Wednesday April 16, 2008 Daily Discussion [Archive]

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 09:11 AM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006
I don't think the DA appeared on Animal Planet. For what purpose? Is he also an expert in dog behavior? [/*]

I think he has done enough damage to his case by crying for Christina IMO. :o

Animal Planet would just be over the top and surely get him a white jacket as tho measurements aren't being taken right now for his stellar performance on the steps. JMO.

I don't feel so generous about Dewey Hudson right now as I think he might be getting a good old fashioned snow job and doesn't know it.

I think he's a nice guy, but he needs to let the story tell itself. He can't rehab the less than forthright Christina Laurean in these eyes.

JMOOC. :no: Not buyin' it.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 09:13 AM

Originally posted by cuppajoe
Glad to see that Mrs. Laurean is now in the clear.

Sixty days is what I heard for the paperwork to reach Mexico. [/*]

:biggrin: How 'bout another cuppajoe?

She is not CHARGED AT THIS TIME WITH A CRIME.

JMO.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 09:15 AM

Originally posted by Babes
Good Morning!!!!

Hudson said it will take couple months before Cesar will be extradited to USA - Hudson needs to submit paperwork still ? Hmm i thought this was submitted already before? [/*]

Good Morning!

We are talking about government agencies here. First the State has to do their stuff then it is sent on to the DOJ and they have to do theirs and bless what the State has done and the DOJ is known for going at a snail's pace. This is just one case among too many to mention so they will take their time then it will finally be sent to the Mexican government and if they have problems with any of the paperwork all of this will have to start all over again and filter through the same agencies and channel's as before.

If he is back in 60 days I will be shocked.

imoo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 09:17 AM

IIRC the first hearing judge in Mexico recommended extradition. Good start and insight on how the Mexican government feels. jmo

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 09:20 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

:biggrin: How 'bout another cuppajoe?

She is not CHARGED AT THIS TIME WITH A CRIME.

JMO. [/*]

I've read his post 3 times and have come away with 3 different interpretations.

I didn't see the word "innocent". I did see where the shoe is now proclaimed to have evidentiary value. I don't want to think that what I saw as blonde hair on the shoe is actually what it was. That would make me think that her head was "stomped" at some point.

But the question still remains: Why wasn't Paramore all over the shoe find? Why was it Christina's attorney who got all indignant about it? IMO, that shoe is never gonna see the inside of a courtroom.

He also mentions items that they are preparing to unseal. Wonder what those items will be?

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:22 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

I think he has done enough damage to his case by crying for Christina IMO. :o

Animal Planet would just be over the top and surely get him a white jacket as tho measurements aren't being taken right now for his stellar performance on the steps. JMO.

I don't feel so generous about Dewey Hudson right now as I think he might be getting a good old fashioned snow job and doesn't know it.

I think he's a nice guy, but he needs to let the story tell itself. He can't rehab the less than forthright Christina Laurean in these eyes.

JMOOC. :no: Not buyin' it. [/*]

Woah ITA! Good Morning-

My pics at Amsterdam is on my friendster lol but i will take some time this weekend to sort it and make some public

Hudson is trying to start the trial by making his witness credible - but unfortunately- he will fail. Majority of the people doesnt believe on Christina and one of them could be a potential juror of this case ... IMO he needs to present the case in the manner that they will not sound stupid - He needs to define "cooperating" and He needs to define "integrity"

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:26 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Good Morning!

We are talking about government agencies here. First the State has to do their stuff then it is sent on to the DOJ and they have to do theirs and bless what the State has done and the DOJ is known for going at a snail's pace. This is just one case among too many to mention so they will take their time then it will finally be sent to the Mexican government and if they have problems with any of the paperwork all of this will have to start all over again and filter through the same agencies and channel's as before.

If he is back in 60 days I will be shocked.

imoo [/*]

Hello Ocean

Do ( Mexican Govt) they need to get some clearance from the Marines also that " No death Penalty" will be delivered to Cesar just in case they decided to take the case in the future? I understand that DA Hudson compromised to them already but that is if the case will only be handled by the state - can the Marines/Navy later say that they will take over the case and death penalty will be on the table?

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box
IIRC the first hearing judge in Mexico recommended extradition. Good start and insight on how the Mexican government feels. jmo [/*]

That is just a formality. He just passes it on and will not be involved in the actual hearings held. Adam Housley with Fox talks about the steps that must be taken. It is the hearings to be held that are important and we don't know for sure if he will or wont fight jurisdiction and even if they decide to extradite he has a right to appeal that decision.

imo

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 09:28 AM

Originally posted by Mystical

Check the link thread Lynn posted an update by DH it could take as long as three or four months.

I'm glad Christina has been cleared too. [/*]

Thank you I'll go look. I'm sure Mrs. Laurean will be glad when this nightmare is over and she can get back to her normal life with the little girl. Cesar Laurean has destroyed many lives with his selfishness I think.

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:30 AM

Originally posted by Mystical

I'm glad Christina has been cleared too. [/*]

IMO - she's cleared based on her diary? That she's a torn woman who is still in-love with the husband? How about they define the word "cooperating witness" and "integrity" before they clear her of this crime?

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 09:31 AM

Originally posted by Babes

Woah ITA! Good Morning-

My pics at Amsterdam is on my friendster lol but i will take some time this weekend to sort it and make some public

Hudson is trying to start the trial by making his witness credible - but unfortunately- he will fail. Majority of the people doesnt believe on Christina and one of them could be a potential juror of this case ... IMO he needs to present the case in the manner that they will not sound stupid - He needs to define "cooperating" and He needs to define "integrity" [/*]

Any juror will see all the evidence. Much more then any of us know. I believe it has been defined by the DA, RS, SB, and her lawyer who sees no charges in the future. The DA, no doubt, keeps him informed.

Christina will not be charged.

I think it is time to move on from speculating about Christina.

LE knows much more then we do and that is what it is.

JMO

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:34 AM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

Thank you I'll go look. I'm sure Mrs. Laurean will be glad when this nightmare is over and she can get back to her normal life with the little girl. Cesar Laurean has destroyed many lives with his selfishness I think. [/*]

Is she really glad that her husband just tell the whole world that he loved Maria? Is she really glad of what she did in "Myspace"?

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Any juror will see all the evidence. Much more then any of us know. I believe it has been defined by the DA, RS, SB, and her lawyer who sees no charges in the future. The DA, no doubt, keeps him informed.

Christina will not be charged.

I think it is time to move on from speculating about Christina.

LE knows much more then we do and that is what it is.

JMO [/*]

Move on to what? That allow myself to be fooled by her and give her the grand applause that she didnt deserve? No one needs to speculate more about Christina - It is already proven that she communicated with Cesar at the back of LE - Is that how you define cooperating witness? She started chatting with him first week of February and for 2 damn months - our government is spending money looking for this man

IMO LE knows much m ore than we do? Of course - Sheriff Brown owe Christina something by bringing Greta to her house without her permission. Do you know the consequences of this if Christina will also complain about the action of Sheriff Brown? It can cost him his JOB.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by Babes

Hello Ocean

Do ( Mexican Govt) they need to get some clearance from the Marines also that " No death Penalty" will be delivered to Cesar just in case they decided to take the case in the future? I understand that DA Hudson compromised to them already but that is if the case will only be handled by the state - can the Marines/Navy later say that they will take over the case and death penalty will be on the table? [/*]

I guess we could say all things are possible.......like SB says every time he mentions CSL not seeing anything at all :D but I would say it is highly improbable.

If we are going to maintain a working friendly relationship with any country, to back door any penalty on a defendant knowing full well that country would have never extradited him in the first place if known is asking for troubled relationships in the future.

The Mexican government is not stupid and they do not like to turn suspects over to a military tribunal anyway. I believe that all charges will be in place before he is extradited and no further charges will be filed.

The military rarely takes over any case that is in a State case, IMO this one wont be one either.

imo

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:43 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I guess we could say all things are possible.......like SB says every time he mentions CSL not seeing anything at all :D but I would say it is highly improbable.

If we are going to maintain a working friendly relationship with any country, to back door any penalty on a defendant knowing full well that country would have never extradited him in the first place if known is asking for troubled relationships in the future.

The Mexican government is not stupid and they do not like to turn suspects over to a military tribunal anyway. I believe that all charges will be in place before he is extradited and no further charges will be filed.

The military rarely takes over any case that is in a State case, IMO this one wont be one either.

imo [/*]

That's true.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 09:46 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

That is just a formality. He just passes it on and will not be involved in the actual hearings held. Adam Housley with Fox talks about the steps that must be taken. It is the hearings to be held that are important and we don't know for sure if he will or wont fight jurisdiction and even if they decide to extradite he has a right to appeal that decision.

imo [/*]

I know he passes it on, but he could just as easily pass it on with not recommending extradition. I don't think he is just a figure head for recommending extradition.

I still think Cesar will waive extradition. I have heard the jails there are not good places to be. Anyway IIRC, the Dog mentioned that.

Cesar knows even if he fights extradition he will lose and be here sooner or later. He will just have to decide where he would rather be, since the DP is off the table. If he is innocent and Christina did it all, I would think he would be in a hurry to get back and clear himself.

All MOO of course.

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 09:47 AM

Originally posted by Grey Goose

Where is everybody seeing that she's been cleared? :confused: [/*]

Where is anyone seeing that she is guilty of something relating to this murder and will be charged? I've read quite the opposite.

Sheesh, such a bunch of die-hards on here! :D But hey that's okay; we are all entitled to our opinion.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 09:52 AM

Originally posted by Babes

Move on to what? That allow myself to be fooled by her and give her the grand applause that she didnt deserve? No one needs to speculate more about Christina - It is already proven that she communicated with Cesar at the back of LE - Is that how you define cooperating witness? She started chatting with him first week of February and for 2 damn months - our government is spending money looking for this man

IMO LE knows much m ore than we do? Of course - Sheriff Brown owe Christina something by bringing Greta to her house without her permission. Do you know the consequences of this if Christina will also complain about the action of Sheriff Brown? It can cost him his JOB. [/*]

Talking to Cesar is not against the law. imo

leah

04-16-2008, 09:54 AM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

Where is anyone seeing that she is guilty of something relating to this murder and will be charged? I've read quite the opposite.

Sheesh, such a bunch of die-hards on here! :D But hey that's okay; we are all entitled to our opinion. [/*]

I agree 100%....There is a BIG difference in what people know for a fact.....and what they THINK they know for a fact.
JMO

henry

04-16-2008, 09:56 AM

good morning everyone . . . one thing i haven't seen mentioned here in rsutherland's response is he said information is set to be unsealed . . . wonder when that will be and what will it be? i hope lkay is on top of that one and wonder why he didn't mention it in question 2 summary.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=60
http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=66

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 09:56 AM

Originally posted by Grey Goose

I haven't made up my mind yet about Christina. Do you have a link to article by the police clearing her I'd like to read it. [/*]

The last page of our links thread has links to read. Also check out Henry's link he just put up of a recent response from RS.

Babes

04-16-2008, 09:58 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Talking to Cesar is not against the law. imo [/*]

So talking to a criminal who escaped an arrest or avoiding any trial and not letting LE knows about the communication is what we will consider part of her "cooperation"?

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:00 AM

Babes

04-16-2008, 10:03 AM

Originally posted by henry
good morning everyone . . . one thing i haven't seen mentioned here in rsutherland's response is he said information is set to be unsealed . . . wonder when that will be and what will it be? i hope lkay is on top of that one and wonder why he didn't mention it in question 2 summary.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=60
http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=66 [/*]

Honestly, this is the only case ive'd seen that LE is answering some questions on the message board/blogs while the case is still pending. Why cant they just answer this on tV/MEDIA - We get the scoop on the blogs - yeah and we like it but - it is just very different from the rest of the case we talked her in CTV.... Is there other agenda involved here?

Babes

04-16-2008, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

It is not important what we see, it is important what LE sees and they have said it is not against the law. imo [/*]

It is not important what we see? LOL "WE" are the JURORS. one of us could be sitting as the juror of this case so please do not set aside the importance of what we see here.

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 10:05 AM

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 10:06 AM

Originally posted by Babes

So talking to a criminal who escaped an arrest or avoiding any trial and not letting LE knows about the communication is what we will consider part of her "cooperation"? [/*]

Apparently it's not against the law in NC. It remains to be seen if the MC adheres to the same standard in defining "cooperation" as okay to chat it up online with a deserter without reporting it.

I still haven't read where Christina has been "cleared" of anything, not from the DA, LE or even the MC.

Remember the grand jury was called into special session just to hear the case against Cesar (mainly because of where the bodies were found and because he fled, presumably to Mexico.) There has been no grand jury convened to hear any possible evidence against Christina. If the grand jury is in session now, we don't know if they have another Laurean case on their docket to consider.

So, yeah I'm waiting to see what's going to be unsealed and hear as Paul Harvey used to say "The Rest of The Story".

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 10:07 AM

Originally posted by Grey Goose

Thank you henry. After reading those answers it's very plain that they do not suspect Christina at all. Kay has really been on top of this case great link. [/*]

He has and the fact that Mrs. Laurean has been declared not a suspect in any part of this crime is very clear.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:08 AM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

Apparently it's not against the law in NC. It remains to be seen if the MC adheres to the same standard in defining "cooperation" as okay to chat it up online with a deserter without reporting it.

I still haven't read where Christina has been "cleared" of anything, not from the DA, LE or even the MC.

Remember the grand jury was called into special session just to hear the case against Cesar (mainly because of where the bodies were found and because he fled, presumably to Mexico.) There has been no grand jury convened to hear any possible evidence against Christina. If the grand jury is in session now, we don't know if they have another Laurean case on their docket to consider.

