Michelle Marie Young 4/30/08

[Barbara2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I didn't follow the case but I do remember his 911 call wasn't what convicted him. Faking hysteria was attempting to sound normal. He also managed to touch the victim to help her. That's normal. It was his abnormal behavior, a clear motive and opportunity that convicted him. jmo [/*]

The man was guilty. He killed his wife. I don't know how you translate that into helping her. He touched her so that her blood on him would be explained. You do realize that we are talking about the murderer here, right?

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by annalyzer


That's just a few known murderers you're referring to. What about the thousands upon thousands of 911 calls that we never hear? Surely you're not going to try and say that people don't cry, act hysterical and sob during their 911 calls after finding a loved one in a bloody heap? Otherwise I really don't see your point. [/*]

Well I'm not rehashing it all over again.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Faking hysteria was attempting to sound normal. [/*]

Exactly.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I don't either. Normal is sobbing, panic, pleas to hurry. Not five minutes of, "uh, I dunno." Maybe she plumb forgot how to act? [/*]


Until the day (God forbid) you or any one else on this board should happen to come upon a lifeless body of a loved one and are faced with making a 911 call, no one is in the position to define what "normal" really is.

IMO

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


If Meredith had sounded "normal" on that 911 call, it wouldn't have attracted the attention it did. The content is also very suspicious, imo. [/*]

What's normal? Is there a 911 playbook? Sure heard enough about there is no playbook for grief a few years ago.

As I said earlier, what about Cynthia Sommer's 911 call?

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by Blaze


It only attracted the attention of a few posters here who want nothing more to see JY get away with the murder of Michelle.
Most people don't see it the way the couple of you do.

JMO [/*]

I know where it started and when she first started banging the drum. Nov 17, 2006. The ones here have just taken up the chant.

IMO

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


What about Cynthia Sommer's 911 call? [/*]

Her 911 call was part of the prosecution's case.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


ok. Wasn't she convicted? [/*]

Yes. Then appealed. Won a new trial. DA dropped all charges. New found tissue samples that showed no arsenic. So there was never a murder to begin with, her husband died of natural causes.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Actually, prosecutors and expert witnesses provide those definitions to juries in every murder trial. :read: [/*]

Every single murder trial?
You mean to tell us that the "normal" way to conduct yourself during a 911 call is defined in all murder trials?

How about only those trials where the 911 call is suspect. And hey, if that's the case with Meredith's call, then prosecutors and expert witnesses can dissect it all they want.


But so far, the only people who seem to have a problem with that call are a handful of message board posters, so until I see anything discussed about it by media, LE, etc. I'll just have to assume that these opinions have been based on poor judgment.
IMO

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


So what's your point about the 911 call? It was used to convict her, but it wasn't the sole reason for her conviction, correct? Nobody here has ever suggested that the 911 call alone is enough to arrest Meredith Fisher. imo, it will be used to convict her. A jury will decide what is "normal." [/*]

Other than the 911 call what reason do you have to suspect her? And I'm not talking about what you "heard". Anything been published in the media, Sws etc...

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by TIAZ


Never having been in Meredith's position I can't judge her either way. I don't think anyone else here can either unless they were called by their BIL to retrieve a document from his home and found their sister dead and their neice alone in the house. If someone here has been in a similar situation, I'd like to know what your 911 call sounded like. [/*]

Listen to Patty Porter after she found her grandson alone, the house "ransacked" and her daughter missing. Not in a bloody heap in front of her but missing.

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?ID=360678&r=0&Category=11&subCategoryID=0

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Listen to Patty Porter after she found her grandson alone, the house "ransacked" and her daughter missing. Not in a bloody heap in front of her but missing.

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?ID=360678&r=0&Category=11&subCategoryID=0 [/*]

And we also saw Bobby Cutts crumbled in a heap during a search for Jesse. He was so distraught. Reminds of falling plumb to his knees.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by TIAZ


Which again makes the point that there is no standard for a 911 call.

If Jason didn't kill Michelle, how does he sleep at night not knowing who did? [/*]

Easy. He doesn't care. And lots of booze and babes help. The guy has moved on. IMO.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


The 911 call is compelling enough to "suspect" her, imo. [/*]

So that's it. Flimsy.

imo

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by TIAZ


Which again makes the point that there is no standard for a 911 call.

[/*]

Bobby Cutts didn't make that call. Patty Porter, the victims mother, did.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Jason has been investigated, has he not? [/*]


And continues to be investigated, is he not?

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Updating dummies isn't my interest. Sorry. [/*]

:lol:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Jules2



Until the day (God forbid) you or any one else on this board should happen to come upon a lifeless body of a loved one and are faced with making a 911 call, no one is in the position to define what "normal" really is.

IMO [/*]Unless of course it's in judgement of Jason.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I haven't seen motive or opportunity. [/*]

Just lots of search warrants for him, his property and his family. Last ones on 2-14-08. Strike that, you haven't seen the latest ones, but you heard about them. And they were served to clear Jason, ROFL.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Not likely, no. [/*]

Well that's where I disagree.

I find it highly likely that he is still being investigated. Just like you continue to believe Meredith is. The difference being the fact that he hasn't cooperated with LE added to the locations and contents of the SW's to name a few.

In your eyes, you see searches being conducted at places where Jason has resided as searches to clear him and implicate his SIL. In your eyes, you see SW's that are still out there for Meredith herself.

What I see with my own two eyes are SW's investigating Jason, his vehicles, where he is residing, his phones, computers etc. I don't see any whatsoever for Meredith.

And until I do, some message board poster claiming to have "heard" of such warrants, isn't credible proof.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I didn't use that standard, you did. [/*]

So who has LE said is a suspect? Other than that NTO where Jason was named. You are implying Meredith is a suspect because the media hasn't said she's been officially cleared. Right?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


Sure do. Lots of criminals are blabber mouths or think they are smarter than LE. [/*]Yup, they sure do.

And since talking to LE doesn't equate to innocence, not talking to LE doesn't equate to guilt.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by alter ego
Unless of course it's in judgement of Jason. [/*]


My personal opinions have been based on what I know of this case, and since Jason didn't make the 911 call, please don't assume that I would scrutinize his conduct during that call.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by TIAZ


Well, since he sent Meredith over to discover the horror he created, he didn't have to make that call, so you are right, we are not able to judge him based on that. [/*]No, instead he is judged based on what some declare they would or would not do or what how they think their spouse would or would not act. You know, giving a definition to what "normal" is.

What some have declared can't be done for the 911 call.


Oops.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by alter ego
Yup, they sure do.

And since talking to LE doesn't equate to innocence, not talking to LE doesn't equate to guilt. [/*]

I had my reservations about that for a long time when it came to a spouse or parent. Then I watched one of the CTV shows about a man's ex-wife and children that were murdered. LE eyed him when he immediately lawyered up. Turned out it was the handyman that murdered them.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by TIAZ


Not in this case. Jason not even willing to answer basic questions, even through an attorney equals guilt.

JMO [/*]It does? Well gosh, why isn't he in jail?

And why is it that a DA is barred from saying anything about a defendant invoking their rights at a trial?

And why did the founding forefathers give us rights that just mean we are guilty if we invoke them.

What in the world were they thinking hammer

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Not talking to LE does equate intelligence, imo. [/*]Absolutely.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


No he didn't. 18+ months and no arrest. Plenty of time to establish opportunity.

Perhaps you should educate yourself? [/*]


Well then by your reasoning, Meredith is also innocent of this crime since it's been 18+ months and she's still a free woman.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
I have heard that for 18+ months.hammer [/*]


Heard it about Meredith too. No arrest. Must mean she's innocent.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by TIAZ


What will you do if Jason is arrested? [/*]

Carrying the jtf torch and scream Duke Lacrosse, Sheriff's up for re-election...

[Jules2]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
Not necessarily. All the JDI swear she has NOT been investigated.When they investigate her for 18+ months and NO arrest.I will agree with you. [/*]


According to a poster here, there are un-returned SW's regarding Meredith. So they must have investigated her right?

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by Jules2



According to a poster here, there are un-returned SW's regarding Meredith. So they must have investigated her right? [/*]

If on 2-14 the media reported that MF's home was searched they would have jumped out of their lazy boys with glee, shouting see she's a suspect. None of this oh they are just clearing her.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


LE hasn't spent18 months investigating Meredith. She might be free but not for long, imo. Meredith has done herself no favors wasting LE's time implicating Jason. [/*]


You don't know who all they have investigated for the entire 18 months, and that's a fact.

No one knows.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


LE hasn't spent18 months investigating Meredith. She might be free but not for long, imo. Meredith has done herself no favors wasting LE's time implicating Jason. [/*]


How is she personally implicating Jason?

A link would be nice.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


I had my reservations about that for a long time when it came to a spouse or parent. Then I watched one of the CTV shows about a man's ex-wife and children that were murdered. LE eyed him when he immediately lawyered up. Turned out it was the handyman that murdered them. [/*]Good to hear. There may be hope for you yet :biggrin:

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
NO,you are finally willing to admit others beside Jason have been investigated. Great... [/*]

I'm sure they did at first, but on 2-14-08...I know broken record. Facts are facts and just the facts are, on 2-14-08 they served new search warrants on Jason and his family.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Actually, my glee came when I learned about the probable cause in search warrants that have yet to be returned. Now, I can patiently wait. I already know the end of this movie, what I'm waiting for is to see YOUR reaction. [/*]

Really? Ya coming over? Let me know so I can book you a room.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE

Oh no,not according to all the JDI. I will play your game and tell you,when they investigate her for 18+ month and NO arrest,I will remove her from my suspect list. Until then she will remain one of others IMO. [/*]


I don't play games. That's twice now that you have said that to me and it's twice now that I will remind you that I take this very seriously. It's not a game and it's not a contest.

If you only consider this as a game to be played, then perhaps you don't fully understand what the Michelle Fisher Young thread is for. IMO

[alter ego]

Originally posted by cooper1946




I could repeat this 100 times but i think you will get it the first go around My Little Lamb Chop Jason Young Killed His Wife And Unborn Son, face the facts here. [/*]Which facts are those?

Have you shared them with WCSO cuz they still haven't solved the case.

Guess they aren't as smart as you even tho they know what the evidence is and you don't. Who woulda thunk :shrug:

[Jules2]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
NO,you are finally willing to admit others beside Jason have been investigated. Great... [/*]

Finally?


