Nicholas Francisco 28, Seattle, 2-13-08 (car found)

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by omsk99


I see similarities in these cases (pregnant wives, kids, financial troubles), but the circumstances are very different (John had a few drinks, Nicholas was leaving work to go to a store), and the fact that Nicholas' car was found the opposite way from his house is a total red flag, JMO. [/*]

I think the fact that both disappeared into thin air and it seems out of character for both to do so is a red flag, but I do understand what you mean.

Unfortunately I think its hard to get LE to really work adult male missing cases. Their standard answer is "foul play is not suspected" and "until otherwise, we are classifying this as a missing person's case". That seems to be the norm in these cases from what I have seen.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Musterion


It's good for the discussion. From all points of view. It may get this case kept in the forefront and solved!

Presumably she is and was pregnant. We don't have her medical reports. We have what she has said.

It seems the financial aspect arose as a reasonable question from LE and Media as a factor in why Nicholas may be missing. Questions were asked publicly to Christine. She answered them. If she had refused to answer them how would we all view that now?

The financial aspect of the case seems to be as much the public's interest as any other aspect of their lives.

Christine seems to have a very sanguine personality. Exaggeration and embellishment can be a common trait within that personality type.

I don't see anyone blaming anyone on this board. I see people discussing. All sides. Again, I think that is good.

What I hope to add is another perspective to generalizations and assumptions brought out.

It is more true than not that if this were a man whose wife was missing more would be required of him.

But, just as we don't have firm facts if Christine was/is pregnant, we don't know for a fact if she was asked to take a polygraph. We don't know for a fact if her home has been searched. We don't know for a fact if her computers have been searched. [/*]

This is true we don't know for a fact that she hasn't taken a polygraph or home been search - but - if they were to search her computer she surely wouldn't be on it like she is now correct? Or perhaps she borrowed someone's, but then again she likes drama and she would state that LE took her computer......I know I'm grasping at straws here.

For some reason I feel Christine is the type that would scream to us that she took a polygraph and passed it, she has voiced her opinon how wrong we all are about thinking perhaps Nicholas had just walked away. I really do believe if the LE even looked twice at her and suspected her in anyway of her husbands disappearance she would be crying all over the internet. This is such a mystery - and I bet when and if it comes to an end - we're going to be happy or sad. I really enjoy reading your post - you put alot of thought into this whole story. moo

[murdershewrote]

New Orleans is a very high crime area, even worse during Mardi Gras so I can see foul play in that case...in this case it's harder.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
I think most of us know from being on these boards is that people with loved ones missing do whatever they can to scrap up money for a reward, even if it's just $1,000. Even if his comany put up some reward money, the idea is always to get it up as high as you can so somebody might come forward. This doesn't seem to be the case here.

Surely they had to have at least one month's expenses on hand in case of an emergency...that gives people a little time to sort things out as far as what they really need to do financially. [/*]

Many many families are only one pay check away from disaster so she could have been in trouble quickly if he was to be paid on the 15th and she wouldn't be getting that check. On the other hand with all the pleas for money it would seem that a fair amount would be coming in and none seems to be going to the reward. I agree that most of my money would be going to that or a PI not into my account to save for a rainy day.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
New Orleans is a very high crime area, even worse during Mardi Gras so I can see foul play in that case...in this case it's harder. [/*]

True. Nellie was comparing cases of missing females with male spouses to this case. Then Musterion stated that those cases really did not compare because they were totally different (i.e. the missing where females and the spouses were not financially dependent on them). I was trying to put a case out there as like as I could find as this one as far as the missing and the spouse.

[murdershewrote]

this woman is spoiled, used to having a husband bring her coffee in bed (probably every day) so she is probably terrified that she might actually have to go get a job. Wonder how much life insurance he has?

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
this woman is spoiled, used to having a husband bring her coffee in bed (probably every day) so she is probably terrified that she might actually have to go get a job. Wonder how much life insurance he has? [/*]

No body, no evidence of foul play, no insurance or Social Security death benefits.

[Breazy]

Originally posted by omsk99


I think he is a graphic designer, so he probably doesn't communicate with clients or other business people much. I am not surprised his phone was dead (IF it was indeed dead), I don't have a car charger, but charge the phone overnight. However, to contradict myself here, he has two small children and a pregnant wife, so I would think he would make sure his phone was always charged... :shrug: [/*]


In my experience, that's true about the graphic designer not having contact with clients. While I was a production manager, I was the one who was in contact with clients, printers, etc. and it was my job to see project through all stages from first contact with client through delivery. Graphic designers were included in meetings with client, but all contact came through me and the client never actually talked to anyone else except during presentation of ideas which designer was included. However, all personnel had company-issued cell phones.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by snowfield
I am having trouble finding the exact thread on Etsy where she claimed to feel the baby move, but I believe it something like "I felt the baby move and wanted to call Nicholas" (ummm..one of her perfectly timed posts mentioned earlier).

Looking... [/*]

thank you all for all of your prayers and support. as of yet i have heard no news on the car so i assume that the lead was another dead end. Please keep praying. please do not loose hope.

I felt our baby move last night. I was so excited I tried to call Nicholas to tell him but then i remembered......
Posted at 12:15 pm, February 18 2008 EST

[desmom]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
I think most of us know from being on these boards is that people with loved ones missing do whatever they can to scrap up money for a reward, even if it's just $1,000. Even if his comany put up some reward money, the idea is always to get it up as high as you can so somebody might come forward. This doesn't seem to be the case here.

Surely they had to have at least one month's expenses on hand in case of an emergency...that gives people a little time to sort things out as far as what they really need to do financially. [/*]

You would think, but the more I read about today's economy the more I realize how many people live from check to check.

Does anyone know how long they have lived at this address? The recent headlines about the mortgages makes me wonder if possibly this could be one of the financial problems. IOW, did their house payment recently take a big jump?

P.S. I love your s/n and a big fan of the show then and now.

[field of snow]

Thanks RainyNite. ..I am in that thread, but only up to 10 AM posts. LOL

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Many many families are only one pay check away from disaster so she could have been in trouble quickly if he was to be paid on the 15th and she wouldn't be getting that check. On the other hand with all the pleas for money it would seem that a fair amount would be coming in and none seems to be going to the reward. I agree that most of my money would be going to that or a PI not into my account to save for a rainy day. [/*]

If his company put up the reward money and hired a PI, I doubt they would immediately stop his paycheck. They seem to value him both as an employee and a person.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


Many many families are only one pay check away from disaster so she could have been in trouble quickly if he was to be paid on the 15th and she wouldn't be getting that check. On the other hand with all the pleas for money it would seem that a fair amount would be coming in and none seems to be going to the reward. I agree that most of my money would be going to that or a PI not into my account to save for a rainy day. [/*]

He was still working as of Feb. 15...so he still had income coming in. NOW, though, the question would be.....what happens to that paycheck? If it's direct deposited, it would automatically go into their joint bank account probably. If it's a check I'm not sure the company would give it to her, but under the circumstances, they might. She could then take it to the bank and deposit it WITHOUT HIS signature to their checking account. You can deposit a check without endorsing it IF you deposit the whole amount. Did you know that? I understand the living from paycheck to paycheck. Done it plenty of times myself. But, she has a housefull of people...I'm sure none of them were going to let her and the kids go hungry. I would think your first line of support would have been your friends and family....not strangers across the country online. A lot of money can be raised online though, to add to those local funds. I guess I just don't see a man going missing as a good reason to appeal for money to pay his/her past debts. Sorry I don't. She should have turned to the people she's close to; not strangers. This is why things took a turn to looking so suspicious.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by snowfield
Thanks RainyNite. ..I am in that thread, but only up to 10 AM posts. LOL [/*]

snowfield - I lost the link - I think it is in Thread 2 - around page 75 - aargh

[Nellie]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


If his company put up the reward money and hired a PI, I doubt they would immediately stop his paycheck. They seem to value him both as an employee and a person. [/*]

I agree....so in light of that, why the panic over finances when the same amount of money would still be coming in?

[Nellie]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I felt our baby move last night. I was so excited I tried to call Nicholas to tell him but then i remembered......
Posted at 12:15 pm, February 18 2008 EST [/*]

sympathy ploy, imo....

[isitme]

Originally posted by Nellie


sympathy ploy, imo.... [/*]

Yep, that is what I said.

That was one of the first huge red flags that led me to be skeptical of anything that she said. Even her statement that she is pregnant.

[murdershewrote]

Thanks, desmom! With all the craziness in this world, Cabot Cove is my private little retreat :)

You're right about people living from paycheck to paycheck...and maybe their house payment did take a jump. With news of a new baby coming, maybe she was getting on him to make more money or something like that.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Breazy



In my experience, that's true about the graphic designer not having contact with clients. While I was a production manager, I was the one who was in contact with clients, printers, etc. and it was my job to see project through all stages from first contact with client through delivery. Graphic designers were included in meetings with client, but all contact came through me and the client never actually talked to anyone else except during presentation of ideas which designer was included. However, all personnel had company-issued cell phones. [/*]

He has also been called an "art director" in some articles. The Publicis website doesn't list all staff, just the top leaders, so it's hard to know what his exact job and job title was.

[desmom]

Welcome Envision !

Your post confirms some of my suspicions.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by desmom


You would think, but the more I read about today's economy the more I realize how many people live from check to check.

Does anyone know how long they have lived at this address? The recent headlines about the mortgages makes me wonder if possibly this could be one of the financial problems. IOW, did their house payment recently take a big jump?

P.S. I love your s/n and a big fan of the show then and now. [/*]

They purchased the house in February 2006 for $260,000. Most ARMs don't change before the 3 year mark, though anything is possible. It does appear that they had two deeds recorded on the same date though (Wells Fargo and Sierra Pacific Mortgage) which *might* mean they took out an equity loan for the down payment, and those can change rates as often as quarterly. But equity loans are tied to the prime rate and if anything may have gone down since 2006.

[field of snow]

Envision -- I heart you! *wonders if I know you?* Throwing out a secret hint: Ludlam?

And now that you mention the Chat, that seems familiar. Under Bella though, right?

I am waiting for the truth to come out and seeing how those sappy bleeding hearts deal with it.

[decor]

I really don't think Christine was involved and I do think that she was genuinely worried on the night he disappeared.

I think once she checked the Paypal account though she knew immediately what had happened. I think that is the link between not knowing and knowing.

You could kind of tell she wore the pants and I am sure he felt overwhelmed. Who knows how much he took care of those kids. And another one would add more work and they would need more income.

I am sure she is worried about having to get a job too. One day she is a SAHM and now she has to not only find a way to support four of them but raise them by herself too if he doesn't come back. And she can't do any of this until after she has this baby.

If it were me I would be worried too, deserved or not.

[desmom]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


They purchased the house in February 2006 for $260,000. Most ARMs don't change before the 3 year mark, though anything is possible. It does appear that they had two deeds recorded on the same date though (Wells Fargo and Sierra Pacific Mortgage) which *might* mean they took out an equity loan for the down payment, and those can change rates as often as quarterly. But equity loans are tied to the prime rate and if anything may have gone down since 2006. [/*]

Thanks.

[Breazy]

Originally posted by KindraLore


Well obviously every case is different BUT DeLatte was in New Orleans with his family. He is from that area but moved when Katrina came. He went to Razzoo's to meet some old friends for A DRINK. He was not drunk and left around 11PM. He is a big family man as well. So yes, to me it is a lot like this case. [/*]


OMG, I went to Razzoo's a few years back with some friends. Don't know why that matters but made me feel weird.

Sorry about the O/T

[abstr]

Hi everyone. I am a new poster but read a lot during the Court TV days and continue to follow the Ray Gricar case.

This disappearance just floors me. What a beautiful smile Nicholas has.

Where the heck is he?

[field of snow]

Something else about this, people in her campsite are so positive that because they don't believe he had any friends in Federal Way or in that condo complex, that he absolutely did not and would never go there. HOW would they know for certain? How many of our family or friends know every single detail of every single aspect of our lives?

Well, for one, I have a lot of Etsy friends I have met in person in the large area where I live (which is as big as, if not bigger than Seattle area).

My husband doesn't know them all or where they live (not because I am hiding it from him -- he just doensn't care..LOL). I have local/out-of-state/out-of-country non-Etsy friends he doesn't know much about, too.

My husband has friends in his networking groups and business connections I have never met and do not know their names. Either one of us could take off and hide with ease.

[abstr]

Chocolate and Potato Chips...yummm...you should share the recipe.

I saw you were from Etsy....I was flipping channels this morning and the Etsy founder was on Martha Stewart. I'd never heard of Etsy until this but just thought it was really funny how coincidental things can be.

Originally posted by dianaelaine
Somebody STOP me from eating all these chocolate/potato chip candies I made!!!

OK .. back to the case:

If Nick is alive, where is he staying?

Is he alone or with friends?

How is he living? If he has cash, it will only last so long. How easy is it for somebody to create a new identity? [/*]

[AngS]

Originally posted by desmom


:seeya: I made the "pregnant without her husband's knowledge because she was following the teachings of their church" post.

Here is my post: http://boards.insessiontrials.com/showthread.php?postid=11308532#post11308532

I am a child of the Make Love Not War era. I remember a lot of friends getting pregnant because they "forgot" to take the pill, but told all their girlfriends they got pregnant on purpose. IMO, deception is not good in any relationship.

I know accidents do happen, but my post is a What If scenario. What if Nicholas did not want any more children, but Christine did? What if Christine decided she was going to have another baby and got pregnant anyway?

Having a family, big or small, is a decision that needs to be made by both parties, not one.

I read http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/09/13/righteous/ and then read somewhere else the Francisco family had resigned from the church 2 days before Nicholas disappeared. Are the two connected? :shrug: .

Some men would be thrilled to find out on their birthdays they are going to be a Daddy again. Others may not be thrilled especially if was not something that was discussed.

My post was not meant to discriminate against large families and I apologize if I offended anyone.

jmo [/*]


No, no don't apologize, you didn't offend me at all. I only noted your post (as an example) because it seems to be a prevailing thought in our society that women and children bring SO much stress upon men. THAT KIND OF THINKING IS THE PROBLEM. I don't understand it at all, and it makes me very sad. Families are SUPPOSED to bring JOY and FULFILLMENT, but a great deal of men today don't see it that way at all. It didn't used to be like this in my grandparents day. Back then, if men did what
Scott Peterson, Neil Entwistle, Christian Longo, etc., did, it would have been so disgraceful! Back then men were MEN!!! They took care of their own and took 2 jobs if they had to! Can anyone at all offer any insight as to why things are this way now? I'm not saying that Nicholas ran off, I'm only addressing the fact that with the world the way it is today, it is not an unlikely scenario.

[soyesterday]

Ok i have some more thoughts that have been going through my mind and i know some have already been talked about, but i'm just trying to put it all together for me by writing it out. :)

Ok so one thing i'm thinking is that maybe Nicholas wasn't as happy as he seemed. (I know alot of us have been thinking that) So what if he was having an affair? Since his car was found in the oppisite direction from his house, maybe his "gf" lived there?
Maybe something happened to him while he was there. A robbery, a carjacking, or something even deeper. Like maybe she was married to and her husband did something to him? Since noone else has been reported missing from those condos, i'm assuming he didn't take off w/ someone from there, but who knows? (It would be alot more interesting if someone that had lived in those condos was reported missing also.)

