Sat evening, 4/12

[daniel green]

Was the thread locked for length or are we locked up for the night?

TIA

[marinewife5]

I do not know.

[hinman]

Not sure but thanks for starting a new one.

[baywench]

Wow that's disorienting. I was right in the middle of an intelligent and well thought out post about the suicide comment being part of the packaging of Christina for public consumption when her reality defying claim she knew nothing is pushed. IMO

[donna]

:shrug:

I was answering a post, then nothing! I hope the board is not closed and CW will let us know if we did anything wrong!

[MoonFlwr]

It looks like a length issue, and not a 'closed for the night' issue.

I think! :)

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by hinman
Not sure but thanks for starting a new one. [/*]

156000 acres is more than 2 miles. jmo

[donna]

Originally posted by baywench
Wow that's disorienting. I was right in the middle of an intelligent and well thought out post about the suicide comment being part of the packaging of Christina for public consumption when her reality defying claim she knew nothing is pushed. IMO [/*]

Please post it, bay! When I heard that said in the PC, my mouth fell open!

[hinman]

Originally posted by marinewife5


156000 acres is more than 2 miles. jmo [/*]So they did not move her all the way across base.


Any way I did like there answer to the MPO issue. They did not advice her to get a civilian restraining order and they do not notify civilian LE that being said let me add this if she had told them she felt threatened or was being threatened they would of taking additional steps and advised her to get a civilian RO.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench
Wow that's disorienting. I was right in the middle of an intelligent and well thought out post about the suicide comment being part of the packaging of Christina for public consumption when her reality defying claim she knew nothing is pushed. IMO [/*]

Hate it when that happens...

And yeah that suidice comment appeared like generic packaging.

[daniel green]

nelkirk
Member

Registered: Apr 2008
Location:
Posts: 8

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by daniel green


ITA

A full 90% of all prisoners come back into our communities.

If only based on selfishness we should all want and demand rehabilitation, job training, drug/alcohol treatment, mental health care and education for our prisoners. [/*]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



II would SELF-PRESERVATION into that sentence

For a community to survive there is a constant need to treat and educate people as a deterrent to crime as well as preventing revolving door crimes committed when a criminal is released on parole and back into the community.
==============================================

Absolutely, Nelkirk.

Don't get me started on prevention. Except to say that for every 5 cents we spend on prevention, we could save a dollar on incarceration.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by hinman
I also found it interresting that Maria used her MPo to express her concern to command about attending formations and events with Laurean. [/*]

Seems it was always Maria who had to miss the formations and events (at least she's the only one mentioned to have in the letter) in order to not be around him, even though the order to stay away from her applied to him. He was ordered to stay 1000 feet from her, she had the option of being excused from his presence if he failed to be the one to stay away. Something about that just doesn't seem right. IMO

Neither one attended the Christmas party, though.

[baywench]

Originally posted by donna


Please post it, bay! When I heard that said in the PC, my mouth fell open! [/*]

The timing is so strange to me. She didn't send him money because she knew that was illegal is being served up IMO I think after the computer was confiscated they put the screws to her and in the next two weeks (with them monitoring) she was told not to agree to help him with money and all of a sudden, in a very short time he is contacting the sheriff and has less than a dollar in his pocket. Very quickly this story is becoming about her and it seems weird. I think she is being packaged as a victim for a reason IMO

[hinman]

Originally posted by daniel green
[
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Absolutely, Nelkirk.

Don't get me started on prevention. Except to say that for every 5 cents we spend on prevention, we could save a dollar on incarceration. [/*]Is that true? I was curious what the cost differential would be. I know it has got to cost a lot for all the rehabilitation you are talking about and I would have to consider the odds of rehab.

[daniel green]

So ML reported the alleged punch in the face and although she alleged bruising and swelling the marines could not find any.

And she reported the alleged keying of the car but could provide no information about that allegation and was told to report it to the Provost, but ML did not.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Just as I thought.

[hinman]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Seems it was always Maria who had to miss the formations and events (at least she's the only one mentioned to have in the letter) in order to not be around him, even though the order to stay away from her applied to him. He was ordered to stay 1000 feet from her, she had the option of being excused from his presence if he failed to be the one to stay away. Something about that just doesn't seem right. IMO

Neither one attended the Christmas party, though. [/*]I have to say your thoughts did go through my mind.

[hinman]

Originally posted by daniel green
So ML reported the alleged punch in the face and although she alleged bruising and swelling the marines could not find any.

And she reported the alleged keying of the car but could provide no information about that allegation and was told to report it to the Provost, but ML did not.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Just as I thought. [/*]To be fair daniel we do not know when they examined her. It was 5 days after the incident that her UVA reported it and then we do not know when the NCIS examined her after that to see if she had bruises.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by hinman
Is that true? I was curious what the cost differential would be. I know it has got to cost a lot for all the rehabilitation you are talking about and I would have to consider the odds of rehab. [/*]

Yep, it's true. Actually the treatment prisoner advocates and prison experts suggest wind up costing MUCH less that to keep somene incarcerated. Especially in the super-max prisons.

The cost of even intensive probation is less than a a quarter of incarcertaion.

http://www.doc.state.nc.us/DOP/cost/cost2001.htm

[baywench]

Originally posted by hinman
To be fair daniel we do not know when they examined her. It was 5 days after the incident that her UVA reported it and then we do not know when the NCIS examined her after that to see if she had bruises. [/*]


Wouldn't it be enough proof if the advocate had seen bruises? (I don't know if she did or didn't) JMO

[daniel green]

Well, good, there goes another theory posed on this board out the window.

As per the marines, ML was not facing a discharge for medical reasons.

[gaelicpeas]

I can't participate in the discussion about the MC response to the Congressman because I can't read pdf files on my home computer. Will read Monday at lunch.

(didnt want anybody to think I didn't like the responses :) )

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench



Wouldn't it be enough proof if the advocate had seen bruises? (I don't know if she did or didn't) JMO [/*]

Yep.

I don't know how someone gets punched in the face (particularly a woman who is punched in the face my a man) and there is no bruising or swelling, even a week afterwards.

[daniel green]

From the marine's response:

Positive pregnancy test on June 27, 07.


On Nov 5, ML told the Military prosecutor that she was certain that CL was not the father based on a recent OB-gyn visit and recalculation of conception date. ML told prosecutor there was no reason to get CL's DNA.

[donna]

Originally posted by baywench


The timing is so strange to me. She didn't send him money because she knew that was illegal is being served up IMO I think after the computer was confiscated they put the screws to her and in the next two weeks (with them monitoring) she was told not to agree to help him with money and all of a sudden, in a very short time he is contacting the sheriff and has less than a dollar in his pocket. Very quickly this story is becoming about her and it seems weird. I think she is being packaged as a victim for a reason IMO [/*]

ITA, bay!

[baywench]

Originally posted by daniel green


Yep.

I don't know how someone gets punched in the face (particularly a woman who is punched in the face my a man) and there is no bruising or swelling, even a week afterwards. [/*]

If you were already worried about being found credible why wouldn't you report it to the MP and why wouldn't you have someone take a picture for you? jmo

[MoonFlwr]

Originally posted by daniel green


Yep, it's true. Actually the treatment prisoner advocates and prison experts suggest wind up costing MUCH less that to keep somene incarcerated. Especially in the super-max prisons.

The cost of even intensive probation is less than a a quarter of incarcertaion.

http://www.doc.state.nc.us/DOP/cost/cost2001.htm [/*]

Wow! That was some interesting information! I did not know that!
I wonder how much rehab would be carried out during 'intensive probation'?

Thanks for the link, daniel green! :)

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by daniel green
nelkirk
Member

Registered: Apr 2008
Location:
Posts: 8

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by daniel green


ITA

A full 90% of all prisoners come back into our communities.

If only based on selfishness we should all want and demand rehabilitation, job training, drug/alcohol treatment, mental health care and education for our prisoners. [/*]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



II would SELF-PRESERVATION into that sentence

For a community to survive there is a constant need to treat and educate people as a deterrent to crime as well as preventing revolving door crimes committed when a criminal is released on parole and back into the community.
==============================================

Absolutely, Nelkirk.

Don't get me started on prevention. Except to say that for every 5 cents we spend on prevention, we could save a dollar on incarceration. [/*]

ITA

[daniel green]

Originally posted by MoonFlwr


Wow! That was some interesting information! I did not know that!
I wonder how much rehab would be carried out during 'intensive probation'?

Thanks for the link, daniel green! :) [/*]

A lot of rehab can be done in intensive probation because the probation can mandate any treatment, education, work, etc.

You are more than welcome.

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by baywench


The timing is so strange to me. She didn't send him money because she knew that was illegal is being served up IMO I think after the computer was confiscated they put the screws to her and in the next two weeks (with them monitoring) she was told not to agree to help him with money and all of a sudden, in a very short time he is contacting the sheriff and has less than a dollar in his pocket. Very quickly this story is becoming about her and it seems weird. I think she is being packaged as a victim for a reason IMO [/*]

So you think it's a big conspiracy, bay? :cool:

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench


If you were already worried about being found credible why wouldn't you report it to the MP and why wouldn't you have someone take a picture for you? jmo [/*]

No kidding.

