Nicholas Francisco 28, Seattle, 2-13-08 (car found)

[desmom]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


I wondered if it was his own laptop, and not the company's, but based on how the company reported that they were attempting to trace the laptop, it seems to indicate it was theirs, or at least they had some details on it. See http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/

The fact that they state it has been filed in some "national crimes" database, that they are checking to see if it pops up on craigslist, etc., seems like they may have had detailed info about it. I suppose they could have just known the make of it and put that in. They also state "And for Nicholas' laptop, AirPort was the built-in method or card he used." but again, that's something they could just know based on the model -- AirPort comes standard on the Macbook. [/*]

This computer sounds important.

How many pawn shops, college bulletin boards, flea markets, used computer shops etc are in the Seattle area?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


From the Nancy Grace interview transcript here:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/21/ng.01.html

close to the end of the transcript

GRACE: Well, Christine, what is this I heard about his car being in different parking spots?

FRANCISCO: That`s what has been reported but it`s -- I don`t know.

I found it interest like she was going to try to say it was true then changed her mind. Since if it was true chances are good he was moving it or someone he gave the keys to. [/*]

The car was moved according to a couple that lives at the condos.. two days before it was found.. it was in the spot they own, for some time, and they were upset about it. They thought that someone from a neighboring apt. complex was using their lot cause the car wasn't familiar to them.

I guess they could have been lying about it.. but not sure why they would.

They also weren't the only people that said something about it being in different spots.. Several residents "thought" they had seen it in other spots.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by seattlematt


If it is off.... it at that point becomes nothing more than a brick. [/*]

Right - as long as Kelsey's phone was on, they were receiving pings but once it died or was destroyed, it became useless as a tracking system.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by seattlematt


If it is off.... it at that point becomes nothing more than a brick. [/*]

Thanks Matt and welcome. :)

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I still don't understand. Was it a work phone or not and why would they give the records to Christine when she wasn't on the account and the phone and bill were the property of Publicis? That makes no sense to me.

But.. I do have to say.. if it was a company phone and they wanted him to be able to be mobile and still be able to get ahold of him then I he would have been provided with a car charger too. So, did he have one? Any.. why.. if he did, didn't he use it? AND why point out to Christine and coworkers that it was dead if he was able to plug it in once he got in the car... it should have been a non-issue.

Another thing that I have heard is that not much is being said about the disappearance at Publicis. Maybe the PI for Publicis did find something and the big wigs there no about it and that is why they aren't saying much. I don't know but I thought that was strange. [/*]

That last bit is interesting, Mystry -- I had been wondering about that since you know someone who works there, right? There haven't been any updates on the company search blog for almost a week so I wondered if they found something too.

Personally, if I were Christine, I'd take some of the $$ she's been donated and hire my own PI, if she really, truly does not know where he is. The Publicis PI isn't obligated to tell her anything even if they do find him alive and well in Mexico or whatever.

She probably really, really doesn't want to believe that he left her but the possibility exists. And if LE believes he left on his own, they are not going to keep looking for him. She will have to be proactive to find him herself so she can pursue legal action to get him to support his children.

Anyone care to hazard a guess of how much $$ she might have received by now -- at least from the Etsy community? of course we could only speculate since nothing has been reported.

[desmom]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Mystry - bless you - I too am hung up on that car charger. I would be willing to bet that the employees on the TMobile plan had any and all accessories they needed. Someone said his battery was dead, but again, I'm sure the company had extra supplies there. [/*]

Excellent points!

I bet the company also had chargers around the office.

IIRC, several reports stated he told coworkers his battery was dead and then he tells Christine. Was he laying the ground work in case someone did try to reach him and it went to his voice mail?

[seattlematt]

Originally posted by desmom


Excellent points!

I bet the company also had chargers around the office.

IIRC, several reports stated he told coworkers his battery was dead and then he tells Christine. Was he laying the ground work in case someone did try to reach him and it went to his voice mail? [/*]

It's a T-Mobile phone.....T-Mobile is a GSM carrier... *Most* GSM phones have a battery life of several days with normal usage.

I have both a blackberry and a razor and they can go an entire weekend without a charge.... so he would had to have had not charged his phone the night before or the night before that.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by seattlematt


It's a T-Mobile phone.....T-Mobile is a GSM carrier... *Most* GSM phones have a battery life of several days with normal usage.

I have both a blackberry and a razor and they can go an entire weekend without a charge.... so he would had to have had not charged his phone the night before or the night before that. [/*]

This is what is so baffling to me. Christine said he would call if he was going to be 15 minutes late so I cannot see him failing to charge his phone (possibly for 2 days) knowing she was pregnant and driving an older model car.

[seattlematt]

I'm venturing out here in a bit..... does anyone want pictures of any of the afore mentioned locations????

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


(snipped)
Another thing that I have heard is that not much is being said about the disappearance at Publicis. Maybe the PI for Publicis did find something and the big wigs there no about it and that is why they aren't saying much. I don't know but I thought that was strange. [/*]

After reading all I did yesterday about Publicis, you may be on to something. Maybe they do not want any more bad publicity. Maybe THAT is why they hired the PI because they were worried it happened right their at their doorstep.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


This is what is so baffling to me. Christine said he would call if he was going to be 15 minutes late so I cannot see him failing to charge his phone (possibly for 2 days) knowing she was pregnant and driving an older model car. [/*]

What hasn't been brought up that I have noticed is usually men if they have company cell phones they also have their personal cell phones - I have both also.....just a thought

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by seattlematt
I'm venturing out here in a bit..... does anyone want pictures of any of the afore mentioned locations???? [/*]

Yes please!

[decor]

"Several residents "thought" they had seen it in other spots."

this is what I was wondering. Having witnessed a few things myself you realize that if you were not made aware of something until after it happened then most times you question yourself about what you "thought" may have been.

On the other hand if someone specifically knew it was in one spot one day and another the second day because it was in their spot etc. then it is proof that it was moved.

what would the purpose of moving it be? because it wasn't reported right away so it was moved so it would be reported?

I really think that Nick told everyone about the phone so that once he was gone and no one could get a hold of him he didn't want them to think something had happened to him because he didn't answer the phone. I really feel that was a complete set up.

I would think that if the car was found there and Nick was not then LE would have the right to question the residents unless they know already that he is somewhere else.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by decor
"Several residents "thought" they had seen it in other spots."

this is what I was wondering. Having witnessed a few things myself you realize that if you were not made aware of something until after it happened then most times you question yourself about what you "thought" may have been.

On the other hand if someone specifically knew it was in one spot one day and another the second day because it was in their spot etc. then it is proof that it was moved.

what would the purpose of moving it be? because it wasn't reported right away so it was moved so it would be reported?

I really think that Nick told everyone about the phone so that once he was gone and no one could get a hold of him he didn't want them to think something had happened to him because he didn't answer the phone. I really feel that was a complete set up.

I would think that if the car was found there and Nick was not then LE would have the right to question the residents unless they know already that he is somewhere else. [/*]

Its my understanding they did canvas the apartments but came up with nothing.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by decor

I really think that Nick told everyone about the phone so that once he was gone and no one could get a hold of him he didn't want them to think something had happened to him because he didn't answer the phone. I really feel that was a complete set up.

[/*]

I agree. I just don't see that the one day he tells people his phone battery is dead, that is the day he runs into some trouble. That would just have to be such bad luck!

I imagine how the people who last saw him that day at work, and Christine herself, must be going over in their mind every word he said to them that day. Trying to figure out the clues...

[seattlematt]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Yes please! [/*]

Any particular places???? (other than the condo's in Federal Way?

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by seattlematt


Any particular places???? (other than the condo's in Federal Way? [/*]

all sides of the Publicis building if possible

[Track292003]

Thank you, SeattleMatt, for offering to take photos...I'm sure we would all like to see them.

Also, the mention of "SeattleEddie" reminds me of something reported briefly on this forum about some of the posters re: Nicholas being missing had disappeared after they'd been put up, I believe in his office area -- either because of the wind and rain or because they were deliberately removed. Do you know anything about that, by any chance? Are there many posters up in the city now?

TIA.

[seattlematt]

Re: "Nick" Francisco.... see overlapping addresses..... It is entirely possible he went by both.

http://www.zabasearch.com/query1_zaba.php?sname=NICHOLAS+FRANCISCO&name_style=1&state=WA

[dianaelaine]

I'm back from shopping and dinner.

Went to Olive Garden and had ravioli with Marinara sauce, soup & breadsticks, and because it took so long, they gave us free dessert. YUM!

OK, enough about me. :D

From the very beginning, I mentioned that when he told his co-workers and C, that his cell was out, it was strange. If it's out at work, either charge it there before leaving or plug it in as soon as you get in the car.

Also, WHY tell your co-workers? There's really no reason to.

It WAS as if he were setting it up, so C would know that ... so nobody could contact him from that point on.

And about the person who sent me the information I posted earlier, this is how it was written:

---------------------------------------

BLANK spoke with BLANK on Wednesday this is what she said:

"I just spoke to BLANK today and she said that Christine is sick and just trying to be alone and stay off the internet for a while ..... and so on and so on ....

--------------------------------------------

I was told by another member, that this person is actually talking to Christine.

So if that's true, I'd guess that the statements are pretty much straight on from Christine.

I do agree that she might want to think about using some of that money to hire a P.I. of her own to find him, for the kid's sake and child support.

I also fine it ironic that there's no more searching, or at least not very active.

So ... that's about all I have for now.

OH .. and the fact that I'm pissed at my husband for watching the waitress' *** too much. :flamemad:

[seattlematt]

Originally posted by Track292003
Thank you, SeattleMatt, for offering to take photos...I'm sure we would all like to see them.

Also, the mention of "SeattleEddie" reminds me of something reported briefly on this forum about some of the posters re: Nicholas being missing had disappeared after they'd been put up, I believe in his office area -- either because of the wind and rain or because they were deliberately removed. Do you know anything about that, by any chance? Are there many posters up in the city now?

TIA. [/*]

The posters are scattered all over the place. There is one still up (circa before there was a reward) on the corner by my apartment.

The weather in seattle is crazy... it's entirely possible they got wet, were blown off, or some drunk person ripped them down.

[mc528]

As you all can tell from my registration date, I'm new to this board. I may be new with regards to posting here, but I've been following this case from the start, both here and all of the other boards. I'm also a seller on Etsy.com, which is where I first learned of Nicholas' disappearance. I do not know either Christine or Nicholas personally, and before the original post there, I had no interactions with either one. I'm also someone who had posted words of encouragement early on in the Etsy threads, but only once or twice - before those threads started to become as bazaar as they did. I also even sent Christine a small donation via PayPal - in the very, very beginning, when it was believed that the $ would help with the reward, and before it was even posted that here sister had conveyed the *desparate need for funds*. I'm mentionaing all of this, just to give some background, before I add my two cents and thoughts to the discussion here.

From very early on in the Etsy drama, I was (and still am) convinced that not everything purported to have been said, or even posted by Christine really was her posting - a trusted family member could have had her log-in information and used her shop to post in the forums. To me, there were too many inconsitencies in the writing style when comparing postings to each other, or to the style of her writing on her Etsy sites, Flickr accounts, etc. Sometimes there were complete sentences, and other times just phrases. Sometimes words were capitalized, and other times the same words were not. And messages in one posting would on occasion seem to not make sense when compared to other postings referencing the same events. An example would be when one of her posts the day before she was to meet with the detective alone referenced why he wanted to meet with her, yet when *she* came back to the thread after the meeting there was no mention of what the original purpose was to be. And to me, her vocabulary and demeanor on the t.v. interviews I watched also didn't always fit with the messages that were left under her name. And I agree that she came across on t.v. much more angry as opposed to grief stricken and distraught. So I guess, for me, some of the criticisms being made that were in reference to on-line postings may actually be, in a way, unfair to Christine because not all of them may have actually been her words - but that said, I do strongly believe that some of those indeed were her. Of course, I could be totally wrong on this whole aspect.

I was also very bothered by the immediate and continued requests for funds that Christine herself stated, in her lengthy post on Etsy on 2/23 were going to be used for groceries and to pay bills, and not towards the reward or efforts to find Nicholas. (she stated she didn't know where the reward money was coming from). This was just one of the statements that led me to believe that she knew more than what was being mentioned, and that she did indeed have reason to believe that Nicholas was not returning and that there would be no further $ from his job, or there was a far more serious reason for needing so much money so soon.....like either a ransom, as has been suggested, or to pay back a large sum of money for something - a lot more than what one would normally need.

As to what she saw when she logged into Nicholas' PayPal account (and she was very specific I believe when she said *his* account and not *hers* or *theirs*) - I don't believe it was a PayPal credit card balance, or even anything directly related to the funds balance at all. I think what she may have discovered had more to do with the bank accounts that were linked to that PayPal account. I believe LE chose their words carefully when on one of the t.v. interviews they stated that they had not immediately seen anything in the Francisco accounts to cause concern, but that they had not yet obtained all of the records. I think, as was mentioned here yesterday by Beth E, that Nicholas may indeed have been directing money from either his employer or the church, or both, to an account that was somehow tied to his PayPal account. And perhaps Christine's comments regarding Nicholas' shielding her from all their debt that was discovered when viewing his PayPal account really meant that she had no idea that they owed so much that he needed to unlawfully obtain it from somewhere.

This would also fit as to why his employer hired a PI so early on....the next day after he disappeared if I remember correctly, and why they have continually given funds to increase the reward. Yes, I know he was a valuable and liked employee, but LE had barely started their investigation and a PI was brought in. That seems a little unusual to me. And if the church were involved, this would also fit as to why LE wanted to question Christine about their involvement with MH (which is what Christine said the day before that meeting with the detectives around 2/20 - 2/21), and would also explain why Christine was so adament that any link to anything relative to MH church be removed from those support threads on Etsy. This request was very puzzling because from what it appeared the church had been very supportive and had even organized searches in the beginning...very strange that any and all reference to the church needed to be removed.