I've known it to be FACT since the beginning of this case that others have been investigated. MM for one.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by alter ego
Good to hear. There may be hope for you yet :biggrin: [/*]

I'm not unreasonable or a everyone is guilty freak. I've followed a few cases that I didn't believe the suspect or person on trial was responsible for the crime.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


I'm sure they did at first, but on 2-14-08...I know broken record. Facts are facts and just the facts are, on 2-14-08 they served new search warrants on Jason and his family. [/*]
So.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by alter ego

So. [/*]

They appear to not be looking in any other direction than Jason.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


It's pretty standard procedure that police look closely at: 1) the spouse, 2) the last person to see the victim alive and 3) the person who finds the body.

We've seen search warrants returned about the first two parties and not a single s/w returned for the third and some posters are under the delusion this is a GOOD sign. Oh my. [/*]

Where did you see a SW for GA friend?

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


It's pretty standard procedure that police look closely at: 1) the spouse, 2) the last person to see the victim alive and 3) the person who finds the body.

We've seen search warrants returned about the first two parties and not a single s/w returned for the third and some posters are under the delusion this is a GOOD sign. Oh my. [/*]


Your assumption that the un-returned SW's pertaining to the "third party" is just that....an assumption. Better yet, wishful thinking.

And we are to believe this because you "heard" this from who/where?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


So who has LE said is a suspect? Other than that NTO where Jason was named. You are implying Meredith is a suspect because the media hasn't said she's been officially cleared. Right? [/*]LE said they were looking at everyone close to the victim and had not ruled anyone out.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by cooper1946


You would be better off served with a dollop of mint jelly before you see pigs fly my dear. [/*]

Are you hungry or something because all you are talking about is food. :confused:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by cooper1946





Well let's just put it this way i am sure me and WSCO are so much smarter then you and thats all that really matters:read: [/*]
Yes and this sentence of yours proves just how much smarter you are.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by alter ego

Yes and this sentence of yours proves just how much smarter you are. [/*]

:biggrin:

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


It's pretty standard procedure that police look closely at: 1) the spouse, 2) the last person to see the victim alive and 3) the person who finds the body.

We've seen search warrants returned about the first two parties and not a single s/w returned for the third and some posters are under the delusion this is a GOOD sign. Oh my. [/*]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Where did you see a SW for GA friend?

I'm not hanging around the rest of the night for an answer to this question, but I would like one. Slip of the tongue? 1 & 2 are the same person...

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


They appear to not be looking in any other direction than Jason. [/*]Things aren't always as they appear.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by alter ego
Things aren't always as they appear. [/*]

In this case we will have to disagree.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


I'm not unreasonable or a everyone is guilty freak. I've followed a few cases that I didn't believe the suspect or person on trial was responsible for the crime. [/*]So why isn't this case one of them?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by cooper1946






It don't take a whole lot to be smarter then you or your little Lamb Chop . You don't like what i type dont read it . [/*]You should be proud of your level of being smarter. I know I'm impressed!

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by TIAZ


Never having been in Meredith's position I can't judge her either way. I don't think anyone else here can either unless they were called by their BIL to retrieve a document from his home and found their sister dead and their neice alone in the house. If someone here has been in a similar situation, I'd like to know what your 911 call sounded like. [/*]

I posted a 911 call from a similiar situation. But here it is again in case anyone didn't listen to it last night.

Listen to Patty Porter after she found her grandson alone, the house "ransacked" and her daughter missing. Not in a bloody heap in front of her but missing. (It is the second video).

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?...subCategoryID=0

[5swab5]

Originally posted by annalyzer


I posted a 911 call from a similiar situation. But here it is again in case anyone didn't listen to it last night.

Listen to Patty Porter after she found her grandson alone, the house "ransacked" and her daughter missing. Not in a bloody heap in front of her but missing. (It is the second video).

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?...subCategoryID=0 [/*]

What's the point?

I doubt any two 911 calls are alike. Patty Porter is a grown woman. She went to the house out of concern for her daughter, not at the behest her daughter's SO, on a "fluke".



MOO

Swabby

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by 5swab5


What's the point?

[/*]

Tiaz asked for a 911 call in a similiar situation to see what it sounds like.

[Barbara2]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Tiaz asked for a 911 call in a similiar situation to see what it sounds like. [/*]

It's not similar except for the fact that a child was at the scene. Nothing else about the situations is the same.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by TIAZ


here was my post:

"Never having been in Meredith's position I can't judge her either way. I don't think anyone else here can either unless they were called by their BIL to retrieve a document from his home and found their sister dead and their neice alone in the house. If someone here has been in a similar situation, I'd like to know what your 911 call sounded like."


I wanted to hear if from someone who is HERE judging Meredith. [/*]
Well gosh, how come that doesn't apply to the judgement passed down on Jason and people declaring they would never do ____ or their spouse would do ______ and if he is innocent he would _____ ?

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
That was over 6 weeks ago. Still not named a suspect or arrested.Maybe they are training new investigators. LMBO [/*]

Hi Hi~C !!

Actually its been almost 11 weeks now!!

Kat

[Hey Paula]

Originally posted by annalyzer


I posted a 911 call from a similiar situation. But here it is again in case anyone didn't listen to it last night.

Listen to Patty Porter after she found her grandson alone, the house "ransacked" and her daughter missing. Not in a bloody heap in front of her but missing. (It is the second video).

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?...subCategoryID=0 [/*]

Meredith had the added pressure of trying to remain outwardly calm, so as not to traumatize her toddler niece, who had already been through the harrowing experience of being left alone with her mother's bloodied corpse for several hours. And from CY's talkativeness in the background, likely heard and saw what no child should ever have to hear and see.

Have you ever listened to Michael Peterson's 911 call? He probably sounded as you expected of Meredith, even though he was the person who murdered Kathleen.

IMO

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Barbara2


It's not similar except for the fact that a child was at the scene. Nothing else about the situations is the same. [/*]


The demeanor of the callers sure aren't the same. :eek:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


Meredith had the added pressure of trying to remain outwardly calm, so as not to traumatize her toddler niece, who had already been through the harrowing experience of being left alone with her mother's bloodied corpse for several hours. And from CY's talkativeness in the background, likely heard and saw what no child should ever have to hear and see.

[/*]

Patty Porter's grandson was right there and he had been traumatized by what he had seen and by being left alone for hours too.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


snip~

Have you ever listened to Michael Peterson's 911 call? He probably sounded as you expected of Meredith, even though he was the person who murdered Kathleen.

IMO [/*]

As Mandy put it, he was faking hysteria to attempt to sound normal.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by TIAZ


here was my post:

"Never having been in Meredith's position I can't judge her either way. I don't think anyone else here can either unless they were called by their BIL to retrieve a document from his home and found their sister dead and their neice alone in the house. If someone here has been in a similar situation, I'd like to know what your 911 call sounded like."


I wanted to hear if from someone who is HERE judging Meredith. [/*]


K, how about this?

The only sister entering the home through the garage has to see Michelle's car there.............hmmm, so, first thought is Michelle is home.....

Wow, what's with Mr. G.he is really freaking on me. 2nd thought

Starts to calll Michelle's name......
Gets no answer..
Hears C somewhere in the home.
Wanders around the downstairs a little, then heads for the stairs.
Upon reaching the doorway, she sees her sister laying on the floor.
She can see Michelle before ever entering the room.

Room is a mess, blood all over, things may be all over, so, let me ask you this.....

Does she see any of Michell's teeth that were knocked out?
Does she see any of these horrific wounds C wants to bandage?


Okay, now she calls 911...did she try to see if she could help Michelle at all?

Somewhere fear or panic has to set in.
It just does.,
It has to kick in that Michelle did not fall, and that something else happened.

She has had time now to take in the situation, so her first call is to 911 , right?

Cause this is going to be important if she called anyone but 911 first,

Very important...big....huge...


Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by cooper1946



ATTENTION WE HAVE A NEW ROOM MOD THERE NAME IS HI-CYCLE
PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC..............you don't really think i am gonna lisen to you do you?????????????????? [/*]

I hope you are having fun, and yes, you have been reported.
Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


I hope you are having fun, and yes, you have been reported.
Kat [/*]

Good.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Good. [/*]

It shouldn't take long.

:)

Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I'm sure you really do believe everyone who makes a 911 call later asks for a copy of the recording but I assure you such a request isn't NORMAL behavior.

:rolleyes: [/*]

The only way we're going to have a copy of a 911 call is usually because a criminal act occured and the tape was released. It's ridiculous to ask for one of us to supply a similiar 911 call tape that we made. I supplied one to compare. The situations were similiar. The two callers sound very different. :eek:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


ITA. You can hear Blake in the background of the calls. Impossible to understand what he says because he was traumatized.

CY doesn't sound traumatized in the least. She sounds like a happy chatterbox suggesting boo-boos and bandaids. I guess she was trying "to hold it together" for her auntie. :rolleyes: [/*]

And Patty is crying, sobbing, pleading for them to hurry, trying to calm down as instructed by the operator, and she's not even looking at a bloody, battered loved one. :eek:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by TIAZ

snip~


Unless you were in the exact same situation as Meredith, you have no room to judge.

Thats all I was saying so don't even start. [/*]

People are judged every day in courtrooms. The jurors were probably never in the same situation as the accused but they must still judge.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


ITA. Very important. Especially if none of those calls were mentioned to police and were discovered only after review of records.

Did you notice on the 911 call how the only sister lowers her voice
when she mentions the dog freaking out? For some odd reason, she doesn't want CY hearing her say that. Maybe 'cuz the dog wasn't freaking out? Was it just another lie MF tossed into the call to divert attention away from that dead body across the way? [/*]

I know, you never hear the dog at all.
@@

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by annalyzer


People are judged every day in courtrooms. The jurors were probably never in the same situation as the accused but they must still judge. [/*]


Patty was hysterical and didn't use Blake as an excuse to hold it together..

I noticed the ony sister even tries to explain her calmness, by saying she is normally good under pressure.

No one is asking her to be good.
no one is asking her to be normal, either.
The only sister, guess what?
You were allowed to freak out.

You just walked into one of the worst crime scenes in Raleigh history..

If Mr. G was freaking out, he had more of a normal reaction than she did.


Kat

[Hey Paula]

Originally posted by annalyzer


And Patty is crying, sobbing, pleading for them to hurry, trying to calm down as instructed by the operator, and she's not even looking at a bloody, battered loved one. :eek: [/*]

There are different ways to look at the situation Patty Porter was in. Undoubtedly Blake told his grandmother "Mommy was crying, Mommy broke the table, Mommy is in the rug". At that point, Patty might have thought Jessie was merely abducted and that time was of the essence in getting LE to find her daughter. As long as someone is missing, there is always hope they are still alive. I think Patty's sense of urgency was centered on that.

I also believe, from listening to Meredith on that 911 call, that she was having a problem absorbing what she was confronted with when she entered her sister's house. Shock and denial are words which enter my mind in describing my impression of Meredith on that tape.

IMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Meredith seemed more worried about the dispatcher's opinion of her rather than helping her sister. Initially in the call, Meredith appears to feign panic. A breathlessness and the dispatcher keeps telling her to calm down. Voila, breathlessness disappears and she's very calm with a flat affect at some points. An expert in voice analysis will have a field day on the witness stand about that call.

jmo [/*]

Good points and not just that, but she says things that aren't important, like why she is there.

Who cares?

And, its not just the things she said, its the things she doesn't do.

Like a protective reaction would be to remove C to anywhere but where she is, so she does not see Michelle.

Doesn't the dispatcher even ask her that?
Let me check Sils blog.

Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


There are different ways to look at the situation Patty Porter was in. Undoubtedly Blake told his grandmother "Mommy was crying, Mommy broke the table, Mommy is in the rug". At that point, Patty might have thought Jessie was merely abducted and that time was of the essence in getting LE to find her daughter. As long as someone is missing, there is always hope they are still alive. I think Patty's sense of urgency was centered on that.

I also believe, from listening to Meredith on that 911 call, that she was having a problem absorbing what she was confronted with when she entered her sister's house. Shock and denial are words which enter my mind in describing my impression of Meredith on that tape.

IMO [/*]

I hope I am never so shocked and in denial that I won't even check on or turn my loved one over to see if there is any way I can help them.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


imo, there is only one way to look at Patty Porter's call and that is in the context of what really happened. Patty's voice reflects sheer terror. Patty feared the worst and she was spot on. Patty never testified she thought Jessie was "merely abducted." How many grown women have been "merely abducted" from their homes and found alive? [/*]

ITA

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


While you're at Sils' pull up the part where she asks CY if someone had been there. That, in itself, is a subconscious admission that she knew her sister had been harmed by another human being. No fall. jmo [/*]

Can you clear PM's.?

:D

Kat

[lilismom]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


Good points and not just that, but she says things that aren't important, like why she is there.

Who cares?

And, its not just the things she said, its the things she doesn't do.

Like a protective reaction would be to remove C to anywhere but where she is, so she does not see Michelle.

Doesn't the dispatcher even ask her that?
Let me check Sils blog.

Kat [/*]

She sounds like she's a nervous wreck to me. She probably listened to that call a million times wondering why she said things like "this place doesn't look like it normally does" and didn't tick off the checklist of places where there actually was blood. Lawd knows the reaction here if she said "there is blood everywhere" when and if it really was only on the lamp, the floor, the wall and the bed.

I think the dispatcher does ask her to secure CY in another room and I think CY follows her back out. That's what it sounds like to me. He asks her if she's on a cordless phone or something too so that she can stay on w/him while she does it.

So, WHO did Meredith call before 911?

IMO,
Lilismom

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by lilismom
snip~


I think the dispatcher does ask her to secure CY in another room and I think CY follows her back out. That's what it sounds like to me. He asks her if she's on a cordless phone or something too so that she can stay on w/him while she does it.

[/*]

He asks her if she's on a cordless phone so she can finally go check on her sister's condition.

[lilismom]

Originally posted by annalyzer


He asks her if she's on a cordless phone so she can finally go check on her sister's condition. [/*]


What should she have done?

a. what she did
*. run screaming from the house and then call 911
c. call 911 and then run screaming from the house

Once she and the dispatcher realized that Michelle was likely beyond help, what should she have done? Start screaming and shaking Michelle? What?

IMO,
Lilismom

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by june1943
snip~

I can't believe people can listen to the 911 call and not find it strange. [/*]

Completely biased IMO. I have always said that Meredith may very well be innocent and that Jason is my number one suspect but I still find that 911 call strange. As agatha put it I'm playing both sides when all I am doing is looking at both sides/all perspectives. I don't know these people and I could care less who the murderer turns out to be. I just want the murderer arrested, tried and convicted.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Completely biased IMO. I have always said that Meredith may very well be innocent and that Jason is my number one suspect but I still find that 911 call strange. As agatha put it I'm playing both sides when all I am doing is looking at both sides/all perspectives. I don't know these people and I could care less who the murderer turns out to be. I just want the murderer arrested, tried and convicted. [/*]
You don't play both sides. You simply don't play.

You make astute observations and ask tough questions.

You have made me rethink my position and see things from a different perspective and for that, I thank you kindly.

I want Michelle's killer arrested, tried and convicted too. I'm also dismayed that the case remains unsolved and her killer roams free.

[lilismom]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
She should have grabbed that child and run out of that house as fast as she could. She had NO idea the killer was NOT still inside,putting Cassidy`s life in danger .She could have called 911 outside when they were safe. I think anyone would understand that. [/*]

But then, how would she, herself, have helped Michelle? Some are upset because she couldn't bring herself to touch her, to FINALLY help her. How would she have helped Michelle until EMS got there if she grabbed the child and left? Can't have it all ways. Either she stays on the phone and tries to get help, calls 911 screaming at them to send help and hangs up or leaves the house screaming and then calls 911. Which is it? Which would everyone prefer?

IMO,
Lilismom

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by lilismom
snip~

But then, how would she, herself, have helped Michelle? Some are upset because she couldn't bring herself to touch her, to FINALLY help her. How would she have helped Michelle until EMS got there if she grabbed the child and left? Can't have it all ways.[/*]

But she did neither. :shrug:

[lilismom]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Some are unable to see the forest for the trees. Those who claim they don't find it strange seem to be the same posters who think Jason is guilty. No coincidence, imo. [/*]

I have said all along I'm not sure. I can't be with what is publicly known.

Until Meredith is arrested, which I don't believe will happen, but you are entitled to think so, I am willing to give her a break on the 911 call. I might feel differently if I saw anything else that pointed me in her direction. Something other than the 911 call and the jealousy issue. That's not enough for me. Until then, it was her sister, the child was there, she was in shock, she couldn't believe what she was seeing. She gets a break from me.

You believe otherwise and that's fine. Now tell me why. Is today the day you'll start that list?

IMO,
Lilismom

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Some are unable to see the forest for the trees. Those who claim they don't find it strange seem to be the same posters who think Jason is guilty. No coincidence, imo. [/*]


There is also no coincidence that those who continue to support the husband are the same who are finding fault with every single thing regarding the sister of the murdered victim.

The same person who was "summoned" by the husband to find his wife's brutally beaten body.

The same person who has co-operated with LE.

The same person who has attended memorials for her much loved and missed sibling.

The same person who had no motive.


IMO

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


But she didn't stay on the phone and try to get help. The dispatcher tried to help Michelle. Meredith resisted. It would take seconds to determine Michelle was beyond help. Seconds. Not five minutes. imo [/*]

Was the ENTIRE 911 call released and made public info?

How long was that actual call?

Any one know?

[lilismom]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


But she didn't stay on the phone and try to get help. The dispatcher tried to help Michelle. Meredith resisted. It would take seconds to determine Michelle was beyond help. Seconds. Not five minutes. imo [/*]

How did she resist? Some of the time she wasn't even in the room. Some of the time she was focused on CY. Some of the time she was probably trying to keep herself from losing it.

I think the 911 call has been talked to death already. What you hear depends on what side of the fence your ears are on I guess. I'm still dangling out there in the middle somewhere and FWIW, as of right now, the 911 call is not enough to make me look in Meredith's direction.

IMO,
Lilismom

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Jules2
snip~

Was the ENTIRE 911 call released and made public info?

[/*]


Wasn't the first five minutes enough? :eek:


Anyway I believe the entire 911 call was released except for the edited out phone number, from the time MF first dials 911 to the point she is connected to the sheriff's dept. I haven't heard or saw anything to show otherwise.

[lilismom]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
I would prefer getting the child to safety.One look at the room and her sister, should, have told her to get cassidy to safety.From the way LE described the scene there should have been NO doubt a crime against her sister had been committed and she could NOT help her.I would have been in fear of my life and certainly you don`t take a chance on a tiny 2 year old becoming a victim. I am sure Michelle would have expected her to save her child's life..How long before LE are ambulance arrived? Would you put your life ahead of your child`s? I just can`t get by that mistake. [/*]

What mistake? Is there a right and a wrong here? She was in the middle of a horrible situation and she dealt with it in the moment. No right or wrong way. IMO.

It is easy to sit here now and criticize her isn't it? Its easy to sit here and pick apart her actions after the fact. It is easy to sit here and assume what you would have done in the same situation. It is easy but it isn't fair. At least not to me.

IMO,
Lilismom

[Jules2]

Originally posted by annalyzer



Wasn't the first five minutes enough? :eek:


Anyway I believe the entire 911 call was released except for the edited out phone number, from the time MF first dials 911 to the point she is connected to the sheriff's dept. I haven't heard or saw anything to show otherwise. [/*]


Actually, the first 5 minutes were enough to convince me that she handled herself quite well under the circumstances.


IMO, the call would probably have gone much differently if there wasn't a small child present. After listening to that call several times, I found Meredith's choice of wording to be more on the lines of "cautious" due to the fact that she didn't want to alarm a small child by acting hysterical like some posters believe she should have.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Allison


There is more.

We do not hear what she said to the Sheriff when the call was transferred to the proper department.

Listen to the very end of the call and you can hear her begin to talk with WCSO and the call ends.

She was "probably" on the phone with the WCSO until they arrived on scene. [/*]

I said from the time she dials 911 to the point she is connected to the sheriff's dept. :read:

The first five minutes is plenty of time to annalyze Meredith's voice inflection, demeanor and attitude about the whole situation.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Jules2



Actually, the first 5 minutes were enough to convince me that she handled herself quite well under the circumstances.


IMO, the call would probably have gone much differently if there wasn't a small child present. After listening to that call several times, I found Meredith's choice of wording to be more on the lines of "cautious" due to the fact that she didn't want to alarm a small child by acting hysterical like some posters believe she should have. [/*]

Did you listen to Patty Porter's 911 call that I supplied a link to at your request?

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by lilismom
snip~


It is easy to sit here now and criticize her isn't it? Its easy to sit here and pick apart her actions after the fact. It is easy to sit here and assume what you would have done in the same situation. It is easy but it isn't fair. [/*]

Yes, yes, yes and, oh well.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Did you listen to Patty Porter's 911 call that I supplied a link to at your request? [/*]


Patty Porter isn't Meredith. I can not nor will I compare the two calls when they were conducted under completely different circumstances by two completely different people.

I might react differently to certain situations than you would. So who is right and who is wrong?

[lilismom]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE
So you don`t think your first natural instinct would to get the child to safety in case the killer was still in the house? [/*]

I can honestly say that don't know what I would have done. Its not like she walked into a burning building where she would have known for 100% certain what she was dealing with. Its easy to say that because of the way the cops described the scene she should have known. They know what a murder scene looks like. Why would Meredith?

