Discussion - March 16th

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by Beth
I've been gone for 30 minutes and was hoping I'd come back to hear about these "fresh ideas" that all the boards are abuzz about.

Well? [/*]
yeah right...
she was just here to "protect" CF....
where are the new ideas???
I, for one, would not be surprised if she is CF herself.
CF acts so suspicious.
This seems like a game to her.
My husband asked me what i was doing on the laptop tonight and he said "oh you're playing Clue again?"
Sometimes it's sure what it feels like.

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by Oregongal


That's a horrible thing to say PJ, I don't think anyone here would have felt better if she miscarried. Especially any women.
JMO [/*]
It was simply an innocent question in response to a post.
It is not nearly as horrible as some of the things posted already.
You had to have read the post I was responding too.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
Good grief, Decor, you know I can't speak "for every member" of the church. I'm just saying I don't know of one that would miss their spouse's vigil. Maybe they would but I would be shocked. I've seen spouses who are sick with cancer, who have to be brought in a wheelchair, who have to be medicated, to attend a memorial or funeral. I know a vigil is a bit different, but I still find it odd that Christine wouldn't attend.
[/*]

Sherry,

I am a committed Christian. I love God. I have been in ministry. I was a minister's wife.

I have seen people in almost every sad and grievious situation there can be. Probably just like you have. The most striking memory I have is of a mother holding her two day old baby. The baby had died. The mother didn't cry. She laughed. She sang to the baby. I never saw a tear. It didn't make sense to me then.

I can't, in good conscience, judge Christine on her choice of not going to a vigil. Not when I've seen the inconsistencies in people who are in grief.

[Pam]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I would love to compile a list of all the unusual things I find about this case.....most of it relates to Christine.

1. why didn't she attend the vigil?
2. did she really feel her baby move at 6 weeks pregnant?
3. why did she sit with her children and cry that they wouldn't
have a daddy? that was rough....
4. why were donations received so soon?
5. why have none of the donations gone to the reward or a PI?
6. why did she say the statement about Nicholas being in or
near water?


Anyone care to add some questions? [/*]

I'll add to your list:

Why did she think it was foul play from the beginning?

Why did she change that to "he was murdered"?

Why not plead for him to come home, contact someone, be released, etc. when she was in the media's spotligh?

Why has everything been about how hard it this is for her...where is the love for her husband?

I'm sure there are a dozen other things I could add...I'm just multi-tasking right at the moment.

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by soyesterday
I know it. Again, if Christine was the one missing and Nicholas was behaving like this, he would be torn to shreds.
What is the difference????:confused: [/*]

The percentage says a lot more men kill women than the reverse.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Shimz
http://supportingchristine.wordpress.com/2008/02/24/supporting-christine-with-word-prayer-and-action/


In reading a majority of these posts, you wouldn't even know NF existed. Except for the title, which doesn't mention his missing... Everything is about her, the post that talks about hoping she is warm that night, what about NF... it is a support site for her, and her alone..

Its like.. he went missing, and everyone is caring more about her, her financial situation, her lonliness, her hardships, her, her, her...

Everyone is talking about her over there, but it is all good things so I guess it is ok..

Everything is JMO [/*]

Yes, that website is all about Christine, and it does seem that Nicholas is, at the most, simply an afterthought there. I understand them wanting to have a place where Christine can feel unconditionally supported during this challenging time. At the same time, I don't understand why people who simply want to "support" Christine and don't want to hear any speculation or theories about her involvement -- what she knows and doesn't know, what reasons at home Nicholas may have had for leaving, what Christine's contradictory statements might mean etc -- why those people would come to this board, which is a crime board that quite naturally is going to be looking at those things.

A little O/T but related. My cousin's 18-year-old son committed suicide 6 months ago. His buddies still post to him on his myspace page sometimes. It is eery and yet touching too.

I wonder if a "supportingnicholasfrancisco.com" website should be started, and people could simply leave positive, uplifting, caring words and prayers for Nicholas there. Hmm. Stay tuned.

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


The percentage says a lot more men kill women than the reverse. [/*]

Well ok then, by all means, since the "percentage" is in favor for the women, then she should not even be suspected of wrongdoing.
I don't think so.
She knows something.
She has been up to something.
Or should i say "you" are up to something?
If you're Christine, you should really just come out and say it.

[Pam]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


The percentage says a lot more men kill women than the reverse. [/*]

But, there are a great number of cases where women have killed or hired a killer.

Just finished reading Joe McGinnis's last book....there was a cold hearted woman!!!

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


Yes, that website is all about Christine, and it does seem that Nicholas is, at the most, simply an afterthought there. I understand them wanting to have a place where Christine can feel unconditionally supported during this challenging time. At the same time, I don't understand why people who simply want to "support" Christine and don't want to hear any speculation or theories about her involvement -- what she knows and doesn't know, what reasons at home Nicholas may have had for leaving, what Christine's contradictory statements might mean etc -- why those people would come to this board, which is a crime board that quite naturally is going to be looking at those things.

A little O/T but related. My cousin's 18-year-old son committed suicide 6 months ago. His buddies still post to him on his myspace page sometimes. It is eery and yet touching too.

I wonder if a "supportingnicholasfrancisco.com" website should be started, and people could simply leave positive, uplifting, caring words and prayers for Nicholas there. Hmm. Stay tuned. [/*]
That sounds like a great idea!
The family and friends of Denise Amber Lee have set up a myspace page for her too.
It says "location" heaven" or something like that.
And people leave messages for her and talk to her.

[Shimz]

I keep going back and forth on my feelings it was foul play or not... but there is one reason i could see him walking...

It is important to look at CF's actions as it could lead to motives for him leaving...

My point is, in the interviews, any worry or concern I see is for herself. IMO, she speaks as if she is more upset that he is gone because she doesn't know how to pay her bills, etc than she misses and loves him..