So, yeah I'm waiting to see what's going to be unsealed and hear as Paul Harvey used to say "The Rest of The Story". [/*]

The DA is not charging Christina so what GJ are you talking about? Have you heard something I haven't? imo

caejde

04-16-2008, 10:09 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

It is not important what we see, it is important what LE sees and they have said it is not against the law. imo [/*]

But she doesn't have integrity. Anyone with an ounce of it would have told law enforcement from day one that he was making contact with her.

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 10:09 AM

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 10:12 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

The DA is not charging Christina so what GJ are you talking about? Have you heard something I haven't? imo [/*]

The grand jury that indicted Cesar on 1st Degree Murder, Robbery, and attempted use of Maria's credit card.

Where have you been?

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:16 AM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

The grand jury that indicted Cesar on 1st Degree Murder, Robbery, and attempted use of Maria's credit card.

Where have you been? [/*]

Right here. The DA is not charging her so he will not be taking anything in front of any grand jury to get any indictments. imo

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 10:19 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Right here. The DA is not charging her so he will not be taking anything in front of any grand jury to get any indictments. imo [/*]

I don't think the DA said "cleared" when he said "Absolutely not, I haven't ruled anything out" when asked if he had ruled out charges in the future against Christina.

And I'm still not seeing the word "cleared" in RS' post.

:shrug:

Babes

04-16-2008, 10:22 AM

who is shouldering christina's lawyer expenses? I dont think she has money to pay an ex-prosecutor to represent her - The shifflets maybe?

Kel65

04-16-2008, 10:25 AM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

Thank you I'll go look. I'm sure Mrs. Laurean will be glad when this nightmare is over and she can get back to her normal life with the little girl. Cesar Laurean has destroyed many lives with his selfishness I think. [/*]

IMO, I think it is going to very hard for this woman to every go back to a "normal" life. If she is innocent, then I think her lawyer did a very big injustice to her by not having her do a public outreach early on or at least offering a statement to the public on her behalf. Yes, I understand that he said the USMC is at fault for her not being able to do a public outreach, but I think there is a big difference in the meaning of the words "advise" and "forbid", especially when it comes to the military interpretaiton.

IMO Welch is using the USMC to CYA himself . I believe a lot of the public opinion regarding Christina and all of this DA Christina stroking, is a result of a poor decision made by Welch early on and now he feels the need to back step.

If he truly believed that the USMC was prohibiting her to speak to anyone other than LE about this case, then I wonder if he ever approached the USMC and said something to the effect of hey, I need to have her out there or I need to make a statement on her behalf.

Also, if the military did in fact "forbid" her from speaking to anyone other than LE regarding this case, then she blatantly disobeyed an order by communicating with Cesar.

IMO, Welch, LE and the USMC have made this woman a mystery and helped to trigger the stuff that comes along with her being a mystery, such as the presumption by many that she is up to her eyeballs in some aspect of this murder/cover up.

When all is said and done if she is not charged or found guilty with anything in regard to this tragedy, she will forever be looked at woman who probably got away with something. Some of it may fade, but some of it will follow her through life.

JMO

Kel65

04-16-2008, 10:26 AM

Originally posted by Babes
who is shouldering christina's lawyer expenses? I dont think she has money to pay an ex-prosecutor to represent her - The shifflets maybe? [/*]

My guess he is doing this Pro Bono or at an extremly reduced rate. JMO

henry

04-16-2008, 10:26 AM

Originally posted by Sumanadevii
I think Christina will be charged. She is far from out of the woods. That sweet diary isn't going to fool anyone. The true story will be known when CL talks. [/*]

yup . . . also rereading another blog that has been referenced earlier in this case . . . it's the newscom report dated 1-12-08 and the paragraph that says police have found evidence of blood & "violent activity" inside the home.

now, if there was violent activity noticed by le . . . wouldn't anyone else in that house also see it during the 3 week (approx) time period :shrug: jmo et all

http://www.shadowscope.com/archives/2008/01/warrant_issued_for_cesar_laurean.php

also there's a good update here:

http://www.shadowscope.com/

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 10:28 AM

Originally posted by caejde

But she doesn't have integrity. Anyone with an ounce of it would have told law enforcement from day one that he was making contact with her. [/*]

IIRC, in that PC the other day, they spoke of "compassion" for Christina, and that anyone would have compassion for her when/if they knew the whole story (what they know and we don't).

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 10:32 AM

Originally posted by Babes
who is shouldering christina's lawyer expenses? I dont think she has money to pay an ex-prosecutor to represent her - The shifflets maybe? [/*]

I think Mrs. Laurean has very supportive parents and I'm glad about that. I wouldn't be surprised to learn they are paying her lawyer.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 10:33 AM

Originally posted by caejde

But she doesn't have integrity. Anyone with an ounce of it would have told law enforcement from day one that he was making contact with her. [/*]

I would like to see Rick Southerland or Dewey Hudson answer the question as to whether they ASKED CHRISTINA to notify them IF CESAR attempted to contact her?????

Now that would be a telling question and if they didn't it might give us pause for thought as to why they need to polish her up a bit for the case against Cesar IMO. :o

That will never speak to the word integrity in my book Caejde.

JMO.

caejde

04-16-2008, 10:33 AM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

IIRC, in that PC the other day, they spoke of "compassion" for Christina, and that anyone would have compassion for her when/if they knew the whole story (what they know and we don't). [/*]

That's then. And when/if something comes out for me to have "compassion" then I reserve the right to change my opinion on her.

I'll be very interesed to see what Cesar has to say. For all we know, he could have a key piece that could implicate Christina in something.

I haven't really made a set opinion on Christina. I have looked at it from both sides and I can see either doing the murder, I can see either covering up the murder.

Something I will have to wait and see on.

caejde

04-16-2008, 10:35 AM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

I think Mrs. Laurean has very supportive parents and I'm glad about that. I wouldn't be surprised to learn they are paying her lawyer. [/*]

Still wonder why they hung up on a reporter when news of Cesar being captured hit. Sounded like to me from the interview they gave before, that they would have been happy with him being caught.

henry

04-16-2008, 10:35 AM

Originally posted by henry

yup . . . also rereading another blog that has been referenced earlier in this case . . . it's the newscom report dated 1-12-08 and the paragraph that says police have found evidence of blood & "violent activity" inside the home.

now, if there was violent activity noticed by le . . . wouldn't anyone else in that house also see it during the 3 week (approx) time period :shrug: jmo et all

http://www.shadowscope.com/archives/2008/01/warrant_issued_for_cesar_laurean.php

also there's a good update here:

http://www.shadowscope.com/ [/*]

sorry for quoting my own post . . . but on the 2nd link there's 2 stories on that page regarding cesar . . . scroll down to the bottom to see story #2

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 10:37 AM

Originally posted by Babes
who is shouldering christina's lawyer expenses? I dont think she has money to pay an ex-prosecutor to represent her - The shifflets maybe? [/*]

I don't know babes, but some people feel they shouldered enough of her marital issues as she let her husband evade the justice system not once, but twice until LE got involved.

I don't think they are lining up to pay her legal fees too, but hey, ya never know. I still see a snow job blowing in the air. There are flurries all over the place.

JMO.:o

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 10:40 AM

Originally posted by caejde

Still wonder why they hung up on a reporter when news of Cesar being captured hit. Sounded like to me from the interview they gave before, that they would have been happy with him being caught. [/*]

I am thinking they like LE believed in Christina and that she would never even entertain the idea of making contact with him again other than to get a divorce. But alas, they were fooled yet again.

You remember when they appeared on CBS their story she had given them was just a bit different from what she was telling LE IIRC.

Way back then, I remember posting about that video of them and how their true interest seemed to be in the child (AS IT SHOULD BE IMO) and that something wreaked of not so much on Christina.

JMO tho. :shrug:

Kel65

04-16-2008, 10:40 AM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

I think Mrs. Laurean has very supportive parents and I'm glad about that. I wouldn't be surprised to learn they are paying her lawyer. [/*]

I think they are probably being as supportive as they can be (as most parents probably would be) and at the same time they are probably very frustrated with CSL and some of her choices.

We really don't much about the Shifflets other than that one interview early on. I wonder how they feel about CSL dragging Amber into all of this and possibly jeopardizing her USMC career?

They may not have the means to pay Welch either. I don't think we know anything about their financial situation and ability to help.

JMO

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 10:42 AM

Originally posted by caejde

Still wonder why they hung up on a reporter when news of Cesar being captured hit. Sounded like to me from the interview they gave before, that they would have been happy with him being caught. [/*]

I'm sure they are very happy he has been captured. Hanging up and not speaking to anyone about this case is the proper thing because anything they say could be twisted. Everyone saw what was done to Maria's Mom.

martha

04-16-2008, 10:42 AM

Originally posted by Kel65

My guess he is doing this Pro Bono or at an extremly reduced rate. JMO [/*] Do all lawyers have to do some cases every year pro bono? I think someone posted that in the mary winkler case but it may just be for some states. they say they can pick which cases they want to do pro bono. if this is true then we know which cases they pick the ones that bring them the most attention. i may be wrong about this but I was told that is why the lawyers for mary winkler took her case. She did have some family that were lawyers if i rem corr. just saying don;t have any facts.jmho:rose:

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 10:42 AM

Originally posted by Mystical

I have thought about what Cesar might say and I think he will protect the Mother of his child. I believe he knows she is innocent and will not lie to point guilt in her direaction. [/*]

Or tell the truth that points in her direction.

IMO it could be either one of those options.

I believe CAL killed Maria and Gabriel and if CSL is guilty of anything, it would be knowing about the murders before CAL took off for Mexico. I also believe she showed a complete lack of integrity and concern for justice where Maria and Gabriel are concerned when she communicated w/her husband w/out informing the authorities that he had contacted her.

I don't know if she participated in the coverup of the crime, but if we learn that she did, it wouldn't surprise me.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:43 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

I would like to see Rick Southerland or Dewey Hudson answer the question as to whether they ASKED CHRISTINA to notify them IF CESAR attempted to contact her?????

Now that would be a telling question and if they didn't it might give us pause for thought as to why they need to polish her up a bit for the case against Cesar IMO. :o

That will never speak to the word integrity in my book Caejde.

JMO. [/*]

RS's answers. Hope this helps.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=60

henry

04-16-2008, 10:45 AM

Originally posted by Mystical

I think the blood from the violent activity was picked out by LE through the use of luminol. Christina would not necessarily have seen it. The fact that she's been cleared by LE would indicate to me she didn't see it. jmo. [/*]

the article says blood "and" violent activity . . . not from, as you have said . . . to me, it's 2 separate things . . . jmo

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by Kel65

I think they are probably being as supportive as they can be (as most parents probably would be) and at the same time they are probably very frustrated with CSL and some of her choices.

We really don't much about the Shifflets other than that one interview early on. I wonder how they feel about CSL dragging Amber into all of this and possibly jeopardizing her USMC career?

They may not have the means to pay Welch either. I don't think we know anything about their financial situation and ability to help.

JMO [/*]

I actually think an agreement and possible down payment of funds were made the day before on the 10th. If not...how in the world would Christina be able to obtain a lawyer right out of the blue that early in the morning so they could be with her when she turned over the infamous notes at 8:00 am?

imoo

caejde

04-16-2008, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

I'm sure they are very happy he has been captured. Hanging up and not speaking to anyone about this case is the proper thing because anything they say could be twisted. Everyone saw what was done to Maria's Mom. [/*]

But they already gave an interview on national tv and spouting off that Christina was at work the day of the murder and how she begged him to turn himself in. They could have given a simple answer "We are happy he's in custody. That's all we'd like to say." Mary did get blasted by the news...but she's still out there giving interviews.

caejde

04-16-2008, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by henry

the article says blood "and" violent activity . . . not from, as you have said . . . to me, it's 2 separate things . . . jmo [/*]

I think there was probably a struggle before she was killed.

Kel65

04-16-2008, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I actually think an agreement and possible down payment of funds were made the day before on the 10th. If not...how in the world would Christina be able to obtain a lawyer right out of the blue that early in the morning so they could be with her when she turned over the infamous notes at 8:00 am?

imoo [/*]

Do we know for certain it was Welch that went with her that day and not maybe a JAG attorney from Base Legal?

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:49 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I actually think an agreement and possible down payment of funds were made the day before on the 10th. If not...how in the world would Christina be able to obtain a lawyer right out of the blue that early in the morning so they could be with her when she turned over the infamous notes at 8:00 am?

imoo [/*]

If someone needs them, some lawyers will do what is necessary before a check is delivered into their hands. A question of money comes up later. jmo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:52 AM

Originally posted by henry

the article says blood "and" violent activity . . . not from, as you have said . . . to me, it's 2 separate things . . . jmo [/*]

I don't see it as two different things. The blood evidence alone can show violent activity. jmo

henry

04-16-2008, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by caejde

I think there was probably a struggle before she was killed. [/*]

yup . . . and the easier thing to be damaged are walls . . . i would sure notice that . . . and of course, it couldn't be caused by the baby or dog, or, could it :) . . . nah! oops, imo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:54 AM

Originally posted by caejde

I think there was probably a struggle before she was killed. [/*]

The blood evidence is probably all it took to show violent activity. jmo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:56 AM

Originally posted by henry

yup . . . and the easier thing to be damaged are walls . . . i would sure notice that . . . and of course, it couldn't be caused by the baby or dog, or, could it :) . . . nah! oops, imo [/*]

Again, the blood evidence showed violent activity. Nothing else imo.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 10:58 AM

Originally posted by Kel65

Do we know for certain it was Welch that went with her that day and not maybe a JAG attorney from Base Legal? [/*]

No we don't. It could have been a JAG. I really don't know what difference it makes. She has retained Welch and that is what it is. jmo

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 11:00 AM

Originally posted by Kel65

IMO, I think it is going to very hard for this woman to every go back to a "normal" life. If she is innocent, then I think her lawyer did a very big injustice to her by not having her do a public outreach early on or at least offering a statement to the public on her behalf. Yes, I understand that he said the USMC is at fault for her not being able to do a public outreach, but I think there is a big difference in the meaning of the words "advise" and "forbid", especially when it comes to the military interpretaiton.

