April 10th to 19

[n/t]

It's been 8 weeks and Nicholas is still missing. We may have some of the answers but many many questions still remain.

Continued prayers that he is safe. :rose:

[Nellie]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by decor


except that Scott was suspected of killing Laci. CF is NOT suspected of killing NF [/*]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Yes, but the point is....why was everyone so suspicious of him?
It wasn't because we witnessed him dumping her body! It was
his body language, things he said, things that he did (like selling her vehicle and trying to sell the house). Yes, he was suspected.....on no proof. Do I suspect C of killing N. Not necessarily, but I'm not dismissing it just because it's a husband missing this time. She's doing some of the same things Scott did......contradicting herself, strange body language, moving from her home and putting her past behind her and starting a new life in such a short time. I was just saying that's why people have a hard time with her being ready to move out so fast. It was in answer to someone questioning why people had a hard time with it.

[Nellie]

I have to wonder why/how it is better to move into another home rather than try to work out something with a present home she owned. Yes, it is a RENT FREE home now, but how long does anyone think it will be Rent free? I don't think it will stay that way forever, do you? So, once the owners decide it's time to charge rent, then what? Many times rent can cost as much or more than a mortgage payment. So, how is this better in the long run? It might seem better right now, but looking at the "big picture" I think it could turn out to be a bad move. I still feel the bank would have worked with her.

I guess I feel the rent free home is a "band-aid" and could cause more problems down the road than staying and trying to hang onto her home she owned (along with the bank). JMO

[Shimz]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I don't know how that works. Would they approve it for the $50 or for the amount he wanted plus the fee before giving him the cash? I would think if it was the ATM charge (which.. THAT is a big fee.. isn't it? I don't know what the fees are anymore cause I always use my bank ATM's only) then they would try to approve the $54 transaction and if he didn't have enough then he would have to enter a different amount. I don't know tho.. I don't use alot of ATM machines because I have my debit card that I use for everything and just get cash back from that.. if I need it. [/*]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I have 2 checking accounts, one I hardly use, and the bank was bought out recently... anyway.. I went to take out $20 from the one i hardly use bc it was right there and i didnt want to pay a fee and they gave me the money no problem. Then I get a letter that i was being charged a $33 overdraft fee...

apparently this bank now will give you money from the ATM even if you don't have the money in there. I had NEVER had that happen before, if I didn't have enough, it wouldn't let me take it out. So when I called, she told me that they are doing this bc in case it is an EMERGENCY and you NEED the money, they give it.

So i ended up paying $30 to take out $20, I was very angry about this new "convenience rule"... so I guess my point is that it depends on the bank =)

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by Nellie
I have to wonder why/how it is better to move into another home rather than try to work out something with a present home she owned. Yes, it is a RENT FREE home now, but how long does anyone think it will be Rent free? I don't think it will stay that way forever, do you? So, once the owners decide it's time to charge rent, then what? Many times rent can cost as much or more than a mortgage payment. So, how is this better in the long run? It might seem better right now, but looking at the "big picture" I think it could turn out to be a bad move. I still feel the bank would have worked with her.

I guess I feel the rent free home is a "band-aid" and could cause more problems down the road than staying and trying to hang onto her home she owned (along with the bank). JMO [/*]

I have to agree with you, Nellie. The bank really doesn't want another house it has to try to sell so I think they would've worked with her, especially due to the unusual circumstances.

Isn't the old owner (CF and NF in this case) still liable for any money left on the mortgage that isn't covered by what they get out of the sale of the house? If that's the case and I believe it is, she still could have a bunch to pay off, especially with the real estate market what it is today (unless its in better shape in Seattle than it is in many other parts of the country).

I'm surprised a "financial advisor" would advise this especially if the mortage was paid up through April as I've heard (of course this may not be true).

It just seems there must be other reasons for her moving so quickly! MOO

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by Nellie
I have to wonder why/how it is better to move into another home rather than try to work out something with a present home she owned. Yes, it is a RENT FREE home now, but how long does anyone think it will be Rent free? I don't think it will stay that way forever, do you? So, once the owners decide it's time to charge rent, then what? Many times rent can cost as much or more than a mortgage payment. So, how is this better in the long run? It might seem better right now, but looking at the "big picture" I think it could turn out to be a bad move. I still feel the bank would have worked with her.

I guess I feel the rent free home is a "band-aid" and could cause more problems down the road than staying and trying to hang onto her home she owned (along with the bank). JMO [/*]

She now has 0 income or will have shortly. She is pregnant. She doesn't have the education to get a good job and her payments with two mortgages is most likely $1500 or more a month. Now she will most likely get no more then 1077 + food stamps from the state once she runs out of money. Or she might be able to get a job paying around 10 an hour so around 1733 a month BEFORE taxes and day care.

Want to tell me how she will be paying for this house, utilities, repairs, and on and on?

Sometimes a band-aid is all you have.

[desmom]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


She now has 0 income or will have shortly. She is pregnant. She doesn't have the education to get a good job and her payments with two mortgages is most likely $1500 or more a month. Now she will most likely get no more then 1077 + food stamps from the state once she runs out of money. Or she might be able to get a job paying around 10 an hour so around 1733 a month BEFORE taxes and day care.

Want to tell me how she will be paying for this house, utilities, repairs, and on and on?

Sometimes a band-aid is all you have. [/*]

Re Education: IIRC, she graduated from the Art Institute of Seattle with a major in graphic design and a minor in photography. I would hope the approx. $50,000 in tuition fees would have provided her with enough education to find a job.

Because she is pregnant and with 2 children under the age of 5 at home, she would qualify for WIC and child care assistance.

jmo

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by desmom


Re Education: IIRC, she graduated from the Art Institute of Seattle with a major in graphic design and a minor in photography. I would hope the approx. $50,000 in tuition fees would have provided her with enough education to find a job.

Because she is pregnant and with 2 children under the age of 5 at home, she would qualify for WIC and child care assistance.

jmo [/*]

I have a friend who graduated from the Art Institute of Seattle. She worked selling house paint. Degrees in art are a dime a dozen here. There just aren't enough jobs to go around.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Curiouser


I have to agree with you, Nellie. The bank really doesn't want another house it has to try to sell so I think they would've worked with her, especially due to the unusual circumstances.

Isn't the old owner (CF and NF in this case) still liable for any money left on the mortgage that isn't covered by what they get out of the sale of the house? If that's the case and I believe it is, she still could have a bunch to pay off, especially with the real estate market what it is today (unless its in better shape in Seattle than it is in many other parts of the country).

I'm surprised a "financial advisor" would advise this especially if the mortage was paid up through April as I've heard (of course this may not be true).

It just seems there must be other reasons for her moving so quickly! MOO [/*]

Hi Curiouser,

There is something called "deed in lieu of foreclosure". From my understanding the bank agrees to take the house back and the owner is not liable. Maybe that is something being done in this case.

I don't know what arrangements would be made to gain Nicholas' signature on the documents. Sometimes a Public Announcement for a specific amount of time in newspapers across the country are used with intent of legal action listed. Examples would be to find a person for a court case on divorce, child custody, etc. The PA would be along with a summons of a court date delivered to the last known residence. If the defendant doesn't answer the petition or show up for court, I believe they are viewed in default and the judge signs the order of divorce or custody, etc. Maybe this can be done with needing to sell a house and not being able to find the other deed holder? Maybe someone else can verify that and speak more knowledgeably.

JMO.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


She now has 0 income or will have shortly. She is pregnant. She doesn't have the education to get a good job and her payments with two mortgages is most likely $1500 or more a month. Now she will most likely get no more then 1077 + food stamps from the state once she runs out of money. Or she might be able to get a job paying around 10 an hour so around 1733 a month BEFORE taxes and day care.

Want to tell me how she will be paying for this house, utilities, repairs, and on and on?

Sometimes a band-aid is all you have. [/*]

You made my point!
What if the "free house" situation is only for 6 months....9 months....1 year. Then what? How will she then pay rent? Get a job paying around $10.00 an hour before taxes and daycare? What will she do then? Want to tell me how she will be paying rent, utilities, etc. when that happens?

I guess I would be thinking of what I need to do to bring in my own income for my future, rather than count on "free rent" from someone. But, I guess I'm more independent and wouldn't want to take "free rent" because I'd feel there would be "expectations" and I'd feel like I was under someone else's "thumb". I'd look for ways to hang onto my own home, which would mean independence for me.

Start up a Daycare! She could make some really good money at that! My kids pay $75.00-$100.00 a week for daycare. Say the lady takes in 10 kids @ $100.00 a week...wow, that's $1000 a week! Sounds like a plan Stan! She'd even be able to be home with her own children! And I bet daycare pays even more in Seattle...we live in a small town.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by Nellie


You made my point!
What if the "free house" situation is only for 6 months....9 months....1 year. Then what? How will she then pay rent? Get a job paying around $10.00 an hour before taxes and daycare? What will she do then? Want to tell me how she will be paying rent, utilities, etc. when that happens?

I guess I would be thinking of what I need to do to bring in my own income for my future, rather than count on "free rent" from someone. But, I guess I'm more independent and wouldn't want to take "free rent" because I'd feel there would be "expectations" and I'd feel like I was under someone else's "thumb". I'd look for ways to hang onto my own home, which would mean independence for me.

Start up a Daycare! She could make some really good money at that! My kids pay $75.00-$100.00 a week for daycare. Say the lady takes in 10 kids @ $100.00 a week...wow, that's $1000 a week! Sounds like a plan Stan! She'd even be able to be home with her own children! And I bet daycare pays even more in Seattle...we live in a small town. [/*]
Wow you are really a super person. I wish I could have been as strong and brilliant as you are. Must be wonderful to know how to react when your whole world is crashing down on you with no way to stop it. Some of us aren't as brilliant and have to try to solve one problem at a time. She has given up a house she couldn't afford to keep up and has a safe place to plan her next move now. Sometimes that all you can do.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by Nellie


You made my point!
What if the "free house" situation is only for 6 months....9 months....1 year. Then what? How will she then pay rent? Get a job paying around $10.00 an hour before taxes and daycare? What will she do then? Want to tell me how she will be paying rent, utilities, etc. when that happens?

I guess I would be thinking of what I need to do to bring in my own income for my future, rather than count on "free rent" from someone. But, I guess I'm more independent and wouldn't want to take "free rent" because I'd feel there would be "expectations" and I'd feel like I was under someone else's "thumb". I'd look for ways to hang onto my own home, which would mean independence for me.

Start up a Daycare! She could make some really good money at that! My kids pay $75.00-$100.00 a week for daycare. Say the lady takes in 10 kids @ $100.00 a week...wow, that's $1000 a week! Sounds like a plan Stan! She'd even be able to be home with her own children! And I bet daycare pays even more in Seattle...we live in a small town. [/*]

Daycare pays like you would not BELIEVE, where I live. I know because I'm paying for it. But starting up a daycare is not without cost or licensing fees, or credentials, etc.

IMO a) she has a degree, which, no matter what it is in, counts for something when looking for work, and *) she has talent and tech savvy, and I have no doubt that *when she is ready* she can find a decent paying job. If I were in a position to do so, I would offer her a WFH gig, with flex hours, within current market rates.

But THIS IS NOT THE TIME for her to be pounding the pavement for any sort of standard paycheck. Another family has seen fit to give her and her kids a safe place in which to settle and sort out the next steps, and their recovery and establishing of routine is top priority. God bless those people and God bless her and her children as they make their way through the next however long without Nicholas.

And speaking of Nicholas, what's the consensus now? Is he dead? Is he alive somewhere and living la vida loca? How are we, or how is she, going to find him and settle all these questions?

[K Anne]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


I so agree with this. I haven't thought of him as a "good guy" for sometime now and I have come to think of Christine and her children as the victims of his "secret life" [/*]

;) I go back and forth about him. Today I have felt he is a real rat *******. And I can't figure out anymore whether I think he is alive or not.

Has anyone established a link for where CF says he is leading a secret life? I don't mean where LE or Harlett conveyed it; I mean something straight from CF. Because, even at risk of the rest of you mocking me, I can't quite believe she has said it, if I don't see it in her own words.

One thing is sure: his daughter is hurting because of this. If it is of his own volition, how bad of him. If it is by random or premeditated foul play, LET'S FIND HIM. Otherwise she may go many years assuming responsibility for his being gone. It is no way for a little girl to grow up.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by CAT TOY
Well so that you didnt have to sign up I posted what pretty much he said...it was very brief, there was nothing more than that. No posts, no photos, nothing more than a short q & a and the cryptic note, 2nd of which I've read now; usually a little touchy on the topic of "who are you" type of question. I can't c&p the page and post it here. So it is not word for word but that is the jist of what he wrote on classmates. There were no connections listed...that I could see; nothing on that front. Dont know if he's a reunion kinda guy..:shrug: [/*]

I am not a reunion person at all, and that's why I don't sign up there. So -- many thanks!!

Has anyone visited his high school alumni pages? I admit I don't know what high school he went to, but... I do visit my own periodically and sometimes there's information available that you wouldn't expect. Just something to look at.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by CAT TOY


omg that's right!!!

(dont ANY ONE SUGGEST SHE WORK) esp whilst preggers...

:shrug:

GMAB :no: [/*]

Ok. Instead, suggest that she work while pregnant (with history of miscarriage), while trying to find her husband (who she just found out shocking things about), and while trying to keep her children safe and soothed while they try to understand why the heck they are suddenly without one of their two parents. And suggest that she get some kind of whatever job that may or may not pay a mortgage AND necessitate daycare -- and pay for daycare -- for two kids?

Kind of unreasonable! She's going to need some help, and !! *someone is giving her help*. THANK GOD.

And FWIW, a Yahoo article on stolen laptops

http://tech.yahoo.com/blog/null/88341

[inv]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


I so agree with this. I haven't thought of him as a "good guy" for sometime now and I have come to think of Christine and her children as the victims of his "secret life" [/*]


Do you happen to know what his "secret life" may be?

Do you know Nicholas?

Do you KNOW Christine?

How do you know that NF's wife and children are not the SURVIVORS of *him as a victim* rather than victims of HIM?

I am sorry, but I had to reply to this post. How did you arrive at the conclusion that NF was/is not a "good guy"?

Please ellaborate on how you are basing this comment.

[inv]

moonlessnite
Member

Registered: Mar 2008
Location:
Posts: 120
"I'm not clear if this will post as a reply or new thread. Anyway, I live in South Seattle and Christine is a casual acquaintance of mine, and I have seen Nicholas around once or twice. I've been wanting to post a comment but it took forever to get activated here. Since my experience of Christine's personality is coming from in-person interactions and not from online forums or the etsy community, I thought it may add a layer to the discussion.

When I first realized it was Christine who was the wife of the local missing man, I immediately thought, oh well, he left her. And then I thought, she knows something. All concern of a missing man in the area went away as I was confident it was a domestic dispute situation. The first responses of a few other casual acquaintances of hers were, "oh, she finally drove him away", and "maybe she killed him off". The reason many of us thought this is because of the way she talked, and talked and talked - that she drove him crazy pestering him and boring him all the time, basically.
We tried to avoid letting her start talking, as she would go on forever about herself, even in situations where that was inappropriate. She was unaware of the environment around her and how she affects other people, and how to behave. Her monologues about herself, and being a wife and mother (no identity otherwise?) were very emphatic and forceful, and she certainly would use forceful tones and a challenging defensiveness in order to make her thoughts heard and agreed with. She also appeared to be someone who did very little outside the house and had a complex about this and her outside abilities (lack thereof), and overcompensated by insisting on the importance of her AHM (at home mother) job.

An aspect related to this I'd like to offer, having "experienced her personality" is the likelihood of a personality disorder, which could explain this situation. I noticed her behavior in my interactions with her to be similar to narcissistic behavior, and I feel she could have NPD (narcissistic personality disorder). http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_a_Narscissist
Narcissistic people will go to extreme lengths to protect their fragile sense of identity if it's threatened. Normal behavior and actions are not considered. Protecting the self is the goal and it must be achieved at all costs.
I never thought she killed Nicholas off, but when it was suggested, I accepted it as a possibility. But I do think if he left her, she knew it, and her actions have been to cover her embarrassment and protect herself, by lying until she believes it herself.
This is why she won't go to vigils (she's pissed off, not mourning) and why she won't look for him.
I don't know why he would leave the kids w/o money, but I do know people w/o options do desperate things. He was always smiling and friendly, but I don't know anything else about him except something in his personality was interested in marrying a narcissist. It takes 2 to tango. I see him as a youthful, energetic, charming man who likely has many other relationship possibilities available to him.
Also, your "Saturn Return" http://newage-directory.com/saturn.html happens at 28, and is a time to revise life if it does not suit your true self.

I found Christine's actions related to this situation questionable, and her behavior was not lining up with the story. I felt badly for thinking this way, wanting to be compassionate and give the benefit of the doubt. So, I was very comforted to see on so many forums that so many other people who have or have not met her feel the same way and question her as well.
What bothered me immediately (so many things have bothered me since and you have all pointed them out thankfully) about this case is her very first interview wherein she stated "if you don't find him these kids won't have a daddy", etc. The fact that she placed responsibility for finding him on "you" (police?, media?), and that she went to the worst case scenario so early on, in front of her children, felt off, to me. As if she knew he left her and she could not find him as he didn't want to be found by her, and to guilt him that his kids won't have a daddy.

Knowing the people involved in this kind of thing is weird, and having the impression that I have of them makes me really want to have the truth be known, whatever is turns out to be exactly. If this woman is perpetuating a hoax (and financial scam), it should be known and she should face the repercussions. If she did worse than that, she should be caught. I hope the detectives can see through her transparent behavior and keep an eye on her.
OK, I think this is long enough and I've said
everything I've been wanting to say now..."



I had not seen this post until tonight. It was refferred to on another board. During my two-week or so conversations with CF, I got the same impression. I was sympathetic towards her. As time went on, I began to notice how she would answer my questions in a way that she emphasized her own needs, wants, desires, misfortunes, etc.

When I asked questions about NF, and what was being done to find him, she displayed an almost immediate need to change the subject to something about the house, finances, etc.

I got the sense that she was angry. She seemed to be angry with NF and angry at everyone who may have views or ideas which oppesed her own.

I am left with the impression that it was all CF all the time in their home.

These are just my thoughts, having had ono-on-one communication with CF. My opinions are just that. They are opinions based upon my direct communication with her, not based upon hearsay or what I found on a message board.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


I so agree with this. I haven't thought of him as a "good guy" for sometime now and I have come to think of Christine and her children as the victims of his "secret life" [/*]

Amazing - LE has not ruled out foul play and Nicholas could very well be dead (murdered I believe CF said) and you still don't think of him as a victim. To my knowledge he is still missing and is still "the victim" until proven otherwise.

[n/t]

Originally posted by K Anne


Ok. Instead, suggest that she work while pregnant (with history of miscarriage), while trying to find her husband (who she just found out shocking things about), and while trying to keep her children safe and soothed while they try to understand why the heck they are suddenly without one of their two parents. And suggest that she get some kind of whatever job that may or may not pay a mortgage AND necessitate daycare -- and pay for daycare -- for two kids?