She speaks more of herself and her hardships because of his missing, than what can actually try to be done to find him...

I do not think these things should be overlooked, or considered "bashing", it is merely pointing out observations... and being that she was the one he was with day in and day out, it could give insight to his daily life, struggles, joys, reasons for leaving or staying... IMO

[isitme]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


(*snipped*)

I wonder if a "supportingnicholasfrancisco.com" website should be started, and people could simply leave positive, uplifting, caring words and prayers for Nicholas there. Hmm. Stay tuned. [/*]


Great Idea!!!!!! Perhaps his family, mom/dad/sisters and friends will feel comfortable posting there. If not at least they will see that there are those that care about him.

[Pam]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


Yes, that website is all about Christine, and it does seem that Nicholas is, at the most, simply an afterthought there. I understand them wanting to have a place where Christine can feel unconditionally supported during this challenging time. At the same time, I don't understand why people who simply want to "support" Christine and don't want to hear any speculation or theories about her involvement -- what she knows and doesn't know, what reasons at home Nicholas may have had for leaving, what Christine's contradictory statements might mean etc -- why those people would come to this board, which is a crime board that quite naturally is going to be looking at those things.

A little O/T but related. My cousin's 18-year-old son committed suicide 6 months ago. His buddies still post to him on his myspace page sometimes. It is eery and yet touching too.

I wonder if a "supportingnicholasfrancisco.com" website should be started, and people could simply leave positive, uplifting, caring words and prayers for Nicholas there. Hmm. Stay tuned. [/*]

Now that would be a wonderful support website!!:)

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth
The percentages also say that online internet donation scams are at an all time high.

More and more, in times of crisis, people use the Internet to contribute money quickly to aid others that provide relief to victims worldwide. Unfortunately, while the Internet has made it easier to make a donation, the Web has also led to an increase in online donation scams. In our effort to lend aid quickly, many of us set aside our cynicism and become more susceptible to false online solicitations. Donation fraud not only cons givers out of their money, it also takes its toll on legitimate groups, which denies them funds for relief efforts and cheats real disaster victims. [/*]

Yes, I just keep thinking if any part of this turns out to be a scam, how will that affect other requests for donations for people who are in need in the future? People will just become jaded about the whole thing, I think. I certainly hope that isn't going to be the case here, but already there are plenty of people (and not just here) that are questioning the financial need aspect of this case.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Are these facts or just your opinion?

Most missing persons don't have a biz board to take over and ask for the donations for them as happened in this case.

Most Missing persons don't have a large number of internet people to get the word spread as fast as in this case.

So yes this is not the average missing person case. [/*]

This is a statement of facts about the majority of missing persons cases, do the research. And my opinions are based on those facts.
No this is not the average missing person case, this one is one of a young man who has seemingly gone up in smoke with no trace. And the facts are even LE does not know if he walked willingly or met with foul play. Wife says foul play, LE doesn't know that for sure but, they have labeled it as suspicious. Why would they say that unless they have suspicions about other scenarios they are not making the public privy to and are investigating along that venue. I've also seen many cases where LE has labled the case suspicious and it turns out they had a very good reason to investigate as such. Only much later does the public and/or the perp were surprised to find the direction they have followed.
As far as I know they may be following the internet trail. They do investigate the internet connections when there are any. They do follow message boards to see what is being said and to find any clues that may be there. Yes this is an internet age and to think the LE is not aware and checking into these avenues is naive.
LE is not stupid. And they follow any and all possible ways to help them with their cases. But, they don't necessarily let public or even those close to the case (family members) know that is what they are doing.
MOO

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I would love to compile a list of all the unusual things I find about this case.....most of it relates to Christine.

1. why didn't she attend the vigil?
2. did she really feel her baby move at 6 weeks pregnant?
3. why did she sit with her children and cry that they wouldn't
have a daddy? that was rough....
4. why were donations received so soon?
5. why have none of the donations gone to the reward or a PI?
6. why did she say the statement about Nicholas being in or
near water?


Anyone care to add some questions? [/*]

1. The vigil one was just answered the last few pages plus at least three separate times in other threads if you look back.

2. No one
knows but with the stress she is undergoing, I personally would say it was just stress.

3 She seems to be a very nervous excitable person. She reminds me of one of my family members. That is one of the reasons I try and support her.

4 Because a very good hearted Christian lady from the biz site took took it upon herself to ask and start the donations.

5 We don't know if any of the money has gone to the reward fund, it could be in the classified "other" .

6. Most likely in my opinion, she read about the water theories on the crime boards over and over. Then she went to sleep with it on her mind and dreamed about it. I find I sometimes have dreams about something that I am upset about. I don't find it as unusual.

Okay, guys I am putting on my suit of armour, let me have it. :D

[Pam]

Originally posted by Envision


"Without his income she will be forced to declare bankruptcy"...To me that insinuates it's his paycheck she is grieving for, not him. [/*]

:beer:

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Envision


"Without his income she will be forced to declare bankruptcy"...To me that insinuates it's his paycheck she is grieving for, not him. [/*]

Yes, it sure does seem to be that is what is so important to her, at least from what she is saying to the public.

[need2no]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I would love to compile a list of all the unusual things I find about this case.....most of it relates to Christine.

1. why didn't she attend the vigil?
2. did she really feel her baby move at 6 weeks pregnant?
3. why did she sit with her children and cry that they wouldn't
have a daddy? that was rough....
4. why were donations received so soon?
5. why have none of the donations gone to the reward or a PI?
6. why did she say the statement about Nicholas being in or
near water?