Do we know where CY was found? Do we know how long Meredith was downstairs? Do we know how long she was in the house before she went upstairs? Maybe she used the bathroom? Maybe she let the dog out? Maybe she put the mail on the table? Maybe she had no reason to think there was a murderer in the house? Maybe looking back she wishes she did grab CY and leave? Maybe she realized after the fact that she and CY could have been in danger too and shudders with the thought of it now?

So many questions.

IMO,
Lilismom

[Jules2]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Did you listen to Patty Porter's 911 call that I supplied a link to at your request? [/*]


BTW, you supplied that link in response to a post made by TIAZ.

I am not TIAZ in case you were confused.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Yes, the ENTIRE 911 call was released, per statute requirement.
The call was about 5 minutes in length.

The 911 portion of the call ended when it was transferred by 911 dispatch to the sheriff's office. [/*]


So, we don't know what was said once she was transferred to the sheriff's office.

Her entire call was not made public. Period

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


The entire 911 portion IS public. [/*]

The ENTIRE call is not.

[lilismom]

Originally posted by HI-CYCLE

I agree,so many questions.But even with all your questions,instinct would tell most people to get to safety,then call 911. Unless LE is lying,anyone with any sense would have known it was not a accident. [/*]

Right. Most people. Not Meredith for whatever reason. At least not on that day, in that situation.

Maybe she looks back now and wishes she'd said and done things differently. Maybe she doesn't. Maybe she's ok with how she handled herself.

:shrug:

IMO,
Lilismom

[lilismom]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


uh, if you want to believe Jason is the killer then you must believe that small child had been in the presence of her mother's unresponsive corpse for HOURS. Apparently this didn't phase the small child in the least because she sounds quite happy and chatty on the call. Not alarmed whatsoever.

Mere's priority should have been to helping her sister. How could Mere's words to a dispatcher possibly alarm that child? If Meredith truly was concerned about alarming the child, why didn't she secure the child AWAY from the scene? The dispatcher had to request that she do so. [/*]

But doesn't she say "I'm keeping her daughter out of there"? Or something close to it?

IMO,
Lilismom

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


uh, if you want to believe Jason is the killer then you must believe that small child had been in the presence of her mother's unresponsive corpse for HOURS. Apparently this didn't phase the small child in the least because she sounds quite happy and chatty on the call. Not alarmed whatsoever.

Mere's priority should have been to helping her sister. How could Mere's words to a dispatcher possibly alarm that child? If Meredith truly was concerned about alarming the child, why didn't she secure the child AWAY from the scene? The dispatcher had to request that she do so. [/*]


Oh I get it, you are now trying to say that there is a handbook for the proper reaction of a two year old when left in the presence of their murdered mother.

GMAB


You can spin this however much you want. There are simply no definitions of the "correct" way to handle oneself during a crisis.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Jules2


The ENTIRE call is not. [/*]

So what? All I needed was the first five minutes to form my opinion. I wonder if Meredith sounded as dumb and evasive to the sheriff's dept. as she did to the poor 911 operator?

Did you see what happened?

I don't know.

:confused:

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Of course you have no link. I'm fairly certain the sheriff's office hasn't let you listen in on their phone conversation with the only sister.

The 911 portion of the call was about 5 minutes. The 911 portion ended when the call was transferred to the WCSO. I have no doubt the Sheriff's deputy told her to remove herself and the child from the crime scene. I have no doubt she probably sought approval from the deputy for her performance. She did the same thing on the 911 portion.

jmo [/*]


Of course you have no link either.

So your "fairly certain" and "I have no doubts" amount to a hill of beans as far as I'm concerned.

Your assumption that Meredith sought approval for her so-called performance is pathetic.

IMO

[Jules2]

Originally posted by annalyzer


So what? All I needed was the first five minutes to form my opinion. I wonder if Meredith sounded as dumb and evasive to the sheriff's dept. as she did to the poor 911 operator?

Did you see what happened?

I don't know.

:confused: [/*]


Just as I only needed the first 5 minutes to form my opinion. Doesn't make my opinion wrong and it doesn't make you opinion wrong either.

I just happen to not agree with your opinion.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Of course you have no link. I'm fairly certain the sheriff's office hasn't let you listen in on their phone conversation with the only sister.

The 911 portion of the call was about 5 minutes. The 911 portion ended when the call was transferred to the WCSO. I have no doubt the Sheriff's deputy told her to remove herself and the child from the crime scene. I have no doubt she probably sought approval from the deputy for her performance. She did the same thing on the 911 portion.

jmo [/*]

Speaking of no link, did you remember where you saw the SW for the GA friend yet?

I'm eager to read it.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Your opinion of my opinion really doesn't amount to a hill of beans as far as I'm concerned. [/*]

Then kindly keep off my bean hill. :patriot:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Jules2


-snip-


You can spin this however much you want. There are simply no definitions of the "correct" way to handle oneself during a crisis. [/*]Unless of course it has to do with Jason. Then all of a sudden there is a "correct" way.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by alter ego
Unless of course it has to do with Jason. Then all of a sudden there is a "correct" way. [/*]


Once again.......Jason did not make that call. But I'll be sure to dissect it for you and give you my honest assessment if that were ever to be the case. :seeya:

[JHP]

Originally posted by Allison


How is that personal info?

We know who Jason's defense atty is and have discussed it many times. If Meredith has one, as Mutt said, then we should be able to discuss them like we discuss Jason's.

I would like a link that says Meredith has retained a defense atty, Mutt brought it up and I would like a link proving it to be fact.

TIA! [/*]


I hope Meredith has an attorney to research civil suits against certain message board posters. I know I would happily pay my own way to testify on her behalf. The way she has been smeared is horrid, to put it mildly.

[JHP]

Originally posted by agathachristie


:beer: [/*]

Thanks aggie, it sure is time for a drink:seeya:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Allison


How is that personal info?

We know who Jason's defense atty is and have discussed it many times. If Meredith has one, as Mutt said, then we should be able to discuss them like we discuss Jason's.

I would like a link that says Meredith has retained a defense atty, Mutt brought it up and I would like a link proving it to be fact.

TIA! [/*]
I would like a link to all your "facts" too.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I can't link the post, it's no longer here. Somebody may have saved it and can repost it.

Feel free to take it as a rumor. [/*]

The person that posted that was the teacher's sil and it wasn't on this board. He spewed that along with his PI nonsense.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Jules2



Once again.......Jason did not make that call. But I'll be sure to dissect it for you and give you my honest assessment if that were ever to be the case. :seeya: [/*]Oh, so one can only be trying to handle a crisis if they are on a call.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by alter ego
Oh, so one can only be trying to handle a crisis if they are on a call. [/*]


Do you have a problem with me, AE?

Why is it that you continuously take my words and twist them to your liking?

I never said that so, kindly take your twisting elsewhere.


The discussion was about 911 calls and the demeanor of said calls. Not about the handling of a crisis in general. So lay off please.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I can't figure out how my speculation "That is going to be very problematic for Meredith's defense attorney"
requires a link to the name of the defense attorney? Sheesh!

Hopefully Meredith has retained an attorney to ensure her rights are protected.

jmo [/*]Funny how she never proved what she claimed to be a lie was in fact a lie but then demands links from others. :shrug:

And don't forget, her atty will also need to reseach civil cases so she can sue msg board posters :tongue:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Jules2



Do you have a problem with me, AE?

Why is it that you continuously take my words and twist them to your liking?

I never said that so, kindly take your twisting elsewhere.


The discussion was about 911 calls and the demeanor of said calls. Not about the handling of a crisis in general. So lay off please. [/*]

I didn't twist anything you said. :shrug:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Allison


Ummm...Sheriff Harrison is the sheriff. He is the only sheriff.

The personnel in his office that have badges are called deputies.

When the 911 operator transferred her call, he transferred her to a sheriff's deputy in dispatch.

She spoke to a deputy then AND when one arrived on scene.

[/*]

So what? Sheriff or sheriff's deputy ~ does it really make a difference?

[JHP]

Originally posted by Blaze


oh so do I. I think she woudl have a very strong case against CTV/IS and its posters after what I have read the past two days. Stories are being invented and passed off as fact. I don't understand why its allowed when there is absolutely no evidendce that Meredith had anything to do with her sisters murder, all we have is an interpretation of a 911 call by 3 posters. I have seen other threads at CTV/IS that don't allow this kind of garbage to be posted about the victim's family so why is it allowed here? Does CW even have an idea what is posted here? I have heard that moderation has been turned over to Kat, so maybe CW doesn't have any idea that this is going on. [/*]

I have always wondered what would have happened if Meredith had gone away for the weekend and forgot her cellphone. How long Cassidy would have been left in that situation. It might have been easier to solve the crime if another person had to have been involved. I'm glad for Cassidys sake that Meredith got there when she did, But just speculating on what might have happened if Meredith had blown Jasons call off.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by alter ego


I didn't twist anything you said. :shrug: [/*]


You most certainly did, but that's ok. From now on, I won't be responding to your insults and mis-interpretations of my posts. I can't help it if you don't comprehend what's being said.

:shrug:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Blaze


oh so do I. I think she woudl have a very strong case against CTV/IS and its posters after what I have read the past two days. Stories are being invented and passed off as fact. I don't understand why its allowed when there is absolutely no evidendce that Meredith had anything to do with her sisters murder, all we have is an interpretation of a 911 call by 3 posters. I have seen other threads at CTV/IS that don't allow this kind of garbage to be posted about the victim's family so why is it allowed here? Does CW even have an idea what is posted here? I have heard that moderation has been turned over to Kat, so maybe CW doesn't have any idea that this is going on. [/*]

No, she would have no case.

Jason, OTOH, would.

Sheriff Donnie said NO ONE has been cleared. That leaves the door wide open for suspicion to fall on anyone close to Michelle. if you have a problem with that, take it up with Donnie.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Jules2



You most certainly did, but that's ok. From now on, I won't be responding to your insults and mis-interpretations of my posts. I can't help it if you don't comprehend what's being said.

:shrug: [/*]ok, whatever.

Buh Bye :seeya:

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by june1943
Now all of us here have seen the size of Mere and she couldn't roll her sister over because she was heavy. I can pick a motor cycle up off the ground and I weigh 136 lb. [/*]

I have to roll my mother over all day every day and she is dead weight and weighs more than Michelle. I have to get her and myself in an awkward position to help her if she starts to choke.

IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Blaze


Where is the moderator when this type of harassment of posters is going on? Its impossible to post here without your post being twisted then you are either made fun of or bashed by Mutt, Kat, AE, June, and Co. for hours. [/*]
The only ones that have been made fun of are June and MandyMutton.