Same as with the alleged keying incident.

BTW, why oh why can't I just copy and paste from this pdf file like I aways do????? :confused:

The marines explain the difference between "stellar" and "solid."

I am gonna guess that ML's family are not gonna be happy with the response. The old "don't answer a question you don't already know the answer to."

[nana2]

Originally posted by daniel green


No kidding.

Same as with the alleged keying incident.

BTW, why oh why can't I just copy and paste from this pdf file like I aways do????? :confused:

The marines explain the difference between "stellar" and "solid."

I am gonna guess that ML's family are not gonna be happy with the response. The old "don't answer a question you don't already know the answer to." [/*] oooo I missed that one what # is it??

[baywench]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


So you think it's a big conspiracy, bay? :cool: [/*]

Now now SS, I hate that word. I think Christina's in it up to her eyebrows and cut a deal with LE that (although it left a bad taste in their mouth) was their ticket to bringing him in (with all due respect to the maurauding Mexican LE) and now they have to package the goods and do some air-brushing before they put her on the stand. Listen to the Sheriff...he says it all if you listen closely. No, no conspiracy but maybe some reluctant bedfellows. JMO

[daniel green]

Originally posted by nana2
oooo I missed that one what # is it?? [/*]

Q28 on pg 9.

[nana2]

Originally posted by daniel green


Q28 on pg 9. [/*] thank you :seeya:

off to read :read:

[aubrey04]

I've read through all of your posts and couldn't keep up. There are some interesting theories being thrown out, which I won't discount until Laurean goes to trial and we see the evidence.. but I am not 100% sure that Christina was not involved in some fashion, but that's for the cops to explore - not me. I am VERY interested to know how long the emails between Christina and Cesar had been going on. We shall see.

A few people were debating the merits of sentencing and punishment. I would like to add what Nancy Grace has said several times.

She says that the purpose of jail/prison sentences is "three pronged":

1. Punishment
2. Rehabilitation
3. Deterrent

It's supposed to be a combination of all three prongs.


JMO

[daniel green]

"There was no evidentiary or evidentiary reason to obtain CL's dna."

[donna]

Christina did not have money to send Cesar, IMO. I think there is much that Christina knew that she has not said, I also tend to think that her swooning little diaries were written by her to leave behind for LE to find when/if she ever went to join Cesar. Just all IMO, but mine nonetheless.

Cesar's location could have been found through the email he sent to Sheriff Brown.

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Seems it was always Maria who had to miss the formations and events (at least she's the only one mentioned to have in the letter) in order to not be around him, even though the order to stay away from her applied to him. He was ordered to stay 1000 feet from her, she had the option of being excused from his presence if he failed to be the one to stay away. Something about that just doesn't seem right. IMO

Neither one attended the Christmas party, though. [/*]

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf
From page 3
A 5In addition, they were directed not to attend formations or unit events of any type (formal or informal) where one or the other expected to be present.

A7In addition, the MPO directed LCPL Lauterbach and CPL Laurean to not attend formations or unit events of any type, formal or informal, where one or the other was anticipated to be present.

This was directed to both CPL Laurean and LCPL Lauterbach not to attend if the other would be present. Neither one was to attend...

[baywench]

Originally posted by daniel green
"There was no evidentiary or evidentiary reason to obtain CL's dna." [/*]



;)

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by aubrey04
I've read through all of your posts and couldn't keep up. There are some interesting theories being thrown out, which I won't discount until Laurean goes to trial and we see the evidence.. but I am not 100% sure that Christina was not involved in some fashion, but that's for the cops to explore - not me. I am VERY interested to know how long the emails between Christina and Cesar had been going on. We shall see.

A few people were debating the merits of sentencing and punishment. I would like to add what Nancy Grace has said several times.

She says that the purpose of jail/prison sentences is "three pronged":

1. Punishment
2. Rehabilitation
3. Deterrent

It's supposed to be a combination of all three prongs.


JMO [/*]

Hey if Nancy Grace said the sky is blue, sorry but I'd say, "no way, uh uh, it is not." (A little humor.....but true....for the evening.)

:tongue:

:seeya:

[baywench]

Originally posted by donna
Christina did not have money to send Cesar, IMO. I think there is much that Christina knew that she has not said, I also tend to think that her swooning little diaries were written by her to leave behind for LE to find when/if she ever went to join Cesar. Just all IMO, but mine nonetheless.

Cesar's location could have been found through the email he sent to Sheriff Brown. [/*]

True but certainly a coincidence that shortly after finding out she was communicating with him he's ready to turn himself in. Remember when LE said they had turned off some of his financial support? Remember when that was? It truly could be a conincidence I suppose but I don't think so. JMO

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by baywench


The timing is so strange to me. She didn't send him money because she knew that was illegal is being served up IMO I think after the computer was confiscated they put the screws to her and in the next two weeks (with them monitoring) she was told not to agree to help him with money and all of a sudden, in a very short time he is contacting the sheriff and has less than a dollar in his pocket. Very quickly this story is becoming about her and it seems weird. I think she is being packaged as a victim for a reason IMO [/*]

They want to improve her image before she is to appear as a witness for the state of NC against her husband... She has to be believeable to the average juror.

[CANDYKISSES]

Originally posted by nelkirk


http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf
From page 3
A 5

A7

This was directed to both CPL Laurean and LCPL Lauterbach not to attend if the other would be present. Neither one was to attend... [/*]

I find that to be very fair and reasonable Nelkirk. Is that a standard practice while investigating when the two work together?

jmo

[baywench]

Originally posted by nelkirk


They want to improve her image before she is to appear as a witness for the state of NC against her husband... She has to be believeable to the average juror. [/*]

Exactly Nel, even Sheriff Brown said something to the effect that it defies logic and what most people think. The dynamic betweel CL and CSL is going to be very interesting. JMO

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by nelkirk


They want to improve her image before she is to appear as a witness for the state of NC against her husband... She has to be believeable to the average juror. [/*]

I'm not sure it's working. jmo

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by hinman
To be fair daniel we do not know when they examined her. It was 5 days after the incident that her UVA reported it and then we do not know when the NCIS examined her after that to see if she had bruises. [/*]

The UVA would have to report it immediately to NCIS. And NCIS would have taken a statement from Ml immediately upon the report.

Both of the UVA and NCIS are trained in the procedures in these cases. They know the imiportance of gathering forensic asap after a crime has been commited.

[daniel green]

"the command has no evidence to indicate that mutual friends or co-workers might be a threat to ML."

Truly, these answers just show how utterly ridiculous this windbag's questions to the marines were. :rolleyes:

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by donna
Christina did not have money to send Cesar, IMO. I think there is much that Christina knew that she has not said, I also tend to think that her swooning little diaries were written by her to leave behind for LE to find when/if she ever went to join Cesar. Just all IMO, but mine nonetheless.

Cesar's location could have been found through the email he sent to Sheriff Brown. [/*]

We can only guess at Christina's financial situation, but even if dead broke, if she REALLY wanted to send him money she could probably beg/borrow/steal it somehow. IMO. She didn't.

As far as her diaries, I don't believe she had a sinister ulterior motive. For one thing, I don't think she is all that bright to do such masterful planning as some believe. After Cesar took off I think her ultimate concern was how to go on with her life and take care of her daughter. And......as we now know....stay in touch with Cesar and think of the horrific situation they were in.

I just don't give her credit for such intelligent deviousness as others on here do.

[hinman]

Originally posted by nelkirk


http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf
From page 3
A 5

A7

This was directed to both CPL Laurean and LCPL Lauterbach not to attend if the other would be present. Neither one was to attend... [/*]Thanks nelkirk.

[daniel green]

And ML told everyone in the command, and UVA that she did not feel threatened. Including the military prosecutor and civilian victim advocate.

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by nelkirk


They want to improve her image before she is to appear as a witness for the state of NC against her husband... She has to be believeable to the average juror. [/*]

Yep, they're all in on this grandiose master plan.....:read: It's a conspiracy I tell ya.

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES


I find that to be very fair and reasonable Nelkirk. Is that a standard practice while investigating when the two work together?

jmo [/*]

Yes it is...

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by marinewife5


I'm not sure it's working. jmo [/*]

I don't either but the spin is just beginning...

[donna]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


We can only guess at Christina's financial situation, but even if dead broke, if she REALLY wanted to send him money she could probably beg/borrow/steal it somehow. IMO. She didn't.

As far as her diaries, I don't believe she had a sinister ulterior motive. For one thing, I don't think she is all that bright to do such masterful planning as some believe. After Cesar took off I think her ultimate concern was how to go on with her life and take care of her daughter. And......as we now know....stay in touch with Cesar and think of the horrific situation they were in.

I just don't give her credit for such intelligent deviousness as others on here do. [/*]


SS, I don't give her credit for much intelligence period. I wish I COULD feel that Christina has been genuine, but I just cannot.

We just have to agree to disagree. But we can and do disagree respectfully.