Anyone care to add some questions? [/*]

for starters:

7. why did she say online how well her business was prospering, but now she says she was only breaking even?
8. why didn't she bring up the need for special ORGANIC sugar needed for things other than cookies in the very beginning?
9. she mentioned a mid wife checking her out...has she seen an OB/GYN in regard to her pregnancy?
10. why did she speak of her wonderful husband and their wonderful marriage, but in the last interview she says her marriage wasn't perfect; so if the marriage wasn't perfect why does she keep saying he would not have walked?
11. why doesn't she replace her pic on the family blog and her Myspace with a pic of Nicholas?
12. why did she make the statement Nicholas is not a coward? odd thing to say in this situation IMO
13. why did she believe it was foul play from day one?
14. why did she change the story about Paypal from "my sweet husband was shielding me from some of our debt" to "he just didn't have as much money in the account as I expected"?
15. why did she bring up that Nicholas' phone doesn't have a GPS on it...odd
16. why did she say she doesn't have anyone to help her, yet had previously told the media NF was so loved and that's why so many are looking for him
17. why is she playing online games and chatting? (as CatToy told us about)
18. why would she claim to have made the April mortgage payment in March?
19. why did she say they were just average like everybody else with regard to their debts, and now she is in dire straights?
20. where are her parents, why hasn't she mentioned their support at this horrific time?

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by need2no



Hmmm...not willing to bring anything new to the table yet you criticise us for not coming up with 'fresh' ideas to solve this case.
If those other boards you are reading are doing a much better job of figuring this case out, why stay here? Are you the self appointed Christine board police? [/*]

Please hit me gently, I don't have a lot of experience yet.
I am just trying to learn to do things correctly.

I am not sure if I am allowed to bring over other message board posts. I don't want to get in trouble before I learn the rules.

[Pam]

Originally posted by need2no


for starters:

7. why did she say online how well her business was prospering, but now she says she was only breaking even?
8. why didn't she bring up the need for special ORGANIC sugar needed for things other than cookies in the very beginning?
9. she mentioned a mid wife checking her out...has she seen an OB/GYN in regard to her pregnancy?
10. why did she speak of her wonderful husband and their wonderful marriage, but in the last interview she says her marriage wasn't perfect; so if the marriage wasn't perfect why does she keep saying he would not have walked?
11. why doesn't she replace her pic on the family blog and her Myspace with a pic of Nicholas?
12. why did she make the statement Nicholas is not a coward? odd thing to say in this situation IMO
13. why did she believe it was foul play from day one?
14. why did she change the story about Paypal from "my sweet husband was shielding me from some of our debt" to "he just didn't have as much money in the account as I expected"?
15. why did she bring up that Nicholas' phone doesn't have a GPS on it...odd
16. why did she say she doesn't have anyone to help her, yet had previously told the media NF was so loved and that's why so many are looking for him
17. why is she playing online games and chatting? (as CatToy told us about)
18. why would she claim to have made the April mortgage payment in March?
19. why did she say they were just average like everybody else with regard to their debts, and now she is in dire straights?
20. where are her parents, why hasn't she mentioned their support at this horrific time? [/*]

Just more questions that make us scratch our heads and go "hmmmm?":shrug:

[SeattleEddie]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I would love to compile a list of all the unusual things I find about this case.....most of it relates to Christine.

1. why didn't she attend the vigil?
2. did she really feel her baby move at 6 weeks pregnant?
3. why did she sit with her children and cry that they wouldn't
have a daddy? that was rough....
4. why were donations received so soon?
5. why have none of the donations gone to the reward or a PI?
6. why did she say the statement about Nicholas being in or
near water?


Anyone care to add some questions? [/*]

I haven't caught up yet on all the responses, but I would add:

1. where are his parents, sisters?
2. where is her family?

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by Envision


"Without his income she will be forced to declare bankruptcy"...To me that insinuates it's his paycheck she is grieving for, not him. [/*]

That's how i feel too.
Her behavior is really disturbing to me.
Didn't she love Nicholas?
Where is all the love now???
I don't get it at all.
I don't get her.
And i really don't understand where all their family is????

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


5 We don't know if any of the money has gone to the reward fund, it could be in the classified "other" .

[snip][/*]

Christine has stated herself that the donated money has gone to pay for bills and living expenses.

I am 100% sure that if even one dime of it had gone to the reward fund, she would have stated so in her "Get the Facts" post, because so many of us have questioned that.

I don't know what her motivation is to be so financially-focused. Perhaps as I suggested some time ago, her parents' divorce was very hard on her family financially and made a big imprint in her psyche and her relationship with money in general, and that is impacting her now. Regardless of her reason, it has been pretty obvious that her financial issues have been a primary concern from nearly the beginning of this case. It could just be a quirk of her upbringing, her age, her personality, or even her religion. But it is a red flag for plenty.

[isitme]

And wasn't there a comment she made along the lines - of there isn't anything left of him to find? I thought it was in her last interview.

Anyway I found it odd when she said it but I am not very good doing the research. So perhaps someone else remembers it and can quote it.

[Pam]

Originally posted by Beth
I am going to bed, however, I look forward to hearing about all the fresh ideas that we haven't thought of and will look forward to being enlightened in the morning.

Good night, everybody! [/*]

G'nite, Beth. Hopefully we'll both wake up to some "fresh" ideas in the morning :D

[Pam]

Originally posted by isitme
And wasn't there a comment she made along the lines - of there isn't anything left of him to find? I thought it was in her last interview.

Anyway I found it odd when she said it but I am not very good doing the research. So perhaps someone else remembers it and can quote it. [/*]

Yeah, that remark gave me the chills for some odd reason!

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth
The percentages also say that online internet donation scams are at an all time high.