Oh, and it's harrassment to manipulate a nic to bash - like you turning MandyMutton into 'Mutt'.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by Blaze


But you still think a ladybug is an animal, soooooo, I kind of find your posts anything but credible.
JMO of course. [/*]


Howdy Blaze!

Speaking of ladybugs, I'm glad that this latest event held in honor of Michelle will include children and has been organized by the friends of Michelle. I think it's a wonderful way to celebrate her life and honor her memory with things she loved and cherished..........children, laughter, families and ladybugs.

Hats off to those who helped organize and fund this event.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by JHP



I hope Meredith has an attorney to research civil suits against certain message board posters. I know I would happily pay my own way to testify on her behalf. The way she has been smeared is horrid, to put it mildly. [/*]

lol

[JHP]

Originally posted by Blaze


I wonder if he had a back up plan? A neighbor maybe? But what excuse could he have used? [/*]

Thats why it might have been easier to solve if time had passed and a back up plan was needed. Maybe the friends would have shown up and heard Cassidy. I'm glad for Cassidy that Meredith was there but I just wonder what would have happened if she didn't. Maybe MM was supposed to show up and she didn't come into town that weekend.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


You'll have to ask your Bud for the name of Meredith's attorney. He posted about a year ago that she had retained counsel. [/*]

I saw it posted also. It was soon brushed under the rug though.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by annalyzer




IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why? [/*]
:shrug:

[Jules2]

Originally posted by annalyzer


lol [/*]

How truly sad that you find this so funny.

There's nothing funny at all about Michelle's murder or the disrespect her sister has been shown on these boards.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


if our discussion about the 911 call bothers other posters, they should be able to engage the ignore feature without the need to threaten and whine. Good grief. The call is a matter of public record. [/*]

Ignore the baiters. They are only here to get this board shut down.

Don't take the bait! ;)

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


if our discussion about the 911 call bothers other posters, they should be able to engage the ignore feature without the need to threaten and whine. Good grief. The call is a matter of public record. [/*]

Who threatened who?

I sure hope that it was reported to CW if that's the case.

[Breakingnews]

Plenty of posters were ready to hang the mother of the Stanley sisters after hearing her 911 call. It was extremely weird and unemotional. Erin's boyfriend was eventually arrested for her death.

Lonny Stanley called 911 at 5:15 a.m. Sept. 1, seeking help for her daughter Erin Stanley, according to a recording of the conversation that lasted about eight minutes.

"My daughter, she's unresponsive, her eyes are halfway open, she's blue," the mother told the 911 operator in flat, calm tones.

When asked whether the teen was breathing, she responded, "She's trying." She also told the dispatcher that the teen had not been ill, but that they'd had a stressful day.

Erin Stanley died that day. She was the mother of a young girl.
http://www.theindychannel.com/news/14131793/detail.html

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Jules2


How truly sad that you find this so funny.

There's nothing funny at all about Michelle's murder or the disrespect her sister has been shown on these boards. [/*]

If you ever ventured away from the MY board you would see that everyone in every case is discussed and not everyone agrees with everyone else's opinion. :read:

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by lilismom


I can honestly say that don't know what I would have done. Its not like she walked into a burning building where she would have known for 100% certain what she was dealing with. Its easy to say that because of the way the cops described the scene she should have known. They know what a murder scene looks like. Why would Meredith?

Do we know where CY was found? Do we know how long Meredith was downstairs? Do we know how long she was in the house before she went upstairs? Maybe she used the bathroom? Maybe she let the dog out? Maybe she put the mail on the table? Maybe she had no reason to think there was a murderer in the house? Maybe looking back she wishes she did grab CY and leave? Maybe she realized after the fact that she and CY could have been in danger too and shudders with the thought of it now?

So many questions.

IMO,
Lilismom [/*]

Well, we know now that she had to pass by Michelle's car , which should have seemed strange to her since Michelle was supposed to be gone, as she said.....

There are so many red flags in that call, I have posted them before.
The whole thing sounds rehearsed , especially when she asks C questions...and when C answers with the word "remember".

Kat

.

[Jules2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


I'm doing my part and engaging ignore and apparently I'm not missing anything but insults. All is well. [/*]


Actually, you've done your fair share of slinging insults as well, but I can see the double standard that certain posters feel they can abide by.

'Tis fine, all is well on this end too. :seeya:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


if our discussion about the 911 call bothers other posters, they should be able to engage the ignore feature without the need to threaten and whine. Good grief. The call is a matter of public record. [/*]And then having the audacity to say that since no one has been in her position, they can't judge her after saying they would have done ____ or not done ____ when it comes to Jason.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by june1943

The bashers come here and whine if we say any thing they don't want to here. Then they run back to their forum and rehash everything said here and they call it a Michelle Young forum there. Michelle's name is never mentioned there just us posters at IS. Why they don't stop using Michelle's name for a chat site is beyond me. There are lots of chat rooms they could go to for their bashing. [/*]I know, it's so childish.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Perish the thought. I believe MF really screwed up his plans by taking so long to get there. We were told that he phoned her at 7:30 in the morning. Took her 6 hours to get there. He must have been frantic ; ergo the frequent checking of voicemail.

JMHO Aggie [/*]What times did he check his voicemail?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by agathachristie


I think sheriff Donnie is pretty slick saying NO ONE has been cleared. ;) [/*]Yeah, not even the sister.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Ignore the baiters. They are only here to get this board shut down.

Don't take the bait! ;) [/*]

I think one of them flew the "coop" already.

It is easy to stay on topic, just scroll....:cool:

Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by JHP


Thats why it might have been easier to solve if time had passed and a back up plan was needed. Maybe the friends would have shown up and heard Cassidy. I'm glad for Cassidy that Meredith was there but I just wonder what would have happened if she didn't. Maybe MM was supposed to show up and she didn't come into town that weekend. [/*]


If Michelle had been scheduled to work or had a Doctor's app't or C was supposed to go to day care, all Jason had to do was call one of those places and if Michelle was not there, he could have become alarmed enough to ask anyone go to the home.

Or a neighbor;
Or a friend..

I want to know more about the printout and the time he called the only sister.
The printout was supposed to be done the nite he left,. according to L E /hours before the body was found.

If the printout was used to get only the sister there, and L E can prove that. there is your arrest. Or at least the start of things.

There has to be something else.

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


It sounds rehearsed and as though CY was talking to someone else, real or imaginary at the same time Meredith was talking to 911. [/*]

Maybe she was talking to Michelle.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by june1943


What is she saying to the deputy just as the call is cut off. Her voice sounds animated but I can't make out the words. Can any one else? [/*]

She's stating yet again that she is there with Michelle's daughter.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by agathachristie


No clue, but I would venture to say it was in the morning hours.
Whenever it was, it is key , as it was mentioned by LE.
We shall see.;)

MOO Aggie [/*]If it was 'key', LE would have included the times. LE mentions all kinds of things in probable cause affidavits - they must stick to known facts but they are given a lot of lattitude.

I would venture to say frequent checking of voicmails is something a salesman does as part of his job and therefore a non starter as far as being significant.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by agathachristie


I don't for one minute believe he was referring to the sister.
JMHO Aggie [/*]Don't then.

It's SOP for LE to look at everyone close to the victim and rule them out one by one.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by agathachristie


You have a burden to bear everyday, if you are speaking the truth.

Let me ask you this. Did you have apprehension the first time you had to roll your mother over? Or did someone prepare you for your daily task ? [/*]

If I am speaking the truth? You think I'm going to lie about my mother and the care I provide for her? If so please scroll on by the rest of my posts.

And the answer is no.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


The only way LE could prove the printout was used to get the sister to the house is for LE to have a recording of his call to Meredith. The fact there has been no arrest tells me they don't have such a recording. [/*]

That's faulty logic. The absence of a recording doesn't prove the lack of an arrest. More likely, the problems disproving his alibi are the reason there has been no arrest. There may or may not be a recording of the call.

JMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Can someone post the link to the transcript of the 911 call here,
I can't find mine.......

Not the audio link, I have that....but the transcript itself.

TIA

:)
Kat

[JHP]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles



If Michelle had been scheduled to work or had a Doctor's app't or C was supposed to go to day care, all Jason had to do was call one of those places and if Michelle was not there, he could have become alarmed enough to ask anyone go to the home.

Or a neighbor;
Or a friend..

I want to know more about the printout and the time he called the only sister.
The printout was supposed to be done the nite he left,. according to L E /hours before the body was found.

If the printout was used to get only the sister there, and L E can prove that. there is your arrest. Or at least the start of things.

There has to be something else.

Kat [/*]

The problem with this case is there has been such little information. nobody's really talking, So it has turned into lots of rumor.

If Jason didn't check on Michelle normally he couldn't all of a sudden be interested in her well being on the day she was murdered. But thats the trouble we know very little.

Hopefully soon there will be an arrest, but I'm not holding my breath.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Why would LE have to give the times to the likes of you and me?
It is key, in my mind; all a piece of the puzzle. They have said VERY little since the beginning. Not good for you and me, but good for the case.

MOO Aggie [/*]Not to us, to the court to support their allegations.

What speaks volumes is that the case remains unsolved.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by annalyzer


So what? All I needed was the first five minutes to form my opinion. I wonder if Meredith sounded as dumb and evasive to the sheriff's dept. as she did to the poor 911 operator?

Did you see what happened?

I don't know.

:confused: [/*]

dumb and evasive? A very ignorant remark if i must say so, and i must. Did you see what happened? No, you werent there, so your ignorance is pretty translucent. You can call it your opinion all you want, its one of the most ignorant remarks ive seen on here because she didnt pass your 911 test. Did you call the dispatcher dumb and evasive for not asking if there was anyone in the house or if CY was safe from an intruder or to get her and the child to safety? Do you think the dispatcher killed MY because of that flaw? Yeah i thought not. Should change your name from annalyzer to imheretostirthepotbetweenbothsidesandthefencesitte rs, because an annalyzer you definitely are not.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by TIAZ
snip~


I think the problem that most here have is the slamming of the victim's family. [/*]

I don't see the ones who believe Jason is innocent getting all hot and bothered and trying to get the board shut down when Jason and his family is "slammed". Why are some of you so afraid of the 911 call being discussed? It is part of this case after all.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


The only way LE could prove the printout was used to get the sister to the house is for LE to have a recording of his call to Meredith. The fact there has been no arrest tells me they don't have such a recording. [/*]

There are other ways it could have went down.
If in fact, the printout was for a purse for Michelle, and the only sister asked if she could see a copy, and called Jason, and he said "If you drop by the house, there is a copy in the printer.:

I think until we really know what happened, that this doesn't add up.