I posted a few questions/comments on the ABC article the day his car was found, but I think they were lost in the drama that ensued there that same day. I know that LE stated that there were no obvious signs of foul play in the car, nor was there anything that indicated his whereabouts (again, I think they were carefully choosing the words they used). I think that even in the absence of fingerprints that there could be ways to tell if someone other than Nicholas had been in possession of the car between Wednesday and Monday. They could try and determine if the positioning of the seat and rearview mirror were consistant with someone of Nicholas' stature. Was the radio station on a familiar channel? Was it typical that Nicholas would leave the car unlocked? For some people it is, others not so much. Also, was the car unusually clean, or unusually messy? I don't mean clean of fingerprints, but clean of other things like papers, beverage containers, etc? I know if it were my husband's truck and if it were to be found devoid of loose change, soda cans, or remnants of a fast-food meal I would certainly *know* that someone else had been driving it. There was never any mention as to what LE found in the car, or what conclusions were drawn from it.....not by LE or in any other message boards that I could find.

I truly hope that Nicholas has not met with foul play, and I also do not believe that Christine had anything directly to do with his disappearance, but I do believe that there is a lot more known than is being let out to the public. The lack of any updates whatsoever, in any forum, by LE or friends/family is a telling indication of that.

Sorry for the long post. I've been lurking here for a couple of weeks, and then impatiently waiting for my ID here to be activated, and once I started writing it seems that I couldn't stop. Thanks for listening. :)

[dianaelaine]

Seattlematt:

Welcome ... and yeah, while you're out taking pictures, would ya stop by my son's apartment and BONK him on the head for me? :biggrin:

He's not called me in forever, and every time I call him, he's busy doing SOMETHING! :rolleyes:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Welcome aboard MC528 - new perspective and insight is always welcome :)

I would like to add this...thank you for bringing up the reference of Christine asking that any reference to the church be removed. I have looked and looked for that post but could not find it.

[mc528]

I would like to add this...thank you for bringing up the reference of Christine asking that any reference to the church be removed. I have looked and looked for that post but could not find it.

I know it was in one of the support threads....sometime after the 22nd. I'll see if I can find where that request was made.

[desmom]

Welcome MC528!

Appreciate the insight.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Beth
Mystery phobia, do you mean amongst the employees or just in general?

"Another thing that I have heard is that not much is being said about the disappearance at Publicis. Maybe the PI for Publicis did find something and the big wigs there no about it and that is why they aren't saying much. I don't know but I thought that was strange." [/*]

no.. lots of talk, speculation.. etc. amongst the employees. Just not alot of info outside of that. Not like in the beginning when everyone was working to find out what may have happened to him. They are still talking about it.. in there little groups but it was much more of an organized effort in the beginning. I am not saying that isn't going on... just saying that from some peoples perspective.. they aren't seeing it now.

[decor]

mc528

thanks for that perspective. I think the PP one was interesting and not something I had thought about before.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by seattlematt


The posters are scattered all over the place. There is one still up (circa before there was a reward) on the corner by my apartment.

The weather in seattle is crazy... it's entirely possible they got wet, were blown off, or some drunk person ripped them down. [/*]

What a lot of people don't know is it is illegal to put flyers on telephone poles. They are taken down. Ones put on private property could also be taken down because one flyer/poster attracts more.

[desmom]

Originally posted by Beth
Here is an interview about N that i had not seen. It talks about LE and the fact that they have gone over his credit cards and some other financial information. Also touches on his cell phone and I still can't figure out whether it was a company issued phone or a phone he got through his company. Maybe somebody else will have better luck deciphering it.

http://foxnews1.a.mms.mavenapps.net/mms/rt/1/site/foxnews1-foxnews-pub01-live/current/launch.html?maven_playerId=videolandingpage&maven_referralParentPlaylistId=14dd8d0f134*75c8565 df1685e721eff8f003aac&maven_referralPlaylistId=*895e6943a20a5ba0d5beadb0 11*18*7ea0a1398&maven_referralObject=a7433ae9-1985-46ed-acf3-c6a2183361d1 [/*]

My attempt of transcribing from the above link

Matt, "Well Nick worked for Publicis and his phone was part of that account and so Christine's name is not on that account right now. It is just Nick's. I know the police are looking into what they need to do to try get those phone records but right now since he had that phone through work the last I heard we have not been able to get access to those records yet."

jmo

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


no.. lots of talk, speculation.. etc. amongst the employees. Just not alot of info outside of that. Not like in the beginning when everyone was working to find out what may have happened to him. They are still talking about it.. in there little groups but it was much more of an organized effort in the beginning. I am not saying that isn't going on... just saying that from some peoples perspective.. they aren't seeing it now. [/*]

We talked about the obligations of the PI - who was footing the bill and who would be told what. If I was Christine, I would take whatever money I could find and hire my own PI who would report to me directly.

[MystryPhobia]

Welcome mc528.

Very interesting, intelligent and thought provoking post.

Thanks.

And..cause it is getting ridiculous trying to post.. I will just add this in here..

If there was some criminal activity that Nicholas was involved in regarding his employer or church.. wouldn't there be a criminal investigation linked to that? There are no warrants for his arrest.

I do find it odd that Christine asked for the posts having to do with the church be taken down. What the heck is the deal with that church? Why did they resign as members? Could the church be, in ANYWAY, linked to his disappearance? I don't think it is just a coincidence that they were no longer members of that church as of two days before. What happened on that Sunday before that? If what I have read is correct.. that church is somewhat cultish in its beliefs. That worries me. Was Christine in favor of quitting the church? Was it all Nicholas' doing? Could they have done something to him or have his somewhere trying to do some kind of intervention because of it? Kinda off the wall but the whole church aspect is what is bothering me and now that she has asked that everything to do with it be taken down.. I am even more wondering...

[mc528]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I would like to add this...thank you for bringing up the reference of Christine asking that any reference to the church be removed. I have looked and looked for that post but could not find it. [/*]


I found it......it was on 2/20, in the Support thread #4. Last pst on page 9 in this link: http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5478831&page=9


fashiongreentbags says:
I'm waiting for a response from Christine but I'm going to close this thread and start thread 5 momentarily. She wants to have the link for the church taken out because her church is causing some problems.


Posted at 6:22 pm, February 20 2008 EST

[RainyNiteNTx]

IFFFFFFFFFFF Nicholas was in some type of trouble, he may have received some phone calls that day at work asking him to come in to talk about it and felt the walls were closing in. So IF he actually declared "I love you Bella" before he hung up with Christine that day, he knew he was leaving. I'm still holding out hope that he'll walk into a place of business and not know who he is - it has happened before.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by mc528



I found it......it was on 2/20, in the Support thread #4. Last pst on page 9 in this link: http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5478831&page=9


fashiongreentbags says:
I'm waiting for a response from Christine but I'm going to close this thread and start thread 5 momentarily. She wants to have the link for the church taken out because her church is causing some problems.


Posted at 6:22 pm, February 20 2008 EST [/*]

Thank you so much! I hope they weren't causing the kinds of problems we're discussing on here.

[RainyNiteNTx]

The part Christine asked to be removed is the part that says Church Link and it is an urgent message about Nicholas. You'll have to scroll down to see the link.

NEW FLIER:http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3113/2280537696_388d4d609d_*.jpg
Flickr-post the pic: http://www.flickr.com/groups/candle-of-support/
MONEY DONATION:
In state: Donate at WAMU to the Nicholas Francisco Family Fund
Out of state/country: paypal donations to:
bella [!at] bellastyleboutique.com (paypal user name)
Wire transfers to the bank account are very expensive. Paypal is much less and they will refund the fees to Christine as soon as she is able to call.
Christine Francisco's original thread:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5472516
Initial Help Thread: http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5472950&page=1
Updates: http://mailpen.net
News updates:
http://www.komotv.com/news/15682797.html
http://www.king5.com/topstories/stories/NW_021608WAB_missing_seatac_man_KS.cbc94803.html
Etsy donations: http://www.etsy.com/search_results.php?search_type=tag_title&search_query=christine+and+family
Church link: http://voxpopnetwork.com/westseattle/2008/02/17/urgent-message-regarding-nicholas-francisco/
Etsy Prayer Chain:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5476347
PROMO THREAD: PURCHASE from list or DONATE an item for Christine:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5476977
Etsy ANGELS PROMO THREAD:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5476325
Add yourself to the Sending Hope to Seattle Map
http://www.frappr.com/?a=constellation_map&mapid=137440361472
Request more prayers from here and get the word out even more:
http://www.prayerrequestsite.com/

http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5477512&page=168
news report:
http://www.wikio.com/more/us/tragedy/missing_person/nicholas_francisco?start=0&count=15&sort=0
List of news sites:
http://www.wikio.com/us/tragedy/missing_person/nicholas_francisco
post your candle avatar:
http://www.flickr.com/groups/candle-of-support/
etsy support sales:
sewinggranny says:
Be sure to post your sales in this thread:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5477821&page=2
donation threads:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5476977
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5476325
holding hands in prayer , join here :
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5476347&page=26
Late interview video
http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=4226712&cl=6516902&src=news
Posted at 5:46 pm, February 20 2008 EST

[desmom]

Originally posted by mc528



I found it......it was on 2/20, in the Support thread #4. Last pst on page 9 in this link: http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5478831&page=9


fashiongreentbags says:
I'm waiting for a response from Christine but I'm going to close this thread and start thread 5 momentarily. She wants to have the link for the church taken out because her church is causing some problems.


Posted at 6:22 pm, February 20 2008 EST [/*]

In the same post, it says Paypal is not going to refund the fees.
I only buy with my paypal account. What fees and how much is paypal's fees?

TIA

[Danette44]

Thank you Rainy! Maybe it's not for us to judge why she wanted them to be removed, but - come on, the more people searching the better chances of recovering something! Sometimes I wonder if she wants him to be found! And yes Beth E, if she is reading this board my question is- has LE asked you to take a polygraph??? :biggrin:

[mc528]

Originally posted by desmom


In the same post, it says Paypal is not going to refund the fees.
I only buy with my paypal account. What fees and how much is paypal's fees?

TIA [/*]

PayPal charges a fee to the recipient whenever you receive money. Depending on the type of PayPal account that you have, and how the payment was funded, those fees could be as much as close to 5%. It is likely that Christine had either a Premier or Business account, so her fees to receive payments would be about 2 - 3%. Here's the link to the PayPal fee chart:
https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_display-fees

[mc528]

Oops...try this link for PayPal instead.....the first one was from the secure side: (sorry)

https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_display-fees-outside

[desmom]

Originally posted by mc528


PayPal charges a fee to the recipient whenever you receive money. Depending on the type of PayPal account that you have, and how the payment was funded, those fees could be as much as close to 5%. It is likely that Christine had either a Premier or Business account, so her fees to receive payments would be about 2 - 3%. Here's the link to the PayPal fee chart:
https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_display-fees [/*]

Thanks. I found it.

[decor]

PP did refund the fees they charged her but I think it was only for the first 3 days. after that they said they would charge her.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Danette44
Thank you Rainy! Maybe it's not for us to judge why she wanted them to be removed, but - come on, the more people searching the better chances of recovering something! Sometimes I wonder if she wants him to be found! And yes Beth E, if she is reading this board my question is- has LE asked you to take a polygraph??? :biggrin: [/*]

No not our place to judge, but the church thing worries me. If whatever was going on was so bad that she requested what looked like a fervent prayer, sincere concern, requests to help the family, and search information was asked to be removed, I would like to know why. MH is a big church - more people - more exposure to help find Nicholas IMO.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Good question.......hope she answers don't you? [/*]

Now Beth Engleman - do you really think she will answer that? lol

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


No not our place to judge, but the church thing worries me. If whatever was going on was so bad that she requested what looked like a fervent prayer, sincere concern, requests to help the family, and search information was asked to be removed, I would like to know why. MH is a big church - more people - more exposure to help find Nicholas IMO. [/*]

I totally agree with you Rainy - I almost wrote the pastor to ask why she would do such a thing after they did searches, set-up the bank for donations, but I was to chicken.......lol

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Do I think she will answer that?

No, but she is lurking and it will give her something to think about. [/*]

What really bites me right now - is seeing her write word for word some lyrics down from a movie she saw today! How in the world can you concentrate like that knowing your husband is missing and could be dead (godforbid thats not the case) or hurt somewhere? I would be a basket case, so this just makes me lean more towards she knows what has happen to him or he left her! JMOO

[isitme]

Originally posted by Danette44


What really bites me right now - is seeing her write word for word some lyrics down from a movie she saw today! How in the world can you concentrate like that knowing your husband is missing and could be dead (godforbid thats not the case) or hurt somewhere? I would be a basket case, so this just makes me lean more towards she knows what has happen to him or he left her! JMOO [/*]

My thoughts exactly when I read that on the support blog. And the words are kind of creepy - made me think that she finds no reason to live . . . .

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Envision
Where is she writing these words? On etsy? [/*]

I had to look for that too. Wow. http://supportingchristine.wordpress.com/2008/02/24/supporting-christine-with-word-prayer-and-action/#comment-130

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Envision
Whwriting these words? On etsy? [/*]


http://supportingchristine.wordpress.com/2008/02/24/supporting-christine-with-word-prayer-and-action/#comments

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Danette44


What really bites me right now - is seeing her write word for word some lyrics down from a movie she saw today! How in the world can you concentrate like that knowing your husband is missing and could be dead (godforbid thats not the case) or hurt somewhere? I would be a basket case, so this just makes me lean more towards she knows what has happen to him or he left her! JMOO [/*]

Her comments do all seem to be about how she is feeling inside, how she is coping... not about poor Nicholas and what could have happened to him. If she really thinks he met up with some foul play, then maybe this is just the (deep) denial stage of her grief. I suppose if she knows he is in some sort of trouble, talking about herself would be a way to avoid saying anything she shouldn't about him. But it does come off as very self-absorbed.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth
If it's the same movie I watched yesterday, It's called "unfaithful" and that song is played in it. [/*]

Interesting if it was the same movie. I haven't seen it, but it sounds like, well, not one she'd be watching with the kids around...