IMO Welch is using the USMC to CYA himself . I believe a lot of the public opinion regarding Christina and all of this DA Christina stroking, is a result of a poor decision made by Welch early on and now he feels the need to back step.

If he truly believed that the USMC was prohibiting her to speak to anyone other than LE about this case, then I wonder if he ever approached the USMC and said something to the effect of hey, I need to have her out there or I need to make a statement on her behalf.

Also, if the military did in fact "forbid" her from speaking to anyone other than LE regarding this case, then she blatantly disobeyed an order by communicating with Cesar.

IMO, Welch, LE and the USMC have made this woman a mystery and helped to trigger the stuff that comes along with her being a mystery, such as the presumption by many that she is up to her eyeballs in some aspect of this murder/cover up.

When all is said and done if she is not charged or found guilty with anything in regard to this tragedy, she will forever be looked at woman who probably got away with something. Some of it may fade, but some of it will follow her through life.

JMO [/*]

ITA Kel65 and a great summation IMO. :patriot:

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 11:02 AM

Originally posted by Marcia3

Or tell the truth that points in her direction.

IMO it could be either one of those options.

I believe CAL killed Maria and Gabriel and if CSL is guilty of anything, it would be knowing about the murders before CAL took off for Mexico. I also believe she showed a complete lack of integrity and concern for justice where Maria and Gabriel are concerned when she communicated w/her husband w/out informing the authorities that he had contacted her.

I don't know if she participated in the cover up of the crime, but if we learn that she did, it wouldn't surprise me. [/*]

Hi Marcia!

Well one thing is for certain she had no qualms about covering up that she had been communicating with him since the first of February. So to me she is all about covering things up.

If she testifies and I believe she will then the defense attorney will be able to attack her credibility and imo they have much ammunition to work with. I don't think there is a jury in the world that is going to believe Christina is honorable or ethical for secretly communicating with an international fugitive. In fact I believe that most reasonable jurors will find it highly improbable that Christina Laurean didn't see, hear or know one thing about what happened in her own home until he supposedly told her on the 10th.

It is not up to us or even to law enforcement or the DA to weigh her credibility. That task belongs to the jury and imo they will not just close their eyes to any inconsistencies, oddities, coincidences or any covert acts she did concerning the suspect in this case.

imoo:seeya:

Mitzy2

04-16-2008, 11:04 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

I don't see it as two different things. The blood evidence alone can show violent activity. jmo [/*] I think I agree with this, it was the "blood splatter" trail from one room to the other then garage , that led LE to believe there was a struggle and Maria was trying to get away from her attacker rather than CL & Mrs. leaving furniture and other items strewn about for 3 weeks. Remember the Laurean's had a party at their home 12-24, others would have seen the house " upset" if that were the case. JMO

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by Sumanadevii
I still think she killed her and CL help HER cover it up. [/*]

Captain Sutherland did admit that they do not know the time of death so this will be a petri dish for any defense attorney imo.

imoo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

ITA Kel65 and a great summation IMO. :patriot: [/*]

You have brought up a case on yesterday's thread that shows this to happen. Many do not and will not believe in the innocence ot the three subjects. They were the defendants and Christina is only a witness. jmo

For Christina, her child, and her dog.:rose:

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

RS's answers. Hope this helps.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=60 [/*]

No it does not. :shrug:

I don't see him saying whether they asked her to advise them or not.

If they didn't, just maybe that's an indication of why they need her so badly IMO.

Pay heed to the part about him not trying to change anyone's mind. Maybe that's because he and DA Hudson fell hook, line and sinker for a pitiful act. Just maybe that's it right there.

JMO. :eek:

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 11:07 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

You have brought up a case on yesterday's thread that shows this to happen. Many do not and will not believe in the innocence ot the three subjects. They were the defendants and Christina is only a witness. jmo

For Christina, her child, and her dog.:rose: [/*]

Funny, the DA or Rick Sutherland have not called her innocent. Maybe it's time for a revisit with the WRAL video after the presser.

JMO.hammer

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 11:08 AM

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 11:09 AM

Kel65

04-16-2008, 11:09 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Captain Sutherland did admit that they do not know the time of death so this will be a petri dish for any defense attorney imo.

imoo [/*]

You bet it will! JMO

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 11:12 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Time will tell Marcia3....

Do you think either one of them asked her to contact them if Cesar attempted to contact her? :cool:

JMO [/*]

Absolutely.

She didn't.......

imoo

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 11:13 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Captain Sutherland did admit that they do not know the time of death so this will be a petri dish for any defense attorney imo.

imoo [/*]

I wonder what evidentiary value the shoe may have now and how the defense will handle it with Greta and crew?

Just curious here. :read:

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 11:18 AM

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 11:20 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

I wonder what evidentiary value the shoe may have now and how the defense will handle it with Greta and crew?

Just curious here. :read: [/*]

That shoe's never gonna see the inside of a courtroom. IMO

And you can tell me that Christina was deaf, dumb, and blind to blood in her own home, but there's no way she missed that shoe!

In fact, didn't she "protesteth too much" when the shoe was shown on tv?

Mitzy2

04-16-2008, 11:21 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Absolutely.

She didn't.......

imoo [/*] ITA, ofcourse they told her and I'am sure LE completely anticipated that CL would try to contact his wife as well as other family members. JMO

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 11:24 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Hi Marcia!

Well one thing is for certain she had no qualms about covering up that she had been communicating with him since the first of February. So to me she is all about covering things up.

If she testifies and I believe she will then the defense attorney will be able to attack her credibility and imo they have much ammunition to work with. I don't think there is a jury in the world that is going to believe Christina is honorable or ethical for secretly communicating with an international fugitive. In fact I believe that most reasonable jurors will find it highly improbable that Christina Laurean didn't see, hear or know one thing about what happened in her own home until he supposedly told her on the 10th.

It is not up to us or even to law enforcement or the DA to weigh her credibility. That task belongs to the jury and imo they will not just close their eyes to any inconsistencies, oddities, coincidences or any covert acts she did concerning the suspect in this case.

imoo:seeya: [/*]

I don't disagree that jurors may view her as less than honorable. But if that is all she appears to be to them, I can't see how it will help Cesar.

Lack of integrity isn't against the law. But unless & until someone can point out with specificity some CRIME that Christina committed, all I can figure she is so far is someone who did not act with much honor or morality. I sure wouldn't want to be in her parents' shoes & have to claim her as my child, but she still seems to be a long way away from having criminal culpability in this case.

If Sutherland says the evidence they have relates only to Cesar being responsible for Maria's murder, I believe him.

JMO

hinman

04-16-2008, 11:24 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Funny, the DA or Rick Sutherland have not called her innocent. Maybe it's time for a revisit with the WRAL video after the presser.

JMO.hammer [/*]I am not sure that they would ever claim her innocent. DO they usually do that?

I have heard of them claiming a suspect has been cleared or is not involved but never innocent.

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Hi Marcia!

Well one thing is for certain she had no qualms about covering up that she had been communicating with him since the first of February. So to me she is all about covering things up.

If she testifies and I believe she will then the defense attorney will be able to attack her credibility and imo they have much ammunition to work with. I don't think there is a jury in the world that is going to believe Christina is honorable or ethical for secretly communicating with an international fugitive. In fact I believe that most reasonable jurors will find it highly improbable that Christina Laurean didn't see, hear or know one thing about what happened in her own home until he supposedly told her on the 10th.

It is not up to us or even to law enforcement or the DA to weigh her credibility. That task belongs to the jury and imo they will not just close their eyes to any inconsistencies, oddities, coincidences or any covert acts she did concerning the suspect in this case.

imoo:seeya: [/*]

This has jury nullification written all over it. Especially if the DA tries to put forth a motive.

Cesar - kills a woman who is obviously leaving town and will be out of his life forever.....

Or will the jury see it another way?

Christina - who finds a woman at her house that she firmly believes had an affair with her husband and his carrying his child....

hinman

04-16-2008, 11:30 AM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

This has jury nullification written all over it. Especially if the DA tries to put forth a motive.

Cesar - kills a woman who is obviously leaving town and will be out of his life forever.....

Or will the jury see it another way?

Christina - who finds a woman at her house that she firmly believes had an affair with her husband and his carrying his child.... [/*]I thinkthat the DA will present enough evidence that the Jury willno with out a doubt that Christina did not kill Maria.

If he can not do that then there is no point in wasting tax payers money. I am sure the DA nows how the public feels about Christina and as Sutherland said we do not have all the info the Jury will.

I think that I am just going to have confidence that CL will be found guilty.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 11:30 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Captain Sutherland did admit that they do not know the time of death so this will be a petri dish for any defense attorney imo.

imoo [/*]

Not a problem. He said they know the parameters. How large or small the parameters are is not known to us. That is all they need for trial. jmo

Sweetyhide

04-16-2008, 11:31 AM

Originally posted by hinman
I am not sure that they would ever claim her innocent. DO they usually do that?

I have heard of them claiming a suspect has been cleared or is not involved but never innocent. [/*]

An Attorney General will here in NC:D

:chicken:

alter ego

04-16-2008, 11:38 AM

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 11:39 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Funny, the DA or Rick Sutherland have not called her innocent. Maybe it's time for a revisit with the WRAL video after the presser.

JMO.hammer [/*]

You are confusing the issue. They said she is not complicit in the murder. She is not complicit in the disposal. The DA said he has not reviewed all the emails. The FBI is still dealing with that. He said it is not a crime to write to her husband. Her lawyer said he doesn't contemplate any charges. Defense attorneys and DAs do communicate. He would know.
The FBI has no doubt communicated to the DA what is in the emails so far.

imo:read:

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 11:40 AM

Originally posted by Mimi428

I don't disagree that jurors may view her as less than honorable. But if that is all she appears to be to them, I can't see how it will help Cesar.

Lack of integrity isn't against the law. But unless & until someone can point out with specificity some CRIME that Christina committed, all I can figure she is so far is someone who did not act with much honor or morality. I sure wouldn't want to be in her parents' shoes & have to claim her as my child, but she still seems to be a long way away from having criminal culpability in this case.

If Sutherland says the evidence they have relates only to Cesar being responsible for Maria's murder, I believe him.

JMO [/*]

I don't give Captain Sutherland much weight in what he says. He is the PR man for LE. It is typical LE speak isms when they are bringing any case against one defendant. It behooves him and the DA to try and shore her up as being a credible witness and IMO it is not working in that county. It is very evident that they must need her badly and this is why I think this case will be more circumstantial and less about forensics that directly points to him as the for certain killer.

It does not matter that she did not commit a criminal offense by law. What matters is it lends credence that she will cover up what she knows and is participating in. That will not be lost in that courtroom imo.

The Couey family trash were inside the realm of the law too when they protected an absconded sex offender however they were looked at with great disdain and fury and the majority did not believe one thing they said.

imo

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Time will tell Marcia3....

Do you think either one of them asked her to contact them if Cesar attempted to contact her? :cool:

JMO [/*]

If they didn't, then I don't know what to say. I would think it would be one of the first things to say to her, right after, "Don't leave town." :D

alter ego

04-16-2008, 11:46 AM

from last night's thread:

Originally posted by Kim

Exactly I am on that boat with ya sister!
The suspect hasnt been questioned and the case is made?! sounds like a mistrial already MOO (which I value greatly LOL) [/*]

The suspect not being questioned is not an indication of a pending or looming mistrial.

LE and the DA are not able to question every suspect as every suspect has the right to remain silent.

KKKKKKatie

04-16-2008, 11:48 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I don't give Captain Sutherland much weight in what he says. He is the PR man for LE. It is typical LE speak isms when they are bringing any case against one defendant. It behooves him and the DA to try and shore her up as being a credible witness and IMO it is not working in that county. It is very evident that they must need her badly and this is why I think this case will be more circumstantial and less about forensics that directly points to him as the for certain killer.

It does not matter that she did not commit a criminal offense by law. What matters is it lends credence that she will cover up what she knows and is participating in. That will not be lost in that courtroom imo.

The Couey family trash were inside the realm of the law too when they protected an absconded sex offender however they were looked at with great disdain and fury and the majority did not believe one thing they said.

imo [/*]

ITA! If she takes the stand in his defense and this is known to them they won't believe a word she says IMO

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 11:49 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I don't give Captain Sutherland much weight in what he says. He is the PR man for LE. It is typical LE speak isms when they are bringing any case against one defendant. It behooves him and the DA to try and shore her up as being a credible witness and IMO it is not working in that county. It is very evident that they must need her badly and this is why I think this case will be more circumstantial and less about forensics that directly points to him as the for certain killer.

It does not matter that she did not commit a criminal offense by law. What matters is it lends credence that she will cover up what she knows and is participating in. That will not be lost in that courtroom imo.

The Couey family trash were inside the realm of the law too when they protected an absconded sex offender however they were looked at with great disdain and fury and the majority did not believe one thing they said.

imo [/*]

What changed your mind about Captain Sutherland? As I remember, everyone gave great credence to what he was saying until it came to Christina. Has he changed that much?

There are questions and answers on the board to and from him. Everyone hung on his answers.

There should have been a hint to posters when RS said if they had probable cause to charge her they would. Right there was the answer.

JMO

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 11:50 AM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

That shoe's never gonna see the inside of a courtroom. IMO

And you can tell me that Christina was deaf, dumb, and blind to blood in her own home, but there's no way she missed that shoe!

In fact, didn't she "protesteth too much" when the shoe was shown on tv? [/*]

Hmm since Sutherland said it may come into the trial later could he mean the defense is probably going to want to bring it in? I still find it odd that CSLs lawyer not Cesar Laurean's lawyer that came out protesting immediately. Did she tell her attorney it is her shoe?