Kind of unreasonable! She's going to need some help, and !! *someone is giving her help*. THANK GOD.

And FWIW, a Yahoo article on stolen laptops

http://tech.yahoo.com/blog/null/88341 [/*]

She found out shocking things about? Do you have a link to where the wife claims this? As far as I know, the detective was the one who said Nicholas may have lead a secret life? There was nothing ever mentioned about a shocking secret life.

Please tell us where you heard this. TIA!

[n/t]

Originally posted by inv



Do you happen to know what his "secret life" may be?

Do you know Nicholas?

Do you KNOW Christine?

How do you know that NF's wife and children are not the SURVIVORS of *him as a victim* rather than victims of HIM?

I am sorry, but I had to reply to this post. How did you arrive at the conclusion that NF was/is not a "good guy"?

Please ellaborate on how you are basing this comment. [/*]


Maybe we're hanging out on the wrong board. KAnne mentioned something about the wife finding out something shocking?

How do posters come to the conclusion that Nicholas is this bad bad guy now without having any evidence whatsoever of what this secret may be? We don't even know if it was even a secret. We only have the wife's word that she didn't know anything about it. What if she did? :shrug:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Mornin n/t

I just looked up at the title and it still says "Nicholas Francisco 28, Seattle, 2-13-08 (car found), so I'm assuming this forum is still about HIM, not Christine.

[Postergeist]

Originally posted by n/t



Maybe we're hanging out on the wrong board. KAnne mentioned something about the wife finding out something shocking?

How do posters come to the conclusion that Nicholas is this bad bad guy now without having any evidence whatsoever of what this secret may be? We don't even know if it was even a secret. We only have the wife's word that she didn't know anything about it. What if she did? :shrug:

Mornin' n/t! I've been reading the past few days and keep thinking how convoluted this case seems to be getting. The "nevers", the "always" the "wouldn'ts" and "I knows" from a key partner of the missing husband, what LE has said, the interesting post by inv...and yes, I too have thought about NPD being a part of the puzzle in his disappearance.

A book I've been reading had a paragraph that just struck a chord with me and the disappearance of Nicholas. It mentioned
"memory always gives way to desire".....

It was in reference to Frederich Nietzsche's comments on when our memory of having committed an ignoble act conflicts with our desire to believe that we are "too honorable" to have possibly committed the deed...

that in effect people lie when it suits their purpose, to protect someone, when they don't want something to be known, etc.

It's just not appearing to be Camelot anymore with this MP case, imo.

~still I have hope for Nicholas to be found alive~

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


I have a friend who graduated from the Art Institute of Seattle. She worked selling house paint. Degrees in art are a dime a dozen here. There just aren't enough jobs to go around. [/*]

Is that a 50-50 split on career paths testimonals after a Seattle Art Institute degree? NF graduates and obtains a Publicis graphic designer job while person X gradates to a Sherwin Williams-like sales clerk job. Perhaps other factors are in play. According to CF's myspace she is a self-proclaimed entrepreneur.
jmo

[Miss Behavin]

Well, I have to say "thank you" to INV for the post and bringing over the post by moonlessnite. I hadn't seen that one yet!

It's nice to hear from people who have actually been involved in some type of conversation with the wife or family of NF. I've had bad feelings about this case from the very beginning and I still believe the wife knew he was going to leave JMO. I also feel all the interviews begging the public to find him was a way for the wife to fight back in her way and guilt or embarrass him into returning home. JMO.

The wife has access to the internet herself and many avenues in which to express her feelings and thoughts about this ordeal. If somebody posts something that isn't true, she surely has the capability of posting her responses on a site of her choice. It would be more beneficial for her at this point to step forward, tell all that she knows, and be done with it. I think honesty in this situation would be more likely to grant her the results she is looking for. JMO

[Musterion]

Originally posted by sadiemay62


They are only victims IF he indeed had a secret life. We don't know that for sure yet. How about waiting to see?? jmo [/*]

Hi sadiemay,

I think they are victims whether he had a secret life or not. He's gone and they are being affected adversely in many ways because of his disappearance. JMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by inv

How do you know that NF's wife and children are not the SURVIVORS of *him as a victim* rather than victims of HIM?
[/*]

Hi inv,

I think you are right. They are survivors in the sense that they are carrying on through a loss. But, I believe they are victims as well. Of circumstance if nothing else. JMO.

[dianaelaine]

Haven't been around in awhile ... just thought I'd drop a few links:

About 'who broke the internet':

http://www.mathewingram.com/work/200...-the-internet/

http://twitter.com/michaelDRoe/statuses/784499119

So ... not too much significance in what NF wrote, doesn't seem.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by K Anne


Ok. Instead, suggest that she work while pregnant (with history of miscarriage), while trying to find her husband (who she just found out shocking things about), and while trying to keep her children safe and soothed while they try to understand why the heck they are suddenly without one of their two parents. And suggest that she get some kind of whatever job that may or may not pay a mortgage AND necessitate daycare -- and pay for daycare -- for two kids?

Kind of unreasonable! She's going to need some help, and !! *someone is giving her help*. THANK GOD.

And FWIW, a Yahoo article on stolen laptops

http://tech.yahoo.com/blog/null/88341 [/*]

IA, the 'help" is very generous, IMO. IIRC, Seattle's tree house guy was also provided a motorhome for housing. I still wonder why the help is from apparent strangers? Where is CF's family during this crisis? Was renting the home an option considered? IMO, puzzle pieces are missing. Where is Nicholas? TIA
jmo

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Nellie


You made my point!
What if the "free house" situation is only for 6 months....9 months....1 year. Then what? How will she then pay rent? Get a job paying around $10.00 an hour before taxes and daycare? What will she do then? Want to tell me how she will be paying rent, utilities, etc. when that happens?

I guess I would be thinking of what I need to do to bring in my own income for my future, rather than count on "free rent" from someone. But, I guess I'm more independent and wouldn't want to take "free rent" because I'd feel there would be "expectations" and I'd feel like I was under someone else's "thumb". I'd look for ways to hang onto my own home, which would mean independence for me.

Start up a Daycare! She could make some really good money at that! My kids pay $75.00-$100.00 a week for daycare. Say the lady takes in 10 kids @ $100.00 a week...wow, that's $1000 a week! Sounds like a plan Stan! She'd even be able to be home with her own children! And I bet daycare pays even more in Seattle...we live in a small town. [/*]

The daycare idea might be a good alternative for her til she has the baby. It is very expensive for daycare around here. I paid almost $900 a month when mine were very young and $300 for before and after school care. BUT.. low income families can get help with all or part of daycare expenses from the state and with 3 children and not alot of income.. she would most definately qualify for that if she wanted to utilize it.

The other thing I wanted to add is... I am not sure what small town you live in or even what state but here in Washington the minimum wage is.. I think.. $8.07 an hour. You can work here at McDonalds or other fast food restaurants and make $10 an hour or more. I am really not sure what the market is for her type of work but if she wanted to actively pursue something better than I am sure that she could find something that was more lucrative for her.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Amazing - LE has not ruled out foul play and Nicholas could very well be dead (murdered I believe CF said) and you still don't think of him as a victim. To my knowledge he is still missing and is still "the victim" until proven otherwise. [/*]

I agree, Rainy.

Nicholas is a victim. Until we know if he is dead or alive I think we have to keep that in mind. And even if he is alive he apparently has some things that affected him enough to make choices that caused pain to others and to himself. Unless he is totally void of any emotion he would be suffering, even if it is his own doing. JMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by inv

I had not seen this post until tonight. It was refferred to on another board. During my two-week or so conversations with CF, I got the same impression. I was sympathetic towards her. As time went on, I began to notice how she would answer my questions in a way that she emphasized her own needs, wants, desires, misfortunes, etc.

When I asked questions about NF, and what was being done to find him, she displayed an almost immediate need to change the subject to something about the house, finances, etc.

I got the sense that she was angry. She seemed to be angry with NF and angry at everyone who may have views or ideas which oppesed her own.

I am left with the impression that it was all CF all the time in their home.

These are just my thoughts, having had ono-on-one communication with CF. My opinions are just that. They are opinions based upon my direct communication with her, not based upon hearsay or what I found on a message board. [/*]

inv,

Based on your observations and conversations and trying to bring them into line with Nicholas' disappearance I'm trying to understand what, if any, bearing her behaviour or what she's saying has on Nicholas' disappearance.

TIA.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by EG~Lives


They're victims either way...he's GONE. [/*]

EXACTLY!

whether he ran away and is dealing with his own demons or he met with foul play.. they are still victims. It is just a matter of WHO victimized them.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Musterion


I agree, Rainy.

Nicholas is a victim. Until we know if he is dead or alive I think we have to keep that in mind. And even if he is alive he apparently has some things that affected him enough to make choices that caused pain to others and to himself. Unless he is totally void of any emotion he would be suffering, even if it is his own doing. JMO. [/*]

ITA - I just hate that people are making wild speculations about him and he could be dead floating in a lake that nobody will search.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Inv
I had not seen this post until tonight. It was refferred to on another board. During my two-week or so conversations with CF, I got the same impression. I was sympathetic towards her. As time went on, I began to notice how she would answer my questions in a way that she emphasized her own needs, wants, desires, misfortunes, etc.

When I asked questions about NF, and what was being done to find him, she displayed an almost immediate need to change the subject to something about the house, finances, etc.

I got the sense that she was angry. She seemed to be angry with NF and angry at everyone who may have views or ideas which oppesed her own.

I am left with the impression that it was all CF all the time in their home.

These are just my thoughts, having had ono-on-one communication with CF. My opinions are just that. They are opinions based upon my direct communication with her, not based upon hearsay or what I found on a message board. [/*]

I'm sorry but IMO moonlessnite had an agenda which was obvious from her very first post. She came here to defame Christine's character and be hostile to anyone that didn't see things her way.

That being said... this the first that I have heard that you were also talking to Christine and am grateful for you observations of your communications with her.

I do think that whether Christine believes that Nic left on his own or if she does indeed think that he is dead somewhere.. that anger is a very normal emotion to have. We all grieve differently and there are many steps to grief that many psychologists have said is the healthy way to grieve... anger is one of them.

As my counselor has always told me. ANGER=PAIN.. if you are not hurt then there is no reason to be angry. When I am hurt.. I automatically just become angry also.. that is easier for me to deal with then the pain and is my way of coping. I don't know that this is true for Christine but it very well could be.

If Nic was murdered then it would be perfectly normal for her to feel anger towards him leaving her.. leaving her raise the children alone... leaving her to have another child without him. Not that he would deserve it or COULD have helped it... but still a normal emotion. If Nic left on his own.. even more so.

As for the making everything about her.. well.. I think that many think that she is a bit narcissistic in her thinking. I think that in her blog that she even said the same when she said that her personality traits shouldn't matter... what should matter is that he is missing. (my paraphrasing) Many people are this way... she is not alone in that at all. I think to some degree we are all like this.. some of us just have a better filter on what comes out of our mouths and when then others of us do.

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by Musterion


inv,

Based on your observations and conversations and trying to bring them into line with Nicholas' disappearance I'm trying to understand what, if any, bearing her behaviour or what she's saying has on Nicholas' disappearance.

TIA. [/*]

But isn't thay exactly why we are here......to discuss the case? We don't know why he disappeared so her behavior could give us some clues into his life before he left. The spouses behavior has been discussed many times in other "missing' cases.

Some people believe (and I am one) that Christine's behavior/actions seem to point to underlying issues that may be having an effect on the SEARCH for Nicholas. Christine was very vocal in the begining of this case and now it seems that some things that she said may not have been entrirely true. It is natural because she is NF's spouse to wonder why. :shrug:

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I'm sorry but IMO moonlessnite had an agenda which was obvious from her very first post. She came here to defame Christine's character and be hostile to anyone that didn't see things her way.

That being said... this the first that I have heard that you were also talking to Christine and am grateful for you observations of your communications with her.

I do think that whether Christine believes that Nic left on his own or if she does indeed think that he is dead somewhere.. that anger is a very normal emotion to have. We all grieve differently and there are many steps to grief that many psychologists have said is the healthy way to grieve... anger is one of them.

As my counselor has always told me. ANGER=PAIN.. if you are not hurt then there is no reason to be angry. When I am hurt.. I automatically just become angry also.. that is easier for me to deal with then the pain and is my way of coping. I don't know that this is true for Christine but it very well could be.

If Nic was murdered then it would be perfectly normal for her to feel anger towards him leaving her.. leaving her raise the children alone... leaving her to have another child without him. Not that he would deserve it or COULD have helped it... but still a normal emotion. If Nic left on his own.. even more so.

As for the making everything about her.. well.. I think that many think that she is a bit narcissistic in her thinking. I think that in her blog that she even said the same when she said that her personality traits shouldn't matter... what should matter is that he is missing. (my paraphrasing) Many people are this way... she is not alone in that at all. I think to some degree we are all like this.. some of us just have a better filter on what comes out of our mouths and when then others of us do. [/*]

I agree that it is normal for a spouse to feel angry when the other spouse is murdered (with the situation, perp..etc). I respectfully disagree that it is "normal" for the spouse to feel angry at her/his spouse when they are a victim of foul play (especially murder).

There are instances when after the facts of the murder are known, that the spouse may feel that his/her spouse did something that contributed to the murder risk (either accidentally or foolishly), thus causing the surviving spouse to be angry with the deceased spouse. However that does not apply here.

IF Christine does not know what happened to Nicholas as she claims, please explain to me how she (or any spouse that does not know how the other spouse died) could be ANGRY at that spouse ???. This in no way makes sense to me and I would really like to know how you came to this conclusion because I have tried.......even googled.....and cannot figure out why you think this :shrug:

In a way I am glad you brought this up because it relates to the fact that I find it very strange that Christine is angry with Nicholas even though (again in her words) she has NO CLUE what happened to him.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


But isn't thay exactly why we are here......to discuss the case? We don't know why he disappeared so her behavior could give us some clues into his life before he left. The spouses behavior has been discussed many times in other "missing' cases.

Some people believe (and I am one) that Christine's behavior/actions seem to point to underlying issues that may be having an effect on the SEARCH for Nicholas. Christine was very vocal in the begining of this case and now it seems that some things that she said may not have been entrirely true. It is natural because she is NF's spouse to wonder why. :shrug: [/*]

Hi beetlebrow,

I think it's good to question my motives, or my post rather! And that is all that I am trying to do with inv's post. Questioning.

I think in any missing persons case the spouse should be scrutinized. I think it is important.

I should have phrased my post better. I should have asked 'based on your conversations with Christine do you now feel that she had something to do with Nicholas' disappearance and why.' Because answering that question might be important to Nicholas' case. Maybe there was something said that can shed more light on helping us find Nicholas.

Beetlebrow, while I don't share your suspicions of Christine, I respect that you have your own viewpoint.

Thank you for helping me clarify my thoughts!

[beetlebrow]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Musterion


Hi beetlebrow,

I think it's good to question my motives, or my post rather! And that is all that I am trying to do with inv's post. Questioning.

I think in any missing persons case the spouse should be scrutinized. I think it is important.

I should have phrased my post better. I should have asked 'based on your conversations with Christine do you now feel that she had something to do with Nicholas' disappearance and why.' Because answering that question might be important to Nicholas' case. Maybe there was something said that can shed more light on helping us find Nicholas.

Beetlebrow, while I don't share your suspicions of Christine, I respect that you have your own viewpoint.

Oh my.......I guess I thought your question reflected a belief that examination of CF's behavior would not be helpful in the search for Nicholas. You are right......my bad. Thank you for being so polite!.

:seeya:

[Musterion]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


I agree that it is normal for a spouse to feel angry when the other spouse is murdered (with the situation, perp..etc). I respectfully disagree that it is "normal" for the spouse to feel angry at her/his spouse when they are a victim of foul play (especially murder).

There are instances when after the facts of the murder are known, that the spouse may feel that his/her spouse did something that contributed to the murder risk (either accidentally or foolishly), thus causing the surviving spouse to be angry with the deceased spouse. However that does not apply here.

IF Christine does not know what happened to Nicholas as she claims, please explain to me how she (or any spouse that does not know how the other spouse died) could be ANGRY at that spouse ???. This in no way makes sense to me and I would really like to know how you came to this conclusion because I have tried.......even googled.....and cannot figure out why you think this :shrug:

In a way I am glad you brought this up because it relates to the fact that I find it very strange that Christine is angry with Nicholas even though (again in her words) she has NO CLUE what happened to him. [/*]

Beetlebrow,

Emotions and behaviours are so hard to read at times, aren't they?

Here is a short read that may (or may not! Ha!) be helpful.

http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=8444&cn=58

"not everyone will experience all of these stages, or, if all are experienced, they won't necessarily occur in this particular order. "

and

"After people have passed through denial and accepted that the loss has occurred (or will shortly occur), they may begin to feel Anger at the loss and the unfairness of it. They may become angry at the person who has been lost (or is dying). Feelings of abandonment may also occur. "

I think, along with our age and maturity and personality, the emotions can be embellished or we can get stuck in one stage. JMO.

:)

[Musterion]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


Oh my.......I guess I thought your question reflected a belief that examination of CF's behavior would not be helpful in the search for Nicholas. You are right......my bad. Thank you for being so polite!.

:seeya: [/*]

You're welcome.

LOL! Things can be so misread, sometimes, when we aren't face to face!

I don't usually have an issue with investigating anyone. But, my heart hurts, sometimes, with how the questions are asked or the comments are made!!!

:)

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


I agree that it is normal for a spouse to feel angry when the other spouse is murdered (with the situation, perp..etc). I respectfully disagree that it is "normal" for the spouse to feel angry at her/his spouse when they are a victim of foul play (especially murder).

There are instances when after the facts of the murder are known, that the spouse may feel that his/her spouse did something that contributed to the murder risk (either accidentally or foolishly), thus causing the surviving spouse to be angry with the deceased spouse. However that does not apply here.

IF Christine does not know what happened to Nicholas as she claims, please explain to me how she (or any spouse that does not know how the other spouse died) could be ANGRY at that spouse ???. This in no way makes sense to me and I would really like to know how you came to this conclusion because I have tried.......even googled.....and cannot figure out why you think this :shrug:

In a way I am glad you brought this up because it relates to the fact that I find it very strange that Christine is angry with Nicholas even though (again in her words) she has NO CLUE what happened to him. [/*]

Just as Musterion pointed out.. it is completely normal to feel anger even at a spouse that was found to be murdered. It is one of the stages of grief and is very well documented in the "grief cycle" theory.. although humans are not black and white.. I think the long term goal is to get to the acceptance stage and to get there you may have to deal with the feelings of anger for the person leaving you behind. You hear it often.. WHY did they have to be there then? WHY did they have to get behind the wheel of the car? ETC ETC.. add on to that the feelings of betrayal that she is probably feeling because of finding out about a secret life that he didn't include her in. Not sure how many of you have dealt with finding out that your entire life has been a lie.. but it is not a fun thing. If this is true about Nic then she has every right to be angry at him for lying to her. That would be a normal emotion. Except unlike most of us that find something out like that.. she can't get answers from him. She is left to speculate what it all meant and I am sure has made it 100 x worse in her head then was the reality because she has no answers or resolution.