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Envision
I doubt she "remembered" word for word. It looks more like a cut and paste. What a funky title of a movie though to be watching when your husband is missing... [/*]

Hey Envision - maybe that title of the movie "Unfaithful", is the key word to this case?? lol

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision
Synopsis:

Edward and Connie Sumner are a wonderfully maintained middle-aged couple living the American dream. Together with their eight year-old son, a dog and a housekeeper, they share an enviable life in the suburbs of New York City. But no life goes unchallenged: This happy marriage, dampened by the routines of affluence, falls prey to an outsider when Connie has a fateful collision with a stranger on a Soho street. It's an encounter which assaults her with mystery, spontaneity, charm and risk. It will pull Connie into an affair which will become her obsession. When Edward innocently learns that his wife has lied to him, suspicion propels him to to uncover the devastating details of her infidelity. Tormented by the knowledge, he confronts her lover, only to discover a level of rage within himself that he could never have imagined

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.......... [/*]

oh my goodness.. I

I have seen that movie.. Beth said she even watched it... what does that say about us??

It was on tv yesterday.. big deal!

This is almost getting ridiculous. What if this woman is COMPLETELY innocent? Has no idea what has happened to her husband and is as much in the dark as the rest of us? What if her husband has met with foul play and she has to live the rest of her life without him. What if his children have to live without him forever??

I don't know.. to me.. this almost seems like a witch hunt, at this point. She can't do anything right.

"why is she on the internet when she should be looking for her husband?"
"why isn't she on the internet anymore?"
"why is she watching movies when her husband is missing?"
"why is she posting songs on the internet?"
"why is she saying that she is sick and tired and won't be posting?"

[decor]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


oh my goodness.. I

I have seen that movie.. Beth said she even watched it... what does that say about us??

It was on tv yesterday.. big deal!

This is almost getting ridiculous. What if this woman is COMPLETELY innocent? Has no idea what has happened to her husband and is as much in the dark as the rest of us? What if her husband has met with foul play and she has to live the rest of her life without him. What if his children have to live without him forever??

I don't know.. to me.. this almost seems like a witch hunt, at this point. She can't do anything right.

"why is she on the internet when she should be looking for her husband?"
"why isn't she on the internet anymore?"
"why is she watching movies when her husband is missing?"
"why is she posting songs on the internet?"
"why is she saying that she is sick and tired and won't be posting?" [/*]


I have to agree.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Envision
Raindrops on roses and whiskers on kittens....blah blah blah.... [/*]

What does this mean?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision
Raindrops on roses and whiskers on kittens....blah blah blah.... [/*]

OK that is intelligent.

Seems like no matter what she does.. it is going to be wrong to some of you.

Some of you were saying that because she was on the internet sticking up for herself proved that she knew where Nicholas was.

Then when she wasn't on.. and said she was sick and tired.. that proved she knew where he was too

Then when she posts a song.. (who DOES NOT relate songs to things going on in their own life).. that proves she is hiding something.

No matter what she does.. it is going to be the wrong thing to some.. PERIOD.

[decor]

If by chance Christine has admitted to herself that it is possible that Nick deserted her and the kids why wouldn't she be thinking about herself?

She probably has a long road ahead of her.

If he isn't found and she can file for his death in a year then her kids can get SS but she still has to wait a year.

If he is found only God knows what will happen to their relationship.



Either way the burden will now be on Christine because she 2 kids to take care and another on the way.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
everyone freaked if anything bad was said about N's dissapperance, on other threads.....

they didn't want C to see the bad stuff

yet, now, as someone said, she is lurking here on this thread....
does she think she is going to learn something here....NO, i think she knows more than our brainstorming could reveal

so C, you are not as delicate as people try to make you out to be, or you would not be lurkin here, if, indeed you are...

you really need to stick with the prayer thread.....

If you are cold enough to read these posts, then tell us what REALLY happened.....or go watch another movie [/*]

No disrespect hippiegirl but tell me how someone on here that doesn't know her.. knows that she is lurking here? And if she is.. how does that make her cold? AND.. Please tell me why.. even if she is lurking here.. she owes any of us an explanation?

The last time I looked at TOS.. anyone is able to lurk or post here. So.. the way I see it.. telling someone "you really need to stick with the prayer thread" is wrong!

[field of snow]

Why it is okay to question Drew Peterson's every move and not Christine's odd little inconsistencies as we see them?

Curious.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Envision
Whenever it sounds as though someone wants to sugarcoat Christine and shield her from valid thoughts, I think of that stupid song. The last line is "And then I don't feel so bad". You get the relation? [/*]

Who is doing that? For 60+ pages posters on here have expressed their thoughts both pro and con on Christine, Nicholas, Etsy, Mars Hill Church, and Publicis. For the most part, everyone has done a very good job of respecting other's opinions, thoughts and speculation.

[isitme]

Originally posted by snowfield
Why it is okay to question Drew Peterson's every move and not Christine's odd little inconsistencies as we see them?

Curious. [/*]

My guess would be that Drew Peterson's supporters, if he has any, aren't involved in those discussions in the manner that we see here.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Christine has a website completely devoted to supporting her with love and prayers. People who write there want to help her get through a really tough time.

This board is for discussion of what might have happened to her husband. It is not a "witch hunt" and if the discussion includes unfavorable comments about her behavior, it is part of our research. It is a realistic approach to the subject. We are not out to hurt her but just find out the truth. [/*]

I agree Beth. Perhaps some don't understand the forums here at TTV. Look on any of the threads...page after page of back and forth with our opinions/thoughts. It really shouldn't take someone long to figure out this is not a prayer board, or a board where everyone agrees and sends healing thoughts. If one isn't comfortable with what they see they should probably refrain from reading here. I've been to forums which I find offensive so I simply stay away from them, rather than tell the posters how I feel about their board. Each to his own.......

[n/t]

To me the fact that she posted that song means she is hurting. She must be going through all kinds of emotions right now.

Scared, upset, angry, frustrated, depressed.......

Let's not forget. She's pregnant so this must be a very difficult time for her. Her emotions must be out of whack compounded by the fact that her husband is missing, she must be a mess.

You know, if God forbid something like this happened to me, I think I'd reach out to my internet friends for support too. There's nothing wrong with that. If it helps, why not.

We see in right here on this Message Board in OC. When posters need prayers and help, people are there for them. Yes, even complete strangers.

At this time, I do NOT see Christine involved in Nicholas' disappearance.

I pray he's safe and comes home to his beautiful family. :rose:

[decor]

I am sure this will not turn into a prayer thread but I don't understand where the anger comes from for someone that we don't know personally and tearing her apart from end to end because she has behaved n a manner that some have said is not the way they would have behaved if this had happened to them.

First no one ever knows how they will behave in a situation until it actually happens to them. I have been through enough stuff and would have never guessed how I would have reacted or how I would have dealt with it.

I thought this was a place to be objective and look at the situation from all angles without getting too emotionally involved that we become the judge and jury when we have so few facts to go on and at this point is all guesswork.

Christine is young, she doesn't have a lot of life experience to draw from and there is no play book.

I am sure she is mistaking some mistakes that she may or may not regret but who hasn't?

We are trying to figure out what happened to Nick, not is wrong with Christine, right?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision


No one may dictate what is allowed to be said or not said regarding her, her behavior or husband's disappearance. If she cannot handle all the speculation going on around forums, then she should stay away from them, bottom line. [/*]

I understand that Envision.

If you say you don't think she should be posting because he is missing.. you then can not say it proves something about her when she isn't. Brings your credibility in to play more then hers IMO. You can't have it both ways. (by "you" I don't mean you specifically.. just all of us in general)

I mean.. c'mon.. I am all for looking at her.. but, be objective.. at this point.. she is a horrible mother because she may have watched the movie "unfaithful" in front of her children. To some.. she shouldn't even be watching TV. WHAT is she suppose to do?

[KindraLore]

Well I would like to chime in again (I know you have all missed me as well…lol)

Whenever anyone logically states how its not very plausible that Christine could have killed Nick, everyone states “I don’t think she killed him” or “I don’t think she had anything to do with his disappearance” and then gives a list of why they don’t like her (i.e. donations, a baby moving, I forgot the others right now).

Then most of those same people state, “but I think he has ran off on his own”. But then he is painted by most of those as awesome and everything she does still continues to be an issue. (which btw, I personally do think he was/is an awesome guy and I don’t think he would leave her and his children).

So I am trying to figure out where you guys are coming from here, really I am. I guess I just don’t understand it. You don’t think she did anything to him. You think that he took off on his own. How is she still the bad guy here? Just asking.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by decor
I am sure this will not turn into a prayer thread but I don't understand where the anger comes from for someone that we don't know personally and tearing her apart from end to end because she has behaved n a manner that some have said is not the way they would have behaved if this had happened to them.

First no one ever knows how they will behave in a situation until it actually happens to them. I have been through enough stuff and would have never guessed how I would have reacted or how I would have dealt with it.

I thought this was a place to be objective and look at the situation from all angles without getting too emotionally involved that we become the judge and jury when we have so few facts to go on and at this point is all guesswork.

Christine is young, she doesn't have a lot of life experience to draw from and there is no play book.

I am sure she is mistaking some mistakes that she may or may not regret but who hasn't?

We are trying to figure out what happened to Nick, not is wrong with Christine, right? [/*]

ITA decor.. that is how I am feeling too.

Everyones differences and differing opinions are awesome and what makes this board great.. but somewhere along the line.. this thread turned into a pick Christine apart and make ourselves feel better. That just doesn't seem right to me.

And for the person who asked about Drew Peterson.. uhh.. the two can NOT even be compared.

[field of snow]

I am picking her apart because I believe she is wasting LE and supporters' time and money. She knows he left her. You don't let taxpayers and friends and strangers finance your domestic problems.

Yes, sad for her that it happened and crappy on Nick for doing this to her like this. But someone in that family needs to stand up and act like an adult.

Moo, of course. I will personally eat dirt if it turns out to not be true.

[seattlematt]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
seattlematt.....are you by chance Nick's best friend? [/*]

No... just a guy in seattle named matt

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by decor

If he isn't found and she can file for his death in a year then her kids can get SS but she still has to wait a year.

[/*]

Unless they find some evidence that he might be dead it will be 7 years before she can get a death certificate and SS.

[RainyNiteNTx]

I don't think a missing person's case can be talked about objectively without looking at the spouse. I think there is a place for discussion about Christine as it could play directly into what was going on at home and perhaps Nicholas' mindset. However, picking apart every tiny thing she does defeats the purpose and takes the focus off of Nicholas - the one who is missing. JMO

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
I don't think a missing person's case can be talked about objectively without looking at the spouse. I think there is a place for discussion about Christine as it could play directly into what was going on at home and perhaps Nicholas' mindset. However, picking apart every tiny thing she does defeats the purpose and takes the focus off of Nicholas - the one who is missing. JMO [/*]

Wow Rainy, you and I actually agree on something. lol

[decor]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Unless they find some evidence that he might be dead it will be 7 years before she can get a death certificate and SS. [/*]

that is what I thought it was or knew it used to be but someone posted yesterday that it was a year so didn't know if it had changed.


I GIVE UP! WHERE IS THE PAGE WITH ALL OF THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE INITIALS. I CAN'T FIND IT!!!!!! THANKS :)

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by KindraLore


Wow Rainy, you and I actually agree on something. lol [/*]

LOL noooooooooo say it isn't so :)

[field of snow]

If you want to talk about Nicholas and not Christine, how about this:

Edited to add that I am talking about the flyer: That first photo on the upper left hand corner (looks like it was taken by his own hand, at the pumpkin patch) is somewhat mysterious and bugging me. Like he wasn't taking it for his wife, but someone else.

Actually...i've already shared privately with one of you what my first instinct was regarding Nicholas. I thought he was gay. I could go into details and my experience why I think that, but I know I haven't been the only one. He wouldn't be the first married guy who realized he was gay and couldn't take it anymore because of religious/cultural/societal expectations.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
I think the reason that everyone loves to hate Christine is this:
we view Nicholas as a sweet and wonderful guy who is missing and not home loving his kids. It hurts to think that something bad could have happened to this kind and gentle man. So, we look for someone to blame and the only person available is his wife Christine.

No it isn't right to blame her but sometimes that is how emotions work. We feel a certain way without a good reason, it is illogical but sometimes that is how life works. [/*]

Thanks for explaining that Beth E. I guess that is where we differ then. I try to look at it all in a logical aspect.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by snowfield
If you want to talk about Nicholas and not Christine, how about this:

That first photo on the upper left hand corner (looks like it was taken by his own hand, at the pumpkin patch) is somewhat mysterious and bugging me. Like he wasn't taking it for his wife, but someone else.

Actually...i've already shared privately with one of you what my first instinct was regarding Nicholas. I thought he was gay. I could go into details and my experience why I think that, but I know I haven't been the only one. He wouldn't be the first married guy who realized he was gay and couldn't take it anymore because of religious/cultural/societal expectations. [/*]

You reminded me of something I wanted to ask - where was the picture taken of his red car? Was it taken at those apartment complexes where his car was found? Does anyone know?

[Silver_Dove]

N is in his 7th year of marriage (7 year itch anyone). He is now 29 looking at 30. I think C's behavior can factor into him leaving or not. If she is a demanding, drama queen who can't face reality, even if he is an awesome guy might have just felt the need to get out before another child came along and didn't feel he could talk to her about it. Or he may have tried to tell her but she just didn't want to hear it. So yes in the end C's personalty and so forth very well could have had a bearing in what is happening.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove
N is in his 7th year of marriage (7 year itch anyone). He is now 29 looking at 30. I think C's behavior can factor into him leaving or not. If she is a demanding, drama queen who can't face reality, even if he is an awesome guy might have just felt the need to get out before another child came along and didn't feel he could talk to her about it. Or he may have tried to tell her but she just didn't want to hear it. So yes in the end C's personalty and so forth very well could have had a bearing in what is happening. [/*]

Well if that is really what happened and he did take the COWARD's way out and left his children (obviously if he chose to leave like this he could not see them again) when instead he could have gotten a divorce and still been a father, well to me that is not painting a very stand up guy. Just sayin'.

[decor]

Nick could also be selfish like a lot of other people and got himself into trouble and decided he needed to fend for himself without sharing with C what he was doing.


He would not be the first or last man to take off and leave a family behind for his own selfish reasons.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


OK that is intelligent.

Seems like no matter what she does.. it is going to be wrong to some of you.

Some of you were saying that because she was on the internet sticking up for herself proved that she knew where Nicholas was.