If this SW was in error and it is Christina's shoe and has blood and maybe hairs of Maria on it if they are not allowed to bring it in the State has just set themselves for a huge issue on Appeal if he is convicted.

imoo

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 11:51 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I don't give Captain Sutherland much weight in what he says. He is the PR man for LE. It is typical LE speak isms when they are bringing any case against one defendant. It behooves him and the DA to try and shore her up as being a credible witness and IMO it is not working in that county. It is very evident that they must need her badly and this is why I think this case will be more circumstantial and less about forensics that directly points to him as the for certain killer.

It does not matter that she did not commit a criminal offense by law. What matters is it lends credence that she will cover up what she knows and is participating in. That will not be lost in that courtroom imo.

The Couey family trash were inside the realm of the law too when they protected an absconded sex offender however they were looked at with great disdain and fury and the majority did not believe one thing they said.

imo [/*]

Yep, I've been saying it for a while now. Hudson wants CSL to have the aura of innocence in all things because he needs her testimony, whatever that is, to be believed. CE is enough to convict CAL and I believe he's going down on this one, but Hudson has more of a "feel" for this trial than I do, of that I am sure.

JMO.

KKKKKKatie

04-16-2008, 11:52 AM

alter ego

04-16-2008, 11:52 AM

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

The Couey family trash were inside the realm of the law too when they protected an absconded sex offender however they were looked at with great disdain and fury and the majority did not believe one thing they said.

imo [/*]

True. But regardless of the jury or general public's dislike of all of them for their disgraceful behavior, the DA DID get the conviction.

Which was my point. I don't think the DA's case is lost here simply because Christina could not conduct herself in an ethical manner. I DO believe if the DA's office had anything AT ALL to indicate that Christina took part in as much as helping Cesar put Maria's body into the ground, they would have charged her.

I don't think she committed the murder. I don't think she helped Cesar dispose of the body. Communicating with him through the internet isn't a civilian crime, no matter how immoral any of us believe it to be in these circumstances. If she turned a blind eye to all sorts of odd behaviors from Cesar after the murder, THAT isn't a crime either. I may not think much of her on a personal level, but that's a d@mn sight different than MURDER.

If she was instructed via the USMC to report any contact she had with Cesar & she didn't - they will take care of all of that, I'm sure.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by KKKKKKatie

not everyone gave him great credence. In fact many here questioned the way he has handled this case.

Remeber his plea for her to just come home :rolleyes: [/*]

That was SB. The plea was for Cesar to just come home.

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 11:55 AM

Originally posted by Mystical

Once again, the latest answers from Captain Sutherland is that Christina has been cleared of any involvement.

I find it silly that people like to pick and choose which statements they will believe by Captain Sutherland when it involves Christina, shows their bias. jmo.

Cesar Laurean will not implicate Christina because he did the murder, clean up and burial alone. jmo. [/*]

Thanks for calling me silly, much appreciated.

I'm not "picking and choosing" from Sutherland's statements. I'm taking them word for word. CSL has been cleared from involvement in the murder, and I've said I believe CAL killed Maria without any help from his wife. He has not stated that CSL has been cleared from the coverup.

I'm not convinced that CSL had a hand in the coverup/burial, just saying that if we learn later that she did, I won't be shocked.

JMO.

nuttintodo

04-16-2008, 11:56 AM

I have wonderful news to report....

Rosie the dog is not at the Animal Shelter. I just got off the phone with them and I was told no dog matching the dog's description (limited description as it is) was with them.

I had to explain the purpose of the inquiry about Rosie and after I explained the situation, I was told to tell the person who was interested in adopting Rosie, there were lots of other dogs available for adoption.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

What changed your mind about Captain Sutherland? As I remember, everyone gave great credence to what he was saying until it came to Christina. Has he changed that much?

There are questions and answers on the board to and from him. Everyone hung on his answers.

There should have been a hint to posters when RS said if they had probable cause to charge her they would. Right there was the answer.

JMO [/*]

Oh I still like him very much. He does his job very well. This is what is expected of him. To build the witnesses up and infer they have an iron clad case but I have noticed on somethings he gives one answer and then at another time he gives another answer as if he realized he needed to rearrange what he had said previously.

His view is very one sided and comes from his own biases which is understandable... after all he is law enforcement. No LE or DA is ever going to admit they may have weakness in their case or may have witnesses that they know that will have baggage of thier own to carry in court.

imoo

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
I have wonderful news to report....

Rosie the dog is not at the Animal Shelter. I just got off the phone with them and I was told no dog matching the dog's description (limited description as it is) was with them.

I had to explain the purpose of the inquiry about Rosie and after I explained the situation, I was told to tell the person who was interested in adopting Rosie, there were lots of other dogs available for adoption. [/*]

Yay!!! Thanks for making that call. Good for you! :)

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 12:01 PM

Originally posted by Marcia3

Thanks for calling me silly, much appreciated.

I'm not "picking and choosing" from Sutherland's statements. I'm taking them word for word. CSL has been cleared from involvement in the murder, and I've said I believe CAL killed Maria without any help from his wife. He has not stated that CSL has been cleared from the cover up.

I'm not convinced that CSL had a hand in the cover up/burial, just saying that if we learn later that she did, I won't be shocked.

JMO. [/*]

Exactly, Marcia. It was obvious in most of the questions to CS that many thought they were covering up for CSL. That is why he replied there was no cover up on their part and she has been given no deal.......which is great news. That means options are still on the table and they haven't closed themselves in.

imoo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 12:05 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
I have wonderful news to report....

Rosie the dog is not at the Animal Shelter. I just got off the phone with them and I was told no dog matching the dog's description (limited description as it is) was with them.

I had to explain the purpose of the inquiry about Rosie and after I explained the situation, I was told to tell the person who was interested in adopting Rosie, there were lots of other dogs available for adoption. [/*]

OMG, thank you Nuttin. I hope she wasn't there before and is just not there now or disposed of and not there now.

Thank you so much.:rose:

nuttintodo

04-16-2008, 12:06 PM

Ocean, I just noticed your sig line! :patriot:

Matter of fact as I type this, there are 3 helicopters flying over my house....

KKKKKKatie

04-16-2008, 12:09 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

That was SB. The plea was for Cesar to just come home. [/*]

my mistake...I read it wrong. :o

Kel65

04-16-2008, 12:09 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
Ocean, I just noticed your sig line! :patriot:

Matter of fact as I type this, there are 3 helicopters flying over my house.... [/*]

O/T I actually miss the sound of them. When I lived in J'ville we resided three miles as the crow flies from Base Ops.

I wonder if we will hear anything from the military about their view on Christina's integrity?

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 12:10 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
I have wonderful news to report....

Rosie the dog is not at the Animal Shelter. I just got off the phone with them and I was told no dog matching the dog's description (limited description as it is) was with them.

I had to explain the purpose of the inquiry about Rosie and after I explained the situation, I was told to tell the person who was interested in adopting Rosie, there were lots of other dogs available for adoption. [/*]

Well what great news.

Maybe SB would still be interested in saving another little pet that IS there.

I have 5 cats and 2 dogs and all but one was adopted from the shelters.

imoo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 12:11 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Oh I still like him very much. He does his job very well. This is what is expected of him. To build the witnesses up and infer they have an iron clad case but I have noticed on somethings he gives one answer and then at another time he gives another answer as if he realized he needed to rearrange what he had said previously.

His view is very one sided and comes from his own biases which is understandable... after all he is law enforcement. No LE or DA is ever going to admit they may have weakness in their case or may have witnesses that they know that will have baggage of thier own to carry in court.

imoo [/*]

I wonder if RS knows that is his job description?:biggrin:

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Exactly, Marcia. It was obvious in most of the questions to CS that many thought they were covering up for CSL. That is why he replied there was no cover up on their part and she has been given no deal.......which is great news. That means options are still on the table and they haven't closed themselves in.

imoo [/*]

It would be counter-productive, IMO, for anyone to be "cleared" at this point, even given whatever evidence they have. Until CAL comes marching home, so to speak, or is dragged here, they only have part of the story, IMO. Not that CAL would make a reliable "witness" since he is the one who has been charged with murder. :D

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 12:13 PM

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 12:14 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
Ocean, I just noticed your sig line! :patriot:

Matter of fact as I type this, there are 3 helicopters flying over my house.... [/*]

Let freedom sound off.:patriot:

When ya see that huge 53 throw it a kiss for my son. He always called them his "baby." LOL Still does.

imoo:seeya:

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 12:15 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
I have wonderful news to report....

Rosie the dog is not at the Animal Shelter. [/*]

Thank you for taking the time to do that, nuttin.

I have a sinking feeling that the rumor about that will never die. I expect 6 months & 6 years from now that 'story' will still be passed around as if it were the truth.

Never ceases to amaze me to realize just how twisted & malicious some people can be when it comes to posting 'information' on the 'net. There are some mighty strange folks in this world, that's for certain.

JMO

nuttintodo

04-16-2008, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by Kel65

O/T I actually miss the sound of them. When I lived in J'ville we resided three miles as the crow flies from Base Ops.

I wonder if we will hear anything from the military about their view on Christina's integrity? [/*]

I think eventually we will, now it might take them a while but they will. jmoo

O/T Where I'm at is in the flight path from New River to both Bogue Field and Cherry Point. I love to hear those helicopters too. Those Osprey's....I call them the goose on steroids, LOL.

They fly more out MW and caejde's way.

Kel65

04-16-2008, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Let freedom sound off.:patriot:

When ya see that huge 53 throw it a kiss for my son. He always called them his "baby." LOL Still does.

imoo:seeya: [/*]

My husband thinks the 46 is God's gift to aviation. He had not desire to move to the Osprey. Guess it is hard to teach old dogs new tricks. That 53 is one loud aircraft! I believe some of the pig farmers in Onslow County have problems with baby pigs being trampled to death when the 53 lands in LZ near some of the farms.

So not to be totally off topic, I wonder why Maria wasn't simply transferred over to MCAS New River? That would have put more distance between she and CAL. I believe there is a lot of Admin consoloidation going on in Jacksonville on the bases, but when I left in June they still had a Pass and ID office at New River. Heck there are admin type jobs, that probably would have accomodated her MOS, at the MCAS Headquarters Bldg over there too. JMO and speculating.

martha

04-16-2008, 12:28 PM

Originally posted by Marcia3

It would be counter-productive, IMO, for anyone to be "cleared" at this point, even given whatever evidence they have. Until CAL comes marching home, so to speak, or is dragged here, they only have part of the story, IMO. Not that CAL would make a reliable "witness" since he is the one who has been charged with murder. :D [/*] ITA i don;t think anyone is cleard yet we have no way of knowing who or what will come up in the trial.I think it is much to early to say anyone is cleared jmho there is so very much we don;t know about this case. I don;t think it will be a simple case. as someone has said it will have a lot of twist and turns again jmho :rose:

martha

04-16-2008, 12:31 PM

I am glad the little dog is ok my son;s name is Rory and his nic is rosie!!!!!! have a very good day everyone i will be in and out reading keep the faith :rose:

hinman

04-16-2008, 12:38 PM

Originally posted by Sweetyhide

An Attorney General will here in NC:D

:chicken: [/*]:D

hinman

04-16-2008, 12:39 PM

Originally posted by hinman
:D [/*]I do not know how I just repostd this reply sorry.

Sweetyhide

04-16-2008, 12:51 PM

I was thinking about the wife having contact with CL.
I have been trying to wondered what instance where I thought it was okay (morally- since its not illegal) that she was in contact with him and didn't tell.

This is under the assumption that she is innocent (which I believe RS). How distraught she must be. This whole thing would be totally overwhelming for her. Surely none of this is setting well in her mind. If it were me, I would WANT to talk to him, ask him WHY? (don't we all want to know why?) Why he did this to Maria and why he did this to his family. The need to know would be overwhelming. Under the enourmous stress I could see trying to get answers. Afterall, LE stated that she didn't aid him, just talked to him. Obviously (to me) he never told her where he was. (they had to trace him back to the internet cafe)

In general, my point is if my husband had done what Cl is accused of I would not be thinking clearly. I could see under these circumstance doing the same thing.

All JMHO

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 12:56 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

Thank you for taking the time to do that, nuttin.

I have a sinking feeling that the rumor about that will never die. I expect 6 months & 6 years from now that 'story' will still be passed around as if it were the truth.

Never ceases to amaze me to realize just how twisted & malicious some people can be when it comes to posting 'information' on the 'net. There are some mighty strange folks in this world, that's for certain.

JMO [/*]

I don't think I'd classify it as a "rumor" or malicious story on the net. We don't know the poster and we don't know the dog's name, but the poster appeared to have.

What the shelter said was they didn't have a dog matching the description nuttin gave them "at this time".

IF the dog was surrendered by the owner, we don't know what the owner requested; whether the dog be adopted or put down.

Again, a big IF.

JMO

alter ego

04-16-2008, 12:58 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

Captain Sutherland did admit that they do not know the time of death so this will be a petri dish for any defense attorney imo.

imoo [/*]Not necessarily.

hinman

04-16-2008, 01:03 PM

Originally posted by Sweetyhide
I was thinking about the wife having contact with CL.
I have been trying to wondered what instance where I thought it was okay (morally- since its not illegal) that she was in contact with him and didn't tell.

This is under the assumption that she is innocent (which I believe RS). How distraught she must be. This whole thing would be totally overwhelming for her. Surely none of this is setting well in her mind. If it were me, I would WANT to talk to him, ask him WHY? (don't we all want to know why?) Why he did this to Maria and why he did this to his family. The need to know would be overwhelming. Under the enormous stress I could see trying to get answers. Afterall, LE stated that she didn't aid him, just talked to him. Obviously (to me) he never told her where he was. (they had to trace him back to the internet cafe)

In general, my point is if my husband had done what Cl is accused of I would not be thinking clearly. I could see under these circumstance doing the same thing.

