Sunday .. 03-16-08 .. a.m. [Archive] - In Session Message Boards

henry

03-16-2008, 06:23 AM

good morning . . . again, nothing new to open with . . . except it's the 66th day that cesar is out there. (i was going to pm gentlebreeze cause her count is a day less than mine . . . glad i didn't - she's got way more important matters to handle & our prayers are with her & family) and i think the pneumonia count is now up to 4 as of last nite?

yes, i have read all of yesterday and was here, but couldn't post . . . that autopsy has thrown me off emotionally . . . so, not in the creative mood! hah! my family knows i pass out at the sight of blood (or hang my head down or out the window) and have a high squeemish level.

and, thank you for answering my question re: onslow county jury conviction & stiff sentencing . . . if it's tough for us to wait for answers, just imagine the family! that's what gives me patience and coming here everyday.

edit: AB has posted a new theory . . . pls. check it out
http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?threadid=324292

henry

03-16-2008, 06:46 AM

i was over at the jd website and found a recent comments post by captain rsutherland dated 3-16 12:13 a.m.. . .

This is not a reference to the Maria investigation, but an explanation as to burden of proof in general. Our Office, and law enforcement nationwide, has a duty to proceed ethically and with integrity when we conduct criminal investigations.
http://www.jdnews.com/news/baby_55479___article.html/autopsy_clothing.html

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 08:51 AM

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 08:56 AM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

From your link:

IOW, they can't put Christina in or at the house when they believe the murder occurred. I hope they're not hanging their hats on the murder occurring between 5:30 and 7:00 p.m.

:shrug: [/*]

I thought his answer was powerful Cryme. WOW...I would be a bit off my game if I was reading there and wearing the name CSL.

JMOOC. :o

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

I thought his answer was powerful Cryme. WOW...I would be a bit off my game if I was reading there and wearing the name CSL.

JMOOC. :o [/*]

That's true! Of course when I read it, I was only on my first cup of coffee.

;)

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 09:57 AM

Good morning all, missed a lot of the discussion last night as I went out to dinner with my son.

Prayers for GB's daughter here, and who is it that has pneumonia?.......:rose:

If I missed any special wishes to people going through hardships, I'm sorry.....you really get confused even missing several hours of posts.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 10:08 AM

I have admitted I was wrong in my initial reaction to Mary with reference to what she actually spoke out about Maria Sami. She was trying to be honest about what SHE THOUGHT and she was castigated even by Nancy Grace IMO.

However, noteworthy is the idea that when Mary and Peter point to flaws and rewrite history, they are relying on 0-19 months of age and the influences of that time period. They had a lifetime with Maria compared to those 19 months and schluffing off any behavior disorder to that time frame gives the appearance of self-serving IMO.

THIS IS A VIDEO of Mary speaking it...

"We suspect that she probably is BIPOLAR and she's had a lot of struggles through the years. She's been a real loner, hasn't had a lot of friends, but one thing is she's very attached to home and would call several times a day." spoken word of Mary Lauterbach.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHrHZgjx4Aw

This is the truth I believe and this means that Mary and Peter suspected she was bipolar but yet encouraged her to go into the Marines. That will never make sense to me, no matter how many ways you try to fry it up and serve it.

It's beyond me that some here are looking for Maria to be a heroine. For those who are trying to prop that up, maybe it's time to go back to reading romance novels. I don't know. I have never followed and studied a case where we were looking for a heroine. It's no wonder victimology is becoming an important tool in our society. Someone needs to keep it real and let the public know these things happen to real people, good and bad, truth telling and occasional compulsive liars too.

Maria was a beautiful young woman who may or may not have been bipolar or had some other behavior disorder. That behavior disorder could contribute to the way she perceived things. IF that is the CASE, then who did who a favor sending Maria off to the Marines for structural learning? NOBODY IMHO.

She made mistakes and she MIGHT have PAID A HIGH PRICE for one if that is determined to be a motive. Do we hand out the death penalty to people who make mistakes that don't kill other human beings? NO, OF COURSE NOT. So no, she didn't deserve it period.

She deserves justice for the crime committed on her body and that of her unborn child period.

She doesn't need people rewriting her life and times to make themselves feel better.

ALL JMOOC.

She stated how much she loved her nephew, yet he didn't get a mention.

She deserved better all the way around IMHO. :(

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 10:14 AM

Originally posted by AnnieBean
Sami you are right this mother has been misunderstoof and attacked, and your analogy to Beth is a good one. She is the exact opposite and her daughter is called a sl** by those who think Beth is glosssing over her daughters "reputation", which nobody posting knows the truth about.

Heres comes mary saying the opposite things about her daughter
yet peeps still call HER daughter names as well.

People are just mean. IMO [/*]

I disagree Annie, there is a need for being open, honest and real when you are dealing with a case like this. When you fall prey to evil, your life is ripped apart too.

This is just one more reason that education and victimology are just as important as profiling anymore. Looking at what makes a person vulnerable can't be underestimated IMO and surely if there is someone holding a weapon in their hand defending our country, a behavior disorder or mental illness undiagnosed could just contribute to a bad decision. You have shared the story of your daughter here, and I applaud you for doing so. Think about that. Would you want your daughter in the military stationed in Iraq?

Trying to FIX a STORY is not the answer if you ever expect to learn anything from a heinous crime like this IMHO.

:patriot: Still seeking justice for Maria and Gabriel.

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 10:17 AM

Originally posted by AnnieBean
Gpood Morning. My hubby is refusing to make a fresh pot of coffee this morning so I'm sitting here drinking a pepsi trying to decide if I want to just go ahead and do it myself or go without.

Can't beleive day 66. [/*]
pssst... what did you do to the Christmas cactus? cover it with bucket.. What is temps like.. sorry o/t

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 10:31 AM

Hi everyone. GentleBreeze's daughter is in my thoughts this morning, I could not get her off my mind last night when trying to sleep. What a terrible thing that was; I can't imagine how frightened she must have been not to mention the physical pain of those injuries. My prayers are with her and her family.

I also have thoughts about Mary L. It seems to me that if she has told the truth to LE, and continues to be forthright with LE and those investigating her daughter's death, that it should not much matter what she tells, or does not tell the rest of us.

It seems to me that perhaps she is trying to restore some semblance of dignity to her daughter who was murdered in such a heinous way. And I simply can't fault the lady for that.

henry

03-16-2008, 10:33 AM

i have to pipe in here :) . . . there are no time references on mary's statements . . . for example, was she a "loner" all her life . . . or just upon entering the mc . . . or just since being stationed at camp lj . . . to take a broad brush, imo, is an inaccucurate assumption, and then add on top of this the emotional stress she was (and is) coping with . . . JMO

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by Sami

You said this last night, CANDY, which makes me think nothing Maria's family can say would be believed by you. I hope I'm wrong.

What could they possibly do or say that would make you believe them? TIA

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?postid=11385874#post11385874 [/*]

At this point I really think the need to survive has superceded their own version of a truth Sami. I don't think they even know it anymore. It's like your desire for Maria to be a heroine as opposed to a victim of crime and acknowledging any mistakes she might have made in becoming one. It's like my feeling that if Maria waited a month to report the allegations and two went to one, and baby was result, and then baby was not; I find someone who waits a month to report and has found out the man they had sex with is married might have a hard time with perception/truth and is feeling fear of becoming pregnant. I think we all get welded into our positions after months of receiving new information, studying and reading history, but legal and undeniable documentation can and may change some of our thought process.

I don't think there is anything they can or should do to worry about what the public thinks of them Sami. What's done is done and you can't unring bells. JMOOC. :shrug:

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 11:18 AM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

Oh no way, but my dd has been diagnosed and is on meds, and Mary and peter I think cooked up the bipolar idea, and I think that ML probably was bipolar although I am in the minority beleieving that...
Even well controlled on her meds everyday, no way is my daughter suitable for any kind of military duty. And IMO nobody who is dx bipolar should be in the service.
Gosh, I am going to get it for that...hammer oh well JMO [/*]

Annie, I would like to sincerely thank you for your frank and honest answer. I knew you had taken your daughter for treatment, but did want to know what your feelings were.

This is one thing that concerns me about our military right now. Nuff said there as I just want a different world and that is one thing I am not realistic about. OR at least, that's what I'm told.

JMO and again, thanks for your brutally honest answer. :patriot:

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by henry
i have to pipe in here :) . . . there are no time references on mary's statements . . . for example, was she a "loner" all her life . . . or just upon entering the mc . . . or just since being stationed at camp lj . . . to take a broad brush, imo, is an inaccucurate assumption, and then add on top of this the emotional stress she was (and is) coping with . . . JMO [/*]

"We suspect that she probably is BIPOLAR and she's had a lot of struggles through the years. She's been a real loner, hasn't had a lot of friends, but one thing is she's very attached to home and would call several times a day." spoken word of Mary Lauterbach.

A LOT OF STRUGGLES THROUGH THE YEARS gives you somewhat of a time reference IMO henry.

All JMO.
:shrug:

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 11:30 AM

Good morning everyone. Thoughts and prayers going out to GB's daughter, I hope they are keeping her painfree and that she's on her way to a speedy recovery.

Also, take care of yourself bkwits, we're thinking on ya.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 11:34 AM

Originally posted by dave sargent

This Mary Lauterbach Defense seems very disingenious coming from You moo & IIRC.

NOt sure what BEth Holloway has to Do with Mary or Maria Lauterbach. JMO tho [/*]

I think Taylor Behl's mother was very open and honest from what I remember. She spoke out about telling Taylor to have the time of her life while away at school and to not miss an opportunity to enjoy life.

She stood up to the scrutiny and even came here and discussed the case. I would say she represents the half way point between the two extremes here. JMO tho. :(

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by Sami

You said this last night, CANDY, which makes me think nothing Maria's family can say would be believed by you. I hope I'm wrong.

I don't believe much Mary and Peter have to say because it's always self-serving in their passive-agressive way. Each time they speak, it has demeaned Maria and the circumstances of her early years and that burns right through me.

What could they possibly do or say that would make you believe them? TIA

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?postid=11385874#post11385874 [/*]

--------------------------------------------------------

Notice the diagnoses of Mary and Peter along with the oft repeated diagnosis of Bipolar for Maria by CK. All unsubstantiated. Yet, the perp in this case, who is charged with a horrible murder is never dissected. Not only that, consistent efforts to blame Christina, who has not been charged.........
:tongue:

I agree with you, Mary did the best she could under horrendous circimstances. Her words were twisted and used against her. She and her family are not rewriting history, they attempted to set the record straight and I believe she has, with people who use their common sense and have no agenda. IMO.

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 11:50 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

At this point I really think the need to survive has superceded their own version of a truth Sami. I don't think they even know it anymore. It's like your desire for Maria to be a heroine as opposed to a victim of crime and acknowledging any mistakes she might have made in becoming one. It's like my feeling that if Maria waited a month to report the allegations and two went to one, and baby was result, and then baby was not; I find someone who waits a month to report and has found out the man they had sex with is married might have a hard time with perception/truth and is feeling fear of becoming pregnant. I think we all get welded into our positions after months of receiving new information, studying and reading history, but legal and undeniable documentation can and may change some of our thought process.

I don't think there is anything they can or should do to worry about what the public thinks of them Sami. What's done is done and you can't unring bells. JMOOC. :shrug: [/*]

Yes, we know your opinion. My opinion is that we shouldn't blame the victim for her own death based on no substantiated evidence. I also frown on calling Maria's family
liars or Maria a liar based on no proven facts. Neither the local LE or the marines have done this. IMO.

There is a way to have a decent discussion without doing the above, in my view.

Kel65

03-16-2008, 11:52 AM

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Regina.Lampert

--------------------------------------------------------

Notice the diagnoses of Mary and Peter along with the oft repeated diagnosis of Bipolar for Maria by CK. All unsubstantiated. Yet, the perp in this case, who is charged with a horrible murder is never dissected. Not only that, consistent efforts to blame Christina, who has not been charged.........
:tongue:

I agree with you, Mary did the best she could under horrendous circimstances. Her words were twisted and used against her. She and her family are not rewriting history, they attempted to set the record straight and I believe she has, with people who use their common sense and have no agenda. IMO. [/*]

I didn't diagnose Maria REGINA, I simply repeated what Mary Lauterbach said.

I am sorry it doesn't fit your victim dress, but life is what it is and there are awful things out there I wouldn't link here, but when MRS. LAUTERBACK looks into a camera and makes a statement, yes it is worthy of repeating here and it's certainly suspect coupled with her other interviews.

I continue to feel IF MARY AND PETER thought or suspected bipolar was the problem with Maria, then how sad if they thought the structure of the USMC would fix her as opposed to getting her treatment.

JMO THO and nothing more. :shrug:

And in the interest of that principle KISS, this is the simplest answer IMO. People are most honest in the beginning unless they are hiding info on a crime from what I have seen in these cases.

So do you think anyone who doesn't go along with your thought process should be silenced?

:patriot: On to the trial.

henry

03-16-2008, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

"We suspect that she probably is BIPOLAR and she's had a lot of struggles through the years. She's been a real loner, hasn't had a lot of friends, but one thing is she's very attached to home and would call several times a day." spoken word of Mary Lauterbach.

A LOT OF STRUGGLES THROUGH THE YEARS gives you somewhat of a time reference IMO henry.

All JMO.
:shrug: [/*]

see, i read that differently. struggles thru the years ends a sentence. a new thought and a new sentence . . . loner when she left the safe & secure home environment for the rest of the quote. jmo . . . hopefully you can understand how others interpret the written word.

henry

03-16-2008, 11:55 AM

Originally posted by Kel65

I've been trying to find more information on CAL, but it is hard to find. Perhaps that is why he hasn't been "dissected". JMO [/*]

as well as his & xtina's parents . . . why are they so silent since he took off.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 12:01 PM

Originally posted by henry

see, i read that differently. struggles thru the years ends a sentence. a new thought and a new sentence . . . loner when she left the safe & secure home environment for the rest of the quote. jmo . . . hopefully you can understand how others interpret the written word. [/*]

So you believe she transitioned time between the two sentences?

Thanks for explaining your interpretation of the written word and the spoken word too. :seeya:

jmo

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 12:02 PM

Originally posted by henry

as well as his & xtina's parents . . . why are they so silent since he took off. [/*]

Do you want them to call a PC for you, henry? :confused:

I just don't know what "we" can or should expect from these people. Well, I know what I personally expect, which is nothing. I don't second guess why they are silent.

henry

03-16-2008, 12:04 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

Do you want them to call a PC for you, henry? :confused:

I just don't know what "we" can or should expect from these people. Well, I know what I personally expect, which is nothing. I don't second guess why they are silent. [/*]

hah . . . a press conference would be magnificent! but i'd expect a parent to plead for their son to turn himself in . . . and think of others - like his daughter - and to stand up & be a man! that'd be enough for me. jmo

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 12:06 PM

Originally posted by Kel65

I've been trying to find more information on CAL, but it is hard to find. Perhaps that is why he hasn't been "dissected". JMO [/*]

I'm just pointing out that the same criteria of picking on this vicitm has not been applied by some to the murdering slime who is actually charged with her murder.