Curious about this statement of yours...

"There are instances when after the facts of the murder are known, that the spouse may feel that his/her spouse did something that contributed to the murder risk (either accidentally or foolishly), thus causing the surviving spouse to be angry with the deceased spouse. However that does not apply here."

How could you possibly know that doesn't apply here? THAT very well could be what she is dealing with but doesn't know yet.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by CAT TOY
believe me the anger stage of grief does NOT occur this quickly; not in this case or the mccann case. The anger, rest assured comes much later.....after the heart breaks and you cant feel the sorrow anymore every day. From What I've exp in life anyway.

The anger this early on, and the quick to move on type of scenario is just as wrong in this case as it is in the Peterson case. Both are examples of inappropriate behavior in a spouse.

CT [/*]

Scott Peterson killed his wife. There is no proof that Christine killed Nicholas.. unless we don't believe the detective in the case?

There is proof that Nic had something else going on in his life that he didn't tell her about.. not sure if this was sexual, emotional, both or an addiction but still something that she wasn't aware of. IMO it wouldn't take months and months of knowing this before you became angry about it. If that something led him to be in harms way then it would be completely normal for her to feel anger at him for putting himself in that position and leaving her to deal with everything.

Grief is a very private thing as I have said before. Some people move quickly through it and others don't. My best friend died 16 years ago... and as stupid as it sounds now to say.. I remember being sooo mad at her for not going to the doctor and for not doing something before it was too late.

We are also dealing with someone who by all outside appearances is a very devoted christian with faith that if God puts her in it.. he will bring her through it. Many that don't have a close relationship with God.. might not understand that and take it as something different.

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by Musterion


Beetlebrow,

Emotions and behaviours are so hard to read at times, aren't they?

Here is a short read that may (or may not! Ha!) be helpful.

http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=8444&cn=58

"not everyone will experience all of these stages, or, if all are experienced, they won't necessarily occur in this particular order. "

and

"After people have passed through denial and accepted that the loss has occurred (or will shortly occur), they may begin to feel Anger at the loss and the unfairness of it. They may become angry at the person who has been lost (or is dying). Feelings of abandonment may also occur. "

I think, along with our age and maturity and personality, the emotions can be embellished or we can get stuck in one stage. JMO.

:) [/*]

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by Musterion


Beetlebrow,

Emotions and behaviours are so hard to read at times, aren't they?

Here is a short read that may (or may not! Ha!) be helpful.

http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=8444&cn=58

"not everyone will experience all of these stages, or, if all are experienced, they won't necessarily occur in this particular order. "

and

"After people have passed through denial and accepted that the loss has occurred (or will shortly occur), they may begin to feel Anger at the loss and the unfairness of it. They may become angry at the person who has been lost (or is dying). Feelings of abandonment may also occur. "

I think, along with our age and maturity and personality, the emotions can be embellished or we can get stuck in one stage. JMO.

:) [/*]


This is from a book called Death and Dying. CF showed anger from the beginning ......how could she know he was dead or dying??.

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


Just as Musterion pointed out.. it is completely normal to feel anger even at a spouse that was found to be murdered. It is one of the stages of grief and is very well documented in the "grief cycle" theory.. although humans are not black and white.. I think the long term goal is to get to the acceptance stage and to get there you may have to deal with the feelings of anger for the person leaving you behind. You hear it often.. WHY did they have to be there then? WHY did they have to get behind the wheel of the car? ETC ETC.. add on to that the feelings of betrayal that she is probably feeling because of finding out about a secret life that he didn't include her in. Not sure how many of you have dealt with finding out that your entire life has been a lie.. but it is not a fun thing. If this is true about Nic then she has every right to be angry at him for lying to her. That would be a normal emotion. Except unlike most of us that find something out like that.. she can't get answers from him. She is left to speculate what it all meant and I am sure has made it 100 x worse in her head then was the reality because she has no answers or resolution.

Curious about this statement of yours...

"There are instances when after the facts of the murder are known, that the spouse may feel that his/her spouse did something that contributed to the murder risk (either accidentally or foolishly), thus causing the surviving spouse to be angry with the deceased spouse. However that does not apply here."

How could you possibly know that doesn't apply here? THAT very well could be what she is dealing with but doesn't know yet. [/*]


I don't quite know how to make myself clearer. We are not talking about a spouse that we KNOW is dead or dying so your anger theories do not apply unless CF Knows NF is dead. Is that what you are saying??? She knows that he is dead?

The instances where the spouse is angry because they believe for one reason or another that the spouse contributed to their own murder does not apply because.........We do NOT know NF has been murdered ........so how would we know he did something accidentally or foolishly that put him in harms way.

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by beetlebrow



This is from a book called Death and Dying. CF showed anger from the beginning ......how could she know he was dead or dying??. [/*]


I want to know where the evidence is that CF was angry at NF at the beginning, or at any time? I did see a blog entry where she appeared to be angry at internet posters gossiping about her, and heard lots of talk about her being *angry*, but didn't see any specific written note, message, blog entry, etc. that showed her being angry with Nicholas. I saw only speculation that she was angry with him for reasons such as she had taken most of his pictures off of the internet, for example.
Where are examples that she was angry with him, from the beginning? Links, please.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by beetlebrow



This is from a book called Death and Dying. CF showed anger from the beginning ......how could she know he was dead or dying??. [/*]

You're right beetlebrow, the link I provided is from that book. But, the book by Elizabeth Kubler-Ross, was written to include not just death but any form of personal loss such as jobs, income, freedom, divorce and even infertility. The five stages of grief are experienced in any of those.

You and I are coming from different perspectives. I hear you saying that you feel that after Nicholas disappeared his wife exhibited behaviours and emotions that didn't fit with what was going on. I hear that you are saying that you saw her as mostly angry. I didn't see anger immediately from CF. I saw shock. I saw fear and when I did see anger it was directed at anyone disbelieving that Nicholas would leave on his own accord. So, my assessment wasn't that she came off as just purely angry from the beginning. She was adamant on her interviews, but I didn't see that as anger. I heard her speak kindly about Nicholas, that he was a good person.

It doesn't make you wrong and me right. It is just perspective. And, I think, it is ok to disagree. I'm not trying to convince anyone of my viewpoint, I'm just voicing my viewpoint and when I see a question that I feel I can add an insight to or a context that I don't see being thought about then I jump in. Maybe it will help and maybe it won't.

I do respect that other's have different views and if these all keep Nicholas' case in the forefront then I think that is a good thing. We all want him found! JMO.

[Silver_Dove]

I think when Christine posted that the boards are 40 steps behind the LE she was total correct, even if she did delete it. I think you are all still 40 steps behind.

[desmom]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove
I think when Christine posted that the boards are 40 steps behind the LE she was total correct, even if she did delete it. I think you are all still 40 steps behind. [/*]

IIRC, it was 30 steps.

IMO, the lady focuses too much on what is happening on crime sleuthing message boards and not on what is important.

jmo

[need2no]

Friday, April 11th in Family by Christine

http://thefranciscos.com/

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by beetlebrow



I don't quite know how to make myself clearer. We are not talking about a spouse that we KNOW is dead or dying so your anger theories do not apply unless CF Knows NF is dead. Is that what you are saying??? She knows that he is dead?

The instances where the spouse is angry because they believe for one reason or another that the spouse contributed to their own murder does not apply because.........We do NOT know NF has been murdered ........so how would we know he did something accidentally or foolishly that put him in harms way. [/*]

I don't know how to make myself clearer. She has felt from the beginning that he was dead. As far as I have heard.. nothing to this date that has been found.. has led her away from believing that he is no longer living. I am not saying this is what actually happened to him but what she thinks happens plays into what she is saying and/or doing.

I didn't see anger in the beginning as others did.. I saw DENIAL.. denial that he would leave them.. denial that their marriage was not what she thought it was. denial that he could have run off for a reason not known to her. denial that she might not have known him like she thought that she did... which leads right into what I have been talking about with grief.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one. We see things differently. No harm.. no foul.. just differing perspectives. I see it through my life experiences and you see it thru yours.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by inv


I assume you are speaking for yourself since you don't know what any other poster may/may not know. [/*]


:rolleyes:

This is true.. so so true.. isn't it inv?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Oh I see that is why Christine is still being dissected, posts about her personality being reposted and all the worry about her getting a job are all here now. Or are you just doing that because she quit talking to you after you posting something she said to you in private? [/*]

I wanted to say but didn't. Thank you!

Nothing like someone with an agenda of their own that really has nothing to do with finding missing people but in only victimizing them further.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by need2no
Friday, April 11th in Family by Christine

http://thefranciscos.com/ [/*]

In the length of time it took her to type all of that out, she could have added a picture of her missing husband to her blog and to her MySpace.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by desmom


IIRC, it was 30 steps.

IMO, the lady focuses too much on what is happening on crime sleuthing message boards and not on what is important.

jmo [/*]

It was 30 steps, but why she felt the need to make a game out of this is disturbing IMO.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by CAT TOY
believe me the anger stage of grief does NOT occur this quickly; not in this case or the mccann case. The anger, rest assured comes much later.....after the heart breaks and you cant feel the sorrow anymore every day. From What I've exp in life anyway.

The anger this early on, and the quick to move on type of scenario is just as wrong in this case as it is in the Peterson case. Both are examples of inappropriate behavior in a spouse.

CT [/*]

The anger stage of grief can happen IMMEDIATELY.

BELIEVE ME.

Everyone responds to grief, shock, trauma, etc *differently*. Just because that anger stage takes/took longer to come forward in some other case or in your own case does not mean that's how it goes for everyone.

There is an awful lot of judgment here! If my spouse ever goes missing, I will come directly here and you all will have an absolute field day. Because I guarantee you, almost everything I do will be considered inappropriate behavior.

THERE ARE NO RULES for how to behave when your spouse goes missing.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by beetlebrow

This is from a book called Death and Dying. CF showed anger from the beginning ......how could she know he was dead or dying??. [/*]

You can go through the stages of grief during a divorce, losing a job, ending a friendship, moving house, enduring long illness, etc.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx

It was 30 steps, but why she felt the need to make a game out of this is disturbing IMO. [/*]

She felt the need to make a game of this? Links please TIA

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by K Anne


She felt the need to make a game of this? Links please TIA [/*]

Did you notice the IMO on my post KAnne?

How about you send me a link for YOUR opinion on things? :rolleyes:

[K Anne]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Did you notice the IMO on my post KAnne?

How about you send me a link for YOUR opinion on things? :rolleyes: [/*]

I parse differently than you do. What you said was:

It was 30 steps, but why she felt the need to make a game out of this is disturbing IMO[/*].

Not,

It was 30 steps, and IMO she felt the need to make a game out this [etc]

Your opinion as stated is not that she felt a need to make a game of ?something, but that her need to make a game out of ?something is disturbing. And I want to see links to where you see she feels a need to make a game of something.

How about you put me on your Ignore list? :seeya:

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


It was 30 steps, but why she felt the need to make a game out of this is disturbing IMO. [/*]



Your statement here seems like your IMO refers to, and your *opinion* is, that her behavior is disturbing, not that it's your opinion that she is making *a game out of this*. You state that *she felt the need to make a game of this*, as though it is a known fact.

A better way to state what you said you were implying is, *IMO, she felt the need to make a game out of this*.

IMO

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by K Anne


I parse differently than you do. What you said was:

It was 30 steps, but why she felt the need to make a game out of this is disturbing IMO[/*].

Not,

It was 30 steps, and IMO she felt the need to make a game out this [etc]

Your opinion as stated is not that she felt a need to make a game of ?something, but that her need to make a game out of ?something is disturbing. And I want to see links to where you see she feels a need to make a game of something.

How about you put me on your Ignore list? :seeya: [/*]


LOL great minds think alike! :seeya:

[Musterion]

Originally posted by CAT TOY

There is no proof that NF had a secret life, all i know is the wife is claiming so; or supposedly the det in the case is saying so but I dont know that to be fact. CT [/*]

Hi Cat! :)

How are you?

I don't know if I am reading your thoughts right here. But, are you saying that you haven't seen evidence of the Sheriff saying that he uncovered some things on Nicholas that led him to find a hidden life or are you saying that you don't believe what the detective is saying?

Musterion

[Musterion]

Originally posted by need2no
Friday, April 11th in Family by Christine

http://thefranciscos.com/ [/*]

It is so sad. I cannot imagine what NF's two little kids are thinking and feeling. :(

[n/t]

Originally posted by Musterion


It is so sad. I cannot imagine what NF's two little kids are thinking and feeling. :( [/*]

I understand your concern for Nick's kids because I am concerned about them too but I don't understand what Christine's post has to do with the children. She's quoting a bible verse from what I can see. Did I miss something?

[n/t]

Originally posted by zenharmony19




Your statement here seems like your IMO refers to, and your *opinion* is, that her behavior is disturbing, not that it's your opinion that she is making *a game out of this*. You state that *she felt the need to make a game of this*, as though it is a known fact.

A better way to state what you said you were implying is, *IMO, she felt the need to make a game out of this*.

IMO [/*]

Good grief. This is not grammar school. :rolleyes:

[Musterion]

Originally posted by n/t


I understand your concern for Nick's kids because I am concerned about them too but I don't understand what Christine's post has to do with the children. She's quoting a bible verse from what I can see. Did I miss something? [/*]

Oh, I'm sorry n/t. I didn't click on the link! I had been reading the supporting Christine site and for some reason thought that is what was posted here. On the supporting site she speaks about their move being hard! My confusion!

Again, sorry!!

[n/t]

Originally posted by Musterion


Oh, I'm sorry n/t. I didn't click on the link! I had been reading the supporting Christine site and for some reason thought that is what was posted here. On the supporting site she speaks about their move being hard! My confusion!

Again, sorry!! [/*]

No need to be sorry Musterion. I thought I missed something. Thanks for clarifying.


:)

[inv]

About me having an agenda. I do. It is called 'helping to find Nicholas Francisco'. It has absolutely nothing to do with providing sympathy for anyone. I think NF's wife has all the support she needs. Now I think it is time that people provide just as much support for finding Nicholas.

No matter what NF may have been involved with online, he is still missing. My point for chatting with Christine was not to provide support for her, it was to help with finding Nicholas.

Now, let's see what we can do to actually help find him. But, of course, that seems to be a problem. People put up fliers and they are taken down. People go out and talk to people who may know something, but they don't want to get involved. People ask for help finding NF, but then reject any help offerred.

I guess the people closest to him don't want him to be found.

Just My Opinion

[n/t]

Originally posted by zenharmony19


It's not about grammar. It's about logic and properly stating what you mean. If one is not careful gossip and conjecture spread and become accepted as fact. [/*]

Well that's odd. The only 2 who didn't get the IMO were you and KAnne. Oh. That could be that you're new to these boards and don't grasp the concept yet.

IMO means an opinion. You'll learn as you go along.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by need2no
Friday, April 11th in Family by Christine

http://thefranciscos.com/ [/*]

Thank you for posting this need2no.

It is a beautiful Psalm and one of my favourites.

I do pray this for NF, CF, their children and all affected by NF's disappearance.

"The LORD is close to the brokenhearted
and saves those who are crushed in spirit."

[K Anne]

Originally posted by n/t


Well that's odd. The only 2 who didn't get the IMO were you and KAnne. Oh. That could be that you're new to these boards and don't grasp the concept yet.

IMO means an opinion. You'll learn as you go along. [/*]

Did I miss the IMO? Zen, did you miss the IMO? I'm sorry. I guess I didn't get that IMO! Could you PM a copy of that IMO next time?

IMO is a sour cream substitute, IIRC, and apparently on crime discussion boards it is also an all-purpose substitute for accurate grammatical structure and logical thinking. Who knew.

BTW how close are you to determining what happened to NF, and where he is now?

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by n/t


Well that's odd. The only 2 who didn't get the IMO were you and KAnne. Oh. That could be that you're new to these boards and don't grasp the concept yet.

IMO means an opinion. You'll learn as you go along. [/*]

Your statement has no basis in fact at all. How do you know others don't feel the way KAnne and I do? It's too bad that you feel it's me that doesn't grasp this, when it appears that it's you that doesn't begin to understand the concept.
Not being careful where and how you write conjecture and opinion can sway peoples ideas and opinions, especially newcomers, who are just starting to follow this case. My concern is to keep the facts straight, and separated from the opinion. For everybody's sake, especially Nicholas, Christine and her children.
Enough said. I'm not going to argue about this.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by inv
About me having an agenda. I do. It is called 'helping to find Nicholas Francisco'. It has absolutely nothing to do with providing sympathy for anyone. I think NF's wife has all the support she needs. Now I think it is time that people provide just as much support for finding Nicholas.

No matter what NF may have been involved with online, he is still missing. My point for chatting with Christine was not to provide support for her, it was to help with finding Nicholas.

Now, let's see what we can do to actually help find him. But, of course, that seems to be a problem. People put up fliers and they are taken down. People go out and talk to people who may know something, but they don't want to get involved. People ask for help finding NF, but then reject any help offerred.

I guess the people closest to him don't want him to be found.

Just My Opinion [/*]

Hi inv,

Maybe you can answer some questions that could be helpful?

You said in a post yesterday that: "During my two-week or so conversations with CF, I got the same impression. I was sympathetic towards her. As time went on, I began to notice how she would answer my questions in a way that she emphasized her own needs, wants, desires, misfortunes, etc.

When I asked questions about NF, and what was being done to find him, she displayed an almost immediate need to change the subject to something about the house, finances, etc."

Having spoken with her for two weeks something changed your sympathy into, is it suspicion? And suspicion of what? Is it just dislike for her as a person? Or are you saying that you think she had something to do with NF's disappearance?

What, specifically, did you ask, what was the context? I think that would be important for us to know and to form our opinions with.

I don't have suspicions about Christine. But, I do want to understand why you do, if you do, and what made you come to that. I am not wanting to attack you or your views. At all!

Would you mind answering some questions?
TIA!! :)

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by inv
About me having an agenda. I do. It is called 'helping to find Nicholas Francisco'. It has absolutely nothing to do with providing sympathy for anyone. I think NF's wife has all the support she needs. Now I think it is time that people provide just as much support for finding Nicholas.

No matter what NF may have been involved with online, he is still missing. My point for chatting with Christine was not to provide support for her, it was to help with finding Nicholas.

Now, let's see what we can do to actually help find him. But, of course, that seems to be a problem. People put up fliers and they are taken down. People go out and talk to people who may know something, but they don't want to get involved. People ask for help finding NF, but then reject any help offerred.

I guess the people closest to him don't want him to be found.

Just My Opinion [/*]

That is your opinion and you are entitled.

Sorry inv.. but I can't help but think that you are twittered cause she has blocked your emails and myspace from contacting her any further because you refused to stop putting information that she asked you not to.. on message boards.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by K Anne


I parse differently than you do. What you said was:

It was 30 steps, but why she felt the need to make a game out of this is disturbing IMO[/*].

