has done, or not done, make him appear guilty. Not talking, alleged affair, insurance policy, do make him look a little suspicious, but is he the killer?

I just don't think he could kill the mother of his child though! The pregnant mother of his little girl, pregnant with a baby boy. What man doesn't want to have a son too?

Thank you for your response annalyzer:) [/*]

Oh okay. You mean it looks like he's guilty. Yes, I agree.

Nice meeting you katy! :seeya:

[katy1974]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Oh okay. You mean it looks like he's guilty. Yes, I agree.

Nice meeting you katy! :seeya: [/*]

Thank you, nice to meet you, annalyzer!:)

How do you feel about Jason , do you think he could do this?

Or the sister, do you think she could kill her own sister?

I just don't think a family member killed her.

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Just a little suspicious ? [/*]

Maybe alot suspicious, but that still doesn't mean he killed Michelle.
It's hard for me to imagine he could kill her when she is carrying his son!

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser



I hate to mention Scott Peterson, but his loving wife was carrying his son .;) [/*]

I know that, he told several people he didn't want to be a father.
Has Jason told anyone he didn't want another baby?

[Hey Paula]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser



I hate to mention Scott Peterson, but his loving wife was carrying his son .;) [/*]

Laci Peterson, Jessie Davis and Lori Hacking were all pregnant when they were murdered. Peterson's and Hacking's husbands were convicted of the crimes. Davis' boyfriend remains on $5 million in her case.
(AP Photo)


EXCERPT:

According to a number of studies, homicide is one of the leading causes of death for pregnant women in the United States. Studies in Maryland, New York and Chicago determined that about 20 percent of women who die during pregnancy are murder victims.

Some states do not even keep track of the number of a pregnant women killed by boyfriends or husband. But the Washington Post identified more than 1,300 during a 14-year period ending in 2004.

LINK:

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3316485

[katy1974]

Originally posted by katy1974


I know that, he told several people he didn't want to be a father.
Has Jason told anyone he didn't want another baby? [/*]

Plus Jason was already a father, and knew how the joys and experience of being a father felt.

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


Laci Peterson, Jessie Davis and Lori Hacking were all pregnant when they were murdered. Peterson's and Hacking's husbands were convicted of the crimes. Davis' boyfriend remains on $5 million in her case.
(AP Photo)


EXCERPT:

According to a number of studies, homicide is one of the leading causes of death for pregnant women in the United States. Studies in Maryland, New York and Chicago determined that about 20 percent of women who die during pregnancy are murder victims.

Some states do not even keep track of the number of a pregnant women killed by boyfriends or husband. But the Washington Post identified more than 1,300 during a 14-year period ending in 2004.

LINK:

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3316485 [/*]

I just gave birth to my first baby, a boy April 22.
My husband treated me like a queen during the entire pregnancy.
Thank God for good husbands!

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


I

While Michelle was 5 months pregnant, her husband was having an affair with her best friend.....not very likely he was treating her like a queen. [/*]

Yes I have read about the alleged affair.

But why were they having another child?
Was Jason a good dad?
A hands on father?
Did her help Michelle?
It's so hard to think he could murder her with an alive viable baby boy inside her womb!

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by katy1974


Thank you, nice to me you, annalyzer!:)

How do you feel about Jason , do you think he could do this?

Or the sister, do you think she could kill her own sister?

I just don't think a family member killed her. [/*]

Men do it all the time. Pregnant women are more likely to be killed by their SO then most any other reason. The statistics are high.

The sister? There are a few here that really believe the sister is the killer. My number one suspect has always been Jason. The 911 call put the sister under suspicion by some.

http://wral.com/news/local/audio/1119462/

Many believe she was just in shock and that is the explanation for her odd voice inflections and demeanor during the call. I think she sounds evasive. Why, I don't know. When comparing her call to a call made in a similiar situation the difference is dramatic. This 911 call was made by a mother who found her grandson alone and her daughter, Jessie Davis, missing.

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?ID=360678&r=0&Category=11&subCategoryID=0

The difference is astounding. But I also agree that everyone is different and there is no playbook on how to make a 911 call. The focus has been on Jason. I've not heard anything (besides the 911 call) to make me think Meredith is in any way involved.