I don't think we have to go back in time to find actions to dissect with cesar. An accusation of rape and a charge of bludgeoning, tossing in a pit and cooking this very pregnant young Marine should be quite enough to lodge the same criticisms of mental problems that have been unfairly thrown at the victim. IMO.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 12:08 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

:beer:

CK, You are just a Class Act. You didnt say what everyone WANTS to hear; You only posted the truth as it pertains to the parties involved in this tragey. The Truth often causes discomfort moo [/*]

Thanks dave. More than a few posters have pm'd me and feel the same way, but fear the backlash for stating what they think about this.

I personally feel it's sad, but you are correct about the truth causing discomfort too, and I'm sure it's hard to look at if you aren't comfortable with it for any reason.

I don't know where the idea comes from in making Maria a heroine and Mary a victim, as we know THE MURDER WAS A HEINOUS ACT and you don't have to be perfect to be a victim IMHO.

JMO. :patriot:

henry

03-16-2008, 12:09 PM

i'd like to repost a "help me please" question from yesterday . . . thanks

i have a mc procedural question if anyone can help me . . . regarding the military protective order . . . once this is requested, how do they go about completing & issuing one . . . what paperwork documentation has to be submitted . . . and where is all of it kept after one has been issued . . . from a recordkeeping & file system/retrieval perspective? tia

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 12:21 PM

Originally posted by henry

hah . . . a press conference would be magnificent! but i'd expect a parent to plead for their son to turn himself in . . . and think of others - like his daughter - and to stand up & be a man! that'd be enough for me. jmo [/*]

We don't know that they are not doing that pleading.....in ways we are unaware of.

hinman

03-16-2008, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Thanks dave. More than a few posters have pm'd me and feel the same way, but fear the backlash for stating what they think about this.

I personally feel it's sad, but you are correct about the truth causing discomfort too, and I'm sure it's hard to look at if you aren't comfortable with it for any reason.

I don't know where the idea comes from in making Maria a heroine and Mary a victim, as we know THE MURDER WAS A HEINOUS ACT and you don't have to be perfect to be a victim IMHO.

JMO. :patriot: [/*]I agree with your post Candy I have no problem with anyone who thinks Maria wasn't innocent and wasn't raped. I also don't mid when people post that Mary contributed to the delay in finding Maria.

Doesn't mean I have to agree or that I am blind to the fact. I just don't see truth in this case yet and very few facts to say for sure either way. Until I know further I rather lean on the side of Maria's.

I hope everyone feels they can express their opinions because it goes both ways on here I see posters getting backlash for supporting Maria and I see posters getting backlash for believing Cesear.

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 12:40 PM

hinman

03-16-2008, 12:43 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

I am sure "you are not familar with her case" :barf:

Good Lord Forbid that YOU would accept that MC is just as, or better, prepared as any Civiliam Agency offering "protection." [/*]dave
Do you really think that Sami is anti military or doesn't protect our sevice members. I haven't got that from her posts and the fact that she continues to post her shows me that she truly does care about this case and making sure that every one get sthe protection they need.

I get that she feels some mistakes were made in this case but I doubt that she things the military is awful. JMO

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 12:47 PM

Who's supposed to protect people from going to their alleged rapist's home, on their own accord?

:shrug:

hinman

03-16-2008, 12:48 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

And backlash for believing Christina. :D [/*]Very true. You know I was thinking about that and that comment that RS left.

You can pretty much know what happened but if you don't have proof you can't charge well see that can work both ways so if you haev no proof Christina helped but feel that she did you can't charge her and also if you think Maria didn't go over there own her own but you can't prove that then no kidnapping charge.

Putting my armory on cause he comes the posts:D

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 12:53 PM

Originally posted by hinman
I agree with your post Candy I have no problem with anyone who thinks Maria wasn't innocent and wasn't raped. I also don't mid when people post that Mary contributed to the delay in finding Maria.

Doesn't mean I have to agree or that I am blind to the fact. I just don't see truth in this case yet and very few facts to say for sure either way. Until I know further I rather lean on the side of Maria's.

I hope everyone feels they can express their opinions because it goes both ways on here I see posters getting backlash for supporting Maria and I see posters getting backlash for believing Cesear. [/*]

I know that hinman, and I respect you and your opinions too. I don't feel the need to belittle you or your thought process and try to sway your thinking process.

I learn things from posters on this board every day and take it with me. Sometimes it results in changing a theory, and sometimes, it throws one of my theories all the way out. I'm open to considering many things about this case.

I don't really know of anyone who believes Cesar, but I do know I find myself wondering about how crazy it could make you to be falsely accused if that was the case and how stressful it could make life for at least three people we know in this case. Especially if the complaining witness was trying to rectify it and couldn't. JMO and I am not saying I know that to be the case, but I do wonder about many aspects of this case.

I understand when posters feel they can't say what they feel, as it takes thick skin to answer back to sometimes rude and offensive posts directly aimed at you. But after time your skin starts to thicken and if you believe what you are saying, you spit it out, providing you aren't breaking the TOS here.

JMOOC.
:patriot:

If we all thought alike, it would be a boring place to post IMO.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 12:57 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

And backlash for believing Christina. :D [/*]

Hey, I don't do give you backlash for supporting Christina. While I might not believe she is an innocent or victim in this too, I would like to be wrong and have stated so on more than one occasion.

I want to that innocent child to have a parent in her life every day.

JMO.

:rose: For the innocent babies who will pay the price and have already paid the price. :rose:

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 12:58 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Good morning, Annie.

Hope you are well this morning.

Excellent points, you bring up, the fact that BHT and ML's mother have actually said THE OPPOSITE about their daughters.

BHT said her daughter was perfect, and had a perfect reputation and was a straight-A student and was a virgin.

ML's mother said her daughter had a history of lying and might be bi-polar. Also said her daughter had always been troubled, and was a loner. Other members of ML's family have echoed those sentiments.

So there is no comparison between the two mothers, except that both their daughters were murdered (and, even there, NH has never been found though she is presumed dead).

However, I have never, ever, nerver, seen ML being called "a name." Have you?

Because certainly, "s+++t" is a name I have read NH called (and many more). But what name(s) has ML been called? :confused:

This whole notion of "preserving the dignity" and all of those holier than thou terms I have seen posted in the last couple of days (not by you, AB) amount to nothing more, imo, than folks wanting to dictate what is said on a board.

We all know that if CW thought we were in any sense "victim-bashing," or "family-bashing," anyone doing so would be banned. Thankfully, that is how this mssg board is run.

This is not the Victorian era nor is it a paperback romance. We are all adults.

Why is it "undignified" or "calling someone a name" to say that she wanted to have sex with someone?
ALL healthy women want to have sex, and do so. I dare say that all of us on this board have done so.

So, really, I think this argument that keeps cropping up about anything but rape(s), sexual assault(s) and even sexual assaults after death--as has been bandied about on this board since Friday--being somehow, bashing the victim, well, they are just patently false.

IMO they are also verging on the ridiculous.

I suggest we ask CW for further instructions, so that we are not mired in pages of those kind of comments every single day. [/*]

:beer: Well stated, worth waiting for such a good post this a.m. :D

henry

03-16-2008, 12:59 PM

candykisses . . . i've noticed you posts includes the words "complaining witness" a couple of times . . . is that xtina you're referring to? tia

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:00 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

I know that hinman, and I respect you and your opinions too. I don't feel the need to belittle you or your thought process and try to sway your thinking process.

I learn things from posters on this board every day and take it with me. Sometimes it results in changing a theory, and sometimes, it throws one of my theories all the way out. I'm open to considering many things about this case.

I don't really know of anyone who believes Cesar, but I do know I find myself wondering about how crazy it could make you to be falsely accused if that was the case and how stressful it could make life for at least three people we know in this case. Especially if the complaining witness was trying to rectify it and couldn't. JMO and I am not saying I know that to be the case, but I do wonder about many aspects of this case.

I understand when posters feel they can't say what they feel, as it takes thick skin to answer back to sometimes rude and offensive posts directly aimed at you. But after time your skin starts to thicken and if you believe what you are saying, you spit it out, providing you aren't breaking the TOS here.

JMOOC.
:patriot:

If we all thought alike, it would be a boring place to post IMO. [/*]ah Candy I think you hit on the head. Swaying opinions. It seems it is more about that then anything.

Just wanted to let you know it is great psoting with you. We do not agree on much but it is fun and really intriguing to see your view on this subject.

and if you ever feel like I am belittling you please let me know I have been working on that.:D

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 01:02 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by hinman
I agree with your post Candy I have no problem with anyone who thinks Maria wasn't innocent and wasn't raped. I also don't mid when people post that Mary contributed to the delay in finding Maria.

Doesn't mean I have to agree or that I am blind to the fact. I just don't see truth in this case yet and very few facts to say for sure either way. Until I know further I rather lean on the side of Maria's.

I hope everyone feels they can express their opinions because it goes both ways on here I see posters getting backlash for supporting Maria and I see posters getting backlash for believing Cesear. [/*][/QUOTE
Good post hinman... I do not see truth or many facts in this case yet either..
All we know about Cesar is from his notes he wrote and that he told someone if he was charged with rape he would flee to Mexico..
We have not heard a peep out of Christina.. and Maria cannot talk to us.. Mary was under much duress when she gave out info about Maria and this has been used against her often I feel.. although I still do not know what happened.. I just don't like to see posters snapping at other posters just because they do not agree with them and say they are seeing Maria as a heroine.. I don`t believe anyone sees her as that at all.. from the posts I have read.. I also feel the ones who feel strongly against Maria and her mother tend to be more adamant and sarcastic towards this tragedy of two people being murdered in such a horrific way..
I will also go out on a limb here and say the first time I heard Mary speak to Maria on TV telling her come come home In any condition (not sure of wording) and to tell the truth it did not sit well with me..but after hearing more and more and hearing Mary speak on the Today show I think it was i understood the reason why she said what she said and I do believe her.. I think she has been through her share of life`s troubles too an may not be the most well spoken person in the world but then neither am I..
So much here is unknown and those who are passionate about Maria and the horrible death she endured being burned etc... is totally gruesome. Does it really matter if she at some time had consensual sex with him
I for the life of me cannot see why this "stellar"marine did what he did to these two people and how anyone can justify it..and make light of it..There is no jsutification for this
jmo and sorry for the rant

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 01:09 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

Oh Darn. I HATE that we dont connect. You seem so upfront and honest. [/*]:no: sarcasm no?
jmo

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 01:10 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

(snipped because I just want to address this in your post, Candy:)

I don't really know of anyone who believes Cesar, but I do know I find myself wondering about how crazy it could make you to be falsely accused if that was the case and how stressful it could make life for at least three people we know in this case. [/*]

I could understand this point if CL had admitted to the MC/NCIS or whoever questioned him that he and ML had had sex, but that it was consensual.

If your theory is correct, i.e., that the rape allegation was false, but CL and ML did have consensual sex, well IMO CL has no one but himself to blame.

If there was zero sex between ML and CL, then yes, I think it would make CL pretty upset.

JMO

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:10 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

:read:

I AM NOT SPEAKING "To You"

My Post is in General about any opinion I have:

FGS. Forget It. A Black Woman isnt worthy of Protetion. The MC should be held to some Higher Standard. I hope it makes You happy that posters that dont support your side might quit posting. If only because real life prevents them. Oh THAT DRAMA

"To You"~~~
Why do YOU expect posters to know what other Posters think? Why do YOU expect posters to assume YOU have a side and will NEVER veer from it??? Dont peeps change their minds sometimes???

I forget == Why do you think the MC was still investigating the Rape Allegations tia??? :biggrin: [/*]:confused:
What the heck are you taking about.

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:11 PM

Originally posted by rjjrg
Good morning. I have posted very little since I registered, but I have been diligent about reading the board and keeping up with the developments on this case. I am just as stymied as most of you that CL is still on the lam and each day, I am hopeful that he will be captured and returned to NC to face charges.

As many of you, I have several theories about the murder and subsequent cover-up/cleanup. I just have a hard time justifying that CSL was not involved at some level, and I simply cannot believe that she lived in that house with CL for at least 3 weeks without detecting some signs and/or evidence of the murder and burial.

Maria and Gabriel’s death were so horrid and I feel so badly for the family. They have endured so much and to add insult to injury, the murderer is still missing.

Hopefully, today is the day that Cesar Laurean will be captured. [/*]:seeya: Welcome

henry

03-16-2008, 01:15 PM

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 01:16 PM

Originally posted by hinman
:confused:
What the heck are you taking about. [/*]

:lol: I love it when I get a good laugh on a crime board.

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 01:16 PM

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:25 PM

I think that any poster who was scared to post their opinion for or against Maria in the rape case should just read the board today. Yikes.

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

You are so Cute & Coy ;)

FWIW This is what I WAS talking about and now I am done. Thanks for the civil exchange of ideas :seeya:

[/*]and how does that relate to a black women not being worthy of protection??

Your post really did confuse me. Though it does say you are not speaking to me I am not sure if that was directed to me or not. I am just trying to understand what you are saying.

caejde

03-16-2008, 01:40 PM

Originally posted by henry
i'd like to repost a "help me please" question from yesterday . . . thanks

i have a mc procedural question if anyone can help me . . . regarding the military protective order . . . once this is requested, how do they go about completing & issuing one . . . what paperwork documentation has to be submitted . . . and where is all of it kept after one has been issued . . . from a recordkeeping & file system/retrieval perspective? tia [/*]

Hi, henry. The MPO would have been signed and dated by Cesar and the commanding officer issuing it. Cesar would have a copy, Maria would have a copy, and the original would go into his personnel file. The MPO is completed by a commanding officer-could be company or regimental. As in Maria's case, it was done by company except for the one time the company commander was on leave and the regimental commander issued it. There is a space provided for the commanding officer to list any information that supports the issuing of an MPO. Hope this helps.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 01:44 PM

Yes, and now you can add baseball bat wielding to that one Jas. Where all this great information comes from is beyond me, but Kel, who is a great researcher can't come up with anything negative before he became involved with someone outside his marriage whether it was by consensual means or rape. JMO.

I am open to finding out more. After all, Maria thought he was popular and Lisa thought he was a nice guy, but we all know some of the most notorious murderers have had the same said one time or another in life.