:)

[gaelicpeas]

from Lindell's blog:

Also, I’ll be on Geraldo tonight at 8:30 discussing the case if anyone wants to check it out. Maybe I’ll draw a map in the sand of where Laurean was hiding. Just kidding.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by donna



SS, I don't give her credit for much intelligence period. I wish I COULD feel that Christina has been genuine, but I just cannot.

We just have to agree to disagree. But we can and do disagree respectfully.

:) [/*]

Okay but if you don't give her credit for much intelligence.....how do you feel she sat back months ago and figured, "Oh I'll write a fictional diary to fool everyone about what really happened. Make myself look innocent and suffering." Then wrote out complete lies, day by day, figuring LE would come and find it? If this were true, why didn't she herself turn in this diary two months ago? Certainly one month of "poor, poor me" would convince them.

I just don't get it.

Wanted to say that, but it's okay if you don't want to respond.

[daniel green]

And so several times she informed the marines that CL might be at an event and they excused her from attendance.

[hinman]

Originally posted by gaelicpeas
from Lindell's blog:

Also, I’ll be on Geraldo tonight at 8:30 discussing the case if anyone wants to check it out. Maybe I’ll draw a map in the sand of where Laurean was hiding. Just kidding.

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/ [/*]Thanks gaelic. Hope your hand gets better.

[hinman]

Originally posted by daniel green
And so several times she informed the marines that CL might be at an event and they excused her from attendance. [/*]yup. That is how I understood it.

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


Yep, they're all in on this grandiose master plan.....:read: It's a conspiracy I tell ya. [/*]

I am not bashing CSL at all. It is standard practice to make your star witness as creditable as possible prior to getting them on stand to testify.

Just as the defense will dress their client in a suit when the public has always seen the accused in gang colors...

[hinman]

Originally posted by nelkirk


I am not bashing CSL at all. It is standard practive to make your star witness as creditable as possible prior to getting them on stand to testify.

Just as the defense will dress their client in a suit when the public has always seen the accused in gang colors... [/*]I think Durham is going to be a star witness.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by nelkirk


http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf
From page 3
A 5

A7

This was directed to both CPL Laurean and LCPL Lauterbach not to attend if the other would be present. Neither one was to attend... [/*]

Right. We know that several times, Maria asked for and was granted permission to be excused from his presence at these things. Why did she have to miss them in order to avoid him, instead of the other way around?

[daniel green]

I think that Mrs L keeping a diary is even stupider than the L's communicating with ea other via the internet.

It just shows how young they are, I guess.

And to think that there were pgs and pgs of posts on this board about how CL knew about cell phone "pings" and was somehow throwing LE off, etc.

As if.

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by nelkirk


I am not bashing CSL at all. It is standard practive to make your star witness as creditable as possible prior to getting them on stand to testify.

Just as the defense will dress their client in a suit when the public has always seen the accused in gang colors... [/*]

Aha, I see what you mean. Didn't come out that way though, I guess because of all the prior discussion today (not necessarily with you).

[hinman]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Right. We know that several times, Maria asked for and was granted permission to be excused from his presence at these things. Why did she have to miss them in order to avoid him, instead of the other way around? [/*]I wonder why if she was having an affair with the man would she ask to be excused from the event.

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Right. We know that several times, Maria asked for and was granted permission to be excused from his presence at these things. Why did she have to miss them in order to avoid him, instead of the other way around? [/*]

Because she chose to do so.

[gaelicpeas]

also from Lindell's blog - CL's cabin:

"View of a wooden cabin, where Laurean supposedly lived while hiding out near the town of San Juan de la Vina, Mexico. (AP Photo). Wonder if he listened to the boombox and does the cabin have electricity?"

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/boom.gif

http://onslowcrime.encblogs.com/

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by hinman
I think Durham is going to be a star witness. [/*]

I am curious as to why?

[donna]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


Okay but if you don't give her credit for much intelligence.....how do you feel she sat back months ago and figured, "Oh I'll write a fictional diary to fool everyone about what really happened. Make myself look innocent and suffering." Then wrote out complete lies, day by day, figuring LE would come and find it? If this were true, why didn't she herself turn in this diary two months ago? Certainly one month of "poor, poor me" would convince them.

I just don't get it.

Wanted to say that, but it's okay if you don't want to respond. [/*]

Because it would not have worked, and LE could have seen through that.

I certainly do not think it was intelligent of Christina to not at least written about how sad it was for a pregnant fellow Marine to be so brutally murdered. No. It was all about her love for Cesar, and then anger at him for having cheated on her!

Selfish and self centered, IMO.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Right. We know that several times, Maria asked for and was granted permission to be excused from his presence at these things. Why did she have to miss them in order to avoid him, instead of the other way around? [/*]


I take it you think that it was because the marines were punishing her? Or because she was the woman? :confused:

[baywench]

Originally posted by hinman
I wonder why if she was having an affair with the man would she ask to be excused from the event. [/*]

With everyone knowing the circumstances between them I would think it be uncomfortable to be in the same room. Also possible she wanted to get out of the event anyway. JMO

[hinman]

Originally posted by nelkirk


I am curious as to why? [/*]He lived with Maria and I think it will be interresting to hear his take on what was going on.

We have not heard much about him and for some reason he felt sorry for Maria.

I don't know I think he is going to be an interresting witness.

I probably shouldn't say star witness I doubt if there is one of them. The guy from the lowes video he will be another witness that I think will be interresting to see his take on Laureans attitude why they were shopping for bonfire stuff.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench


snipped Also possible she wanted to get out of the event anyway. JMO [/*]

Uh huh.

[hinman]

Originally posted by baywench


With everyone knowing the circumstances between them I would think it be uncomfortable to be in the same room. Also possible she wanted to get out of the event anyway. JMO [/*]Could be.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench


snipped

Remember when LE said they had turned off some of his financial support? Remember when that was? It truly could be a conincidence I suppose but I don't think so. JMO [/*]

Just a huge coincidence.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by daniel green
And so several times she informed the marines that CL might be at an event and they excused her from attendance. [/*]

Again, if the order was for him to stay away from her, and even if the order applied to both of them (which it does NOT state anywhere on the actual MPO), why was it up to Maria to have to ask for permission to be excused from the event in order to avoid him? Why wasn't he the one being excused from the event?

It was up to her to miss formations and events in order to keep him in compliance with the MPO against him? This doesn't seem right.

[baywench]

Originally posted by hinman
He lived with Maria and I think it will be interresting to hear his take on what was going on.

We have not heard much about him and for some reason he felt sorry for Maria.

I don't know I think he is going to be an interresting witness.

I probably shouldn't say star witness I doubt if there is one of them. The guy from the lowes video he will be another witness that I think will be interresting to see his take on Laureans attitude why they were shopping for bonfire stuff. [/*]

I have never thought he felt sorry for her. I see it as a roomate/mutually beneficial arrangement. JMO

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by donna


Because it would not have worked, and LE could have seen through that.

I certainly do not think it was intelligent of Christina to not at least written about how sad it was for a pregnant fellow Marine to be so brutally murdered. No. It was all about her love for Cesar, and then anger at him for having cheated on her!

Selfish and self centered, IMO. [/*]

But we don't know that, Donna! We don't know the entire contents of the diary. We have heard them say she talked about loving Cesar and being jealous, but if there was mention of the murder, I don't think that would have been brought out in that PC at all. Just remember though, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. She could well have written pages about how she felt extremely sad about Maria's death, but we were not told. No one said: "she wrote NOTHING about Maria's murder," did they?

[hinman]

Originally posted by baywench


I have never thought he felt sorry for her. I see it as a roomate/mutually beneficial arrangement. JMO [/*]Sorry Bay that was his words not mine. I don't have the link to the article so I will just say IMO.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench


I have never thought he felt sorry for her. I see it as a roomate/mutually beneficial arrangement. JMO [/*]

I don't think he felt sorry for her, either. Why would he? Why would anyone?

[baywench]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Again, if the order was for him to stay away from her, and even if the order applied to both of them (which it does NOT state anywhere on the actual MPO), why was it up to Maria to have to ask for permission to be excused from the event in order to avoid him? Why wasn't he the one being excused from the event?

It was up to miss formations and events in order to keep him in compliance with the MPO against him? This doesn't seem right. [/*]

But how do you know it was up to her? Maybe she just asked first? JMO

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Right. We know that several times, Maria asked for and was granted permission to be excused from his presence at these things. Why did she have to miss them in order to avoid him, instead of the other way around? [/*]

BOTH were directed not to attend if they knew the other would be there. We do not know if CL requested permission to be excused or not. JMO

[gaelicpeas]

Originally posted by hinman
Thanks gaelic. Hope your hand gets better. [/*]

thanks, Hinman!

[Lyn_T]

Originally posted by daniel green


No kidding.

Same as with the alleged keying incident.

BTW, why oh why can't I just copy and paste from this pdf file like I aways do????? :confused:

The marines explain the difference between "stellar" and "solid."

I am gonna guess that ML's family are not gonna be happy with the response. The old "don't answer a question you don't already know the answer to." [/*]

DG - I copied it into a word doc with my Adobe - hilight from left corner and drag, then take a snapshot and paste where ever.