More and more, in times of crisis, people use the Internet to contribute money quickly to aid others that provide relief to victims worldwide. Unfortunately, while the Internet has made it easier to make a donation, the Web has also led to an increase in online donation scams. In our effort to lend aid quickly, many of us set aside our cynicism and become more susceptible to false online solicitations. Donation fraud not only cons givers out of their money, it also takes its toll on legitimate groups, which denies them funds for relief efforts and cheats real disaster victims. [/*]

:patriot: >high five<

[isitme]

Originally posted by Envision


"No trace of Nicholas left." [/*]

Thst's it. TY Envision.

For the life of me I don't understand why she would say that.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Pam


:beer:

Agree!!! If those of you want to just praise CF and support CF...a crime board is not the place to do it. If the tables were turned and CF was the one missing and NF was the one giving us the tidbits of info, we'd be discussing him, and his actions/words/or lack of. [/*]

Amen Pam!!!!

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by soyesterday


Well ok then, by all means, since the "percentage" is in favor for the women, then she should not even be suspected of wrongdoing.
I don't think so.
She knows something.
She has been up to something.
Or should i say "you" are up to something?
If you're Christine, you should really just come out and say it. [/*]

How many people on this board have already been accused of being Christine ?

Is that a standard thing to do when you don't have a better response to a post ?

Is it just something to do to try and start an argument/try to get a person angry?
I don't meant this to be offensive. I just don't know the answer.

[need2no]

Originally posted by isitme
And wasn't there a comment she made along the lines - of there isn't anything left of him to find? I thought it was in her last interview.

Anyway I found it odd when she said it but I am not very good doing the research. So perhaps someone else remembers it and can quote it. [/*]


"He is gone. That's all I know. He just vanished. There is something wrong, I just don't know what it is," she said. "There is no trace of him left."

[Shimz]

... but if he did walk out... IF he walked, why be so dramatic about it? why no contact with anyone (as far as we know), why leave your car? Why walk away from your job? Leave your kids?That is a bit strange... If he is alive and well somewhere, he has probably been on the internet, and he would see all of these things, why not come forward?

Also, I find calling LE so soon somewhat puzzling. Three hours is not a very long time. I am a worrier, but I think i would wait longer than that to call LE. I think i would be calling everyone I knew and waiting for a call for at least that long.

I know my concerns don't really link with eachother, but that is what is so frustrating about this!

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Please hit me gently, I don't have a lot of experience yet.
I am just trying to learn to do things correctly.

I am not sure if I am allowed to bring over other message board posts. I don't want to get in trouble before I learn the rules. [/*]

You could send us a link to the board where you are seeing all these fresh new ideas. I know that links are allowed. Would you be willing to do that?

The only other board I sometimes look at is Web Sleuths. They haven't had anything fresh there in awhile -- most of today's discussion has been on whether or not Christine could or should get a job. Oh, and whether it meant anything that Nicholas's mom referred to Christine as "the wife". And the usual "stop bashing Christine!" admonitions. Yawn.

[Shimz]

just to avoid further argument... I think Pernecia is nellie's daughter

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Are these facts or just your opinion?

Most missing persons don't have a biz board to take over and ask for the donations for them as happened in this case.

Most Missing persons don't have a large number of internet people to get the word spread as fast as in this case.

So yes this is not the average missing person case. [/*]

A PS to my previous post to you...
And what makes you mention the biz board? Most of don't consider this a factor except for the money pleas. For the concern of NF it makes no difference. It's just another piece of the puzzle with CF.
The majority of people here are only concerned with NF and how we can possibly help. The 'biz board' inquiries are only pieces of an unknown puzzle we are all trying to fill to find NF. And if I'm repeating myself, forgive, but in this day and age the internet plays a HUGE part in getting the word of any person missing out there as soon as possible.
MOO

[need2no]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Please hit me gently, I don't have a lot of experience yet.
I am just trying to learn to do things correctly.

I am not sure if I am allowed to bring over other message board posts. I don't want to get in trouble before I learn the rules. [/*]

You don't have to cut and paste, just toss out the theory, if it's something we haven't already beat around we might pick up with the ideas and run with them.

[Pam]

Originally posted by Shimz
... but if he did walk out... IF he walked, why be so dramatic about it? why no contact with anyone (as far as we know), why leave your car? Why walk away from your job? Leave your kids?That is a bit strange... If he is alive and well somewhere, he has probably been on the internet, and he would see all of these things, why not come forward?

Also, I find calling LE so soon somewhat puzzling. Three hours is not a very long time. I am a worrier, but I think i would wait longer than that to call LE. I think i would be calling everyone I knew and waiting for a call for at least that long.

I know my concerns don't really link with eachother, but that is what is so frustrating about this! [/*]

I remember when I was a lot younger, my aunt was very upset with her best friend....I couldn't figure out why. She finally told me that her friend had walk away from her husband and kids. A life that seemed to be very happy and stable. Said she was going grocery shopping and just never came home.

This was years ago, before computers and the internet.

Anyway, this woman was gone for a year or two and then just showed up one day thinking that everything could be as it was before she left....no explanation of where she was or why. My aunt had a very hard time forgiving her for what she put her husband and kids through.

My husband's dad did pretty much the same thing when he was a boy. DH's dad said he was going to the corner store, asked DH's mom if she needed anything and nobody saw him or heard from him for 3 years.

I guess what I'm saying is, it does happen and sometimes there is no warning and no obvious reason.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by need2no



"He is gone. That's all I know. He just vanished. There is something wrong, I just don't know what it is," she said. "There is no trace of him left." [/*]

An email acquaintance some years ago emailed me to say that his wife had disappeared "without a trace." He was arrested less than a week later for her murder. It was at least another month before he finally led police to her body. There's much more to this story that I won't share here, but when I hear "no trace of him left" I can't help but think of that.

I certainly hope she is being emotional and dramatic, and doesn't know for a fact that there is no trace of him left.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


Soyesterday, they can't go to another crime board where CF isn't suspect because there isn't one. It is quite reasonable to question the spouse in a case such a this....and CF has definitely given us more than a few things to question! [/*]

Absolutely sherry!!!!!