JMO. :(

Keep researching Kel.

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 01:46 PM

Originally posted by caejde

Hi, henry. The MPO would have been signed and dated by Cesar and the commanding officer issuing it. Cesar would have a copy, Maria would have a copy, and the original would go into his personnel file. The MPO is completed by a commanding officer-could be company or regimental. As in Maria's case, it was done by company except for the one time the company commander was on leave and the regimental commander issued it. There is a space provided for the commanding officer to list any information that supports the issuing of an MPO. Hope this helps. [/*]

Thanks, Caejde (although I wasn't the one asking for this!).

Interesting that CL would have a copy, too. I wonder if LE found his copy? (actually, I guess he would have 3 copies, one from each MPO)

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:47 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Good day, hinman.

What do you mean by "innocent" above, pls?

Thank you. [/*]It has been assumed that people who think she was not raped believe she was innocent and that is all I mean by that.
Let me clarify a little more. when I say innocent I mean perfect that she did no wrong and led a perfect life.

bkwits

03-16-2008, 01:48 PM

Mornin' all

I'm just up for a little while and been reading today's posts.

It appears to me that at least one poster may have started celebrating St. Paddy's Day a little early.
:D

Drinking herb tea myself. Decided to forego the coffee.:(

hinman

03-16-2008, 01:53 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Oh, OK. You are using the word innocent but giving it some other meaning than what it has.

Thank you.

I was confused because you said "if she was innocent and raped."

I guess that "and" made it even more confusing for me. [/*]Sorry for the confusion:D

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 01:56 PM

Originally posted by hinman
It has been assumed that people who think she was not raped believe she was innocent and that is all I mean by that.
Let me clarify a little more. when I say innocent I mean perfect that she did no wrong and led a perfect life. [/*]

Hi again hinman, and I'm always appreciative of a respectful exchange with you even tho we don't see eye to eye.

I want to answer Jas's question too.

For me innocence in the purest form is reserved for the children and I base that on them not having a choice or a role in the happenings that surround this case that THEY could control.

While it doesn't meet the textbook version of innocence, it's the way I feel about it in this case.

JMO tho.:patriot:

I've never known a perfect person, but I do know a few who might describe themselves as such. ;) They might not call it perfect either, but your definition would apply. JMO again and not aimed at anyone here.

henry

03-16-2008, 01:57 PM

Originally posted by caejde

Hi, henry. The MPO would have been signed and dated by Cesar and the commanding officer issuing it. Cesar would have a copy, Maria would have a copy, and the original would go into his personnel file. The MPO is completed by a commanding officer-could be company or regimental. As in Maria's case, it was done by company except for the one time the company commander was on leave and the regimental commander issued it. There is a space provided for the commanding officer to list any information that supports the issuing of an MPO. Hope this helps. [/*]

thank you caejde . . . would a copy also go into maria's personnel file? tia oh, also, what type of written documentation, if you know, has to be filed for them to issue a mpo - thanks.

edit: thanks jas.s for the answer

bkwits

03-16-2008, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by Sami

I thought about you last night, bkwits -- hoping you're doing okay and the medicine will soon have you healthy again. :rose: [/*]

Thanks, Sami, my DDIL is coming over to take care of me. :)

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:01 PM

Originally posted by henry

thank you caejde . . . would a copy also go into maria's personnel file? tia oh, also, what type of written documentation, if you know, has to be filed for them to issue a mpo - thanks. [/*]

According to the actual MPO, there is a place at the bottom that says "Distribution". And then it lists, servicemember, servicemember's local personnel file, and protected person. Maria would be the protected person. So I don't think anything would be in Maria's personnel file. The written documentation for Maria's rape allegations would be the Marine Corps Order...where it states that an MPO is to be issued if the two work in the same unit. Let me just say this is what I believe as I have not had any personal experience with MPO's and I am going based on what I have read.

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 02:02 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

True.

Unless you count him being a coward, there is nothing he wouldn't do, he is probably in the drug cartel, might be in the Mexican army deserters group, smug, probably into necrophelia, macho, probably wanted a son because "Mexicans are that way," etc, posts we see each day as "dissection." [/*]

:lol: OMG now I REALLY am rolling on the floor......

hinman

03-16-2008, 02:02 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Hi again hinman, and I'm always appreciative of a respectful exchange with you even tho we don't see eye to eye.

SNIPPED:

I've never known a perfect person, but I do know a few who might describe themselves as such. ;) They might not call it perfect either, but your definition would apply. JMO again and not aimed at anyone here. [/*]You are right my definition would apply. Never thought about that. See what I mean I learn a lot from others even when I do not agree with them.

I don't believe a perfect individual exists either except for in someones mind. I agree with your definition though.

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 02:05 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES
Yes, and now you can add baseball bat wielding to that one Jas. Where all this great information comes from is beyond me, but Kel, who is a great researcher can't come up with anything negative before he became involved with someone outside his marriage whether it was by consensual means or rape. JMO.

I am open to finding out more. After all, Maria thought he was popular and Lisa thought he was a nice guy, but we all know some of the most notorious murderers have had the same said one time or another in life.

JMO. :(

Keep researching Kel. [/*]

Too lazy to mow his own lawn too. :D

bkwits

03-16-2008, 02:14 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Not too crazy about his painting skills, either. At least his choice in color. :rolleyes: [/*]

But the color is good for covering up certain stains. :cuss:

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 02:16 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

HUH?

He has nobody to blame but himself for someone falsely accusing him or rape?

Huh? :confused: [/*]

My point was that if he never had sex with ML at all, then yes, I could see a false allegation of rape would make him very upset.

But, if he did have consensual sex with ML, and thus lied to the MC/NCIS by saying he never had sex with ML, then I don't think it makes as much sense for the rape allegation to upset him as much.

(edited to add JMO)

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:21 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Caejde, thanks for the info.

This reminded me that I heard an expert TH on NG Show stating that there was a place to check, to have the MPO sent to local LE. JMO though

Do you know if that is true? Or would that be part of the Distribution and not part of the actual MPO itself? TIA [/*]

There is a place for allotted where it designates "The protected person has also been issued the following court orders" And it lists "a" and "bee". "A" is for a civil protection order and they would have to list date issued, what court, what county, and the state. "Bee" is for any other type of order issued with the same information as "A". And there are 2 boxes to be checked that applies-custody/visitation and property settlement. So, in my opinion, Maria would have to have gotten a civilian protection order on her own and then had it to show the commanding officer. But again, as I said I have never had to deal with these so it's all my opinion.

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:24 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Huh?

Why is it necessary that either of them chose it? [/*]

Very well could have been the same color when they bought the house and chose to stay with it. Maybe the previous owners had a little paint left for them to keep in case of "touch ups" and that is how they knew what color paint to get again. Or maybe Christina told him what color to get. We just don't know.

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 02:25 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

How could I forget that? hammer to me. [/*]

Don't forget the dissecting of those pics of him and Christina...where she was blurred out. That went on for pages and pages and pages (not sure you were on here). LOTTSA psychoanalyzation of Cesar based on his images there. :tongue:

henry

03-16-2008, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by caejde

According to the actual MPO, there is a place at the bottom that says "Distribution". And then it lists, servicemember, servicemember's local personnel file, and protected person. Maria would be the protected person. So I don't think anything would be in Maria's personnel file. The written documentation for Maria's rape allegations would be the Marine Corps Order...where it states that an MPO is to be issued if the two work in the same unit. Let me just say this is what I believe as I have not had any personal experience with MPO's and I am going based on what I have read. [/*]

thank you caejde . . . 'cause i was trying to figure out why the mc didn't know about the mpo until it was discovered in maria's car . . . perhaps there is room for improvement here, of course . . . if i'm following what you're saying :) imo

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:28 PM

Just was thinking...I know Mary referred to Maria as a "loner". But in almost every picture they have showed Maria she was always smiling and surrounded by friends. Now, the "loner" could be when she was at Lejeune. But I finally watched a video of her friend that was interviewed-Melinda. And Melinda said that Maria was coming to see her about everyday and they would go to the beach and stuff on weekends. I just don't know how much of a "loner" she could have been. To me, a "loner" is someone who doesn't want to be involved in sports, doesn't want to go out and do things. I don't know though.

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by henry

thank you caejde . . . 'cause i was trying to figure out why the mc didn't know about the mpo until it was discovered in maria's car . . . perhaps there is room for improvement here, of course . . . if i'm following what you're saying :) imo [/*]

Not sure who you are meaning when you say Marine Corps didn't know. If you are speaking with the base commander...of course she wouldn't have known. But her commanding officer would have known.

henry

03-16-2008, 02:34 PM

Originally posted by caejde

Not sure who you are meaning when you say Marine Corps didn't know. If you are speaking with the base commander...of course she wouldn't have known. But her commanding officer would have known. [/*]

being non-military, i'm not sure who in command i'm talking about! i'm just trying to place an imaginary face (like person A, person * so no one misunderstands imaginary :) ) on how this was overlooked.

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:37 PM

henry

03-16-2008, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by caejde

But as I went on to say, I gave what I thought a loner would be. [/*]

and with that . . . i'm going to be a lone r for a few :) . . . but with several family, friends, etc. around

strick10

03-16-2008, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by caejde

According to the actual MPO, there is a place at the bottom that says "Distribution". And then it lists, servicemember, servicemember's local personnel file, and protected person. Maria would be the protected person. So I don't think anything would be in Maria's personnel file. The written documentation for Maria's rape allegations would be the Marine Corps Order...where it states that an MPO is to be issued if the two work in the same unit. Let me just say this is what I believe as I have not had any personal experience with MPO's and I am going based on what I have read. [/*]

Hey caejde! What form are you looking at? Just askin' as the DD Form 2873 list the distribution as service members immediate command, service memeber, protected person, PMO or the Security officer Criminal Investigation. I would certainly hope that even though the distribution doesn't list the SRB's they could be placed in them. Maybe there's another form that supercedes the 2873? Not that it really matters but I'm just curious if I've been looking at an aged form.

hinman

03-16-2008, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by henry

and with that . . . i'm going to be a lone r for a few :) . . . but with several family, friends, etc. around [/*]:seeya:
enjoy.

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Hey caejde! What form are you looking at? Just askin' as the DD Form 2873 list the distribution as service members immediate command, service memeber, protected person, PMO or the Security officer Criminal Investigation. I would certainly hope that even though the distribution doesn't list the SRB's they could be placed in them. Maybe there's another form that supercedes the 2873? Not that it really matters but I'm just curious if I've been looking at an aged form. [/*]

I'm looking at the same form but it's July 2004...so it is very possible an outdated form. That is what I was going by when answering questions. So just :punch: me

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 02:43 PM

Originally posted by caejde
Just was thinking...I know Mary referred to Maria as a "loner". But in almost every picture they have showed Maria she was always smiling and surrounded by friends. Now, the "loner" could be when she was at Lejeune. But I finally watched a video of her friend that was interviewed-Melinda. And Melinda said that Maria was coming to see her about everyday and they would go to the beach and stuff on weekends. I just don't know how much of a "loner" she could have been. To me, a "loner" is someone who doesn't want to be involved in sports, doesn't want to go out and do things. I don't know though. [/*]

I agree with you, Caejde. Melinda and Renna/Renner (I have seen it both ways) both suggested she was a lot of fun to be with and I didn't get the impression from either of them that she was a loner.

Maybe she didn't have a large circle of friends and that was what her mother meant.

Or maybe ML didn't feel comfortable growing up in a small, midwestern hometown. Who knows.. lol

JMO

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

I went to h3ll to investigate IF there was EVEN A Snoball taking a Chance. Seems you will have better luck IF roll up a rug and toss it into the IntraCoastal Waterway MOO. or the dumpster behind Yanna's :biggrin: [/*]

Hey dave! Now you are talking about my neck of the woods!! I'll have to go check out that dumpster behind Yanna's and see what's in there. :tongue:

caejde

03-16-2008, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by caejde

I'm looking at the same form but it's July 2004...so it is very possible an outdated form. That is what I was going by when answering questions. So just :punch: me [/*]

I do see the MarAdmin where it says that it should go to base PMO though...but the copy of the MPO I'm looking at doesn't list that. So, I dunno!

Mimi428

03-16-2008, 02:47 PM

Originally posted by henry
i was over at the jd website and found a recent comments post by captain rsutherland dated 3-16 12:13 a.m.. . .

This is not a reference to the Maria investigation, but an explanation as to burden of proof in general. Our Office, and law enforcement nationwide, has a duty to proceed ethically and with integrity when we conduct criminal investigations.
http://www.jdnews.com/news/baby_55479___article.html/autopsy_clothing.html [/*]

Whoa hoss! Some kind of timing that he made that long post a couple hours after a multitude of criticism was written re: Christina & her NOT being arrested.

Look at the reference he made here...

This week, another supervisor and I had to tell a unit of investigators that they could not write a search warrant to search a drug dealers house. We knew that he was a dealer, and we knew that he was involved with some drugs that we had seized. But we could not prove it.

We could not ethically obtain a warrant and search someones house because we had not met a standard of proof. Some of the investigators did not agree with our decision, but we felt that it was the best decision based on the integrity expected of our office. This is the standard of conduct that citizens need to appreciate from their law enforcement officers. Even if a particular case is emotionally charged, and everyone feels that someone is guilty of a crime, police officers have a duty to make sure that people are allowed to enjoy their guaranteed rights unless law enforcement has evidence to the contrary.

I'm not deliberately trying to read between the lines, but that was a mighty pointed comparison he made about the drug dealers & how LE KNEW (but couldn't prove).

JMO

hinman

03-16-2008, 02:48 PM

Originally posted by Mystical

I had similar thoughts about that. Maybe Mary was just talking about a certain period of time when she thought Maria was a loner. That's the trouble with trying to interpret these short statements. [/*]It is hard to interpret. i thought maybe she was referring to Maria not liking crowds or something. Kinda like they type of person who doesn't prefer crowded places.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

I don't think that matters, caejde.

Posed pictures like that are not indicative of whether or not one is "a loner."

Look at pictures of ppl who have been referred to as loners and you will see they are with people, and, even smiling. [/*]

Yes, and as parents we try to expose our children to group activities as we help them build their social skills. However, some children will still have behavior disorders IMO.

I don't use group pictures to discredit a mother saying her child is a loner. JMO tho.

:shrug:

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 02:54 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

Whoa hoss! Some kind of timing that he made that long post a couple hours after a multitude of criticism was written re: Christina & her NOT being arrested.

[/*]

Yes, I agree. And he was very careful to put in that phrase at the beginning saying that this was just a general reference, and not necessarily about this case.

(but it sure seemed obvious to me what he was insinuating)

JMO

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 02:56 PM

Speaking of Captain Sutherland... any word from him on our new questions?