Hope that helps.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Again, if the order was for him to stay away from her, and even if the order applied to both of them (which it does NOT state anywhere on the actual MPO), why was it up to Maria to have to ask for permission to be excused from the event in order to avoid him? Why wasn't he the one being excused from the event?

It was up to her to miss formations and events in order to keep him in compliance with the MPO against him? This doesn't seem right. [/*]

I don't think this is going to help because if you have read the marines response and know anything about MPO's you already know this.

But.

They were supposed to stay away from ea other. That's how it works.

It was not "against him."

MPO's are not done like one takes out a protective order in the civilian world.

[baywench]

Originally posted by daniel green


I don't think he felt sorry for her, either. Why would he? Why would anyone? [/*]

Well, there's that "she's a woman" thing. JMO

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by daniel green


I don't think he felt sorry for her, either. Why would he? Why would anyone? [/*]

Oh gosh DG, there has been pages and pages and pages and pages written on this forum in the last three months about how some felt really sorry for Maria, in her situation.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Lyn_T


DG - I copied it into a word doc with my Adobe - hilight from left corner and drag, then take a snapshot and paste where ever.

Hope that helps. [/*]

Thank you, Lyn! I never have any problem copying and pasting from a pdf file but this one has been just impossible for me to do.

[Kel65]

Originally posted by marinewife5


I'm not sure it's working. jmo [/*]

It sure doesn't seem to be. But that is to be expected by her not making an early public outreach. A lot of people assume she has something to hide because she has been so elusive. Now, I think it is too late for her to be exptected to do a public outreach for the purposes of successfully attaining positive public perception. jmo

[SavannahStar]

Originally posted by daniel green


Thank you, Lyn! I never have any problem copying and pasting from a pdf file but this one has been just impossible for me to do. [/*]

I've never been able to copy/paste from a .pdf file. :( I'll try that method also though.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


Oh gosh DG, there has been pages and pages and pages and pages written on this forum in the last three months about how some felt really sorry for Maria, in her situation. [/*]

Yeah, I've seen that. Still don't get it.

What situation? That she was pregnant? That she was looking for a place to live off base?

I can understand posters saying that they felt sorry for her.

But I just don't see why Durham would.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by daniel green
"the command has no evidence to indicate that mutual friends or co-workers might be a threat to ML."

Truly, these answers just show how utterly ridiculous this windbag's questions to the marines were. :rolleyes: [/*]

Other than the reported punch to the face and keying of the car, that is. ;)

The questions were and are perfectly legitimate -- some of the answers are utterly ridiculous. :rolleyes:

IMO

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench


Well, there's that "she's a woman" thing. JMO [/*]

Well, duh.

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by Kel65


It sure doesn't seem to be. But that is to be expected by her not making an early public outreach. A lot of people assume she has something to hide because she has been so elusive. Now, I think it is too late for her to be exptected to do a public outreach for the purposes of successfully attaining positive public perception. jmo [/*]

I can see her keeping herself a bit hidden, but her atty could have released a statement early on. jmo

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Other than the reported punch to the face and keying of the car, that is. ;)

snipped[/*]

For which there was no evidence.

[donna]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


But we don't know that, Donna! We don't know the entire contents of the diary. We have heard them say she talked about loving Cesar and being jealous, but if there was mention of the murder, I don't think that would have been brought out in that PC at all. Just remember though, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. She could well have written pages about how she felt extremely sad about Maria's death, but we were not told. No one said: "she wrote NOTHING about Maria's murder," did they? [/*]

;) .... Exactly right. We do not know ALL that was in the dairy, but I have heard enough not to buy it!

[baywench]

Originally posted by hinman
Sorry Bay that was his words not mine. I don't have the link to the article so I will just say IMO. [/*]

Let me be clearer also....I did not think he felt sorry for her because he knew about Laurean and the harrassment...rather that he empathized with her being single, pregnant. No apology necessary ! IMO

[Kel65]

Originally posted by marinewife5


I can see her keeping herself a bit hidden, but her atty could have released a statement early on. jmo [/*]

Yes, I think that would have been the wise thing to do too. JMO

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Other than the reported punch to the face and keying of the car, that is. ;)

The questions were and are perfectly legitimate -- some of the answers are utterly ridiculous. :rolleyes:

IMO [/*]

there was zero evidence of the punch to the face, no bruising, no picture of bruising, no coworkers or friends stating they saw the bruising. the question claimed the incident was late summer/early fall. turns out May is in the spring. the answers were verifyable truth.

jmo

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by daniel green


I don't think this is going to help because if you have read the marines response and know anything about MPO's you already know this.

But.

They were supposed to stay away from ea other. That's how it works.

It was not "against him."

MPO's are not done like one takes out a protective order in the civilian world. [/*]

Really? It wasn't issued for her protection?

Was she not the protected person?

Was he was not the one she was to be protected from?

Please explain how this military MPO is substantially different from a civilian one, other than being issued by a military officer instead of a civilian judge.

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by baywench


Now now SS, I hate that word. I think Christina's in it up to her eyebrows and cut a deal with LE that (although it left a bad taste in their mouth) was their ticket to bringing him in (with all due respect to the marauding Mexican LE) and now they have to package the goods and do some air-brushing before they put her on the stand. Listen to the Sheriff...he says it all if you listen closely. No, no conspiracy but maybe some reluctant bedfellows. JMO [/*]

Now this is only my opinion and nothing more but this is what I believe is beginning to happen. DA Hudson is beginning to polish his key witness' image that he evidently needs very badly in this case. He knows the potential jury pool is listening intently. Sort of reminds me how Gloria Alred went about bolstering Amber Frey as a key witness in the SP case before the trial.

I see this as a show of weakness in the overall strength of the case. Just like I felt it showed they are not as sure about this case as they would have us think when they stacked charges on top of a First Degree Murder case. If the case is as solid as they would have us think there would be no need to stack a case when proven BARD it would yield LWOP.

Exactly imo SB is not buying it. He said it was "possible" that she may not have not known anything. He however did not say it was probable.

imoo

[daniel green]

Lyn T-- I STILL cannot copy and paste from the pfd doc.

If anyone else can, could u pls post the response to Q28 for us?

Many thanks!

[nana2]

some ssay this is "our" Cesar and have addressed the video choices....(I particuraly like the one where he sacrifices his sight for hers) subliminal??? Cesar???? What say you??

http://www.myspace.com/187234687

[hinman]

Originally posted by baywench


Let me be clearer also....I did not think he felt sorry for her because he knew about Laurean and the harrassment...rather that he empathized with her being single, pregnant. No apology necessary ! IMO [/*]Gotcha.

I have no idea why he felt sorry for her not even going ot pretend I do it will be interresting to find out. Like I said He is going to be an interresting witness.

[baywench]

Originally posted by Kel65


It sure doesn't seem to be. But that is to be expected by her not making an early public outreach. A lot of people assume she has something to hide because she has been so elusive. Now, I think it is too late for her to be exptected to do a public outreach for the purposes of successfully attaining positive public perception. jmo [/*]

I have just NEVER seen such a successful effort to blur every single picture of someone and an almost blackout on her life. IMO

[daniel green]

Originally posted by marinewife5


there was zero evidence of the punch to the face, no bruising, no picture of bruising, no coworkers or friends stating they saw the bruising. the question claimed the incident was late summer/early fall. turns out May is in the spring. the answers were verifyable truth.

jmo [/*]

And when told to report the alleged keying to the provost, ML didn't. And she could offer no specific info about it.

:rolleyes:

[Fallen Angel]

Ok i'm still shocked he said he loved her. I wonder what he would do if he hated her. And i wonder how his wife feels after she heard him say that...........what a sad sad case:(

[donna]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


Now this is only my opinion and nothing more but this is what I believe is beginning to happen. DA Hudson is beginning to polish his key witness' image that he evidently needs very badly in this case. He knows the potential jury pool is listening intently. Sort of reminds me how Gloria Alred went about bolstering Amber Frey as a key witness in the SP case before the trial.

I see this as a show of weakness in the overall strength of the case. Just like I felt it showed they are not as sure about this case as they would have us think when they stacked charges on top of a First Degree Murder case. If the case is as solid as they would have us think there would be no need to stack a case when proven BARD it would yield LWOP.

Exactly imo SB is not buying it. He said it was "possible" that she may not have not known anything. He however did not say it was probable.

imoo [/*]

:beer: (coke classic)

Great post, GB!

[aubrey04]

Originally posted by SavannahStar


Hey if Nancy Grace said the sky is blue, sorry but I'd say, "no way, uh uh, it is not." (A little humor.....but true....for the evening.)

:tongue:

:seeya: [/*]

Well, I am not a Nancy Grace fan or foe.. I admit I watch her on some nights and don't always agree w/her but she is a former prosecutor; therefore, her knowledge of how justice is dispensed is superior to my knowledge. I happen to agree with her, though.

I think jail sentences should provide for punishment, rehabiliation and used as an example.. a deterrent.