All JMHO [/*]Good post sweety hide. I can see Christina being very confused. In her mind Maria was trying to destroy her family, Maria pressed rape allegations on CL and then the restraining order and then if we are t believe her Maria goes over there and gets in a fight with CL.

Then the murder happens, I think that Christina might feel a little sorry for her husband and everything she believes Maria has put them through.

any way just saying not that I could even pretend to know.

caejde

04-16-2008, 01:06 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

I think eventually we will, now it might take them a while but they will. jmoo

O/T Where I'm at is in the flight path from New River to both Bogue Field and Cherry Point. I love to hear those helicopters too. Those Osprey's....I call them the goose on steroids, LOL.

They fly more out MW and caejde's way. [/*]

Yep, we get Cobra's, 46's, 53's, Osprey here every day. Rattles my windows at times when they are flying so low. I can pretty much tell by the sound which is flying over and go outside to check to see if I'm right!

alter ego

04-16-2008, 01:07 PM

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 01:18 PM

Originally posted by alter ego

didn't they need luminol to see that blood? [/*]

IIRC, not all of it. In fact, if you saw Greta's show where RS was showing her pictures from inside the house/garage, there is one photo that clearly shows blood spatter.

That doesn't mean that it was the only area with spatter (not painted over) that was visible to the naked eye.

daniel green

04-16-2008, 02:16 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

I don't think the DA said "cleared" when he said "Absolutely not, I haven't ruled anything out" when asked if he had ruled out charges in the future against Christina.

And I'm still not seeing the word "cleared" in RS' post.

:shrug: [/*]

Yep, that's all he said.

He did not say Mrs L has been cleared or that she is innocent, as has been claimed on this board.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by alter ego
Not necessarily. [/*]

I disagree. It will be very pivotal that they cannot tell that jury with any certainty if this happened before or after CSL came home. They have admitted they only have perimeters and no time of death.

There is not just one side in a criminal case. There are both sides. State and Defense.

imoo

daniel green

04-16-2008, 02:26 PM

Originally posted by alter ego
Why would LE or the DA proclaim a person who is not charged with a crime and has not been named a suspect as 'innocent' ?

:shrug: [/*]

Well, they wouldn't.

As you say, why would they?

daniel green

04-16-2008, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I disagree. It will be very pivotal that they cannot tell that jury with any certainty if this happened before or after CSL came home. snipped[/*]

I agree completely.

daniel green

04-16-2008, 02:29 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

I don't think I'd classify it as a "rumor" or malicious story on the net. We don't know the poster and we don't know the dog's name, but the poster appeared to have.

What the shelter said was they didn't have a dog matching the description nuttin gave them "at this time".

IF the dog was surrendered by the owner, we don't know what the owner requested; whether the dog be adopted or put down.

Again, a big IF.

JMO [/*]

Ditto all.

And they wouldn't tell you that one fitting that description had been put down.

martha

04-16-2008, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I disagree. It will be very pivotal that they cannot tell that jury with any certainty if this happened before or after CSL came home. They have admitted they only have perimeters and no time of death.

There is not just one side in a criminal case. There are both sides. State and Defense.

imoo [/*] ITA with you there is two sides to every story and I really don;t think anyone is cleaned yet. cl is so very young and i really don;t think this was all done by him alone jmho In my heart of hearts I think there is someone or more than one that knows a lot about this case that has not come forward yet. I am just praying the truth will come out. It makes me so very sad when i look at pictures of ml and cl they or so very young. something about seeing them in the uniforms makes my heart go out to them both. I can; t help but think it might have been a love affaire gone wrong. we have no idea what part his wife had in this and I do feel sorry for her. I feel sure she loved cl and was broken hearted about him loving ml. I know all of this has been awful on all the family;s as a mother I just know each mother is suffering over it all right now. my prayer is for GOD to take care of them all. i worrie about cl little girl too. May GOD bless her and keep her from as much harm as he can. when something like this happens everone inv payes a dear price and it will always be with them no matter what happenes in the future. my love goes to all the people in this mess. GOD bless them all. May none of us have to ever face anything like this in our life time.:rose:

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by Kel65

My husband thinks the 46 is God's gift to aviation. He had not desire to move to the Osprey. Guess it is hard to teach old dogs new tricks. That 53 is one loud aircraft! I believe some of the pig farmers in Onslow County have problems with baby pigs being trampled to death when the 53 lands in LZ near some of the farms.

So not to be totally off topic, I wonder why Maria wasn't simply transferred over to MCAS New River? That would have put more distance between she and CAL. I believe there is a lot of Admin consolidation going on in Jacksonville on the bases, but when I left in June they still had a Pass and ID office at New River. Heck there are admin type jobs, that probably would have accommodated her MOS, at the MCAS Headquarters Bldg over there too. JMO and speculating. [/*]

I really don't think that they thought it necessary. The MPO was never violated and she continued to say she did not fear him.

I have been within a 200 feet of the 53 from power up to lift off. It is awesome and the power it has to lift and maneuver is absolutely amazing. It has its own unique deep rolling thunder sound and is an awesome machine with its refueling probe on the front. When Captain O'Grady was rescued he said he will never forget the sound of that powerful 53 coming to get him and he knew he was going home.

LOL The osprey is just plain weird looking.

Now back on topic.

Has there been any new information on Laurean being extradited? And when the next hearing is going to be?

imoo

alter ego

04-16-2008, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by daniel green

Well, they wouldn't.

As you say, why would they? [/*]Well gee then why are there comments about them not saying 'she is innocent'?????

daniel green

04-16-2008, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by KKKKKKatie

not everyone gave him great credence. In fact many here questioned the way he has handled this case.

Remeber his plea for her to just come home :rolleyes: [/*]

Count me in as one of those.

Answering silly questions on a blog is just :eek: to me. I have never heard of any LE officer doing such a thing.

chance

04-16-2008, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by daniel green

Yep, that's all he said.

He did not say Mrs L has been cleared or that she is innocent, as has been claimed on this board. [/*]

I am begininng to think she wil not be charged, but not because she is innocent. They did have a month to cover their tracks.

If she is never charged IMO does not prove her innocence.

When i was in my early 20's and partying. I had drivin my car under the influence (not proud of it mind you)

I was never charged with a DUI because I never got caught not because I was innocent!

We may just have to accept that IMO

Just sayin

moo

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 02:37 PM

Cesar Armando Laurean HAS BEEN INDICTED for Maria's murder.

Christina Laurean has NOT been indicted for Maria's murder.

So now that we have all figured out that, is anyone interested in discussing why Cesar has been indicted for Maria's murder?

Anyone interested in discussing the part of the search warrant that indicated LE believed Maria had been kidnapped? Any ideas on why that particular page shows up on some websites & not on others?

I'm referring to the search warrant which also includes the info on what was recovered at Sgt Durham's home. I will go look for that link again & post it.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by martha
ITA with you there is two sides to every story and I really don;t think anyone is cleaned yet. cl is so very young and i really don;t think this was all done by him alone jmho In my heart of hearts I think there is someone or more than one that knows a lot about this case that has not come forward yet. I am just praying the truth will come out. It makes me so very sad when i look at pictures of ml and cl they or so very young. something about seeing them in the uniforms makes my heart go out to them both. I can; t help but think it might have been a love affair gone wrong. we have no idea what part his wife had in this and I do feel sorry for her. I feel sure she loved cl and was broken hearted about him loving ml. I know all of this has been awful on all the family;s as a mother I just know each mother is suffering over it all right now. my prayer is for GOD to take care of them all. i worry about cl little girl too. May GOD bless her and keep her from as much harm as he can. when something like this happens everyone inv prayers a dear price and it will always be with them no matter what happiness in the future. my love goes to all the people in this mess. GOD bless them all. May none of us have to ever face anything like this in our life time.:rose: [/*]

I find you such a wise woman, Martha.

Yes, both sides must always be told before the truth can ever be learned.:rose:

imoo

martha

04-16-2008, 02:38 PM

they have not chg tina with anything so they can;t say she is guilty now but we may be shocked when cl gets back and things start coming out about this mess what will come up about other people. just saying. jmho:rose:

daniel green

04-16-2008, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by chance

I am begininng to think she wil not be charged, but not because she is innocent. They did have a month to cover their tracks.

If she is never charged IMO does not prove her innocence.

snipped [/*]

I quite agree. I said on Friday that if she had not been charged already, I doubted she would be.

But who knows.

I do agree that LE does not believe that she is innocent, but that, as they say, they don't have enough for probable cause.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by chance

I am beginning to think she will not be charged, but not because she is innocent. They did have a month to cover their tracks.

If she is never charged IMO does not prove her innocence.

When i was in my early 20's and partying. I had drivin my car under the influence (not proud of it mind you)

I was never charged with a DUI because I never got caught not because I was innocent!

We may just have to accept that IMO

Just sayin

moo [/*]

Maybe she will not be charged like some of the group of teenagers that knew all about the murder/mutilation plot to kill Dan Soresson that is being aired on TruTV now.

You are absolutely right. Not being charged does not equate to being innocent......far from it.

imoo

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

I disagree. It will be very pivotal that they cannot tell that jury with any certainty if this happened before or after CSL came home. They have admitted they only have perimeters and no time of death.

There is not just one side in a criminal case. There are both sides. State and Defense.

imoo [/*]

Add to that the STATE has a DUTY to PUBLIC they serve IMO. I have never felt it's the job of a DA and the PIO to boost the popularity of a WITNESS for the STATE.

This is only the second time I've seen it done, and I hope it ends soon. Your witness is either credible or not and shouldn't require a bolstering from either entity from my POV.

Ed Brown is not fooled by any of this and will not hang his hat on the stories we are hearing from what I see. He knows the nature of human beings far too well, to just take a story because it sounds good.

I'll bet he expected some of this and can't wait for the time to come where he is able to talk in retrospect. Him telling Lallama that it was POSSIBLE....is just another person on the list still questioning as it should be. :patriot:

jmo

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 02:48 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Add to that the STATE has a DUTY to PUBLIC they serve IMO. I have never felt it's the job of a DA and the PIO to boost the popularity of a WITNESS for the STATE.

This is only the second time I've seen it done, and I hope it ends soon. Your witness is either credible or not and shouldn't require a bolstering from either entity from my POV.

Ed Brown is not fooled by any of this and will not hang his hat on the stories we are hearing from what I see. He knows the nature of human beings far too well, to just take a story because it sounds good.

I'll bet he expected some of this and can't wait for the time to come where he is able to talk in retrospect. Him telling Lallama that it was POSSIBLE....is just another person on the list still questioning as it should be. :patriot:

jmo [/*]

I agree Candy. After 41+ years in law enforcement that gut instinct is well entrenched. He is not convinced that she "possibly" didn't know a thing. I think he will continue to search for those answers that nag at him and have since the beginning.

imoo

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 02:49 PM

alter ego

04-16-2008, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by daniel green

I quite agree. I said on Friday that if she had not been charged already, I doubted she would be.

But who knows.

I do agree that LE does not believe that she is innocent, but that, as they say, they don't have enough for probable cause. [/*]

What exactly do you think is meant when LE says they believe that she did not have any part in the homicide?

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:02 PM

Originally posted by hinman
I thinkthat the DA will present enough evidence that the Jury willno with out a doubt that Christina did not kill Maria.

If he can not do that then there is no point in wasting tax payers money. I am sure the DA nows how the public feels about Christina and as Sutherland said we do not have all the info the Jury will.

I think that I am just going to have confidence that CL will be found guilty. [/*]

Absolutely and totally agree, hinman.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 03:03 PM

Originally posted by alter ego

What exactly do you think is meant when LE says they believe that she did not have any part in the homicide? [/*]

FOR ME, it is the idea that she is not directly tied to the murder of Maria, but that leaves the door wide open for other kinds of involvement.

JMO.:(

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 03:08 PM

I was reading some articles over on Jacksonville Daily News and thought this was an interesting statement made by Hudson.

District Attorney Dewey Hudson said the Marine Corps was waiting to receive Laurean's DNA, and he knew military authorities were holding off testing any other possible father for Lauterbach's unborn baby.

So does the MC know of "any other possible father"? They must have some inkling or idea if they are going to see if Laurean is the father and if not they will be testing others as the possible father.:shrug:

imo

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:08 PM

Originally posted by alter ego
Why would LE or the DA proclaim a person who is not charged with a crime and has not been named a suspect as 'innocent' ?

:shrug: [/*]

Wish I'd thought of that response! :D

:beer:

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:16 PM

Originally posted by Sweetyhide
I was thinking about the wife having contact with CL.
I have been trying to wondered what instance where I thought it was okay (morally- since its not illegal) that she was in contact with him and didn't tell.

This is under the assumption that she is innocent (which I believe RS). How distraught she must be. This whole thing would be totally overwhelming for her. Surely none of this is setting well in her mind. If it were me, I would WANT to talk to him, ask him WHY? (don't we all want to know why?) Why he did this to Maria and why he did this to his family. The need to know would be overwhelming. Under the enourmous stress I could see trying to get answers. Afterall, LE stated that she didn't aid him, just talked to him. Obviously (to me) he never told her where he was. (they had to trace him back to the internet cafe)

In general, my point is if my husband had done what Cl is accused of I would not be thinking clearly. I could see under these circumstance doing the same thing.

All JMHO [/*]

Another good post. I am just catching up here.

"Not thinking clearly" ......I totally agree. And that's an understatement.

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:19 PM

Originally posted by daniel green

Yep, that's all he said.

He did not say Mrs L has been cleared or that she is innocent, as has been claimed on this board. [/*]

Not in so many words, granted. I've said "all BUT cleared" though others have said cleared as that is the way they interpret many statements. I interpret them that way as well.