(wishful thinking, I know!)

strick10

03-16-2008, 02:56 PM

Lynn Gweeny

03-16-2008, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by caejde

I'm looking at the same form but it's July 2004...so it is very possible an outdated form. That is what I was going by when answering questions. So just :punch: me [/*]

Is this the MPO, DD2873 ... JUL 2004? This is the most current that I was able to find on the DoD site:

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/eforms/dd2873.pdf

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/forminfo/forminfopage3210.html

hinman

03-16-2008, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by gaelicpeas

Yes, I agree. And he was very careful to put in that phrase at the beginning saying that this was just a general reference, and not necessarily about this case.

(but it sure seemed obvious to me what he was insinuating)

JMO [/*]Me to. I think the sheriff said that a couple of times when he was doing Press conferences.

He would say almost the exact same thing when asked about Christina.
Something to the likes of I can believe something but until I have proof I am not going to say nothing I only comment on things I can prove.

Well anyway it went something like that.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 02:58 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S
Nuttin--I am still reading last night's thread.

Did you get a reply from the reporter re the sheet in evidence?

Thank you! [/*]

Sorry to report a big NO from Allegood. But I haven't given up on him quite yet. If I don't hear anything tomorrow, I will send off another one.

caejde

03-16-2008, 03:01 PM

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 03:01 PM

Originally posted by Mystical

I had similar thoughts about that. Maybe Mary was just talking about a certain period of time when she thought Maria was a loner. That's the trouble with trying to interpret these short statements. [/*]

Have you ever actually watched any of the video interviews with Mary?

I think she speaks very clearly each time she was interviewed.

JMO tho.:shrug:

I feel strongly that when she was met with such distaste from the general public, she then went into survival mode and started changing her stories. Unfortunately, all of those things are still available for viewing as she attempts to rewrite history IMHO.:(

caejde

03-16-2008, 03:01 PM

Originally posted by strick10

No need to :punch: . As I said before, the different forms are not important. [/*]

Weird how it doesn't say on the distribution that it goes to base PMO but it does in the MarAdmin.

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 03:01 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Thank you, rjjrg, and I'm so glad you didn't equate my post with my trying to stop opinions from being expressed and discussed.

Like you said in your post 'more thoughtful care would go into some of the messages' -- that is so well stated.

I don't think Mary needs any of us to tell her that her attempt to be totally honest and forthcoming with LE, might have hampered the search for Maria and her killer. I'm sure she eats, sleeps, and breathes that every day.

I just hate a post that says, 'There isn't much I would put past Mary in the interest of making things look right to the outside world.' (http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?postid=11385874#post11385874)

I hope, if it's okay to make a statement as strong and harsh as I feel that one is, that is also okay for ME to post how much I dislike the wording and that I wish it could be phrased in a kinder, gentler fashion.

That's my opinion. [/*]
Sami:seeya: Don't sweat the small stuff.. :) I always enjoy your posts and I do understand what you are saying and imo everyone is entitled to their opinion.. :) Have a good day..

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 03:02 PM

Originally posted by hinman
Me to. I think the sheriff said that a couple of times when he was doing Press conferences.

He would say almost the exact same thing when asked about Christina.
Something to the likes of I can believe something but until I have proof I am not going to say nothing I only comment on things I can prove.

Well anyway it went something like that. [/*]

Yeah, I remember the sheriff saying something like that too...

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 03:05 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

Sorry to report a big NO from Allegood. But I haven't given up on him quite yet. If I don't hear anything tomorrow, I will send off another one. [/*]

:patriot: That's my girl, I know you will stay on top of it. Anything else you can get is always appreciated here.

ALSO, commenting on Southerland....

Why yes, that is quite a coincidence and I'm thinking he's been beat up pretty badly. It seems many from that area have a feeling about Mrs. Laurean being in on this tragedy.

JMNSHOOC.

caejde

03-16-2008, 03:08 PM

My personal opinion is the sheet the ME is referring to is the sheet Maria was taken from the grave in. Otherwise why wouldn't the ME state the sheet was charred. The comforter was charred so how could the sheet have made it unscathed if it was over the comforter? They wouldn't need the body bag for evidence just for the fact that Maria was wrapped in a sheet. And they are testing this sheet to see if anything fell off the body, the comforter that could be used as evidence. All my opinion of course.

strick10

03-16-2008, 03:08 PM

Originally posted by Lynn Gweeny

Is this the MPO, DD2873 ... JUL 2004? This is the most current that I was able to find on the DoD site:

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/eforms/dd2873.pdf

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/forminfo/forminfopage3210.html [/*]

Thanks Lynn. I'm looking at this DD 2873:

http://www.usmc-mccs.org/victimadv/domestic/MPO%20signed.pdf

Both accomplish the same and the only difference I see to this point, too lazy to compare both, is the distribution section.

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 03:08 PM

I have a general IS operating question.

Do you have to hit the refresh button every few seconds/minutes to see new posts, or is there a better way? It seems I spend half my time on here waiting for the screen to refresh... LOL.

TIA

(I am getting impatient waiting on Sutherland's responses to our questions!)

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 03:12 PM

Here are pictures of MPO that expired on Sept. 24, 2007 as I took screenshots from the CNN report:

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mposept20gs9.gif

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=anothercopyofmpost9.jpg

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=4thcopyofmpoxd0.jpg

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3rdcopyofmposi1.jpg

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by caejde
My personal opinion is the sheet the ME is referring to is the sheet Maria was taken from the grave in. Otherwise why wouldn't the ME state the sheet was charred. The comforter was charred so how could the sheet have made it unscathed if it was over the comforter? They wouldn't need the body bag for evidence just for the fact that Maria was wrapped in a sheet. And they are testing this sheet to see if anything fell off the body, the comforter that could be used as evidence. All my opinion of course. [/*]

I'm very confused about the sheet myself. Reading all of last night's posts about it had my head spinning.

I'm wondering what the huge significance is?

I see where some on here think a comforter from the Laurean's house is inculpatory of Christina's knowledge (and there is no question about the comforter.......although I disagree as to it's significance), but if we already know the comforter is from the house, why worry about the sheet?

Maybe I'm just missing something.

IvySterling

03-16-2008, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

What makes you think he chose it? [/*]
I think it was a color/shade Christina has choosen and he bought it. I find it NOT an unusual color, many today are using those shades.

I was viewing a video in another case (SP) and one wall was several shades darker than what the Laureans had in their home.

Also, reading the description of the Laurean house from the Property records it describes the flooring as Vinyl & Carpet. So unless they paid a good sum to install Ceramic tile I think what we see in the photos are Vinyl covering with a tile effect.

hinman

03-16-2008, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo
Here are pictures of MPO that expired on Sept. 24, 2007 as I took screenshots from the CNN report:

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mposept20gs9.gif

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=anothercopyofmpost9.jpg

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=4thcopyofmpoxd0.jpg

http://img357.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3rdcopyofmposi1.jpg [/*]Thanks Nuttin, you are always so helpful.

Running to the store to get groceries will look at it when I get back.:seeya:

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 03:18 PM

Have a pleasant afternoon Jas.

:seeya:

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 03:21 PM

Originally posted by strick10

Thanks Lynn. I'm looking at this DD 2873:

http://www.usmc-mccs.org/victimadv/domestic/MPO%20signed.pdf

Both accomplish the same and the only difference I see to this point, too lazy to compare both, is the distribution section. [/*]

I just noticed what is in the box under where the names of #1 and #2 are: NOTE: Omit information in that, if known to the service member in Item 1, could endanger the protected person.

And under the Distribution box is the following:

Service Member's Immediate Command, Service Member, Protected Person (Custodial Parent of Protected Child), Provost Marshal/Security Officer/Criminal Investigative Organization

All from strick's link above.

Where is the box that indicates this goes to civilian LE? Am I not seeing it but it's there?

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 03:30 PM

Originally posted by rjjrg

Oh my....I hope that I did not come across as critical of Sami, because I definitely did not mean to infer that in any way. In fact, I totally agreed with her post and was just trying to elaborate on what she had said.

Obviously, I did not do a good job. Maybe there is a good reason that I don't get to post more often with you guys. I am so sorry for any confusion. [/*]

no no no...you were not even in my mind when I posted... please do not take offence to my post to sami...
I think there may have been a few unfair posts today directed at her and I would do the same for anyone...
:beer: :rose:

IvySterling

03-16-2008, 03:31 PM

Originally posted by gaelicpeas

~snip

I have a general IS operating question.

Do you have to hit the refresh button every few seconds/minutes to see new posts, or is there a better way? It seems I spend half my time on here waiting for the screen to refresh... LOL.
[/*]
Unfortunately you have to hit the Refresh Icon at the top of your PC screen, or hit F5.

I used to think when I got an DSL line it would automatically show all new posts, I was so wrong :)

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 03:32 PM

quote:
Originally posted by dave sargent

Pls confiscate any apple frittars so I can conduct proper taste testing. I dont kmow nothing about no noseeums

I hope Maria experienced the Drug Store at least once while She was in J'ville.

Freedom Fries sold everywhere! [/*]

Hey dave, if you want some apple fritters I'll be glad to get you some! I have to come up to Durham way on Wednesday and will be glad to drop them off---just tell where to do so!

Oh yes memories of those Freedom Fries! :D

And I do hope Maria got to experience Yanna's too.

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 03:32 PM

Originally posted by Mystical

I had similar thoughts about that. Maybe Mary was just talking about a certain period of time when she thought Maria was a loner. That's the trouble with trying to interpret these short statements. [/*]

I agree.

And, are many "loners" found on sports teams? I wouldn't think so.

I wonder if Mary L. meant something different by the word "loner." Maybe as in someone who chooses her own path as opposed to following the expected one?

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 03:32 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

Whoa hoss! Some kind of timing that he made that long post a couple hours after a multitude of criticism was written re: Christina & her NOT being arrested.

Look at the reference he made here...

This week, another supervisor and I had to tell a unit of investigators that they could not write a search warrant to search a drug dealers house. We knew that he was a dealer, and we knew that he was involved with some drugs that we had seized. But we could not prove it.

We could not ethically obtain a warrant and search someones house because we had not met a standard of proof. Some of the investigators did not agree with our decision, but we felt that it was the best decision based on the integrity expected of our office. This is the standard of conduct that citizens need to appreciate from their law enforcement officers. Even if a particular case is emotionally charged, and everyone feels that someone is guilty of a crime, police officers have a duty to make sure that people are allowed to enjoy their guaranteed rights unless law enforcement has evidence to the contrary.

I'm not deliberately trying to read between the lines, but that was a mighty pointed comparison he made about the drug dealers & how LE KNEW (but couldn't prove).

JMO [/*]

Thank you for this info Mimi. I get your point about not trying to read between the lines on this, but giving us the context of Captain Sutherland's remarks sure puts a whole other light on it.

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

IF Maria went to CLs house on her own accord, as LE is alleging, how does ANYONE Protect her>

[/*]
could you please link this tia

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 03:34 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Thanks, nuttin!:seeya:

I'm having some trouble adequately viewing the MPO, but will keep trying. I really want to see it clearly. [/*]

That's about as clear as it's going to get, I think. I screenshot the pictures directly from the video over at CNN. Sorry they aren't any clearer.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 03:36 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean
This was sent as autp alert to my email any news about Maria- its not news to us but am sharing it anyway-
http://www.witntv.com/home/headlines/16715851.html

AB [/*]

Yes, it isn't news to us but hey at least witntv didn't post what the N&O did about the sheet. Here's what witntv posted:

The paper states, Lauterbach was wrapped in a comforter, and she and her unborn child were extensively burned.

I guess it's up to the individuals about the sheet and its significance.

JMO

IvySterling

03-16-2008, 03:37 PM

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 03:37 PM

Originally posted by IvySterling

Unfortunately you have to hit the Refresh Icon at the top of your PC screen, or hit F5.

I used to think when I got an DSL line it would automatically show all new posts, I was so wrong :) [/*]

Thanks, Ivy! Guess I will keep hitting the refresh button and twiddling my thumbs... :(

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 03:38 PM

Originally posted by old_lady

Huh? :confused: [/*]

More candy coated diagnosing.......... :tongue:

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 03:40 PM

Originally posted by Sami

He was on video buying paint. Unless the unidentified guy with him picked the color, I'm assuming Cesar did, but JMO. [/*]

There was no paint on the Lowe's video that was released. There were cinder blocks, a wheelbarrow, and one shovel.

No paint.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 03:41 PM

Maria and her unborn child were victims of a heinous crime and what was done afterward was unthinkable. But to try and paint this in some extraordinary light to fit a cause such as women suffering sexual assault in the military isn't a fit at this point IMHO.

Her own mother expressed concerns about the story she was hearing that day one month later IIRC. She was worried about him and his career in that phone call outside Walmart that she debated answering because Maria called all too frequently. But now, that's all different for some of us because someone might read about things they have said and done. I don't understand that mentality, but if it works for some, then so be it. But nobody has the right to demand you post a certain way other than IS ADMIN and I can't see where I have broken any TOS here.

From what we know Maria had a relationship with this married man and upon finding out he was married things went bad quickly not to mention the addition of finding out she was pregnant.

I don't automatically dismiss her claim, but nor do I automatically give it credence given her history and the situation coupled with the fact she has allegedly given inconsistent statements to the USMC.

I won't even go into the idea that quite possibly she showed up at his home after all this of her own accord after contact with him.

I have never felt guilty about speaking the truth, and I'm not about to start to do so at this point in my life.

I've noticed Nancy Grace is speaking about this case in a very clear and concise manner as well and feels no need to polish it up.

From her March 5th show.

GRACE: Out to Colonel Robin Johnson, retired Marine Corps colonel.

Colonel, I`m stunned. I mean the Marines have taken several black eyes just recently. Number one, you`ve got Cesar Lauren on the run in Mexico after allegedly killing his pregnant lover and her unborn child. Now this.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0803/05/ng.01.html

THE CRIMES COMMITTED in this CASE are HEINOUS ENOUGH, we don't need to make any changes IMHO. :patriot:

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 03:42 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

Hey- I went away to play with some photos on my camera and came back and saw this post. WHAT is this in reference to? I have never seen this before. Someone please explain- [/*]

There was a JD News article posted first thing this morning, by Henry I think...

Anyway, at the bottom of the article are comments by readers, including a response from Captain Sutherland - his response is what this is about.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 03:43 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

There was no paint on the Lowe's video that was released. There were cinder blocks, a wheelbarrow, and one shovel.

No paint. [/*]

But, but, but Cryme, can't we just say there was paint in the cart so she can call him poor at picking out paint?:cuss:

;)

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 03:48 PM

Originally posted by caejde

Weird how it doesn't say on the distribution that it goes to base PMO but it does in the MarAdmin. [/*]

I looked at it but didn't see the part where the MC is supposed to send it to local LE if the protected one moves off base.