Or we have the gameling idea which would explain a bunch of money missing or his paypal account being low. He owed money and he was maybe going to pay it....maybe to someone at those condos, but something happened to him while he was there.

Since noone saw anything outside that night, maybe he actually went inside someone's condo and something happened in there which would explain why the car was so "clean" too.

[omsk99]

I can't remember now, is his wallet missing or was it in the car? If he as credit cards, Ia m sure they have checked into it. Maybe he had a secret account Christine didn't know about?

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by omsk99
I can't remember now, is his wallet missing or was it in the car? If he as credit cards, Ia m sure they have checked into it. Maybe he had a secret account Christine didn't know about? [/*]

No report of his wallet being found. Car was reported found unlocked with the ignition intact, no keys, nothing else (reported) and no signs of foul play. Supposedly they were checking for prints. If they've found anything, nothing has been shared yet.

He had a PayPal account that she had access to but she apparently didn't discover until the day after he left that he had some significant debt owed on it. This could mean that he had taken out a PayPal credit card tied to the account and ran up the limit without her knowing it, or it could mean that he had made a lot of purchases she didn't know about and then the amounts got automatically deducted from their checking account if it was tied to the PayPal.

I still don't understand the freaking out if it was just a credit card though, since payments can be made each month. If he somehow cleared out their whole checking account and she was left with no money at all, and somehow indicated to her that he wasn't coming back, then I could see her being in "desperate" need as was described. But that doesn't match up with what she has reported to LE then.

As for any other secret cards, unless he took them out in a different name, it would be easy enough for her to look up his credit report and see if there is anything else going on. And as business and Internet savvy as she is, I'm sure she would have done that by now.

[desmom]

Originally posted by AngS



No, no don't apologize, you didn't offend me at all. I only noted your post (as an example) because it seems to be a prevailing thought in our society that women and children bring SO much stress upon men. THAT KIND OF THINKING IS THE PROBLEM. I don't understand it at all, and it makes me very sad. Families are SUPPOSED to bring JOY and FULFILLMENT, but a great deal of men today don't see it that way at all. It didn't used to be like this in my grandparents day. Back then, if men did what
Scott Peterson, Neil Entwistle, Christian Longo, etc., did, it would have been so disgraceful! Back then men were MEN!!! They took care of their own and took 2 jobs if they had to! Can anyone at all offer any insight as to why things are this way now? I'm not saying that Nicholas ran off, I'm only addressing the fact that with the world the way it is today, it is not an unlikely scenario. [/*]



A while back I watched a crime show (city confidential maybe) that covered the story of a family that was murdered back in the late 50's or early 60s. Husband/Dad was not found until 30 + years later. He had remarried and was well liked by all his neighbors.



I think the Scott Petersons have been out there for a long time.
Today's technology brought them into our living rooms.

[truecrimejunkie]

Originally posted by desmom




A while back I watched a crime show (city confidential maybe) that covered the story of a family that was murdered back in the late 50's or early 60s. Husband/Dad was not found until 30 + years later. He had remarried and was well liked by all his neighbors.



I think the Scott Petersons have been out there for a long time.
Today's technology brought them into our living rooms. [/*]

Desmom,

I am in Midwest Cornfield USA, too! :)

[murdershewrote]

seems if he racked up credit card debt that his wife didn't know about, that could mean he did have a secret life. Seems she could easily find out what the charges have been. The cc company would probably be very willing to send her those statements.

[ThruTheTrees]

I think this may have been mentioned before, here or on another board but I don't remember the definite answer.

If LE finds Nicholas and he says "I'm ok, but don't tell anyone where I am", they are only obligated to pass along the fact that he is ok to his family, and then close the case, right? Same thing if Nicholas calls them and says "hey, let my family know I'm ok" and they can definitely conclude that its him and not an imposter. Pass on the info, and case closed, yes?

Is LE obligated in any way to pass along such info to the media?

And, this is more subjective of course, do you all think that if Christine gets word that Nicholas is ok but he just doesn't want to come home for some reason, that she would immediately share that news with her online friends?

Has anyone seen any posts from Christine lately, or any news about her from any of her support team?

[AngS]

Originally posted by Musterion


He did work. His father owns a tool and dye shop and employed him. That's where he dismembered her body.

They had a nanny. From Germany. She is who he was having an affair with when he killed his wife. [/*]

FYI: Grant fled to Northern Michigan and was actually apprehended near our home! YIKES!

[murdershewrote]

desmom, yes that was an incredible murder mystery. I can't think of the guy's name right now, I think it was Frank? Robert Blake played his character on the made for TV movie and he was really scarey. The guy was a religious fanatic and thought his family would be better off in heaven, because he couldn't provide for them the way he felt he should.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by cookiely
Does anyone think that Greta & Nancy stopped talking about this case because they don't believe Christine? [/*]

Related to this question, I haven't seen any updates on his company's blog where they were keeping track of all the searches -- which might mean they are just not doing any more searches, or have run out of ideas of how to find him. Last post I saw was on Tuesday: nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com

There also haven't been many updates on the www.mailpen.net website, though they mainly just linked to news stories.

I haven't followed any other missing person cases like I have this one -- is it common that eventually there's a dead-end like this, not much more to pursue? Or maybe there has been some info found by someone, but it's just not being released yet?

[desmom]

Originally posted by truecrimejunkie


Desmom,

I am in Midwest Cornfield USA, too! :) [/*]

:seeya: I am your neighbor. I am in IL.

[desmom]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
desmom, yes that was an incredible murder mystery. I can't think of the guy's name right now, I think it was Frank? Robert Blake played his character on the made for TV movie and he was really scarey. The guy was a religious fanatic and thought his family would be better off in heaven, because he couldn't provide for them the way he felt he should. [/*]

Thanks. My numbers are off.........

He murdered his family on November 9, 1971 and was arrested 18 years later on June 11, 1989.

The name of the movie "Judgement Day". The man's name is John List.

[Silver_Dove]

What if she didn't find debt in the Paypal account be she found that he had "paid" a debt from it? Maybe sending the money to another account he had created with a fake invoice? or maybe sent it to a gf who he then joined?

I keep thinking of all the hotel/motels along 99 close to the condo where his car was found at. He goes off to join the gf, maybe even the first time they meet in person, they spend a couple days in a room she got. No one sees him enter and she goes out for food or room service with him in the bath. Car isn't notice in a hotel parking lots with strange cars all the time. They decide to take off together and he leaves the car where it will be found so she can have it.

If they met on the internet all that info is in his laptop that is missing.

Just a though I've had.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
seems if he racked up credit card debt that his wife didn't know about, that could mean he did have a secret life. Seems she could easily find out what the charges have been. The cc company would probably be very willing to send her those statements. [/*]

Can he withdraw cash from PayPal account, or only transfer somewhere? Good point, ThruTheTrees, that if he opened another checking/saving account, it would have been on his credit report (unless he opened it under another name).

He might run out of cash, but if started a new life somewhere, under another name, he can get a job.

[murdershewrote]

TTT. yes, cases do stonewall due to lack of anything new but LE will keep investigating. In this case, though, it doesn't seem like they've done a whole lot because I think they believe he just took off (as has been discussed here). They haven't, as far as we know, even checked his computers or looked around inside the house. I hope they have investigated his finances cause that's where the trail on this might lead.

Most of these cases go thru a lull period,, which adds to our frustration, and then, boom, they get a lead or find the person (unfortunately usually not alive).

Nancy/Greta won't keep covering a case unless there is some new "news", unless it is a slow news period. But with all the politics going on, some of these cases are put on the back burner...like this one and Brianna Dennison.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by cookiely
Does anyone think that Greta & Nancy stopped talking about this case because they don't believe Christine? [/*]

For any of you so inclined, rewatch the broadcast with Nancy and Christine. Focus on Nancy - the look on her face.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
desmom, yes that was an incredible murder mystery. I can't think of the guy's name right now, I think it was Frank? Robert Blake played his character on the made for TV movie and he was really scarey. The guy was a religious fanatic and thought his family would be better off in heaven, because he couldn't provide for them the way he felt he should. [/*]

I remember this case too, and I read about it on the Crime Library's website. But for the life of me, cannot remember his name, either! I believe he killed the family at home and covered everything with a blanket, or put on a blanket. If he thought they would be better off in heaven, why didn't he kill himself, too?! :flamemad:

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
[snip]

also, i do not believe, they did not have enough money to pay the next months bills, which would be march.....why beg for money litterely within hours of his not comming home by10:00.... [/*]

The last point reminded me of something she said in one of the interviews. She was asked to confirm that there had been no withdrawals on any of their bank accounts and she said "no, only the automatic payments". So that would make me think he didn't clear out their account completely before he left via the PayPal situation, otherwise the automatic payments wouldn't have gone through. Though he probably had at least one more paycheck coming to him that quite likely was direct-deposited.

I don't get the immediate request for money either.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees
I think this may have been mentioned before, here or on another board but I don't remember the definite answer.

If LE finds Nicholas and he says "I'm ok, but don't tell anyone where I am", they are only obligated to pass along the fact that he is ok to his family, and then close the case, right? Same thing if Nicholas calls them and says "hey, let my family know I'm ok" and they can definitely conclude that its him and not an imposter. Pass on the info, and case closed, yes?

Is LE obligated in any way to pass along such info to the media?

And, this is more subjective of course, do you all think that if Christine gets word that Nicholas is ok but he just doesn't want to come home for some reason, that she would immediately share that news with her online friends?

Has anyone seen any posts from Christine lately, or any news about her from any of her support team? [/*]

I asked a similar question and someone answered part of it. I think the answer was this. Since Nicholas' company is paying for the PI, then the PI has the responsibility to report back to them. BUT neither the PI nor the company would be obligated to report it to LE. My problem with that is that LE could use and waste unnecessary time and energy. Hmmmmm speaking of that, they aren't doing anything, are they? (that we know of)

I absolutely do not think Christine would tell anyone if Nicholas just left her. JMO

[Shimz]

I don't know if all of this has been posted already, I can't remember, but maybe NF had told Christine he wanted a divorce and she vowed to make his life a living hell if he ruined her perfect fairytale marriage. Maybe he thought it would be easier to just leave.

IMO, she does seem more angry than upset, and everything seems to be all about her. She hasn't really shown much effort in finding her husband, she just cries about how hard her life is and will be if he doesn't return.

And her post about "keep the prayers coming", to me if felt like she could have just said "keep the money coming"

I duno, i am just throwing these things out there. I've never posted before but this case is getting to me... actually I think it is Christine and her actions that are getting to me.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove
What if she didn't find debt in the Paypal account be she found that he had "paid" a debt from it? Maybe sending the money to another account he had created with a fake invoice? or maybe sent it to a gf who he then joined?

I keep thinking of all the hotel/motels along 99 close to the condo where his car was found at. He goes off to join the gf, maybe even the first time they meet in person, they spend a couple days in a room she got. No one sees him enter and she goes out for food or room service with him in the bath. Car isn't notice in a hotel parking lots with strange cars all the time. They decide to take off together and he leaves the car where it will be found so she can have it.

If they met on the internet all that info is in his laptop that is missing.

Just a though I've had. [/*]

All quite possible. If he used only his laptop at home and work, then there would be no trace of his online activities on any other computers.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by omsk99


Can he withdraw cash from PayPal account, or only transfer somewhere? Good point, ThruTheTrees, that if he opened another checking/saving account, it would have been on his credit report (unless he opened it under another name).

He might run out of cash, but if started a new life somewhere, under another name, he can get a job. [/*]

Yes, you can get a PayPal debit card tied to a PayPal account and make withdrawals at any ATM.

[AngS]

Originally posted by Silver_Dove


If I posted pictures of my ex husband and infact most pictures I have of him, he looks like a happy loving husband. I have ones of him looking lovingly at me when I was pregnant, looking lovingly at his son, all of us together looking happy. What you wouldn't see because there were no pictures was him hitting me, walking out on me and all the other bad times. I kept it as quit as possible and wanted people to think everything was fine.

I'm in no way saying this was happening to them I'm just saying pictures can be some of the biggest lies of all. [/*]


Very well put, Silver Dove. I am sorry you had to go through that...hugs!

[decor]

John List

if I remember correctly he killed his family because he lost his job and didn't know how he would support them.
I remember because he had a Tiffany stained glass skylight in one of the rooms of the house that was worth $100,000 but he didn't realize it.

Paypal
you can leave your money in PP and it is put into some kind of money market or something and collects interest. If they had opted for this with all the money that was paid them over time thru PP it could have been a substantial amount. and maybe he had taken it all out.

I have a friend that usually doesn't take her money out until she has about $2,000 in there.

[Track292003]

Re: Similarity to Man Missing in New Orleans:

Perhaps Nicholas went to a bar to meet someone after work....
We know it wasn't his habit, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen that particular night.

[murdershewrote]

maybe he left to teach her a lesson...that life without him wouldn't be so hot and she can now really wear the pants in the family.

[desmom]

I wonder if LE ran a credit report on Nicholas and Christine. I wonder if LE found anything in the credit report Christine did not know about...i.e. credit card, loan, another address, cell phone account, bank account.....

just thinking out loud.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by Track292003
Re: Similarity to Man Missing in New Orleans:

Perhaps Nicholas went to a bar to meet someone after work....
We know it wasn't his habit, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen that particular night. [/*]

I don't know, but it sounds doubtful to me. C would have been pissed off if he was late to bake cookies, I am sure. And unless they lived in LA or NYC or Chicago, I don't think he could have explained it by saying he was stuck in traffic (that's the excuse everyone uses in LA when they are late ;))

[Shimz]

I do think him having an affair is totally possible. However, I think that if C found out and knew who the other person was, she would know where to look and I think she would hunt him down and drag him back home. If he was having an affair, I don't think C knows at all who the other person is.

[need2no]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
Does anyone think that Greta & Nancy stopped talking about this case because they don't believe Christine? [/*]

i could tell by the look on both their faces, they did not believe a word she was saying, and both knew she was not really crying......

they were probably thinking OH SH**, i wish i had not put her on MY show [/*]

I don't think either Nancy or Greta would not want Christine on their shows because they don't believe her story, in fact this type of sensational mystery case is exactly what they like to have on their show IMO. Think about how many times Greta has had Joe Brodsky, Drew Peterson's attorney, on her show and repeatedly asked him to get Drew to come on the show. We know Greta thinks Drew killed Stacy, but these are exactly the kind of show that grabs viewers and ratings. She also interviewed Joran van der sloot, the guy involved in Natalie Holloway's disappearance. Then there is Nancy's interview with Melinda Duckett when her little boy was missing and Nancy grilled her with questions when it was obvious she was lying about the details of his disappearance, and the next day Melinda killed herself. Nancy has also had Joe Brodsky on her show and made it clear she didn't believe Drew.