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Other than the reported punch to the face and keying of the car, that is. ;)

The questions were and are perfectly legitimate -- some of the answers are utterly ridiculous. :rolleyes:

IMO [/*]

I thought some of the questions were redundant and a little ridiculous myself.

imoo

[crymeariver2006]

Originally posted by Kel65


It sure doesn't seem to be. But that is to be expected by her not making an early public outreach. A lot of people assume she has something to hide because she has been so elusive. Now, I think it is too late for her to be exptected to do a public outreach for the purposes of successfully attaining positive public perception. jmo [/*]

I look at it like this, back during the Scott Peterson case when I first heard he had a girlfriend, my first thought was she either did it or she was in on it.

Then she made a personal appeal and apology to Laci's family then went before the media and gave a brief statement in which she publicly apologized to Laci's family.

The private and public apology and condolences to the victim's family changed my early opinion of her for the better.

I haven't heard anything like that from Christina and if it only occurs AFTER she was caught communicating with Cesar, it's fake.

IMO

[daniel green]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


I thought some of the questions were redundant and a little ridiculous myself.

imoo [/*]

Completely.

[baywench]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


Now this is only my opinion and nothing more but this is what I believe is beginning to happen. DA Hudson is beginning to polish his key witness' image that he evidently needs very badly in this case. He knows the potential jury pool is listening intently. Sort of reminds me how Gloria Alred went about bolstering Amber Frey as a key witness in the SP case before the trial.

I see this as a show of weakness in the overall strength of the case. Just like I felt it showed they are not as sure about this case as they would have us think when they stacked charges on top of a First Degree Murder case. If the case is as solid as they would have us think there would be no need to stack a case when proven BARD it would yield LWOP.

Exactly imo SB is not buying it. He said it was "possible" that she may not have not known anything. He however did not say it was probable.

imoo [/*]

I have always felt that it is possible the evidence could go both ways. CSL or CAL or both. JMO

[hinman]

Originally posted by baywench


I have always felt that it is possible the evidence could go both ways. CSL or CAL or both. JMO [/*]That is the part that worries me the most about his case. Hopefully the prosecution can do their job.

The DA could put on a good show for us.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by daniel green


For which there was no evidence. [/*]

I'm willing to bet that the damage to her car was visible.

But since she didn't get the incident on videotape, along with numerous eyewitnesses and a signed confession from the perpetrator, well ... there's just no evidence that her car was keyed or damaged with some other item, right?

Or... wait for it, folks... if there was visible damage to her car, but she didn't see, videotape, and have witnesses and a signed confession for the incident, then she musta done it herself!!!

(Thought I'd save somebody the trouble of suggesting that.) :cool:

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I'm willing to bet that the damage to her car was visible.

But since she didn't get the incident on videotape, along with numerous eyewitnesses and a signed confession from the perpetrator, well ... there's just no evidence that her car was keyed or damaged with some other item, right?

Or... wait for it, folks... if there was visible damage to her car, but she didn't see, videotape, and have witnesses and a signed confession for the incident, then she musta done it herself!!!

(Thought I'd save somebody the trouble of suggesting that.) :cool: [/*]

I am sure it was just like the countless other vehicles that get keyed up there on base.

She did not report it to MPs even though told to do so.

imoo

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I'm willing to bet that the damage to her car was visible.

snipped [/*]

Odd, then, that she didn't show the damage to anyone. And could provide no info about it.

[crymeariver2006]

Originally posted by baywench


I have always felt that it is possible the evidence could go both ways. CSL or CAL or both. JMO [/*]

Sure it could. It was THEIR house, THEIR garage, THEIR backyard....both had equal motives for wanting Maria out of the picture.....

This is no slam dunk by any stretch of the imagination.

JMO

[Lyn_T]

Originally posted by daniel green
Lyn T-- I STILL cannot copy and paste from the pfd doc.

If anyone else can, could u pls post the response to Q28 for us?

Many thanks! [/*]

This is one strange doc. I am having to print it out and scan back to copy and paste from word...won't even c/p from a photo.

Can I post it here as a snippet? Don't want to break TOS or copyright.

[donna]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I'm willing to bet that the damage to her car was visible.

But since she didn't get the incident on videotape, along with numerous eyewitnesses and a signed confession from the perpetrator, well ... there's just no evidence that her car was keyed or damaged with some other item, right?

Or... wait for it, folks... if there was visible damage to her car, but she didn't see, videotape, and have witnesses and a signed confession for the incident, then she musta done it herself!!!

(Thought I'd save somebody the trouble of suggesting that.) :cool: [/*]

I wonder if Maria reported the damage to her insurance company? She would have had to have a report from MP's or civilian LE for her insurance company.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Lyn_T


This is one strange doc. I am having to print it out and scan back to copy and paste from word...won't even c/p from a photo.

Can I post it here as a snippet? Don't want to break TOS or copyright. [/*]

it is not copyrighted.

And it won't be against TOS to post.

And thank you!

[daniel green]

Originally posted by donna


I wonder if Maria reported the damage to her insurance company? She would have had to have a report from MP's or civilian LE for her insurance company. [/*]

Interesting question.

[Lyn_T]

Originally posted by daniel green


it is not copyrighted.

And it won't be against TOS to post.

And thank you! [/*]

Working on it, will try to photobucket too in a while

[donna]

:seeya:

Got to get ready for work! Have a great evening, everyone!

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by Charlotte


Again, if the order was for him to stay away from her, and even if the order applied to both of them (which it does NOT state anywhere on the actual MPO), why was it up to Maria to have to ask for permission to be excused from the event in order to avoid him? Why wasn't he the one being excused from the event?

It was up to her to miss formations and events in order to keep him in compliance with the MPO against him? This doesn't seem right. [/*]

On several occasions, LCPL Lauterbach excercised this MPO protection by reporting to her command her concerns when she might encounter CPL Laurean and was uncomfortable attending those formations or events. Her command excused her from these functions. LCPL Lauterbach's actions demonstrated to her command her understanding of the MPO.

She felt uncomfortable attending those functions. she chose not to attend and asked to be excused.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by daniel green


Odd, then, that she didn't show the damage to anyone. And could provide no info about it. [/*]

Where is it said that she didn't show the damage to the car to anyone?

What specific info should she have had to provide?

The name of the person who did it?
The description of the person who did it?
The precise instrument used to do it?

If she didn't see it happen, what info are you faulting her for not providing?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Lyn_T


Working on it, will try to photobucket too in a while [/*]It can't be copied and pasted because it is the image of the Q&A that is saved to .pdf and not a document saved as .pdf

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by donna


:beer: (coke classic)

Great post, GB! [/*]

Thank you. Ah the coke sounds scrumptious. I have been doing yard work today so a cold glass sounds yummy. lol

Just think about it.

Why did DA Hudson find it necessary to talk about her private diaries and most especially her thoughts of suicide and still loving her husband? That was totally unnecessary and why would he publicly release that private information even before trial but wait!.......he needs to create her in the minds of the potential jury and have her as a "woe is me" victim/witness hoping it will bolster her believability.

The spin game has begun imo.

imo

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by donna


;) .... Exactly right. We do not know ALL that was in the dairy, but I have heard enough not to buy it! [/*]

Buy the story or the diary itself?

[daniel green]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


snipped

Why did DA Hudson find it necessary to talk about her private diaries and most especially her thoughts of suicide and still loving her husband? [/*]

That is really strange and unecessary for both him and the DA to mention, actually, wasn't it?

[hinman]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


Thank you. Ah the coke sounds scrumptious. I have been doing yard work today so a cold glass sounds yummy. lol

Just think about it.

Why did DA Hudson find it necessary to talk about her private diaries and most especially her thoughts of suicide and still loving her husband? That was totally unnecessary and why would he publicly release that private information even before trial but wait!.......he needs to create her in the minds of the potential jury and have her as a "woe is me" victim/witness hoping it will bolster her believability.

The spin game has begun imo.

imo [/*]It makes no sense to me. It has been stated on this board a million times a victim ( which LE believes Christina is) does not have to be perfect.

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


Thank you. Ah the coke sounds scrumptious. I have been doing yard work today so a cold glass sounds yummy. lol

Just think about it.

Why did DA Hudson find it necessary to talk about her private diaries and most especially her thoughts of suicide and still loving her husband? That was totally unnecessary and why would he publicly release that private information even before trial but wait!.......he needs to create her in the minds of the potential jury and have her as a "woe is me" victim/witness hoping it will bolster her believability.

The spin game has begun imo.

imo [/*]

IF she made a deal, and as a result they could release that info, she made a bad deal, imo. AND, if she is so vital to the case that they gave her a deal, i'm scared he'll walk. jmo

[nana2]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


Would the "integrity" possibly be her llittle fib about the dead brother and responsible father?

Why was she tardy, I wonder?
Did I read (or dream I read) yesterday that she had difficulties in basic trainig, or with her physical training? why would that be- ??she was athletic! I would think someone as athletic as she was would be a female marines corps ideal, jmo. [/*] I read somewhere that she overslept...Ill go try to find it

[hinman]

Originally posted by nana2
I read somewhere that she overslept...Ill go try to find it [/*]That is what I read to. she over slept which resulted in her being late for work and something else also.
looked and it was a scheduled PT also that she missed.