Am I missing something?

:shrug:

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 03:48 PM

Annie, here's the link... scroll to the bottom where the comments are...

http://www.jdnews.com/news/baby_554...y_clothing.html

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 03:49 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

But, but, but Cryme, can't we just say there was paint in the cart so she can call him poor at picking out paint?:cuss:

;) [/*]

Hell, we can call him poor at picking a lot of things. Wheelbarrows, clothes, wives.......

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 03:49 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Well, as long as I'm free to post my opinion, as are you, CANDY -- I'll settle for that.

No tar and feathers for you, my Friend. Maybe just a friendly :punch: among friends, since we seem to keep our friendship in spite of our strong disagreements. Kudos to us on that, imo. :stolen beer: [/*]

Absolutely, and Dave got the \_/\_/ in such a big size we can both fit in them. ;)

So, I can take it and won't need henry's flack jacket either.

I do want justice for Maria and her unborn child more than you know. I have continued to hope Mary will have a good relationship with her surviving children, and I wish no less for her.

That doesn't stop me from analyzing how this all came to be and some of it isn't pretty, simply because LIFE isn't PRETTY and EVIL IS ALWAYS LURKING IMHO. :(

Mimi428

03-16-2008, 03:50 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean
quote:

Hey- I went away to play with some photos on my camera and came back and saw this post. WHAT is this in reference to? I have never seen this before. Someone please explain- [/*]

Annie - my post was made in reference to what Rick Sutherland posted here...

http://www.jdnews.com/news/baby_55479___article.html/autopsy_clothing.html

Below the article, there is the space for comments. A whole bunch were posted that were very critical of Christina & questioning why she had not been arrested, etc.

3/16/08 at 12:13 p.m. - Capt. Sutherland made a very long post - it begins...

This is not a reference to the Maria investigation, but an explanation as to burden of proof in general. Our Office, and law enforcement nationwide, has a duty to proceed ethically and with integrity when we conduct criminal investigations. We have to make sure that we meet standards of proof by collecting evidence by lawful means...

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 03:51 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

So the MC droppedd the ball not telling OCSD that there was a MPO in place. That helped This Case and This Victim how tia???

IF Maria went to CLs house on her own accord, as LE is alleging, how does ANYONE Protect her>

How is a Civilian granted any/more/less/better Protection than the MC provides? I am trying to see this Tragedy from Your perspective. Nothing "FAULTY" about it moo [/*]

ITA. And yeh, I DO understand what you're saying here. :cool:

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 03:53 PM

Originally posted by Sami

I'm glad you brought that up, Dave, as I wanted to include it in with my former post (the one you've quoted).

Wouldn't we all agree it would be nice if Cesar had been considered a 'flight risk' BEFORE he sauntered out of town, sending letters home like a tourist?

And, Jas.S (and all the rest of us) might not be obsessing over the sheet, or the autopsy report, because if the bodies had been found faster, before the burning and decomposition that the burning enhanced, the autopsy would probably read a lot plainer than it does today.

So, to answer your question -- not sharing information did NOT help this case or this victim -- it helped the suspect only! IMO

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0801/14/acd.02.html [/*]

He wouldn't have been considered a flight risk if he were in a civilian courtroom. Why should he have been considered one in the MC?

But hey, if you want to talk about the lack of sharing information, how 'bout that lack of information from Mary Lauterbach about the MPO and the alleged rapist's name? The one that local LE only found out about on 1/7 when they found her car?

Or does that not count?

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 03:55 PM

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 03:56 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

so the drug business in the transcript has nothing to do with CL's house, then? [/*]

Correct - that was just an example he was using to demonstrate what he meant.

People who had made comments before he posted were suggesting Christina's involvement - hence, his response.

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 03:57 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

He wouldn't have been considered a flight risk if he were in a civilian courtroom. Why should he have been considered one in the MC?

But hey, if you want to talk about the lack of sharing information, how 'bout that lack of information from Mary Lauterbach about the MPO and the alleged rapist's name? The one that local LE only found out about on 1/7 when they found her car?

Or does that not count? [/*]

:beer:

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 03:59 PM

Originally posted by Sami

I hope he was 'poor' at picking Onslow County and the Marine Corps to try to make look inept.

I hope both those entities will prevail in the end.

(And, imo, he picked the WRONG victim/sister marine to rape, and her Family just may be his undoing)! :mad: [/*]

He sure did. Even with all the intimidation and harrassment, this young Marine held fast to her charges and the marines were indeed going forth with their version of a Grand Jury, imo.

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Of course Mary's reporting capabilities count, but we need to remember SHE is not the professional -- she is NOT paid to fight crime or to have a nose for sniffing out criminals or to be aware and suspicious of criminal behavior.

She was just a MOTHER, who had a very pregnant daughter who was missing, and she was DESPERATE to get someone to help her find Maria.

I don't think she could ever be held to the professional, technical standard to which NCIS and local LE could be held. JMO [/*]

So just because she's the mother, she's to be excused for not providing the very piece of information that would have led OCSD right to Cesar's front door? On the 19th of December, rather than on the 7th of January?

And instead, the MC and the Sheriff's Department is to be castigated daily for not having the ability to read minds or determine that if Maria says she's not afraid, that she really is afraid.

Gotcha.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean
Can we all agree the pumpkin-looking paint color was perhaps not the best choice for the ONE WALL in the living room, than then GOD HELP US, the garage? Were they really going to paint that garage punpkin color? Because can you imagine driving into a pumpkin colored garage, or even going into one looking thru junk for something? OMG. [/*]

Look, I have always had a problem with people who PAINT around bookcases and to be quite honest until that day I NEVER imagined anyone painting around a rubbermaid tub.

So, even if I was fried up and out, the pumpkin garage would have skeered me. :cool:

And Sami forgets how upset I was about the carseat cover. I wanted the deputies to confiscate it and prosecute both of them if they were putting their child into that seat.

jmo;)

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:02 PM

Originally posted by Sami

You evidently were in such a hurry to find me guilty of wrong word useage, that you didn't see that I had corrected that myself.

But I appreciate your almost obsessive parsing of every word in my posts.

JK :seeya: [/*]

And you corrected it as I was posting.

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 04:02 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES
Maria and her unborn child were victims of a heinous crime and what was done afterward was unthinkable. But to try and paint this in some extraordinary light to fit a cause such as women suffering sexual assault in the military isn't a fit at this point IMHO.

Her own mother expressed concerns about the story she was hearing that day one month later IIRC. She was worried about him and his career in that phone call outside Walmart that she debated answering because Maria called all too frequently. But now, that's all different for some of us because someone might read about things they have said and done. I don't understand that mentality, but if it works for some, then so be it. But nobody has the right to demand you post a certain way other than IS ADMIN and I can't see where I have broken any TOS here.

From what we know Maria had a relationship with this married man and upon finding out he was married things went bad quickly not to mention the addition of finding out she was pregnant.

I don't automatically dismiss her claim, but nor do I automatically give it credence given her history and the situation coupled with the fact she has allegedly given inconsistent statements to the USMC.

I won't even go into the idea that quite possibly she showed up at his home after all this of her own accord after contact with him.

I have never felt guilty about speaking the truth, and I'm not about to start to do so at this point in my life.

I've noticed Nancy Grace is speaking about this case in a very clear and concise manner as well and feels no need to polish it up.

From her March 5th show.

GRACE: Out to Colonel Robin Johnson, retired Marine Corps colonel.

Colonel, I`m stunned. I mean the Marines have taken several black eyes just recently. Number one, you`ve got Cesar Lauren on the run in Mexico after allegedly killing his pregnant lover and her unborn child. Now this.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0803/05/ng.01.html

THE CRIMES COMMITTED in this CASE are HEINOUS ENOUGH, we don't need to make any changes IMHO. :patriot: [/*]

By "truth" are you referring to your opinions on this case?

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:03 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

I looked at it but didn't see the part where the MC is supposed to send it to local LE if the protected one moves off base.

Am I missing something?

:shrug: [/*]

I didn't see it either.

AND

I asked the same thing earlier but mine fell upon deaf ears as well. So I guess we're in a league of our own now. :D

Hey I better go remove some tags too. ;)

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

So just because she's the mother, she's to be excused for not providing the very piece of information that would have led OCSD right to Cesar's front door? On the 19th of December, rather than on the 7th of January?

And instead, the MC and the Sheriff's Department is to be castigated daily for not having the ability to read minds or determine that if Maria says she's not afraid, that she really is afraid.

Gotcha. [/*]

Mary Lauerbach should be excused for everything, because she is the Mother of a murdered Marine and no one should be second guessing what she did at what probably was the worst period in her life. IMO.

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:06 PM

Originally posted by Sami

You forgot to show proof, or add IMO. hammer [/*]

Are we going to start this again today?

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 04:06 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

I didn't see it either.

AND

I asked the same thing earlier but mine fell upon deaf ears as well. So I guess we're in a league of our own now. :D

Hey I better go remove some tags too. ;) [/*]

I've already called and reported you and Cryme for that offense.:o

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:10 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

I've already called and reported you and Cryme for that offense.:o [/*]

TYVM now I have to go and get my tin foil hat for just in case. ;)

Oh and I forgot, I have a rug in my living room too. I better hide it! :biggrin:

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 04:10 PM

I actually got the impression that Mary was not allowed legally to speak of the "incident", which is what she referred to (IMO) as the rape allegation. I believe Uncle Peter called it the same thing.

I noticed their reference to the "incident" in several early interviews that have been posted lately. It is almost as if somebody (NCIS?) advised them that they could not speak of the "incident" to the media or something. I found it odd at the time when I heard it. Now, whether the same applied to sharing with LE, I have no idea (although my opinion would be that they could tell LE, but who knows)

JMO

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:12 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

I didn't see it either.

AND

I asked the same thing earlier but mine fell upon deaf ears as well. So I guess we're in a league of our own now. :D

Hey I better go remove some tags too. ;) [/*]

So is it true that the MC was supposed to forward the MPO to civilian LE or is this just urban legend?

And they're being blamed for something that's not even their responsibility?

:shrug:

Mimi428

03-16-2008, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

But hey, if you want to talk about the lack of sharing information, how 'bout that lack of information from Mary Lauterbach about the MPO and the alleged rapist's name? The one that local LE only found out about on 1/7 when they found her car?

Or does that not count? [/*]

Wow - one day you slam the woman for telling LE that her missing daughter had a past history of lying in specific circumstances. Today you slam the woman for "lack of information".

Talk about can't catch a break. She's damned if she provides information, she's damned if she doesn't.

Civilian LE, the USMC & NCIS have far more options at their disposal to find out information than any regular citizen will EVER have - yet you claim this woman who had to have been under the most extreme duress any parent can imagine was supposed to bear more of a burden for obtaining information about her daughter than either OCSD or the USMC.

There but for the grace of God...

JMO

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

So is it true that the MC was supposed to forward the MPO to civilian LE or is this just urban legend?

And they're being blamed for something that's not even their responsibility?

:shrug: [/*]

I don't know, but I did think long ago and far away there was a link to something that stated the person needing protection was to deliver a copy to LLE if they lived off base and they usually complied. Don't quote me on that, but I believe someone here had that link.

JMO.:patriot:

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

So is it true that the MC was supposed to forward the MPO to civilian LE or is this just urban legend?

And they're being blamed for something that's not even their responsibility?

:shrug: [/*]

I have no personal knowledge of this, but I do remember seeing a link here (a military directive or something) about there being a box or something to check with regards to notifying LLE - my memory is that it was an option, not a requirement, but I could be wrong about that.

JMO as I don't have the link!

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 04:17 PM

Originally posted by Sami

I hope he was 'poor' at picking Onslow County and the Marine Corps to try to make look inept.

I hope both those entities will prevail in the end.

(And, imo, he picked the WRONG victim/sister marine to allegedly rape, and her Family just may be his undoing)! :mad: [/*]

Sam, you didn't have to go back and correct your statement to read "allegedly rape"....if it's your opinion, as you stated in this post, that laurean is a rapist that is perfectly okay. I agree with you. In my opinion cesar laurean raped Maria, just like she said he did.

I believe the murder victim in this case, not the murderer who fled the scene.

caejde

03-16-2008, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

So is it true that the MC was supposed to forward the MPO to civilian LE or is this just urban legend?

And they're being blamed for something that's not even their responsibility?

:shrug: [/*]

here is what the MPO looks like. Sorry I didn't get a chance to respond...I was doing dishes and laundry.

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/eforms/dd2873.pdf

In box 4, you will see where it says "The protected person has also been issued the following court orders:" Then it goes on to list a civilian protective order and just a general order issued. So, in my opinion, Maria would have to have already had a civilian protective order against Cesar. Because this box is for them to put the type of order, the date it was issued, the court it was issued, the county and the state.

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by gaelicpeas

I have no personal knowledge of this, but I do remember seeing a link here (a military directive or something) about there being a box or something to check with regards to notifying LLE - my memory is that it was an option, not a requirement, but I could be wrong about that.

JMO as I don't have the link! [/*]

I think you're right about that, it's was up to the discretion of the unit command as so many things in this case apparently were.

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by Mimi428

Wow - one day you slam the woman for telling LE that her missing daughter had a past history of lying in specific circumstances. Today you slam the woman for "lack of information".

Talk about can't catch a break. She's damned if she provides information, she's damned if she doesn't.

Civilian LE, the USMC & NCIS have far more options at their disposal to find out information than any regular citizen will EVER have - yet you claim this woman who had to have been under the most extreme duress any parent can imagine was supposed to bear more of a burden for obtaining information about her daughter than either OCSD or the USMC.

There but for the grace of God...

JMO [/*]

Because telling LE that her daughter had a history of lying is one thing - if you believe that she left on her own and is merely waiting it out somewhere because she might be upset.

But when you come out AFTER THE FACT, trying to rewrite history, and talk about "you voiced your fears from day 1", retelling phone conversations where you claim that you told your daughter "you shouldn't have to do that, you've got a restraining order", and yet LE has to find out this information a month later (by accident), then I think you've got a problem with credibility. And that's MY OPINION.

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:21 PM

Originally posted by caejde

here is what the MPO looks like. Sorry I didn't get a chance to respond...I was doing dishes and laundry.

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/eforms/dd2873.pdf

In box 4, you will see where it says "The protected person has also been issued the following court orders:" Then it goes on to list a civilian protective order and just a general order issued. So, in my opinion, Maria would have to have already had a civilian protective order against Cesar. Because this box is for them to put the type of order, the date it was issued, the court it was issued, the county and the state. [/*]

So there's nothing that requires the MC to forward the MPO to local LE?