Not,

It was 30 steps, and IMO she felt the need to make a game out this [etc]

Your opinion as stated is not that she felt a need to make a game of ?something, but that her need to make a game out of ?something is disturbing. And I want to see links to where you see she feels a need to make a game of something.

How about you put me on your Ignore list? :seeya: [/*]

You parsed it better than me. That is what I meant.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by n/t


Good grief. This is not grammar school. :rolleyes: [/*]

LOL well if a simple"thank you" can lead to a post like it did, think what can happen with a poor sentence structure.

[inv]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


That is your opinion and you are entitled.

Sorry inv.. but I can't help but think that you are twittered cause she has blocked your emails and myspace from contacting her any further because you refused to stop putting information that she asked you not to.. on message boards. [/*]

I respect that you think this. I posted one comment (out of 20 or so emails) she made that I though was relevant. And yes, I was sympathetic toward her in the beginning, but I realized that she seemed to want to chat only about her and her needs. I wanted to help her with finding Nicholas. I am sorry that she has had problems since NF disappeared, but my goal was/is to help find him.

I told her that I respected her decision whether she wanted to talk or not, but I would continue helping in any way I could.

[inv]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi inv,

Maybe you can answer some questions that could be helpful?

You said in a post yesterday that: "During my two-week or so conversations with CF, I got the same impression. I was sympathetic towards her. As time went on, I began to notice how she would answer my questions in a way that she emphasized her own needs, wants, desires, misfortunes, etc.

When I asked questions about NF, and what was being done to find him, she displayed an almost immediate need to change the subject to something about the house, finances, etc."

Having spoken with her for two weeks something changed your sympathy into, is it suspicion? And suspicion of what? Is it just dislike for her as a person? Or are you saying that you think she had something to do with NF's disappearance?

What, specifically, did you ask, what was the context? I think that would be important for us to know and to form our opinions with.

I don't have suspicions about Christine. But, I do want to understand why you do, if you do, and what made you come to that. I am not wanting to attack you or your views. At all!

Would you mind answering some questions?
TIA!! :) [/*]

Hi, Musterion. I am afraid to post anything else that Christine shared with me because I don't want to be banned. I honestly don't know what I believe anymore. And no, I do not dislike her. I don't even know her, so I couldn't possible dislike her, right?

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by inv
About me having an agenda. I do. It is called 'helping to find Nicholas Francisco'. It has absolutely nothing to do with providing sympathy for anyone. I think NF's wife has all the support she needs. Now I think it is time that people provide just as much support for finding Nicholas.

No matter what NF may have been involved with online, he is still missing. My point for chatting with Christine was not to provide support for her, it was to help with finding Nicholas.

Now, let's see what we can do to actually help find him. But, of course, that seems to be a problem. People put up fliers and they are taken down. People go out and talk to people who may know something, but they don't want to get involved. People ask for help finding NF, but then reject any help offerred.

I guess the people closest to him don't want him to be found.

Just My Opinion [/*]

Great Post! I guess there are a few of us left who recognize that Nicholas is still missing and needs all the support he can get.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by inv


I respect that you think this. I posted one comment (out of 20 or so emails) she made that I though was relevant. And yes, I was sympathetic toward her in the beginning, but I realized that she seemed to want to chat only about her and her needs. I wanted to help her with finding Nicholas. I am sorry that she has had problems since NF disappeared, but my goal was/is to help find him.

I told her that I respected her decision whether she wanted to talk or not, but I would continue helping in any way I could. [/*]

So lets figure out some ways to find him. We don't have to agree or disagree with what Christine does to find the common ground there. But.. the more it becomes about her... the less and less it becomes about actually finding him.

When looking at the situation we have to realize 2 things. Christine is not perfect AND Nicholas is not perfect. They are both dealing with the same world that the rest of are dealing with. They both are dealing with the same temptations that the rest of us are.. (them even more so then some if you believe the Bible and that believers will be under constant attack from the enemy). Those who believe that Nic was a perfect man.. who did no wrong and that any problems (if there were any) in the marriage must have been all about Christine.. then you are narrowing what you will see. Sometimes it is hard to see that the missing person is less than perfect.. because they are missing and aren't able to speak for themselves but we have to remember.. they are only human.. like the rest of us.

I think we should be looking for an alive Nic.. just as much as a deceased one. I think we should trust that the police DO KNOW more than we do and are trained to see things and hear things that most of us aren't and that they do not suspect Christine of harming Nicholas or of her knowing why he would voluntarily go missing. We.. as a group of intelligent people with MANY different life experiences all have insight that someone else might not have and we all need to be open to that and start trying to find him.

As some of us found out with Beth Smith.. anything can happen and you don't know how you will feel when the truth comes out.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by inv


Hi, Musterion. I am afraid to post anything else that Christine shared with me because I don't want to be banned. I honestly don't know what I believe anymore. And no, I do not dislike her. I don't even know her, so I couldn't possible dislike her, right? [/*]

LOL! Well, you have a point! But, alot of us find ourselves disliking people we don't know(or liking them!)! Especially when they are in the public eye (or on a message board!)

I respect and think that is wise to not post your conversations. I'm glad.

I would like to ask something that maybe you can answer, though. In what capacity did you offer to help search for NF? And why do you feel that help was rejected? If it was rejected.

Thank you!

[Silver_Dove]

Okay let's try facts:

Fact everything Christine posted even before Nicholas disappeared pointed to the fact she is a very devoted Christian even if she wasn't perfect.

Fact Nothing Nicholas post had anything about his faith.

Fact Sheriff said that HE had found evidence of a secret life.

Fact if the secret life was something that wasn't embarrassing and/or sinful someone would have said what it was by now. Remember embarrassing and/or sinful many times isn't illegal

Fact Christine was/is in a church that says if a man strays if is the womans fault for not keeping herself up.

Anything about Nicholas that doesn't make him the perfect guy is rejected while Christine is torn apart even by at least one person (after the reward?) pretended to be her friend. Gee what a surprise she quit taking to most people.

[inv]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


So lets figure out some ways to find him. We don't have to agree or disagree with what Christine does to find the common ground there. But.. the more it becomes about her... the less and less it becomes about actually finding him.

When looking at the situation we have to realize 2 things. Christine is not perfect AND Nicholas is not perfect. They are both dealing with the same world that the rest of are dealing with. They both are dealing with the same temptations that the rest of us are.. (them even more so then some if you believe the Bible and that believers will be under constant attack from the enemy). Those who believe that Nic was a perfect man.. who did no wrong and that any problems (if there were any) in the marriage must have been all about Christine.. then you are narrowing what you will see. Sometimes it is hard to see that the missing person is less than perfect.. because they are missing and aren't able to speak for themselves but we have to remember.. they are only human.. like the rest of us.

I think we should be looking for an alive Nic.. just as much as a deceased one. I think we should trust that the police DO KNOW more than we do and are trained to see things and hear things that most of us aren't and that they do not suspect Christine of harming Nicholas or of her knowing why he would voluntarily go missing. We.. as a group of intelligent people with MANY different life experiences all have insight that someone else might not have and we all need to be open to that and start trying to find him.

As some of us found out with Beth Smith.. anything can happen and you don't know how you will feel when the truth comes out. [/*]

This is true.

[inv]

Originally posted by Musterion


LOL! Well, you have a point! But, alot of us find ourselves disliking people we don't know(or liking them!)! Especially when they are in the public eye (or on a message board!)

I respect and think that is wise to not post your conversations. I'm glad.

I would like to ask something that maybe you can answer, though. In what capacity did you offer to help search for NF? And why do you feel that help was rejected? If it was rejected.

Thank you! [/*]

1. I asked CF to provide me with any usernames NF may have used online so I could try to find out if there were any online clues regarding his disappearance.

2. I provided her with some suggestions concerning CCTV along NF's route.

3. I encouraged her to participate in a 48 Hours segment on Nicholas.

I don't live in WA so this is really the best I can do. I know some people in the media which I though would be beneficial to getting his story and his profile out there.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove
Okay let's try facts:

Fact everything Christine posted even before Nicholas disappeared pointed to the fact she is a very devoted Christian even if she wasn't perfect.

Fact Nothing Nicholas post had anything about his faith.

Fact Sheriff said that HE had found evidence of a secret life.

Fact if the secret life was something that wasn't embarrassing and/or sinful someone would have said what it was by now. Remember embarrassing and/or sinful many times isn't illegal

Fact Christine was/is in a church that says if a man strays if is the womans fault for not keeping herself up.

Anything about Nicholas that doesn't make him the perfect guy is rejected while Christine is torn apart even by at least one person (after the reward?) pretended to be her friend. Gee what a surprise she quit taking to most people. [/*]

From your perspective, is prayer and only prayer likely to resolve the issues surrounding NF's disappearance? TIA

[Musterion]

Originally posted by inv


1. I asked CF to provide me with any usernames NF may have used online so I could try to find out if there were any online clues regarding his disappearance.

2. I provided her with some suggestions concerning CCTV along NF's route.

3. I encouraged her to participate in a 48 Hours segment on Nicholas.

I don't live in WA so this is really the best I can do. I know some people in the media which I though would be beneficial to getting his story and his profile out there. [/*]

Thank you for that inv.

Are you saying that she rejected giving you usernames and your suggestions about CCTV and 48 Hours? She said no to them?

[Musterion]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


So lets figure out some ways to find him. We don't have to agree or disagree with what Christine does to find the common ground there. But.. the more it becomes about her... the less and less it becomes about actually finding him.

When looking at the situation we have to realize 2 things. Christine is not perfect AND Nicholas is not perfect. They are both dealing with the same world that the rest of are dealing with. They both are dealing with the same temptations that the rest of us are.. (them even more so then some if you believe the Bible and that believers will be under constant attack from the enemy). Those who believe that Nic was a perfect man.. who did no wrong and that any problems (if there were any) in the marriage must have been all about Christine.. then you are narrowing what you will see. Sometimes it is hard to see that the missing person is less than perfect.. because they are missing and aren't able to speak for themselves but we have to remember.. they are only human.. like the rest of us.

I think we should be looking for an alive Nic.. just as much as a deceased one. I think we should trust that the police DO KNOW more than we do and are trained to see things and hear things that most of us aren't and that they do not suspect Christine of harming Nicholas or of her knowing why he would voluntarily go missing. We.. as a group of intelligent people with MANY different life experiences all have insight that someone else might not have and we all need to be open to that and start trying to find him.

As some of us found out with Beth Smith.. anything can happen and you don't know how you will feel when the truth comes out. [/*]

This is such a good post Mystry!

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


From your perspective, is prayer and only prayer likely to resolve the issues surrounding NF's disappearance? TIA [/*]

Not at all but being unwilling to look at the fact that Nicholas might have left on his own and might not be the perfect son, husband and father might open more doors to where he is then going over and over every little thing that Christine has done, is doing and will do.

Any talk of Nicholas not being perfect has been rejected as either talking about someone with no voice or smearing his name.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


From your perspective, is prayer and only prayer likely to resolve the issues surrounding NF's disappearance? TIA [/*]

Sorry.. C us C.. I am not seeing where that was implied at all?

I mentioned Beth Smith a few posts ago and was just sitting here thinking.. has anyone checked pawn shops? Would that be a complete waste of time regarding him or is the possibility there that he might pawn his laptop for money.. or his wedding band?

[Cury-us Coyote]

Touring Seattle Homeless Camps (Queen Anne neighborhood)
http://www.kirotv.com/video_legacy/14891597/index.html?rss=sea&psp=video

[n/t]

OK so what do you suggest we do, Mystry? I think we've exhausted all information that's been out there on the internet. We've researched everything from Organic Sugar to Search dogs and Night Life in Seattle.

We have limited information to go on, LE is not releasing anything about this supposed secret life, his wife is not saying much and his family has been silent.

In my opinion, the only thing left to do is physical searches. Maybe searching the lake is what needs to be done. Maybe getting search dogs out there again. The problem is if nobody in his family initiates these, there is not much more a stranger on a message board can do.

Thoughts? Any other ideas?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Not at all but being unwilling to look at the fact that Nicholas might have left on his own and might not be the perfect son, husband and father might open more doors to where he is then going over and over every little thing that Christine has done, is doing and will do.

Any talk of Nicholas not being perfect has been rejected as either talking about someone with no voice or smearing his name. [/*]

I know what you mean about your last statement. That seems to be very true and while I understand it.. like I have said before.. it narrows what we are able to see when we are looking at it like that.

I was wondering where the info that Christine said that he was illiciting sex from men and woman came from? I haven't seen that anywhere.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Not at all but being unwilling to look at the fact that Nicholas might have left on his own and might not be the perfect son, husband and father might open more doors to where he is then going over and over every little thing that Christine has done, is doing and will do.

Any talk of Nicholas not being perfect has been rejected as either talking about someone with no voice or smearing his name. [/*]

Do you have any proof that he wasn't the perfect son or husband? Let's assume he wasn't. Where would you look for him?

[n/t]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I know what you mean about your last statement. That seems to be very true and while I understand it.. like I have said before.. it narrows what we are able to see when we are looking at it like that.

I was wondering where the info that Christine said that he was illiciting sex from men and woman came from? I haven't seen that anywhere. [/*]

Neither have I.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by n/t
OK so what do you suggest we do, Mystry? I think we've exhausted all information that's been out there on the internet. We've researched everything from Organic Sugar to Search dogs and Night Life in Seattle.

We have limited information to go on, LE is not releasing anything about this supposed secret life, his wife is not saying much and his family has been silent.

In my opinion, the only thing left to do is physical searches. Maybe searching the lake is what needs to be done. Maybe getting search dogs out there again. The problem is if nobody in his family initiates these, there is not much more a stranger on a message board can do.

Thoughts? Any other ideas? [/*]

I agree the internet aspect has been exhausted and I have to wonder if that isn't why there is so much contention on the boards.. it is the same info.. over and over.. looking at it from every angle and people need something to move forward or we start getting cranky.

I have always felt that people gave up too easily at the condos. I would want to start the outside search.. there.

I did talk to a couple of younger people there and I walked away with the impression that there had been talk around there about why his car was there and that they thought that he had been around there but they didn't know why or how they knew it.. or they weren't willing to tell me.

A poster from helpfindthemissing.org went there and got the feeling that people didn't want to be involved.

I just can't get out of my head that someone there knows something and that there is a language barrier or some other reason why that info hasn't been found out.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote
Touring Seattle Homeless Camps (Queen Anne neighborhood)
http://www.kirotv.com/video_legacy/14891597/index.html?rss=sea&psp=video [/*]

Thanks for bringing this up again Cury. Homeless shelters were brought up over and over but as far as I know, LE nor any of his family members have looked for him in any of these camps.

What a shame.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


Sorry.. C us C.. I am not seeing where that was implied at all?

I mentioned Beth Smith a few posts ago and was just sitting here thinking.. has anyone checked pawn shops? Would that be a complete waste of time regarding him or is the possibility there that he might pawn his laptop for money.. or his wedding band? [/*]

The missing computer has been filed into the national crimes database and we keep checking craigslist to see if it pops up there.
http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/2008/02/tracking-his-computer.html

IMO, during the first week or so of NF's disappearance, his co-workers (or someone) expended effort searching. They (?) created detailed grid records of search areas completed, areas that required more investigation, and noted any leads for LE. Then the effort (or reporting stopped for some reason). :shrug:

[n/t]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I agree the internet aspect has been exhausted and I have to wonder if that isn't why there is so much contention on the boards.. it is the same info.. over and over.. looking at it from every angle and people need something to move forward or we start getting cranky.

I have always felt that people gave up too easily at the condos. I would want to start the outside search.. there.

I did talk to a couple of younger people there and I walked away with the impression that there had been talk around there about why his car was there and that they thought that he had been around there but they didn't know why or how they knew it.. or they weren't willing to tell me.

A poster from helpfindthemissing.org went there and got the feeling that people didn't want to be involved.

I just can't get out of my head that someone there knows something and that there is a language barrier or some other reason why that info hasn't been found out. [/*]


Maybe it would take a family member to beg and plea for information on their missing husband, son, brother. Were they Asian? Maybe getting an interpreter?

Why isn't LE going back there? See, that's the frustrating part. We come up with these ideas but they just sit here and it seems that nothing gets done.

If I lived there, I'd be asking around and trying to get as much information as possible. Heck, there has been nothing said from any of his coworkers or friends. Nothing since the initial search.

One thing I agree with Christine on is that somebody knows something. The question is why aren't they talking? Or did they?

[Musterion]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I agree the internet aspect has been exhausted and I have to wonder if that isn't why there is so much contention on the boards.. it is the same info.. over and over.. looking at it from every angle and people need something to move forward or we start getting cranky.

I have always felt that people gave up too easily at the condos. I would want to start the outside search.. there.

I did talk to a couple of younger people there and I walked away with the impression that there had been talk around there about why his car was there and that they thought that he had been around there but they didn't know why or how they knew it.. or they weren't willing to tell me.

A poster from helpfindthemissing.org went there and got the feeling that people didn't want to be involved.

I just can't get out of my head that someone there knows something and that there is a language barrier or some other reason why that info hasn't been found out. [/*]

Mystry,

Maybe you know. I read on helpfindthemissing that his car was processed and nothing indicating foul play was found. Have they released the car? If not, why do you think they would keep it if there isn't any evidence?

TIA.

[desmom]

Following the He Walked theory.....

I don't think he is in Seattle. In the beginning, he may have planned on staying in the area. The local media coverage may have forced him to change his plans. I think he would board a bus, boat, plane or train instead of risk having his car recognized on the streets.

The above is my opinion.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by n/t


Do you have any proof that he wasn't the perfect son or husband? Let's assume he wasn't. Where would you look for him? [/*]

The clubs this is a man who was home every night and is now free to be and do whatever he wants. Problem is I can think of a half dozen or more places he could be and none are under water. lol oh wait one is near water.

[inv]

Originally posted by Musterion


Thank you for that inv.

Are you saying that she rejected giving you usernames and your suggestions about CCTV and 48 Hours? She said no to them? [/*]

She did not respond to my question about participating in the 48 Hours interview, she said she would get back to me on the usernames, and she was talking about the expensive cost of daycare when I suggested looking at security camera footage along NF's route.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


The missing computer has been filed into the national crimes database and we keep checking craigslist to see if it pops up there.
http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/2008/02/tracking-his-computer.html

IMO, during the first week or so of NF's disappearance, his co-workers (or someone) expended effort searching. They (?) created detailed grid records of search areas completed, areas that required more investigation, and noted any leads for LE. Then the effort (or reporting stopped for some reason). :shrug: [/*]

Do pawn shops have to enter a laptops serial numbers into the national crimes database (sorry.. I am ignorant as to what this even is)?

and yes his coworkers did pretty detailed grid searches between PitW and his home in SeaTac.. I have no idea why those stopped.. other than there was nowhere else to search til his car was found. They then went all around that area and found nothing again. I don't know.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


The missing computer has been filed into the national crimes database and we keep checking craigslist to see if it pops up there.
http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/2008/02/tracking-his-computer.html

IMO, during the first week or so of NF's disappearance, his co-workers (or someone) expended effort searching. They (?) created detailed grid records of search areas completed, areas that required more investigation, and noted any leads for LE. Then the effort (or reporting stopped for some reason). :shrug: [/*]

Yup. Just like the media coverage. It just stopped. Interestingly enough I was on AMW's website earlier looking at the update posted about Cesar Laurean's capture and I just happened to check Nick's profile there. It hasn't been updated in almost 2 months. There is no mention of the supposed secret life discovery. Wouldn't that be an important detail to put there? Wouldn't LE releasing what they found out help the public keep their eyes open?