Then when she wasn't on.. and said she was sick and tired.. that proved she knew where he was too

Then when she posts a song.. (who DOES NOT relate songs to things going on in their own life).. that proves she is hiding something.

No matter what she does.. it is going to be the wrong thing to some.. PERIOD. [/*]

With all due respect Mystry - It does upset me seeing her writing Lyrics down and not mentioning Nicholas. Perhaps I should stay away from HER prayer board, but I'm always hoping there is some mention of Nicholas - and the sad thing is she doesn't talk about him over there, they are there for her and yes she does say thank you for the prayers, not for donations, not for the time and effort people have put forth to try to find a missing Husband and Father!

I do pray with all my heart Nicholas is found safe and sound, and yes I would feel bad for my thoughts on Christine - but her actions of a concern Wife of a missing Husbands isn't there for me, and it's just my opinon and thats all it is an opinon.

[decor]

there could be a couple of reasons for just leaving. if he was in over his head as Beth E. suggested and he could get into trouble if he stayed.

If he just didn't want to have to worry about supporting an ex and his children.
If he starts over with a new ID he can start with a clean slate and have no responsibility.

[need2no]

I know I will get slammed for this comparison but what the heck. I remember many who wholeheartedly supported Susan Smith and became furious with anyone who would dare to question anything that seemed "off" with her or her story. Her supporters stood steadfast in their staunch support of Susan and clung to her every word as truth while expressing their words of sorrow and comfort for Susan. Others of us saw things differently and spoke of the inconsistencies and Susan's mannerisms, words, fake emotion, etc.

While I would never ever want to offend or add grief or pain with my words and thoughts to someone who is totally innocent, I also don't apologize for questioning things that just don't add up or seem right to me. To not take a second and third look and appraise all situations before making up your mind (in all situations) seems fool hearty to me.This case merits discussion IMO, if it something wasn't "off" here we would be hearing more about this case from the media and TH's like Nancy, Greta and Geraldo. Suppose LE just took everything and everyone at face value and believed everything they said.........


If everybody's thinking the same thing, then nobody's thinking. - George S. Patton

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I tend to find all of this fairly amusing....why are some offended that we find Christine suspicious?

Christine is raking in the donated cash while sitting at home typing songs on the internet....but she can't operate her internet business, no, that would be too stressful. What?

Its obvious that there is something unusual about his case...look at how many pages we have spent discussing it. There are so many unusual things about it that I'm not sure where to begin. However most of the unusual things are not related to Nicholas but Christine.

No, there is no standard way to act in this situation but there is what one might call typical behavior. She doesn't have it...her behavior so far is very bizarre, otherwise we wouldn't be here discussing it. [/*]
It isn't about being offended that some see her as suspicious. It is about the fact that some of those that see her as suspicious seem to want to make everything that she does suspect.. which takes away from their points.. since it almost seems like they are not being objective regarding her.

We are here to discuss the disappearance of Nicholas.. not about whether Christing watched a movie or not.

And.. you know what.. you make my point right in your post sherryhefner..

You said.. "Christine is raking in the donated cash while sitting at home typing songs on the internet"

She posted one song on the internet.. almost 3 weeks after her husband went missing but by looking at your post.. you would think that is all she is doing.

[isitme]

Originally posted by need2no
I know I will get slammed for this comparison but what the heck. I remember many who wholeheartedly supported Susan Smith and became furious with anyone who would dare to question anything that seemed "off" with her or her story. Her supporters stood steadfast in their staunch support of Susan and clung to her every word as truth while expressing their words of sorrow and comfort for Susan. Others of us saw things differently and spoke of the inconsistencies and Susan's mannerisms, words, fake emotion, etc.

While I would never ever want to offend or add grief or pain with my words and thoughts to someone who is totally innocent, I also don't apologize for questioning things that just don't add up or seem right to me. To not take a second and third look and appraise all situations before making up your mind (in all situations) seems fool hearty to me.This case merits discussion IMO, if it something wasn't "off" here we would be hearing more about this case from the media and TH's like Nancy, Greta and Geraldo. Suppose LE just took everything and everyone at face value and believed everything they said.........


If everybody's thinking the same thing, then nobody's thinking. - George S. Patton [/*]


Well said!

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by KindraLore


Well if that is really what happened and he did take the COWARD's way out and left his children (obviously if he chose to leave like this he could not see them again) when instead he could have gotten a divorce and still been a father, well to me that is not painting a very stand up guy. Just sayin'. [/*]

We don't know do we? Maybe they had talked about it and there was no way C was going to let him go? Could be why she is acting so strange and is saying he isn't a coward. Trying to shame him into coming back, maybe?

Maybe she is threatening to take every penny she can (goes with the money thing).

This all shows where looking at her might show why he might have left.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by need2no
I know I will get slammed for this comparison but what the heck. I remember many who wholeheartedly supported Susan Smith and became furious with anyone who would dare to question anything that seemed "off" with her or her story. Her supporters stood steadfast in their staunch support of Susan and clung to her every word as truth while expressing their words of sorrow and comfort for Susan. Others of us saw things differently and spoke of the inconsistencies and Susan's mannerisms, words, fake emotion, etc.

While I would never ever want to offend or add grief or pain with my words and thoughts to someone who is totally innocent, I also don't apologize for questioning things that just don't add up or seem right to me. To not take a second and third look and appraise all situations before making up your mind (in all situations) seems fool hearty to me.This case merits discussion IMO, if it something wasn't "off" here we would be hearing more about this case from the media and TH's like Nancy, Greta and Geraldo. Suppose LE just took everything and everyone at face value and believed everything they said.........


If everybody's thinking the same thing, then nobody's thinking. - George S. Patton [/*]

Who is gonna slam you? Its not me. Heck I know most here don't like what I have to say either. It's alright though.

I can question it though right? You are comparing a murderer to Christine. So then my question goes back to the fact of do you think she actually is a murderer? If not, what exactly is "off".

And yes, I do like your George Patton quote because if you haven't noticed, I'm a minority around here. lol

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


We don't know do we? Maybe they had talked about it and there was no way C was going to let him go? Could be why she is acting so strange and is saying he isn't a coward. Trying to shame him into coming back, maybe?

Maybe she is threatening to take every penny she can (goes with the money thing).

This all shows where looking at her might show why he might have left. [/*]

I hear ya SilverDove. I just don't understand how anyone could justify a man walking out on his pregnant wife and children and have the Nation looking for him and it be ok. I mean unless he or they were in some sort of danger. And even then, seems like at some point he would try to contact her and let her know that so she would not worry about him.

[n/t]

Snowfield, do you have a link to the flyer you mentioned in your post?

TIA

[decor]

This is a site question.
Sometimes I get 2 boxes that say Post a Reply but one is really to start a new thread. Sometimes I only get the post a reply button but when you click on it nothing happens.
Just now I get the words but they are not contained in a box. IS this normal for this site?

and WHERE IS THE PAGE WITH ALL OF THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE INITIALS?
thank you

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Danette44


With all due respect Mystry - It does upset me seeing her writing Lyrics down and not mentioning Nicholas. Perhaps I should stay away from HER prayer board, but I'm always hoping there is some mention of Nicholas - and the sad thing is she doesn't talk about him over there, they are there for her and yes she does say thank you for the prayers, not for donations, not for the time and effort people have put forth to try to find a missing Husband and Father!

I do pray with all my heart Nicholas is found safe and sound, and yes I would feel bad for my thoughts on Christine - but her actions of a concern Wife of a missing Husbands isn't there for me, and it's just my opinon and thats all it is an opinon. [/*]

It bothers me also that she doesn't really mention him and I have to wonder why.

If she did something or knows something then she needs to open up about it.

Unfortunately there are some people that are narcissistic and only think about themselves in crisis. They make situations all about them. I think that Christine may be one of them but that doesn't make her necessarily criminal.

[field of snow]

Originally posted by n/t
Snowfield, do you have a link to the flyer you mentioned in your post?

TIA [/*]

http://bp1.blogger.com/_claryN3FpPA/R7nyBfTR7WI/AAAAAAAAAAM/mp2QtRCkrMM/s1600-h/2271161742_8*03108e14_*.jpg

Upper right in this one, actually. I had recently seen a different flyer with it in the opposite top corner. It's the pumpkin patch pic.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision


I NEVER stated she could not post here. I SAID if she cannot handle the speculation and is so emotionally upset that anyone could think contrary to what she believes, then she should not be lurking. No one will tell me what I may believe or what not nor what I will or will not post. I have not posted outside of TOS either and therefore will continue stating my thoughts. I didn't state one way or another what she may be for watching that movie. Quite frankly, I don't care. I however wouldn't watch that movie whether my husband was missing or not. Your opinion of my credibility does not change anything. I know her from etsy and have been in chatrooms with her where she had painted quite a different story of her marriage than now. That her story has changed now that he is missing, is no shock to me. She is a storyteller of convenience. She will only tell what suits her to look good. [/*]

As I stated in my post.. I didn't mean YOU specifically. :read:

[n/t]

Originally posted by snowfield


http://bp1.blogger.com/_claryN3FpPA/R7nyBfTR7WI/AAAAAAAAAAM/mp2QtRCkrMM/s1600-h/2271161742_8*03108e14_*.jpg

Upper right in this one, actually. I had recently seen a different flyer with it in the opposite top corner. It's the pumpkin patch pic. [/*]

Thanks. I didn't realize you meant the missing poster pic. I thought it was one I hadn't seen before.

[n/t]

This is the flyer they have on facebook.

http://profile.ak.facebook.com/object2/1994/24/l10760854531_4363.jpg

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by decor
This is a site question.
Sometimes I get 2 boxes that say Post a Reply but one is really to start a new thread. Sometimes I only get the post a reply button but when you click on it nothing happens.
Just now I get the words but they are not contained in a box. IS this normal for this site?

and WHERE IS THE PAGE WITH ALL OF THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE INITIALS?
thank you [/*]

Could it be your browser? Mine looks fine. If you have Firefox, try using that instead.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by KindraLore


I hear ya SilverDove. I just don't understand how anyone could justify a man walking out on his pregnant wife and children and have the Nation looking for him and it be ok. I mean unless he or they were in some sort of danger. And even then, seems like at some point he would try to contact her and let her know that so she would not worry about him. [/*]

I think that is the whole thing. Does C know that he might have left her? Does she have the whole Nation looking thinking it will bring him home? She does have a lot of lose if he leaves her. No more stay at home mom, no more day to day help with the kids, no having coffee brought to you and many more.

My thing is random violence happens in Seattle but as I have said over and over they just aren't this neat about it. Car jacks end up with kids in the back but not taking the people in the front with them. Robbers stab/shot the person and run off with the stuff not the person. Sex crimes are normally against women at least where they are kidnapped and killed. If there was debt why not threaten the wife and kids? Killing the guy doesn't get you paid.

I just can't come up with a random act or a deliberate where they take him away and he doesn't fight.

[n/t]

Is this them?

http://profile.ak.facebook.com/profile5/370/90/s1017036184_4094.jpg

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by decor
This is a site question.
Sometimes I get 2 boxes that say Post a Reply but one is really to start a new thread. Sometimes I only get the post a reply button but when you click on it nothing happens.
Just now I get the words but they are not contained in a box. IS this normal for this site?

and WHERE IS THE PAGE WITH ALL OF THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE INITIALS?
thank you [/*]

Do you mean this?

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?threadid=248485&highlight=acronyms

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


I think that is the whole thing. Does C know that he might have left her? Does she have the whole Nation looking thinking it will bring him home? She does have a lot of lose if he leaves her. No more stay at home mom, no more day to day help with the kids, no having coffee brought to you and many more.

My thing is random violence happens in Seattle but as I have said over and over they just aren't this neat about it. Car jacks end up with kids in the back but not taking the people in the front with them. Robbers stab/shot the person and run off with the stuff not the person. Sex crimes are normally against women at least where they are kidnapped and killed. If there was debt why not threaten the wife and kids? Killing the guy doesn't get you paid.

I just can't come up with a random act or a deliberate where they take him away and he doesn't fight. [/*]

Well I have personally read lots of random acts like car jackings. I don't know what you mean about kids in the back.

As far as taking the people with them, you should google Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom then. Sometimes people are just mean and you cannot just discount that. Especially if they are on drugs or just committed a crime and need a fast get away. Who knows...

[field of snow]

Yes, NT, it is.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


I think that is the whole thing. Does C know that he might have left her? Does she have the whole Nation looking thinking it will bring him home? She does have a lot of lose if he leaves her. No more stay at home mom, no more day to day help with the kids, no having coffee brought to you and many more.

My thing is random violence happens in Seattle but as I have said over and over they just aren't this neat about it. Car jacks end up with kids in the back but not taking the people in the front with them. Robbers stab/shot the person and run off with the stuff not the person. Sex crimes are normally against women at least where they are kidnapped and killed. If there was debt why not threaten the wife and kids? Killing the guy doesn't get you paid.

I just can't come up with a random act or a deliberate where they take him away and he doesn't fight. [/*]

Maybe they told him that as long as he did what they said then he wouldn't get hurt.

My question is.. if he left her.. then why leave his great job? Why not use his cell phone that was provided by his employer? Why not just tell police so that they stop looking for him?

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Danette44


What really bites me right now - is seeing her write word for word some lyrics down from a movie she saw today! How in the world can you concentrate like that knowing your husband is missing and could be dead (godforbid thats not the case) or hurt somewhere? I would be a basket case, so this just makes me lean more towards she knows what has happen to him or he left her! JMOO [/*]

Or maybe she was watching "Bewitched". A comedy. To have some laughter in the house.

Or "When A Man Loves A Woman". An inspiring movie that shows the power of love.

Both movies include that REM song.

[need2no]

Originally posted by KindraLore


Who is gonna slam you? Its not me. Heck I know most here don't like what I have to say either. It's alright though.

I can question it though right? You are comparing a murderer to Christine. So then my question goes back to the fact of do you think she actually is a murderer? If not, what exactly is "off".