But, if you think about it, this wasn't the smartest way to get someone to your home to find your wife you just killed.
It would be stupid. And leaving your little girl there?

So, we are expected to believe that this perfect murder (at least up until now) 18 months later was so carefully planned and thought out, that a stupid printout on a computer for a purse for your wife is going to make you look innocent?

Forget innocent even.
How about when the police learn about you and MM?
But, yeah, you are a good husband cause you are sending your wife a Coach purse.

Makes no sense.

Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


dumb and evasive? A very ignorant remark if i must say so, and i must. Did you see what happened? No, you werent there, so your ignorance is pretty translucent. You can call it your opinion all you want, its one of the most ignorant remarks ive seen on here because she didnt pass your 911 test. Did you call the dispatcher dumb and evasive for not asking if there was anyone in the house or if CY was safe from an intruder or to get her and the child to safety? Do you think the dispatcher killed MY because of that flaw? Yeah i thought not. Should change your name from annalyzer to imheretostirthepotbetweenbothsidesandthefencesitte rs, because an annalyzer you definitely are not. [/*]


Want some cheese? :biggrin:

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by agathachristie


No one prepared you ?
You take daily care of your mother who weighs more than Michelle and is in danger of choking and no one prepared you ?
Does your mother not receive medical care?
Has she not ever been evaluated for her medical problems?
These are serious questions.

Moo Aggie [/*]

:cough:

This is the Michelle Young Board.

Thank you.

Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by agathachristie


No one prepared you ?
[/*]

I've been caring for her for years. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know how to roll a person over. :rolleyes:

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


There are other ways it could have went down.
If in fact, the printout was for a purse for Michelle, and the only sister asked if she could see a copy, and called Jason, and he said "If you drop by the house, there is a copy in the printer.:

I think until we really know what happened, that this doesn't add up.

But, if you think about it, this wasn't the smartest way to get someone to your home to find your wife you just killed.
It would be stupid. And leaving your little girl there?

So, we are expected to believe that this perfect murder (at least up until now) 18 months later was so carefully planned and thought out, that a stupid printout on a computer for a purse for your wife is going to make you look innocent?

Forget innocent even.
How about when the police learn about you and MM?
But, yeah, you are a good husband cause you are sending your wife a Coach purse.

Makes no sense.

Kat [/*]

I would think that if there were no phone call from Jason to Meredith, Jason's attorney would have debunked that myth long before now. At the very least, some family friend would have demanded a retraction from all of the media who have printed it.

Michelle never got the purse.

JMO

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


That's faulty logic. The absence of a recording doesn't prove the lack of an arrest. More likely, the problems disproving his alibi are the reason there has been no arrest. There may or may not be a recording of the call.

JMO [/*]

Proving an alibi or disproving an alibi, is only part of it.

What about some evidence from the scene?

Sheriff said there was a lot of stuff left behind..

All I need are 4 things to make me change my mind,.

1) A witness or something that proves Jason was back in Raleigh
2)Scratches or marks on his body
3) Some physical bloody evidence that nails him
4) A MOTIVE

Kat

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by agathachristie


You didn't answer my question.:) [/*]

You don't deserve an answer. :)

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I would think that if there were no phone call from Jason to Meredith, Jason's attorney would have debunked that myth long before now. At the very least, some family friend would have demanded a retraction from all of the media who have printed it.

Michelle never got the purse.

JMO [/*]

Jason's attorney hasn't had to come out and say a word about anything,

There are no cards that need to be played now.
:shrug:

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


Proving an alibi or disaproving an alibi, is only part of it.

What about some evidence from the scene?

Sheriff said there was a lot of stuff left behind..

All I need are 4 things to make me change my mind,.

1) A witness or something that proves Jason was back in Raleigh
2)Scratches or marks on his body
3) Some physical bloody evidence that nails him
4) A MOTIVE

Kat [/*]

Kat, I think if #1 or #3 existed, he would be in jail now. #2 may not exist at all, for any suspect. As for #4, several motives have been presented, but not accepted by the JIIs.

Out of curiosity, what would you consider a convincing motive?

[JHP]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I would think that if there were no phone call from Jason to Meredith, Jason's attorney would have debunked that myth long before now. At the very least, some family friend would have demanded a retraction from all of the media who have printed it.

Michelle never got the purse.

JMO [/*]

Michelles coach purse is with Laci Peterson's lois vuitton wallet.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


Jason's attorney hasn't had to come out and say a word about anything,

There are no cards that need to be played now.
:shrug:

Kat [/*]

That wouldn't stop the family friend. :biggrin:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I would think that if there were no phone call from Jason to Meredith, Jason's attorney would have debunked that myth long before now. At the very least, some family friend would have demanded a retraction from all of the media who have printed it.

Michelle never got the purse.

JMO [/*]Why would Jason's atty debunk anything?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by JHP


Michelles coach purse is with Laci Peterson's lois vuitton wallet. [/*]Amber has it?

:eek:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Kat, I think if #1 or #3 existed, he would be in jail now. #2 may not exist at all, for any suspect. As for #4, several motives have been presented, but not accepted by the JIIs.

Out of curiosity, what would you consider a convincing motive? [/*]As far as #2 (scratches/bruises on body of perp) LE believed there was and said so on the NTIO.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
Why would Jason's atty debunk anything? [/*]

I don't believe a quality attorney would allow such a flagrant lie to be reported in the media over and over again.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by alter ego
Amber has it?

:eek: [/*]

must say that was a goody!

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
As far as #2 (scratches/bruises on body of perp) LE believed there was and said so on the NTIO. [/*]

But we don't know that LE's assertion was correct.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Kat, I think if #1 or #3 existed, he would be in jail now. #2 may not exist at all, for any suspect. As for #4, several motives have been presented, but not accepted by the JIIs.

Out of curiosity, what would you consider a convincing motive? [/*]

Motive to me in this case would never be pre~med.
Not in a million years.

I don't see a hired hit.

I see rage, jealousy, years and years of hatred and resentment IF she was killed by someone who knew her.

I see a robbery or home invasion or thrill killing, and I see fear and panic of getting caught which resulted in her death.

Motive to kill someone for insurance money that you can't touch?
No.
Motive to be free?
No.
When you can move back to Brevard anytime anyway?
Motive to be with someone else?
MM was not Amber.
Not losing the home, not losing C, not having another baby, none of those, not child support, not alimony, nope.

Looking bad to his friends and family because he was leaving Michelle and getting a divorce?
As opposed to what, people thinking he killed her??

Think about it.

Kay

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Of course there are many ways it went down but the fact remains, the only way to prove that Jason sent Meredith to the house to retrieve the printout is to have a recording of the call. If they had that, he'd be indicted and awaiting trial right now.

jmo [/*]

Why? The JIIs have offered many alternate explanations for that phone call, on this very board. Jason making that request of Meredith may be highly suspicious taken together with other circumstances, but it's certainly not, by itself, sufficient for an indictment, imo.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Of course there are many ways it went down but the fact remains, the only way to prove that Jason sent Meredith to the house to retrieve the printout is to have a recording of the call. If they had that, he'd be indicted and awaiting trial right now.

jmo [/*]

but why would they indict him on that? What if he really is innocent, and he really did want mf to pick up that print out. I dont believe that LE would arrest and indict on that. Sure it could be a piece of the puzzle but it could and he could have been innocently wanting that print out. I dont think any one thing in this case is enough to arrest or indict. I believe no matter who did this, it will be alot of CE piled up.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


Motive to me in this case would never be pre~med.
Not in a million years.

I don't see a hired hit.

I see rage, jealousy, years and years of hatred and resentment IF she was killed by someone who knew her.

I see a robbery or home invasion or thrill killing, and I see fear and panic of getting caught which resulted in her death.

Motive to kill someone for insurance money that you can't touch?
No.
Motive to be free?
No.
When you can move back to Brevard anytime anyway?
Motive to be with someone else?
MM was not Amber.
Not losing the home, not losing C, not having another baby, none of those, not child support, not alimony, nope.

Looking bad to his friends and family because he was leaving Michelle and getting a divorce?
As opposed to what, people thinking he killed her??

Think about it.

Kay [/*]

Kat, that's a thorough list of all the reasons you believe Jason DIDN'T have a motive. You stated that you would need a motive to be convinced Jason killed Michelle. My question was, and is, what WOULD you consider a convincing motive?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I don't believe a quality attorney would allow such a flagrant lie to be reported in the media over and over again. [/*]
A quality atty would not address anything in the media as it pertains to their client - especially information that came from atty-client communication and especially if their client is unindicted.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by alter ego
Amber has it?

:eek: [/*]

Hey, I just mentioned Amber.
I spent days defending that girl, lol.
:)
Kat

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Kat, that's a thorough list of all the reasons you believe Jason DIDN'T have a motive. You stated that you would need a motive to be convinced Jason killed Michelle. My question was, and is, what WOULD you consider a convincing motive? [/*]

That's just it, Card, I can't.

He could have left her and all the money in the world wouldn't mean anything, if he killed her and was arrested and convicted and went to death row.

You think C would ever come to see him knowing he killed her Mom?

She would hate him forever.
He would lose everything.

:(
Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego

A quality atty would not address anything in the media as it pertains to their client - especially information that came from atty-client communication and especially if their client is unindicted. [/*]

Any evidence regarding that phone call should have been provided to Jason's attorney. If there is none, I believe the attorney would insist that LE retract the information it has provided to the media. Or at least, insist that they stop perpetuating it.

JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


ITA. Jason's attorney certainly did nail this one with the advice to remain silent so why would he speak out for no reason? Priceless advice.

though it's sorta laughable for Cardinal to imply Jason's attorney has access to his and Meredith's phone records, imo. [/*]

That wasn't my implication; that was your inference. It was incorrect.

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by Cardinal


But we don't know that LE's assertion was correct. [/*]

That's another thing.
If there have been some mistakes made , they need to admit it.
There is no such thing as a perfect murder.

Kat

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by alter ego

A quality atty would not address anything in the media as it pertains to their client - especially information that came from atty-client communication and especially if their client is unindicted. [/*]

Didn't the Duke Lacrosse lawyers speak out before there was an indictment?

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


That's just it, Card, I can't.

He could have left her and all the money in the world wouldn't mean anything, if he killed her and was arrested and convicted and went to death row.

You think C would ever come to see him knowing he killed her Mom?

She would hate him forever.
He would lose everything.

:(
Kat [/*]

Kat, if you can't, that's fine. But then what's the point of asking people to convince you of a motive?

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles


That's another thing.
If there have been some mistakes made , they need to admit it.
There is no such thing as a perfect murder.