:shrug:

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Musterion


Mystry,

Maybe you know. I read on helpfindthemissing that his car was processed and nothing indicating foul play was found. Have they released the car? If not, why do you think they would keep it if there isn't any evidence?

TIA. [/*]

I'm sorry.. I don't know that.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Nicholas reported missing in NCIC database on Feb 15th, according to the Seattle Times.

King County sheriff's spokesman John Urquhart said Francisco's name had been entered in the National Crime Information Center computer system as a missing person, although there was no initial indication of foul play.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2004185302_webmissing.html


According to King County Missing Persons booklet, the criteria to enter a missing person into NCIC is 1) physical or mental handicap, 2) victim of catastrophe, or 3) endangered.

Page 2
http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/_downloads/business/Toolkit.pdf

Which qualification(s) did Nicholas meet? TIA

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by inv


She did not respond to my question about participating in the 48 Hours interview, she said she would get back to me on the usernames, and she was talking about the expensive cost of daycare when I suggested looking at security camera footage along NF's route. [/*]


What? You were talking about how to find her missing husband and instead she is off talking about the high cost of daycare?? Is this what you're saying?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote
Nicholas reported missing in NCIC database on Feb 15th, according to the Seattle Times.

King County sheriff's spokesman John Urquhart said Francisco's name had been entered in the National Crime Information Center computer system as a missing person, although there was no initial indication of foul play.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2004185302_webmissing.html


According to King County Missing Persons booklet, the criteria to enter a missing person into NCIC is 1) physical or mental handicap, 2) victim of catastrophe, or 3) endangered.

Page 2
http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/_downloads/business/Toolkit.pdf

Which qualification(s) did Nicholas meet? TIA [/*]

I would think it would have to be the endangered one?

Is there a way to tell if someone is actually listed in the NCIC?

[n/t]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


The clubs this is a man who was home every night and is now free to be and do whatever he wants. Problem is I can think of a half dozen or more places he could be and none are under water. lol oh wait one is near water. [/*]

I think someone would've come forward to say they've seen him. There haven't been any leads. IIRC, there were 2 sightings. One was at the gas station and another was at storage unit place. Maybe there was another one but I can't remember off hand.

IMO, your water comment wasn't necessary nor was it funny. We don't know where he is and Nick being dead is a possiblity.

[inv]

Originally posted by Curiouser



What? You were talking about how to find her missing husband and instead she is off talking about the high cost of daycare?? Is this what you're saying? [/*]

Yes.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I would think it would have to be the endangered one?

Is there a way to tell if someone is actually listed in the NCIC? [/*]

IIRC, page 9 reported not accessible to general public - LE personnel only.
jmo

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by inv


Yes. [/*]

Well that's a rather terse reply. LOL LOL!! JK!


Anyway, hmmm, that doesn't sound like someone who's trying to find their loved one does it.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by n/t


I think someone would've come forward to say they've seen him. There haven't been any leads. IIRC, there were 2 sightings. One was at the gas station and another was at storage unit place. Maybe there was another one but I can't remember off hand.

IMO, your water comment wasn't necessary nor was it funny. We don't know where he is and Nick being dead is a possiblity. [/*]

If he is in the places I think are possible no one would turn him in not even for the money. Also I'm thinking he would be looking very different by now. I think there is a very very real possibility that he is still alive. I also think there is a real possibility that LE and even Christine may know that and just aren't saying. Why else has everyone close to him including the LE and news stopped saying anything?

ETA there is still a very small possibility that he is dead but I would say only 1%

[inv]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


If he is in the places I think are possible no one would turn him in not even for the money. Also I'm thinking he would be looking very different by now. I think there is a very very real possibility that he is still alive. I also think there is a real possibility that LE and even Christine may know that and just aren't saying. Why else has everyone close to him including the LE and news stopped saying anything? [/*]

Okay. If LE knows where he is, then why is the case still being investigated?

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by inv


Okay. If LE knows where he is, then why is the case still being investigated? [/*]

Because they haven't talked to him. So still a small chance of misadventure just not a large one.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


If he is in the places I think are possible no one would turn him in not even for the money. Also I'm thinking he would be looking very different by now. I think there is a very very real possibility that he is still alive. I also think there is a real possibility that LE and even Christine may know that and just aren't saying. Why else has everyone close to him including the LE and news stopped saying anything?

ETA there is still a very small possibility that he is dead but I would say only 1% [/*]

I think if the media knew anything juicy.. they would not keep it a secret for the sake of protecting anyone. The juicier the better for them.

Not sure that LE would continue searching for someone that they knew didn't want to be found and left on their own. I honestly think that they don't want to say he is safe and have him not show up safe or waste a bunch of time on money on someone that may not want to be found. They have people to answer to too.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


If he is in the places I think are possible no one would turn him in not even for the money. Also I'm thinking he would be looking very different by now. I think there is a very very real possibility that he is still alive. I also think there is a real possibility that LE and even Christine may know that and just aren't saying. Why else has everyone close to him including the LE and news stopped saying anything? [/*]

I don't think someone changes their appearance overnight. If he went bar hopping or clubbing or whatever they call it nowadays that night, I'm sure he would've been noticed by someone.

If the family and LE believe he is alive and left voluntarily, why have the public continue to look for him? It doesn't make any sense. Why would LE continue to waste resources in trying to locate him? Or maybe they're not. Maybe he's at the bottom of the pile but Christine still wants him to be found for whatever reason. Right?

[inv]

Originally posted by Curiouser


Well that's a rather terse reply. LOL LOL!! JK!
[/*]

Sorry, I just thought it would be best to keep it short and sweet.

:)

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I would think it would have to be the endangered one?

Is there a way to tell if someone is actually listed in the NCIC? [/*]

How can an adult be endangered IF there is no indication of foul play?

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by n/t


I don't think someone changes their appearance overnight. If he went bar hopping or clubbing or whatever they call it nowadays that night, I'm sure he would've been noticed by someone.

If the family and LE believe he is alive and left voluntarily, why have the public continue to look for him? It doesn't make any sense. Why would LE continue to waste resources in trying to locate him? Or maybe they're not. Maybe he's at the bottom of the pile but Christine still wants him to be found for whatever reason. Right? [/*]

Who said he even went out the first night? Changing appearance is a lot easier then you would think. I know the scene I'm taking about the clubs are dark if you weren't looking you would most likely miss seeing someone you had only seen a picture of.

And what public is looking only a dozen people on the boards bashing Christine isn't really much looking. As to the LE last I heard the case is open but I don't think they have that many resources on it.

Then again how can be be found if he is alive if people are searching bodies of water.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Who said he even went out the first night? Changing appearance is a lot easier then you would think. I know the scene I'm taking about the clubs are dark if you weren't looking you would most likely miss seeing someone you had only seen a picture of.

And what public is looking only a dozen people on the boards bashing Christine isn't really much looking. As to the LE last I heard the case is open but I don't think they have that many resources on it.

Then again how can be be found if he is alive if people are searching bodies of water. [/*]

As soon as I think I'm getting an intelligent conversation going with you, you bring out the Christine bashing when there has been none of it.

I should've known better. :rolleyes:

[n/t]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote
Nicholas reported missing in NCIC database on Feb 15th, according to the Seattle Times.

King County sheriff's spokesman John Urquhart said Francisco's name had been entered in the National Crime Information Center computer system as a missing person, although there was no initial indication of foul play.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2004185302_webmissing.html


According to King County Missing Persons booklet, the criteria to enter a missing person into NCIC is 1) physical or mental handicap, 2) victim of catastrophe, or 3) endangered.

Page 2
http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/_downloads/business/Toolkit.pdf

Which qualification(s) did Nicholas meet? TIA [/*]


hmmmmm....well isn't that interesting. Good find.

The only explanation I would have is they probably thought endangered because his car was missing at the time.

Does that make any sense?

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by n/t


As soon as I think I'm getting an intelligent conversation going with you, you bring out the Christine bashing when there has been none of it.

I should've known better. :rolleyes: [/*]

You have have been given lots of information but you have chosen to reject it all and trash and betray the people who have given it to you. It would appear to me that if people aren't saying that Nicholas is the perfect man and dead you don't want to hear it.

If the truth came up and bit you on the nose you wouldn't accept it.

I know Seattle. I know the community that I have good reason to believe he is involved in. But like others before me why bother.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


You have have been given lots of information but you have chosen to reject it all and trash and betray the people who have given it to you. It would appear to me that if people aren't saying that Nicholas is the perfect man and dead you don't want to hear it.

If the truth came up and bit you on the nose you wouldn't accept it.

I know Seattle. I know the community that I have good reason to believe he is involved in. But like others before me why bother. [/*]

TRUTH is much appreciated. Please share your community involvement and Federal Way vehicle drop-off theories. TIA

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


So lets figure out some ways to find him. We don't have to agree or disagree with what Christine does to find the common ground there. But.. the more it becomes about her... the less and less it becomes about actually finding him.

When looking at the situation we have to realize 2 things. Christine is not perfect AND Nicholas is not perfect. They are both dealing with the same world that the rest of are dealing with. They both are dealing with the same temptations that the rest of us are.. (them even more so then some if you believe the Bible and that believers will be under constant attack from the enemy). Those who believe that Nic was a perfect man.. who did no wrong and that any problems (if there were any) in the marriage must have been all about Christine.. then you are narrowing what you will see. Sometimes it is hard to see that the missing person is less than perfect.. because they are missing and aren't able to speak for themselves but we have to remember.. they are only human.. like the rest of us.

I think we should be looking for an alive Nic.. just as much as a deceased one. I think we should trust that the police DO KNOW more than we do and are trained to see things and hear things that most of us aren't and that they do not suspect Christine of harming Nicholas or of her knowing why he would voluntarily go missing. We.. as a group of intelligent people with MANY different life experiences all have insight that someone else might not have and we all need to be open to that and start trying to find him.

As some of us found out with Beth Smith.. anything can happen and you don't know how you will feel when the truth comes out. [/*]

Mystry - this is an awesome post. The only thing I disagree with is that I think Nic met with foul play, and in order to look for a deceased man, that would require LE and services such as TES.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by n/t


As soon as I think I'm getting an intelligent conversation going with you, you bring out the Christine bashing when there has been none of it.

I should've known better. :rolleyes: [/*]

Right you are. I FEEL (therefore no link provided) that some people do not feel they can support the victim - the missing (Nicholas Francisco) because that would be a betrayal to CF. Her support comments are in the 300 number range, while his support comments are under 30. I find that very sad. He has never been given the attention he deserves IMO.

For Nicholas - a month tomorrow that you have been gone :rose:

[JustFacts]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


You have have been given lots of information but you have chosen to reject it all and trash and betray the people who have given it to you. It would appear to me that if people aren't saying that Nicholas is the perfect man and dead you don't want to hear it.

If the truth came up and bit you on the nose you wouldn't accept it.

I know Seattle. I know the community that I have good reason to believe he is involved in. But like others before me why bother. [/*]

What community do you believe he's involved in?

[Miss Behavin]

Just checking the thread today to see if anything new has surfaced... doesn't seem to be any news that we didn't already have.

The wait is the hardest, ya know? Waiting to see if any more searches will be done, waiting for LE to make an enlightening statement to the public, waiting for CF to make a statement, waiting for his family to speak out, waiting to hear details of this alleged "secret life" with a paper trail - - yada! yada! yada!

Just gets discouraging with no new leads! I can't even begin to imagine if I were part of this family - the wait would be torture.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Miss Behavin
Just checking the thread today to see if anything new has surfaced... doesn't seem to be any news that we didn't already have.

The wait is the hardest, ya know? Waiting to see if any more searches will be done, waiting for LE to make an enlightening statement to the public, waiting for CF to make a statement, waiting for his family to speak out, waiting to hear details of this alleged "secret life" with a paper trail - - yada! yada! yada!

Just gets discouraging with no new leads! I can't even begin to imagine if I were part of this family - the wait would be torture. [/*]

The family are the ones that could put pressure on LE to keep this in the public; they could also request that TES be brought in; they could also ask their friends with websites and blogs to keep all of the information on NF current. They could be part of searches that people outside the family are participating in; they could put up flyers. So much they could be doing.

While I definitely agree with you that the wait would be torture, there ARE things a family can do that outsiders like us cannot do.

[n/t]

It appears that both families (wife and Nick's family) are very involved in the church communities. Christine getting a lot of support from Mars Hill even though it is alleged that she resigned and Nick's family very much involved with the Catholic Church.

I believe if both families got together, there would be many volunteers willing to help with searches.

I guess I just don't understand why it's not being done. If either family knows something, I would hope they would speak up and tell the public.

Why does it feel like posters on message boards are the only ones doing anything? Even if it's trying to research whatever we could find on the internet. Any sign. Any clue that he is alive or what may have happened to him.

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by n/t
It appears that both families (wife and Nick's family) are very involved in the church communities. Christine getting a lot of support from Mars Hill even though it is alleged that she resigned and Nick's family very much involved with the Catholic Church.

I believe if both families got together, there would be many volunteers willing to help with searches.

I guess I just don't understand why it's not being done. If either family knows something, I would hope they would speak up and tell the public.

Why does it feel like posters on message boards are the only ones doing anything? Even if it's trying to research whatever we could find on the internet. Any sign. Any clue that he is alive or what may have happened to him. [/*]

IIRC, LE discouraged hanging missing persons fliers at a posters location and family endorsement of letter writing campaign to raise awareness of Nicholas perceived missing status failed. Can we totally rule out 1*?

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by n/t



hmmmmm....well isn't that interesting. Good find.

The only explanation I would have is they probably thought endangered because his car was missing at the time.

Does that make any sense? [/*]

Would LE lower the criteria bar to avoid negative publicity?

Husband blasts search policy
Wife missing for days before police responded
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/333554_rider29.html

[n/t]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


IIRC, LE discouraged hanging missing persons fliers at a posters location and family endorsement of letter writing campaign to raise awareness of Nicholas perceived missing status failed. Can we totally rule out 1*? [/*]

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying LE doesn't want the public involved or LE doesn't want posters putting up flyers or both?

I remember reading a letter by the detective or Sgt. telling a poster not to waste their hard earned money on putting up flyers<paraphrasing>

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by n/t

<snipped>
I remember reading a letter by the detective or Sgt. telling a poster not to waste their hard earned money on putting up flyers<paraphrasing> [/*]

That is my recollection as well. Could be the poster's location was unlikely from leads learned at that point in the investigation or flyers placed anywhere were useless or ?.
jmo

[n/t]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


Would LE lower the criteria bar to avoid negative publicity?

Husband blasts search policy
Wife missing for days before police responded
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/333554_rider29.html [/*]

Sadly, that may very well be the case. For all we know, Nicholas could be dead and they're not doing anything to find him. That's why I think the families have to be persistant and continue to pound on their doors wanting answers and insist they do something to find him.

I understand LE's position because it's true that so many just take off voluntarily but when a family member, in this case, the wife continues to say he wouldn't leave his family and she thinks he was murdered, why not believe her? Yes, there was a subsequent discovery of a supposed secret life but how long after was it? Wasn't it a month after he disappeared? And what leads them to believe that this secret life is evidence of him leaving voluntarily. If true and there was a paper trail going back 3 years, why that night? Why on a Wednesday night? Why only take $50.00 if you plan on leaving your wife and kids?

It just doesn't make any sense! I hope somebody wakes up!!

[Musterion]

Originally posted by inv


She did not respond to my question about participating in the 48 Hours interview, she said she would get back to me on the usernames, and she was talking about the expensive cost of daycare when I suggested looking at security camera footage along NF's route. [/*]

Oh ok. She did not refuse your help then. She just hasn't gotten back with you yet. For whatever reasons she has.

Fair enough!

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Miss Behavin
Just checking the thread today to see if anything new has surfaced... doesn't seem to be any news that we didn't already have.

The wait is the hardest, ya know? Waiting to see if any more searches will be done, waiting for LE to make an enlightening statement to the public, waiting for CF to make a statement, waiting for his family to speak out, waiting to hear details of this alleged "secret life" with a paper trail - - yada! yada! yada!

Just gets discouraging with no new leads! I can't even begin to imagine if I were part of this family - the wait would be torture. [/*]

Hi Miss Behavin,

I agree. The wait is hard for the public I can only imagine how the family feels. I hear and see Beth Holloway's voice and face and how it affects her to not know exactly what happened to her daughter. It has to be a pain that not many people can identify with.

I'm curious why you say alleged secret life. Cat Toy said something similar earlier. I'm wondering if you have not read what the KCSO has said regarding that or if you just don't believe it? I might be missing something!?

Thanks.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I'm sorry but your post does not make sense - perhaps it is just the sentence structure that some worry about, but would you mind explaining your first sentence?

Why would Christine was to communicate with any poster's on Message Boards? [/*]

Hiya Rainy! :beer:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Danette44


Hiya Rainy! :beer: [/*]

Hey Dannette - how are ya girl? :seeya:

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Hey Dannette - how are ya girl? :seeya: [/*]

Work, work, work - checking in to see if any New news on Nicholas - and nothing. I see Christine posted again. Sure wish she would PRAY for a miracle that Nicholas will be found soon. I mean all that faith and all - she got a new home - her prayers are being answer. LOL JMOO

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Musterion


Thank you for that inv.

Are you saying that she rejected giving you usernames and your suggestions about CCTV and 48 Hours? She said no to them? [/*]

I do not answer to any of you. I answer to God and God only.
http://www.thefranciscos.com/

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


I do not answer to any of you. I answer to God and God only.
http://www.thefranciscos.com/ [/*]

Cury-us,

I like that quote. I believe all of us, eventually, answer to God for what we say, how we say it.

But, in regard to my post am I to understand that you're answering what I asked inv? Are you implying that CF refused to answer his questions? Because that isn't what he said. He said that she didn't answer them, at least that's what I got from his post. To me refusing to answer and not answering are important distinctions. JMO.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


I do not answer to any of you. I answer to God and God only.
http://www.thefranciscos.com/ [/*]

Yup - thats what she says

:rolleyes:

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Musterion


Cury-us,

I like that quote. I believe all of us, eventually, answer to God for what we say, how we say it.