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 04:23 PM

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:23 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

So is it true that the MC was supposed to forward the MPO to civilian LE or is this just urban legend?

And they're being blamed for something that's not even their responsibility?

:shrug: [/*]

When I looked at the forms that both Lynn and strick provided links to, the only thing civilian that I saw was about whether the protected person had filed a civilian protection order, if so from when to when and which court and county/state where the CPO had been filed.

But I have seen no such box that indicates whether the protected person requests the MPO to be sent to civilian LLE that is unless it can be put in #5 (i)'s box: Other specific provisions of this order.

JMO

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:26 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Exactly, if that last conversation with the stern tone about giving the baby up is to be believed, she was discussing relevant information at that time with Maria and IMO it would have been transmitted through the channels from Vandalia to OCSD.

JMO tho.:patriot: [/*]

At this point, WTH even knows what the last conversation was about? Was she in labor? Was she going to the Christmas party? Was it a normal conversation? Was she talking about places to eat dinner the next week when Mary came? Were they arguing about adoption?

I mean, they've all been preceeded by the words "The last time Mary spoke with her daughter on 12/14 at 2:30.....(fill in the blank).

crymeariver2006

03-16-2008, 04:29 PM

Originally posted by Sami

It was within their discretion to do so. They thought he was NOT a threat and NOT a flight risk.

Faulty Discretion, imo. [/*]

If you don't mind, will you look at the links where caejde and strick posted with an actual MPO and tell me where it says anything about them (discretion or otherwise) forwarding it to local law enforcement?

TIA

caejde

03-16-2008, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

If you don't mind, will you look at the links where caejde and strick posted with an actual MPO and tell me where it says anything about them (discretion or otherwise) forwarding it to local law enforcement?

TIA [/*]

According to my interpretation, Maria would have already had to have had a CPO to give to the commanding officer when he/she was filing an MPO. But of course JMO.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

At this point, WTH even knows what the last conversation was about? Was she in labor? Was she going to the Christmas party? Was it a normal conversation? Was she talking about places to eat dinner the next week when Mary came? Were they arguing about adoption?

I mean, they've all been preceeded by the words "The last time Mary spoke with her daughter on 12/14 at 2:30.....(fill in the blank). [/*]

Am I really the only one here who remembers this conversation about how a person needing protection can go to local LE and they will likely give the same credence to the order?

I know there was a link and can't think of where it came from. :o

jmo

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 04:39 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

Shall I make popcorn?

will this tiff be short-lived?

will it get this thread locked?

...there's your suspense....

jmo [/*]

A (Fricking) Men!!!

Enough is enough, we're surely gonna be locked down if it keeps up. :cuss:

caejde

03-16-2008, 04:39 PM

I'm currently reading the Marine Corps Order...again...to see what it says about the MPO being sent to local authorities. Haven't gotten to the MPO's yet.

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 04:41 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

Ah, I see. Well reading the whole friggin thing made all the difference in the world LOL. Clear now. Thanks!

You know every village has an idiot, and obviously I am the village idiot of this forum.:rolleyes: sorry to be so slow. [/*]

Oh no, Annie, I will happily take the award for Village Idiot on here. I admit, much of the time I read posts and I am sitting here shaking my head wondering WHAT in the world are they discussing that for?.....what does THAT have to do with the murder? I basically chalk it up to (as always :( ) NO real news.

Maka

03-16-2008, 04:41 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

So is it true that the MC was supposed to forward the MPO to civilian LE or is this just urban legend?

And they're being blamed for something that's not even their responsibility?

:shrug: [/*]

Here's something regarding MOUs and notifiying civilian LE is required for domestic violence at the bottom of page 8

Then you have to read their definition of domestic abuse and domestic violence at page 2 and I don't think Maria and CL fit in that category...not even under (the letter after a) since Gabriel was not born yet. moo

http://www.usmc-mccs.org/LeadersGuide/sourcedocs/Domestic%20Abuse%20-%20Campise.doc

I wish we knew if she was advised to go to get a civil protective order.

Babes

03-16-2008, 04:41 PM

Good Afternoon,

Is it posted anywhere if they did a foresic test on the baby clothes in a melted plastic bag? Can they still look for fingerprints on the clothes or any items that didnt get burned completely? If Christina is is Innocent- then i wouldnt expect her fingerprints to be in any of the items in there IMO.

I would be interested to know - why this melted plastic bag w/ baby clothes in there needs to be buried with the body ...I dont think that if someone will be forcing Maria inside the house needs to carry that bag with baby clothes inside. IMO it should have been left inside Maria's car if she was taken by force . But then again where did these baby clothes came from?

This Link shows "baby clothes in a melted plastic bag " :
http://www.witntv.com/home/headlines/16715851.html

Regina.Lampert

03-16-2008, 04:42 PM

Lynn Gweeny

03-16-2008, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by caejde
I'm currently reading the Marine Corps Order...again...to see what it says about the MPO being sent to local authorities. Haven't gotten to the MPO's yet. [/*]

If you don't mind, also see if there's anything in the protocol for when there is an MPO in place, what steps are required to be taken if either the alleged perp or the alleged victim move off base and remain in the same general locale, or even if either is deployed (as in the unit they are both assigned) off base to another base, foreign territory, etc. TIA

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:44 PM

Originally posted by Sami

I most certainly read their posts already. And I appreciated their info.

I also posted what a Retired Navy JAG had to say about the MPO being sent to local LE.

There was NO protocol in place -- leaving it up to the discretion of the MC.

But the Retired Navy JAG placed the blame solidly with the MC. He said the onus was on the Corps to get that MPO to local LE.

Don't shoot the messenger -- I'm just posting what the Retired Navy JAG stated on national television.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRI.../14/acd.02.html [/*]

Okay Sami, since you've posted what the retired JAG said, let's suppose the MC did forward Maria's MPO, and if they did, wonder if the MPO went to JPD instead of OCSD? Would the responsibility then be shifted to JPD to shuttle it over to OCSD? (just speculating, not saying this happened in any way, shape or form)

Either way, whether the MC did or did not send the MPO to the civilian LE doesn't change the fact that Maria was murdered, buried and burned in CAL's backyard. There is clearly a NOTE (in bold lettering under where the names are listed) on the MPO where the Protected Person's name could be omitted if the Service Member named in #1 would endanger the Protected Person.

That's plain as day in the MPO links that Lynn, strick and caejde posted.

JMO

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 04:44 PM

Originally posted by Babes
Good Afternoon,

Is it posted anywhere if they did a foresic test on the baby clothes in a melted plastic bag? Can they still look for fingerprints on the clothes or any items that didnt get burned completely? If Christina is is Innocent- then i wouldnt expect her fingerprints to be in any of the items in there IMO.

I would be interested to know - why this melted plastic bag w/ baby clothes in there needs to be buried with the body ...I dont think that if someone will be forcing Maria inside the house needs to carry that bag with baby clothes inside. IMO it should have been left inside Maria's car if she was taken by force . But then again where did these baby clothes came from?

This Link shows "baby clothes in a melted plastic bag " :
http://www.witntv.com/home/headlines/16715851.html [/*]

The item of baby clothing is a complete mystery to me. As I have posted. Very strange.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:50 PM

Originally posted by Lynn Gweeny

If you don't mind, also see if there's anything in the protocol for when there is an MPO in place, what steps are required to be taken if either the alleged perp or the alleged victim move off base and remain in the same general locale, or even if either is deployed (as in the unit they are both assigned) off base to another base, foreign territory, etc. TIA [/*]

Lynn, in looking at your link: http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/...orms/dd2873.pdf , the only thing I see referred to on an actual MPO is under #5 (bee) and (c):

bee. The above-named service member shall remain at all times and places at least ________ feet away from the above-named protected person and members of the protected person's family or household including, but not limited to, residences and workplaces. Members of the protected person's family or household include:
DD FORM 2873 (BACK), JUL 2004

c. The above-named service member will vacate the military residence shared by the parties located at:

But it doesn't use the specific term 'civilian' in those two boxes.

gaelicpeas

03-16-2008, 04:50 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

RL- you're crakin' me up today girl

IMO the baby clothes were from Cesar, given to ML while she was in his house just prior to Christina arriving on the scene.IMO
and I repeat, IMO. [/*]

This is sorta the way I am leaning on the baby clothing, Annie. I wish the ME's report would have described the baby clothing more (like, was it monogrammed with "Daddy's little boy"?) :eek:

JMO and pure speculation, obviously.

donna

03-16-2008, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by crymeariver2006

Because telling LE that her daughter had a history of lying is one thing - if you believe that she left on her own and is merely waiting it out somewhere because she might be upset.

But when you come out AFTER THE FACT, trying to rewrite history, and talk about "you voiced your fears from day 1", retelling phone conversations where you claim that you told your daughter "you shouldn't have to do that, you've got a restraining order", and yet LE has to find out this information a month later (by accident), then I think you've got a problem with credibility. And that's MY OPINION. [/*]

Hi, cryme!

I am hesitant to jump in here because of the tone of the board today, but I have to get this out of my system.

Yes, Mary knew there was an MPO naming Cesar. Was the MPO information not included in Mary's original email to LE? Did Mary mention to LE that CAL was accused in raping her daughter? I would have immediately brought CAL's name into it if I thought my daughter was missing and had not left of her own accord!

I have also seen two different versions of Mary's last conversations with Maria. One was 'normal', and one has Maria getting upset. The first version was with 'stern' language from Mary. Too many conflicting statements from Mary, IMO.

Mary did include the 'compulsive lying' and 'bipolar' statement in the email to LE. I believe that is why Sheriff Brown made the remark in a PC for Maria to come back. I do not blame SB for that because of the things Mary said in the email.

I have lost a child myself. I have very deep sympathy for anyone who has. However, having said that, I do have to also say that I do not understand Mary at all. As has been stated - you cannot unring a bell.

I feel that Maria was being pressured too much by Mary and her uncle. Period. They wanted Maria to give her baby up and were doing everything within their power to make sure she did. If Maria wanted to keep her baby, she had to have been extremely stressed by her mother and uncle wanting her to give Gabriel up.

Now. This is my opinion. This is what I get from all I have seen in Mary's statements in videos and interviews. I feel Mary is tormented and will forever be tormented by her words. She has my sympathy for having lost a child that she will forever grieve for.

I agree with you, cryme. And I have a healthy respect for all posters and their opinions and a genuine fondness for some I know do not agree with me.

Sorry, but I finally had to get this out of my system. And it is all 'My Opinion Only'.

Babes

03-16-2008, 04:54 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

The item of baby clothing is a complete mystery to me. As I have posted. Very strange. [/*]

I agree.

Babes

03-16-2008, 04:55 PM

Originally posted by Sami

When I placed my request with the NC Medical Examiner, I asked for Maria's autopsy and her Baby's autopsy.

I only received Maria's, with the info about the Baby included with her report.

I'm assuming it might have to do with NC not recognizing Gabriel as being born; thus, he's considered a fetus, I guess.

JMO [/*]

Thanks Sami,

I understand about the fetus and the law but the clothing is an item and any item found by the body should be investigated for any prints and sources as it could lead to "people" - not just one person - who throw that bag in the pit.

caejde

03-16-2008, 04:57 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

Lynn, in looking at your link: http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/...orms/dd2873.pdf , the only thing I see referred to on an actual MPO is under #5 (bee) and (c):

bee. The above-named service member shall remain at all times and places at least ________ feet away from the above-named protected person and members of the protected person's family or household including, but not limited to, residences and workplaces. Members of the protected person's family or household include:
DD FORM 2873 (BACK), JUL 2004

c. The above-named service member will vacate the military residence shared by the parties located at:

But it doesn't use the specific term 'civilian' in those two boxes. [/*]

And as far as "C" goes...that would apply if Maria and Cesar lived in the same barracks...which they did not.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 04:57 PM

Originally posted by donna

Hi, cryme!

I am hesitant to jump in here because of the tone of the board today, but I have to get this out of my system.

Yes, Mary knew there was an MPO naming Cesar. Was the MPO information not included in Mary's original email to LE? Did Mary mention to LE that CAL was accused in raping her daughter? I would have immediately brought CAL's name into it if I thought my daughter was missing and had not left of her own accord!

I have also seen two different versions of Mary's last conversations with Maria. One was 'normal', and one has Maria getting upset. The first version was with 'stern' language from Mary. Too many conflicting statements from Mary, IMO.

Mary did include the 'compulsive lying' and 'bipolar' statement in the email to LE. I believe that is why Sheriff Brown made the remark in a PC for Maria to come back. I do not blame SB for that because of the things Mary said in the email.

I have lost a child myself. I have very deep sympathy for anyone who has. However, having said that, I do have to also say that I do not understand Mary at all. As has been stated - you cannot unring a bell.

I feel that Maria was being pressured too much by Mary and her uncle. Period. They wanted Maria to give her baby up and were doing everything within their power to make sure she did. If Maria wanted to keep her baby, she had to have been extremely stressed by her mother and uncle wanting her to give Gabriel up.

Now. This is my opinion. This is what I get from all I have seen in Mary's statements in videos and interviews. I feel Mary is tormented and will forever be tormented by her words. She has my sympathy for having lost a child that she will forever grieve for.

I agree with you, cryme. And I have a healthy respect for all posters and their opinions and a genuine fondness for some I know do not agree with me.

Sorry, but I finally had to get this out of my system. And it is all 'My Opinion Only'. [/*]

Very well stated and I just want to say I admire your ability to hang in here and be objective having lost a child. My thoughts are with you Donna. :rose:

Do you by any chance remember the publication that addressed the person seeking protection taking it to LLE? We all pretty much agreed that this shouldn't fall on the shoulders of a person who may have just suffered a rape, but there was a link here IIRC.

JMO.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:57 PM

gp: To answer your question about the questions to RS, I have not heard anything yet. I don't know if that's good or bad. :(

Babes

03-16-2008, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by AnnieBean

Irregardless of NC's views on Gabriel, they would have checked the bag of baby clothing for fingerprints if it was in any condition to be checked. Could have been way too compromised, but who knows if they read the size off the plastic and not the tag in the clothing. Seems like the plastic would melt before the tag would burn. Just IMO. [/*]

They could see the tag as 0-3 so i am assuming that bag/clothing is not completely burned so fingerprints or any forensic test should be done on those items.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by caejde

And as far as "C" goes...that would apply if Maria and Cesar lived in the same barracks...which they did not. [/*]

I know, I just put there because it said something about housing, that's all.

caejde

03-16-2008, 04:59 PM

Interesting that I just found that March 2007 was Sexual Assualt Awareness month in the Marine Corps.