[katy1974]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Men do it all the time. Pregnant women are more likely to be killed by their SO then most any other reason. The statistics are high.

The sister? There are a few here that really believe the sister is the killer. My number one suspect has always been Jason. The 911 call put the sister under suspicion by some.

http://wral.com/news/local/audio/1119462/

Many believe she was just in shock and that is the explanation for her odd voice inflections and demeanor during the call. I think she sounds evasive. Why, I don't know. When comparing her call to a call made in a similiar situation the difference is dramatic. This 911 call was made by a mother who found her grandson alone and her daughter, Jessie Davis, missing.

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?ID=360678&r=0&Category=11&subCategoryID=0

The difference is astounding. But I also agree that everyone is different and there is no playbook on how to make a 911 call. The focus has been on Jason. I've not heard anything (besides the 911 call) to make me think Meredith is in any way involved. [/*]

I have never thought that Michelle's sister killed her, and not her boyfriend either. She sounds like she is very full of fear and is in shock during the 911 call to me.

I am suspicious of Jason too. I know all of our rights that we all have in these type circumstances. I can not see myself invoking my rights under the same circumstance. But does that really mean Jason killed her or is he just a weak man who has no backbone?

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


As the family friend said, the baby was just a "fetus".

By all accounts, he loves the little girl, the apple of his eye. That is why she is alive today ;) [/*]

The family friend? Who is the family friend?

It seems if the little one is the apple of his eye, he wouldn't have killed her mother. I know men do it, more times than I like to think about.
Is there any others besides Jason that could have done this do you think?

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Both ;) [/*]

If Jason did kill Michelle, I agree alright, he is a weak man, without a backbone.

I just can't believe that a grown man would not do everything under the sun to find the killer of his wife. He has to be a really really big wimp to not help the investigation!

His mother should be ashamed of his actions really, guilty or innocent.

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


it is my humble opinion that Jason Young killed his wife and unborn son. [/*]


I really lean that direction too. I just have held out saying he is guilty, because it's hard to believe he could really kill her to me.
Just because she was pregnant. That may sound stupid, but if she weren't pregnant I would say yes he did it. But a pregnant woman? So he killed a baby and a wife?

Why didn't he kill her before the pregnancy? Or after?
My thinking this, doesn't mean Michelle's life meant nothing. I just think about the fact that he is a father already, and he didn't kill the little girl. So why would he kill a son?

[katy1974]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


That would be the retired school teacher that posted on numerous boards over the past year as 'Gojo' [/*]

I have seen his name mentioned, I don't know if I've actually read any of his posts. Does he still post? If not, why?

[katy1974]

My little guy is up now, so I'll see you guys later.

Good night.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


I

While Michelle was 5 months pregnant, her husband was having an affair with her best friend.....not very likely he was treating her like a queen. [/*]That's not been proven to be true and you know it.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by katy1974
I have a print out on her autopsy. There was a base skull fracture, means severe violently beaten, enough to break bone in this area is very very rare. [/*]Which Injury # depicts a base skull fracture?

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by alter ego
Which Injury # depicts a base skull fracture? [/*]

None of them.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


None of them. [/*]I found it...it's in the 'internal exam of head' section.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by alter ego
I found it...it's in the 'internal exam of head' section. [/*]

I saw that but it isn't depicted on any of the numbered diagrams. #8 about the 13 lacerations to the back of her head says there are no underlying skull fractures. I think the AR supports June's contention that the heaviest blows were to the left side of her head/face. The blows to the back of her head were less force and didn't produce underlying fractures.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by june1943


A person standing in front of her did the major damage to her. She would probable have died from the wounds to the back of the head but they weren't as severe as the ones to the left side and front. The wounds to the back were to the skull but how far is it to the skull? A fraction of an inch. The skull was not damaged in the back of the head. [/*]

ITA with you, June. The ME made note of it because it is notable. No underlying fractures to the back of the head.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


She had a base skull fracture......

Base skull fracture, is a linear skull fracture involving the base of the skull. Breaks in bones at the base of the skull, require more force to cause than other skull fractures. Thus they are rare, occurring as the only fracture in only 4% of severe head injury patients.

This type of skull fracture can be caused by a blow to the back of the head [/*]
If you are going to cut&pate from Wikipedia,you should abide by TOS and supply a link. :no:

Also, your cut&paste specifically states it is rare as the ONLY fracture. I like the way you mixed the quotes from 2 sections into one.