And yes, I do like your George Patton quote because if you haven't noticed, I'm a minority around here. lol [/*]

Actually one way I expected to be slammed was by some pointing out and questioning why I was comparing a child murderer to Christine, which is exactly what you did. That's okay though, I expected someone to question the comparison, and at least you weren't rude about it. I followed the Susan Smith case closely (partially because I live in SC), and also because the first time I saw her on the national news my gut feeling was that she was lying, based on her words, actions, and what to me appeared to be fake emotion....therein lies the comparsions between the 2 women as I see it. Heck my own hubby asked me how I could be so cruel about a poor woman who's children had been kidnapped.


And no, I don't think Christine murdered Nicholas.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by need2no


Actually one way I expected to be slammed was by some pointing out and questioning why I was comparing a child murderer to Christine, which is exactly what you did. That's okay though, I expected someone to question the comparison, and at least you weren't rude about it. I followed the Susan Smith case closely (partially because I live in SC), and also because the first time I saw her on the national news my gut feeling was that she was lying, based on her words, actions, and what to me appeared to be fake emotion....therein lies the comparsions between the 2 women as I see it. Heck my own hubby asked me how I could be so cruel about a poor woman who's children had been kidnapped.


And no, I don't think Christine murdered Nicholas. [/*]

Hey, if you think I slammed you because I questioned it, I am sorry. I didn't. I was just trying to figure out where you stood.

[decor]

Kindra
I am using Firefox.


Mystry
Yes! thanks

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia

It isn't about being offended that some see her as suspicious. It is about the fact that some of those that see her as suspicious seem to want to make everything that she does suspect.. which takes away from their points.. since it almost seems like they are not being objective regarding her.

We are here to discuss the disappearance of Nicholas.. not about whether Christing watched a movie or not.

And.. you know what.. you make my point right in your post sherryhefner..

You said.. "Christine is raking in the donated cash while sitting at home typing songs on the internet"

She posted one song on the internet.. almost 3 weeks after her husband went missing but by looking at your post.. you would think that is all she is doing. [/*]

Actually this isn't the first song she posted - she put a couple on ETSY maybe a week or so ago.

[n/t]

Has anyone asked CW to create a separate forum for this case? I'm having a hard time locating links. The church link that's being discussed for example. I went back 4 pages and still can't find it.

If anyone did ask CW, let me know so I won't. If not, I'll PM her the request.

TIA

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by n/t
Has anyone asked CW to create a separate forum for this case? I'm having a hard time locating links. The church link that's being discussed for example. I went back 4 pages and still can't find it.

If anyone did ask CW, let me know so I won't. If not, I'll PM her the request.

TIA [/*]

Great idea N/T. This thread is getting soooooooooo long.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by n/t
Has anyone asked CW to create a separate forum for this case? I'm having a hard time locating links. The church link that's being discussed for example. I went back 4 pages and still can't find it.

If anyone did ask CW, let me know so I won't. If not, I'll PM her the request.

TIA [/*]

I haven't but I think we could use it. It would take some time though to get all the links on the sticky thread though, right?

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia
(snipped)

Why not just tell police so that they stop looking for him? [/*]

Maybe he has and maybe they have. We've heard nothing.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Envision

I know her from etsy and have been in chatrooms with her where she had painted quite a different story of her marriage than now. That her story has changed now that he is missing, is no shock to me. She is a storyteller of convenience. She will only tell what suits her to look good. [/*]

I thought most everything she was saying has made Nicholas look good. Not her. I don't recall her saying anything about what a great wife or mother she is. I do recall her saying how wonderful Nicholas is.

We only have your word, Envision, that Christine made disparaging remarks about her marriage. We don't have links provided to these forum discussions. We don't know the context of these remarks.

[n/t]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I haven't but I think we could use it. It would take some time though to get all the links on the sticky thread though, right? [/*]

Yeah. Someone will have to repost all the links or it could be a group effort but at least we'll have a place to post them separately without having to sift through pages to look for one.

I'll put in a request to CW for a separate forum. Hopefully, she'll accept. :)

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by hippiegirl


true, but he wouldn't go to the PD, as they would probably arrest him right then and there, if, indeed he has done something wrong at church or work..

If he has done something wrong at church or at work LE probably knows about it by now.. [/*]

OK this is what I don't get.

There is nothing that says that the police want him in regards to anything he did wrong at work or church.

They can NOT arrest him without an arrest warrant and there is none!

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by n/t


Yeah. Someone will have to repost all the links or it could be a group effort but at least we'll have a place to post them separately without having to sift through pages to look for one.

I'll put in a request to CW for a separate forum. Hopefully, she'll accept. :) [/*]

Okay I've got some in my favorites that may help.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by n/t


Yeah. Someone will have to repost all the links or it could be a group effort but at least we'll have a place to post them separately without having to sift through pages to look for one.

I'll put in a request to CW for a separate forum. Hopefully, she'll accept. :) [/*]

Thank you N/T.

[mc528]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Since we are listing the reasons that Nicholas may be missing, one has yet to be discussed.

That is Nicholas may have committed suicide. Since we are discussing what might have happened to him, it's needs to be part of the discussion.

It would explain the statement Christine made about him not being a coward. Was this what she was talking about? [/*]

An interesting thought, but if that were the case, how did his car end up where it did, with apparently no evidence that would explain his disappearance? And where would his body be?

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Musterion


I thought most everything she was saying has made Nicholas look good. Not her. I don't recall her saying anything about what a great wife or mother she is. I do recall her saying how wonderful Nicholas is.

We only have your word, Envision, that Christine made disparaging remarks about her marriage. We don't have links provided to these forum discussions. We don't know the context of these remarks. [/*]

Musterion.. you took the words right out of my mouth.

Envision.. if you have those links where she talks differently about Nicholas.. can you please post them?

[need2no]

Originally posted by KindraLore


Hey, if you think I slammed you because I questioned it, I am sorry. I didn't. I was just trying to figure out where you stood. [/*]

Sorry slow to respond, I had a phone call and couldn't seem to type here and talk-lol.

No, I didn't consider it a slam because you questioned it in a polite manner. I suspected some may rudely blast me and state/scream there is no comparison between Susan and Christine. To inquire where I was coming from is just debating/discussing the case which is why I post. I have no problem with differing opinions, and welcome them. How boring the world would be if we all saw through the same eyes. Sorry if it sounded like I inferred you were slamming me.

We good now? :D

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by need2no


Sorry slow to respond, I had a phone call and couldn't seem to type here and talk-lol.

No, I didn't consider it a slam because you questioned it in a polite manner. I suspected some may rudely blast me and state/scream there is no comparison between Susan and Christine. To inquire where I was coming from is just debating/discussing the case which is why I post. I have no problem with differing opinions, and welcome them. How boring the world would be if we all saw through the same eyes. Sorry if it sounded like I inferred you were slamming me.

We good now? :D [/*]

We were good to start with n2n! ;)

[n/t]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
the church link is the 7th one down [/*]

Thanks for reposting it.

[field of snow]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia



Envision.. if you have those links where she talks differently about Nicholas.. can you please post them? [/*]

There are no links because it was in live chat. There is no way to log that chat and of course, at the time, nobody would have guessed why it would ever be needed.

I also have been in some of those chats. I didn't realize until Envision first came here and described them that was who was talking like that (under BellaStyleBoutique, not her latest Etsy Seller name that starts with an R )

It is all hearsay, but what is not is her shilling. I am still perturbed by that. Several days before this happened, too..

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by snowfield


There are no links because it was in live chat. There is no way to log that chat and of course, at the time, nobody would have guessed why it would ever be needed.

I also have been in some of those chats. I didn't realize until Envision first came here and described them that was who was talking like that (under BellaStyleBoutique, not her latest Etsy Seller name that starts with an R )

It is all hearsay, but what is not is her shilling. I am still perturbed by that. Several days before this happened, too.. [/*]

Well I guess we have to take yall's word for it then. lol

As far as "shilling" I think that is a term used on eBay when one bids against themselves to up the amount of the final auction price. I believe (correct me if I am wrong) Etsy has a set price, no auctions.

[need2no]

Originally posted by snowfield


~respectfully snipped~

It is all hearsay, but what is not is her shilling. I am still perturbed by that. Several days before this happened, too.. [/*]




Could you elaborate on the above comment, please.

[need2no]

Originally posted by hippiegirl


added here now...."driven there" refers to the storage unit [/*]

Don't you think LE, (or perhaps even Christine), would have checked out the storage unit by now?

[decor]

shilling is when a person bids up a price at any auction, RL or ebay or any other auction site, with the only intention of driving the bid up but not to actually buy the item.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by decor
shilling is when a person bids up a price at any auction, RL or ebay or any other auction site, with the only intention of driving the bid up but not to actually buy the item. [/*]

If it's a fixed price, how can you drive up the bid?

[KindraLore]

IS there a storage unit? I know they said a witness purportedly saw his car at a storage unit place, but I haven't seen there actually is one that Nick or Christine owned.

* edited to ad it seems that would be something LE could easily figure out and or track.

[decor]

kindra
trying to quote you but get a You cannot access this page

you can't shill a fixed price. shilling only refers to auctions.

the shiller can be the same person on the internet or another person that was arranged to shill. shillers are often used at real auctions even though shilling is illegal.

[field of snow]

Somewhat similar...there are different ways to use that term.

A shill is an associate of a person selling goods or services or a political group, who pretends no association to the seller/group and assumes the air of an enthusiastic customer.

In marketing, shills are often employed to assume the air of satisfied customers and give testimonials to the merits of a given product. This type of shilling is illegal in some jurisdictions and almost impossible to detect. It may be considered a form of unjust enrichment or unfair competition, as in California's Business & Professions Code § 17200, which prohibits "unfair or fraudulent business act[s] or practice[s] and unfair, deceptive, untrue or misleading advertising".

Christine's RinnoviBodySpa Etsy Shop was opened on feb 1 (in addition her already established BellaStyleBoutique)

Nicholas' Kauno Etsy Shop was opened on Feb 2

On Feb 6, he sold a banner/avatar package and on Feb 6 (same day), she gave feedback under RinnoviBodySpa saying:
"AMAZING! This seller has it all. Top design skills, great communication, and very creative. Meets the needs of the client."
and "he" left this for her:
"Great buy, easy work with and pleasant communication! Thanks!"

http://www.etsy.com/feedback_public.php?user_id=5591152

I am sure he designed her logo..whatever. It's just tacky and deceptive to use your spouse to leave feedback to beef up your feedback rating. Most people link to their spouse's stores, too.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by decor
kindra
trying to quote you but get a You cannot access this page

you can't shill a fixed price. shilling only refers to auctions.

the shiller can be the same person on the internet or another person that was arranged to shill. shillers are often used at real auctions even though shilling is illegal. [/*]

Thanks for the explanation decor.

btw, its been crazy for me too on the boards as well. Lots of "lagging" where when I post it sits forever.

Anyway, nite all.

[mc528]

hippie....I don't believe it was ever confirmed that the sighting at a storage unit was indeed Nicholas' car. I do suppose that the theory could still hold true and he drove the car to the condo complex parking area (and then continued with his plan). However if the reportings that the car was moved several times over a couple days time period, then that would mean that Nicholas was still in that immediate area hiding both he and the car...since the license number was being looked for, and his picture was all over the place on fliers and the news. But, given that this case, on the surface at least, doesn't fit any *typical* profiles....anything is possible.

[need2no]

Originally posted by KindraLore
IS there a storage unit? I know they said a witness purportedly saw his car at a storage unit place, but I haven't seen there actually is one that Nick or Christine owned.

* edited to ad it seems that would be something LE could easily figure out and or track. [/*]


I wish we knew one way or the other. I suppose I kind of bought into them having a storage unit because of Christine's home based business, and noting how small their house is it just seemed reasonable. I guess it's also possible Nickolas had a storage unit Christine wasn't aware of.

[decor]

snow

I don't think it was any big deal. I am sure there are far worse things that go on.
I know no one likes to be deceived but it was only for feedback to start a new business.


which makes me wonder if something happened only in the last few days before he disappeared that made him want to disappear because he had just opened that store unless Christine had him do it.

[kpb]

Hello everyone,

I have been lurking since page 20 I believe because I wasn't aware I was able to post replies now! So hello!

Regarding the above shilling comment:
Not sure, but it may be in reference to where C bought a banner/avatar from her husband's shop and wrote the feedback as if he were someone she didn't know.

C also started a thread on Etsy recommending his shop saying she was very happy with her purchase, but did not mention he was her husband.

To me it is dishonest. Why not just go ahead and say my husband does awesome work, please check out his shop?? :) If anyone would like to see the threads, I can probably find the links.

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by snowfield
Somewhat similar...there are different ways to use that term.





Christine's RinnoviBodySpa Etsy Shop was opened on feb 1 (in addition her already established BellaStyleBoutique)

Nicholas' Kauno Etsy Shop was opened on Feb 2

On Feb 6, he sold a banner/avatar package and on Feb 6 (same day), she gave feedback under RinnoviBodySpa saying:
"AMAZING! This seller has it all. Top design skills, great communication, and very creative. Meets the needs of the client."
and "he" left this for her:
"Great buy, easy work with and pleasant communication! Thanks!"

http://www.etsy.com/feedback_public.php?user_id=5591152

I am sure he designed her logo..whatever. It's just tacky and deceptive to use your spouse to leave feedback to beef up your feedback rating. Most people link to their spouse's stores, too. [/*]

She also was telling about this new shop she had visited and what a wonderful shop it was, etc. on the promotions threads. The shop was her husband's, of course.

[kpb]

Another thought I had, although C has in her Etsy Store Announcement that her shops are closed, I would think to close her stores she would remove all items by inactivating them. A lot of buyers don't read the shop announcement.

She has sold a few things since N went missing and has shipped the items as she has received feedback.

[field of snow]

I know there are worse things that go on (Although, on any other given day, some of those same Etsy sellers supporting her would rake her over the coals for being caught doing this..).

It's still deception though.

And I am thinking Christine was probably managing it and wrote both. He already had a full plate and she was already familiar with Etsy. All he needed to do is be given the orders to complete.

But whatever.. everyone lies, so we should look beyond anything that shows she has the capability to lie....:-/

Originally posted by decor
snow

I don't think it was any big deal. I am sure there are far worse things that go on.
I know no one likes to be deceived but it was only for feedback to start a new business.


which makes me wonder if something happened only in the last few days before he disappeared that made him want to disappear because he had just opened that store unless Christine had him do it. [/*]

[field of snow]

Originally posted by Curiouser


She also was telling about this new shop she had visited and what a wonderful shop it was, etc. on the promotions threads. The shop was her husband's, of course. [/*]

Oh yeah. And that too. But hey, everyone lies, so we shouldn't think she would lie beyond this.