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


Would the "integrity" possibly be her llittle fib about the dead brother and responsible father?

Why was she tardy, I wonder?
Did I read (or dream I read) yesterday that she had difficulties in basic trainig, or with her physical training? why would that be- ??she was athletic! I would think someone as athletic as she was would be a female marines corps ideal, jmo. [/*]

the fib regarding the dead brother would not have come into play in her most recent evaluation. you are evaluated on your performace since your last evaluation. jmo

[daniel green]

Originally posted by baywench


I'm thinking that was the lying. Nothing was said about the UA? [/*]

Yep. Must be the lying.

I have not seen anything about the UA yet but I have not read it carefully.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by marinewife5


the fib regarding the dead brother would not have come into play in her most recent evaluation. you are evaluated on your performace since your last evaluation. jmo [/*]

Oops.

So these would be new integrity issues?

Thank you for clearing that up.

[nana2]

integrity could simply be the accusation and then recantation of the sexual assault charges

[hinman]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


were they going by the most recent eval, or reporting her cumulative "negative" items in her personnel file? If only going by most recent eval, she had ongoing integrity and tardiness problems??? [/*]The way I am reading it her tardiness was the reason for all problems not lying or anything like that.

she was under no medical treatment and she had no legal or administrative issues that would lead to a discharge. ( I am assuming they did not think she was bi polar then so that issue can be laid to rest also.

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by sherryhefner



GB, the DA's behavior was just crazy to me! I have NEVER heard a prosecutor say all those things about someone so close to a criminal case BEFORE he's even interviewed the accused or received all the evidence. How ridiculous is that?

I asked myself, "Why did he do that? What purpose did it serve?"

You may be correct....either hoping to sway a potential jury OR playing a mind game with XTina. [/*]

I couldn't believe my ears either. I thought it was so strange and I kept thinking "why are you discussing this private information in the media?"

Usually it is customary for DA to make no comment on information they have gathered. But I have seen a few come out and push the envelope especially before any hearings are held and a Judge may put a gag order on all parties.

imoo

[daniel green]

Originally posted by hinman
The way I am reading it her tardiness was the reason for all problems not lying or anything like that.

snipped. [/*]

No, hinman. Look at what it says.

For BOTH tardiness and integrity issues.

LCpl Lauterbach also received
formal adverse counseling entries for both tardiness and integrity issues

[daniel green]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


I couldn't believe my ears either. I thought it was so strange and I kept thinking "why are you discussing this private information in the media?"

snipped[/*]

For real. And the DA said it, too.

[nana2]

Q12 A 12
refers to the tardy issue

[hinman]

Originally posted by daniel green


No, hinman. Look at what it says.

For BOTH tardiness and integrity issues.

LCpl Lauterbach also received
formal adverse counseling entries for both tardiness and integrity issues [/*] wonder why they go into detail about the tardiness and not the integrity???

[n/t]

Wait a sec. Why are posters throwing accusations and bringing up integrity issues against a murdered victim? What does any of this have to do with her murder? Are you suggesting that she deserved what she got? Please explain the constant bashing cuz I'm stunned by what's being posted here. Posting rolling eyes smileys?? Why would anyone help her??

This is shocking.

[baywench]

Originally posted by marinewife5


IF she made a deal, and as a result they could release that info, she made a bad deal, imo. AND, if she is so vital to the case that they gave her a deal, i'm scared he'll walk. jmo [/*]

Seems the more answers we get the cloudier it becomes. JMO

[n/t]

Originally posted by alter ego
So what? [/*]

Exactly. This is unbelievable.

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by nana2
integrity could simply be the accusation and then recantation of the sexual assault charges [/*]

I think it also had to do with her blatant lie she told about her father killing her little brother with a lamp.

She was to have received counseling about that.

imoo

[alter ego]

Originally posted by daniel green


Yep. Must be the lying.

I have not seen anything about the UA yet but I have not read it carefully. [/*]Sure makes folks wonder why people lie about the things they lie about.

Weird.

[hinman]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


I think it also had to do with her blatant lie she told about her father killing her little brother with a lamp.

She was to have received counseling about that.

imoo [/*]Didn't that happen way before this. I thought she was in Basic still. Why would that count against her now??

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


were they going by the most recent eval, or reporting her cumulative "negative" items in her personnel file? If only going by most recent eval, she had ongoing integrity and tardiness problems??? [/*]

In naming the reasons for giving CL the "stellar" moniker, it was stated that the litany recited was for his entire length of service. I'm assuming they used the same criteria in the recitation of what earned the "solid" label for Maria, as in going by her entire time in the service, not just since her last eval.

[henry]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


Would the "integrity" possibly be her llittle fib about the dead brother and responsible father?

Why was she tardy, I wonder?
Did I read (or dream I read) yesterday that she had difficulties in basic trainig, or with her physical training? why would that be- ??she was athletic! I would think someone as athletic as she was would be a female marines corps ideal, jmo. [/*]

i'm shocked my brain is still working . . . iirc she broke her ankle . . . okay, going back to sleep

[alter ego]

Originally posted by n/t


Exactly. This is unbelievable. [/*]Her service record should not be under a microscope.

It certainly doesn't change the fact that she was murdered.

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by hinman
It makes no sense to me. It has been stated on this board a million times a victim ( which LE believes Christina is) does not have to be perfect. [/*]

She has to be the perfect victim to the jury.

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by hinman
wonder why they go into detail about the tardiness and not the integrity??? [/*]

the issues with tardiness and integrity went beyond the tardy incident in the letter. they did not elaborate specifically on either, but it would have taken several incidents of both for it to adversely effect her evaluation. the tardy incident in the letter was a response to a question pertaining to her performance between april 10th and may 12th only. jmo

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


Would the "integrity" possibly be her Little fib about the dead brother and responsible father?

Why was she tardy, I wonder?
Did I read (or dream I read) yesterday that she had difficulties in basic training, or with her physical training? why would that be- ??she was athletic! I would think someone as athletic as she was would be a female marines corps ideal, jmo. [/*]

Being athletic is one thing being that athletic to achieve the higher goals is extremely rigorous and tough to obtain imo.

That is one of the things the Marine Corps is known for and excels in their fitness and I am sure the scale for the top achievement at the highest level is very hard to accomplish even for the athletic.

imoo

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Coldwater
You CANNOT COPY AND PASTE ANYTHING that is not your own quote. You MUST give the source and author's name.

Anything else will be deleted. [/*]

Thank you, CW.

I guess since we are all posting and discussing the marine's letter to the Ohio congressman--and have linked to the document several times in the thread--I assumed that we all knew the source and the author's name.

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by marinewife5


the fib regarding the dead brother would not have come into play in her most recent evaluation. you are evaluated on your performance since your last evaluation. jmo [/*]

I need to read it again I guess.

I thought it was an overall view of both of their records while in the Marine Corps.

imoo

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


were they going by the most recent eval, or reporting her cumulative "negative" items in her personnel file? If only going by most recent eval, she had ongoing integrity and tardiness problems??? [/*]
TO ME it appears they were going on the most recent as there is only one score reported. JMO

[n/t]

Originally posted by daniel green
And ML told everyone in the command, and UVA that she did not feel threatened. Including the military prosecutor and civilian victim advocate. [/*]

link? And what does this have to do with her murder, please?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by Coldwater
You CANNOT COPY AND PASTE ANYTHING that is not your own quote. You MUST give the source and author's name.

Anything else will be deleted. [/*]Thanks for clearing that up!

[daniel green]

Originally posted by n/t
Wait a sec. Why are posters throwing accusations and bringing up integrity issues against a murdered victim? What does any of this have to do with her murder? Are you suggesting that she deserved what she got? Please explain the constant bashing cuz I'm stunned by what's being posted here. Posting rolling eyes smileys?? Why would anyone help her??

This is shocking. [/*]

Nobody is suggesting she deserved to be murdered.

Please.

What is being discussed is the Marine's response to the Ohio congressman. Which was released in the last couple of days.

Here it is:

Marine Corps Reponse to Congressman Turner's Questions (March 31, 2008) (10 page pdf file)

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/imag...nequestions.pdf

The marines, in the letter, say that ML had been counseled for both tardiness and integrity issues.

ETA: and nobody is "throwing around accusations." It is in the letter response to the congressman and certainly not an accusation, but a statement of ML's record as per the marines.

Please note in the letter that the marines' state that ML's mother waived the confidentiality issue so that the marines could respond.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by hinman
wonder why they go into detail about the tardiness and not the integrity??? [/*]

I think the detail about the tardiness was to clear up the statement made by some MC person or another that she had a "history of UAs."

The tardies were the supposed UAs, it seems.

And the "history" of them was limited to two -- both on the same morning, due to oversleeping/faulty alarm clock.

Reports of her "UA history" were greatly exaggerated. ;)

JMO

[n/t]

Originally posted by daniel green
"the command has no evidence to indicate that mutual friends or co-workers might be a threat to ML."

Truly, these answers just show how utterly ridiculous this windbag's questions to the marines were. :rolleyes: [/*]

According to TOS, quotes require links. And what does this have to do with her murder? And is the rolling eyes necessary?