Kat [/*]

No there isn't. But SOMEONE has gotten away with murder for 18 months.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


Didn't the Duke Lacrosse lawyers speak out before there was an indictment? [/*]

The players did. On the advice of, and accompanied by, their attorneys. As did their parents.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


But we don't know that LE's assertion was correct. [/*]They saw the scene and I'll take them on their word that there was a violent struggle that could have left scratches, bruises or other marks on the perp.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


Didn't the Duke Lacrosse lawyers speak out before there was an indictment? [/*]The players did, but not their attorneys.

Not until they got discovery after the indictment.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
They saw the scene and I'll take them on their word that there was a violent struggle that could have left scratches, bruises or other marks on the perp. [/*]

Right. "Could have". Which was sufficient for the NTIO. But that doesn't prove the murderer had scratches, bruises or other marks.

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by alter ego
The players did, but not their attorneys.

Not until they got discovery after the indictment. [/*]

The indictments were handed down mid April. Joe Cheshire was making public statements at the end of March.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Why not? The goal of an indictment is to get the killer off the streets. If LE had Jason's own words asking the only sister to pick up the fax, he'd have been indicted with it. Nancy Grace's first show about this case was devoted to how suspicious that request made him look. The request plus the alleged "relationship" with MM was more than a ham sandwich, imo. [/*]

There's more than enough altogether in my opinion for that ham sandwich. The fact that it hasn't yet been on the menu doesn't prove any one thing conclusively.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Too bad that you feel that way.
I am only left to believe that you cannot support your statement. [/*]

That's faulty logic, also, imo.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Right. "Could have". Which was sufficient for the NTIO. But that doesn't prove the murderer had scratches, bruises or other marks. [/*]Didn't mean to imply it did. :)

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
Didn't mean to imply it did. :) [/*]

I think if anyone close to Michelle has scratches, bruises or other marks immediately after the murder, they would be in jail.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Breakingnews


The indictments were handed down mid April. Joe Cheshire was making public statements at the end of March. [/*]I stand corrected then.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I think if anyone close to Michelle has scratches, bruises or other marks immediately after the murder, they would be in jail. [/*]I would think so too.

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Too bad that you feel that way.
I am only left to believe that you cannot support your statement. [/*]

You know what agatha? After yesterday's post accusing me of "playing" both sides and then today's post insinuating I would lie about the care of my mother I really could care less what you think.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


An incompetent attorney might be dumb enough to speak out for a client who not only hasn't been indicted but who also has NOT been named a POI or suspect but Jason's attorney doesn't have a reputation for incompetence. [/*]

No, he doesn't. In fact, he has an excellent reputation in criminal cases. Which is the reason I believe he would make it known to LE that they should stop perpetuating erroneous information that influences public opinion, and a potential jury pool, against his client.

IF it's erroneous.

JMO

[Breakingnews]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Too bad that LE didn't examine anyone other than Jason. [/*]

Maybe they did and the NTOs are with the rest of those secret SWs.

Did you find that one for the GA friend yet?

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Too bad that LE didn't examine anyone other than Jason. [/*]

We don't know that. We only know that Jason's examination is the only one that required an NTIO.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


iirc, the attorneys spoke out after the players were publicly accused. Jason hasn't been publicly accused. [/*]

You know, I think you're right.

My bad.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


No, he doesn't. In fact, he has an excellent reputation in criminal cases. Which is the reason I believe he would make it known to LE that they should stop perpetuating erroneous information that influences public opinion, and a potential jury pool, against his client.

IF it's erroneous.

JMO [/*]For all we know Jason's atty has made that request to LE, just not publically.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
For all we know Jason's atty has made that request to LE, just not publically. [/*]

True. But Smith has enough of a reputation in the Raleigh legal community that I believe LE would comply if the phone call didn't happen and if he made the request. Yet, that information continues to be published. Which makes me think the phone call happened as reported.

JMO

[Barbara2]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Jason's attorney doesn't have access to Meredith's phone records. He has no way to prove content of a voice message left on her line.

If LE had listened to the message themselves, they would have said so on the p/c for the s/w. No recording exists, imo. [/*]

There's no need to put every bit of information in the p/c section of the s/w. They only need to divulge enough to get the warrant. IMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Jason's attorney doesn't have access to Meredith's phone records. He has no way to prove content of a voice message left on her line.

If LE had listened to the message themselves, they would have said so on the p/c for the s/w. No recording exists, imo. [/*]

LE wouldn't yet have had the opportunity to obtain Meredith's phone records at the time they provided the probable cause on the initial SWs, imo.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Did LE bother to obtain an NTIO for anyone else? Nope. They supposedly knew of MM at that point. They knew Meredith found the body. They knew the GA friend was the last person to see her alive. Not one of those three women were issued an NTIO, which LE said is routine. The s/w of MM's records and the look into the memory book being made by the sorority sisters for CY is all we've seen. The focus at that point was squarely on Jason and only Jason.

jmo [/*]
I hope this investigation didn't suffer from tunnel vision.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego

I hope this investigation didn't suffer from tunnel vision. [/*]

Honestly, I think it may have, in the beginning. But I also think that when it didn't "come easy", LE conducted a thorough investigation.

JMO

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


True. But Smith has enough of a reputation in the Raleigh legal community that I believe LE would comply if the phone call didn't happen and if he made the request. Yet, that information continues to be published. Which makes me think the phone call happened as reported.

JMO [/*]Published by the media, not LE.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
Published by the media, not LE. [/*]

They haf their ways.........:biggrin:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Honestly, I think it may have, in the beginning. But I also think that when it didn't "come easy", LE conducted a thorough investigation.

JMO [/*]But sometimes mistakes made at the beginning cannot be overcome.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


They haf their ways.........:biggrin: [/*]:D

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Sorry that you feel that way, Cardinal.
I've spent years caring for the sick.
Since annalyzer can't answer my honest and sincere questions about her mother's care, I must discount her claims.
She is analyzing the 911 call, stating that she has had experience with such.
If she refuses to answer my questions as to her experience , I am left to believe that she can't support her claims.

My very humble opinion, as always......Aggie [/*]

I simply don't see why a poster on a message board should have to justify their personal lives to anyone.

Like I said a few days ago, I tend to take things literally. I also tend to take things at face value until I have a reason not to. I've seen annalyzer's posts on several other boards at this forum, and I've never had a reason to question her veracity.

JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
But sometimes mistakes made at the beginning cannot be overcome. [/*]

True. And if there were mistakes made at the beginning of this investigation, I sincerely hope they don't preclude justice for Michelle.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


I simply don't see why a poster on a message board should have to justify their personal lives to anyone.

Like I said a few days ago, I tend to take things literally. I also tend to take things at face value until I have a reason not to. I've seen annalyzer's posts on several other boards at this forum, and I've never had a reason to question her veracity.

JMO [/*]ITA

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Cardinal


True. And if there were mistakes made at the beginning of this investigation, I sincerely hope they don't preclude justice for Michelle. [/*]I have the same hope, but all this time later and still the case is unsolved....

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by agathachristie


I respect what you say, Cardinal. I don't visit other boards except for the Maddie McCan board. My point is that Annalyzer has weighed in on her experience with her mother being a measure for how she parses the 911 call. I have NO problem with that . I sincerely asked questions about her mother which she refuses to answer. Normally, home care givers are well versed and prepared for the task at hand. In essence, they are prepared; unlike MF. Do you get my drift now? [/*]

I do. And believe that, in the end, you sincerely were concerned about her mother's care. But I can't blame annalyzer one bit for her response to you. As a matter of fact, it was much more gracious than mine would have been.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by alter ego
I have the same hope, but all this time later and still the case is unsolved.... [/*]

Depending upon who you believe, SOMEBODY is about to be arrested any day now.

;)

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by Cardinal


Depending upon who you believe, SOMEBODY is about to be arrested any day now.

;) [/*]


Do tell
Please?

[jerzeegirl]

but you can hardly compare trying to move a dead lifeless body of your sister, oh wait only sister, that is in a state of rigamortis, compared to a disabled person that is alive and flexible. I was reading here on another case of someone who cut up their victim only because trying to lift and move a body in the state of rigamortis was nearly impossible. And i believe reading in the 911 transcripts that MF stated that her body was in a weird position, now if her body was twisted in any way (meaning her arms and legs for instance) i can only imagine how hard that would be to roll someone that is in rigamortis. And also, someone mentioned that at the size and weight that meredith is, she should have been able to roll MY over. I have to disagree with that, im 115 and my sister in law is 200 lbs, i could lift or push more than her. Size and weight doesnt mean muscle. Sometimes it can be the exact opposite.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by forpsystudent



Do tell
Please? [/*]

The JDIs are convinced Jason is about to be arrested, and MandyMutton is convinced that Meredith is about to be arrested.

JMO

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by Cardinal


The JDIs are convinced Jason is about to be arrested, and MandyMutton is convinced that Meredith is about to be arrested.

JMO [/*]

So, essentially, nothing has changed? Is their reason to believe than an arrest is imminent? TIA

Playing catch-up.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by Cardinal


The JDIs are convinced Jason is about to be arrested, and MandyMutton is convinced that Meredith is about to be arrested.

JMO [/*]

i believe noone is going to be arrested anytime soon unless something significant comes up. Phone calls, printouts, 911 calls, no talkie vs talkie, headstones or lack there of, hootchiemamas on the side, LI either claimed or unclaimed, sistah jealousy, eh its all too vague. I believe there will be no arrest unless there is some dna evidence or someone comes forward with info (and i dont mean us speculators on this message board). Theres just not enough for either JY or MF to be arrested or indicted. Thats unless theres so much info and evidence that we dont know of.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by forpsystudent


So, essentially, nothing has changed? Is their reason to believe than an arrest is imminent? TIA

Playing catch-up. [/*]

No, I don't think anything at all has changed. And I don't know if an arrest is imminent, but hope springs eternal.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


i believe noone is going to be arrested anytime soon unless something significant comes up. Phone calls, printouts, 911 calls, no talkie vs talkie, headstones or lack there of, hootchiemamas on the side, LI either claimed or unclaimed, sistah jealousy, eh its all too vague. I believe there will be no arrest unless there is some dna evidence or someone comes forward with info (and i dont mean us speculators on this message board). Theres just not enough for either JY or MF to be arrested or indicted. Thats unless theres so much info and evidence that we dont know of. [/*]

That pretty much covers it, imo. :lol:

[annalyzer]

People move dead lifeless bodies all the time. How do you think they transport them to the morgue?

If Meredith had checked her sister in the first place the whole moving the body instructions wouldn't have been necessary. Once she was instructed that she must turn her sister over to render aid Meredith did everything she could to resist it. Big sigh, she's too heavy, she's twisted in a way that I can't do that easily, wait, I'll check her pulse.