A basilar skull fracture (or Basal skull fracture) is a linear skull fracture involving the base of the skull. This type of fracture is rare, occurring as the only fracture in just 4% of severe head injury patients...
Basilar skull fractures can be caused by a blow to the back of the head, or by sudden deceleration of torso but not head (as in traffic accidents), resulting in separation of the suture between the occipital and temporal bones.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilar_skull_fracture

Basilar skull fractures, breaks in bones at the base of the skull, require more force to cause than cranial vault fractures. Thus they are rare, occurring as the only fracture in only 4% of severe head injury patients...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skull_fracture

:read:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I saw that but it isn't depicted on any of the numbered diagrams. #8 about the 13 lacerations to the back of her head says there are no underlying skull fractures. I think the AR supports June's contention that the heaviest blows were to the left side of her head/face. The blows to the back of her head were less force and didn't produce underlying fractures. [/*]

I agree.

Here is a diagram showing the skull bones, note the red line depicting the 'base skull'.

http://www.lhsc.on.ca/critcare/icu/edubriefs/baseskull.html

[alter ego]

Originally posted by june1943


A person standing in front of her did the major damage to her. She would probable have died from the wounds to the back of the head but they weren't as severe as the ones to the left side and front. The wounds to the back were to the skull but how far is it to the skull? A fraction of an inch. The skull was not damaged in the back of the head. [/*]
I agree.

[Cardinal]

In the past, I've made a conscientious effort not to judge the Young family based solely upon the behavior of their chief advocate on these boards.

I now find myself making the same effort with regard to the Fisher family.

FWIW and JMO

[katy1974]

Somone did bash the back of Michelle's head. A force so severe it knocked her teeth out, it caused a basilar fracture ( a fracture at the base of her skull), and she had bilateral ( both side ) brusing, swelling and bleeding of her brain. Injuries form blunt force injury #8, 9,10.

This is all in autopsy report. If anyone disagrees, please read the comments of ME on autopsy report.

Now whoever murdered Michelle wanted to make sure she would not get up off of the floor ever again. She was beaten in the worst possible way. Whoever did it was more than a little mad with her.
Whoever did it is a very sick person. And I don't see how they would be able to hide their sickness from people.

[katy1974]

Originally posted by alter ego
Which Injury # depicts a base skull fracture? [/*]

# 8 ,9 , 10 caused the basilar skull fracture alter ego.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


If you want to argue 2 killers, you need to get your facts right.
The autopsy report does not offer any credibility to your theory.

There was a single blow across her mouth breaking her mandible /jaw, loosening or breaking 5 teeth. (some were eventually ejected with the blows to the back of the head like Katy said)
The wounds to the back and side of her head were obviously inflicted with the same weapon, using the same relative amount of force. imo [/*]

omg, ive read the last ten posts, now i have a headache and toothache and feel like im gonna throw up. Cant even imagine someone doing this to another person.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by katy1974
Somone did bash the back of Michelle's head. A force so severe it knocked her teeth out, it caused a basilar fracture ( a fracture at the base of her skull), and she had bilateral ( both side ) brusing, swelling and bleeding of her brain. Injuries form blunt force injury #8, 9,10.

This is all in autopsy report. If anyone disagrees, please read the comments of ME on autopsy report.

Now whoever murdered Michelle wanted to make sure she would not get up off of the floor ever again. She was beaten in the worst possible way. Whoever did it was more than a little mad with her.
Whoever did it is a very sick person. And I don't see how they would be able to hide their sickness from people. [/*]

Noone disputes that Michelle was struck on the back of the head or that it was whomever did this is one sick individual. The valid point June raised is that the blows to the back of the head were less forceful than the wounds on the left side of her head. Please re-read the autopsy report. :read:

[SaraSidle]

Originally posted by june1943


Like I said you are allowed your opinion . I am allowed mine. You have no way of knowing if the wounds to the back of her head were from the same object. No object has been identified so to say obviously same weapon is a stretch on your part. Where in the autopsy did it say the teeth were ejected with a blow to the back of the head? Please point that out to me I can't find it. [/*]

I am going to reiterate my pov. The back of the head has no weakness or cavities like the side of the head. The side of the head is weaker in the skull are due to the orbital cavities,sinuse cavities and ear canals. One Perprtator IMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


If you want to argue 2 killers, you need to get your facts right.
The autopsy report does not offer any credibility to your theory.