There must be some other reason they are not doing followups/updates on this case, and this just makes it even more of a mystery.

Perhaps Christine knows from reading blogs that people didn't fall for her fake tears which she was able to turn off like a light switch so she is afraid to go back on the shows and be scrutinized by the public.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
i ponder him having an affair with someone at that church......not too far fetched.....and getting busted by C [/*]

Yeah, maybe that's why they resigned just a few days before he disappeared

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Shimz
I don't know if all of this has been posted already, I can't remember, but maybe NF had told Christine he wanted a divorce and she vowed to make his life a living hell if he ruined her perfect fairytale marriage. Maybe he thought it would be easier to just leave.

IMO, she does seem more angry than upset, and everything seems to be all about her. She hasn't really shown much effort in finding her husband, she just cries about how hard her life is and will be if he doesn't return.

And her post about "keep the prayers coming", to me if felt like she could have just said "keep the money coming"

I duno, i am just throwing these things out there. I've never posted before but this case is getting to me... actually I think it is Christine and her actions that are getting to me. [/*]

"Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned." Been there, done that. (Well, not what she is doing, but I know the feeling oh so well.)

I posted before that her parents got divorced when she was 10, which quite likely was very hard on her. And there's also the comment on the photo of her grandparents where she put she had only been married for 6 years but she and her husband will be together "til death."

I don't know for a fact that Nicholas left her or asked for a divorce, but everything I've seen in her reactions would fit with such a scenario. She doesn't seem at all like the type who would say "oh, I guess I was wrong about how happy we all are here. I guess I was wrong about us being soul mates. Ok, I'll give you a divorce."

[omsk99]

Originally posted by need2no


I don't think either Nancy or Greta would not want Christine on their shows because they don't believe her story, in fact this type of sensational mystery case is exactly what they like to have on their show IMO. Think about how many times Greta has had Joe Brodsky, Drew Peterson's attorney, on her show and repeatedly asked him to get Drew to come on the show. We know Greta thinks Drew killed Stacy, but these are exactly the kind of show that grabs viewers and ratings. She also interviewed Joran van der sloot, the guy involved in Natalie Holloway's disappearance. Then there is Nancy's interview with Melinda Duckett when her little boy was missing and Nancy grilled her with questions when it was obvious she was lying about the details of his disappearance, and the next day Melinda killed herself. Nancy has also had Joe Brodsky on her show and made it clear she didn't believe Drew.

There must be some other reason they are not doing followups/updates on this case, and this just makes it even more of a mystery.

Perhaps Christine knows from reading blogs that people didn't fall for her fake tears which she was able to turn off like a light switch so she is afraid to go back on the shows and be scrutinized by the public. [/*]

I think they are not following up on the case because there are no developments. I Google this case all the time, there have been NO updates at all. I also get Google alerts when something new is posted online, but all alerts I've been getting these past few days are people's posts on their blogs, asking for help to find Nicholas (none from Christine, by the way!!!)

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
i ponder him having an affair with someone at that church......not too far fetched.....and getting busted by C [/*]

I really find that hard to believe...however, maybe there was a hint of scandal. No one has to even be guilty of anything for there to be a scandal - lots of rumors, innuendoes, etc. Okay I've got a couple things minimized - hoping I do not lose it. This is the church statement (posted many times)

http://voxpopnetwork.com/westseattle/2008/02/17/urgent-message-regarding-nicholas-francisco/

This in the comment section:


(23 February 2008) Christine says:
I can’t believe that on a church blog you all would be speculating that my husband just ran off on me. what kind of people are you? what kind of christians are you? My husband did not run off one me. I have never asked for money. People have asked me out right, including media, about our finances and I answer with the truth. So who are you to jump to conclusions. I am dieing inside, this whole thing is killing me and you who don’t know us and post on a church website are making assumptions and accusations that have no grounds for. what kind of Christian does that? I came and read on this blog hopeing for a little more uplifting thoughts and prayer and here i am being attacked. How cruel.

[need2no]

If NF was planning to leave why didn't he just check in with CF at some point during the day, tell her he would be in a meeting all afternoon and unavailable and then take off from work to get a headstart on his plan? Unless of course to make it appear to LE and CF everything was normal until something sinister happened when he was headed to the store for sugar.

:shrug:

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


[snip]


(23 February 2008) Christine says:
[snip] People have asked me out right, including media, about our finances and I answer with the truth. [snip][/*]


Would the "truth" change from day to day though? One day "we're broke" and the sarcastic "you see his car" (implying how old and crappy it is). Then another day "we're just in the middle like everyone else".

[AngS]

Originally posted by omsk99


Thanks! I don't have kids, but assume that it's not possible, so early in the pregnancy? Why would she lie about it?..:confused: [/*]

I haven't read anything on ETSY, but from all of "Christine's quotes" I have read on here, she sounds like SUCH A DRAMA QUEEN! She seriously reminds me of my sister-in-law. Embellishment is an understatement. I think she LOVES being the center of attention, even for something horible like this. "Sanguine personality" or not, I absolutely CANNOT STAND drama queens, and I can get along with pretty much anyone.

[Shimz]

these are exactly the things I find unnerving. Why is she looking through internet blogs for uplifting thoughts? She obviously doesn't want to hear any speculation of what may have happened except that he met with some type of danger.

If it were my husband I would be organizing searches, handing out fliers, anything to keep myself busy with LOOKING for HIM. Meanwhile, she is online looking for people talking about HER.

It's just all about Christine.

[need2no]

Originally posted by omsk99


I think they are not following up on the case because there are no developments. I Google this case all the time, there have been NO updates at all. I also get Google alerts when something new is posted online, but all alerts I've been getting these past few days are people's posts on their blogs, asking for help to find Nicholas (none from Christine, by the way!!!) [/*]

Could be, but if I were in Christine's shoes I would beg them to do some kind of update, even if it was just posting his missing person's flyer at the end of the show and advising people where to call if they see him. Last night Greta spent a good bit of time on the School Bus Brawl story...yet not a word about this case.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees



Would the "truth" change from day to day though? One day "we're broke" and the sarcastic "you see his car" (implying how old and crappy it is). Then another day "we're just in the middle like everyone else". [/*]

My thoughts exactly! The last one I saw myself, she said they were not rich, but they were not poor either, just in the middle like everyone else. And as it's been mentioned many times here before, she had his paycheck coming in, and since automatic debits were made, that means there was still money for AT LEAST a few days. :rolleyes:

[need2no]

Originally posted by Shimz
these are exactly the things I find unnerving. Why is she looking through internet blogs for uplifting thoughts? She obviously doesn't want to hear any speculation of what may have happened except that he met with some type of danger.

If it were my husband I would be organizing searches, handing out fliers, anything to keep myself busy with LOOKING for HIM. Meanwhile, she is online looking for people talking about HER.

It's just all about Christine. [/*]

ITA, and it is rather telling.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by need2no


Could be, but if I were in Christine's shoes I would beg them to do some kind of update, even if it was just posting his missing person's flyer at the end of the show and advising people where to call if they see him. Last night Greta spent a good bit of time on the School Bus Brawl story...yet not a word about this case. [/*]

That's why you are not Christine ;) In all her quotes that I have read, she only complains how people are bad-mouthing her, she is not asking for help to find Nicholas, so I am certainly not surprised she is not following up with news channels to keep his face out there longer.

[need2no]

Originally posted by omsk99


That's why you are not Christine ;) In all her quotes that I have read, she only complains how people are mad-mouthing her, she is not asking for help to find Nicholas, so I am certainly not surprised she is not following up with news channels to keep his face out there longer. [/*]

Sad, but true. She is more concerned with what people think of her, than concerns over her missing hubby. Either she is in on it, or she is 'off'.

If you have not watched her interview with Nancy Grace, you must see it. Let me know if you need the link to the video.

[Shimz]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
what if............

N did go home, then left again.....

maybe he forgot the sugar...and she let him have it......maybe he got the sugar somewhere else....and she was mad at him being too late to make cookies....and he couldn't take it anymore and left...

that would give her a couple of hours to put get a plan of action

I see her as someone who would not give the man a break for anything he did that did not meet her selfish standards...

the LE needs to check out the kitchen to see if there is sugar there.....

in my mind, i am so sure she is hiding a lot of things, i forget to think that something bad may have happened to him..... [/*]


I never even thought that he may have went home. I wonder if LE has talked to the children at all... I am sure the 4 yr old would be able to tell them something like that, that he came home from work and then left.

[abstr]

on the east coast...i get stuck in traffic quite often
i've spent hours in the dc traffic!
Originally posted by omsk99


I don't know, but it sounds doubtful to me. C would have been pissed off if he was late to bake cookies, I am sure. And unless they lived in LA or NYC or Chicago, I don't think he could have explained it by saying he was stuck in traffic (that's the excuse everyone uses in LA when they are late ;)) [/*]

[omsk99]

Originally posted by need2no


Sad, but true. She is more concerned with what people think of her, than concerns over her missing hubby. Either she is in on it, or she is 'off'.

If you have not watched her interview with Nancy Grace, you must see it. Let me know if you need the link to the video. [/*]

Yes, please post the link. I can't remember if I watched Nancy or Greta. TIA!

[omsk99]

Originally posted by abstr
on the east coast...i get stuck in traffic quite often
i've spent hours in the dc traffic!
[/*]

Oh yeah, forgot about that one! :seeya:

[need2no]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
what if............

N did go home, then left again.....

maybe he forgot the sugar...and she let him have it......maybe he got the sugar somewhere else....and she was mad at him being too late to make cookies....and he couldn't take it anymore and left...

that would give her a couple of hours to put get a plan of action

I see her as someone who would not give the man a break for anything he did that did not meet her selfish standards...

the LE needs to check out the kitchen to see if there is sugar there.....

in my mind, i am so sure she is hiding a lot of things, i forget to think that something bad may have happened to him..... [/*]

So you are suggesting she knows he walked out on her and why, but is keeping quiet about that and changing the story in an effort to scam the public out of money?
Would NF sit back quietly watching this occur if he walked out on her?
Going with this theory how would you explain the car and dead cell phone, not to mention lack of activity in his bank account? And then there is his job.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Shimz



I never even thought that he may have went home. I wonder if LE has talked to the children at all... I am sure the 4 yr old would be able to tell them something like that, that he came home from work and then left. [/*]

Yes this was discussed - nobody really knows if he went home, then left or she left. Nobody knows if any neighbors were spoken to and saw any cars coming/going, etc. This is what is so frustrating because had a young wife gone missing, LE would have been all over it.

[need2no]

Originally posted by omsk99


Yes, please post the link. I can't remember if I watched Nancy or Greta. TIA! [/*]


Here is a link for a video of Nancy Grace interviewing Nicholas Francisco's wife:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bes....francisco.cnn

Pay attention to when she starts sniffling talking about her hubby, and then watch how quick she turns it off.

[omsk99]

Originally posted by need2no



Here is a link for a video of Nancy Grace interviewing Nicholas Francisco's wife:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bes....francisco.cnn

Pay attention to when she starts sniffling talking about her hubby, and then watch how quick she turns it off. [/*]

Thank you! :seeya:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Envision
As far as the church, from what I understand, was there was an uproar of church officials and some problems with management going on. I heard that one was taking money for personal use and all that other kind of blah blah garbage and that quite a few people had actually left, feeling "taken". I don't know why one would have to formally resign from a church they are allegedly only members of. I would think you just would not go back. I haven't been able to get confirmation if he was involved in the "scandal" as a church official or if he was just a fed up member. She has been asked and of course has ignored the question. [/*]

From his artwork on his design blog it looked like he may have been a volunteer art director/teacher? (can't remember exactly) So he may have felt the need to formally resign.

[need2no]

Originally posted by omsk99


Thank you! :seeya: [/*]

YW!

[desmom]

Originally posted by omsk99


Yes, please post the link. I can't remember if I watched Nancy or Greta. TIA! [/*]


A link titled "Video: Click here to watch Christine Francisco's interview" with Greta Van Susteren is available on this page http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,331671,00.html#

Christine's interview with Nancy Grace is here: http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2008/02/22/ng.nicholas.francisco.cnn

The transcript from Nancy Grace's show is available here (toward the bottom of the page): http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/21/ng.01.html

Nicholas' photo is listing under missing persons on CNN Nancy Grace's home page http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/nancy.grace/

[omsk99]

Originally posted by need2no



Here is a link for a video of Nancy Grace interviewing Nicholas Francisco's wife:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bes....francisco.cnn

Pay attention to when she starts sniffling talking about her hubby, and then watch how quick she turns it off. [/*]

I saw that! I hate to say it, but she sounds so fake, everything was so peachy in their family etc. - Every family has arguments once in a while, but he never got angry and took a walk to vent?

[need2no]

Originally posted by cookiely
OK, this is waaaay out there but I've been thinking about it. Are N & the other missing guy the same nationality? Maybe they knew each other before or recently met in a club or the church & got to talking. Maybe they both were feeling overwhelmed & unhappy & wanted out & hatched a plan to leave together. Women do this, I don't know if men would. So they ditched the car & took off in the other one. Both men are still missing. The other wife may have an idea that her husband took off & doesn't want to discuss it. Is it impossible? [/*]

I don't think it's that way out there, and I believe they are of the same nationality. Of course we really don't know if the other guy is still missing or not since the media is not reporting on that either. Wasn't it stated the other guys wife worked for Cosco? And from her MS she isn't concerned about her missing hubby either. I'm also wondering about the bank robbery even though the robber was reported as being shorter than NF. This is all so strange!

[omsk99]

Originally posted by desmom



A link titled "Video: Click here to watch Christine Francisco's interview" with Greta Van Susteren is available on this page http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,331671,00.html#

Christine's interview with Nancy Grace is here: http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2008/02/22/ng.nicholas.francisco.cnn

The transcript from Nancy Grace's show is available here (toward the bottom of the page): http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/21/ng.01.html

Nicholas' photo is listing under missing persons on CNN Nancy Grace's home page http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/nancy.grace/ [/*]

Thank you too, desmom! Will watch Greta now.

[AngS]

Originally posted by murdershewrote
desmom, yes that was an incredible murder mystery. I can't think of the guy's name right now, I think it was Frank? Robert Blake played his character on the made for TV movie and he was really scarey. The guy was a religious fanatic and thought his family would be better off in heaven, because he couldn't provide for them the way he felt he should. [/*]

John List. Very scary, indeed!

[need2no]

Originally posted by omsk99


I saw that! I hate to say it, but she sounds so fake, everything was so peachy in their family etc. - Every family has arguments once in a while, but he never got angry and took a walk to vent? [/*]

My DH always teases me about being a bit pychic because 99% of the time I call it correct when I watch these missing children/adult interviews. He also says I am overly suspicious, yet admits I usually am right on with my assessment of a liar/fake vs someone who is sincere and telling the truth. My impression of Christine is not someone sincere who is telling the truth. I will be interested to see if it turns out she is in the 99% or the 1 %. :)

[omsk99]

Good night everyone, it was great to talk to all of you as always! Hope we will have some news over the weekend. Going home now, to take my puppy out.