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by n/t
Wait a sec. Why are posters throwing accusations and bringing up integrity issues against a murdered victim? What does any of this have to do with her murder? Are you suggesting that she deserved what she got? Please explain the constant bashing cuz I'm stunned by what's being posted here. Posting rolling eyes smileys?? Why would anyone help her??

This is shocking. [/*]

What?:confused: The Congressman sent 29 questions......... the Marine Corps answered them.......we are discussing what was in their answers.:confused:

That has nothing to do with Maria being murdered she was very much alive when she was in the Marine Corps at the time of these evaluations and recorded incidents.:shrug:

imoo

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


Would the "integrity" possibly be her llittle fib about the dead brother and responsible father?

Why was she tardy, I wonder?
Did I read (or dream I read) yesterday that she had difficulties in basic trainig, or with her physical training? why would that be- ??she was athletic! I would think someone as athletic as she was would be a female marines corps ideal, jmo. [/*]

A12 LCPL was counseled for missing a section Physical Fitness Training session on April 21. 2007. LCPL:Lauterbach claimed that she had overslept and was later counseled that same day for failing to show up for work that at 7:00 a.m.. Her rationale for failing to show up for work at 7:00 a.m. was that her alarm clock was broken.

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf

[nana2]

Originally posted by marinewife5


www.jmo.com [/*]
thought not...

[bkwits]

Originally posted by n/t
Wait a sec. Why are posters throwing accusations and bringing up integrity issues against a murdered victim? What does any of this have to do with her murder? Are you suggesting that she deserved what she got? Please explain the constant bashing cuz I'm stunned by what's being posted here. Posting rolling eyes smileys?? Why would anyone help her??

This is shocking. [/*]

I guess you haven't been here for awhile. :mad:

[hinman]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I think the detail about the tardiness was to clear up the statement made by some MC person or another that she had a "history of UAs."

The tardies were the supposed UAs, it seems.

And the "history" of them was limited to two -- both on the same morning, due to oversleeping/faulty alarm clock.

Reports of her "UA history" were greatly exaggerated. ;)

JMO [/*]Thanks for making that so clear. makes sense now.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by n/t


According to TOS, quotes require links. And what does this have to do with her murder? And is the rolling eyes necessary? [/*]

We have been discussing the marine letter. It has been linked to many times.

Here it is yet again:

Marine Corps Reponse to Congressman Turner's Questions (March 31, 2008) (10 page pdf file)

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/imag...nequestions.pdf

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by nana2

thought not... [/*]

so i need a link for my opinion? do you? thought not.

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I think the detail about the tardiness was to clear up the statement made by some MC person or another that she had a "history of UAs."

The tardies were the supposed UAs, it seems.

And the "history" of them was limited to two -- both on the same morning, due to oversleeping/faulty alarm clock.

Reports of her "UA history" were greatly exaggerated. ;)

JMO [/*]

Not if you are a Marine, it isn't.

Tardiness shows a lack of self discipline and is a no no in the military.

imoo

[gaelicpeas]

Originally posted by marinewife5

TO ME it appears they were going on the most recent as there is only one score reported. JMO [/*]

How often are they evaluated, mw5? And do the fitness standards change if you are pregnant, or how does the MC deal with that?

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I think the detail about the tardiness was to clear up the statement made by some MC person or another that she had a "history of UAs."

The tardies were the supposed UAs, it seems.

snipped [/*]

I do not believe that to be the case.

[n/t]

Originally posted by daniel green


Nobody is suggesting she deserved to be murdered.

Please.

What is being discussed is the Marine's response to the Ohio congressman. Which was released in the last couple of days.

Here it is:

Marine Corps Reponse to Congressman Turner's Questions (March 31, 2008) (10 page pdf file)

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/imag...nequestions.pdf

The marines, in the letter, say that ML had been counseled for both tardiness and integrity issues. [/*]


And? So what? Sadly, she's not here to defend herself so what purpose will this serve except to bash and demean her? She's not on trial here. She's dead. Show some respect.

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by Charlotte


I think the detail about the tardiness was to clear up the statement made by some MC person or another that she had a "history of UAs."

The tardies were the supposed UAs, it seems.

And the "history" of them was limited to two -- both on the same morning, due to oversleeping/faulty alarm clock.

Reports of her "UA history" were greatly exaggerated. ;)

JMO [/*]

I disagree. Tardy and UA are very different, IMO.

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by gaelicpeas


How often are they evaluated, mw5? And do the fitness standards change if you are pregnant, or how does the MC deal with that? [/*]

2x a year January 31st and July 31st. (no link...hubby source) as far as the fitness standards, no pft if pregnant. (again, hubby is the source). so JUST HIS OPINION

[daniel green]

Originally posted by n/t



And? So what? Sadly, she's not here to defend herself so what purpose will this serve except to bash and demean her? She's not on trial here. She's dead. Show some respect. [/*]

Discussing true facts about this is not bashing or demeaning.

ML's marine record is factual. Her mother waived confidentiality.

It is not disrespectful to discuss the letter.

[alter ego]

Originally posted by daniel green


I don't think this is going to help because if you have read the marines response and know anything about MPO's you already know this.

But.

They were supposed to stay away from ea other. That's how it works.

It was not "against him."

MPO's are not done like one takes out a protective order in the civilian world. [/*]It most certainly was "against him". Maria was given a copy of it and told it was in place to protect her and that it extended to the civilian community.

See the subsets to A2 detailing this.
http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf

[daniel green]

Originally posted by marinewife5


2x a year January 31st and July 31st. (no link...hubby source) as far as the fitness standards, no pft if pregnant. (again, hubby is the source). so JUST HIS OPINION [/*]

Thank you!

So this record that the marines gave in the letter, this is for the latest eval period, then, and not for the whole time ML was in the marines?

[nuttintodo]

Originally posted by alter ego
Her service record should not be under a microscope.

It certainly doesn't change the fact that she was murdered. [/*]

Let me see if I got this right...

It's okay for Congressman Mike Turner, representing the district in which Maria's family lives, to have his letter PUBLISHED and everyone can sit back, disseminate his questions and say WOW it so looks like the USMC didn't do a thing to protect Maria.

BUT it's NOT okay for the response from the USMC to be published and disseminated like the Congressman's letter???

Sounds like a double standard to me....

I do agree that her SRB doesn't change the fact she was murdered. Absolutely NOTHING will ever change that.

JMO

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by n/t



And? So what? Sadly, she's not here to defend herself so what purpose will this serve except to bash and demean her? She's not on trial here. She's dead. Show some respect. [/*]

We discussed extensively the questions asked by the Congressman and now we are not allowed to discuss the answers given by the Marine Corps? Why?

The Congressman wanted them and he got them. I fail to see why his questions met with no resistance but now because we have the link to the MC answers it is not allowed to be discuss.:confused:

imoo

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


No one means any disrespect here....but this is the truth. This is her record. It doesn't mean she was a bad person....just that she had some incidents.

If you've ever listened or been involved in a trial, you will know that the truth about the victim (and the accused) will come out. It is important as to what was going on with the victim.

We all have compassion for Maria, her child and family. [/*]

ITA. The more i find out about her, the more my heart breaks for her.

[gaelicpeas]

Originally posted by marinewife5


2x a year January 31st and July 31st. (no link...hubby source) as far as the fitness standards, no pft if pregnant. (again, hubby is the source). so JUST HIS OPINION [/*]

Thanks. What is "pft"?

Also, how many fitness levels are there?

[alter ego]

Originally posted by n/t



And? So what? Sadly, she's not here to defend herself so what purpose will this serve except to bash and demean her? She's not on trial here. She's dead. Show some respect. [/*]Now now, n/t - it's only unaccetpable to want to know what Christina looks like.

[nana2]

at any rate it would appear the "stellar" marine murdered the "solid" Marine and her child in cold blood.....so much for the USMC evaluation process

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by daniel green


Thank you!

So this record that the marines gave in the letter, this is for the latest eval period, then, and not for the whole time ML was in the marines? [/*]

I only have MY OPINION for that, and since there was only one set of scores, I would say yes. January 31st 2007 to July 31st 2007. J U S T M Y O P I N I O N

[GentleBreeze]

Originally posted by nuttintodo


Let me see if I got this right...

It's okay for Congressman Mike Turner, representing the district in which Maria's family lives, to have his letter PUBLISHED and everyone can sit back, disseminate his questions and say WOW it so looks like the USMC didn't do a thing to protect Maria.

BUT it's NOT okay for the response from the USMC to be published and disseminated like the Congressman's letter???

Sounds like a double standard to me....

I do agree that her SRB doesn't change the fact she was murdered. Absolutely NOTHING will ever change that.

JMO [/*]

GREAT POST!

:seeya:

[alter ego]

Originally posted by nuttintodo


Let me see if I got this right...

It's okay for Congressman Mike Turner, representing the district in which Maria's family lives, to have his letter PUBLISHED and everyone can sit back, disseminate his questions and say WOW it so looks like the USMC didn't do a thing to protect Maria.

BUT it's NOT okay for the response from the USMC to be published and disseminated like the Congressman's letter???