There was a single blow across her mouth breaking her mandible /jaw, loosening or breaking 5 teeth. (some were eventually ejected with the blows to the back of the head like Katy said)
The wounds to the back and side of her head were obviously inflicted with the same weapon, using the same relative amount of force. imo [/*]

Your attempts to correct June are more than a little silly considering there is an autopsy report that backs her up and she's linked it.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Well, lets see June.
3 of the teeth had complete roots with no breaking or damage.
Reckon they could have been ejected out of her broken mandible during one of the 21 blows to the back /side of her head ? [/*]

There were no underlying fractures to the 13 lacerations described in BFI #8 as June has correctly pointed out to you. If you want to speculate those blows ejected teeth, well I reckon nobody is stopping you.

:rolleyes:

[jerzeegirl]

im honestly not being argumentative here but this is the first ive heard of the possibility of two killers. Have LE or the ME stated this possibility? Or maybe this is one of the details they are keeping hush hush about. Honestly ive never thought that two ppl did this, no matter who did it, i always thought they went solo.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Yep, that same report backs me up ;) [/*]

No, but if you need to believe it does, sobeit.

[SaraSidle]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


No, but if you need to believe it does, sobeit. [/*]


I am trying so hard to see 2 people bashing in one person's head and it is just not working. IMO

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl
im honestly not being argumentative here but this is the first ive heard of the possibility of two killers. Have LE or the ME stated this possibility? Or maybe this is one of the details they are keeping hush hush about. Honestly ive never thought that two ppl did this, no matter who did it, i always thought they went solo. [/*]

It's implied in the autopsy report so of course it is a possibility. Add that to the results of the NTIO that apparently are not a match to Jason or Meredith and it becomes even more likely a possibility. Not sure why some are so insistent it's an impossibility.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by SaraSidle



I am trying so hard to see 2 people bashing in one person's head and it is just not working. IMO [/*]

There was quite a bit more to it that just the bashing of her head.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Don't take their bait.

June and Mutton want you to think Meredith and her boyfriend are the killers. :rolleyes: [/*]

What boyfriend?

[jerzeegirl]

i didnt see in the autopsy report where it was implied there were to ppl who were beating her. I know June stated that some of the hits werent as hard as others but could that just be because the person that was doing the hitting was being blocked by michelles hands or she was crawling away and some hits were closer in range than others? I dont know.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Why are you now backing off June's 'soft blow' theory that obviously involved Meredith ? You know the same girl that received warm hugs from the sheriff and the 2 detectives at the ladybug liftoff . [/*]

What girl? Meredith is a grown woman and I what I saw in a photo was scowls, not hugs.

[jerzeegirl]

June? Is your theory maybe that one person was choking michelle while the other was beating? Im just confused cuz this is the first ive heard of the two person theory.
Anything is possible, JY could have had an accomplice, or whoever did this to her could have, but if there isnt any evidence at the scene from one person, kind of sounds unlikely that two people got outta there without leaving anything, hairs, dna, etc.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl
i didnt see in the autopsy report where it was implied there were to ppl who were beating her. I know June stated that some of the hits werent as hard as others but could that just be because the person that was doing the hitting was being blocked by michelles hands or she was crawling away and some hits were closer in range than others? I dont know. [/*]

Michelle wasn't doing any crawling after the first blow to the head and it's impossible for one person to be trying to strangle her, hitting her in the face and back of the head all at the same time.

[MandyMutton]

Originally posted by Bud Wiser


Maybe you were actually looking in the mirror :lol: :lol: [/*]

it's all just a big joke to you, we know.:rolleyes:

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Michelle wasn't doing any crawling after the first blow to the head and it's impossible for one person to be trying to strangle her, hitting her in the face and back of the head all at the same time. [/*]

did they state in the ME report that the first blow was fatal or knocked her unconsious? Because if not, the other blows may have been first which would make it possible that she was trying to get away. And the attempted strangulation could have been first, then when that failed, pick up something and hit her. Because if one person was choking her and another was hitting her, i believe the strangulation would have been successful. JMO.