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:21 PM

Originally posted by chance

I am begininng to think she wil not be charged, but not because she is innocent. They did have a month to cover their tracks.

If she is never charged IMO does not prove her innocence.

When i was in my early 20's and partying. I had drivin my car under the influence (not proud of it mind you)

I was never charged with a DUI because I never got caught not because I was innocent!

We may just have to accept that IMO

Just sayin

moo [/*]

With all due respect, chance, I don't think that's a very good analogy.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 03:21 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

Not in so many words, granted. I've said "all BUT cleared" though others have said cleared as that is the way they interpret many statements. I interpret them that way as well. [/*]

So how do you interpret Ed Brown's words? :D

You know POSSIBLE?????

JMO.

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:23 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

So how do you interpret Ed Brown's words? :D

You know POSSIBLE?????

JMO. [/*]

I take it as "hey anything's possible." But surely not probable.

chance

04-16-2008, 03:29 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

With all due respect, chance, I don't think that's a very good analogy. [/*]

Maybe not, but it's true.

No charges does not equal innocent.

moo

alter ego

04-16-2008, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

FOR ME, it is the idea that she is not directly tied to the murder of Maria, but that leaves the door wide open for other kinds of involvement.

JMO.:( [/*]And that has been my inkling all along.....but it remains to be seen if that is the case.

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 03:37 PM

Let's deal with the facts.

1. Cesar Laurean has been charged and arrested.

2. Christina Laurean has not.

Kim

04-16-2008, 03:41 PM

Originally posted by cuppajoe
Let's deal with the facts.

1. Cesar Laurean has been charged and arrested.

2. Christina Laurean has not. [/*]

I need to see facts that are comprehensable.Which is why I thought we were discussing the case? :shrug: Working out everyones theory.Including the popular one (the one that makes sense) just saying...........:rolleyes:

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 03:43 PM

Originally posted by Kim

I need to see facts that are comprehensable.Which is why I thought we were discussing the case? :shrug: Working out everyones theory.Including the popular one (the one that makes sense) just saying...........:rolleyes: [/*]

The "popular" one.......that "makes sense"? Pray tell, what one is that? Puhleeze don't say the one that says Christina is the murderer. That doesn't make sense to me.

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 03:56 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

I take it as "hey anything's possible." But surely not probable. [/*]

I think everyone associated with working this case is understandably disinclined to speak in absolutes.

I also think that in the 3 months since Maria's body was discovered burned & buried in the Laurean backyard that if LE had discovered anything to indicate that Christina committed a crime, they would have charged her by now.

Diana Zamora & David Graham forgot alllllll about how much they 'loved' one another after they were each arrested. If there was evidence to charge Christina, it would make sense to have done so before now. Divide & conquer has worked real well on many other cases & I have no doubt it would have done the same IF Christina had done anything worth arresting her over.

JMO

cuppajoe

04-16-2008, 03:56 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

The "popular" one.......that "makes sense"? Pray tell, what one is that? Puhleeze don't say the one that says Christina is the murderer. That doesn't make sense to me. [/*]

Maybe the popular one that had Christina Laurean killing Cesar Laurean? Can we disregard that one now?

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 04:02 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

I think everyone associated with working this case is understandably disinclined to speak in absolutes.

I also think that in the 3 months since Maria's body was discovered burned & buried in the Laurean backyard that if LE had discovered anything to indicate that Christina committed a crime, they would have charged her by now.

Diana Zamora & David Graham forgot alllllll about how much they 'loved' one another after they were each arrested. If there was evidence to charge Christina, it would make sense to have done so before now. Divide & conquer has worked real well on many other cases & I have no doubt it would have done the same IF Christina had done anything worth arresting her over.

JMO [/*]

Yup. I agree. And, BTW, been reading your posts catching up today and they are excellent! IMO.

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 04:17 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze
I was reading some articles over on Jacksonville Daily News and thought this was an interesting statement made by Hudson.

District Attorney Dewey Hudson said the Marine Corps was waiting to receive Laurean's DNA, and he knew military authorities were holding off testing any other possible father for Lauterbach's unborn baby.

So does the MC know of "any other possible father"? They must have some inkling or idea if they are going to see if Laurean is the father and if not they will be testing others as the possible father.:shrug:

imo [/*]

That is interesting, ITA. Maria did retract her previous claim that CAL was the father sometime in November, right? Maybe they are just tying up loose ends, or leaving room for the possibility that he was not the father.

If so, what then? :confused:

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 04:20 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

I think everyone associated with working this case is understandably disinclined to speak in absolutes.

I also think that in the 3 months since Maria's body was discovered burned & buried in the Laurean backyard that if LE had discovered anything to indicate that Christina committed a crime, they would have charged her by now.

Diana Zamora & David Graham forgot alllllll about how much they 'loved' one another after they were each arrested. If there was evidence to charge Christina, it would make sense to have done so before now. Divide & conquer has worked real well on many other cases & I have no doubt it would have done the same IF Christina had done anything worth arresting her over.

JMO [/*]

Actually, that's not quite true regarding David Graham and Diane Zamora. They were sneaking love notes and letters to each other long after they were arrested. Diane, especially.

During their trials, they each pointed the finger at the other, but neither ever said the other wasn't there. In fact, they both were there.

It was only after the trials started that they "broke up".

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 04:21 PM

Originally posted by Marcia3

That is interesting, ITA. Maria did retract her previous claim that CAL was the father sometime in November, right? Maybe they are just tying up loose ends, or leaving room for the possibility that he was not the father.

If so, what then? :confused: [/*]

Exactly! :eek:

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 04:23 PM

Lynn Gweeny

04-16-2008, 04:34 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

Do we know that she ever claimed he was the father? Or did she just never say that he wasn't until 11/5?

To the MC, that is. [/*]

This is from the MC press conference of 1/15/2008:

@ 30:00 (Question: If the conception date was May, who did she ever indicate who she thought the father might be?) That’s part of an ongoing investigation. We’re not going to disclose that information right now.

http://www.jdnews.com/video/index.php?bcpid=1156002469&bclid=1155200144&bctid=1379594756

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 04:35 PM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

Maybe the popular one that had Christina Laurean killing Cesar Laurean? Can we disregard that one now? [/*]

Well, you sure can. :D

jmo

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by Lynn Gweeny

This is from the MC press conference of 1/15/2008:

@ 30:00 (Question: If the conception date was May, who did she ever indicate who she thought the father might be?) That’s part of an ongoing investigation. We’re not going to disclose that information right now.

http://www.jdnews.com/video/index.php?bcpid=1156002469&bclid=1155200144&bctid=1379594756 [/*]

But that would be after she was told the conception date was May as opposed to April or March.

Prior to that I was under the impression as was her MOTHER that she was saying the pregnancy was a result of the alleged rape.

Are you thinking this is untrue?

jmo:confused:

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

Exactly! :eek: [/*]

Between the speculation that Maria was pregnant with a different man's child & the speculation that Christina is or was pregnant when Maria was murdered, it's enough to make your head spin, isn't it?

I'm going to need a supply of smelling salts & an old-fashioned fainting couch by the time we get the actual details on who was doing what with whom in which location. Whew.

Lynn Gweeny

04-16-2008, 04:46 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

But that would be after she was told the conception date was May as opposed to April or March.

Prior to that I was under the impression as was her MOTHER that she was saying the pregnancy was a result of the alleged rape.

Are you thinking this is untrue?

jmo:confused: [/*]

This also from the MC press conference on 1/15/2007:

@ 7:50 thru 9:00 in the video

Re: Maria readjusting her statement on November 5th:

Colonel Sokoloski: When the prosecutor was interviewing LCpl Lauterbach in preparation for a possible preferral of charges, they were talking about obviously the sequence of events and the evidence. And, in these cases, obviously the credibility of the witnesses are critical and corroborating the witness’ statements are very critical. And going over the timeline with respect to the information that was provided from medical examinations, at one point in time, LCpl Lauterbach told the prosecutor that she no longer believed that the pregnancy was the result of the sexual assault incidents around the 26th of March or the 11th of April.

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 04:46 PM

hinman

04-16-2008, 04:48 PM

Originally posted by Lynn Gweeny

This also from the MC press conference on 1/15/2007:

@ 7:50 thru 9:00 in the video

Re: Maria readjusting her statement on November 5th:

Colonel Sokoloski: When the prosecutor was interviewing LCpl Lauterbach in preparation for a possible preferral of charges, they were talking about obviously the sequence of events and the evidence. And, in these cases, obviously the credibility of the witnesses are critical and corroborating the witness’ statements are very critical. And going over the timeline with respect to the information that was provided from medical examinations, at one point in time, LCpl Lauterbach told the prosecutor that she no longer believed that the pregnancy was the result of the sexual assault incidents around the 26th of March or the 11th of April. [/*]Isn't it this the statement that the spokesperson for the MC said Maria did however, still believe that CL was the father.

edited: I just can't get my spelling downhammer

baywench

04-16-2008, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

:biggrin: How 'bout another cuppajoe?

She is not CHARGED AT THIS TIME WITH A CRIME.

JMO. [/*]

Clean house please....taps foot

sunstar

04-16-2008, 05:04 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze
I was reading some articles over on Jacksonville Daily News and thought this was an interesting statement made by Hudson.

District Attorney Dewey Hudson said the Marine Corps was waiting to receive Laurean's DNA, and he knew military authorities were holding off testing any other possible father for Lauterbach's unborn baby.

So does the MC know of "any other possible father"? They must have some inkling or idea if they are going to see if Laurean is the father and if not they will be testing others as the possible father.:shrug:

imo [/*]
Good afternoon :seeya: This IS interesting. I didn't think they believed there was anyone else but there must be someone in mind since they can't test everyone on base.

baywench

04-16-2008, 05:08 PM

Originally posted by sunstar

Good afternoon :seeya: This IS interesting. I didn't think they believed there was anyone else but there must be someone in mind since they can't test everyone on base. [/*]

Does anyone remember if JR said the ex-boyfriend was a marine? I think he was but I don't remember for sure.

sunstar

04-16-2008, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by baywench

Does anyone remember if JR said the ex-boyfriend was a marine? I think he was but I don't remember for sure. [/*]
Sorry I don't remember, but if he was, I wonder when he got out and what his rank was?

IvySterling

04-16-2008, 05:12 PM

Originally posted by baywench

Does anyone remember if JR said the ex-boyfriend was a marine? I think he was but I don't remember for sure. [/*]
Yes, he's USMC and has a MySpace page!

strick10

04-16-2008, 05:12 PM

Originally posted by baywench

Does anyone remember if JR said the ex-boyfriend was a marine? I think he was but I don't remember for sure. [/*]

Hey bay...yes Marias ex is/was a Marine but by the time Maria got pregnant they weren't together, hadn't been together for a few months. IIRC he was transferred a little after they broke up.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by cuppajoe

Maybe the popular one that had Christina Laurean killing Cesar Laurean? Can we disregard that one now? [/*]

:lol: I remember that one.

sunstar

04-16-2008, 05:29 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Hey bay...yes Marias ex is/was a Marine but by the time Maria got pregnant they weren't together, hadn't been together for a few months. IIRC he was transferred a little after they broke up. [/*]
Thanks :) that eliminates him!

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 05:33 PM

Originally posted by Lynn Gweeny

This also from the MC press conference on 1/15/2007:

@ 7:50 thru 9:00 in the video

Re: Maria readjusting her statement on November 5th:

Colonel Sokoloski: When the prosecutor was interviewing LCpl Lauterbach in preparation for a possible preferral of charges, they were talking about obviously the sequence of events and the evidence. And, in these cases, obviously the credibility of the witnesses are critical and corroborating the witness’ statements are very critical. And going over the timeline with respect to the information that was provided from medical examinations, at one point in time, LCpl Lauterbach told the prosecutor that she no longer believed that the pregnancy was the result of the sexual assault incidents around the 26th of March or the 11th of April. [/*]

Okay, so that substantiates she told them the pregnancy was a result of the alleged rape.

Then on November 5th when presented with a different date, she said the pregnancy was not the result of her allegations.

So what are we questioning?

I don't think she was required to reveal paternity if not to do with the alleged assaults, correct?

I must be slow on the draw and missing something. Can you make this one simple? TIA. :D

jmo

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 05:35 PM

Originally posted by baywench

Clean house please....taps foot [/*]

Done, can you hammer it in, if I am running in slow motion today?

strick10

04-16-2008, 05:36 PM

Originally posted by sunstar

Thanks :) that eliminates him! [/*]

I think Cesar thought the baby was his til the very end. He may have not known that Maria had told NCIS that the baby wasn't a product of the alleged rape. Even if NCIS could not prove the alleged rape they were aiming to bring other charges with the DNA. NCIS knew that if the baby was due in mid-Feb as the Naval Hospital docs had stated. Proving that the baby wasn't a product of the alleged rape. Why would they still be waiting for the birth of the baby......because IMO Maria and CAL had a consensual encounter in May right before she reported the alleged rape. NCIS was going to get them both for lying and whatever else. Orrr... they were waiting for the birth of the baby in Feb to prove without a doubt that the baby wasn't the product of the alleged rape. JMO

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 05:41 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Okay, so that substantiates she told them the pregnancy was a result of the alleged rape.

Then on November 5th when presented with a different date, she said the pregnancy was not the result of her allegations.

So what are we questioning?

I don't think she was required to reveal paternity if not to do with the alleged assaults, correct?

I must be slow on the draw and missing something. Can you make this one simple? TIA. :D

jmo [/*]

Oh no, you're not slow. Lynn was responding to a question that I had about whether or not Maria ever told the MC definitively that Cesar was the father or did she just say he wasn't the father after the re-adjusted statement.

IOW, did she ever lead the MC or her mother to believe or think that anyone else *could* have been the father?

And now that you're thoroughly confused, I'll return you to your regular programming!