:seeya:

[homecrafter]

Viliamu is Samoan. I don't believe NF to be Samoan.

Does anyone know the last time Viliamu was seen and where? I hate speculating...but I was just wondering if Viliamu had a fight with his wife, confronted her at Cosco, got pissed, walked out to the parking lot, along comes NF in the parking lot to get sugar and who knows what from there.....?????????
I dunno I can't stop thinking they might be connected in some way...if only we knew MORE!

[AngS]

Originally posted by omsk99


I remember this case too, and I read about it on the Crime Library's website. But for the life of me, cannot remember his name, either! I believe he killed the family at home and covered everything with a blanket, or put on a blanket. If he thought they would be better off in heaven, why didn't he kill himself, too?! :flamemad: [/*]

If only all of the "Andrea Yates" of the world would think of that. Better yet, just take themselves out of the picture and leave everybody else alone! In a perfect world....

[need2no]

Originally posted by homecrafter
Viliamu is Samoan. I don't believe NF to be Samoan.

Does anyone know the last time Viliamu was seen and where? I hate speculating...but I was just wondering if Viliamu had a fight with his wife, confronted her at Cosco, got pissed, walked out to the parking lot, along comes NF in the parking lot to get sugar and who knows what from there.....?????????
I dunno I can't stop thinking they might be connected in some way...if only we knew MORE! [/*]

Feb. 14, 2008, here's the missing person info.-

http://www.waspc.org/mp/missing.php?wac=08M0003445

Odd wife couldn't provide a photo of DH, yet has several on her MS.
Odd that she posts on MS but doesn't mention missing hubby.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by truecrimejunkie


Desmom,

I am in Midwest Cornfield USA, too! :) [/*]

Me too! I wonder if yoru cornfield is very close to my cornfield. LOL!

[need2no]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
my bet, she is in the 99%

did she think everyone in reach of her "voice" would believe every word she said/says....DUH

the more she talked, the deeper the hole she was digging got [/*]

I guess she is the female version of Scott Peterson who certainly expected everyone within the sound of his voice to believe him. But Scott and Christine are not alone...there is a laundry list of murderers who go on TV and run their mouths expecting the public, family members and LE to believe their BS. Seems most of them need acting lessons before appearing on TV.

[dianaelaine]

She also looks very put together in those interviews ... makeup, hair done, lipstick, the whole bit .. as if she wanted her Etsy friends to see her looking good.

Too put together for somebody who's suppose to be so worried about her husband.

[BobbisAngel]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Her lack of concern, the fact that she has not increased the reward or made much effort to help search for Nicholas shows she must know why he is missing.

A woman whose husband is missing would talk about the case, beg for information and demand answers. She would cry scream and tear things apart.... that is, if she really cared.

I think she knows he took off on her but doesn't want to admit it. This is why she is grabbing everything she can...... while she can. [/*]


I think that when we read cases like this we visualize how we would act or what we would do...even though we have never been in those shoes. Even if we have been in those shoes different people react differently. Some people might react as you describe and some may not.

Christine has been on different shows...when she was wore out emotionally others took her place like Nick's best friend. I don't think it is right to judge how she is reacting when we don't know her as a person and how she handles things. I'm sure that she talks about Nick's missing to her friends and family. I would think that he is on her mind 24 hrs a day. She is probably worried sick but she also has 2 children that she has to "stay together" for...at least when they are awake.

Nick's friend has a blog called The Donovan Family which has pictures of the families...him and Nick camping and working on a car. Him and his wife blog daily on it and it is really interesting. They were with Christine and family recently but had to return to Colorado because of work. Nick and this man are like brothers and grew up together. It really saddens them that people are being so negative about Nick's missing.

Personally, I don't see anything wrong with Christine's sister starting an account for Christine and the kids. We don't know when Nick's paydays fell and if Christine had bills due now. She obviously didn't have any money to pay them or buy gro's. As for Christine adding to the reward...where was that money supposed to come from? Nick's employer has put up the reward
and that was really nice of them. He obviously is a well thought of employee as they have also hired a PI to find Nick. I don't read anymore into it then he is a valued person to them. As for signing off on something before he left work that day....he was possibly signing off on a project or contract that he had fininshed. No big deal there.

I hope that there hasn't been any foul play in Nick's case. It doesn't look good though as time goes by. In Seattle and the outlaying areas bad things happen. That area of Washington is riddled with crime all of the time. Drugs prevail just like everywhere else but Seattle is a huge place. I wouldn't be surprised if something didn't happen in a parking lot when he stopped at the store. I can believe someone taking the car to that apt complex...driving it for a few days with the license plate changed then deciding it was probably hot after a couple days...putting the license plate back on it and then LE finding it. No one at the complex is going to admit knowing anything. Most people don't even know their neighbor much less care what they drive in Seattle. For the sake of his family I hope Nick is alright and that he is found soon. I will be surprised if that is the case.

[need2no]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
is it possible, that he was up front with his boss, and told him he had to get away from her for awhile, get divorced, get a restraining order ( i think he would probably need one) on her...

get his act together, and have his job when he came back...and his boss said "ok buddy, no problem"...

then boss has to tell LE, but LE does not have to tell anyone else....and that's the day ol' dixie died....that's why we aren't hearing anything more about it.....

i have a problem with him leaving his job, unless he knew he could get it back.... [/*]

I suppose anything is possible, and it would explain why the media isn't reporting on this anymore. However I think the LE would have to tell the wife, and wouldn't LE step in and stop Christine from scamming the public with pleas for money? Also, wouldn't he need his car unless he has a SO to provide transportation?

[Silver_Dove]

I think if it was me and I was on tv I'd be asking who ever took him to let him go or at least where to find him so I could have closure or even asking him to please call and let me know he is okay but she did none of that. Just saying I need him. That just seemed strange.

[dianaelaine]

BobbieAngel,

You're entitled to your opinions .. but so are we.

I see things differently than you.

[BobbisAngel]

Originally posted by need2no


Sad, but true. She is more concerned with what people think of her, than concerns over her missing hubby. Either she is in on it, or she is 'off'.

If you have not watched her interview with Nancy Grace, you must see it. Let me know if you need the link to the video. [/*]


I watched her interviewed twice on Nancy and didn't see anything wrong with it. Maybe she didn't cry and scream but not all people do or have done on Nancy's show. I did see her start to cry at one point during one of the interviews while talking about Nick and their little girl. I don't think that she is one to allow herself to become all emotional in front of others. Some people are that way and there is nothing wrong with it.

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
is it possible, that he was up front with his boss, and told him he had to get away from her for awhile, get divorced, get a restraining order ( i think he would probably need one) on her...

get his act together, and have his job when he came back...and his boss said "ok buddy, no problem"...

then boss has to tell LE, but LE does not have to tell anyone else....and that's the day ol' dixie died....that's why we aren't hearing anything more about it.....

i have a problem with him leaving his job, unless he knew he could get it back.... [/*]

Personally I don't see the company hiring a PI and offering up part or is it all of the reward in this case. With his skills he can find another job any time and maybe he never plans to come back to Seattle area.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Yes this was discussed - nobody really knows if he went home, then left or she left. Nobody knows if any neighbors were spoken to and saw any cars coming/going, etc. This is what is so frustrating because had a young wife gone missing, LE would have been all over it. [/*]

That is so true Rainy! Hiya BTW :seeya:

You know I'm always asking about the polygraph, and like another poster suggested maybe she has and we don't know about it. Thats true, but I honestly believe if they did a house search - polygraph, computer search - she would be all over this computer crying how she has to borrow someone computer how they are looking at her blah,blah,blah. I'm not disheartful - but this case just isn't sitting right. jmoo

[need2no]

Originally posted by BobbisAngel



I watched her interviewed twice on Nancy and didn't see anything wrong with it. Maybe she didn't cry and scream but not all people do or have done on Nancy's show. I did see her start to cry at one point during one of the interviews while talking about Nick and their little girl. I don't think that she is one to allow herself to become all emotional in front of others. Some people are that way and there is nothing wrong with it. [/*]


Call me cynical, but I lost my rose colored glasses years ago. If I'm wrong about Christine I will be most happy to apologize.

_____________________________________

If everybody's thinking the same thing, then nobody's thinking. - George S. Patton

[dianaelaine]

I agree ... if I'm wrong, I'll be glad I was.

I sure do hope all is well, and Nick is safe.

[decor]

as far as her being "too put together"
do you really think they were going to allow her to go on tv with no makeup and her hair not done? they have makeup people that would have done all that for her.

diana
are you one of the people that were continuously bumping the threads on Etsy about Nicholas? just curious.

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Danette44


This is true we don't know for a fact that she hasn't taken a polygraph or home been search - but - if they were to search her computer she surely wouldn't be on it like she is now correct? Or perhaps she borrowed someone's, but then again she likes drama and she would state that LE took her computer......I know I'm grasping at straws here.

For some reason I feel Christine is the type that would scream to us that she took a polygraph and passed it, she has voiced her opinon how wrong we all are about thinking perhaps Nicholas had just walked away. I really do believe if the LE even looked twice at her and suspected her in anyway of her husbands disappearance she would be crying all over the internet. This is such a mystery - and I bet when and if it comes to an end - we're going to be happy or sad. I really enjoy reading your post - you put alot of thought into this whole story. moo [/*]

Danette,

Maybe Christine has done what many wise posters here have suggested. Maybe she has gotten good advice to stay silent. To not say anything one way or another.

At this point it would seem that no matter what she says or does it will be suspect, viewed negatively. Letting others be the mouthpiece for Nicholas might be the best thing to keep his case in front of the public's eye. That way it can be about Nicholas, as it should be, not about Christine and her behaviours.

[dianaelaine]

Originally posted by decor
as far as her being "too put together"
do you really think they were going to allow her to go on tv with no makeup and her hair not done? they have makeup people that would have done all that for her.

diana
are you one of the people that were continuously bumping the threads on Etsy about Nicholas? just curious. [/*]

If you're asking if I was the one who started the 'ideas and thoughts' on Nicholas .. yes, that was me.

I didn't bump any of the other threads up, no.

[AngS]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Envision
She is an emotional person, that is why her behavior now is so odd. [/*][/QUOTE

I'm curious...you've had personal contact with her, expound on "emotional". She just comes across to me as a
TOTAL. DRAMA. QUEEN. What more can you tell us? Specific incidents?

[decor]

Originally posted by dianaelaine


If you're asking if I was the one who started the 'ideas and thoughts' on Nicholas .. yes, that was me.

I didn't bump any of the other threads up, no. [/*]

oh! you were that one. I thought you got a bum rap. There was not a single thing wrong with that thread except they sure wanted you shut down and did everything possible to get it done. There was nothing negative except for the holier than thous that kept saying the thread was inappropriate. The only good thing that came out of it was because they shut you down they had to shut the others down too.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by omsk99


I saw that! I hate to say it, but she sounds so fake, everything was so peachy in their family etc. - Every family has arguments once in a while, but he never got angry and took a walk to vent? [/*]

....but her make up looked good. I only bring that up because she did!

[Musterion]

Originally posted by Nellie


Hi Musterion! I appreciate your discussion and am willing to look at things from different angles. We know so little about this case.

As far as the financial aspect, I'm not sure how honest Christine has been with LE or the Media about that. She did not let on to Greta that finances would be a reason he would leave. As a matter of fact, she said the opposite. What strikes me about what she told Greta about their finances...that they were in the middle....was the total opposite of what she had been portraying on the internet prior to going on the Greta show. On Greta she said,

Now that is NOT what she had been spreading all over the internet BEFORE going on Greta. Why? She could have acknowledged that finances were a concern and people have been so kind and helping her out. But not a word about that. I have to ask why? It's like she wanted to keep the internet fund raising and appeals for money a "secret".

I did mention earlier that I believe she may have a personality that embellishes things...I agree with you there! [/*]

Hi Nellie,

Yes, she could have acknowledged the financial help and kindness of so many people. If she had said that she may now be accused of going on National/International TV asking for money. Or hinting for money.

You are right, we know little about the case! I pray more facts come out, more clues to where Nicholas is....

[HarlettOhara]

Originally posted by need2no


I don't think it's that way out there, and I believe they are of the same nationality. Of course we really don't know if the other guy is still missing or not since the media is not reporting on that either. Wasn't it stated the other guys wife worked for Cosco? And from her MS she isn't concerned about her missing hubby either. I'm also wondering about the bank robbery even though the robber was reported as being shorter than NF. This is all so strange! [/*]

I believe Nicholas is Philippino and Viliamu is Samoan.. I know Viliamu's family is from Alaska and that's where he and Stephanie lived before moving to WA.


As for where Nicholas' vehicle was found, that complex is about 60% Asian.. so if he is from the Philippines I wouldn't find it odd at all that he may have friends living there.

I also found where a Christina A. Francisco went to college at the University of the Philippines ~ Los Banos. Whether this is the same Christine A Francisco that is married to Nicholas I am not sure of, yet.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Envision


Publicis is an international company. It's not just some tiny run of the mill independently owned ad agency. I would think if his employer was helping him "hide" from her, he could have transfered him to one of their other offices and saved hiring a PI or putting up the reward fund. [/*]

I doubt that the employer would also knowingly keep it quiet while there were so many employees out searching for him at night and on the weekend on their own time, in some parts of town that are not that safe besides.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Musterion


Danette,

Maybe Christine has done what many wise posters here have suggested. Maybe she has gotten good advice to stay silent. To not say anything one way or another.

At this point it would seem that no matter what she says or does it will be suspect, viewed negatively. Letting others be the mouthpiece for Nicholas might be the best thing to keep his case in front of the public's eye. That way it can be about Nicholas, as it should be, not about Christine and her behaviours. [/*]

Love your last line - yes yes yes

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


Exactly...Would joy-riding teen boys return such a neat car with no fingerprints? Ummmm, No. lol [/*]

Plus manage to kill him and hid the body without getting blood or anything else in the car.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by HarlettOhara


I believe Nicholas is Philippino and Viliamu is Samoan.. I know Viliamu's family is from Alaska and that's where he and Stephanie lived before moving to WA.


As for where Nicholas' vehicle was found, that complex is about 60% Asian.. so if he is from the Philippines I wouldn't find it odd at all that he may have friends living there.

I also found where a Christina A. Francisco went to college at the University of the Philippines ~ Los Banos. Whether this is the same Christine A Francisco that is married to Nicholas I am not sure of, yet. [/*]

Her MySpace indicates she went to high school in Mt. Vernon, WA and then attended two years at the Art Institute in Seattle.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by Envision
She is an emotional person, that is why her behavior now is so odd. [/*]

His sisters were very emontional last saturday on the news, they were begging and pleading for him to call home if possible! Christine needs to be back in the news.......pleading with the people from all over th world to help find him - keep your eyes open ! Brian Shaffer's case puzzles me to this day......a promising doctor out having a few drinks and BAM he disappeared! Alexis still pays his cell phone bill so she can call it and say good night hear his voice. Some think his friend that was with refuse to take a polygraph and lawyered up!