BTW, I didn't find anything in the MCO about the MPO. Just said that it was to be issued if needed. I will keep researching. May or may not be today.

caejde

03-16-2008, 05:00 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

I know, I just put there because it said something about housing, that's all. [/*]

Oh, I know, I was just adding my 2 cents...

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:01 PM

Lynn Gweeny

03-16-2008, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

Okay Sami, since you've posted what the retired JAG said, let's suppose the MC did forward Maria's MPO, and if they did, wonder if the MPO went to JPD instead of OCSD? Would the responsibility then be shifted to JPD to shuttle it over to OCSD? (just speculating, not saying this happened in any way, shape or form)

Either way, whether the MC did or did not send the MPO to the civilian LE doesn't change the fact that Maria was murdered, buried and burned in CAL's backyard. There is clearly a NOTE (in bold lettering under where the names are listed) on the MPO where the Protected Person's name could be omitted if the Service Member named in #1 would endanger the Protected Person.

That's plain as day in the MPO links that Lynn, strick and caejde posted.

JMO [/*]

I agree that information about the MPO would have had no effect on Maria's eventual murder; however, knowing there was an MPO in place and that the person named was Cesar Laurean could possibly have been a factor in whether he would be in Mexico right now. That's why what D.A. Dewey Hudson said in an interview on FOX that "if we maybe had done some things different, we would, he wouldn’t be maybe in Mexico that he’d be behind me in Onslow County jail" is why I hold that opinion about knowing about the MPO, even post murder. JMO

http://tinyurl.com/2klk8w

Just looking at the timeline of events, is it clear WHEN the OCSD investigators had Laurean's name? We've heard both sides give different dates, December 19th (Cicarrelli), January 7th (Sheriff Brown).

To their credit, OCSD, once they found Maria's car and the MPO in it, they went into high gear and DID focus on Laurean, wanting to speak with him on the 8th of January. They met with him at the base with NCIS and he declined to answer any questions.

In reading many of the posts here, what seems to be the theme is .... why were there no red flags being observed by anyone when Laurean, after meeting with OCSD on the 8th of January, was now taking off on the 9th and 10th, which from all accounts was different from his usual reporting for duty which led to him not being considered a 'flight risk'. Did no one have a thought that hmmmm, we've got this MPO now, (plus whatever else they had ?possible ATM photos being scrutinized), and the question being asked is .... what was being done to monitor Laurean's comings and goings, talking with neighbors for anything that seemed unusual, or even looking into probable cause for a SW of the house, etc.

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by old_lady

It will be. It was recovered at a homicide scene. jmoo [/*]

They should have the results by now - if they did :)

Howiefan

03-16-2008, 05:04 PM

Originally posted by gaelicpeas
I actually got the impression that Mary was not allowed legally to speak of the "incident", which is what she referred to (IMO) as the rape allegation. I believe Uncle Peter called it the same thing.

I noticed their reference to the "incident" in several early interviews that have been posted lately. It is almost as if somebody (NCIS?) advised them that they could not speak of the "incident" to the media or something. I found it odd at the time when I heard it. Now, whether the same applied to sharing with LE, I have no idea (although my opinion would be that they could tell LE, but who knows)

JMO [/*]

I thought the same thing

donna

03-16-2008, 05:04 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Very well stated and I just want to say I admire your ability to hang in here and be objective having lost a child. My thoughts are with you Donna. :rose:

Do you by any chance remember the publication that addressed the person seeking protection taking it to LLE? We all pretty much agreed that this shouldn't fall on the shoulders of a person who may have just suffered a rape, but there was a link here IIRC.

JMO. [/*]

Thank you, CANDY. I appreciate the rose.

No, I do not remember that publication.
I also do not feel Maria was afraid of CAL, and I feel she went to his house of her own volition on that fateful day. I feel her UVA should have advised Maria (or done it herself) to file the protective order with the local sheriff's office as well as the local police department as she was moving off base.

:rose: ... For Maria and Baby Gabriel - may justice prevail in their murder.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 05:05 PM

Originally posted by dave sargent

<snipped>

That someone/some entity is to Blame for Maria's brutal Murder. MOO - CL is THE ONLY ONE TO BLAME. [/*]

On this dave, you and I agree wholeheartedly! Cesar Armando Laurean and all his other aliases is the one to blame (allegedly and NO ONE misconstrue my meaning of the term allegedly---it's only there because he hasn't been tried and found guilty---YET).

JMO

IvySterling

03-16-2008, 05:08 PM

Originally posted by Babes

They could see the tag as 0-3 so i am assuming that bag/clothing is not completely burned so fingerprints or any forensic test should be done on those items. [/*]
Any further examination such as forensic testing on items found with the body the ME will turn over to the proper Lab.

IMO, MO, MY View/Thoughts

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:09 PM

Originally posted by old_lady

It could be contained in the SBI crime scene report. jmoo

It would be separate from the Autopsy report. imo [/*]

Of course :tongue:

donna

03-16-2008, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Great post, donna. Very well stated, imo.

And I am sorry about your loss, my Friend. :rose: [/*]

Thank you so much, dear Sami! I appreciate you!

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by IvySterling

Any further examination such as forensic testing on items found with the body the ME will turn over to the proper Lab.

IMO, MO, MY View/Thoughts [/*]

And i hope this was actually done :)

caejde

03-16-2008, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by donna

Thank you, CANDY. I appreciate the rose.

No, I do not remember that publication.
I also do not feel Maria was afraid of CAL, and I feel she went to his house of her own volition on that fateful day. I feel her UVA should have advised Maria (or done it herself) to file the protective order with the local sheriff's office as well as the local police department as she was moving off base.

:rose: ... For Maria and Baby Gabriel - may justice prevail in their murder. [/*]

Speaking of UVA's...found out that they usually pick 2...have to be of a certain rank. They go through sexual assault training and they have to meet other qualifications. Same as with what they term a SARC-Sexual Assault Response Coordinator. They are also appointed and have to have a rank of LtCol or higher and there are certain conditions they have to meet as well-they are not the XO, CO...but someone out of the chain of command. They assist the commanders.

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:12 PM

donna

03-16-2008, 05:15 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

On this dave, you and I agree wholeheartedly! Cesar Armando Laurean and all his other aliases is the one to blame (allegedly and NO ONE misconstrue my meaning of the term allegedly---it's only there because he hasn't been tried and found guilty---YET).

JMO [/*]

Hi, nuttin. YET being the operative word! I wonder what the POS is doing today.

I continue to remain absolutely sick AND furious about all that he did to Maria and Gabriel. I hope he never has another moments peace wherever he might be!

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 05:15 PM

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 05:18 PM

donna

03-16-2008, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by Babes

no fingerprint testing? [/*]

Fingerprints can be picked up very easily on plastc bags. Fingerprints are escentially caused by the natural oils in your fingers. I wonder if the bag having been partially melted or having been exposed to such high heat would cause the prints to not be clear enough to be usuable.

Got any thoughts on this one, Old Lady?

donna

03-16-2008, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

I am so sorry for your loss, Donna. :rose: [/*]

Oh, SS, thank you.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 05:22 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Well, where the MC would have sent the MPO would probably have been determined by her address off base.

When she took out her FIRST MPO, she was living on base. When she moved off base, she had an address under County jurisdiction, IIRC.

If the Corps had sent the MPO to J'ville city police, I'm assuming they would have done with it exactly what Ohio did with the Missing Persons Report that was filed, by Mary, with the Ohio LE.

Once jurisdiction is figured out, sometimes LE still doesn't want to share info. That puts all of us at risk, imo.

Here is some more of the AC360 show, where he asks CNN's Senior Legal Analyst about the lack of cooperation:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0801/14/acd.02.html [/*]

I know what you're saying Sami, but I was trying to point out that there could have been a mistake, if, the MC sent the MPO to JPD (and that's an easy mistake to do since county/city jurisdiction gets confusing). And I can't see where the MC has the option to send the MPO to the civilians per their form.

But I think we all agree no MPO was shared with any civilian LE. I do however think the MC perceived Maria's missing as merely her being UA and never thought to look at Laurean, which could have been a mistake (as this case shows).

In my mind, if a MPO or a TRO is issued they aren't worth the paper they are written on if no one is going to enforce them. And if a person wants to get to the person protected they can and will.

JMO

donna

03-16-2008, 05:23 PM

Will do, Sami!

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 05:27 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Nuttin, that is poster-bashing!

No fair you are only giving them to dave. [/*]

Would you like some too?

donna

03-16-2008, 05:29 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Not once the bag is melted, though, Donna.

I was very sadenned when I read your post about your child. That has to be a pain that can never go away. I am very sorry. [/*]

Thank you, Jas.

I thought the bag was just partially melted.

Maka

03-16-2008, 05:32 PM

Originally posted by donna

Fingerprints can be picked up very easily on plastc bags. Fingerprints are escentially caused by the natural oils in your fingers. I wonder if the bag having been partially melted or having been exposed to such high heat would cause the prints to not be clear enough to be usuable.

Got any thoughts on this one, Old Lady? [/*]

I'm not OL but .... The SBI might choose to have the bag fumed at a later date.

IvySterling

03-16-2008, 05:33 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

I am going to disagree with you on that, Ivy.

ME's report said the melted bag/baby item, ML's clothing found with the baby item, the sheet and the comforter were bagged and sent to be tested for an accelerant.

That's all the forensic testing that will be done on those. [/*]

Maybe I watch too much T.V. or read too much about crime :)

I thought anything the ME finds, (for example a bullet, fragment, clothing, etc) pertaining to a corpse that may need to be examined will be sent to a Forensics lab :shrug:

donna

03-16-2008, 05:37 PM

Originally posted by Maka

I'm not OL but .... The SBI might choose to have the bag fumed at a later date. [/*]

It would be good if they did, Maka! LE probably did attend the autopsy and took all evidence at that point in order to preserve it. I hope that fuming will work!

Maka

03-16-2008, 05:38 PM

Originally posted by Maka

Here's something regarding MOUs and notifiying civilian LE is required for domestic violence at the bottom of page 8

Then you have to read their definition of domestic abuse and domestic violence at page 2 and I don't think Maria and CL fit in that category...not even under (the letter after a) since Gabriel was not born yet. moo

http://www.usmc-mccs.org/LeadersGuide/sourcedocs/Domestic%20Abuse%20-%20Campise.doc

I wish we knew if she was advised to go to get a civil protective order. [/*]

The MOU and how sharing the MPO happens....who sends what to whom and what the civilian side should do and what the military side should do.
http://www.ncdsv.org/ncd_military_dtfdv.html

alter ego

03-16-2008, 05:38 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

The item of baby clothing is a complete mystery to me. As I have posted. Very strange. [/*]
ITA

Maka

03-16-2008, 05:41 PM

Originally posted by donna

It would be good if they did, Maka! LE probably did attend the autopsy and took all evidence at that point in order to preserve it. I hope that fuming will work! [/*]

I think you're absolutely right!

(I know I've done my share of "fuming" over this. :flamemad: )

hinman

03-16-2008, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by IvySterling

Maybe I watch too much T.V. or read too much about crime :)

I thought anything the ME finds, (for example a bullet, fragment, clothing, etc) pertaining to a corpse that may need to be examined will be sent to a Forensics lab :shrug: [/*]Hey Ivy trying to get caught up. I always thought that to but when they said they didn't send the shoe I was like:shrug:

donna

03-16-2008, 05:44 PM

Originally posted by Maka

I think you're absolutely right!

(I know I've done my share of "fuming" over this. :flamemad: ) [/*]

Me too, Maka, me too!

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:44 PM

Why is NE ( Nation Enquirer and other tabloids ) not going after looking for Christina's picture? :D

This is a half body blurred pic of her :
http://www3.pictures.zimbio.com/img/82e1/okichabbii/3m.jpg

donna

03-16-2008, 05:48 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S
The strange thing about that baby item in bag thing, is why LE sent that to the ME, of all things. Why that wasn't sent to forensics. Same as with the bag of dirt they included in the body bag. [/*]

The evidence was removed from the pit with the body. It was transported with the body to the ME at which point LE would have been there to document it. This would preserve the 'chain' of evidence. LE would also be present at the autopsy. This is all MOO.

alter ego

03-16-2008, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

I am going to disagree with you on that, Ivy.

ME's report said the melted bag/baby item, ML's clothing found with the baby item, the sheet and the comforter were bagged and sent to be tested for an accelerant.

That's all the forensic testing that will be done on those. [/*]
I don't recall the ME stating that tests for an accelerant would be the ONLY ones done.

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 05:52 PM

I keep thinking about that baby item too, and I really don't think Cesar bought that; that's my instinctive feeling on it.

It does, though, seem like some sort of message that it was placed in the grave with Maria and the baby.

Babes

03-16-2008, 05:53 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Donna, but LE doesn't usually send evidence to the ME.

They usually send it to be analyzed. And that would not alter the chain of evidence.

I have no idea why the dirt and the bag with baby clothes was sent to ME. I really don't.

Never have seen that before. [/*]

i see your point. why send it to ME when they will not do anything with it :)

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 05:59 PM

For anyone wanting to know about GentleBreeze's youngest daughter, she is tolerating her pain and is on crutches. She goes back to the hospital tomorrow AM.

GB can't get online right now due to a computer problem and wanted to thank everyone for their good thoughts and prayers.

Her other daughter who lives in Atlanta was in the parking garage they show on TV fifteen minutes prior to the collapse buying hockey tickets.

Just letting you know. :seeya:

jmo

donna

03-16-2008, 06:00 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

It just makes no sense at all.

ME does the autopsy. Why send anything else other than the body to him/her? [/*]

I think it was done this way because it was in the pit with Maria and was removed with her body. Remember that the ME also has to cut clothing off of bodies and do scrapings of the skin sometimes as well as the scrapings from the nails. All of this is sent to forensics form the ME.

I do understand what you are saying, tho, Jas.. Had Maria been found out in the open and not in a grave, the evidence such as the baby clothing and bagged would have just been bagged by forensics people at the scene.

I could be very wrong, but that is how I see it.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 06:03 PM

Originally posted by Babes
Why is NE ( Nation Enquirer and other tabloids ) not going after looking for Christina's picture? :D

This is a half body blurred pic of her :
http://www3.pictures.zimbio.com/img/82e1/okichabbii/3m.jpg [/*]

Evidently they don't think she's newsworthy enough (along with other news media outlets). As far as I can tell, she hasn't had an alien baby, YET. :eek: (Just trying to lighten up the seriousness today)

And there are many more pictures of CSL out there, ALL blurred too.

RS of OCSD has stated that it is OCSD's policy NOT to release any photo of a cooperating witness. The only way they will release a photo is if someone is arrested.