:D

sunstar

04-16-2008, 05:46 PM

Originally posted by strick10

I think Cesar thought the baby was his til the very end. He may have not known that Maria had told NCIS that the baby wasn't a product of the alleged rape. Even if NCIS could not prove the alleged rape they were aiming to bring other charges with the DNA. NCIS knew that if the baby was due in mid-Feb as the Naval Hospital docs had stated that the baby wasn't a product of the alleged rape. Why would they still be waiting for the birth of the baby......because IMO Maria and CAL had a consensual encounter in May right before she reported the alleged rape. NCIS was going to get them both for lying and whatever else. JMO [/*]
I think you might very well be right on. The due date definitely doesn't fit in with the date of the alleged rape, but the timing of her reporting it coincides with the approximate time she became pregnant. I agree that neither was off the hook with the NCIS.

strick10

04-16-2008, 05:51 PM

Originally posted by sunstar

I think you might very well be right on. The due date definitely doesn't fit in with the date of the alleged rape, but the timing of her reporting it coincides with the approximate time she became pregnant. I agree that neither was off the hook with the NCIS. [/*]

But......I wonder if NCIS had the right to test the babies DNA after the possible due dates that would coincide w/ the alleged rapes had passed. I mean the alleged rapes were the basis of the investigation what really would they gain by waiting to collect DNA in Feb. Just the delivery alone would prove the baby wasn't the product of the alleged rape. Crazy I tell ya. Wish I knew a military legal eagle.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 05:57 PM

IIRC the MC were scheduling a hearing in December that Maria was going to testify at. That leads me to believe they knew the baby's due date and it wasn't in February. I believe the end of December. That's when Mary was going to be with her daughter also.

imo

sunstar

04-16-2008, 06:00 PM

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 06:01 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

Oh no, you're not slow. Lynn was responding to a question that I had about whether or not Maria ever told the MC definitively that Cesar was the father or did she just say he wasn't the father after the re-adjusted statement.

IOW, did she ever lead the MC or her mother to believe or think that anyone else *could* have been the father?

And now that you're thoroughly confused, I'll return you to your regular programming!

:D [/*]

Didn't we know this part?:D

I think this case might turn out to be more like the guy who got out of prison after thirteen years and his woman was more than just a little knowledgable. JMO tho....:o

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by sunstar

A due date at the end of December would put the conception in, what, March? How come then she tested negative in May? :confused: [/*]

False negative. It happens. imo

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box
IIRC the MC were scheduling a hearing in December that Maria was going to testify at. That leads me to believe they knew the baby's due date and it wasn't in February. I believe the end of December. That's when Mary was going to be with her daughter also.

imo [/*]

Yes Squawk I remember that. That's probably why Maria wanted to leave and I don't think her mother may have been aware of the hearing date IMO. I think Marys intent was to visit Maria at that time as Maria couldn't go home for the holidays or whatever but I don't think it was due to the hearing. I believe Mary would've stated by now that that was the purpose of her visit, the hearing. Now if the hearing was scheduled during the time Mary was suppose to be there and Mary was unaware of the hearing it may explain even more so as to why Maria wanted to leave.

That hearing would've had both of them under oath and everything would be laid out to determine what or if any charges would be filed.

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:06 PM

Originally posted by Mystical
Who is to say that Maria wasn't fully intimidated in November and changed her story because of that. Her uncle at some point expressed this iirc.

Also, under what provisions would le or the mc have for testing anyone for paternity except CL? [/*]

Don't you need a babies DNA to compare? Not being rude, your last sentence makes it sound you only need one person tested.

alter ego

04-16-2008, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by Mystical

I tend to agree with you. Very suspicious that she is murdered right before this hearing. [/*]
And Cesar all worried about the MC railroading him on a rape charge....

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by strick10

I think Cesar thought the baby was his til the very end. He may have not known that Maria had told NCIS that the baby wasn't a product of the alleged rape. Even if NCIS could not prove the alleged rape they were aiming to bring other charges with the DNA. NCIS knew that if the baby was due in mid-Feb as the Naval Hospital docs had stated. Proving that the baby wasn't a product of the alleged rape. Why would they still be waiting for the birth of the baby......because IMO Maria and CAL had a consensual encounter in May right before she reported the alleged rape. NCIS was going to get them both for lying and whatever else. Orrr... they were waiting for the birth of the baby in Feb to prove without a doubt that the baby wasn't the product of the alleged rape. JMO [/*]

I think you are probably right.

imoo

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by Mystical

I tend to agree with you. Very suspicious that she is murdered right before this hearing. [/*]

Not suspicious really Mystical. CAL didn't want that baby born, I think he knew or really thought that baby was his. If she went there the 2nd time on the 14th to tell CAL the baby wasn't his his he was home free. He knew or thought that baby was his and I know he knows how to count so they had to have relations in May IMO.

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Not suspicious really Mystical. CAL didn't want that baby born, I think he knew or really thought that baby was his. If she went there the 2nd time on the 14th to tell CAL the baby wasn't his his he was home free. He knew or thought that baby was his and I know he knows how to count so they had to have relations in May IMO. [/*]

I'll never understand why she went over there in the first place. And if she went there to tell him that he wasn't the father, that she had tried to drop the rape case but wasn't successful and she was leaving....remind me again what his motive is?

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by alter ego

And Cesar all worried about the MC railroading him on a rape charge.... [/*]

I don't think he thinks the MC would railroad him on the rape charge but I may be wrong. I don't understand how he could even be concerned about the rape when it is thought he committed the worst kind of crime known to mankind. I think he's more afraid of what will happen if he has to spend the rest of his life in Leavenworth working his rear off and in a military setting. Probably more afraid of the inmates though.....

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 06:20 PM

Originally posted by strick10

I don't think he thinks the MC would railroad him on the rape charge but I may be wrong. I don't understand how he could even be concerned about the rape when it is thought he committed the worst kind of crime known to mankind. I think he's more afraid of what will happen if he has to spend the rest of his life in Leavenworth working his rear off and in a military setting. Probably more afraid of the inmates though..... [/*]

But why would he worry about Leavenworth with the state charges of murder? He would not be going to Leavenworth on those charges. He will go to the state pen. He is going to have to worry about inmates in any prison. jmo

sunstar

04-16-2008, 06:21 PM

caejde

04-16-2008, 06:21 PM

I do not believe Maria's due date was in December. I believe wholeheartedly her due date was in February. According to the Naval Hospital at Camp Lejeune, women with normal pregnancies are seen every 6 weeks until 28 weeks (7 months). At this point women are then seen every 4 weeks until they reach 36 weeks (9 months). From 36 weeks until delivery you are seen every week. So Maria had her appointment 11/26...her next scheduled appointment was 12/26--4 weeks later. So that tells me that Mary was probably 28 weeks on 11/26 and would have only been 32 weeks on 12/26. Also, a dating sonogram is done at or before 12 weeks--these are more accurate than the later sonogram that the Naval Hospital does between 22-24 weeks. So my guess is that when she had her first OB visit, she had a dating sonogram. Based on that and her LMP they gave her a due date of February.

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:22 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

I'll never understand why she went over there in the first place. And if she went there to tell him that he wasn't the father, that she had tried to drop the rape case but wasn't successful and she was leaving....remind me again what his motive is? [/*]

Under those circumstances there would be no motive. Baby not his.....well then there's nothing to charge him with now is there. Since the LE is saying there's proof of a struggle in the L's home I wonder if Maria left any bruises, scratch or bite marks on CAL. Incredible that almost a month after Maria was killed that LE could still tell there had been a struggle. Sure wish I knew how they can tell that it'd be interesting to know.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Under those circumstances there would be no motive. Baby not his.....well then there's nothing to charge him with now is there. Since the LE is saying there's proof of a struggle in the L's home I wonder if Maria left any bruises, scratch or bite marks on CAL. Incredible that almost a month after Maria was killed that LE could still tell there had been a struggle. Sure wish I knew how they can tell that it'd be interesting to know. [/*]

Blood evidence. They lit up the struggle with luminol. imo

caejde

04-16-2008, 06:26 PM

Originally posted by Mystical

strick10 I didn't take your response as rude at all, I'm not thin skinned. You're right of course, the baby's dna is required.

I was just pointing out that I don't think there is any legal basis to test any other marine. [/*]

I don't think so either...I mean unless she told NCIS who could be the father. But then if she did that I dont' think they'd want Cesar's DNA. Besides, if Cesar is not the father, who's to say it was a Marine...could have very well been someone she met in town. Not like they can test every single male here in Jacksonville.

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:27 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

But why would he worry about Leavenworth with the state charges of murder? He would not be going to Leavenworth on those charges. He will go to the state pen. He is going to have to worry about inmates in any prison. jmo [/*]

You're right Squawk he wouldn't be going to Leavenworth on murder charges. From what I understand, Leavenworth is different from state prisons. I'm going to have to research before I say anything about the conditions in Leavenworth. Maybe in a civilian prison he can join a gang that will protect him? Either way he's in deep kimshee!

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 06:28 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Under those circumstances there would be no motive. Baby not his.....well then there's nothing to charge him with now is there. Since the LE is saying there's proof of a struggle in the L's home I wonder if Maria left any bruises, scratch or bite marks on CAL. Incredible that almost a month after Maria was killed that LE could still tell there had been a struggle. Sure wish I knew how they can tell that it'd be interesting to know. [/*]

Well, he was wearing long sleeves in the Lowe's video, as opposed to his friend in the t-shirt.

Oh wait, he must not have had bruises 'cause Christina never saw anything.

:D

strick10

04-16-2008, 06:28 PM

Originally posted by caejde

I don't think so either...I mean unless she told NCIS who could be the father. But then if she did that I dont' think they'd want Cesar's DNA. Besides, if Cesar is not the father, who's to say it was a Marine...could have very well been someone she met in town. Not like they can test every single male here in Jacksonville. [/*]

And why not? :biggrin:

Be back in about an hour.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 06:30 PM

Originally posted by sunstar

A due date at the end of December would put the conception in, what, March? How come then she tested negative in May? :confused: [/*]

Everyone is wrong but Christina Sun, keep up.

barf

Maybe, because she wasn't pregnant yet. JMOOC. ;)

I think the walls were caving in and Maria had to get out of there. IMO her mother was coming and would find out about a relationship at some point. Remember Mary was on the record saying they didn't even have a social relationship. But Mary has bounced all over the place with knowing this and not knowing that.

In the narrative of the SW I believe she told the Vandalia LE that there was no stress, but then there was.

Maria said he was popular according to Mary when talking to the Dayton reporter, but now with MW by her side, she didn't even like him.

I don't know how that bodes with a consensual sexual encounter in March either..... Goodness, all this will be read back at some point IMO.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 06:31 PM

caejde

04-16-2008, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

Well, he was wearing long sleeves in the Lowe's video, as opposed to his friend in the t-shirt.

Oh wait, he must not have had bruises 'cause Christina never saw anything.

:D [/*]

And December is the time of year when wearing cammies sleeves are down. So he very well could have had bruises, scratches or something on him.

CANDYKISSES

04-16-2008, 06:37 PM

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 06:40 PM

Originally posted by strick10

You're right Squawk he wouldn't be going to Leavenworth on murder charges. From what I understand, Leavenworth is different from state prisons. I'm going to have to research before I say anything about the conditions in Leavenworth. Maybe in a civilian prison he can join a gang that will protect him? Either way he's in deep kimshee! [/*]

Yes, he is. I always heard federal prisons like Leavenworth are like summer camps. That's were all the mafia went when they were caught on tax evasion. jmo

sunstar

04-16-2008, 06:42 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Everyone is wrong but Christina Sun, keep up.

barf

Maybe, because she wasn't pregnant yet. JMOOC. ;)

I think the walls were caving in and Maria had to get out of there. IMO her mother was coming and would find out about a relationship at some point. Remember Mary was on the record saying they didn't even have a social relationship. But Mary has bounced all over the place with knowing this and not knowing that.

In the narrative of the SW I believe she told the Vandalia LE that there was no stress, but then there was.

Maria said he was popular according to Mary when talking to the Dayton reporter, but now with MW by her side, she didn't even like him.

I don't know how that bodes with a consensual sexual encounter in March either..... Goodness, all this will be read back at some point IMO. [/*]
Oh, my bad ~ how could I forget your first point! :biggrin: Now, as for the rest, I agree. Mary's planned visit to Maria the following weekend seems to be something almost forgotten about and could be part of the reason Maria chose to buy the bus ticket for the 15th. It seemed she didn't want to give up her baby, and even more so if it wasn't the product of rape but of a consensual relationship. MOO

marinewife5

04-16-2008, 06:44 PM

Originally posted by caejde
I do not believe Maria's due date was in December. I believe wholeheartedly her due date was in February. According to the Naval Hospital at Camp Lejeune, women with normal pregnancies are seen every 6 weeks until 28 weeks (7 months). At this point women are then seen every 4 weeks until they reach 36 weeks (9 months). From 36 weeks until delivery you are seen every week. So Maria had her appointment 11/26...her next scheduled appointment was 12/26--4 weeks later. So that tells me that Mary was probably 28 weeks on 11/26 and would have only been 32 weeks on 12/26. Also, a dating sonogram is done at or before 12 weeks--these are more accurate than the later sonogram that the Naval Hospital does between 22-24 weeks. So my guess is that when she had her first OB visit, she had a dating sonogram. Based on that and her LMP they gave her a due date of February. [/*]

ITA (except Maria, not Mary). I think she was worried that the DNA test would prove the child was Cesars and it would prove there was sexual contact after the alleged rape, which would have had the both of them in hot water. And unless someone else has stepped up and said they may be the father, I can't see NCIS having men line up to give a swab(that is, if Cesar is not the father) JMO

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

Well, he was wearing long sleeves in the Lowe's video, as opposed to his friend in the t-shirt.