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by soyesterday
Oh great....
i see we're having a problem again here tonight.
FTR.....
i think Christine is lying about alot of stuff.
And i don't trust her.
And i think that those of us who feel strongly about that should be able to discuss why we feel that way.
And i think we should be able to talk about our own theories even if they include her.
I really don't understand why those of you that get so upset at us for talking about Christine even stay around here.
If it upsets you so much, why not go to a crime board where noone suspects her or questions her behavior.
Noone is making you stay here. [/*]

ITA soy!!!

[Pam]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


An email acquaintance some years ago emailed me to say that his wife had disappeared "without a trace." He was arrested less than a week later for her murder. It was at least another month before he finally led police to her body. There's much more to this story that I won't share here, but when I hear "no trace of him left" I can't help but think of that.

I certainly hope she is being emotional and dramatic, and doesn't know for a fact that there is no trace of him left. [/*]

Maybe that's why that remark gave me the chills. It just sounds so final :(

[Shimz]

Originally posted by Pam


I remember when I was a lot younger, my aunt was very upset with her best friend....I couldn't figure out why. She finally told me that her friend had walk away from her husband and kids. A life that seemed to be very happy and stable. Said she was going grocery shopping and just never came home.

This was years ago, before computers and the internet.

Anyway, this woman was gone for a year or two and then just showed up one day thinking that everything could be as it was before she left....no explanation of where she was or why. My aunt had a very hard time forgiving her for what she put her husband and kids through.

My husband's dad did pretty much the same thing when he was a boy. DH's dad said he was going to the corner store, asked DH's mom if she needed anything and nobody saw him or heard from him for 3 years.

I guess what I'm saying is, it does happen and sometimes there is no warning and no obvious reason. [/*]

you are right, I guess it is just that it is such a hard thing to comprehend why someone would just abandon their lives and children with no explanation although it happens all the time..

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote


IMO, new scenery and conversations with others may be the needed prescription. Is it more strenuous riding in a car or reading blogs? TIA [/*]

Depends on the motive behind it, I feel Cury.
JMO

[need2no]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


An email acquaintance some years ago emailed me to say that his wife had disappeared "without a trace." He was arrested less than a week later for her murder. It was at least another month before he finally led police to her body. There's much more to this story that I won't share here, but when I hear "no trace of him left" I can't help but think of that.

I certainly hope she is being emotional and dramatic, and doesn't know for a fact that there is no trace of him left. [/*]


:eek:

Me too! I've read true crime cases where things just slipped out.....

[Shimz]

i guess part of me wonders why someone would call LE in so quickly, unless they already knew that person wasn't coming home... i am not saying she "did him in" or anything, just that perhaps there is a chance she knows what may have happened... JMOO

[Pam]

Originally posted by Shimz


you are right, I guess it is just that it is such a hard thing to comprehend why someone would just abandon their lives and children with no explanation although it happens all the time.. [/*]

I don't understand it myself! DH says he remembers the night his dad walked out to go to the store....guess he was still awake and could hear his parents talking. No arguing, just a regular conversation. He said all he knew after that was his dad was gone and it was about 3 years later before they heard from him.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Oh gosh made me bite my tongue :D No I guess it is not a good idea to bring up anything new. In my opinion it would only be met with scarcasm and denial. ;) I will just keep browsing and :read: [/*]

I myself have not seen anything new brought up by you, if I'm mistaken, please let me know the posts where you have.

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


You could send us a link to the board where you are seeing all these fresh new ideas. I know that links are allowed. Would you be willing to do that?

The only other board I sometimes look at is Web Sleuths. They haven't had anything fresh there in awhile -- most of today's discussion has been on whether or not Christine could or should get a job. Oh, and whether it meant anything that Nicholas's mom referred to Christine as "the wife". And the usual "stop bashing Christine!" admonitions. Yawn. [/*]

Sorry, but I am not registered on websleuth's and I do not want to send a lot of disruption to my other board. As I said I am new and do not want to cause trouble there and the posting is a lot different. I am not trying to be rude actually the opposite.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by need2no



:eek:

Me too! I've read true crime cases where things just slipped out..... [/*]

I think that's why everything someone like Christine says is going to be suspect. It may mean nothing, it may just be stress or whatever. Or, it could be something big and significant.

I know I would not enjoy being someone whose every word was scrutinized. But I would understand why.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Shimz
just to avoid further argument... I think Pernecia is nellie's daughter [/*]

Just to clear this up! PERNECIA JANE IS NOT MY DAUGHTER!

It was kinda a joke earlier. My daughter and I have discussed this case and she does know "mom" follows these cases on crime boards, but she has no interest and no time to get on here. LOL! FTR, she thinks this story is "hinky" too....from the things I've told her

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by Shimz
just to avoid further argument... I think Pernecia is nellie's daughter [/*]

I am not Nellie's daughter.

[Pam]

I'm going to say "G'night"...need to get up early and make up for what I didn't get done today, lol.

Keeping NF in my thoughts, that he's alive, well and safe!

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I would love to compile a list of all the unusual things I find about this case.....most of it relates to Christine.

1. why didn't she attend the vigil?
2. did she really feel her baby move at 6 weeks pregnant?
3. why did she sit with her children and cry that they wouldn't
have a daddy? that was rough....
4. why were donations received so soon?
5. why have none of the donations gone to the reward or a PI?
6. why did she say the statement about Nicholas being in or
near water?