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Danette44


That is so true Rainy! Hiya BTW :seeya:

You know I'm always asking about the polygraph, and like another poster suggested maybe she has and we don't know about it. Thats true, but I honestly believe if they did a house search - polygraph, computer search - she would be all over this computer crying how she has to borrow someone computer how they are looking at her blah,blah,blah. I'm not disheartful - but this case just isn't sitting right. jmoo [/*]

Hey Danette :seeya:

I know when she had to meet with the detective, she stated that - stated he had asked to meet with her alone about their home life. Some of the folks encouraged her to get a lawyer. If people want the exact quote I'll have to search for it tomorrow - I'm too tired tonight :) There are 9 threads and each one has anywhere from 70+ pages to 340 pages.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Hey Danette :seeya:

I know when she had to meet with the detective, she stated that - stated he had asked to meet with her alone about their home life. Some of the folks encouraged her to get a lawyer. If people want the exact quote I'll have to search for it tomorrow - I'm too tired tonight :) There are 9 threads and each one has anywhere from 70+ pages to 340 pages. [/*]

I recall that - it was a families freind lawyer and didnt he tell her she didn' need one. Think I need a note pad to keep track of truth/fibs in line. Sorry, for my typing, this sleepinh pill working - you know us old/young we need help to sleep! lol

Good night everyone and lets when we wake up that Nicholas Picture wouldbe said "FOUND"! that would be sweet....nighters :seeya:

[RainyNiteNTx]

Does anybody check out the Seattle Times online? They update their website throughout the day. There is something that alarmed me when I just now checked it.

[need2no]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Does anybody check out the Seattle Times online? They update their website throughout the day. There is something that alarmed me when I just now checked it. [/*]

I looked, didn't see anything alarming...perhaps I missed it. Could you be a bit more specific about what you read that alarmed you?

TIA

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Does anybody check out the Seattle Times online? They update their website throughout the day. There is something that alarmed me when I just now checked it. [/*]

oh no what was it rainy????

[desmom]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Does anybody check out the Seattle Times online? They update their website throughout the day. There is something that alarmed me when I just now checked it. [/*]

The body found in the lake. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2004252179_webbodyfound01e.html

I googled the lake and it appears to be 29 miles from where his car was found.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by need2no


I looked, didn't see anything alarming...perhaps I missed it. Could you be a bit more specific about what you read that alarmed you?

TIA [/*]

I don't like scaring people so I didn't want to bring the link over here - it says they recovered the body of a man in Lake Washington but will not release the identity nor say how long he has been there. Thing is he had on rain gear so I'm soooooo hoping its not him.

[field of snow]

The body found in Lake Washington wearing rain gear?

[desmom]

http://www.komotv.com/news/local/16132577.html

A man's body was found floating in Lake Washington this afternoon near Bellevue, and authorities are trying to determine how he got there.

The body, of unknown age and race, is wearing rain gear and apparently has been in the water between 24 and 48 hours, police said.

Officials said it’s hard to tell where the man might have been carried from, due to wave action.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by snowfield
The body found in Lake Washington wearing rain gear? [/*]

yes

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by desmom
http://www.komotv.com/news/local/16132577.html

[/*]

phew thank you Desmom - the first article didn't give the length of time that I found

[dianaelaine]

Oh dear!!!

[need2no]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I don't like scaring people so I didn't want to bring the link over here - it says they recovered the body of a man in Lake Washington but will not release the identity nor say how long he has been there. Thing is he had on rain gear so I'm soooooo hoping its not him. [/*]

Thank-you, and desmom for the link, I did overlook that article. Strange about the rain gear whether it's NF, or whoever. While I hope it is not him whoever it is has someone who loves him and will be devastated over this news.

Being a suspicious person... I wonder if LE would fib about the rain gear to hopefully prevent people from speculating if it is NF, until the man is identified. Seems odd to mention the rain gear, don't you think?

[desmom]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


phew thank you Desmom - the first article didn't give the length of time that I found [/*]

You are very welcome. The first couple stories I clicked on didn't report a time line either.

[soyesterday]

Oh no :(
I pray it's not him......please God......

I also just posted a thread about a missing woman that was just found stuffed in her car's trunk after being missing for weeks.
I wonder why they wouldn't have checked there????
And i wonder if they've checked Nicholas' trunk.........:(

I sooooo want to ask that Brian guy that has the dreams what he thinks about Nicholas' case, but i'm afraid to.
It looks like just anyone can ask him, not just family, but i don't know.
I just posted a link in Shannon Matthews' thread on this site cuz there is a dream post about her on his page too.........

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
Have we heard anything about Nicholas wearing rain gear on the 13th? Can anyone remember the weather conditions on that day? [/*]

I went to the weather channel.com and looked at the month of February - it was not raining on the 13th or 14th that I could tell from their little map

[Nellie]

BobbisAngel, I can totally understand everything you have said. And I go back and forth on what I think has happened here.
I'll admit it's the pleas for money that alarmed me and made me start looking harder at Christine. And as I watched her posts at Etsy and watch her tv interviews, she really did strike me as a diva who has made this all about her.

But, your points are well taken. I've been wrong before.

I wonder if you always give everyone this kind of benefit of the doubt, or do you get gut feelings about people involved in these cases? Like, SP, did you give him this same kind of benefit or did you get a gut feeling about him right off? Just curious. Or Drew Peterson?

Like I said, I've been wrong before. But things just don't seem on the up and up with Christine. When people start to paint their lives as perfect, I tend not to believe it. If it was as perfect as she is trying to portray it, then she wouldn't be so desperate for money.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


OK--thanks. I think it would be unlikely that its Nicholas, dont you? Especially since they think the body has only been there about 24 hours... [/*]

I hope its not him but as someone stated, it is someone's loved one. I don't know what LE considers rain gear - do they mean a full slicker like fishermen wear or do they mean a waterproof wind breaker?

[soyesterday]

I also saw that he has a case open on Kyle Fleischmann and Justin Gaines......
and Justin's sister has wrote a message to him saying:

Hi Brian,

First off let me say thank you for all that you do. Secondly I was looking at the information you have written about my brother, Kyle. He has been missing since November 9, 2007. Do you feel like he might be with Justin Gaines considering you had also written something about Nashville about him? Do you feel like Kyle might be alive? If there is anything else you can do to give my family answers we would be so unbelievably appreciative. Thank you so much.

Noelle Fleischmann

I hope i was allowed to post that here.......

I still don't see anything on Nicholas there and i want to ask him so bad......
i don't know how i feel about it still or what i "believe" about it, but i kinda wanna see what he says........

[desmom]

Originally posted by soyesterday
Oh no :(
I pray it's not him......please God......

I also just posted a thread about a missing woman that was just found stuffed in her car's trunk after being missing for weeks.
I wonder why they wouldn't have checked there????
And i wonder if they've checked Nicholas' trunk.........:(

I sooooo want to ask that Brian guy that has the dreams what he thinks about Nicholas' case, but i'm afraid to.
It looks like just anyone can ask him, not just family, but i don't know.
I just posted a link in Shannon Matthews' thread on this site cuz there is a dream post about her on his page too......... [/*]

check your pms please.

[need2no]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I went to the weather channel.com and looked at the month of February - it was not raining on the 13th or 14th that I could tell from their little map [/*]

Francisco was last seen wearing a light-blue and white button-down shirt, a plain black jacket and a pair of bluejeans.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Musterion


Hi Nellie,

Yes, she could have acknowledged the financial help and kindness of so many people. If she had said that she may now be accused of going on National/International TV asking for money. Or hinting for money.

You are right, we know little about the case! I pray more facts come out, more clues to where Nicholas is.... [/*]

I just found her to be less than truthful with Greta about the finances. When one lies in one area, it always makes me wonder what other areas they lie in. At the point of the Greta, I had no idea about the fund raising online and the desperate cries for money. So it was quite a shock after watching Greta to learn what was going on at Etsy. Honestly I don't think most of the nation knows about the fund raising. It's only people on forums like this that even know about the online fundraising.

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by desmom


check your pms please. [/*]


I'm sorry.......how do i do that?
I'm looking all over but i don't see it......
but if i posted something wrong, please tell me........i'm sorry if i did......i never know what i'm allowed to post.....

[desmom]

Originally posted by soyesterday



I'm sorry.......how do i do that?
I'm looking all over but i don't see it......
but if i posted something wrong, please tell me........i'm sorry if i did......i never know what i'm allowed to post..... [/*]

You didn't post anything wrong.

At the top of the page click on User CP.

ETA ~ I usually forget to check my PM box, so I have my changed by settings to "Pop up a box when you receive a Private Message" in the Edit Options under User CP. When I log on to the Insession board, a box pops up telling me I have a pm.

[soyesterday]

Originally posted by desmom


You didn't post anything wrong.

At the top of the page click on User CP. [/*]


I found it. Thanks. :)
I wrote you back.

[kaylynn]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I went to the weather channel.com and looked at the month of February - it was not raining on the 13th or 14th that I could tell from their little map [/*]

I went to wunderground.com and checked the weather almanac thing for Feb. 13 and 14th, and it said 0% precipitation on both days.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by kaylynn


I went to wunderground.com and checked the weather almanac thing for Feb. 13 and 14th, and it said 0% precipitation on both days. [/*]

Thanks Kaylynn

[dianaelaine]

Has it rained since the day he was missing?

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Envision
That's why I doubt the employer knows anything about his disappearance. [/*]

I don't think they do either.

[kaylynn]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Thanks Kaylynn [/*]
You're welcome. But, also according to that site, there was only .04 inches of precipitation on Feb.27th and none on the 28th. So, I wonder why whoever it was was wearing rain gear..

[kaylynn]

Originally posted by dianaelaine
Has it rained since the day he was missing? [/*]
On Feb. 15th, they got .03 inches of rain then none again until Feb. 27th when they got .04 inches of rain and then today(Feb.29th), where they got .12 inches of rain.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by kaylynn

You're welcome. But, also according to that site, there was only .04 inches of precipitation on Feb.27th and none on the 28th. So, I wonder why whoever it was was wearing rain gear.. [/*]

Thats why I wonder what LE is calling rain gear - it looks like Seattle was around the 50s and foggy on some days so I can see someone wearing a windbreaker.

[need2no]

Has anyone heard if the vigil mass was held at St. Anthony's Catholic church this past Wednesday, as planned?

It seems like this would have been reported in the news.

[kaylynn]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Thats why I wonder what LE is calling rain gear - it looks like Seattle was around the 50s and foggy on some days so I can see someone wearing a windbreaker. [/*]

Yeah. I guess if it is a fishermans body, or someone who works out on the water, they maybe wore those full-rain suit type things because of the fog and mist, etc. while out on the water? I'm really not sure. It just seems odd.
:rose: For whoevers loved one that is.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by kaylynn


Yeah. I guess if it is a fishermans body, or someone who works out on the water, they maybe wore those full-rain suit type things because of the fog and mist, etc. while out on the water? I'm really not sure. It just seems odd.
:rose: For whoevers loved one that is. [/*]

I don't understand why they would even mention the rain gear. If someone is missing a fisherman or a boater, etc. then they will be scared to death until an identity is confirmed.

[need2no]

Originally posted by sherryhefner
I think if LE thought the body was that of Nicholas, they would contact Christine to at least let her know of their discovery. [/*]

I believe they would want/need to have some indication that it might in fact be Nicholas before they would contact Christine. Also if they had reason to believe it was him they would ask Christine (or another relative), to come to the coronor's office to ID him.

[kaylynn]

Originally posted by need2no
Has anyone heard if the vigil mass was held at St. Anthony's Catholic church this past Wednesday, as planned?

It seems like this would have been reported in the news. [/*]

I heard somewhere that Christine didn't attend the vigil, so, I'm assuming they did have one.
http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/2008/02/worship-and-candlelight-prayer-vigil-7.html
According to the blog set up for Nicholas, they had a private vigil just for friends and family on Wednesday night at the Petry Home. It doesn't say anything about having it at the church.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


Maybe they mentioned the rain gear to discount the notion that this is Nicholas? Just guessing... [/*]

good thought

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by kaylynn


I heard somewhere that Christine didn't attend the vigil, so, I'm assuming they did have one.
http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/2008/02/worship-and-candlelight-prayer-vigil-7.html
According to the blog set up for Nicholas, they had a private vigil just for friends and family on Wednesday night at the Petry Home. It doesn't say anything about having it at the church. [/*]

This just shows a calendar of things...

http://www.mailpen.net/

[need2no]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


I don't understand why they would even mention the rain gear. If someone is missing a fisherman or a boater, etc. then they will be scared to death until an identity is confirmed. [/*]


I can't recall any case where they report on the clothing of a deceased person in their initial report to the media. Usually the article will say the sex of the person, and/or approx. age if it can be determined from the condition of the body.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


I think the body was just discovered... [/*]

It says 5:07PM under their "update" section

[Nellie]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Hey Danette :seeya:

I know when she had to meet with the detective, she stated that - stated he had asked to meet with her alone about their home life. Some of the folks encouraged her to get a lawyer. If people want the exact quote I'll have to search for it tomorrow - I'm too tired tonight :) There are 9 threads and each one has anywhere from 70+ pages to 340 pages. [/*]

Christine convo'd me and said that she spoke with a criminal lawyer and a family friend lawyer and neither believes she needs to have a lawyer with her. There are so many people at her house all of the time that the purpose of the meeting is for the 2 of them to have a quiet place to talk.
Posted at 7:19 pm, February 20 2008 EST


fashion I am so glad to hear that -- I understand everyone's exhortations to have a lawyer present but at the same time, Christine will not be there truly alone --the baby, and GOD, will both be right there with her, and a ton of people praying for her during the whole thing... She will be surrounded in love.
Posted at 7:24 pm, February 20 2008 EST

[kaylynn]

Originally posted by need2no



I can't recall any case where they report on the clothing of a deceased person in their initial report to the media. Usually the article will say the sex of the person, and/or approx. age if it can be determined from the condition of the body. [/*]
I can't believe that if the body had only been there 24-48 hours, why they had no approx. age, ethnicity, etc. It just seems weird.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by need2no



I can't recall any case where they report on the clothing of a deceased person in their initial report to the media. Usually the article will say the sex of the person, and/or approx. age if it can be determined from the condition of the body. [/*]

I can't either.

[desmom]

Originally posted by need2no



I can't recall any case where they report on the clothing of a deceased person in their initial report to the media. Usually the article will say the sex of the person, and/or approx. age if it can be determined from the condition of the body. [/*]

The information may not have come from LE. One of the news sites had an aerial view of the area the body was discovered, so I bet there were reporters on the ground. They may have witnessed the yellow rain gear or got the information from the young girl and her father that found the body.

jmo

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Nellie


Christine convo'd me and said that she spoke with a criminal lawyer and a family friend lawyer and neither believes she needs to have a lawyer with her. There are so many people at her house all of the time that the purpose of the meeting is for the 2 of them to have a quiet place to talk.
Posted at 7:19 pm, February 20 2008 EST


fashion I am so glad to hear that -- I understand everyone's exhortations to have a lawyer present but at the same time, Christine will not be there truly alone --the baby, and GOD, will both be right there with her, and a ton of people praying for her during the whole thing... She will be surrounded in love.
Posted at 7:24 pm, February 20 2008 EST [/*]

Thanks Nellie :seeya:
I've been through those posts so many times cause I never want to misquote anything and then can't remember what thread.