But, in regard to my post am I to understand that you're answering what I asked inv? Are you implying that CF refused to answer his questions? Because that isn't what he said. He said that she didn't answer them, at least that's what I got from his post. To me refusing to answer and not answering are important distinctions. JMO. [/*]

Just a reminder of the words attributed to CF on March 3rd in the post entitled "Get the Facts".
jmo

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Danette44


Work, work, work - checking in to see if any New news on Nicholas - and nothing. I see Christine posted again. Sure wish she would PRAY for a miracle that Nicholas will be found soon. I mean all that faith and all - she got a new home - her prayers are being answer. LOL JMOO [/*]

Hi Danette,

I don't have any negative feelings toward you. I don't feel any animosity toward you because you are vocal about your views regarding this case. Having said that, I don't understand this comment. It seems to me that it is only said to inflame anyone's emotions who cares not just about Nicholas but his wife and family. Why would anyone want to do that? Belittle someone's faith? Why? Get the board shut down? Why? Then an avenue for trying to help Nicholas is eliminated.

Again, I have no bad feelings toward you. I just don't understand this. JMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


Just a reminder of the words attributed to CF on March 3rd in the post entitled "Get the Facts".
jmo [/*]

Why do we need a reminder of that?

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Musterion


Why do we need a reminder of that? [/*]

The Get The Facts paragraph ends with -

For those of you not involved in the crime boards and who would like info please contact me.

Is it possible friends and family (everyone but crime board members who continue to worry and try to locate NF) have heard that Nicholas is indeed safe and sound somewhere and LE just can not release that information without NF's consent? That might explain why few apparent search efforts continue, IMO.

[n/t]

:confused:

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by n/t
:confused: [/*]:lol:

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


The Get The Facts paragraph ends with -

For those of you not involved in the crime boards and who would like info please contact me.

Is it possible friends and family (everyone but crime board members who continue to worry and try to locate NF) have heard that Nicholas is indeed safe and sound somewhere and LE just can not release that information without NF's consent? That might explain why few apparent search efforts continue, IMO. [/*]

Hi Cury,

I'm trying to follow your line of thinking in respect to my question to inv.

Anyway, to answer your question. Possible, yes. Probable. I don't think so.

CF and his family and friends wouldn't need Nicholas' consent to tell anyone he was alive. LE, yes. Family, no. It would be hard for me to believe that not one of them, if they knew he was safe, being as religious as many of them appear, could in good conscience continue to let people search for him. Let alone allow people to continue to question his families' love for him in that they seem to not care about him by not searching. As well as allow a continuance of speculative and sometimes very cruel comments about the mother of his children.

Also, I don't think Harlett would waste her time if she felt that Nicholas' whereabouts were known to CF. Unless, of course, your post did not include CF knowing. JMO.

Why would any of his friends or family want to keep it a secret if he was safe?

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi Danette,

I don't have any negative feelings toward you. I don't feel any animosity toward you because you are vocal about your views regarding this case. Having said that, I don't understand this comment. It seems to me that it is only said to inflame anyone's emotions who cares not just about Nicholas but his wife and family. Why would anyone want to do that? Belittle someone's faith? Why? Get the board shut down? Why? Then an avenue for trying to help Nicholas is eliminated.

Again, I have no bad feelings toward you. I just don't understand this. JMO. [/*]

I don't think I was belittling her faith - I feel she needs to focus alittle more on her husband that is missing and not quotes. If the Board was going to be shut down CW would of did it when she deleted some post after this one was posted. I don't feel it was belittling her, I'm sorry you feel that way. MO

[Musterion]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Musterion brought up the possibility of the board being shut down - Danette just responded to that. I didn't see you say anything to Musterion about bringing that up. [/*]

Rainy! Are you still up!! It's late in Texas!!!

I did bring that up and I hope it doesn't happen!!

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Maranatha


You were of course belittling her faith, and mine and countless others. And that's possibly your problem -- not thinking. IMO.

Why would you possibly care what someone puts on her own blog? Why would you put down Scripture that gives her comfort?

Why should anyone should do what you "feel", tell me who you are that you think that you have all the answers.

And don't bring CW into this ... you brought the whole subject on yourself.

Sheesh. [/*]

Excuse me, but then perhaps her blog messages need to stay on her blogs. I did not put her down - I would just like to see her focus on what this MESSAGE BOARD is about - and that is Nicholas who is MISSING. Get over it.......sheesh JMOO

[inv]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Musterion brought up the possibility of the board being shut down - Danette just responded to that. I didn't see you say anything to Musterion about bringing that up. [/*]

Hi, Rainy. I haven't had a chance to say hi to you today.

:seeya:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Musterion


Rainy! Are you still up!! It's late in Texas!!!

I did bring that up and I hope it doesn't happen!! [/*]

Hi Musterion - I napped today lol

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by inv


Hi, Rainy. I haven't had a chance to say hi to you today.

:seeya: [/*]

Hey INV - I thought I hollered at ya earlier (not literally lol) but maybe not :seeya:

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Musterion brought up the possibility of the board being shut down - Danette just responded to that. I didn't see you say anything to Musterion about bringing that up. [/*]

Thank you Rainy - don't want your friends to get upset with you for sticking by me - I don't think I said anything wrong, as many people speak their minds worst than I do......anyway I would hope CW would ban me if this be the case, so this board would stay open for the search of Nicholas who is the missing person on the message board. Good night Rainy again ty...:)

[dianaelaine]

I don't understand something. I'm a Christian, but this is a MISSING PERSON forum. This is NOT a support CF forum.

We look for clues, we think of ideas, we put our heads together to find the MISSING person.

Being a Christian, I would NOT come to a forum for missing persons and keep quoting Bible verses over and over, we are told to 'live' our religion, not pound others over the head with it.

Those who come here to discuss this case, need to feel free to talk about what they need to, to find the missing links, clues, or anything that will help make sure NF is safe and alive.

Just MOO ...

[Musterion]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Hi Musterion - I napped today lol [/*]

I haven't known many naps for about two and a half years!! That's when my little five year old stopped!!! Lucky you!

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Danette44


Thank you Rainy - don't want your friends to get upset with you for sticking by me - I don't think I said anything wrong, as many people speak their minds worst than I do......anyway I would hope CW would ban me if this be the case, so this board would stay open for the search of Nicholas who is the missing person on the message board. Good night Rainy again ty...:) [/*]

Danette,

I don't think Rainy could do much to get me upset with her! We don't agree on most anything in this case except we want Nicholas found! LOL! But, I like her heart and her consistency.

And you make a good point. A poster, we would hope, would be banned before the board would get shut down.

Have a good night!

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Danette44


Thank you Rainy - don't want your friends to get upset with you for sticking by me - I don't think I said anything wrong, as many people speak their minds worst than I do......anyway I would hope CW would ban me if this be the case, so this board would stay open for the search of Nicholas who is the missing person on the message board. Good night Rainy again ty...:) [/*]

Musterion and I both want the same thing - for Nicholas to be found alive and well. Though we do not agree on everything, she is one person that is fair and objective. She knew she brought it up and being the standup person she is, she confirmed it. No worries Danette :)

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Musterion


Danette,

I don't think Rainy could do much to get me upset with her! We don't agree on most anything in this case except we want Nicholas found! LOL! But, I like her heart and her consistency.

And you make a good point. A poster, we would hope, would be banned before the board would get shut down.

Have a good night! [/*]

LOL we posted at the same time with the same sentiment.

[SeattleEddie]

Luke 17:31 The person who is on the housetop that day must not come down to get the belongings out of his house. The person in the field, too, must not look back. Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife! Luke 17:33 Whoever tries to save his life, will lose it but whoever loses his life will preserve it. Luke 17:34 I tell you, two people will be in the same bed that night. One will be taken and the other will be left behind.

Luke17:37 Then they asked him, "Where, Lord, will this take place?" He told them, "Wherever there's a dead body, there the vultures will gather."

Source:The Bible - The International Standard Version

[Cury-us Coyote]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi Cury,

I'm trying to follow your line of thinking in respect to my question to inv.

Anyway, to answer your question. Possible, yes. Probable. I don't think so.

CF and his family and friends wouldn't need Nicholas' consent to tell anyone he was alive. LE, yes. Family, no. It would be hard for me to believe that not one of them, if they knew he was safe, being as religious as many of them appear, could in good conscience continue to let people search for him. Let alone allow people to continue to question his families' love for him in that they seem to not care about him by not searching. As well as allow a continuance of speculative and sometimes very cruel comments about the mother of his children.

Also, I don't think Harlett would waste her time if she felt that Nicholas' whereabouts were known to CF. Unless, of course, your post did not include CF knowing. JMO.

Why would any of his friends or family want to keep it a secret if he was safe? [/*]

I can not to speak to the alleged conversations between CF and Inv, but Inv responded. I added to the mix, the facts post to remind posters of an old post for reconsideration with fresh eyes and new information. IMO, Inv may be grouped into the crimeboard poster category, who are not entitled to answers.

We know CF is aware of the crime boards, IMO. Do we have any reason to believe any other family members are aware concerns continue? They might think, with no media coverage, discussions and brainstorming efforts for Nicholas have stopped?

I have no idea how HOH determines which of the many missing persons cases receives personal attention or when the return on investment of time is no longer favorable. IMO, the division of effort in this particular case was tilted more towards image control than pure investigative work, just my personal observations from afar.
jmo

[Nellie]

Originally posted by JustFacts


What community do you believe he's involved in? [/*]

And what brings you to think he's in that community????

[Musterion]

Originally posted by dianaelaine
I don't understand something. I'm a Christian, but this is a MISSING PERSON forum. This is NOT a support CF forum.

We look for clues, we think of ideas, we put our heads together to find the MISSING person.

Being a Christian, I would NOT come to a forum for missing persons and keep quoting Bible verses over and over, we are told to 'live' our religion, not pound others over the head with it.

Those who come here to discuss this case, need to feel free to talk about what they need to, to find the missing links, clues, or anything that will help make sure NF is safe and alive.

Just MOO ... [/*]

Hi dianaelaine,

Boy, you've said some truth here. We are to be living epistles read by the world. That is hard sometimes to remember.

And you're right that it isn't a support CF forum. I am not someone who thinks CF is suspect of anything to do with Nicholas' disappearance. I don't think she planned or initiated taking money from people. I don't think that her behaviour after Nicholas went missing is necessarily suspect. But, I know that the majority of people on this board do question her on these things. And when they question, IMO, sometimes they take things out of context. When I post I am trying to add context. I realize it isn't looked on favourably by most posters here and I will be/am criticized. But, that is ok. Keeping context and truth in anything discussed here, in anything to find Nicholas, should be something we all want. JMO.

[inv]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi dianaelaine,

Boy, you've said some truth here. We are to be living epistles read by the world. That is hard sometimes to remember.

And you're right that it isn't a support CF forum. I am not someone who thinks CF is suspect of anything to do with Nicholas' disappearance. I don't think she planned or initiated taking money from people. I don't think that her behaviour after Nicholas went missing is necessarily suspect. But, I know that the majority of people on this board do question her on these things. And when they question, IMO, sometimes they take things out of context. When I post I am trying to add context. I realize it isn't looked on favourably by most posters here and I will be/am criticized. But, that is ok. Keeping context and truth in anything discussed here, in anything to find Nicholas, should be something we all want. JMO. [/*]

Thanks, Musterion. Your consistency with you posts and your respect for other posters should be commended.

:beer:

[mc528]

Originally posted by inv


Thanks, Musterion. Your consistency with you posts and your respect for other posters should be commended.

:beer: [/*]

I'll second that. :beer:

[mc528]

And want to add to my previous post, that I don't think dianaelaine was referring to you Musterion. JMO, since I wouldn't really know for sure....but I believe her post was in reference to several others' posts these past few days or so. And I for one, absolutely agree with dianaelaine's post.

[dianaelaine]

Originally posted by mc528
And want to add to my previous post, that I don't think dianaelaine was referring to you Musterion. JMO, since I wouldn't really know for sure....but I believe her post was in reference to several others' posts these past few days or so. And I for one, absolutely agree with dianaelaine's post. [/*]

YUP! :beer:

[dianaelaine]

I'm off to dreamland ... nitey nite. :hat:

[Carol25]

I don't mean to butt in here, but I think it will come down to one path to follow. If I understand this correctly, LE has scaled back on their investigation and have found that NF had some sort of secret life. Christine has now found that she has no choice but to fend for herself.

At this point, I feel she should get her own attorney and sue for divorce on grounds of abandonment. At that time, her attorney could go to the court and get an order for LE to release all information that would help with revealing the whereabouts of her husband. Up to this point, he hadn't done anything illegal and LE may not have shared all of the information with her, due to his rights of privacy.

Armed with the new information, she might have closure and alimony and child support that she so desperately needs at this time.

Does that make sense to anyone?

[desmom]

Growing up, I heard "no news is good news"....and then I started following missing person cases.

Let today be the day something positive happens to resolve this case.

[MoonFlwr]

Agreed! (hope today is the day of good news).

Nobody else awake yet? ;)

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi dianaelaine,

Boy, you've said some truth here. We are to be living epistles read by the world. That is hard sometimes to remember.

And you're right that it isn't a support CF forum. I am not someone who thinks CF is suspect of anything to do with Nicholas' disappearance. I don't think she planned or initiated taking money from people. I don't think that her behaviour after Nicholas went missing is necessarily suspect. But, I know that the majority of people on this board do question her on these things. And when they question, IMO, sometimes they take things out of context. When I post I am trying to add context. I realize it isn't looked on favourably by most posters here and I will be/am criticized. But, that is ok. Keeping context and truth in anything discussed here, in anything to find Nicholas, should be something we all want. JMO. [/*]

You are absolutely right Musterion and is one reason I read every one of your posts and respect you so highly.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Last night I was watching the Missing Crimes Unit that is advertised on this board and one thing that was said is that no one vanishes without a trace. I don't know that they have ever heard of this case though because it sure seems NF did do just that.

Another thing mentioned was that people lie when being interrogated, but something that does not lie is body language.

This particular case was a cold case (11 years old), and LE started fresh. They reinterviewed people from years back and found the one clue they were looking for.

I wish LE would start over with this case. Talk to Christine, NF's family, his friends, his coworkers, the neighbors, and Mars Hill members.

Nicholas - if you are lost spiritually, emotionally or mentally, I pray God directs your path home. If you are "murdered and in or near water" I pray someone stumbles upon your body so you may be brought home and put to eternal rest with dignity.

For Nicholas on this two month mark of your missing....
:rose:

[Shelby1]

It's been two long months.

Prayers that Nicholas is safe and happy somewhere.

[dianaelaine]

If this were my son and I didn't know where he was, I'd be SCREAMING from every imaginable place, to get help to find him!!!

[n/t]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx

Nicholas - if you are lost spiritually, emotionally or mentally, I pray God directs your path home. If you are "murdered and in or near water" I pray someone stumbles upon your body so you may be brought home and put to eternal rest with dignity.

For Nicholas on this two month mark of your missing....
:rose: [/*]

Rainy, hope you don't mind that used this part of your post. You expressed it so well.

Hoping for some answers. Where are you Nicholas Francisco? :rose:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by n/t


Rainy, hope you don't mind that used this part of your post. You expressed it so well.

Hoping for some answers. Where are you Nicholas Francisco? :rose: [/*]

Not at all :)

[Miss Behavin]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi Miss Behavin,

I agree. The wait is hard for the public I can only imagine how the family feels. I hear and see Beth Holloway's voice and face and how it affects her to not know exactly what happened to her daughter. It has to be a pain that not many people can identify with.

I'm curious why you say alleged secret life. Cat Toy said something similar earlier. I'm wondering if you have not read what the KCSO has said regarding that or if you just don't believe it? I might be missing something!?

Thanks. [/*]

Hi Musterion,

I only say alleged because I haven't seen anything official from LE regarding that. I do understand Harlett has received confirmation of such, but still..... honestly, I'm not sure what the KCSO stands for?

I really have no reason to dispute this information, and am apt to believe there is more to it than we already know, but I do feel since NF isn't hear to speak for himself or defend himself, I should still say alleged. :shrug: JMO

[Miss Behavin]

It's been two months today! I thought about that before I went to sleep last night. Woke up this morning feeling kinda blah! I actually didn't sleep too well either with all the thoughts roaming thru my head.

I commend all the people who search for the missing day after day-whether for a living or just a good heart! I honestly don't know how you do it. It is all-encompassing, extremely consuming, and phenomenally challenging work.

I'm not directly involved in any of the cases that have captured my attention and heart, yet I have a hard time sleeping some nights!

I hope this case has some resolve soon.

[Carol25]

Can you provide the KCSO link?

[desmom]

Originally posted by Miss Behavin


Hi Musterion,

I only say alleged because I haven't seen anything official from LE regarding that. I do understand Harlett has received confirmation of such, but still..... honestly, I'm not sure what the KCSO stands for?

I really have no reason to dispute this information, and am apt to believe there is more to it than we already know, but I do feel since NF isn't hear to speak for himself or defend himself, I should still say alleged. :shrug: JMO [/*]

KCSO = King County Sheriff Office

Carol25, here is their website

http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/

[Carol25]

Originally posted by desmom


KCSO = King County Sheriff Office

Carol25, here is their website

http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/ [/*]
Thanks so much, desmom. Couldn't figure that one out!

[Musterion]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx

I wish LE would start over with this case. Talk to Christine, NF's family, his friends, his coworkers, the neighbors, and Mars Hill members.

Nicholas - if you are lost spiritually, emotionally or mentally, I pray God directs your path home. If you are "murdered and in or near water" I pray someone stumbles upon your body so you may be brought home and put to eternal rest with dignity.

For Nicholas on this two month mark of your missing....
:rose: [/*]

Ok. That made me cry.

I say amen and amen, Rainy.

And thank you, Rainy, MC528, inv and dianaelaine, for your kind words last night.

[Musterion]

Wanted to speak to this so I brought it over from Miss Behavin.

"Hi Musterion,

I only say alleged because I haven't seen anything official from LE regarding that. I do understand Harlett has received confirmation of such, but still..... honestly, I'm not sure what the KCSO stands for?

I really have no reason to dispute this information, and am apt to believe there is more to it than we already know, but I do feel since NF isn't hear to speak for himself or defend himself, I should still say alleged. JMO"

Thank you for clarifying!

I see that the link for KCSO was posted. And I do understand that it is difficult to try to gleen what is 'official', so to speak, information.

I think you are wise to use the alleged term!!

[Musterion]

Also, wanted to address this from yesterday, from Cury-us.

"I can not to speak to the alleged conversations between CF and Inv, but Inv responded. I added to the mix, the facts post to remind posters of an old post for reconsideration with fresh eyes and new information. IMO, Inv may be grouped into the crimeboard poster category, who are not entitled to answers.

We know CF is aware of the crime boards, IMO. Do we have any reason to believe any other family members are aware concerns continue? They might think, with no media coverage, discussions and brainstorming efforts for Nicholas have stopped?

I have no idea how HOH determines which of the many missing persons cases receives personal attention or when the return on investment of time is no longer favorable. IMO, the division of effort in this particular case was tilted more towards image control than pure investigative work, just my personal observations from afar.
jmo"

Cury-us,

When I read your posts they remind me of reading an authour that I admire very much: Oswald Chambers. His words are never wasteful. They are weighty and meaty. It takes me, someone who is not as sharp intellectually :) a while to wade through and digest what is being said.