Oh wait, he must not have had bruises 'cause Christina never saw anything.

:D [/*]

Actually we have not heard that she did not specifically see bruises, did we? (Though I know you're being facetious.) As a matter of fact, maybe she did see bruises but he came up with a reasonable explanation for them. Maybe she (and perhaps others) have by now told LE about these bruises, in response to questioning. And that may be one of the reasons they are convinced Cesar murdered Maria.

Sorta like SB has mentioned before.....you see something that doesn't register as very odd at the time, but later you put pieces together.

See how it works? Any type of scenario is possible, since there is so much we don't know and that LE has kept under wraps.

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 06:47 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Under those circumstances there would be no motive. Baby not his..... [/*]

<snipped>

Since the board is tolerating every possible theory - let's take into consideration the "I loved her" statement from Cesar & look at this theory. . .

Cesar believed the child WAS his, Cesar WAS making plans to hit the road with Maria - but she showed up at his house, baby clothes in hands & said " The baby daddy is REALLY so-and-so's, not YOU."

He flew into a rage at the thought that some other dude was intimate with this woman he "loved" - & killed her.

(not saying I believe this theory, mind you)

sunstar

04-16-2008, 06:49 PM

See you all in a couple of hours after I get home & check the news ~ :seeya:

SavannahStar

04-16-2008, 06:49 PM

marinewife5

04-16-2008, 06:53 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Yes, he is. I always heard federal prisons like Leavenworth are like summer camps. That's were all the mafia went when they were caught on tax evasion. jmo [/*]

I have a friend who was a guard at that prison. It's no summer camp. And a Marine in a federal prison full of military prisoners from killing another Marine? He would long for the days of the cabin in Mexico. jmo

Howiefan

04-16-2008, 07:00 PM

Originally posted by alter ego

And Cesar all worried about the MC railroading him on a rape charge.... [/*]
I think if he did not rape her he would not have been so afraid of being accused of rape..
jmo

crymeariver2006

04-16-2008, 07:01 PM

Originally posted by caejde

And December is the time of year when wearing cammies sleeves are down. So he very well could have had bruises, scratches or something on him. [/*]

IIRC, he wasn't wearing cammies. At least not the shirt or jacket. As I recall, it looked like a windbreaker type jacket.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 07:08 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

<snipped>

Since the board is tolerating every possible theory - let's take into consideration the "I loved her" statement from Cesar & look at this theory. . .

Cesar believed the child WAS his, Cesar WAS making plans to hit the road with Maria - but she showed up at his house, baby clothes in hands & said " The baby daddy is REALLY so-and-so's, not YOU."

He flew into a rage at the thought that some other dude was intimate with this woman he "loved" - & killed her.

(not saying I believe this theory, mind you) [/*]

The only thing about that theory though to me if she was that bullish and came there to taunt him...I just don't see her playing with fire and doing that. It seems she would have just left him twisting in the wind.

Why would she care what he thought or knew. She was leaving it all behind and he could think what the heck he wanted to think. She wouldn't be there to care one way or the other.

I just feel there was a close connection between the two of them somehow. They both were in on the El Paso destination she was going to take imo. Now something went terribly wrong that is for certain when she returned to his home and told him her plans had fallen through. I think they got into a very heated argument and he struck her. I don't think he struck her multiple times because the ME did not say she died from multiple blunt force trauma.

imoo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 07:11 PM

Originally posted by marinewife5

I have a friend who was a guard at that prison. It's no summer camp. And a Marine in a federal prison full of military prisoners from killing another Marine? He would long for the days of the cabin in Mexico. jmo [/*]

I can see that. Funny, I never thought of military prisoners being there.

I always thought of white collar prisoners that were there for tax problems or inside trading or things like that.

Sad to think of any military person being in prison. Except for Cesar.

I guess back in the old days the mafia that were there could buy their way to a summer camp atmosphere.

imo

Marcia3

04-16-2008, 07:12 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

The only thing about that theory though to me if she was that bullish and came there to taunt him...I just don't see her playing with fire and doing that. It seems she would have just left him twisting in the wind.

Why would she care what he thought or knew. She was leaving it all behind and he could think what the heck he wanted to think. She wouldn't be there to care one way or the other.

I just feel there was a close connection between the two of them somehow. They both were in on the El Paso destination she was going to take imo. Now something went terribly wrong that is for certain when she returned to his home and told him her plans had fallen through. I think they got into a very heated argument and he struck her. I don't think he struck her multiple times because the ME did not say she died from multiple blunt force trauma.

imoo [/*]

IMO it all goes back to the "catalyst" that occurred during their last meeting...obviously something happened to set off this chain of events that led to murder. An argument is definitely a possibility, IMO.

marinewife5

04-16-2008, 07:14 PM

Originally posted by Howiefan

I think if he did not rape her he would not have been so afraid of being accused of rape..
jmo [/*]

As I understood the email, he was afraid of being convicted without evidence. Not just being convicted. And I'm not certain he was referring to the rape allegation. JMO

alter ego

04-16-2008, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Yes, he is. I always heard federal prisons like Leavenworth are like summer camps. That's were all the mafia went when they were caught on tax evasion. jmo [/*]There are 4 prisons in Leavenworth...a Federal Prison, a State prison, a private prison (used to hold US Marshall held personnel waiting trial)....and the United States Disciplinary Barracks for the military - notorious for 'hard time'.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by GentleBreeze

The only thing about that theory though to me if she was that bullish and came there to taunt him...I just don't see her playing with fire and doing that. It seems she would have just left him twisting in the wind.

Why would she care what he thought or knew. She was leaving it all behind and he could think what the heck he wanted to think. She wouldn't be there to care one way or the other.

I just feel there was a close connection between the two of them somehow. They both were in on the El Paso destination she was going to take imo. Now something went terribly wrong that is for certain when she returned to his home and told him her plans had fallen through. I think they got into a very heated argument and he struck her. I don't think he struck her multiple times because the ME did not say she died from multiple blunt force trauma.

imoo [/*]

Maybe she didn't go there to see Cesar.
Maybe she went there to see Christina.
Maybe she figured Cesar wasn't even there.

Maybe she wanted to inform Christina once and for all what she had married. To tell her she was raped and the baby was his. She was leaving anyway so why not?

I find it hard to believe she would go there if she knew Cesar was there and especially if she knew he was there alone.

JMO

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 07:19 PM

Originally posted by alter ego
There are 2 prisons in Leavenworth...one is the Federal Prison....the other is the United States Disciplinary Barracks for the military - notorious for 'hard time'. [/*]

Thanks for the info.

alter ego

04-16-2008, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Thanks for the info. [/*]

We have always heard that time at Ft Leavenworth military prison was spent breaking big rocks into little rocks.

Mimi428

04-16-2008, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

Yes, he is. I always heard federal prisons like Leavenworth are like summer camps. That's were all the mafia went when they were caught on tax evasion. jmo [/*]

There is a book entitled "The Hot House: Life inside Leavenworth Prison" - it is 20 years old now, but the during time period it covered Leavenworth was anything but a summer camp. I believe Leavenworth has changed from a maxiumum security prison to a medium security prison, but I can't swear to it.

Either way, I cannot think of any prison that could be described as a safe or a relatively easy place to be. Not for the staff, not for the inmates.

JMO

baywench

04-16-2008, 07:30 PM

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 07:31 PM

Originally posted by alter ego

We have always heard that time at Ft Leavenworth military prison was spent breaking big rocks into little rocks. [/*]

Oh my and Cesar being a stellar typist. I think he must have been afraid of getting blisters on his hands..:biggrin:

Leanne Weich

04-16-2008, 07:32 PM

caejde

04-16-2008, 07:34 PM

Originally posted by marinewife5

ITA (except Maria, not Mary). I think she was worried that the DNA test would prove the child was Cesars and it would prove there was sexual contact after the alleged rape, which would have had the both of them in hot water. And unless someone else has stepped up and said they may be the father, I can't see NCIS having men line up to give a swab(that is, if Cesar is not the father) JMO [/*]

Whoops...yes I did mean Maria.

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 07:35 PM

Originally posted by baywench

Maybe rage for what she had put them through? [/*]

That is certainly a possibility. A meltdown due to the months and months of stress and tension.

imo

caejde

04-16-2008, 07:35 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

IIRC, he wasn't wearing cammies. At least not the shirt or jacket. As I recall, it looked like a windbreaker type jacket. [/*]

I meant like at work. If there were bruises on his arms, cammie sleeves would have been down so no coworkers would have seen them.

IvySterling

04-16-2008, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

IIRC, he wasn't wearing cammies. At least not the shirt or jacket. As I recall, it looked like a windbreaker type jacket. [/*]
Sweatshirt
http://i28.tinypic.com/2elcf8j.jpg

caejde

04-16-2008, 07:40 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

There is a book entitled "The Hot House: Life inside Leavenworth Prison" - it is 20 years old now, but the during time period it covered Leavenworth was anything but a summer camp. I believe Leavenworth has changed from a maxiumum security prison to a medium security prison, but I can't swear to it.

Either way, I cannot think of any prison that could be described as a safe or a relatively easy place to be. Not for the staff, not for the inmates.

JMO [/*]

Still a maximum security prison.

nuttintodo

04-16-2008, 07:43 PM

I can go along with Squawk's theory except for the part of being raped and informing Christina what she had married. Even if you don't believe Ms. Renner, you also heard 'Lisa' say they had been involved.

IMO, CAL had probably told Maria that he was going to leave his wife for her and the baby and for her to go purchase her ticket to El Paso. Who knows if CAL purchased a ticket to El Paso but I have a feeling that CAL may have tried to back out after Maria bought her ticket (saying perhaps, after Maria told him the bus was full and they couldn't leave that day). But somewhere along the way, CAL probably got cold feet and began to waffle trying to get out of leaving.

Maria probably got upset and was ready to confront CSL and say we're involved and he's leaving with me.

Then an argument ensued and Maria may or may not have thrown it at him, well you know this baby may not be yours.

But scenario happened, sadly Maria was killed by blunt force trauma then buried and charred in the backyard at Meadow Trail.

jmoo

strick10

04-16-2008, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by baywench

Maybe rage for what she had put them through? [/*]

Most probable......I think.

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 07:46 PM

I wonder which prison in NC he will go? I suppose there are more then one. Hope ii is maximum security.

nuttintodo

04-16-2008, 07:53 PM

IIRC, all adult males, AFTER conviction, are sent to Central in Raleigh for processing. Then after that, it's up the NCDOC as to where the prisoner is sent.

Rae Carruth and Michael Peterson are at Nash Correction. (just examples)

jmo

Squawk Box

04-16-2008, 07:54 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
I can go along with Squawk's theory except for the part of being raped and informing Christina what she had married. Even if you don't believe Ms. Renner, you also heard 'Lisa' say they had been involved.

IMO, CAL had probably told Maria that he was going to leave his wife for her and the baby and for her to go purchase her ticket to El Paso. Who knows if CAL purchased a ticket to El Paso but I have a feeling that CAL may have tried to back out after Maria bought her ticket (saying perhaps, after Maria told him the bus was full and they couldn't leave that day). But somewhere along the way, CAL probably got cold feet and began to waffle trying to get out of leaving.

Maria probably got upset and was ready to confront CSL and say we're involved and he's leaving with me.

Then an argument ensued and Maria may or may not have thrown it at him, well you know this baby may not be yours.

But scenario happened, sadly Maria was killed by blunt force trauma then buried and charred in the backyard at Meadow Trail.

jmoo [/*]

I can't go along with that because if they had some sort of romantic relationship, I believe it was very short lived when Maria found out he was married and dumped him. I believe he got mad and obsessive and forced her into sex twice.

There was no relationship after that for sure.

When Maria was there to see Christina and wouldn't leave until she saw her, he killed her.

He would never give up his Marine career for anyone and never were there any plans to leave together.

jmo

strick10

04-16-2008, 08:01 PM

Rick Sutherland Says:

April 15th, 2008 at 10:11 pm

I am not sure at what point OCSD/NCIS had contact with Maria’s biological parents. The homicide investigators would know if they had information material to the case and make contact with them at the appropriate time. I can not answer for NCIS.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=60

Why would NCIS contact Marias bio parents. Could they be the ones in El Paso?

GentleBreeze

04-16-2008, 08:05 PM

Originally posted by Squawk Box

I can't go along with that because if they had some sort of romantic relationship, I believe it was very short lived when Maria found out he was married and dumped him. I believe he got mad and obsessive and forced her into sex twice.

There was no relationship after that for sure.

When Maria was there to see Christina and wouldn't leave until she saw her, he killed her.

He would never give up his Marine career for anyone and never were there any plans to leave together.

jmo [/*]

How do we know there was no relationship after that for sure?

imoo

Lynn Gweeny

04-16-2008, 08:06 PM

Missing Marine Manhunt video from January 2008

@ 1:10 in the video:

Correspondent Jeff Glor: Friends say that Lauterbach and Laurean, who is a married man, became more than friends early last year.

Melinda Artzer: “I knew there was some sort of involvement, but there was a period that she decided that it was a bad idea … that she decided that she wanted to put a stop to it”.

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=3708126n

nuttintodo

04-16-2008, 08:09 PM

Originally posted by strick10
Rick Sutherland Says:

April 15th, 2008 at 10:11 pm

<snipped>

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/?p=60

Why would NCIS contact Marias bio parents. Could they be the ones in El Paso? [/*]

Strick, I snipped out what RS said over there as CW posted earlier that we aren't to bring the words used at JDNews (and I take it also to mean Off the cuff, since they are copyrighted.

But I agree, why would NCIS want to contact her bio-parents. Didn't they give up their parental rights when Maria and Anne were adopted?

I would think if anyone makes contact with them, it should be Mary, Uncle Peter or some other member of the family, not NCIS.

As to the El Paso connection....that's another part of this inquiring puzzle.

jmo