Sounds like a double standard to me....

I do agree that her SRB doesn't change the fact she was murdered. Absolutely NOTHING will ever change that.

JMO [/*]Sorry, I don't see speculating what any of the issues not described in detail might be, as discussing the responses to the Congressman. :shrug:

[baywench]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


Not if you are a Marine, it isn't.

Tardiness shows a lack of self discipline and is a no no in the military.

imoo [/*]

Yep my daughter was late twice in short period and got put back a rank.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by nuttintodo


snipped

BUT it's NOT okay for the response from the USMC to be published and disseminated like the Congressman's letter???

[/*]

Not if the truth is not perfect, I guess. :rolleyes:

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by AnnieBean


Would the "integrity" possibly be her llittle fib about the dead brother and responsible father?

Why was she tardy, I wonder?
Did I read (or dream I read) yesterday that she had difficulties in basic trainig, or with her physical training? why would that be- ??she was athletic! I would think someone as athletic as she was would be a female marines corps ideal, jmo. [/*]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A12 LCPL was counseled for missing a section Physical Fitness Training session on April 21. 2007. LCPL:Lauterbach claimed that she had overslept and was later counseled that same day for failing to show up for work that at 7:00 a.m.. Her rationale for failing to show up for work at 7:00 a.m. was that her alarm clock was broken.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Q12 ...From the period April 10, 2007 through May 12, 2007 did LCPL Lauterbach have attendance issues, administrative counseling or discipline?...

[daniel green]

Originally posted by marinewife5


I only have MY OPINION for that, and since there was only one set of scores, I would say yes. January 31st 2007 to July 31st 2007. J U S T M Y O P I N I O N [/*]

Thank you.

That makes sense.

The story about the little bro being killed by the father was in boot camp, correct?

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by n/t


link? And what does this have to do with her murder, please? [/*]

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Coldwater


Well I'm one that doesn't. [/*]

And after you posted that it made me realize that someone just popping in on the thread might not know that it had been linked to many times previously and that it was an ongoing discussion.

Thanks for reminding us!

[alter ego]

Originally posted by daniel green


Discussing true facts about this is not bashing or demeaning.

ML's marine record is factual. Her mother waived confidentiality.

It is not disrespectful to discuss the letter. [/*]Speculating what the integrity issues were is not 'discussing true facts'.

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by nuttintodo


Let me see if I got this right...

It's okay for Congressman Mike Turner, representing the district in which Maria's family lives, to have his letter PUBLISHED and everyone can sit back, disseminate his questions and say WOW it so looks like the USMC didn't do a thing to protect Maria.

BUT it's NOT okay for the response from the USMC to be published and disseminated like the Congressman's letter???

Sounds like a double standard to me....

I do agree that her SRB doesn't change the fact she was murdered. Absolutely NOTHING will ever change that.

JMO [/*]

No, I don't think you have it right.

The MC response letter was published, or we wouldn't have it.

The dissemination of both the Turner letter and the MC response is up to the media -- they were given both. If they haven't given the MC response equal dissemination in the press, take the matter up with them.

As for discussing the MC response letter here, I tried doing just that earlier, and was summarily informed that there was nothing in it to discuss, as the answers were perfectly wonderful and Turner should go suck eggs, or something to that effect. Further attempt at discussing the answers in the letter were met with more resistance.

Now the discussion is being had. There are differing opinions it. No double standard as far as I can see. JMO

[bkwits]

Originally posted by marinewife5


ITA. The more i find out about her, the more my heart breaks for her. [/*]

I have no problem with discussing the USMC answers, but some, not most, posters (certainly not you, MW) seem to have a personal reason for denigrating and making disparaging remarks about the victim, like wanting to characterize each remark, or bit of info, casting Maria into the worst light possible.

I sometimes have had to leave the board because of this. But maybe it is my problem that I feel Maria is not here to speak for herself.

I will take each bit of information as it comes out. I will accept when I'm wrong (I was wrong about Cesar living a good life in Mexico).
But as for Maria, I will continue to believe what I think is her side of the story until I learn otherwise. IMO

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by gaelicpeas


Thanks. What is "pft"?

Also, how many fitness levels are there? [/*]

PFT: Physical Fitness Test

For Maria's age, 1st class would be a score of 225, 2nd class would be 175, and 3rd class would be 135. and here's the link (it's pdf, that's why i answered as well as provided the link)

http://www.usmc.mil/news/publications/Documents/MCO%20P6100.12%20W%20CH%201.pdf

[n/t]

Originally posted by GentleBreeze


We discussed extensively the questions asked by the Congressman and now we are not allowed to discuss the answers given by the Marine Corps? Why?

The Congressman wanted them and he got them. I fail to see why his questions met with no resistance but now because we have the link to the MC answers it is not allowed to be discuss.:confused:

imoo [/*]

I think it's wrong because Maria is not here to defend herself. She's not the one on trial here. Her stone cold murderer will be. Why don't you post how brutal her murder was and how she didn't deserve to have her young life sucked out of her by this monster? Why the need to continue to post bad stuff about her just to demean her? What for?

I'm not the moderator so saying you're not allowed is not my decision.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by Janz


Just goes to show what a sad and lonely person she must have been. I feel so very bad for her and Gabriel, but these are public documents! These documents nor anything in them make her any less a victim!! [/*]

Actually, the marines' response goes a bit beyond public record bu ML's mother had given them permission to disclose the details about her record.

That is mentioned in:

Marine Corps Reponse to Congressman Turner's Questions (March 31, 2008) (10 page pdf file)

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/imag...nequestions.pdf

[daniel green]

Originally posted by marinewife5


PFT: Physical Fitness Test

For Maria's age, 1st class would be a score of 225, 2nd class would be 175, and 3rd class would be 135. and here's the link (it's pdf, that's why i answered as well as provided the link)

http://www.usmc.mil/news/publications/Documents/MCO%20P6100.12%20W%20CH%201.pdf [/*]


Thank you.

Now the details in the letter about that make sense.

[daniel green]

Originally posted by n/t


I think it's wrong because Maria is not here to defend herself. snipped. [/*]

It was her mother that gave permission to the marines to give the information and to make it public.

Marine Corps Reponse to Congressman Turner's Questions (March 31, 2008) (10 page pdf file)

http://media.mgnetwork.com/nct/images/links/marinequestions.pdf

Answer to question 28. It says that the executor of ML's estate (her mother) signed a privacy waiver.

[bkwits]

Originally posted by n/t


I think it's wrong because Maria is not here to defend herself. She's not the one on trial here. Her stone cold murderer will be. Why don't you post how brutal her murder was and how she didn't deserve to have her young life sucked out of her by this monster? Why the need to continue to post bad stuff about her just to demean her? What for?

I'm not the moderator so saying you're not allowed is not my decision. [/*]


Well said.

[nelkirk]

Originally posted by hinman
Thanks for making that so clear. makes sense now. [/*]

The congressman gave a specific time period when he asked:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Q12 ...From the period April 10, 2007 through May 12, 2007 did LCPL Lauterbach have attendance issues, administrative counseling or discipline?...

The MC gave him the answer:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A12 LCPL was counseled for missing a section Physical Fitness Training session on April 21. 2007. LCPL:Lauterbach claimed that she had overslept and was later counseled that same day for failing to show up for work that at 7:00 a.m.. Her rationale for failing to show up for work at 7:00 a.m. was that her alarm clock was broken.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The MC was not asked for a complete history of her UAs or Integrity issues, we are not given her entire history...

[baywench]

Originally posted by nana2
at any rate it would appear the "stellar" marine murdered the "solid" Marine and her child in cold blood.....so much for the USMC evaluation process [/*]


Unfortunately they are not psychic evaluators. JMO

[Charlotte]

Originally posted by marinewife5


I only have MY OPINION for that, and since there was only one set of scores, I would say yes. January 31st 2007 to July 31st 2007. J U S T M Y O P I N I O N [/*]

Okay, so in your opinion, why did Lt. Gen. Kramlich give an overview of CL's entire military career, and only this limited time frame for ML, in response to the same question asked about both of them?

[marinewife5]

Originally posted by bkwits


I have no problem with discussing the USMC answers, but some, not most, posters (certainly not you, MW) seem to have a personal reason for denigrating and making disparaging remarks about the victim, like wanting to characterize each remark, or bit of info, casting Maria into the worst light possible.

I sometimes have had to leave the board because of this. But maybe it is my problem that I feel Maria is not here to speak for herself.

I will take each bit of information as it comes out. I will accept when I'm wrong (I was wrong about Cesar living a good life in Mexico).
But as for Maria, I will continue to believe what I think is her side of the story until I learn otherwise. IMO [/*]

she was who she was. you and i disagree on some issues, but we both seem to be on her side. I think everyone here is. issues with tardiness and integrity could have any number of roots. none of us will never know what they are. jmo

[n/t]

Originally posted by daniel green


Discussing true facts about this is not bashing or demeaning.

ML's marine record is factual. Her mother waived confidentiality.

It is not disrespectful to discuss the letter. [/*]

Link to the mother waiving confidentiality.