Having said that, ha! What I hear you saying is that inv, based on CF's statement, is probably not among those she would answer questions to. And that what has been done in this case hasn't been just work to find Nicholas but damage control of someone who wasn't looked upon most favourably because of public persona. At least that's what I'm hearing. I never had thought of it in this way, but I understand your view. I think!

Also, that perhaps Nicholas' family, meaning mother, father and siblings, etc. may not know that there is a segment of the public who is sick at heart and want to help find Nicholas. Maybe they think no one really cares. If that is the case, that makes me really sad and maybe we can find a way, on this board, to remedy that. Good point and thought, Cury.

[Musterion]

Ok. Last one bringing over. Promise. From Carol25.

"I don't mean to butt in here, but I think it will come down to one path to follow. If I understand this correctly, LE has scaled back on their investigation and have found that NF had some sort of secret life. Christine has now found that she has no choice but to fend for herself.

At this point, I feel she should get her own attorney and sue for divorce on grounds of abandonment. At that time, her attorney could go to the court and get an order for LE to release all information that would help with revealing the whereabouts of her husband. Up to this point, he hadn't done anything illegal and LE may not have shared all of the information with her, due to his rights of privacy.

Armed with the new information, she might have closure and alimony and child support that she so desperately needs at this time.

Does that make sense to anyone?"

Hi Carol,

It does make sense.

But, I wonder, if it was found when the legal proceedings were started that LE didn't know where NF was or if he is alive where that would leave CF and their children. She would be divorced with no alimony or child support. And, from what I am thinking, it wouldn't do anything different for her than remaining married to a missing person. She'd just be divorced. JMO.

[MystryPhobia]

I accidentally entered Nic's name wrong while googling it this morning and found this. A pro bono environmental ad that he did production on for Publicis. There was obviously a typo with his name. It may have already been found before but I hadn't seen it before. Pretty cool.

http://www.commarts.com/exhibit/project-pro-bono-campaign.html

[Carol25]

Actually, once the proceedings started, she woulde be privy to all of the information that LE has. It doesn't mean she has to finish her divorce proceedings. She can terminate it any time she wants.

[field of snow]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia
I accidentally entered Nic's name wrong while googling it this morning and found this. A pro bono environmental ad that he did production on for Publicis. There was obviously a typo with his name. It may have already been found before but I hadn't seen it before. Pretty cool.

http://www.commarts.com/exhibit/project-pro-bono-campaign.html [/*]

That IS pretty cool!

[zenharmony19]

Christine has made a new blog entry:

http://thefranciscos.com/

[Carol25]

With all of the publicity there, don't you think he's far, far away?

[n/t]

Originally posted by zenharmony19
Christine has made a new blog entry:

http://thefranciscos.com/ [/*]

What does she mean by she prays for the truth to be revealed?

[Postergeist]

Originally posted by Shelby1
It's been two long months.

Prayers that Nicholas is safe and happy somewhere.

:( Yes Shelby, two months and counting and no leads as to what happened to Nicholas.

I'd post a rose but I didn't think it was allowed in this forum so a cyber candle of hope for this young father.

http://www.freefoto.com/images/05/04/05_04_51---Candle_web.jpg


Anyone with information please call King County Sheriff’s Office tip line: 206-296-3311

[Shelby1]

Originally posted by Carol25

With all of the publicity there, don't you think he's far, far away? [/*]

He could be.

Sometimes, though, it's easy to hide right under someone's nose........

[Shelby1]

Originally posted by Postergeist


:( Yes Shelby, two months and counting and no leads as to what happened to Nicholas.

I'd post a rose but I didn't think it was allowed in this forum so a cyber candle of hope for this young father.

http://www.freefoto.com/images/05/04/05_04_51---Candle_web.jpg


Anyone with information please call King County Sheriff’s Office tip line: 206-296-3311 [/*]

Hi Postie!

I like the candle.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by n/t


What does she mean by she prays for the truth to be revealed? [/*]

Hi n/t,

What do you think it means?

[n/t]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi n/t,

What do you think it means? [/*]

I don't know. That's why I asked the question.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Hi guys :seeya:

IMO, I think she is saying she wants the truth no matter what it is. If someone harmed him, or if he walked off to be with someone else, she wants to know. She said "for whatever reason Nicholas did not come home that night two months ago" which indicates to me that she may be considering that he left them voluntarily.

She is right that someone somewhere has to know something unless he took his own life and just has yet to be found.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by n/t


I don't know. That's why I asked the question. [/*]

She said that she prayed for the truth about his disappearance to be revealed. When I read your quote I had to go back and look because I wasn't sure what you referenced.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Musterion


She said that she prayed for the truth about his disappearance to be revealed. When I read your quote I had to go back and look because I wasn't sure what you referenced. [/*]

Yes, that's what she said. I just don't understand what she means by she prays for the truth about his disappearance to be revealed. Revealed to whom? The public? Herself?

I just thought it was an odd statement considering there was supposedly a secret life and a paper trail discovered. I would assume she and LE would know some of the truth, wouldn't they?

Also, if there was a "paper trail", then there would be some evidence to direct them to somewhere? A person or place perhaps?

IMO!

[n/t]

Originally posted by CAT TOY
after reading extensively about Nick; he had a lot of issues about going to work, esp if it was raining he mentions it a lot; having to go back to work, working weekends, how he loves weekends, how he looks forward going to work on the weekends (not) And how he loves a day off. Over worked, stressed out and tired. Thats the impression I got. If you added to that a new baby...


This guy was under stress about working; and commitments. You can tell just by reading from his online twitter posts. Its really sad to read them all in depth again. But it clearly shows to me a guy who probably arranged to leave. He also had a contact with someone from craigslist and that's always bothered me. Dont know how he picked up a bookcase in his car, maybe it fit; I dont know. It's probably nothing but still a lot of online access; I wonder how often he met ppl off line from online? Could he have really ran into trouble, someone he met from the internet?

CT [/*]

Hey CT! Hope you're doing well.

See, I took those twitter posts to mean the opposite. Maybe he was being sarcastic in what he was posting but to me it sounded like he was glad to work on the weekends? That's how I interpreted it.

:shrug:

[n/t]

Originally posted by litchfield29


I find this part of your post quite interesting, ......."it clearly shows to me a guy who probably arranged to leave. He also had a contact with someone from craigslist ......". From that you deduce he ran away? I'm sorry, but that doesn't make any sense to me. Sorry. I don't think he ran away. [/*]

I don't either. :(

[inv]

Originally posted by litchfield29


I find this part of your post quite interesting, ......."it clearly shows to me a guy who probably arranged to leave. He also had a contact with someone from craigslist ......". From that you deduce he ran away? I'm sorry, but that doesn't make any sense to me. Sorry. I don't think he ran away. [/*]

I am with you.

1. LE says they have evidence of a 'secret life'. There is no mention of the secret life extending beyond the date he went missing as far as we know.

2. There has been no activity on his cell phone since 4ish on Feb. 13 as far as we know.

3. There has been no activity on any of his bank or online accounts since Feb.13 as far as we know.

4. There has been no trace of him since then as far as we know.

I have beleived this was foul play from the beginning. Two months have gone by without so much as a phone call to his kids. How far could you possibly get when you are reported missing after being only four hours late getting home? I think LE would have found some trace of him by now if he had hopped a plane, train, or bus.

jmo

[n/t]

Originally posted by inv


I am with you.

1. LE says they have evidence of a 'secret life'. There is no mention of the secret life extending beyond the date he went missing as far as we know.

2. There has been no activity on his cell phone since 4ish on Feb. 13 as far as we know.

3. There has been no activity on any of his bank or online accounts since Feb.13 as far as we know.

4. There has been no trace of him since then as far as we know.

I have beleived this was foul play from the beginning. Two months have gone by without so much as a phone call to his kids. How far could you possibly get when you are reported missing after being only four hours late getting home? I think LE would have found some trace of him by now if he had hopped a plane, train, or bus.

jmo [/*]


Also taking off with only $50.00 doesn't make any sense. And leaving $4.00 for bank charges?? I think if he planned on leaving he would've left with a lot more cash. And like you said, the fact that there has been no activity, is a RED FLAG.

Leaving his car behind is another RED FLAG. Why dump it where he did? If he wanted to leave, he could've driven it to wherever he was headed and dumped it later or kept it. If he left voluntarily, it's legal.

None of it is making any sense and it's worrisome.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by inv


I am with you.

1. LE says they have evidence of a 'secret life'. There is no mention of the secret life extending beyond the date he went missing as far as we know.

2. There has been no activity on his cell phone since 4ish on Feb. 13 as far as we know.

3. There has been no activity on any of his bank or online accounts since Feb.13 as far as we know.

4. There has been no trace of him since then as far as we know.

I have beleived this was foul play from the beginning. Two months have gone by without so much as a phone call to his kids. How far could you possibly get when you are reported missing after being only four hours late getting home? I think LE would have found some trace of him by now if he had hopped a plane, train, or bus.

jmo [/*]

I completely agree! This is why it has been most frustrating that TES has not been actively pursued, friends' blogs not updated, pertinent helpful information put on his flyer, reward money increased - the list goes on.

Even if there is a "secret" somewhere does not exclude the possibility that Nicholas met with foul play. Of course it would take Nick's family to have a loud voice with LE - the only loud voice seems to be coming from the internet.

[mc528]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I completely agree! This is why it has been most frustrating that TES has not been actively pursued, friends' blogs not updated, pertinent helpful information put on his flyer, reward money increased - the list goes on.

Even if there is a "secret" somewhere does not exclude the possibility that Nicholas met with foul play. Of course it would take Nick's family to have a loud voice with LE - the only loud voice seems to be coming from the internet. [/*]


It's pretty sad, IMO, that only about 100 or so total strangers are the only people who seem to care whether NF is found, or what happened to him on 2/13. I certainly hope that if I ever went missing this wouldn't be the case. :(

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by mc528



It's pretty sad, IMO, that only about 100 or so total strangers are the only people who seem to care whether NF is found, or what happened to him on 2/13. I certainly hope that if I ever went missing this wouldn't be the case. :( [/*]

mc - I've thought the exact same thing. You'd hate to think if you went missing that someone could get on the internet and try to make you look like the bad guy; therefore LE says "ahhhhh okay she just left". Scary.

[figritout]

On the news this morning they found a body in Seattle. If I heard right it was downtown. My first thought is always of NF. But I don't think it was him as they could determine evidently that the person was between 35 & 40 years old. I don't think that there will come a day until NF is found that my head doesnt swing up when I hear they have found a body. Thinking of you NF...

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Musterion
Ok. Last one bringing over. Promise. From Carol25.

"I don't mean to butt in here, but I think it will come down to one path to follow. If I understand this correctly, LE has scaled back on their investigation and have found that NF had some sort of secret life. Christine has now found that she has no choice but to fend for herself.

At this point, I feel she should get her own attorney and sue for divorce on grounds of abandonment. At that time, her attorney could go to the court and get an order for LE to release all information that would help with revealing the whereabouts of her husband. Up to this point, he hadn't done anything illegal and LE may not have shared all of the information with her, due to his rights of privacy.

Armed with the new information, she might have closure and alimony and child support that she so desperately needs at this time.

Does that make sense to anyone?"

Hi Carol,

It does make sense.

But, I wonder, if it was found when the legal proceedings were started that LE didn't know where NF was or if he is alive where that would leave CF and their children. She would be divorced with no alimony or child support. And, from what I am thinking, it wouldn't do anything different for her than remaining married to a missing person. She'd just be divorced. JMO. [/*]

It would leave her free to marry again.....
So there is definately a difference.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by n/t


Yes, that's what she said. I just don't understand what she means by she prays for the truth about his disappearance to be revealed. Revealed to whom? The public? Herself?

I just thought it was an odd statement considering there was supposedly a secret life and a paper trail discovered. I would assume she and LE would know some of the truth, wouldn't they?

Also, if there was a "paper trail", then there would be some evidence to direct them to somewhere? A person or place perhaps?

IMO! [/*]

I think you're right. They know some of the truth. But, it doesn't appear that they know the complete story of why he disappeared. The complete story might uncover the whole truth.

As for the public having the truth....I don't know that that would be high on the list. IMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by mc528



It's pretty sad, IMO, that only about 100 or so total strangers are the only people who seem to care whether NF is found, or what happened to him on 2/13. I certainly hope that if I ever went missing this wouldn't be the case. :( [/*]

It seems that way to many posters. Because we don't know what the family is or isn't doing. We don't see efforts being made that we believe we would make in their shoes.

But, I believe they care, very very much, if he is found. They must have so much pain that is hard to bear. Thinking that Nicholas may have had a life other than the one he portrayed would be a shock to say the least.

As a mother or a sister there would be nothing that my child or sibling could do to make me stop loving them. Not the worst crime. As a wife, I would have ambivalent feelings as to wanting to see the spouse again, in a situation like this. If I had children with him I would know that the children would need to know, regardless if I did. That's one reason I think CF continues to state that she will always look for him. JMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Nellie


It would leave her free to marry again.....
So there is definately a difference. [/*]

That's true, Nellie.

I was thinking more of benefitting her and her children monetarily.

I don't know what her church advises. I know alot of churches will not counsel to divorce under any reason except proven adultery. JMO.

Oh! I pray for answers today for her and Nicholas' family.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by n/t


Yes, that's what she said. I just don't understand what she means by she prays for the truth about his disappearance to be revealed. Revealed to whom? The public? Herself?
IMO! [/*]

I also wanted to add that I think it is a brave thing to pray. For the truth to be revealed. Many times when truth is revealed it brings alot of pain before it sets you free to heal. IMO.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Musterion


That's true, Nellie.

I was thinking more of benefitting her and her children monetarily.

I don't know what her church advises. I know alot of churches will not counsel to divorce under any reason except proven adultery. JMO.

Oh! I pray for answers today for her and Nicholas' family. [/*]

But, in the end, a new marriage could greatly help financially, assuming she would marry someone with money or a job.

Not saying this is what she will do.....just saying divorce would free her to do this. Because quite frankly, if she stays single I can't see how she will support herself and her children unless she gets a job. Either a new husband or a job. And she can't get a new husband if she's already married. Right?

Not trying to be disrespectful.......just giving insight into why she might eventually want to file for divorce.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Nellie


But, in the end, a new marriage could greatly help financially, assuming she would marry someone with money or a job.

Not saying this is what she will do.....just saying divorce would free her to do this. Because quite frankly, if she stays single I can't see how she will support herself and her children unless she gets a job. Either a new husband or a job. And she can't get a new husband if she's already married. Right?

Not trying to be disrespectful.......just giving insight into why she might eventually want to file for divorce. [/*]

I don't think you are being disrespectful, Nellie.

I know this: God has a plan for our lives. He has a plan for Christine and the children. I pray that she will walk that plan out, whatever it is.

I wouldn't begrudge her and her children a happy and prosperous life (I'm not saying you are Nellie!). She and her children didn't deserve to be abandoned. Whether it was intentional or not. No one, IMO, deserves to be left without an explanation or a warning, especially when there are little ones. That is said assuming someone left willingly. IMO.

[twinkiesmom]

Originally posted by Musterion


That's true, Nellie.

I was thinking more of benefitting her and her children monetarily.

I don't know what her church advises. I know alot of churches will not counsel to divorce under any reason except proven adultery. JMO.

Oh! I pray for answers today for her and Nicholas' family. [/*]

For someone in Christine's shoes, wouldn't you need a legal separation at least to make sure you didn't have to share in any new debt your partner created in his new life?

[twinkiesmom]

Originally posted by litchfield29


I find this part of your post quite interesting, ......."it clearly shows to me a guy who probably arranged to leave. He also had a contact with someone from craigslist ......". From that you deduce he ran away? I'm sorry, but that doesn't make any sense to me. Sorry. I don't think he ran away. [/*]

Is the Craigslist contact something we know for sure (source?) or surmised?

[figritout]

This board is winding down... One last thought...

The interviews and reactions of those involved in this case make it quite puzzling... I have watched the reactions of loved ones on tape of men missing recently and it just doesn't compare..

I guess because I have waffled on my opinions on what has happened I leave this particular board quite baffled... I think we all will be quite shocked on the outcome.. But if NF chose to leave we might not have an answer for years to come..

So for CF and CF supporters I would be encourging her to find a life outside of donations and sympathy, it will wear thin, and try to make a living as best she can.. It might mean looking for a man.. But it could all replay again so why not try to find a way to depend on yourself and make a life for the children? It is possible.. Happens everyday, women realize that their children have only them and they need to step up to the plate and make it right.. Prayers are great, but be sure to have the "working" tools in your hand...

I wish the best for you CF and NF I hope that you are alive and come back and make things right with your family...

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Musterion


I don't think you are being disrespectful, Nellie.

I know this: God has a plan for our lives. He has a plan for Christine and the children. I pray that she will walk that plan out, whatever it is.

I wouldn't begrudge her and her children a happy and prosperous life (I'm not saying you are Nellie!). She and her children didn't deserve to be abandoned. Whether it was intentional or not. No one, IMO, deserves to be left without an explanation or a warning, especially when there are little ones. That is said assuming someone left willingly. IMO. [/*]

I totally agree with everything you said if he just took off.

[inv]

Originally posted by Amaryllis
I just wish some news would come in about poor Nicholas.....I just feel he is dead..........Praying for Nicholas......

Nicholas if you are alive people are still wanting to know where you are..........

MOO! [/*]

I have the same fear. Unfortunately, until LE has new leads, I don't think we are going to know what happened to Nicholas for a long time. Especially given that his posters are being taken down, interest in the case seems to be dwindling, nobody is talking, etc.

IMO, we are going to know what happened to Nicholas when someone unintentionally discovers his body.

I hate that I believe this, but I do. I hope I am wrong.

*eta* I also think we are all gonna be quite surprised with the aftermath. Too many things about this case are so strange.

IMO

[zenharmony19]

You know, this thing with Viliamu Fale has always bothered me, being that his wife worked at the Costco where Nick was supposed to go shopping for sugar. Isn't that a strange coincidence? A very very strange coincidence? Maybe one that is beyond random chance?

OK, Nick disappears on Feb 13th. Lets suppose Nick, makes it to Costco that night. What could have happened there, in the parking lot?
After he got out of his car, on the way into the store, could he have been hit by Vilamu Fale's car, who, let's just speculate, was on his way out of the parking lot, after just dropping off his wife at work? Maybe Fale did hit him, killed him, panicked, threw his body into the trunk of his car, and took off. Usually 6-7 PM is a very quiet time at most grocery/department stores, maybe nobody saw what happened.
Fale disappeared they say, after work the next day. So is it possible, Fale could have dumped the body that night, and got up and went to work the next day as usual. But during the day he became more and more worried that somebody may have witnessed what happened, his anxiety about it grew, and so he decided by the end of the work day to take off. And he did.

Maybe something like that happened? It's possible.

[Carol25]

I see it as fairly clear that he just took off. LE isn't searching, they knew he had a secret life, his family isn't on tv pleading for people to search and his wife is asking for someone to provide information so he can be "exposed."