[decor]

Originally posted by need2no
Has anyone heard if the vigil mass was held at St. Anthony's Catholic church this past Wednesday, as planned?

It seems like this would have been reported in the news. [/*]

here is an article about the service
http://www.sentinel.org/node/8824

[Curiouser]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


Yes that's perplexing....if the body had only been in the water for a short time, you would think determining an estimated age, etc., would not be that hard and would actually help them. [/*]


Don't they generally like to contact the family of whoever they think or know a body is before they say much to the news media? That might take awhile if the next of kin was away from their home or phone.

[desmom]

Without going into a lot of detail, drowning victims physical appearance change rather quickly.

jmo

[need2no]

Originally posted by kaylynn


I heard somewhere that Christine didn't attend the vigil, so, I'm assuming they did have one.
http://nicholasfrancisco.blogspot.com/2008/02/worship-and-candlelight-prayer-vigil-7.html
According to the blog set up for Nicholas, they had a private vigil just for friends and family on Wednesday night at the Petry Home. It doesn't say anything about having it at the church. [/*]

From http://www.mailpen.net/

Mon., Feb. 25, 7:00 pm
The St. Matthew Catholic Church in Hillsboro, Oregon held a prayer service for Nicholas and the Francisco family.
Wed., Feb. 27, 7:00 pm
The St. Anthony's Catholic Church in Forest Grove, Oregon held a Vigil Mass for Nicholas and the Francisco Family.
http://www.stanthonysforestgrove.org/

http://www.stmatthewhillsboro.org/

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Curiouser



Don't they generally like to contact the family of whoever they think or know a body is before they say much to the news media? [/*]

Yeah thats why what the person was wearing with no other details bothers me. Someone is going to be frantic until a positive ID is made.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Thanks Nellie :seeya:
I've been through those posts so many times cause I never want to misquote anything and then can't remember what thread. [/*]

Here's what I did Rainy! I opened up a new email addressing it to myself. Then as I went along reading at Etsy, I'd copy and paste any post I found interesting into that email and then I sent it to myself. So I just have an email of the ones I found of interest and don't have to wade through all those hundreds of posts looking for them. LOL! Is that a sign I'm sick? :biggrin:
See the kind of stuff they'd find on MY computer if I went missing or something happened to MY hubby? LOL!

[need2no]

Originally posted by desmom
Without going into a lot of detail, drowning victims physical appearance change rather quickly.

jmo [/*]


I have an uncle that did search and recovery, the stories he told about the appearance of people found in water.........

He left that job after a couple of years because it affected him so bad.

[desmom]

Originally posted by need2no



I have an uncle that did search and recovery, the stories he told about the appearance of people found in water.........

He left that job after a couple of years because it affected him so bad. [/*]

I was an EMT many moons ago with a volunteer fire dept. Some of our calls still haunt my dreams 20 years later.

Water recovery is not pleasant.

[Nellie]

Ok, how about this one....
Make of it whatever you want. I just found it interesting.

there is also a local prayer vigil tonight but i'm not attending.
Posted at 8:08 pm, February 20 2008 EST

Christine, I wouldn't think people would expect you to be at the prayer vigil. You have enough on your plate with being there for your children. The prayer vigil will support you and give people a way to feel they are making a contribution to the effort to find your precious Nicholas. Stay strong and please take care of yourself! God loves you!
Posted at 8:18 pm, February 20 2008 EST

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Yeah thats why what the person was wearing with no other details bothers me. Someone is going to be frantic until a positive ID is made. [/*]

From Link (http://www.king5.com/localnews/stories/NW_022908WAB_bellevue_body_TP.ce9c7db.html)

BELLEVUE, Wash. – Police are investigating a man's body found floating near a home in Lake Washington Friday afternoon.

The body was found in the 5500 block of Pleasure Point Road by a 12-year-old girl who lives in the area.

Video shows the person floating face down in complete yellow rain gear.

Bellevue Police say it's initially unclear how long the body has been in the water or how the person got there.



From another article (http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/353286_body01.html?source=mypi)

A dead man was found in Lake Washington justy before 2 p.m. Friday.

A 12-year-old girl in the 5600 block of Pleasure Point Lane Southeast in Bellevue first saw the body and alerted her dad, Bellevue police said. He came from their waterfront home and hung on to the dead man until firefighters arrived.

The dead man was an adult, but police could not determine his a general age.

"He was completely clothed and had rain gear on," police spokesman Greg Grannis said. "We don't know if there are any sign of trauma because of his clothes. We could see his face, but nothing else."

The body was found south of the Newcastle Beach Park, near Metro's Newport Hills park and ride lot.

Staff from the King County Medical Examiner's Office retrieved the body and took photographs at the scene. An office spokesman said it might be until Monday before the man's identity and cause of death are released.

[desmom]

Originally posted by KindraLore


From Link (http://www.king5.com/localnews/stories/NW_022908WAB_bellevue_body_TP.ce9c7db.html)

BELLEVUE, Wash. – Police are investigating a man's body found floating near a home in Lake Washington Friday afternoon.

The body was found in the 5500 block of Pleasure Point Road by a 12-year-old girl who lives in the area.

Video shows the person floating face down in complete yellow rain gear.

Bellevue Police say it's initially unclear how long the body has been in the water or how the person got there.



From another article (http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/353286_body01.html?source=mypi)

A dead man was found in Lake Washington justy before 2 p.m. Friday.

A 12-year-old girl in the 5600 block of Pleasure Point Lane Southeast in Bellevue first saw the body and alerted her dad, Bellevue police said. He came from their waterfront home and hung on to the dead man until firefighters arrived.

The dead man was an adult, but police could not determine his a general age.

"He was completely clothed and had rain gear on," police spokesman Greg Grannis said. "We don't know if there are any sign of trauma because of his clothes. We could see his face, but nothing else."

The body was found south of the Newcastle Beach Park, near Metro's Newport Hills park and ride lot.

Staff from the King County Medical Examiner's Office retrieved the body and took photographs at the scene. An office spokesman said it might be until Monday before the man's identity and cause of death are released. [/*]

Thanks.

[desmom]

Good Night All!

:rose: For the man in the yellow rain gear, his family and friends.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by sherryhefner


Goodnite Desmom!:seeya: [/*]

I need to go to bed also and I echo what Desmom said...
:rose: for the unknown man
:rose: for Nicholas and family

[need2no]

Good night All...perhaps tomorrow will bring some good news for the Francisco family.

May the deceased man discovered today RIP.

:rose: for those who love and miss him.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Morning Everyone :seeya:

I looked for news in several places before posting, but see nothing. I found a post by C last night that said there is still no news on the car. Somebody somewhere knows something and I just pray they will come forward so Nicholas can return home.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Well this is interesting reading...scroll down to the Dark Side of Publicis West

http://agencyspy.wordpress.com/category/publicis-west/

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Well this is interesting reading...scroll down to the Dark Side of Publicis West

http://agencyspy.wordpress.com/category/publicis-west/ [/*]

Good Morning Rainy :seeya:

Interesting - sex scandles go on all the time in compies - just glad we didn't see Nickolas's name there. Not much talk about him missing thou - only 6 comments. The more time he is gone the more I feel he left on his own - and thats only because of his car, no finger prints, no struggle, but then Jennifer Keese was the same way. Praying this weekend will give some answers.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Danette44


Good Morning Rainy :seeya:

Interesting - sex scandles go on all the time in compies - just glad we didn't see Nickolas's name there. Not much talk about him missing thou - only 6 comments. The more time he is gone the more I feel he left on his own - and thats only because of his car, no finger prints, no struggle, but then Jennifer Keese was the same way. Praying this weekend will give some answers. [/*]

Hey Danette :) Yeah I know a lot of big companies have scandals, unfortunately. It just looks like some unrest but that may be par for the industry.

I'm getting frustrated so I can only imagine how the family is feeling. I don't understand what LE is looking at or if they even are. Usually you start with the last known person or place this person was seen. To my knowledge no one can even confirm if he was in the car driving away (per AMW), headed to the car, parked in the garage, parked on the street, etc. Little things like this could mean a lot.

[Danette44]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Hey Danette :) Yeah I know a lot of big companies have scandals, unfortunately. It just looks like some unrest but that may be par for the industry.

I'm getting frustrated so I can only imagine how the family is feeling. I don't understand what LE is looking at or if they even are. Usually you start with the last known person or place this person was seen. To my knowledge no one can even confirm if he was in the car driving away (per AMW), headed to the car, parked in the garage, parked on the street, etc. Little things like this could mean a lot. [/*]

I thought Christine stated he parked on the street, so much hearsay, who knows anymore. I do pray that isn't Nicolas that they pulled from the Lake. I know they had search teams out, but do we know if they have searched any Lakes - Rivers or even in the mountains? What surprised me with those articals is it seems this is a big company - out of NY, SF, WA, and not much talk at all about Nicholas on their bloggs.

[Breazy]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


He has also been called an "art director" in some articles. The Publicis website doesn't list all staff, just the top leaders, so it's hard to know what his exact job and job title was. [/*]


An Art Director is basically a graphic designer who is in charge of a certain project. In other words, several graphic designers may work on a certain project, but the art director would oversee those designers on that project and would have the authority to nix ideas or use them.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Danette44


I thought Christine stated he parked on the street, so much hearsay, who knows anymore. I do pray that isn't Nicolas that they pulled from the Lake. I know they had search teams out, but do we know if they have searched any Lakes - Rivers or even in the mountains? What surprised me with those articals is it seems this is a big company - out of NY, SF, WA, and not much talk at all about Nicholas on their bloggs. [/*]

Christine said he was parked on the street. After seeing a picture of the building, it looked like anyone could see out the glass windows if there was a struggle or scuffle. However I don't know if there is another street behind the building that is filled with thugs.

In one of the articles it said a co-worker saw him last as they were headed to their cars in different directions.

Did someone he knew ask him for a ride? Did someone he casually knew (say from a business across the streeet) ask him for a ride? C said he would not pick up a hitchiker, but being a good guy maybe he gave someone a ride he thought he knew.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Breazy



An Art Director is basically a graphic designer who is in charge of a certain project. In other words, several graphic designers may work on a certain project, but the art director would oversee those designers on that project and would have the authority to nix ideas or use them. [/*]

thus his statement of needing to sign off on something before he left for the day probably

[decor]

thanks Beth

[RainyNiteNTx]

Do you think that C suspects this - therefore her puzzling statements of "he is not a coward" or "if you don't find him, these babies won't have a daddy", and her panic over her financial situation.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Christine wants him found to make him PAY for what he has done to her and to the family. It's called revenge.

If she does not push the foul play angle, no one would be looking for him........ and she wants him found !! [/*]

Beth, I've noticed that you really, really think he took off. I tend to agree with you, but am sometimes torn that maybe something happened to him. He does appear to be a really good daddy and he could have separated and got a divorce and still had join custody of his children and I tend to think he'd want that. So why take off instead of divorce? That's what I can't wrap my brain around and leaves a little room in my mind for foul play. But, you see really, really convinced that he took off. Do you have any reasons to suspect this so heavily other than anything that we've discussed here already? Do you know him or her personally? Or any of the family personally? Just curious.....

[Track292003]

Perhaps Nicholas was OWED money by someone who couldn't pay him.

Perhaps if he'd been paid, he could have covered the funds missing in his PayPal account immediately and no one would have known about the situation.

He could even have met that person the evening he went missing...

JMO

[wondering?]

I would think that if he crossed over into Canada, in a car, then the officials there would have a record of him going into Canada. They have gotten so strict about entry now.

The man that was found floating, just hope that he has ID on him, so many times bodies do not have any ID.

How sad for the girl who saw him in the water, that would be so hard for a youngster.

I still feel so bad for Christine and her babies. I hope that she is not reading this board or any other and has to see what things people are imagining about her and her husband. Wow, I am amazed by some of the comments being made and every blink of her eyes being analyzed.

No ones marriage is perfect, but to go on TV the day after your husband is missing and be able to even speak about him and what is happening is more than I could do.
I think that she did her best on her interviews, of course she was wearing makeup. look at her photos, it appears that she always looks her best!

So many young men are missing, vanished, never to be heard from again, leaving wives, girlfriends and family to wonder and grieve.

Hopefully this will have a happy ending but the more time that passes makes this more unlikely.

[jagstar58]

Greetings fellow posters. I hate to ask this, but I need a favor from anyone who has an extra few minutes. I am trying so hard to follow this case but am working for tax people this season.

Can someone answer a few questions while I am on break reading here to catch up? :D Please?

Why are most of you so sure he just walked away as opposed to meeting with trouble?

I thought I just read another male is missing too. Are some of you thinking they left together? (I see a Beth has put a theory out about Nicholas being in a car)

Has Christine revealed what the investigator wanted to tell her referencing their home life?

Thanks and I'll keep reading as I have another half hour on break.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
beth, good point...

the thing is, at some point people will stop donating to her.
she can only reach so many people, and once the pleas for money start hitting dead ends...the money will stop rolling in to her, it will get less and less, until it stops...then what? get ahold of N and tell him to come home....i'm just thinking outside the box [/*]

So do you really think that he ran off and his hiding somewhere and that they are both in on it just to get money from people? Putting his mother and sisters through all this? His job at stake and even face jail time?

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
actually, the leaving his job, does put a wrench in that thought...but, what if he was unhappy with his job, which i don't think he was, then it might play a part....

as for him being in on a money getting scheme with, I don't think so....

i would rather think he left on his own, than to think that something bad has happened to him...

it is all very strange....I think C knows something we don't know..
there is more to this than we know about

why did LE back off so quickly?? [/*]

Probably because they have no leads, just like in the many of cases I follow. I could site at least a half a dozen cases where the families are frustrated because they do not think LE is doing enough. However, in all the cases, these people (just like Nick) just disappeared with very little evidence to go on. You cannot manufacture evidence. Either you have it, or you dont.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Beth


Thank you. My brother was 23 when it happened and i remember after going to the police, they said "wont you be embarrassed when your brother comes walking through the door". I knew that he had met with foul play and they still wouldn't take me/us seriously. The frustration that comes along with LE is unreal and a lot of times, they aren't doing enough for the families and they are writing these missing people off too soon. I'm sure the numbers are even higher when it's young men that are reported missing. [/*]

I too am sorry for what you went through. Seems you can relate then to others missing loved ones and the frustration they feel when they know something bad has happened to them.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by jagstar58
Greetings fellow posters. I hate to ask this, but I need a favor from anyone who has an extra few minutes. I am trying so hard to follow this case but am working for tax people this season.

Can someone answer a few questions while I am on break reading here to catch up? :D Please?

Why are most of you so sure he just walked away as opposed to meeting with trouble?

I thought I just read another male is missing too. Are some of you thinking they left together? (I see a Beth has put a theory out about Nicholas being in a car)

Has Christine revealed what the investigator wanted to tell her referencing their home life?