So here's my question again:

IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why?

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl
but you can hardly compare trying to move a dead lifeless body of your sister, oh wait only sister, that is in a state of rigamortis, compared to a disabled person that is alive and flexible [/*]

Edited for brevity.


Jerzeegirl:

There was a discussion way, way back at the beginning of this case about Meredith being unable to move Michelle and how some viewed this with, well, let's just say a jaundiced eye. However, at the time there was a great deal of research done on the web (and library) by quite a few people (who may or may not still be around to attest to it) that it would have been very hard for even a grown man to move Michelle. Apparently, rigor mortis, when it is full and/or fixed, renders the body completely inflexible--hence the horrid term "stiff." Sorry I don't remember more or that I don't have a link. JMO

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by annalyzer
People move dead lifeless bodies all the time. How do you think they transport them to the morgue?

If Meredith had checked her sister in the first place the whole moving the body instructions wouldn't have been necessary. Once she was instructed that she must turn her sister over to render aid Meredith did everything she could to resist it. Big sigh, she's too heavy, she's twisted in a way that I can't do that easily, wait, I'll check her pulse.

So here's my question again:

IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why? [/*]


Here you go.
Google is as good a place as any to start.

Link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigor_mortis





Otherwise JMO


ETA

As you pointed out, dead bodies are moved all the time. However, if they are in rigor, they are moved in situ which is different than what I think the original inference was. Yes, obviously, dead people are moved all the time but a murder victim would never have their rigor broke by any medico-legal professionals. They would be moved just as they are found. If they were found half sitting, they would be moved half sitting IRC.

[jerzeegirl]

Originally posted by annalyzer
People move dead lifeless bodies all the time. How do you think they transport them to the morgue?

If Meredith had checked her sister in the first place the whole moving the body instructions wouldn't have been necessary. Once she was instructed that she must turn her sister over to render aid Meredith did everything she could to resist it. Big sigh, she's too heavy, she's twisted in a way that I can't do that easily, wait, I'll check her pulse.

So here's my question again:

IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why? [/*]

i recall in the transcript she tried

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by annalyzer
People move dead lifeless bodies all the time. How do you think they transport them to the morgue?

If Meredith had checked her sister in the first place the whole moving the body instructions wouldn't have been necessary. Once she was instructed that she must turn her sister over to render aid Meredith did everything she could to resist it. Big sigh, she's too heavy, she's twisted in a way that I can't do that easily, wait, I'll check her pulse.

So here's my question again:

IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why? [/*]

I think the answer to that depends upon which "side" you're on. One answer would be that she was in shock and denial, and couldn't bring herself to deal with it. The other answer would be COG.

Sorry if I took away the arguments. :D

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by agathachristie


Too bad that you feel that way.
I am only left to believe that you cannot support your statement. [/*]

I don't know what your reasons are for personally attacking Annalyzer, but I think you should take it elsewhere or to a PM.

This weekend marks the 18th month of the murder, and a lot of us are thinking about Michelle tonite.

Could you just try and think of her too?

Thanxxxxxxxx.

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


Where did I say Meredith is "about to be arrested"??? I'm convinced she will be arrested eventually. I've given no prediction as to date. [/*]

"About to be"......."eventually".........what's the difference?

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by forpsystudent



Here you go.
Google is as good a place as any to start.

Link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigor_mortis


Otherwise JMO [/*]

Like I said people have to move dead lifeless bodies in rigor mortis all the time. Add the adrenaline rush of finding your little sister in a bloody heap on the floor and tell me you couldn't turn her over to try to help her.

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by Cardinal


No, I don't think anything at all has changed. And I don't know if an arrest is imminent, but hope springs eternal. [/*]


Yes it does.
Along with other things.
JMO

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by forpsystudent



Here you go.
Google is as good a place as any to start.

Link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigor_mortis





Otherwise JMO


ETA

As you pointed out, dead bodies are moved all the time. However, if they are in rigor, they are moved in situ which is different than what I think the original inference was. Yes, obviously, dead people are moved all the time but a murder victim would never have their rigor broke by any medico-legal professionals. They would be moved just as they are found. If they were found half sitting, they would be moved half sitting IRC. [/*]



BUMP

[Barbara2]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Like I said people have to move dead lifeless bodies in rigor mortis all the time. Add the adrenaline rush of finding your little sister in a bloody heap on the floor and tell me you couldn't turn her over to try to help her. [/*]

Why do you believe there would be an adrenaline rush and not shock and disbelief?

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by annalyzer
People move dead lifeless bodies all the time. How do you think they transport them to the morgue?

If Meredith had checked her sister in the first place the whole moving the body instructions wouldn't have been necessary. Once she was instructed that she must turn her sister over to render aid Meredith did everything she could to resist it. Big sigh, she's too heavy, she's twisted in a way that I can't do that easily, wait, I'll check her pulse.

So here's my question again:

IMO it's not that Meredith couldn't turn her sister over, it's that she wouldn't. Why? [/*]

Didn't she also have a lttle medical training background too?
Someone posted that, but I don't remember exactly what.

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by annalyzer


Like I said people have to move dead lifeless bodies in rigor mortis all the time. Add the adrenaline rush of finding your little sister in a bloody heap on the floor and tell me you couldn't turn her over to try to help her. [/*]

I don't know. I think I'd try.

But after reading all of the sometimes excrutiating discussion of the 911 call today, the one thing that stands out for me is the comment (from, I believe MandyMutton, believe it or not) is this:

Why wasn't CY more traumatized????

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by Cardinal


"About to be"......."eventually".........what's the difference? [/*]


About to be - imminent.

Eventually - happening or expected to happen at an unspecified time - ultimately.

[jerzeegirl]

DISPATCHER: Can you get her on her back for me?

MEREDITH: She’s kind of…twisted in a way that I can’t do that.

DISPATCHER: You can’t roll her over.

MEREDITH: Not…not easily.

DISPATCHER: You’re gonna have to try.

MEREDITH: Hang on…let me…I’m trying to see if I can get her pulse.

DISPATCHER: We gotta try to do CPR if we can get her on her back, Meredith.

MEREDITH: No, she’s ice cold.

DISPATCHER: She’s cold?

MEREDITH: Yeah.

DISPATCHER: Okay, alright.

MEREDITH: And her body is stiff.

DISPATCHER: Okay, then don’t try. If she’s cold then just…


http://frictionpowered.blogspot.com/2007/02/merediths-911-call.html

[Kat4Eagles]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


i recall in the transcript she tried [/*]


Anyone got the link to the transcript handy?

If I could ever find anything.....
:sigh:

Kat

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by forpsystudent



Yes it does.
Along with other things.
JMO [/*]

:beer:

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


i recall in the transcript she tried [/*]


From what I recall of the research done earlier on this topic it would not have been unusual for Meredith to have been unable to move Michelle's body if she were in full rigor. Obviously LE must have agreed? JMO

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by annalyzer



About to be - imminent.

Eventually - happening or expected to happen at an unspecified time - ultimately. [/*]

Fair enough. I've invoked semantics myself. For the record though, I meant them as the same thing.

[Cardinal]

Originally posted by Kat4Eagles



Anyone got the link to the transcript handy?

If I could ever find anything.....
:sigh:

Kat [/*]

Courtesy of Scout (if that works for you):

http://frictionpowered.blogspot.com/2007/02/merediths-911-call.html

[jerzeegirl]

DISPATCHER: Alright, can you…can you get her on her back?

MEREDITH: [deep breath] okay…oh my God. Michelle? I don’t think so. She’s so heavy.

DISPATCHER: Alright, see if you can get her on her back.

MEREDITH: I just really think she’s dead.


http://frictionpowered.blogspot.com/2007/02/merediths-911-call.html

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl
DISPATCHER: Can you get her on her back for me?

MEREDITH: She’s kind of…twisted in a way that I can’t do that.

DISPATCHER: You can’t roll her over.

MEREDITH: Not…not easily.

DISPATCHER: You’re gonna have to try.

MEREDITH: Hang on…let me…I’m trying to see if I can get her pulse.

DISPATCHER: We gotta try to do CPR if we can get her on her back, Meredith.

MEREDITH: No, she’s ice cold.

DISPATCHER: She’s cold?

MEREDITH: Yeah.

DISPATCHER: Okay, alright.

MEREDITH: And her body is stiff.

DISPATCHER: Okay, then don’t try. If she’s cold then just…


http://frictionpowered.blogspot.com/2007/02/merediths-911-call.html [/*]


Thanks Jerzeegirl

This fits in with what I recall. Rigor Mortis begins, certain variables notwithstanding, at about the same rate and becomes fixed, therefore, at about the same rate which would result in rigor ending correspondingly. So, rigor is a huge forensic clue and if someone forces a body in full rigor into a different position--say if they straightened a bent arm or leg for instance--then IIRC rigor would be "broken?"

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


ITA. It defies common sense to suggest it is it more difficult to ROLL OVER a stiff body than a flexible body. There was no lifting involved for Meredith to roll over Michelle.

o/t Bless you for caring for your mom. For you both:

:rose: [/*]

Exactly

and thanks. :seeya:

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


ITA. It defies common sense to suggest it is it more difficult to ROLL OVER a stiff body than a flexible body. There was no lifting involved for Meredith to roll over Michelle.

o/t Bless you for caring for your mom. For you both:

:rose: [/*]

That would depend on the position of the body, which is an unknown factor here. JMO

[jerzeegirl]

well i believe someone said Meredith "wouldnt" try to move her sister, i believe from the transcripts is that she couldnt. And also the fact im not in the medical field, dont even sit on my armchair and argue, but i do know this much, cold, stiff and no pulse, means dead. Why keep trying to move her if when you first attempt you feel her to be cold and stiff. Whats the point? And she also stated she was twisted which i believe would make it even more difficult to move her in the state of rigor (thanks forpsy for the correct spelling :)

[annalyzer]

Originally posted by jerzeegirl


i recall in the transcript she tried [/*]


Why didn't she "try" when she first discovered her sister laying there?

By the time they got to that part in the 911 call it should've been well established that Michelle was dead and beyond help.

[forpsystudent]

Originally posted by MandyMutton


"Not easily." What kind of comment is that? GMAB. She didn't try to roll her over because she didn't want Cassidy to see Michelle's face. MF already knew what it looked like.

jmo [/*]


http://chemistry.about.com/cs/biochemistry/a/aa061903a.htm




A few hours after a person or animal dies, the joints of the body stiffen and become locked in place. This stiffening is called rigor mortis. Depending on temperature and other conditions, rigor mortis lasts approximately 72 hours. The phenomenon is caused by the skeletal muscles partially contracting. The muscles are unable to relax, so the joints become fixed in place

End quote