Anyone care to add some questions? [/*]

Questions I've had also sherry. I'll think on anymore, but usually when I do, someone else posts the ones I think of.
;)

[Shimz]

Originally posted by Pam


I don't understand it myself! DH says he remembers the night his dad walked out to go to the store....guess he was still awake and could hear his parents talking. No arguing, just a regular conversation. He said all he knew after that was his dad was gone and it was about 3 years later before they heard from him. [/*]

I guess some people can't handle the stress, but I think sometimes people feel they are carrying the weight of the world on their shoulders and they feel they cannot ask for help, or tell anyone about it (especially men, who some times have a "I don't need help" attitude more than women) and then it is just too late... they break...

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Sorry, but I am not registered on websleuth's and I do not want to send a lot of disruption to my other board. As I said I am new and do not want to cause trouble there and the posting is a lot different. I am not trying to be rude actually the opposite. [/*]

Ok, well I'm not trying to be rude here either, but I am having trouble understanding why you are on this board, if there are other boards with much fresher ideas available to discuss? You haven't shared any of those ideas here, or any really that I've seen that haven't already been discussed.

Did you just come here to say that there are better ideas somewhere else? Why not just hang out over there then? Really I am just trying to understand what your motivation is?

[Cury-us Coyote]

Do we know the source of the current reward for Nicholas? IIRC, Nicholas's firm hired a PI, do we know why? Are we safe to assume if paid by Publis, he/she reports findings to the paying client? Is the PI from a local firm? Does the PI have LE experience and working with LE's support and input? Is the PI's primary focus finding Nicholas or protecting the company's interest? TIA

[Shimz]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


I am not Nellie's daughter. [/*]

I am sorry, i guess i got that impression from the posts on page 7

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Cury-us Coyote
Do we know the source of the current reward for Nicholas? IIRC, Nicholas's firm hired a PI, do we know why? Are we safe to assume if paid by Publis, he/she reports findings to the paying client? Is the PI from a local firm? Does the PI have LE experience and working with LE's support and input? Is the PI's primary focus finding Nicholas or protecting the company's interest? TIA [/*]

I think that Christine said the reward money came from family & friends, IIRC. It might be in her "Get the Facts" which was removed from her website but may have been posted somewhere here.

As far as the PI stuff, it was reported on one advertising industry blog that Publicis had hired a PI. It was implied that the PI was hired to help find Nick. I think that only Publicis or the PI would be able to answer the rest of those questions.

[Shimz]

Originally posted by Nellie


Just to clear this up! PERNECIA JANE IS NOT MY DAUGHTER!

It was kinda a joke earlier. My daughter and I have discussed this case and she does know "mom" follows these cases on crime boards, but she has no interest and no time to get on here. LOL! FTR, she thinks this story is "hinky" too....from the things I've told her [/*]

again.. i am sorry lol :D

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Riding in a car is worse for at risk pregnancy. [/*]

Sorry, I have to disagree. I had a high risk pregnancy and when I had to travel 8 hrs in a car I discussed with my doctor, he advised me exactly what to do. Stop every hour and rest out of the car for at least 30 mins. He told me as long as I followed his instructions since I would be sitting in the car I would be fine. I did as he instructed, altho, I didn't want to do the stop every hour etc. and all was fine.
Has CF even seen an OB to advise her on how to handle her situation?

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by Nellie


Just to clear this up! PERNECIA JANE IS NOT MY DAUGHTER!

It was kinda a joke earlier. My daughter and I have discussed this case and she does know "mom" follows these cases on crime boards, but she has no interest and no time to get on here. LOL! FTR, she thinks this story is "hinky" too....from the things I've told her [/*]

LOL we both posted at the same time. 12:56

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by soyesterday
Oh great....
i see we're having a problem again here tonight.
FTR.....
i think Christine is lying about alot of stuff.
And i don't trust her.
And i think that those of us who feel strongly about that should be able to discuss why we feel that way.
And i think we should be able to talk about our own theories even if they include her.
I really don't understand why those of you that get so upset at us for talking about Christine even stay around here.
If it upsets you so much, why not go to a crime board where noone suspects her or questions her behavior.
Noone is making you stay here. [/*]

:beer: Bravo.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Shimz
i guess part of me wonders why someone would call LE in so quickly, unless they already knew that person wasn't coming home... i am not saying she "did him in" or anything, just that perhaps there is a chance she knows what may have happened... JMOO [/*]

I realize we are all different and as such react different. But I've been married pushing 20 years. I always joke you could set the clock by my DH, leaves for work at the same time or a bit early every day, arrives home at almost the exact time every day, never late for an appointment,etc., just the exact opposite of me-lol
I can only recall twice he had been late (without calling), not 3 hours mind you, but still if 3 hours passed I would attempt to reach him by his cell and if unsuccessful I would call work, then co-workers, and his parents and then when all else failed I would hop in my SUV and go looking for him along the route he takes. There is no way I would call LE after 3 hours unless I had explored all possibilites, I am absolutely certain of that.

Which brings me back to the cell phone...too coincidental for it to be turned off or dead the very day he goes missing. And odd that Christine would remark he doesn't have GPS on his phone.

[PerneciaJane]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


Ok, well I'm not trying to be rude here either, but I am having trouble understanding why you are on this board, if there are other boards with much fresher ideas available to discuss? You haven't shared any of those ideas here, or any really that I've seen that haven't already been discussed.

Did you just come here to say that there are better ideas somewhere else? Why not just hang out over there then? Really I am just trying to understand what your motivation is? [/*]

No, I have read all the threads here. I have only posted one idea and that is why I think NF MIGHT have just walked away, if he did in fact walk away. After I posted about fresh ideas I saw about 15 posts making fun of me, Thank You, so I will keep my ideas to myself, it is obvious new people are considered incompetent to post with some. Thank you for the pleasure of sharing ideas and opinions.