But let me ask this: What is going to be proved even if we see a picture of CSL? Is showing her face going to prove that she's both blind and stupid not to know about what her husband allegedly did or will it prove she isn't blind or stupid as to what her husband allegedly did? :shrug:

JMO

donna

03-16-2008, 06:06 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

Evidently they don't think she's newsworthy enough (along with other news media outlets). As far as I can tell, she hasn't had an alien baby, YET. :eek: (Just trying to lighten up the seriousness today)

And there are many more pictures of CSL out there, ALL blurred too.

RS of OCSD has stated that it is OCSD's policy NOT to release any photo of a cooperating witness. The only way they will release a photo is if someone is arrested.

But let me ask this: What is going to be proved even if we see a picture of CSL? Is showing her face going to prove that she's both blind and stupid not to know about what her husband allegedly did or will it prove she isn't blind or stupid as to what her husband allegedly did? :shrug:

JMO [/*]

Hi, nuttin!

LOL at the alien baby thing!

I think it is just curiousity - I know it is on my part! Nothing at all could be proven by a pic of Christina being published!

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 06:06 PM

strick10

03-16-2008, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES
For anyone wanting to know about GentleBreeze's youngest daughter, she is tolerating her pain and is on crutches. She goes back to the hospital tomorrow AM.

GB can't get online right now due to a computer problem and wanted to thank everyone for their good thoughts and prayers.

Her other daughter who lives in Atlanta was in the parking garage they show on TV fifteen minutes prior to the collapse buying hockey tickets.

Just letting you know. :seeya:

jmo [/*]

Thanks for the update. My thoughts are w/ GW.

Babes

03-16-2008, 06:10 PM

Originally posted by nuttintodo

But let me ask this: What is going to be proved even if we see a picture of CSL? Is showing her face going to prove that she's both blind and stupid not to know about what her husband allegedly did or will it prove she isn't blind or stupid as to what her husband allegedly did? :shrug:

JMO [/*]

Who knows - maybe she looks like Maria and when her picture comes out - the sales ticket person will recognize her face and says - oh this is the woman who bought that ticket :chicken: :chicken:

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 06:12 PM

strick10

03-16-2008, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by Babes

Who knows - maybe she looks like Maria and when her picture comes out - the sales ticket person will recognize her face and says - oh this is the woman who bought that ticket :chicken: :chicken: [/*]

MW5 has viewed a picture of CSL and said she didn't look anything like Maria. She said CSL was kind of plain. Didn't know if you knew that.....

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

For real.

What besides purient interest and noseyness do we get out of seeing her unblurred features? :confused: [/*]

#2 POST OF THE DAY.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by BarbraAllen

Oh my that family has really been through it this weekend. I am so glad her daughter in Atlanta is safe. And again the dog fight injury just gives me chills, I am so happy she survived that and will recover.

Thank you for posting this; I had been hoping for an update. [/*]

Strick and Barb thanks, and anyone else reading, now we just have to figure out how to get her PC to do a command function on XP.

I sent her DIL a note asking her to do a boot disk, but if you know GB, you know this is driving her nutso. She does everything online. :cool:

jmo

Maka

03-16-2008, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by donna

I think it was done this way because it was in the pit with Maria and was removed with her body. Remember that the ME also has to cut clothing off of bodies and do scrapings of the skin sometimes as well as the scrapings from the nails. All of this is sent to forensics form the ME.

I do understand what you are saying, tho, Jas.. Had Maria been found out in the open and not in a grave, the evidence such as the baby clothing and bagged would have just been bagged by forensics people at the scene.

I could be very wrong, but that is how I see it. [/*]

I think that's the right track...because there could also be particles of bone and whatever else in the folds of the bag and inside it for the ME to separate and identify.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 06:17 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Thanks so much, CANDY. I hope she gets good news tomorrow. [/*]

YW.:seeya:

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 06:17 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Yep, Candy.

The "from day one" thing is really lame after she told LE and the public that her daughter had a history of compulsive lying and that you believe she's upset and off somewhere. [/*]

Hi Jas, I am trying to remember the wording of that statement about lying but I thought the conflict/confusion resulting from it was that Mary said something like "occasional history of compulsive lying." Another one of these situations where the interpretation of the words can be so difficult.

And again, another "Mary said" this, so it would go to Mary's credibility as to whether or not we accept it as truth.

I become confused because some posters talk about Mary rewriting history. Yet it seems they may pick and choose which things Mary said that are decided to become "truth and fact."

Babes

03-16-2008, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by strick10

MW5 has viewed a picture of CSL and said she didn't look anything like Maria. She said CSL was kind of plain. Didn't know if you knew that..... [/*]

Hi strick5 - i could create a name here and says i saw her picture and she look exactly like Maria - would you also believe that?

Sorry MW5 - nothing negative on you or not i dont believe you but without a "link" or proof" then that is still just a hearsay :)

alter ego

03-16-2008, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

It just makes no sense at all.

ME does the autopsy. Why send anything else other than the body to him/her? [/*]
uh...because the ME in NC are responsible for making sure there is an adequate investigation

hinman

03-16-2008, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Strick and Barb thanks, and anyone else reading, now we just have to figure out how to get her PC to do a command function on XP.

I sent her DIL a note asking her to do a boot disk, but if you know GB, you know this is driving her nutso. She does everything online. :cool:

jmo [/*]Thanks Candy for the update. Tell GB I am thinking of her.

I have no idea on the PC I do not even know how to upload photos. I am just not very computer savvy.:rose:

alter ego

03-16-2008, 06:20 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

278 times.

You want actual dates? [/*]Yeah

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 06:22 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

For real.

What besides purient interest and noseyness do we get out of seeing her unblurred features? :confused: [/*]

Seeing her would help with the theory several posters have had about Cesar possibly having fallen in love with Maria. Maria was younger. Was she prettier? Smarter? More fun?
I always think it makes everything more interesting to see the people who are involved and I don't think that has to be classified as "prurient." She is very much a part of this case.

("Noseyness"? Well, yes, I suppose so!)

SavannahStar

03-16-2008, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by BarbraAllen

Seeing her would help with the theory several posters have had about Cesar possibly having fallen in love with Maria. Maria was younger. Was she prettier? Smarter? More fun?
I always think it makes everything more interesting to see the people who are involved and I don't think that has to be classified as "prurient." She is very much a part of this case.

("Noseyness"? Well, yes, I suppose so!) [/*]

You're kidding, right? (your first paragraph).

Noseyness......that's about it, IMO. It's definitely a prurient interest, nothing more, nothing less. As Jas. said, "gawking"...

donna

03-16-2008, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Well, it might be nice, but I won't bore you all with a show and tell.

They are certainly not on topic. [/*]

Jas.S, no one here has to prove anything. I find it rather odd that you would even be asked! I think your posts make perfect sense!

:)

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by Babes

Hi strick5 - i could create a name here and says i saw her picture and she look exactly like Maria - would you also believe that?

Sorry MW5 - nothing negative on you or not i dont believe you but without a "link" or proof" then that is still just a hearsay :) [/*]

It may be hearsay but then there's credibility as well. I could see that posters might seriously question if I, for example, being a new poster came here and said I know what Christina looks like.
But even though new, I have read the forum since the beginning and MW5 is a very credible poster imo and has contributed a lot of facts relating to the MC, so yes I would believe what she says.

Babes

03-16-2008, 06:26 PM

Originally posted by Sami

Good point, Babes. And then our timeline would be back to Square One. [/*]

Thanks Sami,

And if there is nothing important in that picture - then why it is SO HIDDEN and they needed to make it blurry on the media. :(

Ionmhainn

03-16-2008, 06:27 PM

Originally posted by BarbraAllen

Hi Jas, I am trying to remember the wording of that statement about lying but I thought the conflict/confusion resulting from it was that Mary said something like "occasional history of compulsive lying." Another one of these situations where the interpretation of the words can be so difficult.

And again, another "Mary said" this, so it would go to Mary's credibility as to whether or not we accept it as truth.

I become confused because some posters talk about Mary rewriting history. Yet it seems they may pick and choose which things Mary said that are decided to become "truth and fact." [/*]

I spend a lot of time reading here, and stll haven't figured out what Mary Lauterbach's "credibility" has to do with the fact that her daughter was murdered. :confused:

Anybody who has lost a loved one knows that any problems they had in life pale in comparison to the loss. imo

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 06:28 PM

Originally posted by SavannahStar

You're kidding, right? (your first paragraph).

Noseyness......that's about it, IMO. It's definitely a prurient interest, nothing more, nothing less. As Jas. said, "gawking"... [/*]

No, I'm not kidding. There was some discussion on yesterday's thread about this and I think it could make as much sense as many other theories put out there.

And I am offended by the description of this curiousity as being "prurient." Many people here have expressed the wish to see Christina's picture. Would you describe their interest as:

Prurient: Definition

Inordinately interested in matters of sex; lascivious.

Characterized by an inordinate interest in sex: prurient thoughts.
Arousing or appealing to an inordinate interest in sex: prurient literature.

http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/prurient

donna

03-16-2008, 06:28 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

It's silly, donna.

And against TOS, I might add! [/*]

:D .... Yes

Babes

03-16-2008, 06:28 PM

Originally posted by BarbraAllen

It may be hearsay but then there's credibility as well. I could see that posters might seriously question if I, for example, being a new poster came here and said I know what Christina looks like.
But even though new, I have read the forum since the beginning and MW5 is a very credible poster imo and has contributed a lot of facts relating to the MC, so yes I would believe what she says. [/*]

Of course that is your opinion and no one is questioning her credibility but there will be posters like me who will ask for a Link or proof and would like to see in our own eyes to fully agree :)

IvySterling

03-16-2008, 06:29 PM

Thank you CK for the update from Ocean. I hope the injuries to her daughter were not also to her face.

hinman

03-16-2008, 06:29 PM

Originally posted by Ionmhainn

I spend a lot of time reading here, and stll haven't figured out what Mary Lauterbach's "credibility" has to do with the fact that her daughter was murdered. :confused:

Anybody who has lost a loved one knows that any problems they had in life pale in comparison to the loss. imo [/*]Well put.

Hope you are doing good my friend.:seeya:

alter ego

03-16-2008, 06:29 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

It's silly, donna.

And against TOS, I might add! [/*]It's not against TOS to ask you to prove your *facts* :read:

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 06:32 PM

Originally posted by BarbraAllen

Hi Jas, I am trying to remember the wording of that statement about lying but I thought the conflict/confusion resulting from it was that Mary said something like "occasional history of compulsive lying." Another one of these situations where the interpretation of the words can be so difficult.

And again, another "Mary said" this, so it would go to Mary's credibility as to whether or not we accept it as truth.

I become confused because some posters talk about Mary rewriting history. Yet it seems they may pick and choose which things Mary said that are decided to become "truth and fact." [/*]

I won't speak for anyone else, but I go with her initial statements when she wanted to find her daughter as her best shot at putting it all out there.

Unfortunately, many of us JUST CAME UNGLUED at the thought, especially when she was called her step-mother.

Once the dust settled, I felt bad for all the abuse she took. However, then there came a time when she wanted to rewrite history and I find it disingenuous to Maria and her family.

Not to mention my feelings about the things important to Maria being schluffed off like her nephew.

JMO tho.:o

strick10

03-16-2008, 06:32 PM

BarbraAllen

03-16-2008, 06:33 PM

Originally posted by Jas.S

Thank you for the correct spelling of prurient.

I bet I have never spelled that correctly.

As per looking at CSL's picture to see whether or not CL would have fallen in love with ML? Huh? :confused: How does that work? [/*]

Do you know the definition of the word "prurient"? I just posted it upthread. That is partly why I took offense to the wording in your post.

And, I said nothing about "looking at CSL's picture to see whether or not CL would have fallen in love with ML." I wish you would not change meaning of what people post when you respond; since others have been called out here for not quoting exactly I think it should apply to all.

CANDYKISSES

03-16-2008, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by IvySterling
Thank you CK for the update from Ocean. I hope the injuries to her daughter were not also to her face. [/*]

Fifty-three stitches in the leg. :( She said there is throbbing and swelling. They gave her morphine last night, but not sure about now what she is taking other than antibiotics. I would imagine something to take care of that kind of pain tho.

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by Babes

Hi strick5 - i could create a name here and says i saw her picture and she look exactly like Maria - would you also believe that?

Sorry MW5 - nothing negative on you or not i dont believe you but without a "link" or proof" then that is still just a hearsay :) [/*]

Babes and I mean this as no disrespect---MW5's husband is very good friends with CSL's recruiter. IIRC that's how MW5 saw the picture of CSL. MW5 also said the recruiter wouldn't let her take the picture and scan it for us to see.

I also know who MW5 is in RL, not that makes any difference here and now but if she said she saw a picture, I tend to believe her.

JMO FWIW

alter ego

03-16-2008, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by BarbraAllen

Do you know the definition of the word "prurient"? I just posted it upthread. That is partly why I took offense to the wording in your post.

And, I said nothing about "looking at CSL's picture to see whether or not CL would have fallen in love with ML." I wish you would not change meaning of what people post when you respond; since others have been called out here for not quoting exactly I think it should apply to all. [/*]

Now there's the POST OF THE DAY.

:beer:

Babes

03-16-2008, 06:35 PM

Originally posted by Sami
I'm sorry, but evidently some of ya'll have forgotten you wanted to see a picture of Christina, 'cause now you're posting all superior about prurient interest, etc.

Do I have to go find those posts? Ya'll know who you are. . . . asking, practically begging, for a poster here who had written to someone who was in Christina's class, for a yearbook picture of her! IMO, IIRC, some of you are here right now. IMO

When did your prurient interests change??? :D [/*]

FYI: The interest to see Christina's picture is not only expressed in CTV's board but in many boards like websleuths and etc
:D

alter ego

03-16-2008, 06:35 PM

Originally posted by CANDYKISSES

Fifty-three stitches in the leg. :( She said there is throbbing and swelling. They gave her morphine last night, but not sure about now what she is taking other than antibiotics. I would imagine something to take care of that kind of pain tho. [/*]

Thanks for the updates CandyKisses

donna

03-16-2008, 06:36 PM

nuttintodo

03-16-2008, 06:37 PM

Originally posted by Sami
I'm sorry, but evidently some of ya'll have forgotten you wanted to see a picture of Christina, 'cause now you're posting all superior about prurient interest, etc.

Do I have to go find those posts? Ya'll know who you are. . . . asking, practically begging, for a poster here who had written to someone who was in Christina's class, for a yearbook picture of her! IMO, IIRC, some of you are here right now. IMO

When did your prurient interests change??? :D [/*]

I remember wanting to see her photo. But now I could care less whether I see her or not. I'm sure I will see her in due time.

And I remember being asked to 'accidently' get someone to bump into her to get this picture, LOL.

JMO