[Curiouser]

Has anyone stopped to consider how busy Christine must have been? She has two small children to take care of and neither apparently goes to any type of pre-k or daycare. She's making lotions, etc. for the Rinnovabodyspa store and sewing aprons and such for the BellaBoutique and selling quite a few, at least an average of one a day I believe so she's having to keep up with the sewing plus packing and shipping these items, taking pictures and listing new items on her sites. She also has a photography site and is on My Space or similar sites and I believe does some blogging. She seems to be spending quite a bit of time on the etsy forums and chat rooms. When did she have time to cook, clean house a bit, do laundry and all that daily stuff that just keeps piling up? Makes me tired just thinking about it!!!

[need2no]

NF was reported [/*] missing on February 14th, correct?

Without going back and listening to the interviews again...did Christine ever say if she tried to contact Nicholas by phone on the evening of the 13th when he didn't made it home timely? Did she comment about NF telling her his cell phone was dead and she wouldn't be able to reach him after he left work Wednesday night? Did she say it was unusal for NF to let his cell phone battery run down, or state whether he had a car phone charger? Did she say if she contacted friends or family on the evening of the 13th to ask if they had seen him? If so did any of these friends or family attempt to look for NF or his car? Unless I have forgotten I don't think she remarked about any of this.

If nothing happened until the 14th, NF had a considerable head start.

I thought LE had to wait 24 or 48 hours before investigating a missing adult case unless there was evidence of foul play.

[kpb]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by need2no
NF was reported [/*] missing on February 14th, correct?

QUOTE]

I thought she called the police at 10pm on 2/13/08.

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by kpb
[QUOTE]Originally posted by need2no
NF was reported [/*] missing on February 14th, correct?

QUOTE]

I thought she called the police at 10pm on 2/13/08. [/*]

Yes, that's what she said. She started getting worried when he wasn't home to make the cookies by 8 o'clock which was bedtime and then called the police when he still wasn't there by 10.

[need2no]

Originally posted by kpb
Hello everyone,

I have been lurking since page 20 I believe because I wasn't aware I was able to post replies now! So hello!

Regarding the above shilling comment:
Not sure, but it may be in reference to where C bought a banner/avatar from her husband's shop and wrote the feedback as if he were someone she didn't know.

C also started a thread on Etsy recommending his shop saying she was very happy with her purchase, but did not mention he was her husband.

To me it is dishonest. Why not just go ahead and say my husband does awesome work, please check out his shop?? :) If anyone would like to see the threads, I can probably find the links. [/*]

Welcome to the board kpb! :seeya:

Yes, I would like the link. TIA!

[need2no]

Thanks for all your responses about CF reporting NF missing at 10pm on the 13th...guess I forgot.

Now, does anyone know if there is indeed a 24 to 48 hr. waiting period before LE will actually search/investigate a missing adult unless there is evidence of foul play? I'm not talking about taking a report, I'm talking about actually conducting an investigation.

Does this vary by state?

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
well, good people, i have to lay my head down and sleep..
nite nite...keep thinking! [/*]


Every time I finally get all the posts read and am ready to start chatting about this, everyone goes off to bed!!! Wwhhaaaa!!

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser



Every time I finally get all the posts read and am ready to start chatting about this, everyone goes off to bed!!! Wwhhaaaa!! [/*]


LOL...I know how you feel! :D

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by decor
snow

I don't think it was any big deal. I am sure there are far worse things that go on.
I know no one likes to be deceived but it was only for feedback to start a new business.


which makes me wonder if something happened only in the last few days before he disappeared that made him want to disappear because he had just opened that store unless Christine had him do it. [/*]

She probably opened the store herself and filled out the profile and the shop announcement, etc. All he would have to do was do the work when something sold.

[mc528]

Originally posted by kpb
Another thought I had, although C has in her Etsy Store Announcement that her shops are closed, I would think to close her stores she would remove all items by inactivating them. A lot of buyers don't read the shop announcement.

She has sold a few things since N went missing and has shipped the items as she has received feedback. [/*]

I had noticed that too. Her shops technically aren't really closed, since all of her items are still actively listed, and almost no buyers visit the main shop page if they are purchasing based on a search. I think some, if not all of the sales that she has made since 2/13 have actually been to other Etsy sellers, none of which are actually expecting a product...they just wished to donate the sales $ to her. Maybe she doesn't know about de-activating her listings....but since she's been a seller there since 2006 (I believe) she more than likely does, especially since she seems to be in communication with other Etsy sellers, who would certainly have already suggested this to her. This is just another reason that led me to think that maybe someone else is actually posting under her shop name in the forum, and not necessarily her. JMO

[need2no]

Originally posted by Envision


She could still report him however I do not believe any search or investigation would have taken place until the following day. At 10pm, he would have only been missing 4 hours and that is not really considered missing yet. [/*]

I just went on a search and found this info. :


In Washington, thousands of adults are reported missing each year. You may have seen on television or heard that you must wait 24 or even 72 hours to report someone missing. This is not true. There is no required waiting period. In fact, the sooner law enforcement has a case the sooner they can get to work in helping you find the missing person. Very few missing adults are victims of foul play or some other criminal act. Most missing persons are found or return home within just a few days. If any foul play is suspected the investigation changes and escalates accordingly.
Being a missing person is not a crime. Adults can be missing if they choose to. They can choose to leave work, ignore friends and even family. Because of this, law enforcement is quite limited in what they can do. Even if law enforcement does locate the person, they can not divulge any private information about that person without specific permission from that person.
Information about your missing loved one may be entered into the national database, National Crime Information Center (NCIC). A report may be taken, but there are specific criterion for missing persons to be entered into NCIC. They can be entered into NCIC only when the missing person has a physical handicap or mental disability, if they are missing involuntarily (kidnapped), if they are a victim of a catastrophe or if they are in some way endangered.
Social Security will not provide a missing person’s address but will forward a letter. Call Social Security at 1-800-772-1212 to determine your eligibility for the letter forwarding service and to ascertain if the social security number is active.
http://www.fnfvcv.org/support.html

This is only a small portion of what is on this site..interesting reading over there.

[kpb]

Kinda OT, but how can I make where I DON'T get an email notification every time someone replies to this thread?

[isitme]

I don't know about the laws there but here in Michigan they will take a report and put out a BOTLO but will not "actively" search until the person has been missing for 24 hours.

At least that is what I was told and is how they handled it back in 1995 when my father was missing.

[Curiouser]

Is it true that Christine had another visit with the police in the last few days, Friday I think was mentioned? But I suppose no one has heard what it might have been about? Its really frustrating that no one is saying anything about what's going on. Even NF's mother and sisters aren't out there any more.

I did think his mother made a rather strange comment on one of the news interviews she did. She stated something to the effect that he wouldn't leave and not tell "his sisters" and "his mother" but then she says "the wife" and "the children" like they certainly don't have the same status as Mom and the sisses.

[mc528]

Originally posted by Envision
It actually involves a good amount of time to deactivate listings as you have to do each one separately. Then if he had shown up the following day and she'd have to reactivate...If it was me, I'd be pulling my hair out. So I'll give her that one. [/*]

True, between her two shops she does have a little over 200 listings. It probably would take about an hour (maybe less) to put them all in edit mode....and a little longer to reactivate them.

[isitme]

Originally posted by kpb
Kinda OT, but how can I make where I DON'T get an email notification every time someone replies to this thread? [/*]

Go to "user cp" at the top and deactivate this thread.

[Curiouser]

I don't understand why it isn't a crime to abandon your children, which in turn may make the remaining parent have to file for county or state help, which is paid for by the taxpayers who really shouldn't have to be responsible for a runaway person's children!!! He/she made these children in the first place and they should be held responsible for supporting them.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision


You know as well as I do that chatrooms aren't logged on etsy. However, she is why I stopped doing chats. I could not stand her bragging about herself being superwoman and her husband being a trained seal in her mind. [/*]

OK how would I know that? I am not on etsy.. never have been but ooookay.

I think your post says it all Envision. You are not unbiased.. you couldn't stand her. I am starting to understand your posts alot more.

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by Envision
When I heard "the wife and the children", it sounded like maybe she doesn't accept them as her daughter in law and grandchildren or subconsciously blaming them for his disappearance. [/*]


Subconciously?? Maybe even conciously! And if so, for what reason I wonder.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser
Is it true that Christine had another visit with the police in the last few days, Friday I think was mentioned? But I suppose no one has heard what it might have been about? Its really frustrating that no one is saying anything about what's going on. Even NF's mother and sisters aren't out there any more.

I did think his mother made a rather strange comment on one of the news interviews she did. She stated something to the effect that he wouldn't leave and not tell "his sisters" and "his mother" but then she says "the wife" and "the children" like they certainly don't have the same status as Mom and the sisses. [/*]

If you notice in my post upthread...it says if LE does locate the 'missing' person they cannot divulge any private information about that person without specific permission from that person. I take it if they found NF and he said he needed to get away to clear his head, or had a girlfriend, or was running from debt, or contemplating a divorce, etc. etc. that all LE could tell CF was NF was located alive and their investigation is officially over. It sounds like they can't even say where he is at or why he left unless he gives LE specific permission to do so.

[kpb]

Originally posted by need2no


Welcome to the board kpb! :seeya:

Yes, I would like the link. TIA! [/*]

Thank you need2no!

Here are 2 links I found.


Link #1 to thread on Etsy that C started about N's shop (http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5456227)

Link #2 (http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5456263)

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by need2no


If you notice in my post upthread...it says if LE does locate the 'missing' person they cannot divulge any private information about that person without specific permission from that person. I take it if they found NF and he said he needed to get away to clear his head, or had a girlfriend, or was running from debt, or contemplating a divorce, etc. etc. that all LE could tell CF was NF was located alive and their investigation is officially over. It sounds like they can't even say where he is at or why he left unless he gives LE specific permission to do so. [/*]

So are you saying maybe the visit they had with CF late last week was to let her know they'd found him but that's all they could tell her??

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by need2no


If you notice in my post upthread...it says if LE does locate the 'missing' person they cannot divulge any private information about that person without specific permission from that person. I take it if they found NF and he said he needed to get away to clear his head, or had a girlfriend, or was running from debt, or contemplating a divorce, etc. etc. that all LE could tell CF was NF was located alive and their investigation is officially over. It sounds like they can't even say where he is at or why he left unless he gives LE specific permission to do so. [/*]

That is my understand also need2no.

The case would then be closed as far as LE goes.

As far as I know.. this case is still open.

[kpb]

Originally posted by Curiouser


So are you saying maybe the visit they had with CF late last week was to let her know they'd found him but that's all they could tell her?? [/*]

Interesting! So many twists and turns to this story. I hope we eventually get an answer and that it is that he is alive and safe.

[kpb]

Originally posted by isitme


Go to "user cp" at the top and deactivate this thread. [/*]

Thank you for that isitme!

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser
I don't understand why it isn't a crime to abandon your children, which in turn may make the remaining parent have to file for county or state help, which is paid for by the taxpayers who really shouldn't have to be responsible for a runaway person's children!!! He/she made these children in the first place and they should be held responsible for supporting them. [/*]

I'm pretty sure if she receives state assistance in the form of child support, NF would be liable to repay the amount she receives if he turns up. Of course there is also welfare, WIC, food stamps, free medical and dental care, education for her, reduced or free school lunches, reduced or free childcare, heck I even heard about a new reduced price cell phone program for people on welfare ...and I have no idea how all that works.

But I agree..how can a father just up and walk away and leave tax payers to support the children he created.

[Curiouser]

UPDATE!! UPDATE!! Christine posted this about 3 hours ago apparently on the support blog (it was dated 9:02 p.m., I just saw it 2 seconds ago although I was on their about 15 minutes ago and it was not there then. It is now 12:20 a.m. my time (EST).

__________________________________________________

"the detective on the case is on vacation until 3/13 so i’m not sure much will get uncovered until then. I’m glad to know you are all still here as many of the emails and phone calls have stopped as people are tired and there really isn’t anything new to say."

_________________________________________________

Maybe we should e-mail her and just ask WTH is going on!!

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser


So are you saying maybe the visit they had with CF late last week was to let her know they'd found him but that's all they could tell her?? [/*]


Well...I'm not saying that..but the thought did cross my mind.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision


If you read correctly, I didn't say I could not stand HER, I said I could not stand her bragging and dissing. Big difference there. I actually am impressed with her aprons although she did fib about her making her own patterns for them as those are Simplicity and McCalls commercial patterns.

Do you know Christine personally? If you do, it would sure explain why you are so defensive about her. Afraid to admit fault with her? You sure know quite a bit about etsy, are you sure you're not a member there? [/*]
I never heard of etsy til last week... and I can assure you that I am not a member there. I am a member of insessions and before that CTV message boards.. you can search my posts.. they will speak for themselves.

I have never met Christine and I am not defending her. I am trying to look at the case without any bias.. based just on the facts. I have stated that many times.. and I have said what my problems with her and her story are. I don't think it does anybody any good to come on to a message board just to slam on someone.

How do you know that she said that she made THOSE patterns.. I thought I read here a few days ago that her story of how she began making things etc. was that she got a new sewing machine and started making things and even began creating her own patterns. I didn't read that it was those patterns specifically. Do you have the link to that?

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser
UPDATE!! UPDATE!! Christine posted this about 3 hours ago apparently on the support blog (it was dated 9:02 p.m., I just saw it 2 seconds ago although I was on their about 15 minutes ago and it was not there then. It is now 12:20 a.m. my time (EST).

__________________________________________________

"the detective on the case is on vacation until 3/13 so i’m not sure much will get uncovered until then. I’m glad to know you are all still here as many of the emails and phone calls have stopped as people are tired and there really isn’t anything new to say."

_________________________________________________

Maybe we should e-mail her and just ask WTH is going on!! [/*]


"NOT MUCH WILL GET UNCOVERED UNTIL THEN" WTH????????