Leaving on the 13th tells me he told someone that they would be celebrating on Valentines Day.

I always thought it very strange that CF would call 911 and declare him "missing" before she called area hospitals fearing an accident. Having an accident would certainly enter my head rather than my husband getting murdered on the way to get sugar. But that's just me.

She knew he was leaving her and she wanted the police to bring him back. JMO

[MoonFlwr]

Originally posted by zenharmony19
You know, this thing with Viliamu Fale has always bothered me, being that his wife worked at the Costco where Nick was supposed to go shopping for sugar. Isn't that a strange coincidence? A very very strange coincidence? Maybe one that is beyond random chance?

OK, Nick disappears on Feb 13th. Lets suppose Nick, makes it to Costco that night. What could have happened there, in the parking lot?
After he got out of his car, on the way into the store, could he have been hit by Vilamu Fale's car, who, let's just speculate, was on his way out of the parking lot, after just dropping off his wife at work? Maybe Fale did hit him, killed him, panicked, threw his body into the trunk of his car, and took off. Usually 6-7 PM is a very quiet time at most grocery/department stores, maybe nobody saw what happened.
Fale disappeared they say, after work the next day. So is it possible, Fale could have dumped the body that night, and got up and went to work the next day as usual. But during the day he became more and more worried that somebody may have witnessed what happened, his anxiety about it grew, and so he decided by the end of the work day to take off. And he did.

Maybe something like that happened? It's possible. [/*]

hmmm....interesting theory!

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by zenharmony19
You know, this thing with Viliamu Fale has always bothered me, being that his wife worked at the Costco where Nick was supposed to go shopping for sugar. Isn't that a strange coincidence? A very very strange coincidence? Maybe one that is beyond random chance?

OK, Nick disappears on Feb 13th. Lets suppose Nick, makes it to Costco that night. What could have happened there, in the parking lot?
After he got out of his car, on the way into the store, could he have been hit by Vilamu Fale's car, who, let's just speculate, was on his way out of the parking lot, after just dropping off his wife at work? Maybe Fale did hit him, killed him, panicked, threw his body into the trunk of his car, and took off. Usually 6-7 PM is a very quiet time at most grocery/department stores, maybe nobody saw what happened.
Fale disappeared they say, after work the next day. So is it possible, Fale could have dumped the body that night, and got up and went to work the next day as usual. But during the day he became more and more worried that somebody may have witnessed what happened, his anxiety about it grew, and so he decided by the end of the work day to take off. And he did.

Maybe something like that happened? It's possible. [/*]

I TOTALLY agree..........What are the chances ?????. I did some research into the "friends" on VF's wife's page and came up with some possible clues......but I am not sure how to link this and I don't want to write anything that will get me in trouble.

Furthermore.......doesn't anyone think the reaction of VF's wife was strange. She seemed to not want ANY publicity.

Everything stated above is IMO and MOO and is in NO way intended to appear to be FACT. :patriot:

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


I TOTALLY agree..........What are the chances ?????. I did some research into the "friends" on VF's wife's page and came up with some possible clues......but I am not sure how to link this and I don't want to write anything that will get me in trouble.

Furthermore.......doesn't anyone think the reaction of VF's wife was strange. She seemed to not want ANY publicity.

Everything stated above is IMO and MOO and is in NO way intended to appear to be FACT. :patriot: [/*]


Sorry...VF's wifes MySpace page

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by sadiemay62


I don't think he took off. I don't think CF "knew he was leaving her, and she wanted the police to bring him back". That makes no sense to me at all. I guess time will tell.

jmo [/*]

It totally makes sense to me!!!!

IMO, Given her continuing "poor me" focus, her immediate emphasis on money and herself (as opposed to finding N), and even the fact that her only blog on myspace is a group of bad things that have happened to her.......I believe that Christine has displayed a "victim" type of mentality. I believe this mentality may be derived from a low self esteem.

It is also possible that the reason we have not heard from Christines family is because she could be estranged from them due to some type of abusive situation (I suspect verbal). ( I am speculating).

IMO It is entirely possible that she knows (or is just now having to acknowledge) why NF ran off (if he did), and is relying on the others including online friends, the police and God, to find him.

IMO, She created the vision of a "perfect" life that protected her from having to face reality. When this vision crumbled she was unable to function and reverted to victim status. (did not attend vigil, did not push to have search org.s involved, did not "pound the pavement", knock on doors...etc). She used an inordinate amount of time searching for sympathy and rejecting anything that was not.

Similarly, IMO, Christine never have initiated any involvement in Nicholas' disappearance. IMO He was a key player in her "perfect world" and I believe if she became angry with him she would be much more likely to play "victim" and pray to god to make it all go away.

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


I TOTALLY agree..........What are the chances ?????. I did some research into the "friends" on VF's wife's page and came up with some possible clues......but I am not sure how to link this and I don't want to write anything that will get me in trouble.

Furthermore.......doesn't anyone think the reaction of VF's wife was strange. She seemed to not want ANY publicity.

Everything stated above is IMO and MOO and is in NO way intended to appear to be FACT. :patriot: [/*]

Hi Beetle, if you can figure out how to post links to that information, I'm interested. I'm new to posting myself, so sorry, can't be of help in that area.

I think someone had mentioned they think VF left on his own and that may be why his wife doesn't want any more publicity, but sorry I don't have any links to support that.

The fact that he went missing the day after Nicholas has always bothered me, it would be a coincidence even if it was just that he went missing the day after Nick, but the fact that his wife works at the Costco where Nick was going to buy sugar, is just bizarre. The fact that they both have Asian ancestery is a little strange, too, but probably not significant.

Oh yeah and I guess the traffic in the stores around where I have lived has always seemed to slow down by 6:30 pm, anyway. But I have never lived in the city, workdays there may run a little later, I don't know.

IMO, MOO

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Carol25
I
I always thought it very strange that CF would call 911 and declare him "missing" before she called area hospitals fearing an accident. Having an accident would certainly enter my head rather than my husband getting murdered on the way to get sugar. But that's just me.

She knew he was leaving her and she wanted the police to bring him back. JMO [/*]

Hi Carol!

I'm not sure she didn't call the hospitals. He was expected home around seven to eight, from what I can tell. She called the police at ten. In those couple of hours maybe she was calling friends, his co workers and the hospitals? I could be wrong and if I am can you point me to the information that says she did not call the hospitals?

TIA!

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


It totally makes sense to me!!!!

IMO, Given her continuing "poor me" focus, her immediate emphasis on money and herself (as opposed to finding N), and even the fact that her only blog on myspace is a group of bad things that have happened to her.......I believe that Christine has displayed a "victim" type of mentality. I believe this mentality may be derived from a low self esteem.

It is also possible that the reason we have not heard from Christines family is because she could be estranged from them due to some type of abusive situation (I suspect verbal). ( I am speculating).

IMO It is entirely possible that she knows (or is just now having to acknowledge) why NF ran off (if he did), and is relying on the others including online friends, the police and God, to find him.

IMO, She created the vision of a "perfect" life that protected her from having to face reality. When this vision crumbled she was unable to function and reverted to victim status. (did not attend vigil, did not push to have search org.s involved, did not "pound the pavement", knock on doors...etc). She used an inordinate amount of time searching for sympathy and rejecting anything that was not.

Similarly, IMO, Christine never have initiated any involvement in Nicholas' disappearance. IMO He was a key player in her "perfect world" and I believe if she became angry with him she would be much more likely to play "victim" and pray to god to make it all go away. [/*]

Needy people can have more trouble functioning without support then your average person with a well-developed and healthy ego. IMO from my experience with psychology, this has nothing whatsoever to do with the integrity of the person, their moral functioning, their ability to tell right from wrong, and their likelihood to commit a criminal act.

Another thing I have noticed IMO from my personal experience is when a person expresses neediness in socially inappropriate or unacceptable ways, it certainly does tend to push some people's buttons. But we all have egos and needs which we repress to get by in society. Our own unmet hidden ego needs tend to block clear seeing of others situations because of projection (IMO, MOO).

IMO in my excursions into psychology I have seen certain family types that tend to be more on the quiet side, where family members have difficulty expressing themselves, sticking up for themselves, etc. Because these people have trouble expressing themselves they would never be good in the limelight. If someone in one of these families goes missing, it is quite possible they would not be too outspoken in the media about it, simply because they are not capable of it. IMO

[Musterion]

Originally posted by zenharmony19
You know, this thing with Viliamu Fale has always bothered me, being that his wife worked at the Costco where Nick was supposed to go shopping for sugar. Isn't that a strange coincidence? A very very strange coincidence? Maybe one that is beyond random chance?

OK, Nick disappears on Feb 13th. Lets suppose Nick, makes it to Costco that night. What could have happened there, in the parking lot?
After he got out of his car, on the way into the store, could he have been hit by Vilamu Fale's car, who, let's just speculate, was on his way out of the parking lot, after just dropping off his wife at work? Maybe Fale did hit him, killed him, panicked, threw his body into the trunk of his car, and took off. Usually 6-7 PM is a very quiet time at most grocery/department stores, maybe nobody saw what happened.
Fale disappeared they say, after work the next day. So is it possible, Fale could have dumped the body that night, and got up and went to work the next day as usual. But during the day he became more and more worried that somebody may have witnessed what happened, his anxiety about it grew, and so he decided by the end of the work day to take off. And he did.

Maybe something like that happened? It's possible. [/*]

I do think the probability of two men missing from around the same area within a day of each other is suspect.

Having said that, it's been reported that Le doesn't believe the two cases are connected. Stated here: http://helpfindthemissing.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2562&page=12 "Nicholas Francisco and Viliamu Fale cases are not connected according to LE."

JMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by zenharmony19


Needy people can have more trouble functioning without support then your average person with a well-developed and healthy ego. IMO from my experience with psychology, this has nothing whatsoever to do with the integrity of the person, their moral functioning, their ability to tell right from wrong, and their likelihood to commit a criminal act.

Another thing I have noticed IMO from my personal experience is when a person expresses neediness in socially inappropriate or unacceptable ways, it certainly does tend to push some people's buttons. But we all have egos and needs which we repress to get by in society. Our own unmet hidden ego needs tend to block clear seeing of others situations because of projection (IMO, MOO).

IMO in my excursions into psychology I have seen certain family types that tend to be more on the quiet side, where family members have difficulty expressing themselves, sticking up for themselves, etc. Because these people have trouble expressing themselves they would never be good in the limelight. If someone in one of these families goes missing, it is quite possible they would not be too outspoken in the media about it, simply because they are not capable of it. IMO [/*]

Well put, Zen!!! IMO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by beetlebrow



Sorry...VF's wifes MySpace page [/*]

Beetle,

Is this the page/link?

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=6372150

Musterion

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by Musterion


Beetle,

Is this the page/link?

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=6372150

Musterion [/*]

Yes.

[beetlebrow]

Originally posted by zenharmony19


Needy people can have more trouble functioning without support then your average person with a well-developed and healthy ego. IMO from my experience with psychology, this has nothing whatsoever to do with the integrity of the person, their moral functioning, their ability to tell right from wrong, and their likelihood to commit a criminal act.

Another thing I have noticed IMO from my personal experience is when a person expresses neediness in socially inappropriate or unacceptable ways, it certainly does tend to push some people's buttons. But we all have egos and needs which we repress to get by in society. Our own unmet hidden ego needs tend to block clear seeing of others situations because of projection (IMO, MOO).

IMO in my excursions into psychology I have seen certain family types that tend to be more on the quiet side, where family members have difficulty expressing themselves, sticking up for themselves, etc. Because these people have trouble expressing themselves they would never be good in the limelight. If someone in one of these families goes missing, it is quite possible they would not be too outspoken in the media about it, simply because they are not capable of it. IMO [/*]

I was responding to a post where the poster said they could not understand how anyone could believe that Christine would use the police to find N.

I wasn't commenting on her morals or integrity in regards to her abilty to be involved in the foul play aspect of this case. I do think that a person's opinions of their own abilities and self confidence can have an effect on that persons decision to commit a crime. Again I do not think Christine is involved.

IMO, N's wife does not seem to be the quiet type and does not seem to have difficulty expressing herself. She has been quite outspoken about what she is going thru and how all this is effecting her.

Unless stated as fact all of the above is MOO.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by beetlebrow


I was responding to a post where the poster said they could not understand how anyone could believe that Christine would use the police to find N.

I wasn't commenting on her morals or integrity in regards to her abilty to be involved in the foul play aspect of this case. I do think that a person's opinions of their own abilities and self confidence can have an effect on that persons decision to commit a crime. Again I do not think Christine is involved.

IMO, N's wife does not seem to be the quiet type and does not seem to have difficulty expressing herself. She has been quite outspoken about what she is going thru and how all this is effecting her.

Unless stated as fact all of the above is MOO. [/*]

Hi Beetle,

While I don't share most of your opinions I did understand your conclusions. And I understood that you weren't commenting on CF's morals or integrity!

I think, and Zenharmony would be better to explain what she meant, that maybe she was talking about why Nic's family seems to be so quiet in their search for him. I might be wrong in that but that's what I got from her last paragraph. IMO.

[zenharmony19]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by beetlebrow


I was responding to a post where the poster said they could not understand how anyone could believe that Christine would use the police to find N.

I wasn't commenting on her morals or integrity in regards to her abilty to be involved in the foul play aspect of this case. I do think that a person's opinions of their own abilities and self confidence can have an effect on that persons decision to commit a crime. Again I do not think Christine is involved.

IMO, N's wife does not seem to be the quiet type and does not seem to have difficulty expressing herself. She has been quite outspoken about what she is going thru and how all this is effecting her.

Unless stated as fact all of the above is MOO. [/*][/
QUOTE]

I was really just stating my opinion concerning some of things that you mentioned, and did not intend to imply that you were commenting on Christine's morals or integrity, sorry if it seemed that way. Actually, I do think you have made some good points.


IMO I do think that some people who can't express themselves well, tend to lash out instead of being able to articulate their feelings properly verbally. They may be articulate but might have trouble properly expressing their thoughts and feelings on a Bulletin board, for instance, or in front of any large audience. They just may not know how to act in certain situations, from lack of sense of self. I'm not saying this is the case with CF and NF, just giving food for thought. IMO

It's a complicated subject with no easy answers, so I don't think it's worth debating too much. I do think however, that there is no real evidence at all that Christine knew about Nick's leaving before or when he did. MOO. I see a strange connection between Viliamu Fale and Nicholas but I see no unexplained evidence that Christine knew Nicholas was leaving.

Peace and Blessings.

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi Beetle,

While I don't share most of your opinions I did understand your conclusions. And I understood that you weren't commenting on CF's morals or integrity!

I think, and Zenharmony would be better to explain what she meant, that maybe she was talking about why Nic's family seems to be so quiet in their search for him. I might be wrong in that but that's what I got from her last paragraph. IMO. [/*]

Yes, thanks Musterion, and hi! That's exactly what I meant, that it might explain why Nic's family is so quiet.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by zenharmony19
[QUOTE][i]

I see a strange connection between Viliamu Fale and Nicholas but I see no unexplained evidence that Christine knew Nicholas was leaving.

Peace and Blessings. [/*]

I agree she didn't know.

If Nicholas left on his own, I don't believe that CF knew he was going to leave. I think that Nicholas hid his alleged 'other' life very well. I think it has blindsided Christine and everyone that knew Nicholas. Not one person has come forward publically to say that they knew him to be the kind of guy to leave or to have another life. They all seem in shock. JMO.

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by Musterion


I agree she didn't know.

If Nicholas left on his own, I don't believe that CF knew he was going to leave. I think that Nicholas hid his alleged 'other' life very well. I think it has blindsided Christine and everyone that knew Nicholas. Not one person has come forward publically to say that they knew him to be the kind of guy to leave or to have another life. They all seem in shock. JMO. [/*]

Those are good points and I do agree with them. If someone does know about his *secret life* the only reason I can think of for them not coming forward at this point, is because they also know that he took off, and aren't about to disclose where he is. Or else, of course, they were involved in his disappearance somehow, and it was indeed foul play. IMO

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by Musterion


I agree she didn't know.

If Nicholas left on his own, I don't believe that CF knew he was going to leave. I think that Nicholas hid his alleged 'other' life very well. I think it has blindsided Christine and everyone that knew Nicholas. Not one person has come forward publically to say that they knew him to be the kind of guy to leave or to have another life. They all seem in shock. JMO. [/*]

Of course if his secret life did involve some kind of *affairs* with other people, there should be *someone* that had been involved with him willing to come forward to give information about that. Unless maybe they themselves are married, or are afraid of being implicated in his disappearance, or are just unaware that he is missing at all. If he was having affairs, you would think somebody would know something..

[Melly53]

Originally posted by zenharmony19


Of course if his secret life did involve some kind of *affairs* with other people, there should be *someone* that had been involved with him willing to come forward to give information about that. Unless maybe they themselves are married, or are afraid of being implicated in his disappearance, or are just unaware that he is missing at all. If he was having affairs, you would think somebody would know something.. [/*]

Sorry but I disagree to a point. If there was "someone" that had been involved with him, I can see them perhaps relaying that information to LE but not to the public. I don't know of many people that would be willing to admit publicly that they have had or were having an affair with a married man. IMO, JMO, MOO

[saydeezmom]

Originally posted by zenharmony19


Of course if his secret life did involve some kind of *affairs* with other people, there should be *someone* that had been involved with him willing to come forward to give information about that. Unless maybe they themselves are married, or are afraid of being implicated in his disappearance, or are just unaware that he is missing at all. If he was having affairs, you would think somebody would know something.. [/*]

Hi zenharmoney19:

do you or did you know nf?

does ze= zea
does n = noah

just wondering...the way your reponses are...i picture cf on tv.

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by Melly53


Sorry but I disagree to a point. If there was "someone" that had been involved with him, I can see them perhaps relaying that information to LE but not to the public. I don't know of many people that would be willing to admit publicly that they have had or were having an affair with a married man. IMO, JMO, MOO [/*]

Yes you are indeed probably right on that, when writing about "coming forward" I was thinking both about speaking out publicly and going to LE...

[zenharmony19]

Originally posted by saydeezmom


Hi zenharmoney19:

do you or did you know nf?

does ze= zea
does n = noah

just wondering...the way your reponses are...i picture cf on tv. [/*]

Hi. No I don't know nf, nor anyone involved with the case. I'm just an interested party on the other side of the country.

[decor]

I see that Nick's best friend has made his blog private.

I wonder what kind of secret life Nick had that he didn't even share it with his best friend.

[K Anne]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi Carol!

I'm not sure she didn't call the hospitals. He was expected home around seven to eight, from what I can tell. She called the police at ten. In those couple of hours maybe she was calling friends, his co workers and the hospitals? I could be wrong and if I am can you point me to the information that says she did not call the hospitals?

TIA! [/*]

Hi folks,

IIRC one or more of the earliest news articles reported that the hospitals had been contacted, either by family or by LE.

I don't have time to search for links tho, so, consider it JMO...