I do not think CF did anything to NF.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


The percentage says a lot more men kill women than the reverse. [/*]

Percentage or not, there are wives who kill there husbands. Look at the news. It is unusual, but there are many women in prison right now that have killed there husbands. And when they do, they tend to be overlooked at first, but the truth comes out and everyone is outraged.
It's naive or stupid for women to think they won't be looked at and maybe proven that they are the ones who did the deed.
Women just seem to be more clever at the coverup than men do.
Men and women are wired differently and the women seem to be the ones who are better at details in covering up the crime. But, the truth comes out eventually.
JMO

[need2no]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


I think that Christine said the reward money came from family & friends, IIRC. It might be in her "Get the Facts" which was removed from her website but may have been posted somewhere here.

As far as the PI stuff, it was reported on one advertising industry blog that Publicis had hired a PI. It was implied that the PI was hired to help find Nick. I think that only Publicis or the PI would be able to answer the rest of those questions. [/*]

From media reports:

A $2,500 reward has been offered for information about the disappearance of a young SeaTac husband and father


A reward offered by friends and co-workers for information on his whereabouts has been doubled to $5,000, Christine Francisco said.

A reward for information about the whereabouts of a missing SeaTac man has been increased from $5,000 to $15,000 according to a family friend.

Wish we had some details about the PI. One thing for sure, their hourly rate is very expensive so I highly doubt they are going outside of the Seattle area.

[Shimz]

Originally posted by need2no


I realize we are all different and as such react different. But I've been married pushing 20 years. I always joke you could set the clock by my DH, leaves for work at the same time or a bit early every day, arrives home at almost the exact time every day, never late for an appointment,etc., just the exact opposite of me-lol
I can only recall twice he had been late (without calling), not 3 hours mind you, but still if 3 hours passed I would attempt to reach him by his cell and if unsuccessful I would call work, then co-workers, and his parents and then when all else failed I would hop in my SUV and go looking for him along the route he takes. There is no way I would call LE after 3 hours unless I had explored all possibilites, I am absolutely certain of that.

Which brings me back to the cell phone...too coincidental for it to be turned off or dead the very day he goes missing. And odd that Christine would remark he doesn't have GPS on his phone. [/*]

yes exactly, at least some time would have to pass before you start to really worry, then the calls would start... I can see worrying that person was in a car accident, I worry about that all the time when I do not hear from someone when I should, and I know they are driving... and she could have in her head seen him stranded in a ditch or trapped in the car and not being able to call anyone (i worry about things like that), and panic could set in... But still, 6-7 is still rush hour time i would think someone would SEE that happen... See... I keep flip-flopping back and forth I don't know what to think!

[Shimz]

oh and the only reason i could see her calling LE instead of doing it herself, is that she would have to drag the kids out too...

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


Yes, that website is all about Christine, and it does seem that Nicholas is, at the most, simply an afterthought there. I understand them wanting to have a place where Christine can feel unconditionally supported during this challenging time. At the same time, I don't understand why people who simply want to "support" Christine and don't want to hear any speculation or theories about her involvement -- what she knows and doesn't know, what reasons at home Nicholas may have had for leaving, what Christine's contradictory statements might mean etc -- why those people would come to this board, which is a crime board that quite naturally is going to be looking at those things.

A little O/T but related. My cousin's 18-year-old son committed suicide 6 months ago. His buddies still post to him on his myspace page sometimes. It is eery and yet touching too.

I wonder if a "supportingnicholasfrancisco.com" website should be started, and people could simply leave positive, uplifting, caring words and prayers for Nicholas there. Hmm. Stay tuned. [/*]

Great idea TTT!!! I would go there if it were started. :rose:

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by need2no


From media reports:

A $2,500 reward has been offered for information about the disappearance of a young SeaTac husband and father


A reward offered by friends and co-workers for information on his whereabouts has been doubled to $5,000, Christine Francisco said.

A reward for information about the whereabouts of a missing SeaTac man has been increased from $5,000 to $15,000 according to a family friend.

Wish we had some details about the PI. One thing for sure, their hourly rate is very expensive so I highly doubt they are going outside of the Seattle area. [/*]

I never saw anything in news reports about the PI, just that ad blog post.

Thanks for the reward details. Still wondering where the family is in all this...

[need2no]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


No, I have read all the threads here. I have only posted one idea and that is why I think NF MIGHT have just walked away, if he did in fact walk away. After I posted about fresh ideas I saw about 15 posts making fun of me, Thank You, so I will keep my ideas to myself, it is obvious new people are considered incompetent to post with some. Thank you for the pleasure of sharing ideas and opinions.

I do not think CF did anything to NF. [/*]

PJ, everyone and their opinion is welcome here on this public board, and it seems to me many here are new, not just you. The difference is they are not trying to moderate the board by trying to control what people can talk about. The same whining post after post about all you are doing is focusing on Christine gets old. It is quite obvious and logical to focus on the wife of the missing man, and especially in view of some of CF's questionable behavior, the lack of updates from LE, and just the general lack of ANY evidence one way or the other.

I am more than happy to debate my opinion, but I will not continually defend my right to express my opinion, or the reason why I see Christine as being a part of the equation in all this-like or not she is.

If I found a board with fresh new ideas to explore I would probably go post there myself...but I've checked all of them and haven't seen anything that hasn't been posted here already. What I do see is some on WS walking on egg shells after CF complimented them for being kinder to her than we are on this board..at least in her opinion.

Don't get upset with us if we ask you to put your money where your mouth is...you are the one who said other boards had 'fresh' ideas, so we simply asked what they were.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


I am not Nellie's daughter. [/*]

Gosh, now I'm curious too. Are you Hubbard's daughter?

[Shimz]

http://subparspokane.wordpress.com/2008/03/07/nicholas-francisco-update-2/

This guy has CF's fact list up...

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


1. The vigil one was just answered the last few pages plus at least three separate times in other threads if you look back.