This does not sound like the words of a distraught (pregnant) wife and mother who's husband mysteriously disappeared, and she has no idea what may have happened.

"I'm glad to know you are all still here" (and donating).

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth


3/13? Obviously not working on a STAT basis are they? That in itself says something. [/*]


Yes it does. If they were working on a STAT basis either the PI would postpone his MARCH vacation, or another PI would step in.
A lot can happen in a week.

[mc528]

Originally posted by Beth


3/13? Obviously not working on a STAT basis are they? That in itself says something. [/*]

If the police dept only has one person qualified to work on the case, and since that person is out for the next 10 days, so nothing new will develop....that does explain why a PI was brought in on the first days. Sorry, but MOO is that this is just another of the statements that don't add up in this case.

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by need2no



"NOT MUCH WILL GET UNCOVERED UNTIL THEN" WTH????????

This does not sound like the words of a distraught (pregnant) wife and mother who's husband mysteriously disappeared, and she has no idea what may have happened.

"I'm glad to know you are all still here" (and donating). [/*]

UH yeah need2no.. I would be beating down their doors. Not just saying.. oh well.. they will look at it again on the 13th. hmmm

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by mc528


If the police dept only has one person qualified to work on the case, and since that person is out for the next 10 days, so nothing new will develop....that does explain why a PI was brought in on the first days. Sorry, but MOO is that this is just another of the statements that don't add up in this case. [/*]

I agree.. that doesn't seem normal, at all. Either she is completely numb and has shut down or something is wrong with this picture.

[need2no]

Would LE ask CF to come to the station just to advise her they had no news to report?

Wonder how she found out about the PI, he has no responsibility to report to her, or LE.

I'm trying to put myself in Christine's place. If I found out the employer hired PI was going on vacation for about 2 weeks I believe I would call the employer and ask them if they could please have another PI assigned to the case, and/or use some of the donations, or ask family to help to hire my own PI (which I would prefer anyway).
I don't know about Christine, but to me time would be of the essence. Her comment sounded so ho hum...oh well, gosh it looks like it's going to be a while before we get any information for me to post on blogs...my oh my. GEEZ...is it just me?

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by Envision


If you read correctly, I didn't say I could not stand HER, I said I could not stand her bragging and dissing. Big difference there. I actually am impressed with her aprons although she did fib about her making her own patterns for them as those are Simplicity and McCalls commercial patterns.

Do you know Christine personally? If you do, it would sure explain why you are so defensive about her. Afraid to admit fault with her? You sure know quite a bit about etsy, are you sure you're not a member there? [/*]

I looked at several of the aprons she has listed and all the ones I checked have the following in the description:

"*Bridgett Hostess Apron pattern and name are under full copyright protection. Any infringement upon this copyright protection will result in prosecution" (the name of the apron is changed for whatever apron listing it is).

So are they hers or Simplicity or McCall's??

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by Envision


It is or was in profile in her shop. I am going to ignore you from now on because you are not here to discuss this case but are here to pick fights with anyone who does not see it the way you do. Have a lovely evening. [/*]
This case is about Nicholas.. not about Christine and whether she made a pattern for a apron or not.

We can just agree to disagree on this.

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by need2no
Would LE ask CF to come to the station just to advise her they had no news to report?

Wonder how she found out about the PI, he has no responsibility to report to her, or LE.

I'm trying to put myself in Christine's place. If I found out the employer hired PI was going on vacation for about 2 weeks I believe I would call the employer and ask them if they could please have another PI assigned to the case, and/or use some of the donations, or ask family to help to hire my own PI (which I would prefer anyway).
I don't know about Christine, but to me time would be of the essence. Her comment sounded so ho hum...oh well, gosh it looks like it's going to be a while before we get any information for me to post on blogs...my oh my. GEEZ...is it just me? [/*]

She didn't say the PI was going on vacation, she said "the detective" which I took to mean the police dept. detective. Right or wrong??

[MystryPhobia]

Originally posted by need2no
Would LE ask CF to come to the station just to advise her they had no news to report?

Wonder how she found out about the PI, he has no responsibility to report to her, or LE.

I'm trying to put myself in Christine's place. If I found out the employer hired PI was going on vacation for about 2 weeks I believe I would call the employer and ask them if they could please have another PI assigned to the case, and/or use some of the donations, or ask family to help to hire my own PI (which I would prefer anyway).
I don't know about Christine, but to me time would be of the essence. Her comment sounded so ho hum...oh well, gosh it looks like it's going to be a while before we get any information for me to post on blogs...my oh my. GEEZ...is it just me? [/*]

No.. it isn't just you. That has been one of the things that has always piqued my curiousity about her. I would be freaking out.. begging for help to find him.. driving his route OVER and OVER again.. etc.

I would be asking.. okay.. if that detective is going on vacation then who is going to be taking our case and demanding that something be done.

It does however prove that it is still an open investigation or there would be no detective. So, they must not know where he is.

[mc528]

Originally posted by need2no
Would LE ask CF to come to the station just to advise her they had no news to report?

Wonder how she found out about the PI, he has no responsibility to report to her, or LE.

I'm trying to put myself in Christine's place. If I found out the employer hired PI was going on vacation for about 2 weeks I believe I would call the employer and ask them if they could please have another PI assigned to the case, and/or use some of the donations, or ask family to help to hire my own PI (which I would prefer anyway).
I don't know about Christine, but to me time would be of the essence. Her comment sounded so ho hum...oh well, gosh it looks like it's going to be a while before we get any information for me to post on blogs...my oh my. GEEZ...is it just me? [/*]

Maybe I'm mistaken, but I thought she was talking about the Police detective....not that PI that Nicholas' company had hired. In her previous posts regarding discussion with LE she had referenced meeting with the police detective on the case - not the PI.

[Silver_Dove]

King County Sheriff dept is large and well qualified but with no evidence and no leads after this time I think there is only one Sheriff Detective assigned to the case and with nothing new he is going away.

I'm sure if something does turn up someone will step in to do something.

I don't believe this is the PI going away and even if it was I can't see C having the right to ask her husbands company for anything really. They don't appear to have anything to do with his being missing.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser


She didn't say the PI was going on vacation, she said "the detective" which I took to mean the police dept. detective. Right or wrong?? [/*]


:o Oh geez, thank you for pointing that out. I misread or my tired brain went in the wrong direction-lol.

That's even worse ...yes I'd be screaming my lungs out and calling every media outlet to report this unbelieveable, unacceptable injustice, and would have a sit in at the LE station. Obviously LE doesn't think there was foul play or surely they would simply assign another detective to fill in or take over the case.

But my thoughts still stand, PI or detective...something is just not right here.

Sorry I misread and thanks again for straightening me out.

:)

[Curiouser]

Personally, if I didn't know where NF was and no more was happening in the search than it seems like, I would take some of the donation money and hire my own PI. Of course, we don't really know that there isn't more happening I guess. It may be happening and the public just hasn't been told about it.

[need2no]

Originally posted by mc528


Maybe I'm mistaken, but I thought she was talking about the Police detective....not that PI that Nicholas' company had hired. In her previous posts regarding discussion with LE she had referenced meeting with the police detective on the case - not the PI. [/*]

Thank-you, I had it screwed up...see my post below.:o

[Curiouser]

I'm sure a detective couldn't wait till every case he was working on was all done or he'd never get to go on vacation. Surely though there are other detectives that can step in for him for the duration of his vacation.

[Curiouser]

Good night, y'all!!

[need2no]

Originally posted by Envision
They still check leads and tips if any come in, however they won't go out of their way to actively obtain them. I am sure there will be someone to step in should a good lead come in. [/*]


What would be the point in even making Christine aware of this? For most this would just cause them to worry more.
If CF called LE to get an update and asked for the assigned detective then she would learn he was on vacation at that time. I doubt it is SOP to call and inform people when 'their' assigned detective goes on vacation, or is out ill.

A couple of years ago we had a break in (nothing taken) in our home, called LE and they came out and checked around, made a report. Long story short we discovered it was likely a teen boy in our neighborhood so I called and informed them. The detective said he would check into it and talk to the boy and his parents and let us know what he found out. After a week and no phone call I started calling him and left numerous messages. 2 weeks later I found out he had been in a bad car wreck, was hospitalized and they had yet to reassign his cases. I know this is no comparison to a missing person but I bet it's the similar SOP with most LE.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser
Good night, y'all!! [/*]


:seeya: Night Curiouser!

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth
I just think she's taking that bit of news rather well. [/*]


Sure sounds that way from her post.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Envision


I think they should have let you know he was "indisposed" and that the case would have to be reassigned. It's unprofessional IMO not to tell you. [/*]

We thought so too, and a month later still nothing had been done...in anger I told them just to forget about it. It cost us over a thousand dollars to replace 2 doors and repair another one. I'd go into more detail but I don't want the mod to nab me for being O/T.

I suppose in this case they would simply state they have no leads, no witnesses, nothing to check out from info provided by family, friends, co-workers, etc., and no foul play indicated, so unless or until they do have some info there isn't anything much for the detective to investigate or work on.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth
Or, was this not even stated by anybody and it's just buying more time? [/*]

Could be........

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia

I never heard of etsy til last week... and I can assure you that I am not a member there. I am a member of insessions and before that CTV message boards.. you can search my posts.. they will speak for themselves.

I have never met Christine and I am not defending her. I am trying to look at the case without any bias.. based just on the facts. I have stated that many times.. and I have said what my problems with her and her story are. I don't think it does anybody any good to come on to a message board just to slam on someone.

How do you know that she said that she made THOSE patterns.. I thought I read here a few days ago that her story of how she began making things etc. was that she got a new sewing machine and started making things and even began creating her own patterns. I didn't read that it was those patterns specifically. Do you have the link to that? [/*]

Here is the link to what she said about sewing and patterns.

http://www.etsy.com/profile.php?user_id=5008691

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Beth
I just think she's taking that bit of news rather well. [/*]

I'm baffled after reading that. Well I've been baffled all along really.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Snowbird


I have only been mostly lurking on this thread so far but I think I agree with both of you. I am not sure we have ever been this close to agreement before. Nice for a change.:beer: [/*]

Hi Snowbird :)

I enjoy reading everyone's opinions even if they differ from mine. What I don't want to happen is that after all these pages, links, and information for the thread to get shut down. Its happened before so I hope everyone can politely agree to disagree.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Envision


You know as well as I do that chatrooms aren't logged on etsy. However, she is why I stopped doing chats. I could not stand her bragging about herself being superwoman and her husband being a trained seal in her mind. [/*]

I know you aren't addressing me, but I myself knew nothing about Etsy before all of this. I know on AOL you can log a chat, so even if someone had told me about an Etsy chatroom I would have thought the chat could be logged. Of course why would you? Most of the time people who log chats are doing it just to cause trouble for someone for something they said (at least that is how it works on AOL lol)

[bitsy555]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I'm baffled after reading that. Well I've been baffled all along really. [/*]

That is really strange. That makes me think she knows something that we don't. I don't think I would be taking it that well....but maybe there is nothing more she can do.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by bitsy555


That is really strange. That makes me think she knows something that we don't. I don't think I would be taking it that well....but maybe there is nothing more she can do. [/*]

Right - she may feel helpless at this point and out of energy. This is where her family and friends need to help out. If they are not careful, this will go into a cold case box.

[decor]

Originally posted by Curiouser
UPDATE!! UPDATE!! Christine posted this about 3 hours ago apparently on the support blog (it was dated 9:02 p.m., I just saw it 2 seconds ago although I was on their about 15 minutes ago and it was not there then. It is now 12:20 a.m. my time (EST).

__________________________________________________

"the detective on the case is on vacation until 3/13 so i’m not sure much will get uncovered until then. I’m glad to know you are all still here as many of the emails and phone calls have stopped as people are tired and there really isn’t anything new to say."

_________________________________________________

Maybe we should e-mail her and just ask WTH is going on!! [/*]


I saw this on one of the blogs early last week but it also said that the case was given to someone else until he gets back. It is not like they said, Oh well going on vacation I'll put all my cases in a drawer.
I can guarantee there is never a time when the police don't have some case/s that they are investigating so when is a good time to go on vacation?

[greeneyez78]

Was anyone aware that he seems to have an alias that is nothing similiar to his real name???

I did verify that the person with the alias has the same birthdate listed, and the same type of vehicle and tag numbers....


As well as about 15 parking tickets.....one as current as 02/01/2008.........

[n/t]

Originally posted by greeneyez78
Was anyone aware that he seems to have an alias that is nothing similiar to his real name???

I did verify that the person with the alias has the same birthdate listed, and the same type of vehicle and tag numbers....


As well as about 15 parking tickets.....one as current as 02/01/2008......... [/*]

Where did you see this? Do you have a link?

[starling]

Originally posted by MystryPhobia


I understand that Envision.

If you say you don't think she should be posting because he is missing.. you then can not say it proves something about her when she isn't. Brings your credibility in to play more then hers IMO. You can't have it both ways. (by "you" I don't mean you specifically.. just all of us in general)

I mean.. c'mon.. I am all for looking at her.. but, be objective.. at this point.. she is a horrible mother because she may have watched the movie "unfaithful" in front of her children. To some.. she shouldn't even be watching TV. WHAT is she suppose to do? [/*]

I agree.
In the movie 'The Up Side of Anger' the wife did & said some
very off the wall things. I found myself disliking her character.
I decided, well, maybe she deserved to be 'left'.
She thought her husband ran off to Sweden with another woman
(spoiler)
All the time he was dead...
He had fallen down an old well on the back forty of their house.
She was not a perfect wife & he was a patient man who did not leave her.

I'm trying to keep an open mind about the missing of NF
JMO

[decor]

Originally posted by greeneyez78
Was anyone aware that he seems to have an alias that is nothing similiar to his real name???

I did verify that the person with the alias has the same birthdate listed, and the same type of vehicle and tag numbers....


As well as about 15 parking tickets.....one as current as 02/01/2008......... [/*]

I do not believe anyone is aware of that. can you post anymore info?

[greeneyez78]

Defendant Summary
Court Defendant Number: 628125
Name Of Record:
Aliases: NICHOLIS FRANCISCO
JIM CAMMACK

Date Of Birth: 01/23/1980
Language:
Employer:

[greeneyez78]

Defendant Summary
Court Defendant Number: 996041
Name Of Record: NICHOLAS S FRANCISCO
Aliases: NICHOLAS S FRANCISCO
NICHOLES FRANCISCO
NICHOLAS FRANCISCO

Date Of Birth: 01/23/1980
Language:
Employer:

[n/t]

In my opinion, Chrisitne probably initiated the call to find out if there was any news and that's when she was told the assigned detective is on vacation and returning on the 13th.

I agree LE doesn't take a break. It's not like one is on vacation and they close the investigation for 2 weeks.

Personally, I don't see anything wrong in what she posted. She was giving an update. What more can she do?

Seriously. If LE is working on the case and the file remains open, what else can one do?

[bitsy555]

Originally posted by starling


I agree.
In the movie 'The Up Side of Anger' the wife did & said some
very off the wall things. I found myself disliking her character.
I decided, well, maybe she deserved to be 'left'.
She thought her husband ran off to Sweden with another woman
(spoiler)
All the time he was dead...
He had fallen down an old well on the back forty of their house.
She was not a perfect wife & he was a patient man who did not leave her.

I'm trying to keep an open mind about the missing of NF
JMO [/*]

I'm really trying to keep any open mind to Starling. Just because she doesn't do things like I would....doesn't mean it is wrong. I keep telling myself that.

[bitsy555]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Right - she may feel helpless at this point and out of energy. This is where her family and friends need to help out. If they are not careful, this will go into a cold case box. [/*]

I fear that is going to happen.....

[greeneyez78]

These are the list of tickets on the first Nicholas listed.....


Case Citations Hearings Defendant Obligations Warrants
Case Number Type Status Filing Date Police Incident Number


202463625 IP CLSE 08/17/2006

202247288 IP CLSE 09/29/2004

202472335 IP CLSE 09/15/2006

202252533 IP CLSE 10/16/2004

202469164 IP CLSE 09/07/2006

202032245 IP CLSE 02/05/2003

202393403 IP CLSE 01/10/2006

201650826 IN CLSE 05/05/2000

202181857 IT CLSE 04/05/2004

202437984 IP CLSE 05/24/2006

202461294 IP CLSE 08/08/2006

202636847 IP OPEN 02/01/2008

202234613 IP CLSE 09/04/2004

[n/t]

greeneyez, except for Jim Cammack which is totally different, I could understand misspelling of his name.

I didn't know misspelling would be considered aliases. Was that intentional by Nicholas or the courts misspelled it?

[greeneyez78]

I understand all of the other ones, and no I dont consider those aliases.....but what about

Jim Cammack??

[decor]

Originally posted by n/t
greeneyez, except for Jim Cammack which is totally different, I could understand misspelling of his name.

I didn't know misspelling would be considered aliases. Was that intentional by Nicholas or the courts misspelled it? [/*]

It is not just the courts but ANYONE that misspells your name on anything considered legal and entered. I know because I was informed I had aliases of which I found to be quite amusing as I thought if I was going to hide I would change my name, not just the spelling.

[n/t]

Originally posted by greeneyez78
I understand all of the other ones, and no I dont consider those aliases.....but what about

Jim Cammack?? [/*]

Yeah that one is puzzling. Can you post a link to where you got that info from.

TIA!

[n/t]

Originally posted by decor


It is not just the courts but ANYONE that misspells your name on anything considered legal and entered. I know because I was informed I had aliases of which I found to be quite amusing as I thought if I was going to hide I would change my name, not just the spelling. [/*]

Thanks that's what I thought. It doesn't sound like he was intentinally trying to hide, imo.

The other name is puzzling though.

[need2no]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Here is the link to what she said about sewing and patterns.

http://www.etsy.com/profile.php?user_id=5008691 [/*]

Not to be picky lol,...but it says "an at home mom of 3 kids." :shrug:

[decor]

Originally posted by need2no


Not to be picky lol,...but it says "an at home mom of 3 kids." :shrug: [/*]

she is pregnant so she seems to refer to the child as one of her three.
I did read on one of the other sites where she said mother of three and then explained that she had two and one on the way

[need2no]

Originally posted by decor


she is pregnant so she seems to refer to the child as one of her three.
I did read on one of the other sites where she said mother of three and then explained that she had two and one on the way [/*]

Ok, I had considered that but just assumed she wrote the bio when she signed up in Nov. '06 as stated on the site, and she wouldn't have been pregnant then. I even considered she included the dog as one of her 'kids'.
Still seems kinda odd to me.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by need2no


Ok, I had considered that but just assumed she wrote the bio when she signed up in Nov. '06 as stated on the site, and she wouldn't have been pregnant then. I even considered she included the dog as one of her 'kids'.
Still seems kinda odd to me. [/*]

I count my cats as kids - they are certainly more work than my son :D

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by need2no


Ok, I had considered that but just assumed she wrote the bio when she signed up in Nov. '06 as stated on the site, and she wouldn't have been pregnant then. I even considered she included the dog as one of her 'kids'.
Still seems kinda odd to me. [/*]

Maybe she was counting Nicholas LOL!!

[mc528]

Since these were all parking tickets, could that other name, Jim Cammack simply be the previous owner of the car, and that the WA DMV's records aren't current? I'm not sure how the state of WA works....is the license plate attached to the car? I know in NY plates need to be turned in and new ones issues when a car changes hands....maybe in WA they stay with the vehicle. Maybe that other person was the previous owner and somehow his name was never removed from the files.

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by greeneyez78
I understand all of the other ones, and no I dont consider those aliases.....but what about

Jim Cammack?? [/*]

There is a Jim Cammack listed as a Director of the Olympic Medical Center. State of Washington I think. Maybe the records were just entered wrong wherever that alias info came from. "Data entry error" as my bank calls it when they screw up!!

[mc528]

Originally posted by Curiouser


There is a Jim Cammack listed as a Director of the Olympic Medical Center. State of Washington I think. Maybe the records were just entered wrong wherever that alias info came from. "Data entry error" as my bank calls it when they screw up!! [/*]

I also found a Jim Cammack from the state of WA registered on Classmates.com (as are Nicholas and Christine). The "Jim" graduated in 1974, not the same school as NF. I don't think I can post the links here for the info I saw through Classmates....you need to be registered and signed in there in order to view it, or to even do a search.

[greeneyez78]

That is a pretty big error to make when dealing with tickets, warrants, fines, court dates.etc........

Yeah I guess you could be right.....all of these things could all just be strange coincidences.....I guess I have just been lucky then....I haven't had any aliases completely different than my own name put in any court computer systems.......

[greeneyez78]

Yeah there seems to be a Jim Cammack, that lives in Port Angeles, which according to Google Maps.....around 2 1/2 hours away from Seattle......

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by mc528
Since these were all parking tickets, could that other name, Jim Cammack simply be the previous owner of the car, and that the WA DMV's records aren't current? I'm not sure how the state of WA works....is the license plate attached to the car? I know in NY plates need to be turned in and new ones issues when a car changes hands....maybe in WA they stay with the vehicle. Maybe that other person was the previous owner and somehow his name was never removed from the files. [/*]


Do you Washington State residents know if this is how your license plates work? Do they indeed stay with the car or does each new owner get a whole new plate, number, etc.??

[dianaelaine]

Just wanted to let you guys know I'm still here ... just very tired.

I'm reading ... and observing. :)

Huggles!

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by dianaelaine
Just wanted to let you guys know I'm still here ... just very tired.

I'm reading ... and observing. :)

Huggles! [/*]

Why are you so tired, Dianaelaine? Late night?? Too much dancing??

[huskiki]

Good Morning Everyone :seeya:

I missed everything from yesterday so I have to go back and read. That should keep me busy. My guess is there's nothing new on Nicholas.

:rose:

[desmom]

Originally posted by need2no


I'm pretty sure if she receives state assistance in the form of child support, NF would be liable to repay the amount she receives if he turns up. Of course there is also welfare, WIC, food stamps, free medical and dental care, education for her, reduced or free school lunches, reduced or free childcare, heck I even heard about a new reduced price cell phone program for people on welfare ...and I have no idea how all that works.

But I agree..how can a father just up and walk away and leave tax payers to support the children he created. [/*]

Good Morning! Finally caught up.

IMO, if Christine was to apply for assistance she would have to declare the donations she has received. Depending on how much has been donated, she may not be eligible for any of the programs listed above.

jmo

[n/t]

Yay! Nicholas gets a forum. Thank you CW. :seeya:

Hopefully, someone can start a link thread with whatever links you have available! Thanks!

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by n/t
Yay! Nicholas gets a forum. Thank you CW. :seeya:

Hopefully, someone can start a link thread with whatever links you have available! Thanks! [/*]


So where do we go to find this new forum. Will it have a different name. This is the first case I've ever read about on here so I don't really know what happens now!!

[desmom]

:seeya:

[desmom]

Originally posted by Curiouser



So where do we go to find this new forum. Will it have a different name. This is the first case I've ever read about on here so I don't really know what happens now!! [/*]

The forum is at the top of the page in the Amber Alerts & Missing People.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser



So where do we go to find this new forum. Will it have a different name. This is the first case I've ever read about on here so I don't really know what happens now!! [/*]

You will still find it under Amber Alerts and Missing People, it just has it own thread titled on the main page, like Brianna Denison.

[n/t]

Originally posted by Curiouser



So where do we go to find this new forum. Will it have a different name. This is the first case I've ever read about on here so I don't really know what happens now!! [/*]

You're on it. It's a sub forum of the Amber Alert one so you can create separate threads. As an example, if a link thread is created it will remain in the same forum. (same as the Brianna forum)

I hope I explained it ok.

[need2no]

Originally posted by desmom


Good Morning! Finally caught up.

IMO, if Christine was to apply for assistance she would have to declare the donations she has received. Depending on how much has been donated, she may not be eligible for any of the programs listed above.

jmo [/*]

Good point, hadn't thought of that. She would have to divulge all her assets and income.

[huskiki]

Nicholas is a popular guy here, to bad he's not in the press. Has anyone found any recent articles on him?

[Nellie]

Originally posted by desmom


Good Morning! Finally caught up.

IMO, if Christine was to apply for assistance she would have to declare the donations she has received. Depending on how much has been donated, she may not be eligible for any of the programs listed above.

jmo [/*]

I think the ones through Pay Pal could be hidden easily.

I often wonder how many people with online businesses actually claim the income on their taxes. Not saying SHE didn't. I just have always wondered that when I see "WAHM" sites. I have a website and I DO claim the income and am registered with my State.

[n/t]

Maybe we can create daily threads also. There is a lot of discussions and it'll be easier to follow.

I'll start one for today.

[huskiki]

Originally posted by n/t
Maybe we can create daily threads also. There is a lot of discussions and it'll be easier to follow.

I'll start one for today. [/*]


Hi n/t :seeya:

That's a great idea!

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by n/t


You're on it. It's a sub forum of the Amber Alert one so you can create separate threads. As an example, if a link thread is created it will remain in the same forum. (same as the Brianna forum)

I hope I explained it ok. [/*]

So all 60+ pages remain and we just keep posting here like before?? TIA

[Musterion]

UPDATE!! UPDATE!! Christine posted this about 3 hours ago apparently on the support blog (it was dated 9:02 p.m., I just saw it 2 seconds ago although I was on their about 15 minutes ago and it was not there then. It is now 12:20 a.m. my time (EST).

__________________________________________________

"the detective on the case is on vacation until 3/13 so i’m not sure much will get uncovered until then. I’m glad to know you are all still here as many of the emails and phone calls have stopped as people are tired and there really isn’t anything new to say."

_________________________________________________

[/*]

Christine, from the beginning, has believed that Nicholas met with foul play. It seems, in her mind, that the only things uncovered might be Nicholas' dead body. Maybe that is not something she is looking forward to dealing with. Maybe that is why her sense of urgency is not there to keep looking for him. She believes he is dead.

[huskiki]

Originally posted by Curiouser


So all 60+ pages remain and we just keep posting here like before?? TIA [/*]

Yes, they'll stay right here.

[need2no]

Originally posted by n/t
Maybe we can create daily threads also. There is a lot of discussions and it'll be easier to follow.

I'll start one for today. [/*]

While you are at it we could use a LINKS thread too.

TIA!

[n/t]

Originally posted by need2no


While you are at it we could use a LINKS thread too.

TIA! [/*]

Done.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
This may be a HUGE stretch here connecting the dots.....does this relate to missing people in the Nicholas Francisco investigation???

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,334539,00.html [/*]


LOL that is a stretch, I suppose. Why would you think NF would be involved in something like this?

I found this article over there rather interesting, and a tad insulting. Women Are World Class Fibbers; Women lie as a survival techique, but also to get what they want:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,334381,00.html

[need2no]

Originally posted by n/t


Done. [/*]

Thank you, this will make it so much easier.

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by need2no



LOL that is a stretch, I suppose. Why would you think NF would be involved in something like this?

I found this article over there rather interesting, and a tad insulting. Women Are World Class Fibbers; Women lie as a survival techique, but also to get what they want:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,334381,00.html [/*]

I think Author Barash is lying.

[need2no]

Originally posted by Curiouser


I think Author Barash is lying. [/*]

:lol:

[need2no]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Why? That is the question.

Why would a loving husband and father leave his family, his job and his life that he has worked so hard to build unless he were in very serious trouble.

He did not leave Christine because she couldn't make coffee or he found someone else, or he was mad at his boss or had money problems. He left because he was in very serious life changing trouble.

No wonder his mother and sisters are so distraught.

Remember the storage unit? That is a major clue.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,334539,00.html [/*]

Excuse me for sounding confused...but are you suggesting condo units and storage units are one in the same? Or the fires could cover some evidence?

What exactly do you consider the life changing trouble? Being one of this group and fear (or expectation) of being caught?

I'm not disagreeing or trying to be difficult...just having a bit of trouble following your thoughts is all.

[need2no]

We need to head over to the March 3rd daily thread:

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?threadid=325747

to continue our discussion.

[desmom]

Good Morning All!

CW was kind of enough to start a Nicholas Francisco Forum.

Because this thread is so long, a daily thread has been started
here:
http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?threadid=325747

A links only thread has been started here: http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?threadid=325748