Thanks and I'll keep reading as I have another half hour on break. [/*]

The main reasons I think he took off as opposed to meeting up with foul play are:

1) He told co-workers that his cell phone battery was dead that day, yet his wife has reported he would always call even if he was just 15 minutes late in traffic; this makes it seem to me he was setting the stage for being unreachable. How likely is it that the one day his phone isn't working was the day he had the bad luck to run into some trouble?

2) Seattle is a very populated place, and his car was found a few days after his disappearance with no signs of foul play. The possibility that someone stole his car with no sign of struggle, no witnesses, and no sign of him (or his body if he was killed) for more than 2 weeks and with a reward offered as well, just seems very unlikely.

3) Christine reported that she discovered that her "sweet husband" had been "shielding her from debt" when she looked at his PayPal account the day after he disappeared. And her sister reported almost immediately that they were in "desperate need" of money. Financial troubles could have been a reason for him to leave. (It could also give a reason for him to have met up with foul play, but see #1 and #2 above.)

4) Her reactions in interviews and in her online posts have shown a lot more anger than sincere worry. As if she feels he intentionally abandoned her and their kids. She doesn't come right out and say that -- in fact she strongly says the opposite "he would never leave us" -- but the comments about "he's not a coward" come across to me as more of a challenge to guilt him into returning.

JMO!

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Re: crossing over into Canada

There are many ways to do so that are not legal. Not all back roads are monitored such as private land.

Also, we do not know that he does not have his passport. He could have legally crossed the border before anyone knew he was missing or started searching. He could have also used a fake passport.

[snip] [/*]

True about getting into Canada. There is no fence or anything. In fact, a little off topic, but I watched this local news report about a bed and breakfast near the border in Washington called Smugglers Inn, where part of the nightly "entertainment" for guests is watching people try to sneak across the border -- and most of them getting caught by border patrol. http://www.komotv.com/home/video/16141967.html?video=pop&t=a

I also wonder how much information the government can or will give to LE or a PI in a case like this. Would the Canadian border guards be compelled to release information as to whether he crossed in with his passport or ID? Or would they consider that information protected by privacy laws. Again since no crime is suspected. Leaving the country isn't against the law.

[dianaelaine]

Which is WHY guys, I started the thread on Etsy .... for thoughts, ideas, anything we could come up with.

UGH, still makes me mad I was shut down!

OK, maybe they don't have any other leads ... but somehow I don't think they are or have time, to sit there all day thinking of what could have happened.

The public (we) sometimes can, and who knows what we might come up with, that could crack the case? I REALLY wish the thread could have kept going ... more I think about it, madder I get. :flamemad:

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Nellie:

I believe that he is in seious legal trouble to the point that he can not contact anyone who might turn him in.

Being a good daddy or not..... has nothing to do with it. [/*]

Oh, I'm not saying being a good has anything to do with serious legal trouble! I was pointing to a "bad marriage" scenario. In that case, I would think divorce would be the answer so he could still see his kids.

Now, if we're talking about a illegal aspect of his dissappearance, I've just never given that a thought. And, yes, in that case being a good daddy would have nothing to do with it. But, I can't imagine what kind of legal trouble would be so bad to make you dissappear. Got any ideas you want to share?

[Nellie]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
LE, including detectives, never stop thinking about a case....it's in their blood, like in ours!), they come up with a thought and it spins in their head, until they check it out...there is probably a lot of thought and research going on by LE, that they are keeping to them selves.

If LE, or PD, found N alive and well somewhere, and i hope they do), would LE relsease that information...not where he is, but the fact that he has been found alive? [/*]

In the case of Beth Smith, they would not tell where she was....actually not even that she was safe, I don't think. They encouraged HER to at least call home and tell them she was safe. She finally did. I'm not so sure LE ever really told the family they had found her, but instead convinced HER to call them.

So, I guess it's ok to abandon your kids? Does it make a difference if it's a male or female? I ask that because it seems they look for deadbeat daddies that aren't supporting their children. So, if Nicholas took off, would he fit in that category or is that category just reserved for daddies that have been through the courts and been ordered to pay child support?

[Silver_Dove]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Nellie:

I believe that he is in seious legal trouble to the point that he can not contact anyone who might turn him in.

Being a good daddy or not..... has nothing to do with it. [/*]

No legal problem, he had every right to walk away and although we have been talking about it nonstop even in Seattle there were only a few short bits on it and national has been what 3? If he left the city say to Calif he would blend in and never see anything about it if he didn't look for it.

There is no legal problem with leaving. Although C might go after him.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


The main reasons I think he took off as opposed to meeting up with foul play are:

1) He told co-workers that his cell phone battery was dead that day, yet his wife has reported he would always call even if he was just 15 minutes late in traffic; this makes it seem to me he was setting the stage for being unreachable. How likely is it that the one day his phone isn't working was the day he had the bad luck to run into some trouble?

2) Seattle is a very populated place, and his car was found a few days after his disappearance with no signs of foul play. The possibility that someone stole his car with no sign of struggle, no witnesses, and no sign of him (or his body if he was killed) for more than 2 weeks and with a reward offered as well, just seems very unlikely.

3) Christine reported that she discovered that her "sweet husband" had been "shielding her from debt" when she looked at his PayPal account the day after he disappeared. And her sister reported almost immediately that they were in "desperate need" of money. Financial troubles could have been a reason for him to leave. (It could also give a reason for him to have met up with foul play, but see #1 and #2 above.)

4) Her reactions in interviews and in her online posts have shown a lot more anger than sincere worry. As if she feels he intentionally abandoned her and their kids. She doesn't come right out and say that -- in fact she strongly says the opposite "he would never leave us" -- but the comments about "he's not a coward" come across to me as more of a challenge to guilt him into returning.

JMO! [/*]

1) Maybe she meant in general, that if something was wrong or he was running late, he would call. If his cell was dead, if it was getting to late to where she would worry, he would find a phone and let her know he was ok.

2)" for more than 2 weeks and with a reward offered as well, just seems very unlikely. " That to me lends to the point of foul play. With a reward, if he just took off on his own, SOMEONE has seen him unless he is hold up in some cave or something. And with a reward, it would even be more reason to tell LE.

3) The whole paypal thing is over played I think. She said she did not realize how bad they needed money or something to that effect when she looked at his account. That could mean anything. Maybe he was spending more than she knew. Whatever the case, its not unusual for young couples to have money issues and its not uncommon that if the husband is handling all the bills, the wife does not know the status of their financial situation.

4) I dont see what you guys are seeing about "her reactions". And yes, she feels strongly he did not just run out on them. I know if my husband did not return after work, I would KNOW something is wrong. We have been together long enough for me to know that he loves us all and he would not do that.

MOO

[Nellie]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
The fact that C said money was missing from the pay pal account, doesn't make it true, in my mind!

unless it is backed up by LE.. [/*]

C didn't say money was missing from his pay pal.
She said she realized he had been shielding her from their debt after she looked at his pay pal account the day after he went missing. I'm just not sure what she saw in that Pay Pal account and I've wondered if LE has been able to see his Pay Pal account.
If a large sum of money was removed from it the day he went missing, it could mean he removed it and took off....or it could mean that someone kidnapped him and made him withdraw it. So, I hope LE has checked out that account.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Re: what kind of trouble would make someone would take off?

Answer: Grand Larceny

Please note, I am NOT accusing anyone here. Only speculating why someone would leave without telling anyone. [/*]

You mean like embezzling from his workplace? If that happened, I think it would have come out by now from his employer that he was being investigated for embezzling funds. So, if not his employer, where else? Can one embezzle on the internet?

I'm not sure how he could do that. Anything is possible, I guess.
I just don't know how he'd have access to any funds there.
I actually had a friend who committed grand larceny. She embezzled a half a million dollars from the company she worked for. She didn't take off. She is sitting in a federal prison right now. She got less than 3 years.

I still want to believe he's a good guy. But I never would have believed my friend would do what she did, so you just never know the secrets people are hiding. I just thought she had lots of money, never realizing she was stealing it! I was in shock! Still am.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Help me out here - in one of the articles or Etsy posts or broadcasts, C said that Nicholas would not run away - that if he did, he would take them with him. Do you remember that?

I look at his pictures of him, his family, and I just can't see him walking off. I don't know why I don't believe that because it happened in my immediate family. Loving Christian father with a beautiful baby just walked off without a word.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
Beth E,,, i thought about that also, you mean RE: from his employer? in his position with the co. i don't see how he could get "funds" on the sly from the co.

And, from all accounts of him, as a person, he would have to have been awfully desperate to do something like that, i don't see him doing that.

somewhere in this thread, a few pages back, i read something to the effect, that he was not due, or getting, any more paychecks, or money from his employer...that's what made me think he MAY have taken "funds" from the co.
I may have read that wrong.... [/*]

hippiegirl, in reference to my girlfriend I just mentioned that embezzled funds from her employer. It wasn't out of desperation, imo....at first anyway. She was high maintanence and I honestly believe she lived beyond her means and liked living beyond her means and she needed some way to fund it. I saw what she spent money on. If she wanted it...she got it.

[jagstar58]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


The main reasons I think he took off as opposed to meeting up with foul play are:

1) He told co-workers that his cell phone battery was dead that day, yet his wife has reported he would always call even if he was just 15 minutes late in traffic; this makes it seem to me he was setting the stage for being unreachable. How likely is it that the one day his phone isn't working was the day he had the bad luck to run into some trouble?

2) Seattle is a very populated place, and his car was found a few days after his disappearance with no signs of foul play. The possibility that someone stole his car with no sign of struggle, no witnesses, and no sign of him (or his body if he was killed) for more than 2 weeks and with a reward offered as well, just seems very unlikely.

3) Christine reported that she discovered that her "sweet husband" had been "shielding her from debt" when she looked at his PayPal account the day after he disappeared. And her sister reported almost immediately that they were in "desperate need" of money. Financial troubles could have been a reason for him to leave. (It could also give a reason for him to have met up with foul play, but see #1 and #2 above.)

4) Her reactions in interviews and in her online posts have shown a lot more anger than sincere worry. As if she feels he intentionally abandoned her and their kids. She doesn't come right out and say that -- in fact she strongly says the opposite "he would never leave us" -- but the comments about "he's not a coward" come across to me as more of a challenge to guilt him into returning.

JMO! [/*]

Thanks so much for spelling it out for me. I was called back, but sneaking online here between customers.

Did anyone ever divulge whether or not he took money out that day or shortly before RE the paypal account?

I haven't seen LE on this in a good week so I was thinking they must be going in another direction. Has Christine revealed what they wanted to talk to her about yesterday yet?

I'll feel bad if we find out he met with foul play but you are right about it sounding like he was setting the stage. IF I was married to Christine, I would probably be afraid to just come home now.


JMO

[Musterion]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


4) Her reactions in interviews and in her online posts have shown a lot more anger than sincere worry. As if she feels he intentionally abandoned her and their kids. She doesn't come right out and say that -- in fact she strongly says the opposite "he would never leave us" -- but the comments about "he's not a coward" come across to me as more of a challenge to guilt him into returning.

JMO! [/*]

Or we could admire her for her strong convictions and belief in Nicholas and his character. JMO.

Re: Coward comment and seeming anger. It was reported that her parents divorced when she was ten. Not knowing the circumstances one can only speculate. However, it is possible that she has heard her father called a 'coward' for leaving his family, if that in fact did happen. Nicholas' disappearance and Christine's adamancy that he is not a coward may be directed at some other male in her life, not Nicholas.

Going through a parent's divorce at ten may have left scars and insecurities that are surfacing and erupting deep emotions. Sometimes that causes misplaced anger.

Just a thought.

[Breazy]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


thus his statement of needing to sign off on something before he left for the day probably [/*]

The ad agencies I worked for, everyone that had dealings with a project had to sign off on their part of the work as it progressed through the agency. For example, someone had to sign off on the ad design, the copywriting, the photography, the graphics, etc. until the project was complete. Definitely not odd that he had to sign off on something. He probably did this many times a day, every day.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by KindraLore


[snip]

2)" for more than 2 weeks and with a reward offered as well, just seems very unlikely. " That to me lends to the point of foul play. With a reward, if he just took off on his own, SOMEONE has seen him unless he is hold up in some cave or something. And with a reward, it would even be more reason to tell LE.


MOO [/*]

Depends on where he might have went. Certainly if he's still around Seattle, especially where posters have been put up, etc., then it would be more likely that someone has seen him and would report it. I live in the north part of Seattle and I haven't seen a single poster. And I've talked to a lot of people even here in Seattle who haven't heard of this case -- Nicholas could be standing behind them at 7-11 and they wouldn't know! It's not like it's on the front page or evening news every day. I also don't see it being posted on craigslist regularly or on other cities' craigslists. That would be a simple, easy thing that even Christine herself could be doing. Much more productive than some of the posts she's put on blogs for sure. (Well maybe I'll go post it on some craigslists myself. Hey, couldn't hurt.)

I don't think it would be hard if he changed his appearance a bit and used a different name, to not be recognized. And, if he's left the area then I think it's even less likely that people would know that he is a guy reported missing in Seattle.

The cave idea (well not literally!) is not so far-fetched -- there is that whole concept of people (especially guys) needing their "cave time". 17 days of it is a little extreme without calling anyone though. That's why it seems more like if he did leave, it was for good, not for a break.

[jagstar58]

Originally posted by dianaelaine
Which is WHY guys, I started the thread on Etsy .... for thoughts, ideas, anything we could come up with.

UGH, still makes me mad I was shut down!

OK, maybe they don't have any other leads ... but somehow I don't think they are or have time, to sit there all day thinking of what could have happened.

The public (we) sometimes can, and who knows what we might come up with, that could crack the case? I REALLY wish the thread could have kept going ... more I think about it, madder I get. :flamemad: [/*]

Can you direct people from there over here?

I would be willing to help you tonight after 6PM EST.

[Nellie]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Help me out here - in one of the articles or Etsy posts or broadcasts, C said that Nicholas would not run away - that if he did, he would take them with him. Do you remember that?

I look at his pictures of him, his family, and I just can't see him walking off. I don't know why I don't believe that because it happened in my immediate family. Loving Christian father with a beautiful baby just walked off without a word. [/*]

I am so sick and tired of everyone asking me or blogging that they think Nicholas ran off on me. it is so frustrating and their heads are so stubborn. they just wont listen when i tell them that it is impossible that he would leave us. if he was going to run away he'd come and get us and we'd go together.

I thought it was an odd statement. She was so adamant that he would not take off...but then turns around and says...but if he did, he'd take them with him. It seemed like a contradiction! I thought..."What???? If you think that, then you can think of a reason he'd take off....cause why would he take off with you and the kids?". I almost felt like she was mad that he didn't take them. So it made me wonder if she knew the reason he'd take off and maybe they even discussed taking off together. I mean....what reason does she think they would all take off together? It just seemed strange for her to say that....like it'd be ok that he took off, just not ok that he took off without her and the kids.

Of course I'll admit that I may over analyse things. LOL

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
rainey, i remember that.

what was she thinking would have made him run away...in the first place, and then to say he would have taken them with him...sounds like she may have an idea why he ran....maybe she knew he was in trouble for something, and thought he was going to stay and deal with it...but didn't [/*]

She may have just been responding to the questions that interviewers were asking "Do you think he ran away?" I'm pretty sure that response she gave was to an interviewer. At the time I thought it was a little curious because it made me think that hey, maybe they were just collecting money to start a new life somewhere else and she would be joining him soon. So many possibilities.

[RainyNiteNTx]

Thanks Nellie :) My biggest fear is misquoting something - there is enough speculation without doing that.

[decor]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx
Help me out here - in one of the articles or Etsy posts or broadcasts, C said that Nicholas would not run away - that if he did, he would take them with him. Do you remember that?

I look at his pictures of him, his family, and I just can't see him walking off. I don't know why I don't believe that because it happened in my immediate family. Loving Christian father with a beautiful baby just walked off without a word. [/*]

I remember that clearly because I thought it was such an odd thing to say. I was thinking if he was going to run away and take them with him why would he need to run away?


Diana
don't be upset about that thread on Etsy. it wasn't supposed to play out there and over here is much better anyway. Don't worry most of those on Etsy will find out what is going on.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth
He may have been socking money away for this. I read somewhere and it may have been speculation, that they had an ARM on their house. If they didn't, and with the prime rate going down as it has, he may have refinanced without her knowledge (if that's possible) and may have a nice chunk of change with him.

I know I'd be pretty PO'd at my husband if he took off and I started finding unknown financial decisions had been made without my consent. [/*]

I reported yesterday that public records show 2 deeds from different mortgage companies recorded against their house when they purchased it 2 years ago. Nothing more recent though, but sometimes those don't get recorded immediately.

Washington is a community property state and it is possible to take out loans, credit cards, etc., without your spouse knowing it yet they become obligated for the debts too, as I understand it. Not sure if he could do anything on the house without her knowing or signing though. Plus there would most likely have been an appraisal for a new loan and how could he do that without her knowing, when she is home with the kids?

[Sunday Moon]

I'm wondering why there has been no follow up on Nancy or Greta about this. For a few days it was national news and now....nothing. I'm wondering if they have tried to get Christine on and she stonewalled them or if they think it's a voluntary missing person case and, therefore, unnecessary to profile. I just wish one of them would have it on so we could hear what the panels have to say about it all.

[decor]

Originally posted by Beth Engleman
Re: not funds.......designs, company plans and trade information. Plans and projects. [/*]


this may explain why the company put out a reward AND hired a PI to find him.

the other missing man disappeared the following day. He may have been contemplating it and when he saw that NF had disappeared the day before it gave him the incentive he needed to leave too.

obviously CF knows that NF did something and knows what it is. wonder if she shared that info with LE

I can also see now why she is really really miffed. He left her behind when she believed that if they had to leave she would be going too. I am sure she was in shock when the realization hit her.

[decor]

Originally posted by Beth




Also, this reward and PI set up by his employer got me thinking. What if (and it's a big one), they want to find him for another reason other than they're concerned about his well being. The PI would fit along well with the theory that's been alluded to where he may have done something wrong. (is that too cryptic?) [/*]

okay I am beginning to believe that I am truly invisible. No matter what I say it is brought up in another post after mine as if I never said anything. ;)

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth


I wish they would too. I wonder if they've requested information from her that she didn't want to give them.

Also, this reward and PI set up by his employer got me thinking. What if (and it's a big one), they want to find him for another reason other than they're concerned about his well being. The PI would fit along well with the theory that's been alluded to where he may have done something wrong. (is that too cryptic?) [/*]

And, if Christine knew about any work-related problems, it could explain why she let her sister know that they were in "desperate need" financially -- she wouldn't be expecting he'd have another paycheck coming then, or that he would be returning to his job at least.

OTOH, there's Nicholas leaving work at the end of the day like every day -- no "clean out your desk and give us your cell phone, laptop, and ID card, you're out" kind of finality. Unless he did something that his employer only discovered *after* he disappeared?

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by decor


okay I am beginning to believe that I am truly invisible. No matter what I say it is brought up in another post after mine as if I never said anything. ;) [/*]

LOL Decor I know what you mean.

[decor]

it's okay Beth.
you are about the third person that has done it. I posted an entire scenario the other day and then someone posted almost the same exact thing on the next page and hours later. :)

[dianaelaine]

Originally posted by decor


okay I am beginning to believe that I am truly invisible. No matter what I say it is brought up in another post after mine as if I never said anything. ;) [/*]


I feel the same way many times.

You're not ignored. :beer:

That's not beer .. that's root beer.

Big Huggles!

[isitme]

Originally posted by decor


okay I am beginning to believe that I am truly invisible. No matter what I say it is brought up in another post after mine as if I never said anything. ;) [/*]

Me too. That is why I have quit posting my thoughts and questions.

[dianaelaine]

Beth,

It was Thursday ...

[decor]

thanks now I don't feel so bad. LOL

you do really wonder though, does anyone else see my posts or are they only visible to me. :)

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


And, if Christine knew about any work-related problems, it could explain why she let her sister know that they were in "desperate need" financially -- she wouldn't be expecting he'd have another paycheck coming then, or that he would be returning to his job at least.

OTOH, there's Nicholas leaving work at the end of the day like every day -- no "clean out your desk and give us your cell phone, laptop, and ID card, you're out" kind of finality. Unless he did something that his employer only discovered *after* he disappeared? [/*]

I have harped and harped and harped on that cell phone. He said it was dead or near dead due to a battery or not being charged. A company that size would normally have extras of both. He even mentioned it to a coworker about his cell phone. If it was a blackberry or whatever TMobile calls their model like that, that would contain his email as well as his cell phone calls. Why someone did not help him out with that knowing he had a commute, an old beat up car and a pregnant wife I'll never know I guess.

[desmom]

Originally posted by Beth
Exactly, Thru the Trees!

Does anybody remember what day of the week it was on his last day at work? [/*]

I believe it was Wednesday, Feb. 13.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Beth
Maybe there wouldn't be so many eyebrows raised if she were at least working outside the house, even part time and at least trying to bring in some money. This nonsense about not working because she is 7 weeks pregnant, is just that... nonsense. [/*]

Call me weird but I think if my husband of seven years and the father of my children disappeared into thin air and left me pregnant with two small children, my whole world around me crushed; I doubt I would be able to function properly, much less go be a cashier or hold a job somewhere. JMO

[dianaelaine]

Originally posted by desmom


I believe it was Wednesday, Feb. 13. [/*]

OOPS .. you're right ... I was looking at February, didn't realize it was March all ready. :D

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by Beth


Please don't stop. Even though I am new to this board (as far as posting), every opinion matters and sometimes, especially when threads are really flying, it is just too hard to respond to all of them. Of course I speak from my experiences elsewhere, I'm sure it is the same here. I am a board administrator for another private crime/victim board, and I can say firsthand, sometimes, the threads get so active that by the time you catch up and have read them all, there are 50 more after that.

So please, try again! [/*]

I know some of us work and try to read throughout the day and I definitely miss some posts.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth


[snip]

I don't understand abandoning your mother and sisters when they need to know, one way or the other. [/*]

This puzzles me too. Unless he fears for his life, or theirs, or is in some legal trouble and is worried that by contacting him he'll be found, it doesn't make sense -- if he really is the devoted, loving father, husband, and son that everyone says. Another scenario is an extreme stress or mental illness reaction, where his whole sense of reality has changed.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by decor
it's okay Beth.
you are about the third person that has done it. I posted an entire scenario the other day and then someone posted almost the same exact thing on the next page and hours later. :) [/*]

It's the "Great Minds Think Alike" syndrome. ;)

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by Beth


And I totally agree and I'm not sure I could do it either. But, would I rather do that, or expose my personal debt and financial situation to the world? And I certainly would have put a stop to all donations by now.

I guess there is no right answer, but at some point, she is going to have to fend for herself and not depend on the generosity of others. [/*]

I dont know what the issue is with the donations. Anyone that donates money does not have a gun to their head. They are doing it out of kindness and compassion for another human being.

Almost ALL of the cases I have followed (minus John Glasgow considering he and his family were well off) have donation funds set up.

[desmom]

I don't think anyone intentionally ignores another's thoughts or questions.

Sometimes when posters pop in they begin reading from the bottom up and others try to begin with the last post they read. Thoughts come and they want to get their thoughts posted before they go. They realize later someone has already posted the same thing. By that time, the edit time frame has run out and their post cannot be deleted or edited.

Threads covering high profile trials, verdict announcements or new LE info can really fly and are full of duplicate ideas and questions.

jmo

[RainyNiteNTx]

Originally posted by KindraLore


I dont know what the issue is with the donations. Anyone that donates money does not have a gun to their head. They are doing it out of kindness and compassion for another human being.

Almost ALL of the cases I have followed (minus John Glasgow considering he and his family were well off) have donation funds set up. [/*]

Donations for reward money and search organizations or donations for the family to live on? Personally I would be taking every spare cent somebody wanted to give me but it would be to make that reward money as HIGH as I could get it. I would depend on my family for anything else.

[KindraLore]

Originally posted by RainyNiteNTx


Donations for reward money and search organizations or donations for the family to live on? Personally I would be taking every spare cent somebody wanted to give me but it would be to make that reward money as HIGH as I could get it. I would depend on my family for anything else. [/*]

You can say that, but if you had two small children - mouths to feed, in jepardy of losing your home and making everything much worse, then you are saying you would not let people help you?

I'm sure that any of these good natured people that donate personally don't care. They are just trying to help them, period.

[Breazy]

Christine and everyone that knows Nicholas has stated that he is a very religious man, family man, etc. He has also been stated that Nicholas loved his job.

I went to the Publicis site and read that article that was posted earlier, "The Dark Side of Publicis West." I also read the comments posted and other comments on another site that were linked on the original comments. Just wanted to share a few thoughts . . .

Publicis West is being protrayed as a very hip and happening place . . . to the point of employees being provided a keg on Friday afternoons. Alot of the comments alluded to a lot of drinking and partying by the employees there. Also mentions of sex scandals and much disssatisfaction (sp?) with their job there.

Does anyone else find it contradictory that Nicholas could be very religious and a total family man and still love his job?

There was a time in my life that I was a bit of a partier myself. However, when I outgrew that kind of life, I would have never wanted to work in an atmosphere such as portrayed. People that are not partiers DO NOT constantly want to be around people that do, especially to the point of drinking at work on Friday afternoons or co-workers getting drunk and dancing on tabletops at a Christmas party. I'm sorry, but there are plenty of other jobs out there than to subject myself to this environment if I lived a totally opposite life.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by Beth


And I totally agree and I'm not sure I could do it either. But, would I rather do that, or expose my personal debt and financial situation to the world? And I certainly would have put a stop to all donations by now.

I guess there is no right answer, but at some point, she is going to have to fend for herself and not depend on the generosity of others. [/*]

In the worst-case scenario, if he doesn't reappear in any form, does anyone know what the waiting time is for life insurance? I wonder if she would be able to get state aid for families with dependent children, especially for her medical needs for her pregnancy and her children's health care needs. I hope she is getting some practical advice from the people helping her and considering all her possible options for financial support, including government assistance.

[Breazy]

Originally posted by decor
it's okay Beth.
you are about the third person that has done it. I posted an entire scenario the other day and then someone posted almost the same exact thing on the next page and hours later. :) [/*]


Don't worry . . . happens to me too. I just chalk it up to the fact that no everyone reads EVERY post like I do. :cool:

[Breazy]

Originally posted by dianaelaine
Beth,

It was Thursday ... [/*]

Valentine's Day was Thursday, February 14 -- His last day at work would have been Wednesday, the 13th.

[desmom]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


This puzzles me too. Unless he fears for his life, or theirs, or is in some legal trouble and is worried that by contacting him he'll be found, it doesn't make sense -- if he really is the devoted, loving father, husband, and son that everyone says. Another scenario is an extreme stress or mental illness reaction, where his whole sense of reality has changed. [/*]

What ever kind of trouble or problems, his actions at the time may have sounded like a great idea. Now that time has passed, it could be as simple as he is embarrassed by his actions and does not want to face his family.....to admit he really messed up.

jmo

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by desmom


What ever kind of trouble or problems, his actions at the time may have sounded like a great idea. Now that time has passed, it could be as simple as he is embarrassed by his actions and does not want to face his family.....to admit he really messed up.

jmo [/*]

Yes, embarrassment and shame could be logical reasons for staying out of contact too.

[ThruTheTrees]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
is it a year after someone goes missing, that they can delcare him/her dead, and the insurance co. would/could then payout the life insurance, unless, it was suicide...

and if the insurance co. paid out, and they found the missing person in the Bahamas, alive and well, does that insurance money have to be paid back to the ins. co. [/*]

I would think it would have to be paid back for sure. And if they could prove she knew he was alive, or that he knew he had been declared dead, then there would be insurance fraud charges as well.

[Breazy]

Originally posted by ThruTheTrees


This puzzles me too. Unless he fears for his life, or theirs, or is in some legal trouble and is worried that by contacting him he'll be found, it doesn't make sense -- if he really is the devoted, loving father, husband, and son that everyone says. Another scenario is an extreme stress or mental illness reaction, where his whole sense of reality has changed. [/*]

Yes, it's beyond the realm of my thinking also but that's exactly what Beth Smith did. Left her two children without a word to her siblings, parents, best friend . . . nobody. There were many who said she was a wonderful mother and teacher (taught kindergarten) and would NEVER just take off. She was found in New York 4 months later where she had started a new life. She was even a Baptist preacher's wife and had left her best friend hanging at a women's conference, saying she was going to the bathroom. So, it does happen . . .

[desmom]

Originally posted by hippiegirl
is it a year after someone goes missing, that they can delcare him/her dead, and the insurance co. would/could then payout the life insurance, unless, it was suicide...

and if the insurance co. paid out, and they found the missing person in the Bahamas, alive and well, does that insurance money have to be paid back to the ins. co. [/*]

I think it depends on the state, the insurance company and the evidence the insured is deceased.

[dianaelaine]

Hey ... not to interrupt or anything, but:

I just posted over on the "Open Court" area, about a personal decision I'm trying to make. Would you guys take a second and go have a look?

Perhaps you have an opinion or idea for me?

Thanks!

It's titled "Which Would You Suggest To Choose?"

Diana

[Breazy]

Originally posted by Breazy


Valentine's Day was Thursday, February 14 -- His last day at work would have been Wednesday, the 13th. [/*]


Sorry for quoting my own post but I wanted to apologize to all for posting before getting through all the posts.

Sorry for the typos in my previous posts too. :o

[dianaelaine]

Thanks for taking a look at my post guys.

:D

[Breazy]

I was thinking that too . . . like he just couldn't face the charade any longer, especially since the next day was Valentine's.

[decor]

Originally posted by isitme


Me too. That is why I have quit posting my thoughts and questions. [/*]

don't give up. if we give up we'll never be heard ;)