2. No one
knows but with the stress she is undergoing, I personally would say it was just stress.

3 She seems to be a very nervous excitable person. She reminds me of one of my family members. That is one of the reasons I try and support her.

4 Because a very good hearted Christian lady from the biz site took took it upon herself to ask and start the donations.

5 We don't know if any of the money has gone to the reward fund, it could be in the classified "other" .

6. Most likely in my opinion, she read about the water theories on the crime boards over and over. Then she went to sleep with it on her mind and dreamed about it. I find I sometimes have dreams about something that I am upset about. I don't find it as unusual.

Okay, guys I am putting on my suit of armour, let me have it. :D [/*]

#4-Yes a very good Christian lady has admitted to that, I got a pm from her that confirmed it.
#5-CF said herself that she has used the donations to pay her bills, she is a month ahead on her mortgage payments.
#6-CF herself was the first to mention the water theory, which then of course became fodder for the message boards. In fact, iirc she is the one who said she dreamed about NF being in water.
What's your point?

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by need2no


for starters:

7. why did she say online how well her business was prospering, but now she says she was only breaking even?
8. why didn't she bring up the need for special ORGANIC sugar needed for things other than cookies in the very beginning?
9. she mentioned a mid wife checking her out...has she seen an OB/GYN in regard to her pregnancy?
10. why did she speak of her wonderful husband and their wonderful marriage, but in the last interview she says her marriage wasn't perfect; so if the marriage wasn't perfect why does she keep saying he would not have walked?
11. why doesn't she replace her pic on the family blog and her Myspace with a pic of Nicholas?
12. why did she make the statement Nicholas is not a coward? odd thing to say in this situation IMO
13. why did she believe it was foul play from day one?
14. why did she change the story about Paypal from "my sweet husband was shielding me from some of our debt" to "he just didn't have as much money in the account as I expected"?
15. why did she bring up that Nicholas' phone doesn't have a GPS on it...odd
16. why did she say she doesn't have anyone to help her, yet had previously told the media NF was so loved and that's why so many are looking for him
17. why is she playing online games and chatting? (as CatToy told us about)
18. why would she claim to have made the April mortgage payment in March?
19. why did she say they were just average like everybody else with regard to their debts, and now she is in dire straights?
20. where are her parents, why hasn't she mentioned their support at this horrific time? [/*]

Great questions need2no, I would love to know the answers to them from CF herself.
:beer:

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Pam


:beer: [/*]

:beer:

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Beth
I am going to bed, however, I look forward to hearing about all the fresh ideas that we haven't thought of and will look forward to being enlightened in the morning.

Good night, everybody! [/*]

Good night Beth, sleep well, see you tomorrow.
:seeya:

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Shimz
... but if he did walk out... IF he walked, why be so dramatic about it? why no contact with anyone (as far as we know), why leave your car? Why walk away from your job? Leave your kids?That is a bit strange... If he is alive and well somewhere, he has probably been on the internet, and he would see all of these things, why not come forward?

Also, I find calling LE so soon somewhat puzzling. Three hours is not a very long time. I am a worrier, but I think i would wait longer than that to call LE. I think i would be calling everyone I knew and waiting for a call for at least that long.

I know my concerns don't really link with eachother, but that is what is so frustrating about this! [/*]

I posted before on the speed that she called LE. I too am a worrier, but I also posted about an experience I had with my ex when he didn't come home one night. I called all I thought would know anything that night and then just waited. Up all night, sick and worried, but it turned out he was safe and sound. I also said how unglued he woud have been if I had called the police. He would have been totally embarassed. It turned out he'd been out drinking with friends and the next mid morning I heard from him from work. He was so sorry for the worry he caused, I got flowers that evening when he came home. But, if I had called police he may not have been so sorry and maybe I wouldn't have heard from him for awhile.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Pam
I'm going to say "G'night"...need to get up early and make up for what I didn't get done today, lol.

Keeping NF in my thoughts, that he's alive, well and safe! [/*]

G'night Pam. And with me too, everynight I pray that he is alive and well and will be found soon.
:rose:

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Nellie


Just to clear this up! PERNECIA JANE IS NOT MY DAUGHTER!

It was kinda a joke earlier. My daughter and I have discussed this case and she does know "mom" follows these cases on crime boards, but she has no interest and no time to get on here. LOL! FTR, she thinks this story is "hinky" too....from the things I've told her [/*]

Thanks Nellie for clearing this up, I didn't think it was your daughter, but it's great that you verified.
;)

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by PerneciaJane


Sorry, but I am not registered on websleuth's and I do not want to send a lot of disruption to my other board. As I said I am new and do not want to cause trouble there and the posting is a lot different. I am not trying to be rude actually the opposite. [/*]

You don't need to post what your other board is, just post what they are saying that is alot different. That wouldn't cause any trouble at all with your other board and may help us in our quest for finding NF. Which is our main goal here.

[Oregongal]

Originally posted by Shimz
oh and the only reason i could see her calling LE instead of doing it herself, is that she would have to drag the kids out too... [/*]

If the kids were up anyway waiting to do those cookies, I myself would have piled them into their carseats and done some recon.
Sorry, I'm an ex military wife and I mean reconissance. IE: going out to check out his route, the places he was supposed to stop at and this would have been done after I had called his work, his friends, his family. I even once did wake up my live- in -with me daughter and we put her 3 yr old son, my grandson in the car and went and searched. So I have a hard time with the 'would have to drag the kids out too...' thing. If I hadn't found him, which I did, then maybe after I had taken my daughter and grandson home and back to bed and still had not found him, heard from him, that is when I may have called LE.
JMO

[Oregongal]

Ok, I'm done for tonight, waaayyyy past my bedtime.
Good night to all, see you all tomorrow.
As it has been for many nights...
Nicholas is in my prayers.
:rose: